Azeem Rafiq accused of sending 'creepy' messages to teenage girl six years ago

[TAK]

Azeem Rafiq accused of sending 'creepy' messages to teenage girl six years ago

Gayathri Ajith said he sent the inappropriate Whatsapp messages to her in December 2015, three months after they met on a flight from Manchester to Dubai.

Ms Ajith, who was 16-years-old when they met, said she told the professional cricketer she was 17 to “seem a bit older” and agreed to have a vodka coke with him on the plane, but turned down an invitation to have dinner with him in Dubai.

Screenshots of messages from a number belonging to Mr Rafiq, sent in December 2015, read: "u know what I wanted to do on the plane?" and "I want to grab you push u up against wall and kiss you".

When she said "do you realise that I'm only 17?" she was asked: "Does tht mean it not allowed to want to kiss me" and “Wud u have let me kiss u?”

Ms Ajith, who is now 22 and lives in Yorkshire, described his message as "creepy" and was so perturbed by Mr Rafiq, she asked: "How do I know that you're no some absolute pervert"?.

She told The Yorkshire Post: “I was just kind of shocked by the crudity of those messages. They were just so vulgar.

“I'm not disputing any of his racism claims, because I'm sure they're very true experiences. But certain aspects of what he said just don't really sit right with me.

“If he was being forced to drink by his teammates, then surely that wouldn’t then mean he would be drinking alone on a flight and encouraging a 17-year-old girl to be drinking with him."

She added: “His behaviour towards me was a direct contradiction really of what he said in his testimony.

“He's calling for equality and respect, but why is he not embodying that in all aspects? Especially in his tone towards women. It’s hypocrisy.

“He is being put on this pedestal for inciting systemic change, but he's really contributing to the problem of the vulgar attitudes towards women. The whole nature of that dosen’t sit right with me.”

A spokesman for Mr Rafiq said: “This was put to us late on a Friday evening. We need to look into this, so cannot comment further for now.”

Mr Rafiq has been praised for calling out the racist abuse he suffered at the hands of coaches and teammates while playing for Yorkshire County Cricket.

It comes after the club conducted an investigation which found that the former spin bowler had suffered racial harassment and bullying, but decided that no-one would face disciplinary action.

The married 30-year-old, also told a Digital, Culture, Media and Sport select committee this week that English cricket is "institutionally" racist, but by speaking out he hopes there will be "massive change in five years' time".

Earlier this week, he apologised after it was revealed he had posted anti-Semitic messages as a teenager in 2011.

https://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/new...essages-to-teenage-girl-six-years-ago-3464984

 

[RexRex]

https://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/new...essages-to-teenage-girl-six-years-ago-3464984

Wow .. so not only is he an antisemite, he was sexually pursuing a minor. This person is more creepy than most of us thought he was.

 

[Mamoon]

What a despicable human being he is. You cannot get lower than this. A fraud, a liar, a racist, a harasser.

If he was racially abused at Yorkshire I would say they let him off easily, he deserved and deserves to be treated a lot worse than that.

The way he is being humiliated and his drama is crashing down and backfiring in spectacular fashion is extremely satisfying to watch.

 

[shah_1]

Damn he is exposed as a person

 

[SpiritOf1903]

This isn't going well at all .. he might end up in the mire. Mental health issues is right. Maybe Dobell was playing the long game ..

 

[DeadlyVenom]

More texts will be out soon, particularly with women, perhaps when married.

Unfortunately positioning Azeem as anti-racist messiah was doomed to fail. Ex-colleagues and the media were going to come at him hard to protect themselves, he doesnt have many Asian allies in the game either and has a lot of skeletona in the closet.

Part of me wonders whether the press coverage and low ball questions in thr select commitee was a deliberate attempt to raise him up and publicly tear him down.

 

[Technics 1210]

He must be sued for every penny he's got including the 200K payout.

 

[TAK]

Rafiq knew what was coming:

The group that released his social media stuff to the Times are Yorkshire fans…who know that heads had to roll at Yorkshire…they also, through connections with the people he’s named, know that he’s implicated and shamed people who’ve done no wrong, that he’s lied and embellished.

What’s going to follow now is a feee for all.

 

[Technics 1210]

He can pay for his legal defence using the 200K he received. The no win no fee service must not apply to him.

 

[Rana]

He’s a rubbish guy but still, institutionalized racism exists in cricket.

 

[MenInG]

He must be sued for every penny he's got including the 200K payout.

Could you please detail out the charges that you as a lawyer on behalf of the millions would put in court of this litigation?

