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If we select Salman Butt we will lose all respect and credibility.....

GLORY OF '92

Test Debutant
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Dec 10, 2007
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13,521
This guy was the captain.....

It is unbelievable that we are even considering it.

If we allow him back in we will basically legitimise his actions as he was fully aware and responsible.

I think people have forgotten the humiliation and pain of 2010.
 
Inzi likes his mates, and Salman always knew how to know the right people



All we can do is hope that he will fail massively if selected
 
After selecting Amir, it was only a matter of time before Salman Butt got selected.

If Pak pace bowling continues to under perform, then even Asif can get a sighter.

Everyone deserves a 2nd chance :holding
 
Guys please, we are all humans, If Salman earns a recall due to his hardwork and on merit then so be it. Please.
 
It's not for us to decide but if all involved are compatible with it including the players then it should happen despite our personal feelings or the opinions of the intellectual saviours of the masses called Indians; otherwise was there a point in him serving his punishment? However, while he may be scoring runs at the FC level it's better to groom the future and the opening slots are all occupied at present including the reserve slots.
 
Guys please, we are all humans, If Salman earns a recall due to his hardwork and on merit then so be it. Please.

Its a black mark and he is a cheat who orchestrated the event as a captain which is unforgivable.. For which pakistan and their genuine players have to earn their credibility back... I agree he finished his punishment term and did his hardwork but not at the cost of other performing players who are genuine and not cheats...

i cannot accept him coming into the team ahead of guys who are already there in the team aslam, sharjeel. Also cannot accept him coming ahead of Imam ul haq, jaahid ali, fakhar zaman, haris sohail, Umar amin and even shehzad (can tolerate his atrocity of an attitude than giving a chance to butt)..
 
that ship has sailed long past when amir got selected.. you are too late buddy..

no though ppl did look at his age when he did the crime but still many are against it.. Amir acted as approver in the spot-fixing case from the very outset while both Salman and Asif had contested their cases at the World Arbitration Court but failed to get a decision in their favour for which even ICC had a soft corner for Amir only.
 
People go on like the trio comitted a terrorist attack, killing 100s and used their Pakistani origins as the reason why. If one cares about their country like most the crybabies of the fixers claim they do, they'd know best available talent should be picked for the country.

Now...whether old man Asif and Butt are the best [and youngest future prospects] in Pakistan is a completely different question.
 
Pakistani fans have very short memory, not long ago, ppl were begging for Amir selection who was invovlved in same crime.
Have we forgotton how we treated Azhar n Hafeez when thry try to object Amir's selection?

As for PCB, they missed that train in mid 90s
 
People comparing Amir with Butt/Asif are indeed ignorant as to them claiming innocence all the way through until being jailed.

Only recently have both come forward and have accepted their roles in the fixing. So please enough of the "Well selecting Amir only proves..." rubbish!
 
To play or not to play fixers is up to individual boards. Each board deals with it differently. Having said that if one convicted fixer can be allowed to represent Pakistan by PCB then all convicted fixers should be allowed by the same board to represent Pakistan. I don't see any issue here.
 
Either none of the 3 should've been allowed back or all should be treated the same way and given the opportunity to play for their country.
 
Butt was a rubbish player anyway - avg of 30 even on pancake pitches of Pakistan. Woeful fielder and runner between wickets.
 
I kno religion has no place in sport .. but an Islamic state that praises Allah after every victory or milestone Thanks to Allah AlhumdoIillah and the choises to contradict the words of Allah to forgive and forget
 
If the rule is you must preform in domestic games matches then you will be selected (I can't select Ahmed Shazad in his performances in BBL. He needs to preform Pakistan domestic matches) please dont think I'm Shaazad fan !!
 
PCB has made him available for selection meaning that we are OK with him returning to the side.

So the moral/principled decision is not for the selection committee to make. They should only be deciding purely on playing merit. I dont see him adding value to T20/ODIs. In tests he could make a case especially with 2 upcoming vacancies along with Sami's position open to a challenge.
 
After watching Amir make his comeback and be part of the test team for the last 6 months and see all this discussion going on, all i'm gonna say is both school of thought are right in their own way.

I think we should just respect each others opinion regarding this matter.
 
If Amir is allowed back in the team so why treat Salman differently?
 
