All this focus on Junaid and Amir yet we are forgetting that Hasan Ali is our best performing bowler

[Adil_94]

Hasan Ali deserved more recognition. He is standing up nearly every game and he actually looks threatening constantly.

Junaid and Amir are living off their past success and reputations.

Hasan Ali deserves more respeck

 

[Rayyman]

He is young and talented. Improving also. We shouldn't overrate him. His bad days are very bad. I agree he is one of our best bowlers in the LO formats.

 

[Hawkeye]

I have no idea how did you come up with that logic.

Who is forgetting Hasan is our best bowler atm? Everyone on the forum I know appreciates him.

Indeed our top LOI bowler atm.

 

[hadi123]

He is young and talented. Improving also. We shouldn't overrate him. His bad days are very bad. I agree he is one of our best bowlers in the LO formats.

agree, he can be inconsistent

 

[marlonbrowndo]

World class bowler. He was the most threatening pacer in the PSL for me even if he didn't get the most wickets

 

[waleed88]

Junaid is a spent force....

Mohammad Amir likes to bowl a negative line so that he doesn't concede runs...

So apparently Jason Holder leaves all the stumps, and goes 5 yards towards the leg side, and Amir bowls in his pads instead of trying to hit the stumps

There is only one bowler who knows what he is doing

 

[Syed1]

In the last match he bowled 5 overs and went for 43 (eco of 8.6) without picking up a wicket.


PP'er love to put cricketers on a pedestal or discard them as finished or TTFs after one match.

 

[ahmadharis1]

Great find, loving him so far

 

[godzilla]

how on earth was junked selected for this squad, on what domestic performances? wasnt he ordinary in the ipl too?

 

[MMHS]

Indeed he is a good LO bowler, very good with oldish ball. But, the game isn't played that way - it's all about combination. His job was made easy by the 2 early wickets with new ball, something he isn't good at using. Also, he had 282 to defend on a 240 per wicket, but all the credit for bowling intelligently & setting up perfectly.

 

[Arsalan Pro]

A good young bowler,still needs to be more consistent.

 

[Arsalan Pro]

His last 2 ODI matches were very poor,good to see he has recovered from it.

 

[Mamoon]

Another 5-fer, but of course Amir is better. He is our most threatening and aggressive pacer at the moment. And by aggressive I don't mean Wahab type aggressive, i.e. hot air only.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

I have no idea how did you come up with that logic.

Who is forgetting Hasan is our best bowler atm? Everyone on the forum I know appreciates him.

Indeed our top LOI bowler atm.

This. I was telling my brother in the 2nd T20 that Ali wouldn't bottle it when it came down to the last over. He didn't.

 

[Faran96]

Another 5-fer, but of course Amir is better. He is our most threatening and aggressive pacer at the moment. And by aggressive I don't mean Wahab type aggressive, i.e. hot air only.

Have you noticed that Hasan has increased his pace substantially since his debut? Anyways, I think he just needs to improve his consistency in order to become world class.

 

[Mamoon]

Have you noticed that Hasan has increased his pace substantially since his debut? Anyways, I think he just needs to improve his consistency in order to become world class.

Yes. He has become quicker and more hostile, love his attitude which is backed by wickets unlike Wahab. Needs to make his Test debut now, enough of Rahat.

 

[Hamza_]

Yes. He has become quicker and more hostile, love his attitude which is backed by wickets unlike Wahab. Needs to make his Test debut now, enough of Rahat.

We need to get rid of Junaid as soon as possible. What rubbish bowling today.

 

[SarfiBabarHaris]

Should have moved on from Junaid and Wahab long time ago.
Give some new faces a chance.

Rumman, Usman, Ehtisham, Sadaf these are the few i know who i think will do better than them.

 

[Speedster777]

Junaid looks toothless with no pace. Amir is taking his place for granted. Hassan Ali is turning out to be our strike bowler.

 

[Faran96]

Yes. He has become quicker and more hostile, love his attitude which is backed by wickets unlike Wahab. Needs to make his Test debut now, enough of Rahat.

