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Did we miss a trick by not selecting Mohammad Hafeez & Imad Wasim for Asia Cup?

cricguru

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In UAE spinners seems to be taking more wickets and contains the net run rate. With that said do you think we have missed trick of not selecting Hafeez and Imad ? Don't forget Hafeez used to be #1 ODI spinner not long ago. * also my topic of selection of spinners is for UAE conditions or spin friendly sub continent conditions only..

Hafeez can be used as opener instead of Imam ul Haq
Imad can take place of Malik

Lets discuss !!
 
No we dont need Hafeez back in side.

Malik is in the team for his batting which is miles better then Imads, as bowlers not much difference between the 2.

Discussion over

Thread closed ;)
 
Hafeez has been opening since Inzamam's days. He has been nothing less than an absolute failure in that position. And at No. 3 aswell. His bowling is a short-term solution, it brings balance to the attack but a ban for chucking is always waiting around the corner.

I would have liked Imad in there possibly inplace of Faheem but you can't select someone who has failed a fitness test twice.

So no, we did not miss any trick.
 
In UAE spinners seems to be taking more wickets and contains the net run rate. With that said do you think we have missed trick of not selecting Hafeez and Imad ? Don't forget Hafeez used to be #1 ODI spinner not long ago. * also my topic of selection of spinners is for UAE conditions or spin friendly sub continent conditions only..

Hafeez can be used as opener instead of Imam ul Haq
Imad can take place of Malik

Lets discuss !!

Mickey Arthur said he would have liked to have Imad but he failed the fitness test.
 
Mickey Arthur said he would have liked to have Imad but he failed the fitness test.

I still think he would have gone with the same 11

In odis i think we can get away with it, but its tets I worry that he will once again go with one spinner
 
We need a proper spinner like Zafar in the squad.
 
The only slot where the second spinner could play was Fahim's, but Rana jee has been doing such a spectacular job since his debut that it is hard to bench him. Besides playing four pacers is a very attacking option.


I know Kohli isn't in the tourney, but when push comes to shove I would much rather have someone like Fahim bowling to Kohli rather than Nawaz/Zafar who would just be milked around and then smashed to long on/off boundaries as required.
 
Whatever trick you're talking about there, I am kinda actually glad we missed it. Especially if that trick includes Hafeez of all people :facepalm:
 
Why PPers hate Hafeez so much? He's no Kohli but he's always been a fairly decent batsman from Pakistan's standards. An average of 40ish with strike rate of 83-84 since 2015, these are good numbers.
 
I checked stats. Hafeez's last series was NZ tour where he scored 2 80s in 5 matches, which Pakistan lost 5-0. I am sure the remaining batsmen didn't set the stadium on fire.
 
I am glad we don't depend on "tricks" and depend on good performers and talent:ashwin
 
No we dont need Hafeez back in side.

Malik is in the team for his batting which is miles better then Imads, as bowlers not much difference between the 2.

Discussion over

Thread closed ;)

It's a dilemma. On the one hand, everyone wants to see the back of Hafeez, who has outlived his welcome by about five years. Yet the harsh truth is that there is no ready replacement for him. And by replacement, I mean not a batting allrounder, just a spinner who can be miserly and prize out key wickets. The problem here is Hafeez himself, not the selection. He simply never learnt to bowl well again without chucking.

Meanwhile, however, only someone who has not been paying attention for about three years would believe that Malik offers anything with the ball these days. He averages 60 with it since 2015, when Wasim debuted and is very rarely called on to bowl.

Wasim, recently the no 1 T20 bowler, averages 30 something with the ball and was a bone fide threat in the CT, taking the prize scalps of ABDV and Amla. He was also handy for scuffing the ball for the pacers, enabling them to get swing later. So he would absolutely be an asset in the UAE.

Batting wise, Malik is also becoming less and less reliable, averages 43, boosted by cheap runs against Lanka in the UAE, while Wasim goes at 35. The problem is that while Malik is counted on to be a middle order stalwart, capable of accelerating late, Wasim never quite progressed to the point where he could be relied on to play either role. Plus his fitness has gone downhill.