 

[Technics 1210]

Could you please detail out the charges that you as a lawyer on behalf of the millions would put in court of this litigation?

Racism and perjury.

More could be added as revealtions comes.

 

[Technics 1210]

Racism and perjury.

More could be added as revealtions comes.

Forgot to add Defamation of Character/Libelous

 

[Rana]

Forgot to add Defamation of Character/Libelous

Is your issue with the individual or the issue he is trying to tackle?

The issue exists. Racism in cricket exists my friend. He is a bad person, but the issue that has been raised through him required a major clean up in the system. Hopefully we will be getting that much required clean up.

 

[Technics 1210]

Is your issue with the individual or the issue he is trying to tackle?

The issue exists. Racism in cricket exists my friend. He is a bad person, but the issue that has been raised through him required a major clean up in the system. Hopefully we will be getting that much required clean up.

Where did I say racism doesn't exist?

Is the issue new? Certainly not.

Is your issue I am not supporting the narrative of Azeem and being objective based on my experience?

You have admitted he's a bad person, doesn't change racism exists but does change Azeem's motive - this is my issue. Azeem's motive isn't tackling racism bit filling his pockets.

Speaking of tackling racism; how's it going? Was Azeem the first to highlight racism in Cricket? What will change he revelation? YCCC has been under the rader of racism for yonks. What has changed and what will change for YCCC. Asians will remain a minority in the UK. Or you waiting for an Asian starting 11 for England?

Let me tell you a clear change - there are more Asians representing County/National teams compared with 70s/80s based on merit.

Racism isn't going anywhere. You and anyone who believes Azeem's publicity stunt will change anything is naive.

 

[MenInG]

Racism and perjury.

More could be added as revealtions comes.

Forgot to add Defamation of Character/Libelous

Think you are very confused.

Defamation of whom, libel against whom?

Have the people he has accused actually denied they did what he said they did?

What will your law suit entail? What do you expect from it as a result?

 

[IMMY69]

For Rafeeq to be sued the accused will have to prove they weren't racist in the first place.

The law won't just consider Rafeeq's background, they look at the surrounding circumstances. Historic messages. Independant reports, other players statements and the joint county statement which admits to there being racism.

People have come out and apologised to him so it would look somewhat strange if they were now to sue him.

But here is the crux. The allegations of racism snd name calling were done in front of. parliamentary committee. From what I understand this would protect him from prosecution and being sued on a personal level. On this last point, do correct me if I am wrong.

 

[Technics 1210]

Think you are very confused.

Defamation of whom, libel against whom?

Have the people he has accused actually denied they did what he said they did?

What will your law suit entail? What do you expect from it as a result?

Micheal Vaughan and Alex Hales have denied the allegations of racism. You understand what deformation of character is right? It's not what someone says, it's accusing someone of being something they are not. Thus being Libelous.

I just told you what the law suit would entail, and from the basis of the latest revelations, sexual harresment may be added to the list.

 

[IMMY69]

Texting a 16 year old girl like he did was sleazy but it's a bit early to be calling it sexual harassment.

 

[MenInG]

Micheal Vaughan and Alex Hales have denied the allegations of racism. You understand what deformation of character is right? It's not what someone says, it's accusing someone of being something they are not. Thus being Libelous.

I just told you what the law suit would entail, and from the basis of the latest revelations, sexual harresment may be added to the list.

A few facts:

1. You are not a lawyer but a layman on an internet forum so please stop sharing your views as if its considered legal opinion

2. Vaughan's statements have been corroborated by Adil and Rana Naved in public

3. Hales has denied and you can argue that Hales word vs Azeem's holds more value as things stand.

 

[Ahmad-GERMANFC]

Texting a 16 year old girl like he did was sleazy but it's a bit early to be calling it sexual harassment.

That’s textbook definition of harassment of a minor.

Additionally his whole sob story of being forced to drink comes crashing down

He is a despicable person and he has set the Asian community far back

 

[Technics 1210]

A few facts:

1. You are not a lawyer but a layman on an internet forum so please stop sharing your views as if its considered legal opinion

2. Vaughan's statements have been corroborated by Adil and Rana Naved in public

3. Hales has denied and you can argue that Hales word vs Azeem's holds more value as things stand.

1. You a lawyer? I live in the UK and understand thenlaw better than anyone who doesn’t live in the UK. Do you live in the UK?

2. Adil and Rana corroborated on what was said, so what? What was said doesn’t constitute to racism based on UK law. Meaning just cos one said ‘you lot’ this doesn’t mean said person is racist. Speaking of corroborating, Root does not agree with Azeem. What’s your point?