How much longer do you think we should give Amir to get his act together? It seems to me that he is the bowler version of a tuk-tuk batsman. He wants to contain runs and is unwilling to take risk by pitching the ball up.

 

[Mamoon]

We need to get rid of Junaid as soon as possible. What rubbish bowling today.

He is terrible. Cost Peshawar two matches vs Islamabad in the PSL and got rewarded by Inzi. No pace, no swing, no control, no fitness, poor batting and fielding. He is an awful cricketer and should be discarded soon.

 

[Syed1]

He is terrible. Cost Peshawar two matches vs Islamabad in the PSL and got rewarded by Inzi. No pace, no swing, no control, no fitness, poor batting and fielding. He is an awful cricketer and should be discarded soon.

Hehe keep crying

 

[Hasan123]

I think he is well appreciated on this forum.

 

[Hamza_]

He is terrible. Cost Peshawar two matches vs Islamabad in the PSL and got rewarded by Inzi. No pace, no swing, no control, no fitness, poor batting and fielding. He is an awful cricketer and should be discarded soon.

Junaid and Hafeez were insane selections.

I was hoping that Fahim would be used as third seamer.

Also I don't think this is good idea to take away new ball from Hassan after one match only, It shows defensive mindset of management.

 

[Mamoon]

How much longer do you think we should give Amir to get his act together? It seems to me that he is the bowler version of a tuk-tuk batsman. He wants to contain runs and is unwilling to take risk by pitching the ball up.

That's a good analogy. He has zero impact and bowls defensive rubbish most of the time, apart from the first 2-3 overs which never yields him more than 1 wicket. In ODIs, he is generally economical because of his defensive bowling, so he is not a significant problem as long as he is not treated as strike bowler. However in Tests, he has been really poor. I think if he doesn't pick his game up by the end of this year, he should be dropped. He has been coasting a bit too much based on the notion that he is an automatic pick. The fact that Hasan is taking over from him as the strike bowler should serve as a wakeup call.

 

[Mamoon]

Hehe keep crying

Yes. Who cares about the betterment of the team, the only thing that matters is our favorites playing.

 

[Haz95]

That's a good analogy. He has zero impact and bowls defensive rubbish most of the time, apart from the first 2-3 overs which never yields him more than 1 wicket. In ODIs, he is generally economical because of his defensive bowling, so he is not a significant problem as long as he is not treated as strike bowler. However in Tests, he has been really poor. I think if he doesn't pick his game up by the end of this year, he should be dropped. He has been coasting a bit too much based on the notion that he is an automatic pick. The fact that Hasan is taking over from him as the strike bowler should serve as a wakeup call.

I'm surprised you rate Hasan so highly. He's very similar to Umar Gul who although was a good bowler, was hardly a proper strike bowler. But oh well if he's taking wickets, who's to complain eh?

 

[New Yorker]

His last 2 ODI matches were very poor,good to see he has recovered from it.

If his name were Wahab he could have had 4 rubbish matches, then taken 3 wickets instead of 5, and half the board would have felt that his indispensability to the team had yet again been proven beyond a shadow of a doubt. 'He makes things happen, on his day, etc etc.' For his inconsistencies, when Hasan makes things happen they really happen.

 

[Mamoon]

Junaid and Hafeez were insane selections.

I was hoping that Fahim would be used as third seamer.

Also I don't think this is good idea to take away new ball from Hassan after one match only, It shows defensive mindset of management.

You need your wicket-taking pacer to bowl with the new ball, and he is the only one right now. He is not excellent with the new ball yet, but he has a good learning curve and the only way he can get better is by bowling.

 

[Ellipsism]

I'm surprised you rate Hasan so highly. He's very similar to Umar Gul who although was a good bowler, was hardly a proper strike bowler. But oh well if he's taking wickets, who's to complain eh?

I'm surprised you don't.

He's got the full skill-set, reverse swing, conventional swing and pace; what more could you ask for?

 

[Mamoon]

I'm surprised you rate Hasan so highly. He's very similar to Umar Gul who although was a good bowler, was hardly a proper strike bowler. But oh well if he's taking wickets, who's to complain eh?