I would say that for the purposes only of the Asia cup, it would have made sense to swap Hafeez *and* Malik for Haris and Imad. Haris is twice the batsman of Hafeez and Malik combined, and can play an achor role, so even with Wasim being unreliable, you are covered in the batting stakes. Spin wise, we would be much much better off, with Haris being comfortable as good (or bad) as Malik and Hafeez, and Wasim being a real asset.
 
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It's a dilemma. On the one hand, everyone wants to see the back of Hafeez, who has outlived his welcome by about five years. Yet the harsh truth is that there is no ready replacement for him. And by replacement, I mean not a batting allrounder, just a spinner who can be miserly and prize out key wickets. The problem here is Hafeez himself, not the selection. He simply never learnt to bowl well again without chucking.

Meanwhile, however, only someone who has not been paying attention for about three years would believe that Malik offers anything with the ball these days. He averages 60 with it since 2015, when Wasim debuted and is very rarely called on to bowl.

Wasim, recently the no 1 T20 bowler, averages 30 something with the ball and was a bone fide threat in the CT, taking the prize scalps of ABDV and Amla. He was also handy for scuffing the ball for the pacers, enabling them to get swing later. So he would absolutely be an asset in the UAE.

Batting wise, Malik is also becoming less and less reliable, averages 43, boosted by cheap runs against Lanka in the UAE, while Wasim goes at 35. The problem is that while Malik is counted on to be a middle order stalwart, capable of accelerating late, Wasim never quite progressed to the point where he could be relied on to play either role. Plus his fitness has gone downhill.

I would say that for the purposes only of the Asia cup, it would have made sense to swap Hafeez *and* Malik for Haris and Imad. Haris is twice the batsman of Hafeez and Malik combined, and can play an achor role, so even with Wasim being unreliable, you are covered in the batting stakes. Spin wise, we would be much much better off, with Haris being comfortable as good (or bad) as Malik and Hafeez, and Wasim being a real asset.

Excellent post. The only down side of Haris over Malik is that Haris is an average player of spin and if we are to play him then he can only play 2nd down where he would have to face spinners most of the time.
 
Hafeez is a useless batsmen, and a pretty toothless bowler since ''correcting'' his action

Imad failed his fitness test, absolutely no exceptions can be made on fitness when you're trying to build a new culture centered on fitness

Nawaz is on par, if not better than either one. He can be brought in when needed
 
How many mistakes have srilanka made in these 2 Matches totally horrendous got to be their worst tournament ever
 
I get what the OP is saying, but rather than Imad, or Hafeez, would have love to see Usama Mir, or even Bilal Asif
 
Hafeez is a useless batsmen, and a pretty toothless bowler since ''correcting'' his action

Imad failed his fitness test, absolutely no exceptions can be made on fitness when you're trying to build a new culture centered on fitness

Nawaz is on par, if not better than either one. He can be brought in when needed

This is why I think it is apt that the thread talks about "missing a trick." Believe it or not, sometimes one needs to play the team that will win today, not the team that might win tomorrow.

I don't know if Nawaz is on par even. Same List A average and same ODI average as Wasim, but Wasim at least has a bit more pedigree, having performed with the ball in the CT. And then Imad is clearly better with the bat.

If one can play a specialist captain, despite his lack of fitness, why not a specialist spinner?
 
Hafeez was needed here,horses for courses guys horses for courses. But I don't think this Asia Cup has any relevance. Wasting yourself in this heat has no meaning . India is a superior side in both tests and ODIs ,it doesn't make any sense to play a depleted Indian side . Anyways Hafeez was needed .
 
Micky said Imad will be missed but rule is rule, he failed the fitness test.

Off topic: It was funny seen today when Bowler ( malinga ) was Bowling to Shehzad and the Umpire, all had big belleys. Both Malinga and Shehzad were lucky not to have Micky their coach.
 
This is why I think it is apt that the thread talks about "missing a trick." Believe it or not, sometimes one needs to play the team that will win today, not the team that might win tomorrow.

I don't know if Nawaz is on par even. Same List A average and same ODI average as Wasim, but Wasim at least has a bit more pedigree, having performed with the ball in the CT. And then Imad is clearly better with the bat.

