Is Imran Khan the best Test pace bowler from Pakistan?

ikky47

Debutant
Joined
Apr 3, 2017
Runs
209
The thread title says it all, is Imran Khan Pakistan’s best test pace bowler? If you look at his overall average in test he averages 22.81 with the ball in 88 matches with his wicket tally standing at 362.

Which is a lower average than what the 2 W’s achieved, he also averages under 30 with the ball in every country which he played in.

So is it fair to say he’s the number 1 test pace bowler in Pakistan’s history?

Imran Khan Career Stats​

Batting & Fielding
FormatMatInnsNORunsHSAveBFSR100s50s6sCtSt
Tests8812625380713637.69--61855280
 
I say Wasim Akram is the best Test pacer from Pakistan.

I would put Imran Khan in 2nd position.
 
Yeah?

Wasim was great but he didn't knock out attacks like Imran did in the infamous series in West Indies
 
I think the fact this debate is acceptable, shows how special Imran was as a cricketer.

But for sure, arguably he bowled the most impactful spells against high quality opposition when the stakes were high.

Not to mention, completely reinventing himself when he was meant to be done as a cricketeer and then coming out of retirement years later to lead Pak to glory.
 
best all rounder we can say not specifically the best fast bowler.. i will pick waqar younus the best fast bowler in Test cricket for Pakistan.
 
Can you believe there was a time when we had Imran, Wasim and prime pre injury Waqar in the same team.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
his spell vs aus in sydney is unarguably best bowling performance by an asian bowler down under
 
Wasim was the best Pakistani bowler away from home and a better all format bowler.
 
It’s between him and Wasim and Wasim will always tell you that he wouldn’t have been the bowler he became if it wasn’t for Imran Khan. Imran is the Morgoth to Wasim’s Sauron. Waqar being Azog The Defiler.
 
Can you believe there was a time when we had Imran, Wasim and prime pre injury Waqar in the same team.

Indians and their bumrah :ROFLMAO: :ROFLMAO:

And still didn't win a single Test in Australia with all 3 playing.

You are right. It's unbelievable how bad Pakistan were even then
 
Where else did they play together in Test cricket ? I mean an away tour?
That's what I'm saying. I've been watching cricket for a long time and only today thanks to you I have been educated that only matches in Australia determine how good or bad a team is.
 
For me wasim > Imran as a bowler but I don't mind people who think Imran is >
 
Greatest leader
Greatest captain ever of pakistan

In terms of ability he is the best Asian captain of all time

In terms of achievements ge is the second greatest captain of all time just behind th3 goat Asian captain of all time that is virat king kohli.


As a bowler ge is the second greatest pakistani bowler of all time and 3rd overall from Asia just behind wasim and jassi bumrah bhai.

4th I would have waqar and then shami followed by akthar and so on. Kapil dev srinath and vaas right after.


Give imran khan kohlis goat Asian side and imran would win everywhere. He was the smartest shrewdest captain of all time from Asia.
 
Imran was clocked as third fastest in international cricket during his peak in a speed test behind only Thompson & Holding
He was clocked at 139 kmph, wasn't he? There's a video of it on youtube. Lillee too was clocked higher than Imran.
 
He was clocked at 139 kmph, wasn't he? There's a video of it on youtube. Lillee too was clocked higher than Imran.

Here it is. It was in 1979. Sorry, Imran didn't reach his peak by the point. Imran should have been measured by around 1984/85 when he was at his peak.

Holding's 1st ball - 127.9 kmph; 7th ball - 139 kmph; 8th ball - 141.3 kmph

Lillee 's 1st ball - 128.1 kmph; 7th ball - 134.8 kmph; 8th ball - 136.4 kmph

Hadlee's 1st ball - 126.7 kmph

Roberts's 1st ball - 132.2 kmph; 7th ball - 138.1 kmph; 8th ball - 138.6 kmph

Thompson's 1st ball - 138.7 kmph; 7th ball - 142.8 kmph; 8th ball - 147.9 kmph

Imran's 1st ball - 135.6 kmph; 7th ball - 139.1 kmph; 8th ball - 139.7 kmph


 
Here it is. It was in 1979. Sorry, Imran didn't reach his peak by the point. Imran should have been measured by around 1984/85 when he was at his peak.