PCB had to set the precedent with Amir.

He was selected, so the other two deserve a chance too.
 
Bringing in a 34-35 year old butt will be a big mistake, especially when we will Sami who is doing fine,and have some good upcoming youngsters in Jahid ali and Fahim.If we bring back old guys like Kami,Butt and hafeez back into the team then we will be moving backwards and soon our test team will be performing like our onedayer team is doing these days.
 
A simple question to them who are defending or supporting him here!!! salman did the crime for which he was punished!!! For his fixing crime!! But what about his continuous attempt of making fool everyone for years!!! By denying his crime for almost five years!!! He only accept when there was no way!!! He not only cheated with nations for once but also lied before them millions time to make them fool!!!
To me his continually denying is much bigger crime than his fixing crime!!! He should never be allowed to represent pakistan again!!!
 
Guys, take the morality out of the situation and ask yourselves this. Does Salman Butt deserve to be in the starting XI ON MERIT ?

The answer is no. We used to call him here on PP pre-ban "the best of a sorry bunch" - as his competition consisted of dross like Khurrum Manzoor, Yasir Hameed, Imran Farhat etc. That's the only reason why he had such a run. Go break his numbers down and you'll see how mediocre he was.

Azhar Ali has the Test opening position locked down. Sami Aslam has shown better awareness of his off-stump in his short career than Butt ever did in his six year career. Sharjeel is a gamble but let's see how he does. Likes of Imam-ul-Haq are also knocking on the door.

In ODIs and T20s it is out of the question. Don't be fooled by Butt's batting averages in recent one day domestic tournaments as they've come at unbelievably selfish SRs.
 
We need Asif back in tests. If butt continues to prove form, he deserves a go.
 
If he keeps performing in domestic cricket than he may have a chance, if Amir can come back than Butt and Asif should be given equal treatment. Agee with Markhor though, atm he doesn't deserve a place in any format
 
If one can come, then all can come. Either have it all the way or none of the way. Age or not for Amir, he was an international player. The coercion factor played in effect for his sentencing versus the sentencing of others, but now by the rules they are both equal to play as they are allowed. If you supported Amir, you support Butt.
 
Inzi likes his mates, and Salman always knew how to know the right people



All we can do is hope that he will fail massively if selected

Stop pointing at Inzamam. He's doing his job and if your golden youngsters would stop taking selfies and failing outside Asia, he wouldn't have to go back to Butt.

Or do you want Inzamam to stop selecting players on merit?
 
Stop pointing at Inzamam. He's doing his job and if your golden youngsters would stop taking selfies and failing outside Asia, he wouldn't have to go back to Butt.

Or do you want Inzamam to stop selecting players on merit?

I am sorry Bilal but Inzamam has been an absolute disappointment when it has come to selection. I don't want to go on a rant here but I can point at least 6-8 MAJOR flaws that I see in whenever Pakistan announces it's selected squads !!

For the great man that Inzamam is and has been over the years he's been a big let down as a selector up till now !!
 
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I am sorry Bilal but Inzamam bhai has been an absolute disappointment when it has come to selection. I don't want to go on a rant here but I can point at least 6-8 MAJOR flaws that I see in whenever Pakistan announces it's selected squads !!

For the great man that Inzamam is and has been over the years he's been a big let down as a selector up till now !!

Really 6-8? No exaggeration?
 
Stop pointing at Inzamam. He's doing his job and if your golden youngsters would stop taking selfies and failing outside Asia, he wouldn't have to go back to Butt.

Or do you want Inzamam to stop selecting players on merit?


What golden selfies?

Yes Sami failed. We should end his career right , 21 year old failed in Aus , there fore it is the end. He should have bee dropped now we have sharjeel who deserves a go in tests and an extended run in limited overs

Additionally butts 'success' is built on scoring slowly ,just what we need in our sides right now , brilliant idea

Finally looking at the moral implications of this there is a difference. Butt only admitted guilt when he exhausted every possible alternative option and even then he did so in a conceited way

I love inzi but let's not get blinded by that love

There is no good reason to select butt . At least with professor there is a legitimate argument that we. We'd an off spinner
 
Guys please, we are all humans, If Salman earns a recall due to his hardwork and on merit then so be it. Please.