If one can play a specialist captain, despite his lack of fitness, why not a specialist spinner?

The specialist captain passed the fitness test while the spinner didn't. It's as simple as that isn't it?
 
Hafeez was needed here,horses for courses guys horses for courses. But I don't think this Asia Cup has any relevance. Wasting yourself in this heat has no meaning . India is a superior side in both tests and ODIs ,it doesn't make any sense to play a depleted Indian side . Anyways Hafeez was needed .

Are you saying that India is a one man team?
 
Imad was not fit enough to pass the fitness test otherwise he would have been in the squad and in the playing IX for Faheem. Where as Hafeez goes you can only play him as a replacement for Faheem or Shadab as a bowling all rounder as all the batsman are currently in the side are better than him or in better form. We need players that can hit the ball in the lower order but Hafeez usually takes his time to get going so I do not see him getting into the playing IX ahead of Faheem or Shadab. If we really need another slow bowling option we might see Haris Sohail in place of Imam in the side or for Faheem if the wicket is very slow.
 
This is why I think it is apt that the thread talks about "missing a trick." Believe it or not, sometimes one needs to play the team that will win today, not the team that might win tomorrow.

I don't know if Nawaz is on par even. Same List A average and same ODI average as Wasim, but Wasim at least has a bit more pedigree, having performed with the ball in the CT. And then Imad is clearly better with the bat.

If one can play a specialist captain, despite his lack of fitness, why not a specialist spinner?

you can make up anything you want about Sarfraz's fitness in you mind

but facts are: Sarfraz passed (even excelled) on the fitness test, Imad failed
 
you can make up anything you want about Sarfraz's fitness in you mind

but facts are: Sarfraz passed (even excelled) on the fitness test, Imad failed

The lengths people go... :)))
 
No a specialist spinner should have been included, like Zafar.

Though having said that, probably Hafeez or Imad would outperform Nawaz currently.

It's funny though we're obssessed over these four allrounders Faheem, Hafeez, Imad, Nawaz. When none are that good of late, and if we think about it logically arguably a specialist bat or bowler would be an improvement over them. Especially since Shadab's shown his ability to bat at 7, and our batsmen have shown ability to bowl part time in Fakhar, Haris, Malik. I just don't like allrounders who don't make it in on one skill alone. Otherwise they have no room in the side. If any of those four allrounders play in the side, they'll be the worst of all the specialist batsmen, and the worst of all the specialist bowlers. Which places their worth really low in my eyes.
 
Hafeez gets picked: PP whines.
Hafeez gets dropped: PP whines
 
Excellent point, if we needed a spinner in sqaud it should be a specalist and not part timers.

I don't disagree, which is why I pointed out that Hafeez is missed not for his batting but his bowling. He regularly bowled the full 10 overs. As did Imad. But again, the problem is 1. not Hafeez's non selection, but that he can't bowl well anymore without chucking. 2. We have no specialist spinner worth their salt. I did realize that Nawaz has performed well recently with the ball, taking 4fers and 3fers in domestics, so perhaps he really is the best possible alternative.
 
What do you mean by specialist captain? Keeping is a job too and he is one of the safest keepers going around if you compare him with other keepers in world cricket now. Even if we take captaincy from him i still think he will be our first choice wicket keeper batsman as no one is close to Sarfraz as a keeper batsman in Pakistan. Never understood this specialist captain bit.
 
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Fine but what do you mean by specialist captain? Keeping is a job too and he is one of the safest keepers going around if you compare him with other keepers in world cricket now. Even if we take captaincy from him i still think he will be our first choice wicket keeper batsman as no one is close to Sarfraz as a keeper batsman in Pakistan. Never understood this specialist captain bit.

It's all tongue in cheek, ie I am not being serious. Because yes I agree with you. Maybe I should start using emoticons. I think the assumption is that other poster's would know one's positions, but I am not that frequent a poster on the board. Sigh.
 
It's all tongue in cheek, ie I am not being serious. Because yes I agree with you. Maybe I should start using emoticons. I think the assumption is that other poster's would know one's positions, but I am not that frequent a poster on the board. Sigh.

