Kindly get vaccinated for the flu with the latest vaccines

[last_knight]

This is THE BEST way to avoid getting the flu and spreading it to other people.

Vaccine often includes a deactivated flu virus. The flu vaccine contains tiny amounts of the viruses it protects against. The presence of these viruses in the vaccine triggers the body’s natural defense mechanism to produce antibodies to fight them.

It is usually recommended for kids, for elderly and for healthcare workers and is generally safe for everyone.

Getting a flu vaccine is routine procedure in many countries but this is not a common practice in developing and third world countries.

Everyone in Pakistan, India, Bangladesh : kindly get vaccinated for Flu. ASAP.

 

[Itachi]

You've to look for cost too. In third world countries, there are diseases that are deadlier than common flu which require more attention unlike developed countries.

Vast majority of people can't afford it in seasonal basis. And most develop immunity already from previous occurrence of actually suffering through it and hence, it isn't a serious disease in India.

Different environments so different priorities play its role.

 

[last_knight]

You've to look for cost too. In third world countries, there are diseases that are deadlier than common flu which require more attention unlike developed countries.

Vast majority of people can't afford it in seasonal basis. And most develop immunity already from previous occurrence of actually suffering through it and hence, it isn't a serious disease in India.

Different environments so different priorities play its role.

Compare the cost with cost of every flu patient being investigated for CORONA with PCR Tests, Isolation and other stuff.

Flu is more common than Corona. But in current situation, everyone with Flu-Like Symptoms has to be tested for Corona and that's a massive burden for budget and man power. With Flu-Vaccine, we can reduce at least this burden.

 

[Sirris]

This is a totally bad advice for the current situation. In normal circumstances yes but not now. The general flu and coronavirus are different. Being immune from flu isn't going to help against coronavirus.

It is bad advice because this will overwhelm the health care sector when the need to put all their resources to combat coronavirus.

The best advice for now is to wash your hands regularly, keep your distance from other people, if you have flu like symptoms than stay home and avoid any contact with others. If you have flu like symptoms AND have been to Iran/china/Italy then go get checked.

Don't rush to buy medical masks and think they are going to help you. Medical masks should be worn by people who have flu like symptoms so that they don't spread it further.

 

[blackanhyellow]

Go in for a flu shot for the common flu and come out with Corona virus.

Back in the day it was go in you get your blood tested, come out with aids. Ahh simpler times.

 

[Sirris]

In case of Pakistan it's certain where the virus came from. A random guy in a rural area isn't suddenly going to have the virus. If he develops flu like symptoms he should rest at his home and avoid contact with others. No need to panic. While those folks who have been to Iran in February and all their close relatives and friend need to be honest with the rest of the country and self-isolate themselves for a while, at least 10 days.

 

[Itachi]

Don't rush to buy medical masks and think they are going to help you. Medical masks should be worn by people who have flu like symptoms so that they don't spread it further.

this part is very important for the fact that, not only for people who has flu symptoms, due to increase in demand, the medical professionals may not get the required supply. Most doctors are advicing against wearing a normal mask (that people are buying) because it isn't effective against COVID-19 which gives a misleading confidence against the virus.

I heard even toilet papers are in tremendous demand in USA for COVID-19. Why is that?

 

[BreadPakoda]

this part is very important for the fact that, not only for people who has flu symptoms, due to increase in demand, the medical professionals may not get the required supply. Most doctors are advicing against wearing a normal mask (that people are buying) because it isn't effective against COVID-19 which gives a misleading confidence against the virus.

I heard even toilet papers are in tremendous demand in USA for COVID-19. Why is that?

At least on the East Coast, toilet paper is available at Target and other such stores.

 

[Sirris]

this part is very important for the fact that, not only for people who has flu symptoms, due to increase in demand, the medical professionals may not get the required supply. Most doctors are advicing against wearing a normal mask (that people are buying) because it isn't effective against COVID-19 which gives a misleading confidence against the virus.

I heard even toilet papers are in tremendous demand in USA for COVID-19. Why is that?

I heard it has something to do with people believing the coronavirus causes diarrhea or something. Which is totally wrong and isn't the case.

 

[Ryw]

Bad advice, at the moment just takecare of your hygiene, clean hands, avoid rush areas.

 

[MenInG]

How many of you will take the flu jab this autumn/winter?

According to many, this is vital to make sure that you stay clear of the seasonal flu bug and ensure that this is not mistaken for Covid-19.

Many others feels its not necessary but what is your opinion?

 

[Tubs]

Hmm, I did get a text about one for seemingly the first time (I'm 23, so still pretty young). I assumed it may be because I have had some health issues fairly recently, but perhaps the prevailing medical advice is to get it done? I'm not sure to be honest, but I'm certainly not an anti-vaxxer so I'll probably go for it.

