Gyanvapi Masjid - Court Extension of sealing of Shivling area

[ex-q-zit]

On Sealing Of "Shivling" Area On Gyanvapi Premises, Supreme Court's Extension

New Delhi: After both the Hindu and Muslim side agreed on retaining, for now, the current position on a "Shivling" said to have been found in Varanasi's Gyanvapi Mosque, the Supreme Court on Friday extended its order for sealing and protection of the particular area.

This is in line with what the court said yesterday, after advocate Vishnu Shankar Jain, appearing for some Hindu devotees underlined that the area-protection order of May would expire on November 12.

In May, the Supreme Court had passed an interim order directing the District Magistrate to ensure protection of the area inside the Gyanvapi-Shringar Gauri complex where the "Shivling" was said to have been found in a court-ordered survey. The Muslim side says the base of a water fountain is being wrongly portrayed as a Shivling.

Another aspect of the case is on in a fast-track district court, which, on November 8, postponed till November 14 its judgement on a plea seeking permission to allow Hindu worship of the purported "Shivling".

The mosque committee has challenged the very validity of of the petition by some Hindu devotees demanding right to pray at the shrine. After a trial court said the Hindu women's petition is valid, the mosque management's appeal is pending in the Allahabad High Court.

The case took limelight in April, when a lower court — orignally hearing a plea by a group of women seeking permission for daily worship of idols of Hindu deities on the mosque's outer walls — ordered a video survey of the Gyanvapi complex.

The Hindu side then made the "Shivling" claim based on the survey, but the Muslim side has said the object was part of a water fountain at the 'wazookhana' reservoir where devotees carry out ablutions before offering namaz.

The Supreme Court then transferred the case from the civil judge to the district judge on May 20, saying, looking at the "complexities" and "sensitivity" of the issue, it is better if a senior judicial officer with an experience of 25-30 years handles the case.

Yet another related case is being heard by a district judge. It demands a survey of closed underground places on the Gyanvapi premises.

NDTV

 

[PakLFC]

So another shivling has been found! I am sure if the dug deep enough all over the world they'd find such rock's everywhere. Are they shivling's too?

 

[PakLFC]

Its not Rock but Gods Penile organ

Yeah they are God's to the Hindu's only. How can a person tell the difference between a shivling and rock shaped like that?. The RSS see shivling's everywhere. Why were they not being found before Modi became the PM?

 

[ex-q-zit]

Yeah they are God's to the Hindu's only. How can a person tell the difference between a shivling and rock shaped like that?. The RSS see shivling's everywhere. Why were they not being found before Modi became the PM?

Do you know anything about Gyanvapi Masjid.

Firstly, why does a masjid have a sanskrit name?

Secondly, which masjid in the world looks like this?

<blockquote class="imgur-embed-pub" lang="en" data-id="a/4ZnSG1v" data-context="false" ><a href="//imgur.com/a/4ZnSG1v"></a></blockquote><script async src="//s.imgur.com/min/embed.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Do you know the history of Vishwanath temple and Gyanvapi masjid before you start posting about it? In any Shiva temple Nandi always looks towards Shivling. But in Kashi it faces the masjid because when the maratha queen conquered Varanasi she didn't take down the masjid but respected islam and built a new temple beside it and left nandi facing the original temple on which the masjid was built.

I haven't read the quran but correct me if I am wrong. Doesn't it say in quran that a masjid can be built on a land only if it is owned or legally possessed and not by demolishing an existing place of worship?

Lastly, 3 issues have been going on in India since decades not after Modi came to power. They are Babri masjid in Ayodhya, Gyan vapi in Varanasi and the Shahi Idgah mosque in Mathura.

 

[Local.Dada]

Yeah they are God's to the Hindu's only. How can a person tell the difference between a shivling and rock shaped like that?. The RSS see shivling's everywhere. Why were they not being found before Modi became the PM?

Well these are the theological questions that require a lot more to understanding than some online trolling by angry but pious teenagers. I stay away from such matters usually because even though I don’t have much of a head, I value mine. That’s why I bury a lot of questions I have.

As far as your 2nd point goes, well I would take it you are not much of a history buff.

 

[PakLFC]

[MENTION=143985]ex-q-zit[/MENTION]

Many Hindu temples in India were most likely converted to Mosques but why bring such things up now that will only cause trouble in your country? It is not as if this Mandir became a Masjid two years back or something. Also I am sure many Masjids have also been converted to Mandir's over the years too. I am talking about your Mandir's in general not a specific one. So are you going to supposedly reconvert million's of Masjids to Mandir's now? Yes the Qur'an does say what you mention however these Masjid's have been around for centuries.

