June 25, 2009 - The death of Michael Jackson

James

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Can't believe it's been this long already. I remember watching it all unfold on television and the Internet. Quite unbelievable. The light that burns twice as brightly goes out twice as fast.

RIP Jacko. What a singer, performer and entertainer. The best dancer I've ever seen. And even a bit of a songwriter too.

As for the other stuff...proper shady, but he was found not guilty (I think). ;-)

What are your opinions and memories of this unique individual?
 
Michael Jackson, after Hello, and OK, is the most popular word in the world.

MJ was truly the King of Entertainment.
 
It is scary the amount of talent this guy had. Whenever you say the word music, you think Michael Jackson. He is the greatest entertainer of all time.

However he did have his drug problems. I don't want to dwell too much on it because it detracts from his musical accomplishments but its sad that he only ever found peace on the stage, performing.

At home though he was a troubled person, when Conrad Murray went on trial a sound clip of MJ was played - and it is deeply disturbing as he sounded totally disorientated. His difficult upbringing and inability to cope with pressures that go with global fame as a child contributed to his downfall. The tabloids wrote a great deal of garbage about him, but all in all - I think that Martin Bashir documentary thoroughly broke him. Close friends to him say that was the night that broke Michael Jackson.

Its a shame that others felt the need to piggyback off Jackson's career, and his death to boost their own egos and careers - Uri Geller for example. He just wanted to bask in reflected glory and get publicity for himself. He exploited him, made fun of him – told him he was going to get him to the moon and then after he died he laughed at him being “gullible” – and introduced him, for payment, to Bashir who manipulated his so called ‘documentary’.

It also sickened me to see all the celebrities in faux-grief when MJ died, where were they when he was alive ? Fact is that MJ was a highly ostracised person and reduced to a comedy figure at the end of his life, but these celebrities were nowhere to be seen during his struggles.

Jackson though didn't help himself, he developed a painkiller addiction and had some bizarre fetishes.

Nevertheless, his songs such as Billie Jean, Bad, Thriller will still live long in the memory. Kind of wish you could rewind the clock so to speak and relive them all over again because Michael Jackson was THE biggest icon of the entertainment industry when those songs got the success that it did.
 
No artist compares to Jacko, he did turn himself into a freak but he was mega talented. I remember when his videos were about to premier on tv there was so much anticipation, you just don't get that anymore :(
 
Great singer no doubt. Bit of a whackjob though.

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Listening to Thriller (the album) to mark the occasion. Still absolutely erm...thrilling! Especially Wanna Be Startin' Somethin' which has the feel of greatness foreshadowed, and Billie Jean which possesses a very clever message about the pressures of fame.
 
I used to listen to MJ all the time on cassette tape. Loved it.

Thriller is the best music video ever pretty much.

thriller.gif

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We were just discussing it at home a few hours back about (Michael Jackson´s third death anniversary and) how times just flies away.

Condolences to his survivors:53:.
 
The light that burns twice as brightly goes out twice as fast.

Oh yes, Blade Runner was on last night..... ;-)

RIP Jacko. What a singer, performer and entertainer. The best dancer I've ever seen. And even a bit of a songwriter too.

What are your opinions and memories of this unique individual?

Some American coppers I know reckon he was guilty the first time, but not guilty the second time.

I think he was a writer and performer of genius. He went too young.

I remember sitting up late in my first year at uni halls TV room to watch the Thriller video when it came out. It caused quite a stir. We 'ad just 't three telly channels in them days, mind.... none of this yootoob nonsense! Eeee, ye dunno yer born....
 
OMG really 3 years it really feels like yesterday. I am really shocked.
 
No artist compares to Jacko, he did turn himself into a freak but he was mega talented. I remember when his videos were about to premier on tv there was so much anticipation, you just don't get that anymore :(

Especially in iNDIA,the first word that comes out if anyone talked abt English music is MICHAEL JACKSON......
and wen it comes to dance there are no parallels.......but Prabhu deva is not bad
 
It is scary the amount of talent this guy had. Whenever you say the word music, you think Michael Jackson. He is the greatest entertainer of all time.

However he did have his drug problems. I don't want to dwell too much on it because it detracts from his musical accomplishments but its sad that he only ever found peace on the stage, performing.

At home though he was a troubled person, when Conrad Murray went on trial a sound clip of MJ was played - and it is deeply disturbing as he sounded totally disorientated. His difficult upbringing and inability to cope with pressures that go with global fame as a child contributed to his downfall. The tabloids wrote a great deal of garbage about him, but all in all - I think that Martin Bashir documentary thoroughly broke him. Close friends to him say that was the night that broke Michael Jackson.

Its a shame that others felt the need to piggyback off Jackson's career, and his death to boost their own egos and careers - Uri Geller for example. He just wanted to bask in reflected glory and get publicity for himself. He exploited him, made fun of him – told him he was going to get him to the moon and then after he died he laughed at him being “gullible” – and introduced him, for payment, to Bashir who manipulated his so called ‘documentary’.