 

[last_knight]

According to many, this is vital to make sure that you stay clear of the seasonal flu bug and ensure that this is not mistaken for Covid-19.

I started a thread around March, exactly for this. To not mistake seasonal flu for Covid

 

[last_knight]

I will get a flu shot this month.

 

[Robert]

I will get the flu jab.

 

[IMMY69]

I’m immune suppressed and should be having the flu vaccine every year...
However first time I took it, around three years ago, it hit me so bad that I was down with it fatigue and caugh for ten days.

So I’ve not taken it since then and fortunately I’ve not had any major cold or flu since then.

Now with COVID-19 around I’m in two minds

 

[KingKhanWC]

I never take any vaccine and I would advise people to read this before they take the flu shot.

Danuta Skowronski and her Canadian colleagues recently found that influenza vaccine had “no effect on coronavirus or other NIRV risk.” Furthermore, they re-analyzed Wolff’s study and identified a methodological problem to account for the unexpected 36% increase in risk of coronavirus infection that he found associated with influenza vaccine.

https://www.bmj.com/content/369/bmj.m2184/rr-4

 

[Lurker_Ind]

Got mine.

 

[WhenSultansBowled]

Don't.

By no means, I am an anti-vaxxer or flat earther etc.

But why take a vaccine when you aren't even sick? It's a logical reasoning.

Keep your mask on, eat healthy, do some exercise and don't stress.

Only take vaccines if you are sick and your doctor explicitly asks you to do so.

 

[WhenSultansBowled]

According to many, this is vital to make sure that you stay clear of the seasonal flu bug and ensure that this is not mistaken for Covid-19.

Many others feels its not necessary but what is your opinion?

Only a qualified person should tell if a vaccine is necessary or not.

Unfortunately, we have people on both sides of the spectrum, ones who refuse to vaccinate and others who would inject anything

Stay safe and listen to your doctor fellas.

 

[James]

I didn’t really want to, and I’m at home 95% of the time now due to also working from home. So personally I don’t see the point. But “she who must be obeyed“ has insisted that I do, apparently for the kids’ sake as much as anything, so I have reluctantly agreed....got it booked in at the end of this month.

 

[Technics 1210]

There is no vaccine against the flu because the virus mutates. Fact.

Don't fall for the hoax.

 

[Kroll]

There is no vaccine against the flu because the virus mutates. Fact.

Don't fall for the hoax.

Disclaimer: Not for or against vaxx.

But that's why there's a vaccine every year because of the virus mutation.

 

[Slog]

Don't.

By no means, I am an anti-vaxxer or flat earther etc.

But why take a vaccine when you aren't even sick? It's a logical reasoning.

Keep your mask on, eat healthy, do some exercise and don't stress.

Only take vaccines if you are sick and your doctor explicitly asks you to do so.

The whole point of a vaccine is that it’s pre emptive. There’s not much point to taking a vaccine AFTER you’ve been afflicted with whatever it’s supposed to keep away

 

[Slog]

There is no vaccine against the flu because the virus mutates. Fact.

Don't fall for the hoax.

Your confidence is great but this post makes you look a bit foolish.

What you mention is why there is a need for a flu vaccine every year. New flu vaccines are released every year to keep up with rapidly adapting flu viruses. When you get vaccinated, your immune system produces antibodies to protect you from the viruses included in the vaccine.

What you have mentioned is the reason why there is a flu shot recommended every year but a polio vaccine once in your life.

 

[Technics 1210]

Your confidence is great but this post makes you look a bit foolish.

What you mention is why there is a need for a flu vaccine every year. New flu vaccines are released every year to keep up with rapidly adapting flu viruses. When you get vaccinated, your immune system produces antibodies to protect you from the viruses included in the vaccine.

What you have mentioned is the reason why there is a flu shot recommended every year but a polio vaccine once in your life.

It's not a vaccine if you need it every year.

 

[Shazzam]

Already got it for humanities sake.

 

[Robert]

I never take any vaccine and I would advise people to read this before they take the flu shot.

Vaccine for one disease does not prevent another disease.

Well blow me down with a feather.

 

[CanadianG00se]

This is THE BEST way to avoid getting the flu and spreading it to other people.

Vaccine often includes a deactivated flu virus. The flu vaccine contains tiny amounts of the viruses it protects against. The presence of these viruses in the vaccine triggers the body’s natural defense mechanism to produce antibodies to fight them.

It is usually recommended for kids, for elderly and for healthcare workers and is generally safe for everyone.

Getting a flu vaccine is routine procedure in many countries but this is not a common practice in developing and third world countries.

Everyone in Pakistan, India, Bangladesh : kindly get vaccinated for Flu. ASAP.

Never heard of Flu shot in India and I highly doubt an average India will even bother with it

 

[Arsal_AK]

There is no vaccine against the flu because the virus mutates. Fact.

Don't fall for the hoax.