3. Now you are getting there, it’s Azeem’s words vs others, Azeem has not produced any empirical evidence of racism other than a hollow cry that he should’ve played for England based on his 2017 stats.

The only empirical evidence is against Azeem - his anti-Semitic messages, and further to come.

Azeem is toast. Fact.

 

[Technics 1210]

One more point, you ask me for my opinion - sharing my views, MiG.

 

[Rana]

Where did I say racism doesn't exist?

Is the issue new? Certainly not.

Is your issue I am not supporting the narrative of Azeem and being objective based on my experience?

You have admitted he's a bad person, doesn't change racism exists but does change Azeem's motive - this is my issue. Azeem's motive isn't tackling racism bit filling his pockets.

Speaking of tackling racism; how's it going? Was Azeem the first to highlight racism in Cricket? What will change he revelation? YCCC has been under the rader of racism for yonks. What has changed and what will change for YCCC. Asians will remain a minority in the UK. Or you waiting for an Asian starting 11 for England?

Let me tell you a clear change - there are more Asians representing County/National teams compared with 70s/80s based on merit.

Racism isn't going anywhere. You and anyone who believes Azeem's publicity stunt will change anything is naive.

What about all of those people who have suffered racism, prejudice over the decades with no monetary compensation whatsoever? Maybe AZeem is in it to fill up his pockets, but you must remember that there are hundreds, thousands who will never get any compensation for the abuse they suffered. I firmly believe that money will do him no good if the intention is evil, but the damage he has caused to white supremacy and elitism in the game is irreparable

 

[Technics 1210]

What about all of those people who have suffered racism, prejudice over the decades with no monetary compensation whatsoever? Maybe AZeem is in it to fill up his pockets, but you must remember that there are hundreds, thousands who will never get any compensation for the abuse they suffered. I firmly believe that money will do him no good if the intention is evil, but the damage he has caused to white supremacy and elitism in the game is irreparable

Dear friend. Why are you equating racism with money. This highlights the motive.

The fact you mention compensation highlights the very problem in tackling racism in the UK - it’s not about the cause, but about the money - compensation culture. Claiming racism is a lucrative way out.

When claims of racism are sincere, people will listen - Stephen Lawrence.

 

[dildilpak]

What a creep - Hitting on a teenager & an anti-semitic to boot! The racism might be real, but boy he makes some of the hazing incidents he mentioned in his testimony disbelievable. The girl should bring charges on him.

 

[Majestic_Inzi]

The girl said she was 17 years old and he was 24 years old. What laws has he broken in UK?

 

[DeadlyVenom]

The girl said she was 17 years old and he was 24 years old. What laws has he broken in UK?

Under 18 cant drink in the UK.

Probably no laws broken but it shows he was a bit of a slimeball. The girl probably got a couple of G's for selling her story

 

[mazkhan]

In this case azeem has done nothing wrong the age of consent in the UK is 16 .

And uk has some of the highest teenage pregnancy rates below 16 in the developed world so these girls are clued on about sexual activities anyway.

U can't have one rule for this girl and another for shamima begum who was a school girl 15 at the time.

Plus the girl said she was 17

I'm not excusing his actions but atm you can't call him a pedophile .

 

[Majestic_Inzi]

The age of consent in the UK is 16 years old.

The witch hunt has begun, i couldnt care less about Azeem but this racism in cricket gotta stop, why are asian cricketers not playing professional cricket.

 

[Vildoc]

He’s a rubbish guy but still, institutionalized racism exists in cricket.

Agree on both.

 

[Majestic_Inzi]

There is clearly someone doing a background check on Azeem, it wasnt done before its only began when the ecb has become involved. Hmmm

But regardless things need to change in cricket.

 

[MenInG]

One more point, you ask me for my opinion - sharing my views, MiG.

No problem there at all - this is a forum for discussions.

I really have nothing more to add.

 

[Technics 1210]

In this case azeem has done nothing wrong the age of consent in the UK is 16 .

And uk has some of the highest teenage pregnancy rates below 16 in the developed world so these girls are clued on about sexual activities anyway.

U can't have one rule for this girl and another for shamima begum who was a school girl 15 at the time.

Plus the girl said she was 17

I'm not excusing his actions but atm you can't call him a pedophile .

Correct. There is no case of underage sexual activities. So we can drop this underage malarky.

However recall Tim Paine and his text. He resigned despite the texts between 2 adults. we can all read PP views on that episode.

Given the latest revelations, if true, there can be ground of sexual harresment beyond the legal age of consent.