Gul was a class LOI bowler before his knees gave up. Would take a peak Gul in this team in a heartbeat. Proper clutch performer, barring Mohali. He seems more feisty though, Gul was a bit soft. I don't mind a higher ER as long as the wickets keep coming. Defensive pacers get on my nerves. Defensive bowling is for spinners, not pacers.

 

[Syed1]

Yes. Who cares about the betterment of the team, the only thing that matters is our favorites playing.

Bhai we all want Pakistan to do well, but within the squad Junaid is the better option when compared to Wahab. Select someone better than both.

 

[Mamoon]

Bhai we all want Pakistan to do well, but within the squad Junaid is the better option when compared to Wahab. Select someone better than both.

He should not have been in the squad in the first place, considering how terrible he was in the PSL.

 

[Hamza_]

You need your wicket-taking pacer to bowl with the new ball, and he is the only one right now. He is not excellent with the new ball yet, but he has a good learning curve and the only way he can get better is by bowling.

[MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION] He bowled with new ball in PSL and was sharp, Also used outswinger with new ball.

He should have bowled with new ball as well today despite one failure.

 

[Hamza_]

Bhai we all want Pakistan to do well, but within the squad Junaid is the better option when compared to Wahab. Select someone better than both.

Asghar or Fahim should have been given a debut.

Junaid is a very poor bowler who if plays for Pakistan consistently, I'm sure will break Wahab's bowling records.

 

[Syed1]

He should not have been in the squad in the first place, considering how terrible he was in the PSL.

PSL shouldn't be sole selection criteria

 

[Haz95]

I'm surprised you don't.

He's got the full skill-set, reverse swing, conventional swing and pace; what more could you ask for?

Not that much conventional swing tbh. He's got good reverse swing and is intelligent when he wants to be. Is a brilliant first change bowler but not in that higher tier category. However so long as he remains the best pacer in the team, he should always open the bowling

Gul was a class LOI bowler before his knees gave up. Would take a peak Gul in this team in a heartbeat. Proper clutch performer, barring Mohali. He seems more feisty though, Gul was a bit soft. I don't mind a higher ER as long as the wickets keep coming. Defensive pacers get on my nerves. Defensive bowling is for spinners, not pacers.

A peak Umar Gul would wipe the floor with most pacers, he was a damn good ODI bowler, nothing to be ashamed of being compared to him. However he had that thing lacking which put him in top tier category, same with Hasan for me. However Hasan can definitely become a world class bowler.

 

[Mamoon]

[MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION] He bowled with new ball in PSL and was sharp, Also used outswinger with new ball.

He should have bowled with new ball as well today despite one failure.

Yes, he got good out-swing in the PSL. It seems like the management is trying too hard to resurrect Junaid's career. The quicker they realize that he is finished, the better.

 

[Mamoon]

Not that much conventional swing tbh. He's got good reverse swing and is intelligent when he wants to be. Is a brilliant first change bowler but not in that higher tier category. However so long as he remains the best pacer in the team, he should always open the bowling


A peak Umar Gul would wipe the floor with most pacers, he was a damn good ODI bowler, nothing to be ashamed of being compared to him. However he had that thing lacking which put him in top tier category, same with Hasan for me. However Hasan can definitely become a world class bowler.

Skill-wise, Gul's main problem was that he couldn't get conventional swing. Once he physically declined, his pace dropped and he could not execute those yorkers. The two new balls also damaged him because it killed the reverse-swing. Hasan though has shown more potential in terms of conventional swing so far. Doesn't have Gul's yorkers yet, but matching those are not easy. Gul's yorkers were ATG material, could execute them at will.

 

[Mamoon]

PSL shouldn't be sole selection criteria

He fails every criteria, selected on TTF quota.

 

[dildildalwalla]

Hasan Ali deserved more recognition. He is standing up nearly every game and he actually looks threatening constantly.

Junaid and Amir are living off their past success and reputations.

Hasan Ali deserves more respeck

I never forget about Ali!

