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Do you consider Shahid Afridi an All Time Great in ODIs?

shaz619

shaz619

Test Star
Joined
Mar 31, 2010
Runs
38,447
Post of the Week
7
Matches

398

Batting Statistics

8064 runs at an average of 24 and S/R of 117

6 100's and 29 50's

Bowling Statistics

395 wickets at an average of 34.51

9 five wicket hauls

Man of the Match Awards

32 (equal 3rd highest, just behind Jayasuriya and Tendulkar)

Other notable all rounders in the ODI format:

Jaquest Kallis
Imran Khan
Shane Watson
Kapil Dev
Andrew Symonds
Ian Botham
Shakib Al Hassan
Yuvraj Singh
 
Has a pretty good shot at it. Personally, I feel he is an ATG because of being the GOAT entertainer. His numbers are terrific. Has some great performances. His sole presence in the field brought in thousands of supporters and filled stadiums in the desert and therefore, to me, his is an ATG.
 
naah he has a mediocre record
so he wont qualify as an atg but ye can be considered a good player
 
Yes. And it's not just because of stats. He was beyond stats. Most entertaining cricketer in modern times.
 
ExpressPacer said:
Has a pretty good shot at it. Personally, I feel he is an ATG because of being the GOAT entertainer. His numbers are terrific. Has some great performances. His sole presence in the field brought in thousands of supporters and filled stadiums in the desert and therefore, to me, his is an ATG.
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The entertainer aspect is often overlooked and bringing in huge crowds, but definitely should be factored in as well. Wanted to get people's thoughts given that he has been a notable omission in the which team has the most ODI ATG's thread
 
He could've become a true ODI ATG. But relegated himself to being just an "impact player". He should've focused more on his bowling and shouldn't have been as brainless with his batting.
 
"Beyond stats"
"Hack"
"Trash"
"Entertainer"
"Matchwinner"
"Selfish"
"Brand"
"Crowd pleaser"

There, saved you reading the entire discussion thats gonna happen in this thread, ye may go on your day in peace
 
Could have been if he applied himself.

Instead he selfishly refused to temper his recklessness due to commercial reasons.

He would not have played 398 matches for any other team in the world.
 
shaz619 said:
Matches

398

Batting Statistics

8064 runs at an average of 24 and S/R of 117

6 100's and 29 50's

Bowling Statistics

395 wickets at an average of 34.51

9 five wicket hauls

Man of the Match Awards

32 (equal 3rd highest, just behind Jayasuriya and Tendulkar)

Other notable all rounders in the ODI format:

Jaquest Kallis
Imran Khan
Shane Watson
Kapil Dev
Andrew Symonds
Ian Botham
Shakib Al Hassan
Yuvraj Singh
Click to expand...

Where is Sanath jayasuriya??!!!
 
Donal Cozzie said:
"Beyond stats"
"Hack"
"Trash"
"Entertainer"
"Matchwinner"
"Selfish"
"Brand"
"Crowd pleaser"

There, saved you reading the entire discussion thats gonna happen in this thread, ye may go on your day in peace
Click to expand...

Thanks :afridi
 
never. he's his own. his status is higher than all time greats. I think it'd embarrassing for him if he listed along with some no name immy yuvi dev etc. :sa
 
There was a period of 18 months or so around 2004-6 where he was legit one of the bestest all-rounders in the world but nah, not an all time player overall.
 
ATG? Pathetic would be the word I would use to describe his cricket.
 
Markhor said:
Could have been if he applied himself.

Instead he selfishly refused to temper his recklessness due to commercial reasons.

He would not have played 398 matches for any other team in the world.
Click to expand...

In the UK he's incredibly popular amongst the neutrals, I'd say for the fans in general he's highly rated while the experts and enthusiasts are sceptical. But what I've noticed watching him over the years, for opposing teams he has always been a figure whom they looked upon as a big threat despite the lack of consistency. But surely if he is to break into the top 10 ODI A/R ever, can we not consider him to be an ATG?
 