It also sickened me to see all the celebrities in faux-grief when MJ died, where were they when he was alive ? Fact is that MJ was a highly ostracised person and reduced to a comedy figure at the end of his life, but these celebrities were nowhere to be seen during his struggles.

Jackson though didn't help himself, he developed a painkiller addiction and had some bizarre fetishes.

Nevertheless, his songs such as Billie Jean, Bad, Thriller will still live long in the memory. Kind of wish you could rewind the clock so to speak and relive them all over again because Michael Jackson was THE biggest icon of the entertainment industry when those songs got the success that it did.
Top post , I doubt anyone else can gain as much popularity around the world again as he did .
 
A legend.....A true legend.....One of the greatest musicians and dancers that ever walked on this planet! RIP :( :'(
 
His music transcends so many boundaries and will stay awesome for decades to come.

Imo he was murdered.
 
It is scary the amount of talent this guy had. Whenever you say the word music, you think Michael Jackson. He is the greatest entertainer of all time.

However he did have his drug problems. I don't want to dwell too much on it because it detracts from his musical accomplishments but its sad that he only ever found peace on the stage, performing.

At home though he was a troubled person, when Conrad Murray went on trial a sound clip of MJ was played - and it is deeply disturbing as he sounded totally disorientated. His difficult upbringing and inability to cope with pressures that go with global fame as a child contributed to his downfall. The tabloids wrote a great deal of garbage about him, but all in all - I think that Martin Bashir documentary thoroughly broke him. Close friends to him say that was the night that broke Michael Jackson.

Its a shame that others felt the need to piggyback off Jackson's career, and his death to boost their own egos and careers - Uri Geller for example. He just wanted to bask in reflected glory and get publicity for himself. He exploited him, made fun of him – told him he was going to get him to the moon and then after he died he laughed at him being “gullible” – and introduced him, for payment, to Bashir who manipulated his so called ‘documentary’.

It also sickened me to see all the celebrities in faux-grief when MJ died, where were they when he was alive ? Fact is that MJ was a highly ostracised person and reduced to a comedy figure at the end of his life, but these celebrities were nowhere to be seen during his struggles.

Jackson though didn't help himself, he developed a painkiller addiction and had some bizarre fetishes.

Nevertheless, his songs such as Billie Jean, Bad, Thriller will still live long in the memory. Kind of wish you could rewind the clock so to speak and relive them all over again because Michael Jackson was THE biggest icon of the entertainment industry when those songs got the success that it did.

Agree with everything but to add - the reason why MJ flopped in the later years was because his music didn’t evolve. It was the same Drum Set/Groove used in Thriller than was used in the album Invincible. The same "Aaahhs" and "oooos", groove, tempo, just made his music predictable.

Still I shed a tear when MJ died. Still listen to Thriller and Bad Album. I also remember the day I bombed it home so I could catch the world exclusive of "Black and White"

What memories.
 
Earth Song is possibly my favourite. A bit solipsistic and insane, but what an astounding vocal performance.
 
Agree with everything but to add - the reason why MJ flopped in the later years was because his music didn’t evolve. It was the same Drum Set/Groove used in Thriller than was used in the album Invincible. The same "Aaahhs" and "oooos", groove, tempo, just made his music predictable.

Still I shed a tear when MJ died. Still listen to Thriller and Bad Album. I also remember the day I bombed it home so I could catch the world exclusive of "Black and White"

What memories.

The guitar bit at the start is wicked and little Macaulay Culkin , whatever happened to him?
 
My top 5 Jacko songs:

5. Black or White
4. Beat It
3. Thriller
2. Rock with You
1. Human Nature
 
Absolute genius. I love almost everyone of his songs, I can play different ones to suit my mood.

I listened to stranger in moscow today on the way home from work today and it sent chills down my spine.

Also the invincible album has been critically panned but it contains some of his finest ballads..in particular butterflies and break of dawn.
 
Blood on the Dance Floor is an underrated song. Really dark, macabre and sexual. Taboo-style Jacko.
 
I still remember the first time I heard the news...I was coming back from school in a bus..and somebody in the bus got a text message and the lady shouted to everybody in the bus...every one was shocked.

And then I spent the next week..listening to his songs...watching documentaries...his videos...my spare time was all michael Jackson...

And that Speech my Jackson's Daughter in the Funeral was sad...

Guy was a freaking Genius....True Global superstar....CNN published an article about how michael jackson tooked down internet......


Its so sad how his life turned out...but how ever sad this may sound...His death brought back his legacy...people now actually talk about his music, his dance..than his personal life. As saying goes " You never know its value untill you do not have it oneday" ..