Also, I feel like Irfan Jr or Raees should have gotten a shot over either of JUnaid or Wahab.

Amir is still quite economical and ocne again bowled well even if he only got 1 wicket. I really think he should have been given 2 more overs at some stage.

 

[phoenix363]

Very good bowler, especially given his height which makes it easy for batsman to get under some of his length deliveries hence he has been taken to the cleaners a few too many times.

However he seems to be a thinking bowler and is using this to his advantage, with the skiddy inswingers thudding into the pads becoming something of a trademark, particularly in the middle overs.

Continues to improve but I've felt he's looked a little tired this series. I hope that's not the case as he is quickly becoming our most reliable pacer.

 

[Flat_Track_Bully]

This is how he was received back in his home town after the England tour.

He has it in him to become world class. He is only 22 and is delivering under pressure.

 

[Bilal7]

We have four good pacers at the moment, in Amir, Junaid, Hassan and Riaz. All four should play in the first two matches of the Champions Trophy, at least.

 

[cricketInsight]

We have four good pacers at the moment, in Amir, Junaid, Hassan and Riaz. All four should play in the first two matches of the Champions Trophy, at least.

From this bunch Riaz is the least deserving in ODIs/T20s. Junaid has yet to re-establish himself. He has to prove that he has got it. Doubts remain but he is worth give a few opportunities.

Lets dump Riaz in the ODI squad and bring in whoever is next in line.

 

[Bilal7]

From this bunch Riaz is the least deserving in ODIs/T20s. Junaid has yet to re-establish himself. He has to prove that he has got it. Doubts remain but he is worth give a few opportunities.

Lets dump Riaz in the ODI squad and bring in whoever is next in line.

After the CT perhaps. Riaz is always turned on during tournaments so he needs to be there.

 

[Hawkeye]

After the CT perhaps. Riaz is always turned on during tournaments so he needs to be there.

Will you realize the reality of Junaid if he fails in CT (again) ?

 

[Indiafan]

After the CT perhaps. Riaz is always turned on during tournaments so he needs to be there.

Didn't he average over 100 in the last CT?

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/en...ault;template=results;trophy=44;type=allround

 

[ExpressPacer]

Didn't he average over 100 in the last CT?

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/en...ault;template=results;trophy=44;type=allround

He bowled pretty well in short bursts. Overall Pakistan's performance was so pathetic, no performance from him could have saved us.

 

[Bilal7]

Will you realize the reality of Junaid if he fails in CT (again) ?

You clearly won't get rid of your delusions no matter what happens. Junaid can be one of the best bowlers in the tournament and you'll still call him crap, while insisting that Kamran open the batting for us.

Didn't he average over 100 in the last CT?

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/en...ault;template=results;trophy=44;type=allround

Err... I was talking about Wahab Riaz, not Junaid Khan. Please read more carefully next time.

 

[The_Odd_One]

Gul was a class LOI bowler before his knees gave up. Would take a peak Gul in this team in a heartbeat. Proper clutch performer, barring Mohali. He seems more feisty though, Gul was a bit soft. I don't mind a higher ER as long as the wickets keep coming. Defensive pacers get on my nerves. Defensive bowling is for spinners, not pacers.

ER is more important in ODIs than wickets. A bowler with figures of 10/40/0 is much better than a bowler with 10/60/3.

 

[Syed1]

ER is more important in ODIs than wickets. A bowler with figures of 10/40/0 is much better than a bowler with 10/60/3.

What in the world. Are you even serious???

 

[The_Odd_One]

What in the world. Are you even serious???

Team A has 5 bowlers who give 40 runs on average. Target will be 200 runs for them.

Team B has 5 bowlers who give 60 runs on average. Target will be 300 runs for them.

Which team do you think will win?

 

[Abdullah719]

Team A has 5 bowlers who give 40 runs on average. Target will be 200 runs for them.

Team B has 5 bowlers who give 60 runs on average. Target will be 300 runs for them.

Which team do you think will win?

If Team B's bowlers take 3/60 on average (as per your example) then the total will be 200 as well...

But this is far too simplistic, you need wicket-takers as well as economical bowlers in a lineup.