All viruses mutate, this isn't novel to influenza viruses. It does however mutate really fast hence the reason there is a sightly different vaccine each year.

 

[Gabbar Singh]

I never take any vaccine and I would advise people to read this before they take the flu shot.



https://www.bmj.com/content/369/bmj.m2184/rr-4

KingKhan, do you have children or nieces/nephews and if so do you think they should take vaccines for measles, mumps, rubella, meningitis etc?

 

[Technics 1210]

All viruses mutate, this isn't novel to influenza viruses. It does however mutate really fast hence the reason there is a sightly different vaccine each year.

Indeed thus the sheeple buy into the hoax of a vaccine.

As a said before Doctors are paid to prescribe, the poorer the health, the bigger the cash signs. They're all on the scam.

What next, cure for common cold?

 

[HitWicket]

It's not a vaccine if you need it every year.

It's something put in your body that encourages the production of antibodies that help your immune system fight a virus, that's pretty much the dictionary definition of a vaccine...

 

[Technics 1210]

It's something put in your body that encourages the production of antibodies that help your immune system fight a virus, that's pretty much the dictionary definition of a vaccine...

I suggest you read up what vaccine and immune mean. The fact is flu vaccine doesn't prevent flu.

You go right ahead and let doctors inject kak into your body. Then you wonder why humans in the West are unable to fight diseases through natural immune system' the reliance on drugs and hoax vaccines.

The more you rely on medicine, the weaker your immune system becomes. Doctors won't tell you this because one vaccine is enough to fill their petrol tank for a day.

 

[KingKhanWC]

Vaccine for one disease does not prevent another disease.

Well blow me down with a feather.

Sure, the issue here is the flu jab makes it more likely to get Coronavirus. See the link I posted.

KingKhan, do you have children or nieces/nephews and if so do you think they should take vaccines for measles, mumps, rubella, meningitis etc?

Its up to the parents of small children to make this decision, I dont have to make any such decision. We do know many vaccines for children have caused serious health issues.

 

[Technics 1210]

I know plenty of parents who did not opt for MMR vaccines. Their kids are healthy as can be, well into their 20s too.

 

[HitWicket]

I suggest you read up what vaccine and immune mean. The fact is flu vaccine doesn't prevent flu.

You go right ahead and let doctors inject kak into your body. Then you wonder why humans in the West are unable to fight diseases through natural immune system' the reliance on drugs and hoax vaccines.

The more you rely on medicine, the weaker your immune system becomes. Doctors won't tell you this because one vaccine is enough to fill their petrol tank for a day.

The suggestion that vaccinations can weaken the immune response the body shows to diseases that weren't vaccinated against is nonsense.

 

[Technics 1210]

The suggestion that vaccinations can weaken the immune response the body shows to diseases that weren't vaccinated against is nonsense.

Read up on vaccine and immunity, and NHS's advice on antibiotics.

Until then feel free to be the guinea pig of the health system.

 

[HitWicket]

Sure, the issue here is the flu jab makes it more likely to get Coronavirus. See the link I posted.

The article you're referring to concludes that the flu vaccine does not increase the risk of COVID-19 or any other non-influenza respiratory virus. There are no articles in peer reviewed journals that conclude the opposite to this.

 

[HitWicket]

Read up on vaccine and immunity, and NHS's advice on antibiotics.

Until then feel free to be the guinea pig of the health system.

I'm unsure of your point, antibiotics are not vaccines and are not prescribed for minor illnesses. Again though, the suggestion that vaccinations can weaken the immune response the body shows to diseases that weren't vaccinated against is nonsense. Perhaps you'd like to point me in the direction of some peer-reviewed articles that are specific to the area you want to discuss?

 

[Technics 1210]

I'm unsure of your point, antibiotics are not vaccines and are not prescribed for minor illnesses. Again though, the suggestion that vaccinations can weaken the immune response the body shows to diseases that weren't vaccinated against is nonsense. Perhaps you'd like to point me in the direction of some peer-reviewed articles that are specific to the area you want to discuss?

When your white cells must rely on 3rd party assistance to fight illness, your immune system is then dependant on whatever kak you take. Fact.

Also stop mentioning peer-review. Doesn't make you smart. You have no subscription to peer-review, had you, you'd post the papers. How do you pay for Peer-review subscription! You can mention in INR.

Also the fact that generations have survived without vaccine destroys any point you have about survival.

Death rates among the eldery still remain constant, with or without the flu jab.

 

[miandadrules]

When your white cells must rely on 3rd party assistance to fight illness, your immune system is then dependant on whatever kak you take. Fact.

Also stop mentioning peer-review. Doesn't make you smart. You have no subscription to peer-review, had you, you'd post the papers. How do you pay for Peer-review subscription! You can mention in INR.

Also the fact that generations have survived without vaccine destroys any point you have about survival.

Death rates among the eldery still remain constant, with or without the flu jab.