Next you'll insist converting the Taj Mahal to a Mandir too. There has already been talk of that over the years.

 

[PakLFC]

Well these are the theological questions that require a lot more to understanding than some online trolling by angry but pious teenagers. I stay away from such matters usually because even though I don’t have much of a head, I value mine. That’s why I bury a lot of questions I have.

As far as your 2nd point goes, well I would take it you are not much of a history buff.

The only person appearing angry here is you. I call it a mature debate where as disagreement to kid's like you is trolling. Once again how can you tell the difference between a shivling and normal rock? If something like this is found beneath London or NYC is that a shivling too?

Commonsense comes much before history in my book. I live in today's times not 10,000 years back like many people here who want to dig up past skeletons. Masjids converted to other places of worship should also remain what they now are.

 

[Local.Dada]

The only person appearing angry here is you. I call it a mature debate where as disagreement to kid's like you is trolling. Once again how can you tell the difference between a shivling and normal rock? If something like this is found beneath London or NYC is that a shivling too?

Commonsense comes much before history in my book. I live in today's times not 10,000 years back like many people here who want to dig up past skeletons. Masjids converted to other places of worship should also remain what they now are.

Well London on NYC doesn’t have a history of ravaging tribesman destroying local monuments do they? They kind of do but a different kind of invasion

I am sure if they find ancient Native American or some other ethnic local architecture on some of those buildings, I am sure they will correct such things.

Even that line of thinking is common sense. Isn’t it.

As far as raging on this goes, not my cup of tea so carry on

 

[PakLFC]

Well London on NYC doesn’t have a history of ravaging tribesman destroying local monuments do they? They kind of do but a different kind of invasion

I am sure if they find ancient Native American or some other ethnic local architecture on some of those buildings, I am sure they will correct such things.

Even that line of thinking is common sense. Isn’t it.

As far as raging on this goes, not my cup of tea so carry on

Have you seen how the first Brit was a coloured man? So if a shivling type thing was found in the west then it is okay but if found in the subcontinent then the place was a former Mandir??

No one is gonna correct anything in the west or do stupid things like that. In Spain I have seen many churches built on former Masjid's but the Muslim's are nor demanding they be returned to them.

It is impossible to return everything to what it once was. Only RSS Hindu nutcases and their supporters think in such illogical ways. This is what commonsense is.

 

[ex-q-zit]

Gyanvapi Case: UP Court To Hear Plea For Prayers At 'Shivling' At Mosque

Lucknow: A petition seeking that prayers be allowed to the "Shivaling" found inside Varanasi's Gyanvapi mosque complex, will be heard by a local court. A fast-track court, in its order on the matter today, has said that the petition -- which also sought that Muslims be banned from the Gyanvapi mosque complex and it be handed over to Hindus -- is "maintainable". The court dismissed the challenge to the petition by the Gyanvapi mosque committee and fixed December 2 as the next date of hearing.

The petition before the fast track court was filed by an organisation called the Vishwa Vaidic Sanatan Sanstha.

Another court in Varanasi, the court of district judge AK Vishwesha, is already hearing the main petition related to the Gyanvapi dispute.

The mosque, located next to the iconic Kashi Vishwanath Temple, has been one of the three temple-mosque rows -- besides Ayodhya and Mathura -- which the BJP raised in the 1980s and 90s, gaining national prominence.

The decades-old legal dispute over the issue was escalated after the Supreme Court's judgment in favour of a temple in the Ram Janambhoomi-Babri Masjid issue.

The 'Shivling' was found earlier this year during a video survey carried out in the Gyanvapi temple complex following the orders of a lower court in Varanasi.

Five women had filed the initial petition, seeking permission for year-long prayers at a shrine inside the mosque complex. They had claimed that ancient idols of Hindu gods and goddesses are located inside the mosque.

After the Supreme Court's intervention , the case was transferred to the court of Varanasi's seniormost judge, who later ruled that the case by the women was 'maintainable' and would be heard in court and dismissed the mosque committee's plea that the Hindu side's petition had no legal standing

The committee had cited the Places of Worship (Special Provisions) Act 1991, which maintains that the religious status of any place of worship should stay the way it was on August 15, 1947. Section 3 of the Act bars the conversion of places of worship. The Babri Masjid case was the exception.

The court ruled that the petitioners do not want ownership, but only the right to worship.

Four of the five women petitioners then filed a plea seeking "scientific investigation" of the "Shivaling", contending that it is necessary to determine its age.

The mosque committee objected to a scientific investigation, arguing that the object being called a "Shivaling" is actually a "fountain" for ritual ablutions.