Human beings who commit crimes deserve forgiveness. They do NOT deserve fame and millions and most of all to represent your country. If you are sending your best delegation to represent your country in the UN, will you ever pick anyone with a tainted past?

Playing for your country is not a right. Millions dream of playing for their country but only a handful in history can. Playing for your country is a privilege.
 
How many times should one get punished for the same crime?

Being not selected for your country is NOT a punishment. are you and I being punished because we are not being selected to play for our country? There is a huge difference between giving someone a right to earn his livelihood and not selecting him for one of the most prestigious thing in the world, i.e. playing for you country and earning millions and fame.

People should stop this stupid logic. Being appointed to/selected for a prestigious thing is NOT a right but a privilege which is earned.
 
that ship has sailed long past when amir got selected.. you are too late buddy..

Come on, so many were saying that Amir is ONLY pardoned because he is an innocent 17 year old who didnt know better. So his case is different than Asif and Butt. Now funnily the same people are mostly also supporting Asif and Butt which shows how much truth there was in their initial statement.
 
Mate don't we have so many corrupt politicians whom many of us go and vote for and allow them to run our country, most of then are with tainted past and don't even serve their time.

Moreover we are not the decision makers, the decision makers and people far more knowledgeable than us in legal matters have found that 5 years of ban is sufficient for the crime they committed... If it were left to individuals like us, some would have wanted death sentence for the trio.

So let's respect the law, and let's move on.
 
Being not selected for your country is NOT a punishment. are you and I being punished because we are not being selected to play for our country? There is a huge difference between giving someone a right to earn his livelihood and not selecting him for one of the most prestigious thing in the world, i.e. playing for you country and earning millions and fame.

People should stop this stupid logic. Being appointed to/selected for a prestigious thing is NOT a right but a privilege which is earned.

I think the underlying assumption in this argument is that you and me are not good enough for the team anyways and that Butt has earned the privilge through his performance etc and is being denied that hard earned priviliged because of his past deed which he's already punished for.

Just trying to explain the opposite side. I personally want Sami over Butt a thousands time over,
 
Salman Butt served his punishment, and we should all forgive him, no second thought. But that doesn't mean we should support his inclusion in the team vehemently. I hated his guts when he refused to accept his wrongdoings, lashed at Afridi, used his father and sisters as shield, and pointed at conspiracy along with Pakistani diplomat in UK and Ijaz Butt.
 
Mate don't we have so many corrupt politicians whom many of us go and vote for and allow them to run our country, most of then are with tainted past and don't even serve their time.


Some of the most ridiculous excuses and bahaneybaazi ever.

Just because there is stupidity going on in one realm, people should be fine with the same virus spreading in every other realm as well. Superb logic.

Secondly, the selection process is VERY different. Politicians exert their influences and even bring in crass tactics to win. Are you even serious comparing the process here?

Thirdly, the team is representing at int'l level. You seriously need to give your forgive n forget theory a rest.


They were punished for violating the norms/rules. Not selecting them is not punishment.

If they are not even selected at the domestic level, that ll be abs understandable. Humanitarian nazariya is to allow them to earn a living by playing at the local levels. Once you sell the country for monetary gains, privileges like representing the country goes out of the window.
 
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Reading this thread makes me weep for the future of Pakistan. Our mentality is just sad. No respect for law and order. We will never learn, and our society will continue to slowly crumble
 
Reading this thread makes me weep for the future of Pakistan. Our mentality is just sad. No respect for law and order. We will never learn, and our society will continue to slowly crumble

Law and order did their job - it is time the PCB did theirs in the name of merit based selection.
 
Law and order did their job - it is time the PCB did theirs in the name of merit based selection.

You want PCB to do their job? They should make a public statement that Butt and Asif will never play for pakistan again. They can play domestic to put food on the table for their families. But after what they did, and denying it again and again and again, there should be no way back for them. Send a strong message.
 
Logically, if you allow Amir, you should allow Butt and Asif.

But if you allow Butt and Asif, the whole concept of looking at the situation, giving concession, etc loses its meaning. All the arguments, viewpoints, justifications etc used for Amir loses its meaning.

If people had told the world about this happening before itself, EVERYONE (and I mean everyone) outside Pakistan would have turned against Amir too.

Sometimes the logical answer is the illogical answer and this is one of those times.
 