You tell them, Pakistani Jones!

Just to clear up any ambiguity. I know you would never expect people to simply take your word for it, can you share the evidence that helped you reach these obvious conclusions?


Thanks in advance.

 

[HitWicket]

When your white cells must rely on 3rd party assistance to fight illness, your immune system is then dependant on whatever kak you take. Fact.

So have you got something to back up your claim that vaccines can negatively affect your immunity to other diseases? I'd love to read it if you could provide it please.

Also stop mentioning peer-review. Doesn't make you smart.

Why would I think mentioning peer-review makes me smart? It's simply a sign that whatever research has been carried out/written has been verified by multiple academic professionals and isn't potentially just someone's unverified or unreliable ramblings.

You have no subscription to peer-review, had you, you'd post the papers. How do you pay for Peer-review subscription! You can mention in INR.

Fortunately I do have access to many peer-reviewed journals. For your information there are many open access peer reviewed journals out there and sites such as sciencedirect are making research related to COVID-19 open access for everyone currently. I'm not exactly sure what papers you expect me to post. Currently your only real response to my posts other than the above one is "research vaccines and immunity", which is a pretty big and open topic... Perhaps you'd like to be more specific of what specifically you want to be looking into or like I suggested, provide some articles more specific to the area you'd like to discuss that back up your claims?

Also the fact that generations have survived without vaccine destroys any point you have about survival.

Death rates among the eldery still remain constant, with or without the flu jab.

There's loads of research out there that indicates the flu vaccine reduces the death rate among the elderly. Here's the first open-access article I found for you: https://erj.ersjournals.com/content/34/1/56.

 

[KingKhanWC]

The article you're referring to concludes that the flu vaccine does not increase the risk of COVID-19 or any other non-influenza respiratory virus. There are no articles in peer reviewed journals that conclude the opposite to this.

The link gives you a reference to a reports which suggests it does, take which ever opinion you are more comfortable with.

Btw we also have Luc Montagnier, noble prize winner, the man who discovered aids and one of the worlds top virologists who says it's a man made virus.

Medical science still DOES NOT understand this virus fully, so it's pretty stupid imo take a vaccine for it, esp one which is rushed without careful clinical trials.

 

[Robert]

All viruses mutate, this isn't novel to influenza viruses. It does however mutate really fast hence the reason there is a sightly different vaccine each year.

Flu undergoes antigen shift and drift which is how you can be immune to one strain but not another next year.

The jab reduces the likelihood of getting Ill from flu by 50% or so, depending on how well the current vaccine is matched to the current strains of flu.

I think I have only had flu once. It poleaxed me. I don’t want it again. Gimme the jab!

 

[HitWicket]

The link gives you a reference to a reports which suggests it does, take which ever opinion you are more comfortable with.

Btw we also have Luc Montagnier, noble prize winner, the man who discovered aids and one of the worlds top virologists who says it's a man made virus.

-video-

Medical science still DOES NOT understand this virus fully, so it's pretty stupid imo take a vaccine for it, esp one which is rushed without careful clinical trials.

The report you're referring to was been completely misinterpreted to come to the wrong conclusion (and as a result the spread of false information such as this) about COVID-19 by the admission of the original author. His response on this matter is available here: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7250546/. The key bit:

Therefore, the results of this study cannot and should not be interpreted to represent any sort of relationship or association of influenza vaccination receipt and COVID-19 illness. Results from this study DO NOT support the anti-vaccination viewpoint of avoiding seasonal influenza vaccination, and in fact should be interpreted in the opposite manner, since significant protection against influenza was associated with vaccination receipt, and a slight decrease in the odds of infection from other respiratory viruses was also noted.

Results from this study should not be applied to or interpreted with COVID-19 in any way.

On the topic of Luc Montangier, although he did win a nobel prize, he's made a lot of statements since then that have been discredited by the scientific community such as his advocation for the medical effectiveness of homeopathic treatments among other things. Similarly the claim he's made here isn't backed up by any scientific research and is infact in direction contradiction to verified research. The original claim came from an article that was not peer-reviewed with the major flaws in it subsequently pointed out by experts.

 

[Robert]

Sure, the issue here is the flu jab makes it more likely to get Coronavirus. See the link I posted.



Its up to the parents of small children to make this decision, I dont have to make any such decision. We do know many vaccines for children have caused serious health issues.

This data from Brazil suggests that survival rates once COVID is contracted are improved among those who have had the flu jab.

https://www.news-medical.net/news/2...-against-COVID-19-severity-and-mortality.aspx

As for your second point, MMR has a 1/1,000,000 change of causing brain damage, but measles gives brain damage to 1/1000 children infected, and elevated chance of pneumonia too. Plus, your children could infect others. There really is no good reason not to vaccinate your kids.

 

[miandadrules]

The link gives you a reference to a reports which suggests it does, take which ever opinion you are more comfortable with.