Shahid bhai's impact can never be measured by stats alone. His batting can create mental scars for bowlers for the rest of their lives. Eg. His 100 off 37 in which he demolished Lankan bowlers not only won that match but all future encounters against Lanka were mostly in favour of pakistan primarily because of that 1 innings. Stats won't tell you that. ATG ODI and T20 player.
 
On his day , the world would stop in its tracks and watch his game. I'd rate him slightly below Sobers :iqasim
 
shaz619 said:
The entertainer aspect is often overlooked and bringing in huge crowds, but definitely should be factored in as well. Wanted to get people's thoughts given that he has been a notable omission in the which team has the most ODI ATG's thread
Click to expand...

Exactly. All the money PCB recently made in the UAE have been largely due to his presence. Heck, he even pulls crowds in Sri Lanka and BD.
 
shaz619 said:
in the uk he's incredibly popular amongst the neutrals, i'd say for the fans in general he's highly rated while the experts and enthusiasts are sceptical. But what i've noticed watching him over the years, for opposing teams he has always been a figure whom they looked upon as a big threat despite the lack of consistency. But surely if he is to break into the top 10 odi a/r ever, can we not consider him to be an atg?
Click to expand...

big no
 
Nikhil_cric said:
Shahid bhai's impact can never be measured by stats alone. His batting can create mental scars for bowlers for the rest of their lives. Eg. His 100 off 37 in which he demolished Lankan bowlers not only won that match but all future encounters against Lanka were mostly in favour of pakistan primarily because of that 1 innings. Stats won't tell you that. ATG ODI and T20 player.
Click to expand...

Was the leading wicket taker in the 2011 WC to and helped his country win the World T20. And true, that hundred is more immortal the hoak hogan bubbah
 
No not an atg. If he applied himself he had potential to be an atg. He was a matchwiner on a good day but was too inconsistent to be an atg.
 
Best all-rounders in ODI:

1) Imran Khan
2) Flintoff
3) Kapil Dev
4) Kallis
5) Pollock
6) Shakib
7) Watson
8) Yuvraj
9) Malik
10) Afridi
 
In LOI... Kapil Dev, Yuvraj Singh and Afridi don't have good stats. But won WC. Yuvraj worse stats than Malik but I put him above due to WC. Same for Kapil, not in top 10 without WC. And Afridi is same thing, not very good stats but so many MOM and T20 WC so he is ATG all-rounder.

None of them 4 ATG in tests. If only tests then only Imran, Sobbers, Kallis, Miller and Pollock are ATG.
 
Would have had a shot had he performed in WC's.

I think he failed against all top teams in WC's?

I will, however remember him for his epic phainta of Kumble/Zaheer and co in one of the 2005 ODI's in India.
 
Forget about stats, records etc, regarding shahid afridi everyone knows he was very inconsistent in the field, but i dont care what anyone says the guy was an out and out superstar, how many players have had people glued on to there screens like he has, how many came to a watch a match just because of him, how many stayed just to watch his innings even though the match was already lost, he bought in people to watch who werent even into cricket. THAT folks is why hes an ATG, sometimes its not always abt stats, records etc
 
shaz619 said:
Matches

398

Batting Statistics

8064 runs at an average of 24 and S/R of 117

6 100's and 29 50's

Bowling Statistics

395 wickets at an average of 34.51

9 five wicket hauls

Man of the Match Awards

32 (equal 3rd highest, just behind Jayasuriya and Tendulkar)

Other notable all rounders in the ODI format:

Jaquest Kallis
Imran Khan
Shane Watson
Kapil Dev
Andrew Symonds
Ian Botham
Shakib Al Hassan
Yuvraj Singh
Click to expand...

Sorry Shaz but not in a million years.

An average player who had the potential to become much better but still had his moments where he performed exceptionally well.

Unfortunately - those moments were few and far between...
 
msb314 said:
Sorry Shaz but not in a million years.

An average player who had the potential to become much better but still had his moments where he performed exceptionally well.

Unfortunately - those moments were few and far between...
Click to expand...

I've not said he is an ATG , but wanted to provoke an intelligent discussion. It seems many people are not capable of that. Afridi's IQ is often insulted, there's must be lower when basic manners and courtesy are beyond them.
 
shaz619 said:
I've not said he is an ATG , but wanted to provoke an intelligent discussion. It seems many people are not capable of that. Afridi's IQ is often insulted, there's must be lower when basic manners and courtesy are beyond them.
Click to expand...