Holding's 1st ball - 127.9 kmph; 7th ball - 139 kmph; 8th ball - 141.3 kmph

Lillee 's 1st ball - 128.1 kmph; 7th ball - 134.8 kmph; 8th ball - 136.4 kmph

Hadlee's 1st ball - 126.7 kmph

Roberts's 1st ball - 132.2 kmph; 7th ball - 138.1 kmph; 8th ball - 138.6 kmph

Thompson's 1st ball - 138.7 kmph; 7th ball - 142.8 kmph; 8th ball - 147.9 kmph

Imran's 1st ball - 135.6 kmph; 7th ball - 139.1 kmph; 8th ball - 139.7 kmph


Imran 3rd in terms of speed
 
Can you believe there was a time when we had Imran, Wasim and prime pre injury Waqar in the same team.
Bumrah has a better average and strike rate than them.

If your argument is that Bumrah has lesser wickets then guess what the trio have lesser wickets than Anderson. And the gap between their and Anderson’s averages is smaller than the gap between Bumrah and them.

But congrats on having the 2nd, 3rd and 4th best Asian pacer playing at the same time though.
 
That's what I'm saying. I've been watching cricket for a long time and only today thanks to you I have been educated that only matches in Australia determine how good or bad a team is.
Since you have been watching cricket for a long time, can you educate me on how many away series the trio won against top teams?

80’s west indies or hadlee era nz? The two best teams of the 80s.

90s aus or sa? The two best teams of the 90s?
 
Since you have been watching cricket for a long time, can you educate me on how many away series the trio won against top teams?

80’s west indies or hadlee era nz? The two best teams of the 80s.

90s aus or sa? The two best teams of the 90s?
They have won a fair amount. Perhaps more than so called god of cricket did in 90s.

If we use your god of cricket as an example then they have exceeded him.
 
They have won a fair amount. Perhaps more than so called god of cricket did in 90s.

If we use your god of cricket as an example then they have exceeded him.
A grand total of ZERO Test series wins against the mightly West Indies team from from the mid 70's till the time they were the No. 1 Test team on the charts till 1995.
 
They have won a fair amount. Perhaps more than so called god of cricket did in 90s.

If we use your god of cricket as an example then they have exceeded him.
No they haven’t lol.

They won ZERO series in WI/NZ in the 80s as well as in Aus/SA in the 90s.

And Sachin’s career extended into the 00s and 10s as well.

Wonder why that was excluded? 🤣🤣🤣🤣
 
No they haven’t lol.

They won ZERO series in WI/NZ in the 80s as well as in Aus/SA in the 90s.

And Sachin’s career extended into the 00s and 10s as well.

Wonder why that was excluded? 🤣🤣🤣🤣
Because we are making a comparison. What relevance has his 00s got. They were retired by then.
 
A grand total of ZERO Test series wins against the mightly West Indies team from from the mid 70's till the time they were the No. 1 Test team on the charts till 1995.
Sounds same level to your god then.
 
A grand total of ZERO Test series wins against the mightly West Indies team from from the mid 70's till the time they were the No. 1 Test team on the charts till 1995.
Even 90s team failed to win in WI and that was not even that strong.

Same with 80s team in Australia.

Pak has NEVER won a test series away against a top 3 team ie ranked top 3 when the series began.

Ind did in WI 71, Eng 71, Aus 20. Maybe Eng 07 and Aus 18 too.
 
Because we are making a comparison. What relevance has his 00s got. They were retired by then.
cause the comparison is over a career?

What point is including the 80s then when sachin debuted in the last few months of the decade lol.
 
cause the comparison is over a career?

What point is including the 80s then when sachin debuted in the last few months of the decade lol.
Don't include it then it's upto you if you want to run away from the facts.
 
Don't include it then it's upto you if you want to run away from the facts.
Facts are that Sachin’s win against Aus in 2001 is better than ANY series win Pak has had.

Win in Eng in 2007 better than ANY away series Pak has won.

And this is ALL- TIME.
 
Facts are that Sachin’s win against Aus in 2001 is better than ANY series win Pak has had.

Win in Eng in 2007 better than ANY away series Pak has won.

And this is ALL- TIME.
These are your opinions and the basis for your worship but not facts.

Facts are your god was unable to win one match during the 90s away from Asia.
 