Logically, if you allow Amir, you should allow Butt and Asif.

But if you allow Butt and Asif, the whole concept of looking at the situation, giving concession, etc loses its meaning. All the arguments, viewpoints, justifications etc used for Amir loses its meaning.

If people had told the world about this happening before itself, EVERYONE (and I mean everyone) outside Pakistan would have turned against Amir too.

Sometimes the logical answer is the illogical answer and this is one of those times.

People REALLY need to stop comparing Aamir to Asif and Butt. Asif and Butt LIED to everyone for YEARS, showing no remorse for their actions. Plus Asif has a long history of indiscipline, and Butt was the captain. Totally different situations, and to try and lump all 3 together is deliberate manipulation.
 
You want PCB to do their job? They should make a public statement that Butt and Asif will never play for pakistan again. They can play domestic to put food on the table for their families. But after what they did, and denying it again and again and again, there should be no way back for them. Send a strong message.

They already served their time in jail and away from cricket for 5 years - why should PCB punish them further?

If they make the team on merit - then they should be selected.
 
Being not selected for your country is NOT a punishment. are you and I being punished because we are not being selected to play for our country? There is a huge difference between giving someone a right to earn his livelihood and not selecting him for one of the most prestigious thing in the world, i.e. playing for you country and earning millions and fame.

People should stop this stupid logic. Being appointed to/selected for a prestigious thing is NOT a right but a privilege which is earned.

Don't be silly.....he is performing in the domestic circuit.....why is he not being picked?
 
So selecting Amir made us gain respect and credibility?

We lost much of it the day we decided to let 3 cheats back in the game.

This just reinforces the fact that there is serious dearth of batsmen who are actually good in Pakistan (and hence the new found desperation to include anyone who is making runs).
 
Of course you guys will and im shocked that some of you are okay with this.
 
As if we had any to begin with.

Looks like OP was sleeping during the 2003 and 2007 World cups where we had two convicted match fixers leading us.

Butt is a kid infront of the 90's fixers. I hope butt gets a fair opportunity and he performs.
 
Personally I was against Aamir playing again. IMO cheats shouldnt be allowed again. He has been a main asset for the team. I realised then that for the overall benefit for the country , you sometimes have to intake a bitter pill.

If Salman Butt can prove himself, then he should be given the same opportunity as Aamir.
 
I am sorry Bilal but Inzamam has been an absolute disappointment when it has come to selection. I don't want to go on a rant here but I can point at least 6-8 MAJOR flaws that I see in whenever Pakistan announces it's selected squads !!

For the great man that Inzamam is and has been over the years he's been a big let down as a selector up till now !!

6-8 is a huge exaggeration on your part. From the test squad, Sohail and Imran were the only ones who were questionable selections. Even then, there wasn't a strong case for any other pacer.

What golden selfies?

Yes Sami failed. We should end his career right , 21 year old failed in Aus , there fore it is the end. He should have bee dropped now we have sharjeel who deserves a go in tests and an extended run in limited overs

Additionally butts 'success' is built on scoring slowly ,just what we need in our sides right now , brilliant idea

Finally looking at the moral implications of this there is a difference. Butt only admitted guilt when he exhausted every possible alternative option and even then he did so in a conceited way

I love inzi but let's not get blinded by that love

There is no good reason to select butt . At least with professor there is a legitimate argument that we. We'd an off spinner

After another collapse, a solid opener is a necessity for our team. Sami Aslam is too raw and needs to be refined. The CS has to balance long-term planning with short term gain. Can't just play all youngsters if the seniors are doing better.
 
op spot on. not that you should care about global press but there will be criticism. amir was different. you would know this if you even followed a little of what happened.
 
Yeah right! And we don't lose respect when we select sifaarshi talentless players on recommendation of influential selectors and play and lose worse than a B grade team. Heck we don't lose respect on meritless selection and when we unfairly discard talented youngsters based on personal liking and disliking of the captain and team management.

Being number 8 in ODI, 7 in T20s and 5 in Tests is the biggest disrespect and embarrassment.
 
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Salman Butt makes it to the team on merit. I'll have him in the team anyday over the corrupt selfish and talentless hafeez, shehzad, akmals and yes-men of PCB.
 