Yeah, I have followed your posts for a long time and your support for Sarfraz (when he deserved) so was bit surprised myself too when you labelled him as a specialist captain as i was quite sure you didn't mean it.
 
Huge trick!

We should also have selected the following in our extended squad:

Imran Farhat
Rao Ifthikar Anjum
Zulfiqar Babar
Yasir Hameed
Faizal Iqbal
Shan Masood
Rana Naveed
Junaid Zia
Akram Raza
Rizwan-uz-Zaman
Sohail Tanwir
Awais Zia
Wajahatullah Wasti
 
Huge trick!

We should also have selected the following in our extended squad:

Imran Farhat
Rao Ifthikar Anjum
Zulfiqar Babar
Yasir Hameed
Faizal Iqbal
Shan Masood
Rana Naveed
Junaid Zia
Akram Raza
Rizwan-uz-Zaman
Sohail Tanwir
Awais Zia
Wajahatullah Wasti

Where's:shezzy2
 
Does it not seam so ? Or Pakistan has to be seriously poor to lose to an Indian team without Kohli .

I think our chances are good, but this thread points up a chink in our armor, the lack of a potent spin attack in conditions that are otherwise sapping for fast bowlers. Also we are very reliant on Fakhar who likes the ball to come unto the bat.
 
Yeah, I have followed your posts for a long time and your support for Sarfraz (when he deserved) so was bit surprised myself too when you labelled him as a specialist captain as i was quite sure you didn't mean it.

I called for Sarfraz to be made ODI captain when Azhar was still in charge.
 
Like I questioned in original post , seeing current match progress I really now believe we have missed a trick not picking Hafeez and Imad. Look at Jahdiv, as soon he take over Pandya bowling. Whole match situation is changed, wicket is too slow and good length wicket to wicket bowling created extra pressure on batsmen to take un nessary risk. We need a good spinner to support Sadab in such conditions, also may be we need three total spinner s like India is using and getting rewards.
 
Like I questioned in original post , seeing current match progress I really now believe we have missed a trick not picking Hafeez and Imad. Look at Jahdiv, as soon he take over Pandya bowling. Whole match situation is changed, wicket is too slow and good length wicket to wicket bowling created extra pressure on batsmen to take un nessary risk. We need a good spinner to support Sadab in such conditions, also may be we need three total spinner s like India is using and getting rewards.

It may be an academic question, the main problem clearly being a batting lineup inexplicably eager to give wickets away to Jadhav. Having said that, why not at least play Nawaz, who has actually been putting up good numbers domestically with the ball in recent List A matches?
 
Hafeez can play a role, if he comes in at number 6/7. His SR in overs 41-50 is pretty awesome
 
Yes big missed just imagine Hafeez in place of Asif and Imad in place of Faheem
Line up looks better for these tracks . We would have 3 spinners and 3 pacers much better attack
Stupidity from inzi and Mickey fitness dramas
 
There are clearly issues between Hafeez and the team management/ skipper.

As for Imad, he didn't pass the fitness test and there's no way Mickey would allow him to be selected due to that.
 
Hafeez adds balance like nobody else can within the top 8.
Problem is where does he fit in
 
No trick missed with these 2. None of them deserves a spot in squad and MoHa without chucking won’t be better than part-timer & Imad failed fitness test.

The trick was missed in other areas for a squad of 16. But, I can find reasons as well

1. Squad is too heavy with pacers - reason is WC preparation 👍

2. No specialist finger spinner - reason again WC preparation & batting contributions from spinners.

3. No back up WK for such a tournament with tight fixtures & extreme weather - reason is to keep captain dynamic feel secured.


I really, I would have dropped Nawaz, JK & one of Shan or Imam and pick Gohar/Raja, Saud & one young WK - may be even as an apprentice.

And, I would have opened with Babar to find a place for Haris or Saud, both of whom bowl a bit SLAO spin as well & drop one of the pacers to pick the specialist spinner. But, I guess that’s too much to ask for as it goes against Imam.
 
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Not so much imad wasim, but I think Mohammad hafeez would have been useful for his batting down the order around 6/7.
 
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