Lol. How did Tendulkar come in?
Anyways, There were so many draws back in the day and it was damn near impossible for one individual to influence the match result. Unlike today where one great innings or bowling performance swings the game.

Imran or Wasim. Think Wasim was more gifted. Imran had the far higher peak. I personally lean towards Akram but all the stats say IK.
 
Bumrah has a better average and strike rate than them.

If your argument is that Bumrah has lesser wickets then guess what the trio have lesser wickets than Anderson. And the gap between their and Anderson’s averages is smaller than the gap between Bumrah and them.

But congrats on having the 2nd, 3rd and 4th best Asian pacer playing at the same time though.
Shami is better than waqar sorry.
 
And still didn't win a single Test in Australia with all 3 playing.

You are right. It's unbelievable how bad Pakistan were even then

It's because of their batting and how there is a batting collapse always waiting around the corner.

Look at the first Test in the series. Wasim gets 6fer and gets Australia all out for 223 in the first innings but calamity ensues when it's their time to bat and they're all out for 107. Game is essentially over then but Wasim gets a 5fer in the 2nd innings and Pak put up 336 runs in the 4th innings which is great but 429 target was never being chased as the game was already lose in the first innings. Funnily enough, Wasim is the POTM despite being on the losing side.

2nd match, your highest score from a batsmen is 52 runs in the first innings from Javed & Wasim Akram. Wasim gets a 5fer. 2nd innings, batting collapse again but Imran & Wasim batting saved the team as they combined for a whopping 259 runs combined with Imran batting for 8 hours. Must have taken a toll as Imran didn't bowl in the 4th innings and Wasim hardly bowled himself in the 4th. Yet again Wasim was POTM. An all-time legendary performance from Wasim with bat & bowl completely wasted.

Imagine you are getting this level of bowling performance and he's batting at 8 for you + Imran Khan as an allrounder and yet, rest of the batting lineup is completely abysmal. Wasim ended the tour with the most wickets and Imran with 2nd most runs. Sucks that Waqar was a rookie at the time too as it was only his 2nd Test series in his career. A bit better contribution from literally anyone but Wasim & Imran and they win the series.
 
Imran was in a league of his own. People generally don't talk about him when it comes to his bowling skills. He was a beast.. a real match winner
 
Away average against non-minnows is a quick short cut to see quality of pacers.

Here is away average of Wasim and IK:

Wasim_IK_Away.jpg

Wasim is marginally ahead but SL was minnow for the first 10 years of career of Wasim. NZ also was very poor team after Hadlee retired.



Excluding NZ and SL when playing away,

Wasim_IK_Away_1.jpg

 
Impact against the same 6 teams when playing away.

5-fers in wins:

IK has 4 and Wasim has 1.


Not listing everyone because Wasim comes far down in list and it makes it too long.

1735707635601.png
 
Over all average against top 5 teams of their eras:

IK home and away
against WI, Eng, Ind, Aus, NZ - Avg 24

Wasim home and away
against WI, Eng, Ind, Aus, SA - Avg 26
 
I did not see IK's career, but going by their outputs, a good case can be made for IK being a better test pacer than Wasim.
 
how many of those tests Imran played as a batsman , not bowling . Can anyone has stats?
 
how many of those tests Imran played as a batsman , not bowling . Can anyone has stats?
7 tests he did not bowl.

Few of them in Aus was due to not able to bowl due to injury and it was not a case of him playing as pure batsman.

3-4 tests in last few years he played as a batsman without bowling.
 
Imran was factually a better pacer than Wasim.

ATG in West Indies (leaked a lil more runs, but took like 7 wickets every match), ATG in England and so forth, India and Australia he wasn't ATG in but has an ATG performance in Australia where he led Pakistan to like the first ever win in Australia.
 
From someone who has seen both, Imran was a distance ahead of Wasim in test cricket

Imran is an underrated bowler because his captaincy and his allrounder credentials put his bowling in the shadow.

Incredible as his bowling stats are, they don't do him justice because of the injury-led compromises he made towards the end of his career in speed/effort to prolong his career to the world cup. Yet he averaged 19 with the ball in the 80's over 50 tests.