 

[Bewal Express]

He can pay for his legal defence using the 200K he received. The no win no fee service must not apply to him.

He got a 6 figure offer

 

[MesonK]

This man is an attention seeker and a drama queen.

 

[Bewal Express]

There are lots of different issues being conflated into a free for all. YK have on their books people who have used racial language when such language has been widely accepted to be racist since the mid 1980s, it has been revealed by a guy who didn't achieve his potential and is looking for money and is a very flawed character. In my opinion His career wasn't affected by an racism, he wasn't good enough after his initial success but that doesn't mean that he hasn't revealed the mindset of some YK players.

 

[TAK]

He can pay for his legal defence using the 200K he received. The no win no fee service must not apply to him.

His case was taken on no win no fee but his payout also includes the 70K legal fees he's incurred...

 

[rhony]

Someone with a better stature like Rasheed or Moeen need to own this going forward so the racism case doesn't get derailed. Pandora's box has been opened and Azeem is done.

 

[Kroll]

This reminds me of the old 'kiss and tell' stories of famous footballers in the low quality tabloids back in the day. Seems like everyone is in for a quick buck.

 

[BunnyRabbit]

Azeem may be an awful person in life and should be held accountable but this should not be an excuse to let racism run rampant.

 

[Bewal Express]

Someone with a better stature like Rasheed or Moeen need to own this going forward so the racism case doesn't get derailed. Pandora's box has been opened and Azeem is done.

Totally agree. We have lots of players who have credibility and generally are well liked by their team mates and fans.

 

[Bewal Express]

This reminds me of the old 'kiss and tell' stories of famous footballers in the low quality tabloids back in the day. Seems like everyone is in for a quick buck.

He should have said from the outset that I am not perfect and I,too am a flawed character. He tried to make out that he is totally innocent and there was some massive conspiracy against him, which there wasn't. He has in pursuit of compensation revealed the mindset of some YK players and that has shone a light on prejudice.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

Someone with a better stature like Rasheed or Moeen need to own this going forward so the racism case doesn't get derailed. Pandora's box has been opened and Azeem is done.

100%.

This an important movement that will be derailed by these shenanigans.

 

[James]

The broader investigation into racism within cricket must continue.

Clearly there is nobody in this world without skeletons in their closet, which we are being well and truly reminded of this week.

 

[Saj]

I think some of these 'discoveries' about Azeem Rafiq should not cloud the fact that racism is a huge problem in English cricket.

 

[street cricketer]

Not been a good week for Paine and Azeem.

Their past coming back to haunt them.

 

[Giannis]

Seems convinient for all this to be coming out around the YCC are being slammed. Looks like the club/cricket establishment are forking out as much money possible to get all the dirt on Rafiq. Character assassination is the typical route to discredit someone. Not saying he's not a dbag for these alleged actions but the timing of all this is very suspicious.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

I mean its obvious they are trying to discredit the attention he is bringing to the issue of institutional racism.

But that doesn't mean all this isn't extremely creepy and sleazy, bordering on sexual harassment. It might just be sexual harassment depending on what the girl thinks.

What Azeem Rafiq said about racism was powerful and I'm glad he brought attention to something that is clearly rampant within English cricket. Really hope the debate on that does not die down till there is actual structural change.

But I'm afraid I've lost all respect for Rafiq as a human being after this. Anyone who behaves like this with a 17 year old is a creep and a lowlife who I cannot respect as a person.

 

[Cricketrenew]

When he came in front of the enquiry, dirt was definitely going to be found about him, there will be more.

1. Does this mean racism did not exist and his experiences didnt happen.

The witchhunt is a means to stop other people coming forward, any person coming forward will have thier life analysed deeply to ever regret coming forward. It always happens whatever side of an argument you are on, the other side will try and cause distractions. These are cricketers not politicians and they make no law they just show what has happened to them, so makes me wonder why so many people want to keep the Status Quo?

Do we expect Azeem to respond to every story that comes out? If anyone has a problem take him to court Otherwise its just people trying detract from the many story, Racism.

 

[Giannis]

I mean its obvious they are trying to discredit the attention he is bringing to the issue of institutional racism.

But that doesn't mean all this isn't extremely creepy and sleazy, bordering on sexual harassment. It might just be sexual harassment depending on what the girl thinks.

What Azeem Rafiq said about racism was powerful and I'm glad he brought attention to something that is clearly rampant within English cricket. Really hope the debate on that does not die down till there is actual structural change.

But I'm afraid I've lost all respect for Rafiq as a human being after this. Anyone who behaves like this with a 17 year old is a creep and a lowlife who I cannot respect as a person.