Btw we also have Luc Montagnier, noble prize winner, the man who discovered aids and one of the worlds top virologists who says it's a man made virus.

Medical science still DOES NOT understand this virus fully, so it's pretty stupid imo take a vaccine for it, esp one which is rushed without careful clinical trials.

Even if it is man made, how does that change the way in which you manage it?

 

[Colorblind Genius]

This is THE BEST way to avoid getting the flu and spreading it to other people.

Vaccine often includes a deactivated flu virus. The flu vaccine contains tiny amounts of the viruses it protects against. The presence of these viruses in the vaccine triggers the body’s natural defense mechanism to produce antibodies to fight them.

It is usually recommended for kids, for elderly and for healthcare workers and is generally safe for everyone.

Getting a flu vaccine is routine procedure in many countries but this is not a common practice in developing and third world countries.

Everyone in Pakistan, India, Bangladesh : kindly get vaccinated for Flu. ASAP.

Last year I was at a clinic getting ready for flu vaccination while nurse kept bragging about this vaccine. And he kept repeating the vaccine name that had the word "Quad". So I asked her, what does that mean? She said, it protects against FOUR strains. FOUR! (There was a loud stress on "Four").

So I said, "Oh ok. That's great! And how many strains of flu do we we have in our area?"
She got quite for a second and then changed her voice to tone to display a "no worry" notion, and said .... "ummm about 50".

 

[KingKhanWC]

The report you're referring to was been completely misinterpreted to come to the wrong conclusion (and as a result the spread of false information such as this) about COVID-19 by the admission of the original author. His response on this matter is available here: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7250546/. The key bit:



On the topic of Luc Montangier, although he did win a nobel prize, he's made a lot of statements since then that have been discredited by the scientific community such as his advocation for the medical effectiveness of homeopathic treatments among other things. Similarly the claim he's made here isn't backed up by any scientific research and is infact in direction contradiction to verified research. The original claim came from an article that was not peer-reviewed with the major flaws in it subsequently pointed out by experts.

Other Doctors such as Dr Cunnigham also agreed with the extra risk but perhaps they have changed their minds or have been pressured to. Even if I accept this, there is no real evidence the flu vaccine helps with Covid19.

Nobody has been able to refute him, he has mapped the sequence. It doesnt matter what some think of him and of course he will be shunned now as he goes against the grain, esp as he points to HIV within the virus.

This data from Brazil suggests that survival rates once COVID is contracted are improved among those who have had the flu jab.

https://www.news-medical.net/news/2...-against-COVID-19-severity-and-mortality.aspx

As for your second point, MMR has a 1/1,000,000 change of causing brain damage, but measles gives brain damage to 1/1000 children infected, and elevated chance of pneumonia too. Plus, your children could infect others. There really is no good reason not to vaccinate your kids.

I wouldn't take Brazil seriously.

Other data suggests larger issues.

Again, its up to the person. I've never had any vaccinations and never been ill. At most flu but this happens once every few years and lasts a day or two. Imo it's better to streghthen immune system.

Even if it is man made, how does that change the way in which you manage it?

Because if its man made other variations can be released into the public.

 

[Technics 1210]

So have you got something to back up your claim that vaccines can negatively affect your immunity to other diseases? I'd love to read it if you could provide it please.



Why would I think mentioning peer-review makes me smart? It's simply a sign that whatever research has been carried out/written has been verified by multiple academic professionals and isn't potentially just someone's unverified or unreliable ramblings.



Fortunately I do have access to many peer-reviewed journals. For your information there are many open access peer reviewed journals out there and sites such as sciencedirect are making research related to COVID-19 open access for everyone currently. I'm not exactly sure what papers you expect me to post. Currently your only real response to my posts other than the above one is "research vaccines and immunity", which is a pretty big and open topic... Perhaps you'd like to be more specific of what specifically you want to be looking into or like I suggested, provide some articles more specific to the area you'd like to discuss that back up your claims?



There's loads of research out there that indicates the flu vaccine reduces the death rate among the elderly. Here's the first open-access article I found for you: https://erj.ersjournals.com/content/34/1/56.

Please cite the Peer review paper that demonstrates the flu jab is effective. I'm assuming you have read it since you've been asking for alternatives.

 

[Technics 1210]

From the peer review search cited above. This is in the abstract section.


"Annually, influenza epidemics are associated with high mortality rates, notably among elderly persons 1, 2. Since the introduction of influenza vaccines, only one randomised double-blind trial has been conducted among (younger) elderly persons, and influenza infection was halved in the vaccine group compared with the placebo group 3. Large-scale trials evaluating more serious outcomes such as mortality are not available in part because of the large sample size needed, and also due to ethical constraints. Instead, several nonrandomised observational studies have set out to estimate the effects of influenza vaccination on serious outcomes among elderly person.