I remember times, particularly early 80's, and even mid 80's when Wasim was developing, where Imran was the only one whose spells opposition had to see through (and possibly Qadir's) in Pakistan attack. Yet Imran would invariably knock one or two players over in each spell to break partnerships, and then not stop there but continue making inroads to press home the advantage. He was lethal as opening bowler, in the middle of the innings and at the end with the reversing ball. His spells were sustained pace (I'd think early 140s) from beginning to end, and sometimes very long because he was the only one who could take wickets in difficult bowling conditions.

Keep in mind he would shun easy series at home and away (Sri Lanka, New Zealand) in the last few years of his career, and preserve himself for the difficult one's - West Indies, Aus, England, India Away. His five-fers and ten-fers were invariably match winning. Some of his spells - against India at home in early 80s (which I didn't see), against England away in 87, against West indies away in 1st test in '88, against Australia in '77 in Sydney (again didn't see) are what define him as an all time great fast bowler. He has more bowling performances where he decisively won test matches for his country almost on his own, than any other player I know from any team I have watched over 4 decades - maybe only Murali can match.

If he played for England or Austalia, with the amount of cricket they play, he'd have had 600+ wickets in that era when 400 was a dream. Remember Imran was out for 2 1/2 years due to injury when on his absolute peak. In the season prior to his injury, he had taken 62 wickets in just 9 tests - an absolute monster. There is a reason Imran is 3rd in all time ICC bowling rankings in tests (ICC All Time Test Bowling Rankings).

Akram was an amazing bowler in his own right. I just think he didn't have the kind of bowling influence Imran had in test matches to warrant comparison. ODIs for sure. He does get praised a lot in Australia and England - where he has had magical performances and that puts him in many all time teams. Fair play - because he was definitely a magician.

Two things both had in common - they were both supremely talented (although Imran diverts this bit from himself by focusing more on his "hard work" philosophy) and both were at opposition faces all the time, no quarters given.

If I were to build a test team, I'd put Imran ahead of Akram 10 out of 10 times on bowling alone. If it were an ODI team, I'd take Akram.
 

Attachments

  • Screenshot 2025-01-01 at 13.20.15.png
    Screenshot 2025-01-01 at 13.20.15.png
    580.6 KB · Views: 1
  • Screenshot 2025-01-01 at 13.20.43.png
    Screenshot 2025-01-01 at 13.20.43.png
    505.6 KB · Views: 1
Imran in his last 52 Test matches, averaged a insane 51 with the bat, and 19 with the ball.

Imran, no doubt is the best Test pacer from Pakistan.
 
From someone who has seen both, Imran was a distance ahead of Wasim in test cricket

Imran is an underrated bowler because his captaincy and his allrounder credentials put his bowling in the shadow.

Incredible as his bowling stats are, they don't do him justice because of the injury-led compromises he made towards the end of his career in speed/effort to prolong his career to the world cup. Yet he averaged 19 with the ball in the 80's over 50 tests.

I remember times, particularly early 80's, and even mid 80's when Wasim was developing, where Imran was the only one whose spells opposition had to see through (and possibly Qadir's) in Pakistan attack. Yet Imran would invariably knock one or two players over in each spell to break partnerships, and then not stop there but continue making inroads to press home the advantage. He was lethal as opening bowler, in the middle of the innings and at the end with the reversing ball. His spells were sustained pace (I'd think early 140s) from beginning to end, and sometimes very long because he was the only one who could take wickets in difficult bowling conditions.

Keep in mind he would shun easy series at home and away (Sri Lanka, New Zealand) in the last few years of his career, and preserve himself for the difficult one's - West Indies, Aus, England, India Away. His five-fers and ten-fers were invariably match winning. Some of his spells - against India at home in early 80s (which I didn't see), against England away in 87, against West indies away in 1st test in '88, against Australia in '77 in Sydney (again didn't see) are what define him as an all time great fast bowler. He has more bowling performances where he decisively won test matches for his country almost on his own, than any other player I know from any team I have watched over 4 decades - maybe only Murali can match.

If he played for England or Austalia, with the amount of cricket they play, he'd have had 600+ wickets in that era when 400 was a dream. Remember Imran was out for 2 1/2 years due to injury when on his absolute peak. In the season prior to his injury, he had taken 62 wickets in just 9 tests - an absolute monster. There is a reason Imran is 3rd in all time ICC bowling rankings in tests (ICC All Time Test Bowling Rankings).