Well he is a creep and a perv but would it make it better if she were 18? He didn't violate age of consent laws in his country. Yes, it's weird but lets not conflate this with actual abuse of prepubescent children such as at the Catholic church.

 

[ElRaja]

the only real issue here is that its obvious he liked a drink. texting who he thought was a 17 year old wont get him into too much trouble.

im guessing theres more skeletons in the closet tho.

 

[MenInG]

I think some of these 'discoveries' about Azeem Rafiq should not cloud the fact that racism is a huge problem in English cricket.

Think you will find that is exactly the agenda for some.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

Well he is a creep and a perv but would it make it better if she were 18? He didn't violate age of consent laws in his country. Yes, it's weird but lets not conflate this with actual abuse of prepubescent children such as at the Catholic church.

I'm not conflating anything. Calling him a molester would be conflating. And look we can debate semantics all day but you even if it wasn't sexual harassment (which I think it probably was), or not in violation of UK consent laws, nobody can deny that this is an immensely creepy and perverted thing to do. And I simply cannot respect a person who engages in stuff like this.

 

[Babeikh]

It is pretty obvious what is happening here.

Whenever someone (from a position of weakness) challenges or embarrasses or exposes the 'establishment' the response from the establishment and their cronies / lackeys is exactly the same.

They go through each and every minute detail of the exposers life - from the detention he got at school when he was 13, to when he was slightly dishonest on the insurance form when claiming for a car accident, to when he under reported his income by a few grand to pay a little less tax, to when he tried to chat up a girl on a flight, to when he said something idiotic on social media when he was a teenager, to when he laughed at something when he was 25 etc etc etc. All the while this is happening, the establishment's little cronies, chacha Toms, lackeys etc are joining in the shouting saying 'LOOK, LOOK, LOOK AT HIM, LOOK WHAT HE DID' etc etc


The aim of doing this is two fold:

1. They want to scare off anyone who might think about challenging, embarrassing or exposing them again in the future. Because, of course, nobody is perfect. We have all made mistakes. We have all, at some point or another, done things, said things, treated someone badly etc Things which if seen in isolation would put question marks over our character. Historically this has worked very well - it is partly why the establishment has managed to remain the establishment!

2. They want to shift the conversation. So instead of talking about the real issues...the truth which Azeem has rightly exposed, the conversation shifts to Azeem's character as a human. Again the Chacha Tom lackeys lap it all up for their masters. Then people forget why we were actually here in the first place.

But I am sensing something different now, particularly with the younger generation. Do not underestimate the resolve! Azeem will not be the last.

 

[dildilpak]

I think some of these 'discoveries' about Azeem Rafiq should not cloud the fact that racism is a huge problem in English cricket.

Is racism that affects Asians the only problem in the world? A young girl was sent creepy messages by an anti-semitic pervert, but it is disturbing that some here are trying to dismiss them saying it is above the age of consent. And you too are trying to imply that they are coming to discredit him - well, the girl had nothing to gain by bringing forth those texts & the fact whether that phone number belongs to Azeem Rafiq will be pretty easy to verify.

Does racism exist in Yorkshire cricket- maybe yes. But now questions will be asked how much Azeem Rafiq’s testimony is credible - he implied racism because he was forcefed liquor, but then he is out harassing girls after drinking.. how do you ensure that he is not embellishing stuff because he was bitter about certain people?

 

[Giannis]

Is racism that affects Asians the only problem in the world? A young girl was sent creepy messages by an anti-semitic pervert, but it is disturbing that some here are trying to dismiss them saying it is above the age of consent. And you too are trying to imply that they are coming to discredit him - well, the girl had nothing to gain by bringing forth those texts & the fact whether that phone number belongs to Azeem Rafiq will be pretty easy to verify.

Does racism exist in Yorkshire cricket- maybe yes. But now questions will be asked how much Azeem Rafiq’s testimony is credible - he implied racism because he was forcefed liquor, but then he is out harassing girls after drinking.. how do you ensure that he is not embellishing stuff because he was bitter about certain people?

If you watch his press conference, he says he said he started drinking due to peer pressure when got into county cricket, he said he fell away from his religion and was ashamed of the stuff he did early in his career, so him drinking/offering liquor at the time isn't a surprise when he's already admitted to have gone through that phase.

 

[dildilpak]

If you watch his press conference, he says he said he started drinking due to peer pressure when got into county cricket, he said he fell away from his religion and was ashamed of the stuff he did early in his career, so him drinking/offering liquor at the time isn't a surprise when he's already admitted to have gone through that phase.