There you have it folks based on randomised trial. ONE.

Lets see if other peer review articles will surface supporting the flu vaccine, because thus far, if you have sheep relying on the outcome of a flu jab based on 1 trial, we're heading for trouble.

 

[James]

The only peer-reviewed journal article that was vaccine-sceptical, to my knowledge, was the one in the Lancet by the now struck-off Andrew Wakefield. The article linked the MMR jab to autism and turned out to contain falsified data for personal financial gain. This was the worst thing that could have happened to the somewhat interesting vaccine hesitancy movement, because no medic will touch the topic with a barge pole now.

 

[Slog]

You tell them, Pakistani Jones!

Just to clear up any ambiguity. I know you would never expect people to simply take your word for it, can you share the evidence that helped you reach these obvious conclusions?


Thanks in advance.

It is very interesting though. Not just this topic but many topics whether religion or global geopolitics, these guys always ask for evidence for any claim and tbh that is a fair enough ask. But once presented with the correct, credible evidence they do whataboutism regardless and do not accept the evidence despite is being crystal clear and accurate in what it is saying.

However they themselves make very fringe claims and statements and never provide any evidence or citation. They somehow just know. Lol!

 

[miandadrules]

Other Doctors such as Dr Cunnigham also agreed with the extra risk but perhaps they have changed their minds or have been pressured to. Even if I accept this, there is no real evidence the flu vaccine helps with Covid19.

Nobody has been able to refute him, he has mapped the sequence. It doesnt matter what some think of him and of course he will be shunned now as he goes against the grain, esp as he points to HIV within the virus.



I wouldn't take Brazil seriously.

Other data suggests larger issues.

Again, its up to the person. I've never had any vaccinations and never been ill. At most flu but this happens once every few years and lasts a day or two. Imo it's better to streghthen immune system.



Because if its man made other variations can be released into the public.

And?

 

[miandadrules]

It is very interesting though. Not just this topic but many topics whether religion or global geopolitics, these guys always ask for evidence for any claim and tbh that is a fair enough ask. But once presented with the correct, credible evidence they do whataboutism regardless and do not accept the evidence despite is being crystal clear and accurate in what it is saying.

However they themselves make very fringe claims and statements and never provide any evidence or citation. They somehow just know. Lol!

Exactly.

 

[HitWicket]

Other Doctors such as Dr Cunnigham also agreed with the extra risk but perhaps they have changed their minds or have been pressured to. Even if I accept this, there is no real evidence the flu vaccine helps with Covid19.

Cunningham didn't agree that the flu vaccine caused an extra risk, he quoted research such as that done by Wolff on coronaviruses (which in his own words should not be applied or interpreted with COVID-19 in any way) and proposed a case-control study. Agreed that there is not much evidence out there that the flu vaccine helps prevent COVID-19, but as the same time there is absolutely no reliable evidence that indicates the flu vaccine puts you at greater risk from COVID-19.

Nobody has been able to refute him, he has mapped the sequence. It doesnt matter what some think of him and of course he will be shunned now as he goes against the grain, esp as he points to HIV within the virus.

I would assume we're back to talking about Luc Montagnier here in which case he has not mapped the sequence at all, his statements were made based on others preliminary and non peer reviewed research trying to do that. The research was submitted for peer review and multiple members of the scientific community pointed out that the similarities seen between COVID-19 and HIV were highly common between viruses. It has also been shown that the same similarity could also be seen between the organism that causes malaria and HIV.

Please cite the Peer review paper that demonstrates the flu jab is effective. I'm assuming you have read it since you've been asking for alternatives.

As I said in my post, I've provided a link at the end to a peer reviewed paper that concludes that the flu vaccine reduces mortality rates among the elderly. It's also open-access for your benefit.

 

[Technics 1210]

I wouldn't take Brazil seriously.

Other data suggests larger issues.

Again, its up to the person. I've never had any vaccinations and never been ill. At most flu but this happens once every few years and lasts a day or two. Imo it's better to streghthen immune system.

Indeed. Lets look at Sweden. Their herd immunity tactics are paying off. One of the lowest death rates with C19, and their economy has not suffered as much as the rest of the world.

 

[Technics 1210]

As I said in my post, I've provided a link at the end to a peer reviewed paper that concludes that the flu vaccine reduces mortality rates among the elderly. It's also open-access for your benefit.

I thought as much. You don't have access, just like using big words you don't understand. Even the pitiful attempt at citing a paper didn't help your cause. The paper itslef you highlight says morality rates are not available based on one trial Why lie?

Don't use words like peer review. I get you like to use science to bolster your theory, but atleast understand what you are citing first instead of lifting verbatim arguments from the net.

 

[HitWicket]

I thought as much. You don't have access, just like using big words you don't understand. Even the pitiful attempt at citing a paper didn't help your cause. The paper itslef you highlight says morality rates are not available based on one trial Why lie?