Akram was an amazing bowler in his own right. I just think he didn't have the kind of bowling influence Imran had in test matches to warrant comparison. ODIs for sure. He does get praised a lot in Australia and England - where he has had magical performances and that puts him in many all time teams. Fair play - because he was definitely a magician.

Two things both had in common - they were both supremely talented (although Imran diverts this bit from himself by focusing more on his "hard work" philosophy) and both were at opposition faces all the time, no quarters given.

If I were to build a test team, I'd put Imran ahead of Akram 10 out of 10 times on bowling alone. If it were an ODI team, I'd take Akram.

Spot on.
 
7 tests he did not bowl.

Few of them in Aus was due to not able to bowl due to injury and it was not a case of him playing as pure batsman.

3-4 tests in last few years he played as a batsman without bowling.

So that should be brought into consideration here , to give true picture.
 
From someone who has seen both, Imran was a distance ahead of Wasim in test cricket

Imran is an underrated bowler because his captaincy and his allrounder credentials put his bowling in the shadow.

Incredible as his bowling stats are, they don't do him justice because of the injury-led compromises he made towards the end of his career in speed/effort to prolong his career to the world cup. Yet he averaged 19 with the ball in the 80's over 50 tests.

I remember times, particularly early 80's, and even mid 80's when Wasim was developing, where Imran was the only one whose spells opposition had to see through (and possibly Qadir's) in Pakistan attack. Yet Imran would invariably knock one or two players over in each spell to break partnerships, and then not stop there but continue making inroads to press home the advantage. He was lethal as opening bowler, in the middle of the innings and at the end with the reversing ball. His spells were sustained pace (I'd think early 140s) from beginning to end, and sometimes very long because he was the only one who could take wickets in difficult bowling conditions.

Keep in mind he would shun easy series at home and away (Sri Lanka, New Zealand) in the last few years of his career, and preserve himself for the difficult one's - West Indies, Aus, England, India Away. His five-fers and ten-fers were invariably match winning. Some of his spells - against India at home in early 80s (which I didn't see), against England away in 87, against West indies away in 1st test in '88, against Australia in '77 in Sydney (again didn't see) are what define him as an all time great fast bowler. He has more bowling performances where he decisively won test matches for his country almost on his own, than any other player I know from any team I have watched over 4 decades - maybe only Murali can match.

If he played for England or Austalia, with the amount of cricket they play, he'd have had 600+ wickets in that era when 400 was a dream. Remember Imran was out for 2 1/2 years due to injury when on his absolute peak. In the season prior to his injury, he had taken 62 wickets in just 9 tests - an absolute monster. There is a reason Imran is 3rd in all time ICC bowling rankings in tests (ICC All Time Test Bowling Rankings).

Akram was an amazing bowler in his own right. I just think he didn't have the kind of bowling influence Imran had in test matches to warrant comparison. ODIs for sure. He does get praised a lot in Australia and England - where he has had magical performances and that puts him in many all time teams. Fair play - because he was definitely a magician.

Two things both had in common - they were both supremely talented (although Imran diverts this bit from himself by focusing more on his "hard work" philosophy) and both were at opposition faces all the time, no quarters given.

If I were to build a test team, I'd put Imran ahead of Akram 10 out of 10 times on bowling alone. If it were an ODI team, I'd take Akram.
Very well written post.

Wasim is mainly rated highly because of his OD performance , and secondly because he was left armer.
 
Imran in his last 52 Test matches, averaged a insane 51 with the bat, and 19 with the ball.

Imran, no doubt is the best Test pacer from Pakistan.
40 wickets in a series , against India 1982, 12 Wickets in Sydney test 1977 and 11 wickets against mighty West Indies at Georgetown, WI in 1988 and many such performance against high profile teams at that time. No other Pakistani bowler can match him, Waqar comes 2nd .
 
Imran
Waqar
Wasim

Waqar is comfortably behind Wasim. Gap is so massive between them that any subjectivity can't over come the gap given the fact that both played together.

Removing SL because SL was minnow before mid 90s.

bestP.jpg
 
Waqar is comfortably behind Wasim. Gap is so massive between them that any subjectivity can't over come the gap given the fact that both played together.

Removing SL because SL was minnow before mid 90s.