IQ or not but one doesn't need to be a genius to learn from his mistakes and adapt his game over time.

Afridi seemed incapable of that and did not take on responsibility when the team needed it.

He failed to improve his game and did not heed the advice of his coaches and managers - that was his biggest flaw and what dragged him back the most.

Not an ATG for me - not even one of the best in fact.
 
msb314 said:
IQ or not but one doesn't need to be a genius to learn from his mistakes and adapt his game over time.

Afridi seemed incapable of that and did not take on responsibility when the team needed it.

He failed to improve his game and did not heed the advice of his coaches and managers - that was his biggest flaw and what dragged him back the most.

Not an ATG for me - not even one of the best in fact.
Click to expand...

If it were that easy then we could shake a tree and ATG's would fall out like it's nothing, one of Umar Akmal's biggest flaws has been a failure to adapt; not everyone is capable of it but I recall a player named by Hashim Amla who had a god awful technique, Younis Khan who didn't look like he belonged and even Moeen Ali who did not know where his off stump was. We should begin to appreciate those who may not have been naturally gifted but worked hard on their flaws, we tend to underrate such dedication and something called a work ethic.

And with regards to Afridi, his status as an ATG is being refereed to the ODI format as an A/R and whether he'd rank amongst the top 10 in the format, a mixed response in the thread thus far
 
Players like afridi are dime a dozen - just to name a few actually were leaps and bounds better - Yuvraj, Robin singh, M Bevan, A Symonds, craig McMillan, L Kluesner , jayasuriya, flintoff - none of them are considered ATG but afridi is. Pakistan celebrates mediocrity on the grandest level
 
Afridi bowling average is near 40 against non-minnows in his long career. Afridi's ranking as an all rounder will be not among the top all rounders in history. Dev, IK etc will be far ahead and even Shakib from current era will come ahead. Afridi falls far below ATG all rounder tag. He has been a top entertainer and probably among the best in that aspect.
 
He gas got 39 fifties but u mentioned 29.
Anyways i would say 102 off 37, 102 off 45, 5 or 6 fifties of less than 19 balls, 75 odd and 5 wickets vs SL in sharjah , 75 odd and 7 for 12 vs windies in 2013 , best bowler in wc 2011 and t20 2007( alongwith umar gul), allround performences in semi finals and finals of t20 wc 2009 , 2 sixes off ashwin... all these performances say it all..
 
No, he is not an ATG. Except 2011 WC, he failed in all other tournaments, usually failed in high pressure games as well.

This said, he was one of the best utility cricketer I have ever seen. He could bowl full 10 overs at 28@4.5, score about 23 runs at an amazing strike rate in the lower order, and then was a brilliant fielder. All traits considered, he was very useful in shorter formats when he started playing as a bowling all rounder from 2006 onwards.
 
Ramez said:
He gas got 39 fifties but u mentioned 29.
Anyways i would say 102 off 37, 102 off 45, 5 or 6 fifties of less than 19 balls, 75 odd and 5 wickets vs SL in sharjah , 75 odd and 7 for 12 vs windies in 2013 , best bowler in wc 2011 and t20 2007( alongwith umar gul), allround performences in semi finals and finals of t20 wc 2009 , 2 sixes off ashwin... all these performances say it all..
Click to expand...

they say he's a T20 ATG, not ODI
 
Someone once said

"“Until you're ready to look foolish, you'll never have the possibility of being great. "

Afridi an ATG because he did things in ODI cricket, others could only dream of.
 
Without a shadow of a doubt. Greatest ever six hitter, he had a "modern sr" before people even knew what that was and we all forget that he was a damn good, limited overs leg spinner. His leg spin stats, avg of around 35, decent sr, lots of wickets are exceptional. How many leggies in the history of the game have that many ODI wickets?

ATG without a doubt. Oh and in the early days of t20 cricket, also its greatest exponent, so all round, he is the best limited overs players I think there has ever been. Or certainly top 5.
 