Don't use words like peer review. I get you like to use science to bolster your theory, but atleast understand what you are citing first instead of lifting verbatim arguments from the net.

I've provided you with a peer reviewed article that has a concluding point that contradicts your currently unsourced claims. Whether that article is open-access or not has no relation to it's reliability or accuracy so I'm bemused by your obsession over that? Is there a reason you'd prefer the majority on the forum not to be able to access the articles that refute your claims?

Of course there's a lack of direct random trials available studying the link between people who/have not taken a flu vaccine and their mortality rate as a result. What kind of ethics board do you think is going to approve giving people an injection (and not giving them a choice as to whether it's a placebo or vaccine) and then studying whether/how/when they die? There are still a range of studies based on non-random trials (with measures taken to try and account for that factor) such as the one linked though that reach the conclusion that flu vaccines result in a notable reduction in mortality rates.

 

[Technics 1210]

If you consider the word peer-reviewed to be big then perhaps a discussion on a scientific topic isn't the place for you? I've provided you with a peer reviewed article that has a concluding point that contradicts your currently unsourced claims. Whether that article is open-access or not has no relation to it's reliability or accuracy so I'm bemused by your obsession over that? Is there a reason you'd prefer the majority on the forum not to be able to access the articles that refute your claims?

Of course there's a lack of direct random trials available studying the link between people who/have not taken a flu vaccine and their mortality rate as a result. What kind of ethics board do you think is going to approve giving people an injection (and not giving them a choice as to whether it's a placebo or vaccine) and then studying whether/how/when they die? There are still a range of studies based on non-random trials (with measures taken to try and account for that factor) such as the one linked though that reach the conclusion that flu vaccines result in a notable reduction in mortality rates.

Thanks for trying at least. It's a pity you couldn't back up your bravado. So glad I called your bluff.

 

[Technics 1210]

The flu vaccine does not work. It's completely hit and miss, and a scheme to line pockets.

The fact there are people living right now (UK), who are healthy, have survived childhood illnesses by relying on their natural immune system, without the need of any sort of vaccine, proves that vaccines are not essential.

 

[HitWicket]

The flu vaccine does not work. It's completely hit and miss, and a scheme to line pockets.

Repeating things doesn't make them true. A reliable academic article that contradicts this claim (and references multiple others that do the same) has been referred to in this thread. Despite regular requests for you to do so you have failed to provide any kind of equivalent that backs up your claim, any chance you could do that for us all rather than just constantly repeating yourself?

The fact there are people living right now (UK), who are healthy, have survived childhood illnesses by relying on their natural immune system, without the need of any sort of vaccine, proves that vaccines are not essential.

As with the flu vaccine and the elderly, there are multiple studies out there indicating childhood vaccinations reduce the chance of childhood mortality (or serious illness), Are you able to provide anything that contradicts this too?

Before you ask and given it seemed to surprise you in the case of the flu vaccine and the elderly, no there has not been direct trials where certain children were randomly given vaccines or not and then people studied whether they died as a result or not. Unsurprisingly again, this isn't the kind of thing that's getting past an ethics board.

 

[Technics 1210]

You keep talking about mutliple studies but struggle to cite any. Anyway, the ONS doesn't agree with your assessment.

 

[Technics 1210]

Whatever happened to the good old days when patients were given just a pint of Guinness?

 

[James]

Whatever happened to the good old days when patients were given just a pint of Guinness?

Not even that sometimes. GPs would often just tell people to man up and go home, get bed rest and drink honey lemon tea, then finally give the patient a right royal rollocking for even turning up at the surgery. (thereby spreading their bug.) Everyone is too soft nowadays.

 

[Lurker_Ind]

The flu vaccine does not work. It's completely hit and miss, and a scheme to line pockets.

The fact there are people living right now (UK), who are healthy, have survived childhood illnesses by relying on their natural immune system, without the need of any sort of vaccine, proves that vaccines are not essential.

It does work. In some Flu still comes after the vaccination. But majority will not suffer major attack of Flu once given a vaccination.

There is a vaccine for Flu-A. But Flu-B has no vaccine. Most people who get Flu after the vaccination get infected by Flu-B.

 

[Slog]

Indeed. Lets look at Sweden. Their herd immunity tactics are paying off. One of the lowest death rates with C19, and their economy has not suffered as much as the rest of the world.

Sweden has shown an improvement in the last few weeks but for most of pandemic their infection rates were clearly higher than their Scandinavian neighbors and at the same time their economy suffered in similar proportions despite no lockdowns. Sweden doesn’t support your point.

 

[Technics 1210]

Sweden has shown an improvement in the last few weeks but for most of pandemic their infection rates were clearly higher than their Scandinavian neighbors and at the same time their economy suffered in similar proportions despite no lockdowns. Sweden doesn’t support your point.

The point is of herd immunity.