Look everything is not about racism. Many universities/sororities used to have hazing customs when the new guys were forced to drink. Such things are common across the world. To associate that with racism is an issue - especially when you yourself drink to fit into the crowd.

Again i am not denying that racism could exist in English cricket, but trying to discredit people who bring out issues in his character is also a problem. It is equally true that just like he makes accusations against others, people can also accuse him. He can be a victim of racism, but can be sexist & anti-semitic himself and that’s something he will have to deal with.

 

[Giannis]

Look everything is not about racism. Many universities/sororities used to have hazing customs when the new guys were forced to drink. Such things are common across the world. To associate that with racism is an issue - especially when you yourself drink to fit into the crowd.

Again i am not denying that racism could exist in English cricket, but trying to discredit people who bring out issues in his character is also a problem. It is equally true that just like he makes accusations against others, people can also accuse him. He can be a victim of racism, but can be sexist & anti-semitic himself and that’s something he will have to deal with.

True but the timing is just odd, it's a typical character assasination plot that you see during election campaigns. Notice how all the dirt about Trump and Biden comes out during elections but then everything is forgotten cause the whole point is to use these allegations to discredit them.

 

[Saj]

The witchhunt is a means to stop other people coming forward, any person coming forward will have thier life analysed deeply to ever regret coming forward. It always happens whatever side of an argument you are on, the other side will try and cause distractions. These are cricketers not politicians and they make no law they just show what has happened to them, so makes me wonder why so many people want to keep the Status Quo?

A very valid and important point.

I've had a few guys say to me today, this is why we didn't want to speak up because they would start digging up all sorts of stuff about us and our families.

 

[dildilpak]

True but the timing is just odd, it's a typical character assasination plot that you see during election campaigns. Notice how all the dirt about Trump and Biden comes out during elections but then everything is forgotten cause the whole point is to use these allegations to discredit them.

Such things happen when you are in the limelight. Rafiq, a man who was virtually a nobody so far is the current man of the hour so when his image is splashed on TV sets everywhere people who would have usually forgotten stuff about him would remember past stuff associated with him. Doesnt mean they are not credible & should not be investigated.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

the only real issue here is that its obvious he liked a drink. texting who he thought was a 17 year old wont get him into too much trouble.

im guessing theres more skeletons in the closet tho.

Even liking a drink isn't really an issue in Britain, neither is hitting on a girl who's not a minor. The guy was obviously one of those party type lads which you often find, but that's not a crime in itself, neither does it diminish the racism that has been rumbling in Yorkshire for decades.

Obviously he has ruffled some feathers and he is going to get some blowback, but for the rest of the British Pak community his case will still pave the way for better opportunities.

 

[NeVerMind]

Nothing but a witch-hunt now... don't question your position and speak out against the white patriarchal hierarchy or they destroy you with any means necessary...seen this many times at the early part of my career in the UK and why I never spoke out against the racism in my youth...would do things very differently now but as the saying goes "Youth is wasted on the young"...feel sorry for Rafiq but this was expected..it's what happens to whistleblowers

 

[Varun]

Let's be real - everybody has a 10-15 social media/texting history which can be scoured with a fine toothed comb for anything remotely controversial.

The only ones insured are the likes of Donald Trump who go out all Guns blazing 24x7 with the detractors not knowing where to begin or end.

 

[Mamoon]

A very valid and important point.

I've had a few guys say to me today, this is why we didn't want to speak up because they would start digging up all sorts of stuff about us and our families.

If you are going to dig up stuff on other people, blame them, defame them and air their dirty laundry, why do you complain if they return the favor and do the same for you?

Why is right for you but wrong for them?

 

[Mamoon]

True but the timing is just odd, it's a typical character assasination plot that you see during election campaigns. Notice how all the dirt about Trump and Biden comes out during elections but then everything is forgotten cause the whole point is to use these allegations to discredit them.

So Rafiq can dig up dirt on others but others cannot dig up dirt on him. Interesting.

 

[Mamoon]

It is pretty obvious what is happening here.

Whenever someone (from a position of weakness) challenges or embarrasses or exposes the 'establishment' the response from the establishment and their cronies / lackeys is exactly the same.