Afridi is a good ODI player but nowhere near ATG lmao. He was an good bowler and a mediocre slogger. As a spinner he did his job.

Not an ATG. A pakistani great maybe
 
ATG or not he would be remembered for a long long time.. One of the best entertainers in cricket
 
I'd say he's the best t20 player of all times. As for ODis he would be close to ATG status. His average isnn't actually bad. That average for a number 7 player and also a handy bowler would be nice for a team
 
Joseph Gomes said:
Afridi is a good ODI player but nowhere near ATG lmao. He was an good bowler and a mediocre slogger. As a spinner he did his job.

Not an ATG. A pakistani great maybe
Click to expand...

I agree with this, I am not certain he would make my best ATG Pakistan ODI XI and he's not even close to being a world ATG.
 
Back in the days, he was ahead of his peers. As days progressed, his performance with the bat declined. His bowling however stayed intact during his career. He was the type of player who would strike fear to the foes heart. If he clicked with the bat, it was pretty much over (that Asia cup match Vs BD is a prime example). To me, he will be one of Pakistan's ATG.
 
ATG entertainer.

ATG T20I cricketer.

But ATG cricketer overall? No way.

Matchwinner for sure, though.
 
An all time entertainer and Afridi would be on top.

However he never really played for Pakistan and was more interested in batting for showmanship. When it came off, fans went into rapturous applause. When it didn't he conveniently became a bowler.

There are few players in the game who have played solely as entertainers. Jayasuriya comes to mind. But in Jayasuriya's defense at least he did not have spurts of madness in every match.

Another one who tried to be like Afridi was Romesh Kaluwitharana. Sri Lanka aptly disposed him off because he had no brain. However, Pakistan team could not dispose off Afridi.

Sometimes I wonder if Afridi had a made a 0 ball duck instead of a 37 ball 100 on his debut, would it have been easier for PCB to drop Afridi. Because in that moment of mad batting, an icon figure rose for Pakistan cricket fans. They just wanted to watch him bat because he would charge down the wicket to every bowler or try to hit every ball out of the park.

Cricket however does not stop there. Cricket is about grueling battles, endless patience, grit and determination. It is about winning small battles and then winning the final war. Afridi fell well short here. He did not have the patience or intelligence to grit it out. That was a fault of his.

How big a fault? His fans would argue it was a minor technical inconvenience. When he fired he would inevitably win the game. A lot of his fans came just to watch him hit sixes or fours. If that is cricket, then surely Afridi is an ATG. But that is just entertainment of highest class. Which is why Afridi belongs to the category of genuine entertainment. The chance of such type of batting succeeding is way too low to classify it as ODI greatness or even ODI cricket.

At this point the conversation sometimes shifts. He is only a bowler who can occasionally hit those long 6's and 4's. However this idea does not hold much credence. Getting 400 wickets in 400 ODI's is probably just average and not enough to deserve a place in the team. A further dissection of stats tell us most of those wickets were against minnow teams, who had never played Afridi before and were not aware of his bowling style and his fast ball. A non-minnow average of 40 and you have as a package as a player who was not really useful with the ball against major teams.

So why then the curious case of Shahid Afridi repeatedly being selected despite obvious shortcomings while bowling against major teams and mad batting against all teams? The answer lies in the grounds of Nairobi where a 17 year old once fluked his way to a hundred.

Such was the response of the villagers and common people to such a feat that they imagined him doing it every single time. And hence the crowds flocked.

Had PCB nipped the evil in the bud, there would have been some protests. There would have been anger. But gradually such remonstrations would have petered out to minor murmurs and finally just whispers all dying together.

But PCB gave slack to such type of cricket and cricketer. By the time PCB saw his irresponsibility and Afridi's inability to actually play to a certain standard in cricket games, it was way too little and way too late. They could never boot out Afridi without a huge lash back and they surrendered to his whims.

I have a slight fondness for Afridi because he helped Pakistan win a small trophy the T20 World Cup. Beyond that I feel he let the gullible masses think he was a cricketer for major part of his career. His best came in 2007 to 2010 and those 3 years were the only time he was a cricketer.

Afridi is the major entertainer in the history of the game.