The district judge's court then dismissed the scientific investigation plea.

Recently, a petition has been filed challenging the Constitutional validity of certain sections of the Places of Worship (Special Provisions) Act 1991 before the Supreme Court.

NDTV

 

[ex-q-zit]

Gyanvapi Case: Court To Hear Plea On Carbon Dating Of "Shivling" On Nov 30

Prayagraj: The Allahabad High Court today fixed November 30 for hearing a revision petition challenging the Varanasi district judge's order by which the lower court had refused the demand of carbon dating of a 'Shivling' claimed to have been found in the Gyanvapi mosque complex.

Justice J J Munir passed the order on the revision plea filed by Laxmi Devi and others.

On October 14, Varanasi District Judge A K Vishvesh had turned down the plea seeking scientific investigation and carbon dating of the 'Shivling', citing Supreme Court directives for its safe keeping so that no tampering can be done.

When the matter was taken up in the high court on Monday, counsel for Archaeological Survey of India submitted that an application has been moved for extension of time for the survey. However, the court commented that there should be no damage to the 'Shivling'. Then the ASI's counsel said that there are more ways to determine the age and no damages could be caused.

On behalf of the Anjuman Intezamia Committee which manages the Gyanvapi mosque, it was said that a 'vakalatnama' has to be filed in the meantime. 'Vakalatnama' is a written document signed by a client to allow his advocate to plead a case in a court on behalf of him.

Four of the five Hindu parties had sought carbon dating of the 'Shivling' found during a court-mandated videography survey of the mosque premises close to the "wazookhana", a small reservoir used by Muslim devotees to perform ritual ablutions before offering Namaz.

The revision petition has sought appropriate survey or excavation to find out the nature of construction beneath the 'Shivling' discovered on May 16, 2022.

The Hindu parties have also sought scientific investigation by carbon dating to determine the age, nature and other constituents of the 'Shivling' in accordance with the provisions of The Ancient Monuments and Archaeological Sites and Remains Act, 1958.

NDTV

 

[uppercut]

[MENTION=143985]ex-q-zit[/MENTION]

Many Hindu temples in India were most likely converted to Mosques but why bring such things up now that will only cause trouble in your country? It is not as if this Mandir became a Masjid two years back or something. Also I am sure many Masjids have also been converted to Mandir's over the years too. I am talking about your Mandir's in general not a specific one. So are you going to supposedly reconvert million's of Masjids to Mandir's now? Yes the Qur'an does say what you mention however these Masjid's have been around for centuries.

Next you'll insist converting the Taj Mahal to a Mandir too. There has already been talk of that over the years.

Can you name some Temples that were built on top of a Masjid ? Note: Ram temple at Ayodhya does not count.

 

[ex-q-zit]

High Court To Hear On Dec 5 Plea Against Varanasi Court Order On Gyanvapi

Prayagraj, UP: The Allahabad High Court on Wednesday fixed December 5 for further hearing on a Gyanvapi masjid management's revision petition challenging a Varanasi court order on the maintainability of a plea seeking permission to offer regular prayers to idols of deities in the mosque complex.

On Tuesday, the high court, after a brief hearing, had adjourned the hearing in the case till Wednesday.

During the hearing on Wednesday, the counsel for the Hindu side argued that the case before the lower court was drafted honestly. He was arguing with the counsel for the Anjuman Intejamia Masjid, the Gyanvapi mosque management committee, who alleged that the case was cleverly drafted.

The Hindu side counsel further submitted that the provisions of the Places of Worship Act would not apply in the present case. However, after a brief hearing, Justice J J Munir directed the matter to be heard next on December 5.

The Gyanvapi mosque management committee had challenged the Varanasi court order rejecting its objection to the maintainability of the suit filed by five Hindu women who sought permission to worship Shringar Gauri and other deities whose idols are located on an outer wall of the mosque.

The district judge of Varanasi had on September 12 dismissed the plea.

The high court also fixed January 18, 2023, for further hearing on another revision petition filed by Laxmi Devi and others challenging the Varanasi district judge's order by which the lower court had refused the demand of carbon dating of a 'Shivling' claimed to have been found in the Gyanvapi mosque complex. This plea was also heard in the court of Justice J J Munir.

The counsel for the Hindu side sought time to gather information on whether the May 17 order of the Supreme Court is about a stay or whether the 'Shivling' should be examined scientifically without damaging it.

On October 14, Varanasi District Judge A K Vishvesh had turned down the plea seeking scientific investigation and carbon dating of the 'Shivling', citing Supreme Court directives for its safe keeping so that no tampering can be done.