View attachment 149201
Stats not always tell the true story , you haven't seen Waqar at peak, Wasim never enjoyed that kind of peak . Waqar stats suffered in later part of his career.
 
40 wickets in a series , against India 1982, 12 Wickets in Sydney test 1977 and 11 wickets against mighty West Indies at Georgetown, WI in 1988 and many such performance against high profile teams at that time. No other Pakistani bowler can match him, Waqar comes 2nd .

Any example of Waqar's taking sub 20 away series with 10+ test wickets? Please, No BD/SL/Zim.

For Wasim some good away series:

  • 17 wickets at avg of 18 in Aus
  • 25 wickets at vg of 17 in NZ
  • 15 wickets at avg of 17 in Wi
  • 14 wickets at avg of 19 in Aus

Let's see some examples of sub 20 away series for Waqar. He should have lots of series like this.
 
Stats not always tell the true story , you haven't seen Waqar at peak, Wasim never enjoyed that kind of peak . Waqar stats suffered in later part of his career.
I saw entire career of Waqar. His mythical peak gets talked and many believe it due to not seeing his entire career. He wasn't that great against good teams even during his peak.

6 top test teams during Waqar's peak:

WaqarPeak_Top6.jpg




Waqar's performance in test involving top 6 teams during his peak:

1735788254528.png

 
Waqar is comfortably behind Wasim. Gap is so massive between them that any subjectivity can't over come the gap given the fact that both played together.

Removing SL because SL was minnow before mid 90s.

View attachment 149201
also crazy thing is bumrah doesnt get to stat pad in home conditions like rabada and cummins
otherwise his average would be like 15 16

bumrah plays on crappy spinning pitches at home. no bounce nothing.
 
Imran averaged 19 with the ball for 10 years in Tests. For me the GOAT FAST BOWLER WITH MARSHAL AND MCGRATH.
 
He is already ahead for impact fear factor and stats. What dream on

You can live in nostalgia.

I don't care

But I will give you imran over wasim. 20 more tests and bumrah moves ahead of imran.

I couldn't give a monkeys whst you think.

For me imran is the greatest fast bowler from the subcontinent.

Infact as a complete package, the greatest cricketer to come out of subcontinent
 
I couldn't give a monkeys whst you think.

For me imran is the greatest fast bowler from the subcontinent.

Infact as a complete package, the greatest cricketer to come out of subcontinent
Likewise. I couldn't care less what you think.

Bumrah is the best from Asia ever. Ball tamperer imran second.
 
Likewise. I couldn't care less what you think.

Bumrah is the best from Asia ever. Ball tamperer imran second.

So you resort to spitting dummy out.

Let me get it clear. You atleast have imran and wasim in your list somewhere.

I dont have bumrah no where on my lis5 until his dodgy action gets cleared
 
So you resort to spitting dummy out.

Let me get it clear. You atleast have imran and wasim in your list somewhere.

I dont have bumrah no where on my lis5 until his dodgy action gets cleared
No one cares what you think about his action

No one has lodged a complaint.
His action is legal

Ball tamperer imran if anything is a bonafide cheater.

I have imran at 1 for now due to longevity. Bumrah number 2

Wasim 3

Then rest you can change based on preferences. I have shami waqar and shoaib.
 
No one cares what you think about his action

No one has lodged a complaint.
His action is legal

Ball tamperer imran if anything is a bonafide cheater.

I have imran at 1 for now due to longevity. Bumrah number 2

Wasim 3

Then rest you can change based on preferences. I have shami waqar and shoaib.
No he chucks and that's why he isn't being tested. A drink driver never wants to take the breathalyser, the BCCI knows what's coming
 
I would pick an Imran over Wasim every single day. Just that dogged fighting till the last ball never giving up approach is worth it. He's also a statistically better pick & you get a free batter at 7.

I mean if you just add Imran to the current Pak team, it'll immediately go from mediocre to world class while if you add Wasim, it'll be be good but won't create the same impact.
 
No one cares what you think about his action

No one has lodged a complaint.
His action is legal

Ball tamperer imran if anything is a bonafide cheater.

I have imran at 1 for now due to longevity. Bumrah number 2

Wasim 3

Then rest you can change based on preferences. I have shami waqar and shoaib.

Lol. Imran averaged 19 with the ball for a WHOLE DECADE. you aint beating that
 
Back
Top