They go through each and every minute detail of the exposers life - from the detention he got at school when he was 13, to when he was slightly dishonest on the insurance form when claiming for a car accident, to when he under reported his income by a few grand to pay a little less tax, to when he tried to chat up a girl on a flight, to when he said something idiotic on social media when he was a teenager, to when he laughed at something when he was 25 etc etc etc. All the while this is happening, the establishment's little cronies, chacha Toms, lackeys etc are joining in the shouting saying 'LOOK, LOOK, LOOK AT HIM, LOOK WHAT HE DID' etc etc


The aim of doing this is two fold:

1. They want to scare off anyone who might think about challenging, embarrassing or exposing them again in the future. Because, of course, nobody is perfect. We have all made mistakes. We have all, at some point or another, done things, said things, treated someone badly etc Things which if seen in isolation would put question marks over our character. Historically this has worked very well - it is partly why the establishment has managed to remain the establishment!

2. They want to shift the conversation. So instead of talking about the real issues...the truth which Azeem has rightly exposed, the conversation shifts to Azeem's character as a human. Again the Chacha Tom lackeys lap it all up for their masters. Then people forget why we were actually here in the first place.

But I am sensing something different now, particularly with the younger generation. Do not underestimate the resolve! Azeem will not be the last.

Rafiq took a stand against racism but it turns out that he himself holds racist views against Jews and blacks.

So why should not be exposed as a fraud and a hypocrite that he is?

The establishment will remain the establishment when frauds and hypocrites take a stand against them because it doesn’t take long to expose them.

For institutional racism to be tackled, real and genuine people who have been victims of racial abuse need to stand up and make their voices heard, and their struggle will have a significant impact.

Rafiq’s fight against racism crashed harder than his cricket career not because of the evil establishment but because he is a fraud and a hypocrite.

 

[Ahmad-GERMANFC]

A very valid and important point.

I've had a few guys say to me today, this is why we didn't want to speak up because they would start digging up all sorts of stuff about us and our families.

If that is the case then don’t do that in the first place.

These people are making it sound lol everyone by default has a ton of skeletons in their cupboard. That is not the case with normal folks.

 

[Spitfire]

It clearly seems that the main motive of Rafiq to come out with racism claims was financial gains. What prompted this was a case of sour grapes and jealousy as his playing career didn't take off the way he hoped, largely due to the fact that he wasn't good enough.

Yes, the racism was and remains rampant at YCCC and other counties but he did not raise concerns for the right reasons.

If Rafiq was able to forge a more successful career. Would he have rocked the boat and cried racism?

With all the stuff coming out right now, he seems to be the sort where the fame would have gone to his head and would have carried on with his shenanigans.

If someone far less controversial and more high profile in the English setup like Moeen, Adil or someone from a Caribbean background like Chris Jordan would have raised it. It would have definitely carried a lot more weight and made a lot bigger splash.

 

[khan991]

You clearly haven’t lived outside pakistan. What an ignorant point of view. These issue are vastly different from each other. Systematic racism is the main issue here not an individual’s personal mishaps.

 

[Waq]

With this latest sexting revelation along with concerns of Rafiq himself making racial comments, it’s becoming very difficult to defend him and perhaps I’m even looking at the institutional racism with a different pair of eyes.

Yes institutional racism and direct racism incidents seem to have occurred where Rafiq was a victim. I’m glad that it has gone to parliamentary levels and there maybe a positive outcome and sometimes positive discrimination and quotas can help at school boy levels if it is felt that a middle class white boy will get more support and opportunity then their Asian peers, particularly if the white middle class white boy is a 3rd generation player and mother is club secretary etc. At the same point, the Asian community has to integrate more on their own accord.

I’m a typical second generation Pakistani born in the UK. I have two teenage children and throughout their lifetime, I’ve been a governor at one of their schools, volunteered at school trips and school fetes, became a coach at their Sunday football team when they were younger, I have joined their village cricket team as a senior player where my kids are juniors and I also box at the same boxing club as my children and started doing jiu jitsu recently at their BJJ gym. Yes it seems like a lot and this is personal choice but my kids love dad being part of their hobbies and we are integrated into society and local community. I also see many parents who drop their kids in the car park and collect them from there and most are from a non white background I’m sad to say.

Going back to Rafiq….

I’ve also maintained up to now that it is irrelevant whether Rafiq was a good person or a good cricketer but my mind is now swaying. Sexting and pursuing a 15 year old who lied she was 17 and having racist tweets for all public to read shows the character and intellect of a man.

Many of us on this board I’m sure are no angels in our private lives and I have plenty of skeletons but I’m savvy enough to therefore not be a public figure and be exposed for wrongdoings.

I just don’t believe that Rafiq was merely an innocent victim of racism, as he seems a willing party of the lad’ish culture and drinking culture and perhaps even a participant of the racial banter.