Four of the five Hindu parties had sought carbon dating of the 'Shivling' found during a court-mandated videography survey of the mosque premises close to the "wazookhana", a small reservoir used by Muslim devotees to perform ritual ablutions before offering Namaz.

The revision petition has sought appropriate survey or excavation to find out the nature of construction beneath the 'Shivling' discovered on May 16, 2022.

The Hindu parties have also sought scientific investigation by carbon dating to determine the age, nature and other constituents of the 'Shivling' in accordance with the provisions of The Ancient Monuments and Archaeological Sites and Remains Act, 1958.

NDTV

 

[DeadlyVenom]

Can you name some Temples that were built on top of a Masjid ? Note: Ram temple at Ayodhya does not count.

There are 3-4 in Haryana alone.

 

[uppercut]

There are 3-4 in Haryana alone.

Can you provide more details on these mosques that were demolished and a Temple constructed on top of it ?

 

[Ahmad-GERMANFC]

Can you name some Temples that were built on top of a Masjid ? Note: Ram temple at Ayodhya does not count.

Lol why

 

[Stewie]

Do you know anything about Gyanvapi Masjid.

Firstly, why does a masjid have a sanskrit name?

Secondly, which masjid in the world looks like this?

<blockquote class="imgur-embed-pub" lang="en" data-id="a/4ZnSG1v" data-context="false" ><a href="//imgur.com/a/4ZnSG1v"></a></blockquote><script async src="//s.imgur.com/min/embed.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Do you know the history of Vishwanath temple and Gyanvapi masjid before you start posting about it? In any Shiva temple Nandi always looks towards Shivling. But in Kashi it faces the masjid because when the maratha queen conquered Varanasi she didn't take down the masjid but respected islam and built a new temple beside it and left nandi facing the original temple on which the masjid was built.

I haven't read the quran but correct me if I am wrong. Doesn't it say in quran that a masjid can be built on a land only if it is owned or legally possessed and not by demolishing an existing place of worship?

Lastly, 3 issues have been going on in India since decades not after Modi came to power. They are Babri masjid in Ayodhya, Gyan vapi in Varanasi and the Shahi Idgah mosque in Mathura.

I understand the essence of your question, but I would just like to say that a masjid's name is not bound by any particular language or type of name. For instance, in the West, a lot of Masjids are associated with Western names based on locations, cities, streets, etc. It sounds like Hindus believe masjids can only have arabic or persian sounding names which is not true. I thought I should try and clear that ambiguity.

 

[Ahmad-GERMANFC]

Can you name some Temples that were built on top of a Masjid ? Note: Ram temple at Ayodhya does not count.

Jama Masjid of Sonipat
Jama Masjid of Farrukhnagar
Khilji Jumma Masjid, aurangabad
Dana Shir Masjid, Hisar
Jama Masjid of Meham
Gol Masjid, Amritsar

 

[uppercut]

Lol why

because it has been proven without a shadow of doubt that the Babri Masjid was constructed right on top of the Ayodhya Ram mandir which BTW is not a Random temple ... it is one of THE holiest shrines in Hinduism.

 

[MenInG]

The Supreme Court on Friday deferred the scientific survey to determine age of purported 'Shivling' found at Gyanvapi mosque in Varanasi, underscoring that "we need to tread carefully in this matter".

The top court was hearing a plea challenging the May 12 Allahabad High Court order of conducting a "scientific survey", including carbon dating, to determine the age of the structure.

"Since the implications of the impugned order merit closer scrutiny, the implementation of the directions concerned in the order shall stand deferred till the next date," said the bench headed by Chief Justice DY Chandrachud.

The bench also issued notices to the Centre, the Uttar Pradesh government and the Hindu petitioners on the mosque panel's plea against the high court order for the scientific survey and carbon dating of 'Shivling'.

The Centre and the Uttar Pradesh government have both agreed for adjourning the proposed scientific survey of 'Shivling' for the time being.

The 'Shivling' was found earlier this year during a video survey carried out in the Gyanvapi temple complex following the orders of a lower court in Varanasi.

The mosque authorities have objected to a scientific investigation, arguing that the object being called a 'Shivling' is actually a "fountain" for ritual ablutions.

The mosque, located next to the iconic Kashi Vishwanath Temple, has been one of the three temple-mosque rows -- besides Ayodhya and Mathura -- which the BJP raised in the 1980s and 90s, gaining national prominence.

The decades-old legal dispute over the issue was escalated after the Supreme Court's judgment in favour of a temple in the Ram Janambhoomi-Babri Masjid issue.

NDTV