 

[Ellipsism]

Team A has 5 bowlers who give 40 runs on average. Target will be 200 runs for them.

Team B has 5 bowlers who give 60 runs on average. Target will be 300 runs for them.

Which team do you think will win?

Cricket isn't that simple- Using your logic we could calculate the total that Pakistan would concede each game by using each bowlers economy rate.

With wickets in hand batsman, can go all out at the death. Say for example, Team A was 180/2 (40) and Team B was 220/7 (40)- Team B would be looking to conserve wickets whilst Team A can go all guns blazing.

 

[Bilal7]

Team A has 5 bowlers who give 40 runs on average. Target will be 200 runs for them.

Team B has 5 bowlers who give 60 runs on average. Target will be 300 runs for them.

Which team do you think will win?

Massive flaw in your reasoning. You said 60/3, not 60/0. Team B will bowl out the opposition for 180. Team A, even if they are all as economical as you say, will still concede 200+. Most probably though, Team A will get murdered in the last 10 and concede over 350 because they were unable to take wickets and the opposing batsmen could come out swinging.

60/3 is far better than 40/0, especially for one of your specialist bowlers and spearheads.

 

[Hasan123]

Wahab is pure lottery especially in LO. How anyone can have faith in him is beyond me.

 

[msb314]

With the new ball - Amir remains our best bowler despite his inconsistency.

He is followed by Junaid, Hassan and Sohail Khan.

Wahab is rubbsih and so is Rahat "The Destroyer". The less said about Bhatti, Anwar Ali, Imran Khan etc. the better.

 

[Hawkeye]

You clearly won't get rid of your delusions no matter what happens. Junaid can be one of the best bowlers in the tournament and you'll still call him crap, while insisting that Kamran open the batting for us.



Err... I was talking about Wahab Riaz, not Junaid Khan. Please read more carefully next time.

Hahahha. Just asking a question.

Look at his performances. How anyone sane can support him?

He badly failed in last Champions Trophy too. So my question is, despite his constant failures, if he fails in CT too, what will be your stance?

 

[DRsohail]

Indeed he is a good LO bowler, very good with oldish ball. But, the game isn't played that way - it's all about combination. His job was made easy by the 2 early wickets with new ball, something he isn't good at using. Also, he had 282 to defend on a 240 per wicket, but all the credit for bowling intelligently & setting up perfectly.

after a long time a good performer in domestic gets chances and he proved to be the best so far..the conclusion is that we need to givr these young fast bowlers chances at highest level otherwise they will fade away..am i right??/ same apply for the batsmen..

 

[dildildalwalla]

I've always liked Ali. He is quick, gets swing, is intense and picks up wickets. I just hope he can start translating better to test cricket and becomes a major factor in the CT.

 

[Bilal7]

Hahahha. Just asking a question.

Look at his performances. How anyone sane can support him?

He badly failed in last Champions Trophy too. So my question is, despite his constant failures, if he fails in CT too, what will be your stance?

I question the sanity of someone who supports a TTF like Kamran, who has a batting average in the 20s, not someone who supports Junaid who took two wickets in his last game, bowled superbly at the death and has a bowling average in the 20s.

 

[Hamza_]

I question the sanity of someone who supports a TTF like Kamran, who has a batting average in the 20s, not someone who supports Junaid who took two wickets in his last game, bowled superbly at the death and has a bowling average in the 20s.

Soon his average will be 30+

 

[Syed1]

Soon his average will be 30+

Same cannot be said of Kami's batting average.


Checkmate.

 

[Bilal7]

Same cannot be said of Kami's batting average.


Checkmate.

) Brutal.

 

[Hawkeye]

I question the sanity of someone who supports a TTF like Kamran, who has a batting average in the 20s, not someone who supports Junaid who took two wickets in his last game, bowled superbly at the death and has a bowling average in the 20s.

You're dodging the question again.

Junaid has made multiple comebacks in recent past and failed in all, single-handedly lost his team the matches in the PSL as well.

So, if he fails in CT too, will you call Junaid out or keep supporting him blindly?