<iframe width="480" height="360" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/XnDMMwaMCa8" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

One of those videos that always comes to my mind..when MJ is named..look at the fan reaction through out the video..amazing...and watch out for the step at 6: 40 to 6:50
 
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Article I was talking about..

How many people does it take to break the Internet? On June 25, we found out it's just one -- if that one is Michael Jackson.

The biggest showbiz story of the year saw the troubled star take a good slice of the Internet with him, as the ripples caused by the news of his death swept around the globe.

"Between approximately 2: 40 p.m. PDT and 3:15 p.m. PDT today, some Google News users experienced difficulty accessing search results for queries related to Michael Jackson," a Google spokesman told CNET, which also reported that Google News users complained that the service was inaccessible for a time. At its peak, Google Trends rated the Jackson story as "volcanic."
As sites fell, users raced to other sites: TechCrunch reported that TMZ, which broke the story, had several outages; users then switched to Perez Hilton's blog, which also struggled to deal with the requests it received.

CNN reported a fivefold rise in traffic and visitors in just over an hour, receiving 20 million page views in the hour the story broke.


Twitter crashed as users saw multiple "fail whales" -- the illustrations the site uses as error messages -- user FoieGrasie posting, "Irony: The protesters in Iran using Twitter as com are unable to get online because of all the posts of 'Michael Jackson RIP.' Well done." The site's status blog said that Twitter had had to temporarily disable its search results, saved searches and trend topics.

Wikipedia saw a flurry of activity, with close to 500 edits made to Jackson's entry in less than 24 hours. CNET reported that by 3:15 p.m. PT, Wikipedia seemed to be "temporarily overloaded."

The Los Angeles Times, the first news organization to confirm Jackson's death, suffered outages. The site also reported that AOL's instant messenger service had been hit, quoting an AOL statement that said, "AIM was down for approximately 40 minutes this afternoon." The statement said, "Today was a seminal moment in Internet history. We've never seen anything like it in terms of scope or depth."

That was backed up by AOL consumer adviser Regina Lewis, who said that, although the numbers weren't in yet, the day should prove a historic milestone for mobile Internet traffic.

http://articles.cnn.com/2009-06-26/...nds-search-results-michael-jackson?_s=PM:TECH
 
Blood on the Dance Floor is an underrated song. Really dark, macabre and sexual. Taboo-style Jacko.

True...I also think Dirty Diana is also one of his under rated songs....atleast people do not usually name it as one of his best...which I think it is...

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Modern r&b artists like usher, chris brown and neyo basically lifted their whole style from MJ....they more or less openly admit this.


Also theres a great video on youtube where james brown calls MJ and prince on stage. MJ does a cool song and dance improv while Prince does some freaky prince moves.

Im on my phone so cant post it atm but its a great video.
 
MJ was a great dancer/performer

i still don't like any of his songs........some songs have good beat to it, but i still don't like any of his song
 
Modern r&b artists like usher, chris brown and neyo basically lifted their whole style from MJ....they more or less openly admit this.


Also theres a great video on youtube where james brown calls MJ and prince on stage. MJ does a cool song and dance improv while Prince does some freaky prince moves.

Im on my phone so cant post it atm but its a great video.

Thats one of my favourite youtube clips of all time.. my 3 fav artists on one stage :)

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/hPK12SymqeQ" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
 
King of Pop.



The guy revolutionized the whole industry, made a place in people's hearts all over the world. No mean achievement. Arguably the greatest international celebrities of'em all.
 
Give in to me is one of his finest songs, however, its not even that popular. What a legend!
 
Michael Jackson turns 60 today. The king of pop died at the age of 50 in 2009.
 
I remember I was abroad at the time of his death.Everyone at the hotel breakfast was talking about Jackson.I never found his songs to be extraordinary tbh but he was a good dancer.
 
Legend. There will never be an entertainer like him ever again!
 
I came to know of him because his performance at MTV 1995 music awards. His videos would routinely come up on MTV those days. I loved each and every video of his especially Smooth Criminal.
 
It was his live performances that really, really stood out. Could keep the fans at the palm of his hands. People can argue whether his music was great or not, but no one can argue whether he was a phenomenal dancer and performer.
 
Not a good time for MJ fans given the recent revelations about his personal life.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en-gb"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Leaving Neverland director: ‘We needed to establish what Michael Jackson was doing with little children’ <br> <a href="https://t.co/huxY0MiTvo">https://t.co/huxY0MiTvo</a></p>— The Independent (@Independent) <a href="https://twitter.com/Independent/status/1100057919108907008?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">25 February 2019</a></blockquote>
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Hear The Jacksons play last year. They played ‘Gone Too Soon’ in their brother’s memory.
 