If one can come, then all can come. Either have it all the way or none of the way. Age or not for Amir, he was an international player. The coercion factor played in effect for his sentencing versus the sentencing of others, but now by the rules they are both equal to play as they are allowed. If you supported Amir, you support Butt.

Right but if any format than Test Cricket only. This is because He has played 2 domestic Odi cups. I think around 12 List A matches. Though he averages 45+ in these 12 matches his SR has been hardly 75. This SR isn't good enough for Odi Cricket of 2010 and remember his SR may dip by 5 points in Int Cricket.


So if he wants to be selected in Odi team than in Pentangular Cup he needs to score at a SR of 95+ and Average 40 plus. For this he needs to vasten his scoring areas and increase hos shot range and develop new innovative shots of modern era.

He is Super Fit physically which is a big plus.
 
6-8 is a huge exaggeration on your part. From the test squad, Sohail and Imran were the only ones who were questionable selections. Even then, there wasn't a strong case for any other pacer.



After another collapse, a solid opener is a necessity for our team. Sami Aslam is too raw and needs to be refined. The CS has to balance long-term planning with short term gain. Can't just play all youngsters if the seniors are doing better.


You are ignoring all the moral implications

You are ignoring the fact that butt is slower than Azhar Ali

You are blinded by your love for inzi
 
Guys please, we are all humans, If Salman earns a recall due to his hardwork and on merit then so be it. Please.

Agree, everyone deserves a 2nd chance in life, particularly after completing a harsh punishment.
 
You are ignoring all the moral implications

You are ignoring the fact that butt is slower than Azhar Ali

You are blinded by your love for inzi

Butt has served his punishment and the higher-ups in the PCB and the ICC have no problem with him coming back. The moral implications of not selecting players on merit is huge.

Butt won't be the first or second choice opener, he'll be the backup to when Azhar and Sami or Azhar and Sharjeel can't get it done.
 
Being not selected for your country is NOT a punishment. are you and I being punished because we are not being selected to play for our country? There is a huge difference between giving someone a right to earn his livelihood and not selecting him for one of the most prestigious thing in the world, i.e. playing for you country and earning millions and fame.

People should stop this stupid logic. Being appointed to/selected for a prestigious thing is NOT a right but a privilege which is earned.

A player who is leading the charts at the domestic level has the right to be selected. When this doesn't happen, the system is corrupted. You are not being selected because you are not a good cricket player.

I don't like Butt and would prefer if he doesn't play for Pakistan again but it is good to see that Inzamam has changed the selection system to be based solely on merit.
 
Butt has served his punishment and the higher-ups in the PCB and the ICC have no problem with him coming back. The moral implications of not selecting players on merit is huge.

Butt won't be the first or second choice opener, he'll be the backup to when Azhar and Sami or Azhar and Sharjeel can't get it done.

Backup should be a youngster like Jaahid Ali, however i fear that our openers will be Azhar and Hafeez and Butt will be the backup.
We should invest in youngsters, there should be no place in the team for players like Butt,Hafeez,kami etc
 
Backup should be a youngster like Jaahid Ali, however i fear that our openers will be Azhar and Hafeez and Butt will be the backup.
We should invest in youngsters, there should be no place in the team for players like Butt,Hafeez,kami etc

After the CT is over, I agree that we should phase out the over 30 guys and invest in players who will be hitting their peak in 2019.

Until then, however, we have to play the best players regardless of age.
 
Absolutely, selection should be on merit otherwise there is no point in having a domestic competition.

Pakistan needs to have a broader view, don't dwell too much now upon what happened in 2010, right now the team needs results, I'm not saying Salman or Asif or Kamran will definitely give you results but if they are the best performing players at domestic level, then select them, I've seen all three of them giving match winning performances in the past, so they have the capability, and surely when at their peak I can recall Salman, Kami, Asif have more individual brilliance than the likes of Hafeez, Wahab, Aslam etc...

Even Sherjeel is very inconsistent, I'm still fine with inconsistency as long as you give a match winning century or a blistering performance that can win you the game but Sherjeel doesn't even do that, he will score a quick fire 40, get out and then it pretty much doesn't help. Otherwise he will have to consistently give you those quick fire 40s so that it helps in some occasions when target is low, but he doesn't do that either.
 
i know Butt has been slow but he had much much more impact in the game when he performed then majority of players currently in the side
 
I think we are underestimating the resistance to his return from other members of the team
 
Butt has served his punishment and the higher-ups in the PCB and the ICC have no problem with him coming back. The moral implications of not selecting players on merit is huge.