Where the board have failed is that they didn’t remain impartial and didn’t investigate claims by Rafiq as a victim and acknowledge that the culture required changing. With all the bad press towards Bumble, Hoggard, Vaughan and Ballance etc then hopefully we won’t see another situation where words such as ‘Your lot’, ‘elephant washer’ and ‘p*ki’ becomes acceptable in the dressing room and change occurs.

Bumble made a point, albeit badly about the club house and that’s how integrating normally occurs. There needs to be some work around this.

My cricket club during games have and social events have a bbq. It is the usual non halal burgers and sausages and I’m sure if I said give me halal options that they would accommodate but I pop to nearby coffee shop and get a big pastry and coffee instead. These are the areas that require work in my opinion and more non white parents to come forward and want to integrate.

 

[Manunited18]

Where did I say racism doesn't exist?

Is the issue new? Certainly not.

Is your issue I am not supporting the narrative of Azeem and being objective based on my experience?

You have admitted he's a bad person, doesn't change racism exists but does change Azeem's motive - this is my issue. Azeem's motive isn't tackling racism bit filling his pockets.

Speaking of tackling racism; how's it going? Was Azeem the first to highlight racism in Cricket? What will change he revelation? YCCC has been under the rader of racism for yonks. What has changed and what will change for YCCC. Asians will remain a minority in the UK. Or you waiting for an Asian starting 11 for England?

Let me tell you a clear change - there are more Asians representing County/National teams compared with 70s/80s based on merit.

Racism isn't going anywhere. You and anyone who believes Azeem's publicity stunt will change anything is naive.

Asians are representing county age groups up to the academy ages , then they get fired off which is the issue. The academy reps in general are the cricketers in general who go on to play professional cricket.

 

[iniqbal223]

I think some of these 'discoveries' about Azeem Rafiq should not cloud the fact that racism is a huge problem in English cricket.

ok. And when will Asian cricketers start respecting women? That is also a crime, and more serious one

 

[Manunited18]

It clearly seems that the main motive of Rafiq to come out with racism claims was financial gains. What prompted this was a case of sour grapes and jealousy as his playing career didn't take off the way he hoped, largely due to the fact that he wasn't good enough.

Yes, the racism was and remains rampant at YCCC and other counties but he did not raise concerns for the right reasons.

If Rafiq was able to forge a more successful career. Would he have rocked the boat and cried racism?

With all the stuff coming out right now, he seems to be the sort where the fame would have gone to his head and would have carried on with his shenanigans.

If someone far less controversial and more high profile in the English setup like Moeen, Adil or someone from a Caribbean background like Chris Jordan would have raised it. It would have definitely carried a lot more weight and made a lot bigger splash.

It has made a massive impact. Every county in England will revise the player pathways which will prevent players of ethnic minorities being stuck in the system.

 

[Manunited18]

100%.

This an important movement that will be derailed by these shenanigans.

Far from the truth. I'm a member at Lccc, because of Azim rafeeqs experiences at Yorkshire, every county will have to revise player pathways which will enable players of ethnic minorities to continue in the system without obstacles which clearly were apparent.

 

[Saj]

ok. And when will Asian cricketers start respecting women? That is also a crime, and more serious one

Can you show me your evidence that no Asian cricketer respects women?

 

[Saj]

Asians are representing county age groups up to the academy ages , then they get fired off which is the issue. The academy reps in general are the cricketers in general who go on to play professional cricket.

Absolutely, and largely because the Asian lads or certainly most of them aren't seen as 'fitting' into the club. And largely down to the fact that the scouts and coaches and selectors see the Asian lads differently.

 

[Saj]

If you are going to dig up stuff on other people, blame them, defame them and air their dirty laundry, why do you complain if they return the favor and do the same for you?

Why is right for you but wrong for them?

Where does it end?

What was quite rightly highlighted as an important cricketing issue has now become a game. What happens next, Azeem's lawyers start digging up dirt regarding Vaughan, Ballance and others from many years ago, or start digging up stuff about their families?

They can dig up what they want regarding Azeem Rafiq, but his point about racism in cricket will always be a valid one.

 

[Salma_T]

ok. And when will Asian cricketers start respecting women? That is also a crime, and more serious one

When will men start respecting women....can name men of all backgrounds disrespecting women.....just had "cleanskin" Tim Paine just resigned over a sexting scandal. Whatever Azeem has done in relation to this doesn't make his racism complaints null and void!

 

[gazza619]

Can you show me your evidence that no Asian cricketer respects women?

Its ridiculous Saj that Asians think so bad of Asians. I say it is the slavery mindset which they would just not let go off.