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en-gb"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Michael Jackson's music has been 'dropped' by BBC Radio 2 <a href="https://t.co/YLlVnFUEA5">https://t.co/YLlVnFUEA5</a></p>— The Independent (@Independent) <a href="https://twitter.com/Independent/status/1102157435492544513?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">3 March 2019</a></blockquote>
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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">A statue of Michael Jackson has been removed from Britain's National Football Museum in the wake of fresh allegations of sexual abuse that continue to surround the pop superstar's legacy <a href="https://t.co/CWPcy2hsQJ">https://t.co/CWPcy2hsQJ</a> <a href="https://t.co/GHxIjgaOmb">pic.twitter.com/GHxIjgaOmb</a></p>— CNN (@CNN) <a href="https://twitter.com/CNN/status/1103631399318376448?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">March 7, 2019</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>


<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Radio stations drop Michael Jackson’s music over sex abuse claims: Right decision or over the top? <a href="https://t.co/BgqD2ILHYx">pic.twitter.com/BgqD2ILHYx</a></p>— RT (@RT_com) <a href="https://twitter.com/RT_com/status/1103586280217198592?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">March 7, 2019</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">HBO's <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/LeavingNeverland?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#LeavingNeverland</a> has radio stations around the world banning Michael Jackson's music: <a href="https://t.co/74PFoP2ozF">https://t.co/74PFoP2ozF</a> <a href="https://t.co/azdb7sRPA4">pic.twitter.com/azdb7sRPA4</a></p>— Complex (@Complex) <a href="https://twitter.com/Complex/status/1103483566778929152?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">March 7, 2019</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
 
skynews-michael-jackson-bus_4605910.jpg


Transport for London is facing calls to remove bus adverts proclaiming Michael Jackson's innocence in the wake of child sexual abuse allegations against the singer.

The adverts - which follow a £20,000 crowdfunding campaign backed by Jackson's supporters - have appeared on double-decker buses across the capital.

They feature the pop star's face with the word "innocent" over his mouth, along with the slogan: "Facts don't lie. People do."

It comes after the Leaving Neverland documentary, broadcast on Channel 4 last week, featured claims by two men who say they were sexually abused by Jackson as children.

The Survivors Trust, which supports victims of rape and child sexual abuse, told Sky News the adverts were "really inappropriate" and called for Transport for London (TfL) to take them down.


"The decision to prioritise advertising revenue over the option of remaining neutral on such an emotive topic is disappointing," it added.

The trust said fewer than one in five victims of rape or assault by penetration reported the attacks to police, while a quarter of those victims remain silent because they do not think they will be believed.

"An advertising campaign such as this perpetuates this fear amongst survivors and is very misplaced," it added.

The adverts have appeared after a crowdfunding page, entitled Michael Jackson Innocent Campaign, hit its £20,000 target within a month

According to the page's author, the campaign decided to post the adverts on London buses because "they are iconic and instantly recognisable across the world."

The campaign is reportedly being led by former Big Brother UK contestant and Jackson fanatic Seany O'Kane.

In Leaving Neverland, Wade Robson and James Safechuck claim they were molested by Jackson when they were children - and described the alleged incidents in graphic detail.

The singer's estate has dismissed the allegations and denounced HBO and Channel 4's decision to air them, claiming the programme spreads falsehoods about a man who is not alive to defend himself.

Responding to criticism of the bus adverts, TfL said the advertising campaign "is compliant with our advertising policy".

"Prior to running the campaign, advice was taken from the Committees of Advertising Practice (CAP) and our legal team," a spokeswoman added.

A spokeswoman for Mayor of London Sadiq Khan said: "The Mayor did not approve this campaign. This was a decision made by TfL in line with their advertising policy."

https://news.sky.com/story/michael-...adverts-protesting-singers-innocence-11663224
 
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Seems guilty. Was never a fan cause he had a weird persona and his music wasn't my type. He does seem like a victim of abuse himself thus the weird personality and the fatal drug addiction. He grew up in Hollywood where this stuff is rife and his father was known to be abusive so that definitely played a role in how he turned out.
 
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His music was incredible in particular his early stuff, and he was one of the best live performers we’ve ever seen. He really was a genius imo.

However, given the evidence against him and from so many different sources I think it’s fair to say that on the balance of probabilities Michael Jackson was a paedophile and a child abuser. And he got away with it because of his power, fame and money.
 
Watched the documentary after body language experts said the victims and their mothers aren't lying and it is actually disturbing.
 
His music was incredible in particular his early stuff, and he was one of the best live performers we’ve ever seen. He really was a genius imo.

However, given the evidence against him and from so many different sources I think it’s fair to say that on the balance of probabilities Michael Jackson was a paedophile and a child abuser. And he got away with it because of his power, fame and money.

Idk his music never appealed to me but then it must be a generational thing, didn't grow up listening to his music.
 
Watched the documentary after body language experts said the victims and their mothers aren't lying and it is actually disturbing.

I feel like they aren't lying however body language "experts" are quacks and follow a pseudoscience, you should believe them based off the evidence which is very believable.
 