Butt won't be the first or second choice opener, he'll be the backup to when Azhar and Sami or Azhar and Sharjeel can't get it done.

Many jobs in the world are dependent on past transgressions


And what's the point of having a 30 year old who is a slow old school batsmen as a backup ?


Are you silly enough to think his ego and senior tag will let him be a back up ?
 
Many jobs in the world are dependent on past transgressions


And what's the point of having a 30 year old who is a slow old school batsmen as a backup ?


Are you silly enough to think his ego and senior tag will let him be a back up ?

And? Cricket is not one of those jobs since Butt's employer and the governing body both have no problems with his return.

The point is that he is batting better than any of the other opening options. I bet you were one of those who said the same thing about Misbah, when he was appointed captain.

As long as the frontline options keep performing, Butt won't get a game. If they fail, he'll get a chance to prove himself. That is how a merit based system works.

Some of you guys are the reason why so many deserving cricketers haven't received fair chances while players with the right connections have.
 
If one can come, then all can come. Either have it all the way or none of the way. Age or not for Amir, he was an international player. The coercion factor played in effect for his sentencing versus the sentencing of others, but now by the rules they are both equal to play as they are allowed. If you supported Amir, you support Butt.

Your last sentence is ridiculous, how by supporting Amir does it imply you are supporting Butt ?

Both committed the same crime but that doesn't you charge them with the same yardstick as you look at all the whole picture and then make a judgement according to the circumstances - point being you can not label it as a black and white issue.

Salman Butt had more responsibilities, he was the damn captain and he was encouraging this activity. There was a reason why he got a stiffer sentence - both by the ICC and legally.

However since he has completed his sentence and if he has proven he's good enough (I have major doubts about Tests since he was always average there) then he too can make it back.

Asif was one of my favourite Test bowlers post 2006 -2010 but I will say the same thing, he too should be judged accordingly and not because you support one means automatically supporting the other.
 
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Salman has lost all respect he ever had but the only chance he will get to regain some will be by playing and performing for Pakistan , not without it.
 
And? Cricket is not one of those jobs since Butt's employer and the governing body both have no problems with his return.

The point is that he is batting better than any of the other opening options. I bet you were one of those who said the same thing about Misbah, when he was appointed captain.

As long as the frontline options keep performing, Butt won't get a game. If they fail, he'll get a chance to prove himself. That is how a merit based system works.

Some of you guys are the reason why so many deserving cricketers haven't received fair chances while players with the right connections have.


You are again avoiding fundamental issues . Butt can play domestic and psl but him not playing international cricket is akin to someone not getting promoted in the corporate ladder and hence completely justified .

Again Butt has been batting slower than Azhar, what a way to fix our batting woes . I'm sure mickey will be thrilled

Lastly I supported misbah when he was first appointed when some of his biggest defender stayed here were calling him grandpa misbah, because then there was no real option then.
 
You are again avoiding fundamental issues . Butt can play domestic and psl but him not playing international cricket is akin to someone not getting promoted in the corporate ladder and hence completely justified .

Again Butt has been batting slower than Azhar, what a way to fix our batting woes . I'm sure mickey will be thrilled

Lastly I supported misbah when he was first appointed when some of his biggest defender stayed here were calling him grandpa misbah, because then there was no real option then.

It is not justified to keep one of the best batsmen in Pakistan out of the team. He's done his time, been accepted into the fold by the ICC and the PCB and from all accounts, is remorseful for what he has done.

If you think that he shouldn't play ODIs because he's slow, that's a valid criticism and I somewhat agree with you. However, don't use any non-cricketing reason to keep him out.
 
It is not justified to keep one of the best batsmen in Pakistan out of the team. He's done his time, been accepted into the fold by the ICC and the PCB and from all accounts, is remorseful for what he has done.

If you think that he shouldn't play ODIs because he's slow, that's a valid criticism and I somewhat agree with you. However, don't use any non-cricketing reason to keep him out.


Yes we can use non cricketing reasons because butt was unrepentant till he had no option and even then passed comments saying the country had not treated him well.