ODI ATG. Meh. Has done nothing of note to be considered as such.
 
Yes he is that no doubt. This is not to say that he would command an automatic place in an all time best one day eleven.
 
Shahid Afridi was never a batting all-rounder. He was brought into the team as a specialist bowler. Saeed Anwar was the captain and he saw a good hitter in Afridi. So, he promoted him in the batting order and Afridi hit the fastest century in his 2nd ODI. After that, Afridi mainly played as a batsman who was used as the 6th bowler. That was a big mistake PCB made.

Afridi was always a bowling all rounder who should have always batted at #7 or #8. After 2005, when he started bowling more, he was easily one of the best spinners in ODIs and merited a place as a bowler alone. His batting was a bonus.

I believe if Afridi had bowled more in the first 10 years of his career, he would have easily taken 500 wickets in ODIs. His overall numbers would have looked much better and he might have ended as an ODI ATG.
 
No other cricketing nation would have given him the opportunity to play more than 25 ODI's. Enough said.
 
What exactly is ATG BTW? Who decides on this title and who heads the jury? I am never able to understand our cricket fans' obsession to put their favorite players on some kind of pedestal by using such titles. If u like afridi then enjoy his success, why chase others to put a label of validation. If he has played against 100 players, then 40 wud probably say he was mediocre, another 40 wud say he was gud and another 20 ll say he was excellent. Which ones of those ll u believe?
 
Not even close.

Overrated cricketer. Irfan Pathan would have ended up with stats + impact similar to him had he played that many games.
 
shaz619 said:
Forgot to add him in the list wanted to annoy [MENTION=132270]SL_Fan[/MENTION] :yk3 ! certainly is among the notable ODI all rounders
Click to expand...

Just wanted to let you know that I may or may not accept the apology you haven't given yet :shafiq2
 
A great in ODIs, like Kapil Dev. Below Imran who was an ATG ODI player.
 
Is Shahid Afridi an ATG ODI player?

More than 7000 ODI runs
Close to 400 wickets
Strike rate close to 120
Respectable WC stats

Are these points enough to consider Shahid Afridi as ATG ODI player?
 
Not even remotely close.

Even though he has more runs than Viv Richards and more wickets than Shane Warne.
 
Stats etc do not define Afridi.

The most impactful and entertaining player in the history of cricket :bow:
 
no

Honestly I swear some people swap afridi's bowling and batting averages in order to to validate this claim
 
No, he had a few memorable innings with the bat and a good ODI bowler (was great from 2007-2011) years). However, he's not an ATG
 
🤦🏽*♂️
No chance, if there was a list of “what if ....” that would be topped by him followed by a few other Pakistanis, out of 400 games he probably won us 20-30 games & lost over 100 easily, a decent leggie who massively under used his surprise faster ball & never flighted it hence not a atg odi bowler & his batting well it’s painful to say the least prob the best hand-eye coordination but mentally weaker then a 10 yr old as in 20 + years he still hasn’t grasped the idea of “batting for the team”still a bloody compulsive slogger who gets lucky once in a blue moon
 
Afridi is MILES from an ATG, M.I.L.E.S. Inconsistent, irresponsible, unreliable and undependable.

Not one ATG quality, just a lot of fortune that there haven't been many quality SPIN allrounders in ODIs, but even Shakib puts Afridi to bed in this discussion.

Afridi WAS a game changer, he COULD win matches on his own, but ATGs are predicted to win you matches and do so reliably, a description completely against the very fibers that compose Afridi.

He was excellent form 07 to 12, maybe one fifth of his career - the same career in which he failed to develop a single brain cell beyond what he had from his debut.

If you treat the meaning of ATG as someone who can fit into any XI, then I can comfortably name an armada of allrounders that I'd pick over Afridi.

He's not even the best ODI allrounder to come out of Pakistan...
 
Most entertaining cricketer of our times.
He is in a special category of ATGs of which he's the chairman and sole member. Once in a century player.
 
If other ATG ODI players are likes of 2Ws, SRT, Kohli, Jayasuriya, Gilchrist or Ponting etc... then hell nah.

But nice try OP. Credit where it's due :yk
 
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