Watched the documentary after body language experts said the victims and their mothers aren't lying and it is actually disturbing.

It was obvious they were lying. A 20 year old did not know he was abused or what abuse is? One of them also said he had no interest in money for filing a lawsuit. $1billion but he had no interest in money?

Nobody can say for sure if MJ abused any child but he had extensive investigations inc by the FBI. He was cleared in a criminal trial and many other kids said he did not abuse them.

Until someone is found guilty in a court of law, they are innocent and MJ was the greatest music artist of all time.
 
It was obvious they were lying. A 20 year old did not know he was abused or what abuse is? One of them also said he had no interest in money for filing a lawsuit. $1billion but he had no interest in money?

Nobody can say for sure if MJ abused any child but he had extensive investigations inc by the FBI. He was cleared in a criminal trial and many other kids said he did not abuse them.

Until someone is found guilty in a court of law, they are innocent and MJ was the greatest music artist of all time.

Nah fam, it can takes decades for a victim of abuse to come out or even understand what they experienced. Although you do have a point that they lied under oath saying that MJ didn't abuse them however they explain it in the documentary. Also it's not true FBI cleared him lmao, they found a lot of questionable stuff in his house, [MENTION=7898]Gabbar Singh[/MENTION] posted a pdf of what the cops found. Of course he couldn't be prosecuted for that however that indicates that he was a creep. Also you need to ask yourself, what kind of a grown 35 year old man or any man for that matter shares a bed with children? (They're not even his own kids). Watch his interview with Martin Bashir (Brit Pak btw :afridi ), he came off as so weird. There's a part in that interview where he's holding tightly one of the boys hands who couldn't be more than 13, no boy of that age would like to hold hands with any guy or anybody for that matter. You should also check out interviews of his sister LaToya from as far back as the early 90s, she really called him out.
 
Nah fam, it can takes decades for a victim of abuse to come out or even understand what they experienced. Although you do have a point that they lied under oath saying that MJ didn't abuse them however they explain it in the documentary. Also it's not true FBI cleared him lmao, they found a lot of questionable stuff in his house, [MENTION=7898]Gabbar Singh[/MENTION] posted a pdf of what the cops found. Of course he couldn't be prosecuted for that however that indicates that he was a creep. Also you need to ask yourself, what kind of a grown 35 year old man or any man for that matter shares a bed with children? (They're not even his own kids). Watch his interview with Martin Bashir (Brit Pak btw :afridi ), he came off as so weird. There's a part in that interview where he's holding tightly one of the boys hands who couldn't be more than 13, no boy of that age would like to hold hands with any guy or anybody for that matter. You should also check out interviews of his sister LaToya from as far back as the early 90s, she really called him out.

Where did I say the FBI cleared him?

** bro, a 20 year old man will know if he was abused unless he has no brain.

Most of his family disagree with Latoya.

Yes he was strange and some dodgy stuff was found but we dont know the reason for those materials being present. He had a lot of ememies too.

It's a fact he was cleared unless you think the Jury trials in the US are a joke.
 
Where did I say the FBI cleared him?

** bro, a 20 year old man will know if he was abused unless he has no brain.

Most of his family disagree with Latoya.

Yes he was strange and some dodgy stuff was found but we dont know the reason for those materials being present. He had a lot of ememies too.

It's a fact he was cleared unless you think the Jury trials in the US are a joke.

A certain O.J. Simpson was found not guilty by court as well.
 
Where did I say the FBI cleared him?

** bro, a 20 year old man will know if he was abused unless he has no brain.

Most of his family disagree with Latoya.

Yes he was strange and some dodgy stuff was found but we dont know the reason for those materials being present. He had a lot of ememies too.

It's a fact he was cleared unless you think the Jury trials in the US are a joke.

you're right, juries are a joke. Casey Anthony and George Zimmerman were also acquitted.
 
A certain O.J. Simpson was found not guilty by court as well.

I dont think OJ was guilty, I think his son was and OJ arrived at the scene and ever since has covered his back. The police produced the infamous glove in court claiming it was worn by the killer , yet it didnot fit the hand of the OJ.

you're right, juries are a joke. Casey Anthony and George Zimmerman were also acquitted.

Well that's the best you have and I think on many occasions US justice system works really well but on others it doesn't. However we cannot in society suggest someone is guilty if not proven in court and because of the words of people without any new evidence.

Btw Why not stop the music of others who are accused or even where there is strong evidence they had intimate relations with minors such as David Bowie and Elvis?
 
It was obvious they were lying. A 20 year old did not know he was abused or what abuse is? One of them also said he had no interest in money for filing a lawsuit. $1billion but he had no interest in money?

Nobody can say for sure if MJ abused any child but he had extensive investigations inc by the FBI. He was cleared in a criminal trial and many other kids said he did not abuse them.

Until someone is found guilty in a court of law, they are innocent and MJ was the greatest music artist of all time.