Also how is he the one of the best when he failed in first class and is batting at snail pace
 
Your last sentence is ridiculous, how by supporting Amir does it imply you are supporting Butt ?

Pretty simple. Two players commit the same crime, one is supported, the other is given more flack because one was seen as more of a puppet master or in control (never proven), and the other was seen as a naive 18 year old.

Both committed the same crime but that doesn't you charge them with the same yardstick as you look at all the whole picture and then make a judgement according to the circumstances - point being you can not label it as a black and white issue.

Actually committing the same crime should be seen with the same yardstick, otherwise there would be a lack of congruence.

Salman Butt had more responsibilities, he was the damn captain and he was encouraging this activity. There was a reason why he got a stiffer sentence - both by the ICC and legally

Once again, for that he got a higher sentence by the ICC, but when it comes to now, they are both on equal playing ground. The offense was the same, the circumstances a tad bit different, but again given Amir's age, Pakistan fought for him, as they thought by the time Butt could play he would be of no use. Responsibility is irrelevant to me when it comes to playing for Pakistan under this rule. I don't condone either of their behaviour, but one cannot say Amir yes, Butt no, as they are arguing justification for them playing. As of now both are on equal ground to play internationally. Choosing not to play is again one's personal preference, but they did the same crime. If someone plans to steal a bank, calls on a friend to join, the friend agrees, they will both be charged relatively the same. The first may get an inducing charge, or solicitation, but most likely both will be charged together with the inchoate offense of conspiracy to commit, and committing. Whoever acts on the thoughts of another are just as guilty as they accepted it. They may be charged slightly different as a result, but in the end, a future employer will see them both as relatively the same, as they should.

However since he has completed his sentence and if he has proven he's good enough (I have major doubts about Tests since he was always average there) then he too can make it back

Agreed. I see no reason why there should be different rules. The ICC handed out their bans, bans are over, now they are no different barring a few semantic differences.

Asif was one of my favourite Test bowlers post 2006 -2010 but I will say the same thing, he too should be judged accordingly and not because you support one means automatically supporting the other.

No, he should be judged on the fact that he is now able to play, and his crime was the same as the other two. If one actually wants to go deeper into Asif, he actually was the one with the least evidence against, which again, I am not arguing. They are all the same to me who have slight differences here and there, but in reality Amir's age was his saving grace. Had he been the same age as the other two, no one would say anything about his sentence being different. If you are old enough to play for Pakistan, you are old enough to be judged by all ICC rules equally.

The sentence by ICC was a subjective one, but the crime was the same one. Being captain and all that was again, ICC making a subjective change, but the crime if looked at specifically was exactly the same.
 
This guy was the captain.....

It is unbelievable that we are even considering it.

If we allow him back in we will basically legitimise his actions as he was fully aware and responsible.

I think people have forgotten the humiliation and pain of 2010.

I totally agree. Asif and Amir different story but this guy was damn captian of the team. I actually would perfer us loose than to have this guy play again. And if he does it will be a shameful and sad day for Pakistan. I actually couldn't believe that Dr Noman was supporting him for slection the other day. One should ask him that if you leave your house keys with someone and trust that person, he turns around and steal from you, would any sane person would give him the keys of his house again? SALMAN BUTT IF YOU READ PAKPASSION THEN I PRAY TO ALMIGHTY THAT YOU NEVER GET SELECTED FOR NATIONAL TEAM. However i do wish him best of luck in whatever other profession he wants to pursue.
 
It is not justified to keep one of the best batsmen in Pakistan out of the team. He's done his time, been accepted into the fold by the ICC and the PCB and from all accounts, is remorseful for what he has done.

If you think that he shouldn't play ODIs because he's slow, that's a valid criticism and I somewhat agree with you. However, don't use any non-cricketing reason to keep him out.

He served his punishment for a crime not while fighting for civil rights.
He was the Captain who is suppose to be the most upright and role model atleast in fighting to win the game for country.
Once a cheater always a cheater. I think its better for him not to play because everytime he wont perform then it will be thought that he is a sellout. Even if he plays slow it will be thought so( how can one forget his slow innings against Aus inT20).
He shouldnt be allowed any where near the national team.
Last and not least if people like Salim Malik, Hansie Cornje can be dropped for good then this Butt guy is no way near as good as them.
 
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