Kami has just made a comeback and has the ability to play pace, so we'll judge him how he does in CT and against good teams with pace attacks. If he fails, he'll be called out.

But the same cannot be expected of Junaid clan.

 

[Bilal7]

You're dodging the question again.

Junaid has made multiple comebacks in recent past and failed in all, single-handedly lost his team the matches in the PSL as well.

So, if he fails in CT too, will you call Junaid out or keep supporting him blindly?

Kami has just made a comeback and has the ability to play pace, so we'll judge him how he does in CT and against good teams with pace attacks. If he fails, he'll be called out.

But the same cannot be expected of Junaid clan.

There is no dodging. The entire reason I support Junaid is because he is a quality bowler who was hampered by injury but now seems to be fit. He bowled very well in Australia and bowled well in the last game too, of course you don't see it. If Junaid has a shocker and fails in multiple series/tournaments then he is no longer a quality bowler and won't be supported by me.

Kamran's ability to play pace has a ceiling of 25 runs. The fact that he's 35 years old and you still haven't realized this makes you a really strange person.

 

[Hawkeye]

There is no dodging. The entire reason I support Junaid is because he is a quality bowler who was hampered by injury but now seems to be fit. He bowled very well in Australia and bowled well in the last game too, of course you don't see it. If Junaid has a shocker and fails in multiple series/tournaments then he is no longer a quality bowler and won't be supported by me.

Kamran's ability to play pace has a ceiling of 25 runs. The fact that he's 35 years old and you still haven't realized this makes you a really strange person.

I'm glad you said that. And you judge batsmen (who have set the domestic/PSL on fire) 'after' their comeback performances. Not their history. Age is not the factor - Malik and Hafeez are 35, but averaging better than their entire previous past.

Let's judge cricketers objectively, not because of likes/dislikes. I have no interest in Kami, except he's a better opener than alternatives and let's see what he does in CT/other series against pace bowling sides.

 

[saeedhk]

Junaid , Wahab and Amir are absolute garbage bowlers. The obsessions with Amir is truly nauseating; he has been mediocre since his comeback. He should be booted out from the team. The fact that a youngster Hassan Ali has outbowled all these three legends sums up their mediocrity.

 

[Bilal7]

I'm glad you said that. And you judge batsmen (who have set the domestic/PSL on fire) 'after' their comeback performances. Not their history. Age is not the factor - Malik and Hafeez are 35, but averaging better than their entire previous past.

Let's judge cricketers objectively, not because of likes/dislikes. I have no interest in Kami, except he's a better opener than alternatives and let's see what he does in CT/other series against pace bowling sides.

I was one of those that wanted to give Kami a chance but it's clear that he hasn't improved one bit. If he can't score runs in the West Indies, he's definitely not scoring any in the CT.

 

[Speedster777]

This is a never ending cycle. PCB selects TTFs before CT and WC they lead us to embarrassing defeat then PCB discards them only to recall them again before major tournaments.

Akmals have connections both the brothers are atrocious players and fixers yet they're selected again and again they're part of every major tournament on zero merit. Umar and Kamran are true definition of TTF. Even Hafeez is better compared to these guys.

 

[Rayyman]

Junaid Khan with a poor economy today, even though he bowled three maidens.

Hasan and Amir are locks to start in CT.

Who should be 3rd and 4th pacers?

Imo neither Junaid nor Wahab. I like Yamin and Sohail as the 2 other options.

This adds firepower to the lower order too.

6. Imad
7. Yamin
8. Shadab
9. Sohail
10. Amir
11. Hasan

What a bowling lineup!

 

[Chief Destroyer]

Junaid Khan with a poor economy today, even though he bowled three maidens.

Hasan and Amir are locks to start in CT.

Who should be 3rd and 4th pacers?

Imo neither Junaid nor Wahab. I like Yamin and Sohail as the 2 other options.

This adds firepower to the lower order too.

6. Imad
7. Yamin
8. Shadab
9. Sohail
10. Amir
11. Hasan

What a bowling lineup!

Bashir, Irfan, Sultan if you want young pacers.