I disagree, I found the alleged victim’s testimonies to be generally convincing.

There is also documented circumstantial evidence like video footage of Jacko holding hands and being very close with the kids, hotel room records showing how far away the parents were being booked from Jacko’s room (increased distance over time), tour intineraries and such, which show Jacko developing an extremely intimate friendship with these two small boys.

I would also refute the idea that because other children say they weren’t abused, that proves Jacko was not an abuser. An abuser does not abuse everyone that they come into contact with - they are clever and manipulative people, who select and target their victims carefully as to give themselves the best chance of getting away with it. If Jacko had tried to abuse Macauley Culkin for example, the world’s biggest and most stridently confident child star at the time, who was followed day & night by the press, then there is no way it would have ever stayed a secret - hence, Jacko did not select Culkin for abuse.

I too am a huge fan of Michael Jackson's work - but I also now believe that he sexually abused at least two children.
 
Has anyone seen the documentary Leaving Neverland? If so, what are your reactions, observations etc?
 
Has anyone seen the documentary Leaving Neverland? If so, what are your reactions, observations etc?

I watched it. Essentially it was several hours of 2 people describing how they were groomed and sexually abused by Jackson. On its own I don’t think it would ever be enough to conclude that MJ was a paedophile however when you add it to all the other stuff like:

The other accusers through the years- there are at least 3 or 4 others;

The fact that MJ paid out tens of millions to settle out of court when accused of child abuse;

The fact that MJ is on record stating he spent countless nights with just him and young boys in his bedroom alone;

The fact that pornography involving young boys was found in his bedroom during the police search;

The fact that several employees that worked at neverland have stated he used to sleep naked with young boys, go into the bath naked with young boys and generally behave inappropriately with them.

The fact that his own sister accused him of abusing young boys.

Then it paints a different picture imo.

If some random bloke down the street behaved like this what would we say? MJ is only being defended because of his past fame. Take away the celebrity part of him and just analyse his actions and it doesn’t look good.
 
Has anyone seen the documentary Leaving Neverland? If so, what are your reactions, observations etc?

I've not watched it yet.

Part of me doesn't want to watch it as I was a fan of Jackson's music.
 
He also has a pakistani victim, omer bhatti. He had a very weird relationship with him. Look him up, it's creepy. Also all of their greedy parents are complicit and should be locked up
 
I've not watched it yet.

Part of me doesn't want to watch it as I was a fan of Jackson's music.

Sorry for the late response bro, but watch it and it giev you more insight in why those 'victims' are claiming the things that happend to them. On the other side you might find their claimes weak and you could live further in peace
 
I watched it. Essentially it was several hours of 2 people describing how they were groomed and sexually abused by Jackson. On its own I don’t think it would ever be enough to conclude that MJ was a paedophile however when you add it to all the other stuff like:

The other accusers through the years- there are at least 3 or 4 others;

The fact that MJ paid out tens of millions to settle out of court when accused of child abuse;

The fact that MJ is on record stating he spent countless nights with just him and young boys in his bedroom alone;

The fact that pornography involving young boys was found in his bedroom during the police search;

The fact that several employees that worked at neverland have stated he used to sleep naked with young boys, go into the bath naked with young boys and generally behave inappropriately with them.

The fact that his own sister accused him of abusing young boys.

Then it paints a different picture imo.

If some random bloke down the street behaved like this what would we say? MJ is only being defended because of his past fame. Take away the celebrity part of him and just analyse his actions and it doesn’t look good.

Sorry for the late response bro.
The part about MJ being alone in his room with those is disgusting. In my opinion its also the fault of the parents to let that happen. Specially the one lady with the red hair gave me the feeling that she didn't want to face the reality of what might have happend o her son because of all the benefits they got with their son being up and close with MJ.
Your last sentence is soo true man. It's disgusting to see how some people will defend a celebrity no matter what they've done.
 
I watched it. Essentially it was several hours of 2 people describing how they were groomed and sexually abused by Jackson. On its own I don’t think it would ever be enough to conclude that MJ was a paedophile however when you add it to all the other stuff like:

The other accusers through the years- there are at least 3 or 4 others;

The fact that MJ paid out tens of millions to settle out of court when accused of child abuse;

The fact that MJ is on record stating he spent countless nights with just him and young boys in his bedroom alone;

The fact that pornography involving young boys was found in his bedroom during the police search;

The fact that several employees that worked at neverland have stated he used to sleep naked with young boys, go into the bath naked with young boys and generally behave inappropriately with them.

The fact that his own sister accused him of abusing young boys.

Then it paints a different picture imo.

If some random bloke down the street behaved like this what would we say? MJ is only being defended because of his past fame. Take away the celebrity part of him and just analyse his actions and it doesn’t look good.

Too add to my last post: Isn't it F****** strange that a grown men is so intrested in your young son and wants to spend so much time with him and spends 3-4-5 hours talking to him on the phone???? Where those parents head stuck up in their behind?
 
Too add to my last post: Isn't it F****** strange that a grown men is so intrested in your young son and wants to spend so much time with him and spends 3-4-5 hours talking to him on the phone???? Where those parents head stuck up in their behind?

I was stunned by the lenient approach of the parents. It was literally only when Jacko said that he wanted that one boy to permanently live at Neverland that his mum finally clicked and said no.
 
Too add to my last post: Isn't it F****** strange that a grown men is so intrested in your young son and wants to spend so much time with him and spends 3-4-5 hours talking to him on the phone???? Where those parents head stuck up in their behind?

To be fair, most people just assumed Jackson was just a man who never really grew up. He did a lot of wacky stuff like wear surgical masks in public and walk around holding hands with a chimp.

I haven't watched the documentary, but by all accounts those who have seem fairly convinced by the testimony of the guys involved. Of course they have lied before so you could say they might be lying now. I tend to believe it's true but am not a fan of talking about stuff after the guy is dead and can't refute the claims.
 
I was stunned by the lenient approach of the parents. It was literally only when Jacko said that he wanted that one boy to permanently live at Neverland that his mum finally clicked and said no.

Yes totally agree. It looked like the parents just didn't want to know what was really happening. Specially the lady with the red hair.
 
To be fair, most people just assumed Jackson was just a man who never really grew up. He did a lot of wacky stuff like wear surgical masks in public and walk around holding hands with a chimp.

I haven't watched the documentary, but by all accounts those who have seem fairly convinced by the testimony of the guys involved. Of course they have lied before so you could say they might be lying now. I tend to believe it's true but am not a fan of talking about stuff after the guy is dead and can't refute the claims.

They were still really young I think when they said that MJ didn't abuse them. But you should also know that a lot of people who have been abused realise later on in life what has really happend.
 
I tend to believe it's true but am not a fan of talking about stuff after the guy is dead and can't refute the claims.

Would you apply the same standard to Jimmy Savile? I’m not saying that you personally would or wouldn’t, but Jacko seems to be getting an easier ride than Savile in many quarters to say that he is an equally dead man.
 
Would you apply the same standard to Jimmy Savile? I’m not saying that you personally would or wouldn’t, but Jacko seems to be getting an easier ride than Savile in many quarters to say that he is an equally dead man.

There is money to be made from accusing Jackson whilst there is nothing to be made from Savile. The court trial in 2005 was the time for these guys to come forward, but they didn't even though they were grown men, hence we will never the truth. We only have 2 facts: he paid off a kid in the early 90's and he was found not guilty in court which these guys didn't partake in. The rest is just speculation.
 
Would you apply the same standard to Jimmy Savile? I’m not saying that you personally would or wouldn’t, but Jacko seems to be getting an easier ride than Savile in many quarters to say that he is an equally dead man.

Wasn't the evidence against Savile far more comprehensive? In my mind there is still some doubt over Jackson and that is why it is unfortunate he can't answer the accusations. That said, I haven't seen the documentary and I accept that those who have seen it almost universally believe the accusations so in all likelihood it is true.
 
I watched it. Essentially it was several hours of 2 people describing how they were groomed and sexually abused by Jackson. On its own I don’t think it would ever be enough to conclude that MJ was a paedophile however when you add it to all the other stuff like:

The other accusers through the years- there are at least 3 or 4 others;

The fact that MJ paid out tens of millions to settle out of court when accused of child abuse;

The fact that MJ is on record stating he spent countless nights with just him and young boys in his bedroom alone;

The fact that pornography involving young boys was found in his bedroom during the police search;

The fact that several employees that worked at neverland have stated he used to sleep naked with young boys, go into the bath naked with young boys and generally behave inappropriately with them.

The fact that his own sister accused him of abusing young boys.

Then it paints a different picture imo.

If some random bloke down the street behaved like this what would we say? MJ is only being defended because of his past fame. Take away the celebrity part of him and just analyse his actions and it doesn’t look good.

Most of your 'evidence' has an explanation.

The first young boy to accuse Michael did it at the behest of his greedy father. Theres tonnes of info that shreds that case.

Why did Michael settle out of court? Well he would have had to cancel a series of tour dates, lost a ton of money, had the media all over him for months and probably would have had pictures of his private parts shown publicly.

20 million dollars is an amount he could have made in one night, literally pocket change compared to the amount he would have lost in cancelled tour dates. I believe Michael retrospectively admitted he should have fought the case instead of settling.

Now what do other greedy parents see when they see him settling? A chance to make money...out come the allegations.

Also none of the evidence you mentioned the cops finding was child abuse related. The books were commercially available. Sketchy yes..but they were sold as art. The rest was porn with adults.

His bedroom was a bloody duplex the size of a house. Saying kids slept in his bedroom makes people think of a small boxed room. His room could sleep about 20 adults in it.

Latoya also admitted that she was forced to say those things by a controlling husband.

The stuff you mentioned about the staff at neverland is new to me.

Yes MJ was a proper weirdo. Yes he had an abnormal relationship with kids....however im of the opinion that it wasnt sexual. He was a disturbed man reliving his lost childhood through them and doing things he wasnt allowed to do because his father was nuts.

I dont believe Wade and the other guy one bit....but i feel sorry for them as they are clearly disturbed. However a one sided documentary isnt going to help them with their personal issues.
 
Would you apply the same standard to Jimmy Savile? I’m not saying that you personally would or wouldn’t, but Jacko seems to be getting an easier ride than Savile in many quarters to say that he is an equally dead man.

Jackson is pretty much universally loved so it is hard for fans to believe these testimonies. How could anyone who created all that happiness be a child molester?

Even as a wee lad watching Jim’ll Fix It I found something creepy about Saville. I didn’t know what it was but others must have felt it too. Deep down many knew he was a wrong ‘un. But he did all that charity work, had tea with Thatcher at Chequers, was chummy with Chief Constables and that made it hard for those who knew something was wrong to push for investigation. When it all came out everyone knew what they felt was true.
 
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I disagree, I found the alleged victim’s testimonies to be generally convincing.

There is also documented circumstantial evidence like video footage of Jacko holding hands and being very close with the kids, hotel room records showing how far away the parents were being booked from Jacko’s room (increased distance over time), tour intineraries and such, which show Jacko developing an extremely intimate friendship with these two small boys.

I would also refute the idea that because other children say they weren’t abused, that proves Jacko was not an abuser. An abuser does not abuse everyone that they come into contact with - they are clever and manipulative people, who select and target their victims carefully as to give themselves the best chance of getting away with it. If Jacko had tried to abuse Macauley Culkin for example, the world’s biggest and most stridently confident child star at the time, who was followed day & night by the press, then there is no way it would have ever stayed a secret - hence, Jacko did not select Culkin for abuse.

I too am a huge fan of Michael Jackson's work - but I also now believe that he sexually abused at least two children.

The two had practiced their statments like a script and it was part of a docu which wasn't neutral but aimed at making Jacko look guilty.

Again a 20 year old will know if he was abused. What happened , one day he woke up and reaslied this all on his own? The other guy claims he was watching T.V when he realised he was also abused but lied because he was contacted by the lawyer of his new found mate, which he failed to mention. They also claimed money is no their motive but $1billion lawsuit is pending?

As for Saville , the key difference is Jackson was aquitted , Saville never faced trial and evidence against him is much much stronger.
 
Two men who featured in a documentary alleging sexual abuse by the singer Michael Jackson can pursue legal claims against two of his companies, a court has ruled.

Wade Robson and James Safechuck claim they were abused by the singer in the late 80s and early 90s while staying at his Neverland ranch.

Jackson died in 2009 but his family have denied the claims.

They described the documentary Leaving Neverland as a "public lynching".

A lower court had dismissed lawsuits brought by the two men in 2014 because California's statute of limitations required that claims of childhood sexual abuse be filed before an accuser's 26th birthday.

However a new law, which came into effect on 1 January, extends the timeframe up to a person's 40th birthday.

Both Mr Robson and Mr Safechuck claim they were abused by Jackson from the ages of seven and 10.

Vince Finaldi, the lawyer for the two men, said in a statement following the ruling: "We are pleased that the Court has recognised the strong protections California has put into place for sexual abuse victims under the state's new law extending the statute of limitations."

Howard Weitzman, a lawyer for Jackson's estate, said: "The Court of Appeal's ruling merely revived lawsuits against Michael Jackson's companies, which absurdly claim that Michael's employees are somehow responsible for sexual abuse that never happened."

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-50990766
 
Michael Jackson's Neverland ranch finally sells - but for fraction of original asking price

Michael Jackson's Neverland Ranch has sold for $22m (£16.2m) more than 10 years after his death.

Billionaire businessman and family friend of the Jacksons, Ron Burkle, bought the 2,700-acre estate after spotting it from the air while viewing a nearby property by helicopter.

The estate, near Santa Barbara in California, sold for a third of the latest asking price - which dropped from £73.6m to £49m in 2016, The Wall Street Journal reported.

As well as the 12,500-square foot main residence, the property boasts a 3,700-square foot pool house and a separate building with a 50-seat cinema and dance studio.

Jackson, who died in 2009 aged 50, installed a railway and theme park rides, as well as a zoo.

He named the ranch Neverland after the home of Peter Pan - the boy who never grew up - from the famous children's story.

The singer vowed never to return to the estate after he was acquitted of molesting a young boy there.

https://news.sky.com/story/michael-...or-fraction-of-original-asking-price-12172458
 
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