 

[Technics 1210]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/amp/world-europe-53498133

Swedens approach of herd immunity worked out to be a better strategy than full blown lock downs pumped with vaccine.

 

[KingKhanWC]

I would assume we're back to talking about Luc Montagnier here in which case he has not mapped the sequence at all, his statements were made based on others preliminary and non peer reviewed research trying to do that. The research was submitted for peer review and multiple members of the scientific community pointed out that the similarities seen between COVID-19 and HIV were highly common between viruses. It has also been shown that the same similarity could also be seen between the organism that causes malaria and HIV.

He has observed the sequence himself. Believe him or not but this raises seriious questions esp since it orignates out of Wuhan which has a bio weapons lab. US armed forces were also present in Wuhan not long before. I prefer to connect various dots and come to my own conclusion. One thing for sure the virus has been vastly overblown, to enslave the populations.

As I said in my post, I've provided a link at the end to a peer reviewed paper that concludes that the flu vaccine reduces mortality rates among the elderly. It's also open-access for your benefit.

Elderly would be better given more facilities to enjoy a later on life, better health care, more pension money, free tv licence , free fresh food, free clothes, free holidays, they wouldn't need any injection.

You want to take it and give it your family, be my guest.

But nobody has the right to force others to inject anything into their bodies.

 

[Robert]

Other Doctors such as Dr Cunnigham also agreed with the extra risk but perhaps they have changed their minds or have been pressured to. Even if I accept this, there is no real evidence the flu vaccine helps with Covid19.

Nobody has been able to refute him, he has mapped the sequence. It doesnt matter what some think of him and of course he will be shunned now as he goes against the grain, esp as he points to HIV within the virus.

I wouldn't take Brazil seriously.

Other data suggests larger issues.

Again, its up to the person. I've never had any vaccinations and never been ill. At most flu but this happens once every few years and lasts a day or two. Imo it's better to streghthen immune system.

Because if its man made other variations can be released into the public.

You wouldn’t take Brazil seriously because the evidence does not fit your belief. Trouble is that the real world of biological disease does not care what we believe.

So you never got sick. That’s a data pool of 1 so not statistically significant. If something bad never happened to you did it not happen to everyone?

By extension we should not bother to MOT our cars or wear seatbelts because one person never had a crash.

Flu lasts more than a day or two and kills plenty of older folk. I had it once, it’s harsh, four days of shaking and sweating and the worst headache and throwing up and being unable to eat. If a jab prevents that again, give me the jab. I am not as young as I was and more vulnerable now.

Preventing TB is not just a matter of strengthening immune systems. It will kill you. Though it can be fought off with the help of antibiotics over six or nine months as it is so tough and intractable. Avoid that. Make sure your kids get the BCG. Then you will also help prevent other people getting it.

This man-made thing is a red herring. Even if so, nobody would release a killer disease on their own population on purpose.

 

[Robert]

On Sweden.

The approach they took worked because of the national character of the Swedes.

Firstly they trust their government.

Secondly they have a very high level of social cohesion due to the harsh winters and months of night. They pull for each other.

So they obeyed their government guidelines on COVID and have not suffered much.

In Britain we don’t believe our government, particularly this one. We are prey to conspiracy thinking due to lack of education compared to the Swedes. And we are much more individualistic and don’t look out for each other like they do.

 

[HitWicket]

You keep talking about mutliple studies but struggle to cite any. Anyway, the ONS doesn't agree with your assessment.

Feel free to look through the following that all find links between reduced vaccination and increase mortality in children:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4757942/

https://www.researchgate.net/public...founding_A_Danish_register-based_cohort_study

Again, perhaps you'd like to provide some articles that match your claims? What exactly don't the ONS agree with?

He has observed the sequence himself. Believe him or not but this raises seriious questions esp since it orignates out of Wuhan which has a bio weapons lab. US armed forces were also present in Wuhan not long before. I prefer to connect various dots and come to my own conclusion. One thing for sure the virus has been vastly overblown, to enslave the populations.

Montagnier's statements were based on the following preprint https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.01.30.927871v1. Of the many experts who critiqued and discredited this work I think the best analogy I've seen is that the conclusion of the work is the equivalent of claiming the author of one book copied another because their books shares the same word somewhere in it... As you can see based on the feedback they got even the original authors have withdrawn their work.

 

[KingKhanWC]

Montagnier's statements were based on the following preprint https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.01.30.927871v1. Of the many experts who critiqued and discredited this work I think the best analogy I've seen is that the conclusion of the work is the equivalent of claiming the author of one book copied another because their books shares the same word somewhere in it... As you can see based on the feedback they got even the original authors have withdrawn their work.

He is not the only one. We have chinese and other scientists saying the same. We have ex Mi5 saying it and many more.

You believe it came from a bat, please take the vacccine, in fact take two, take mine also.

My main issue isn't what some believe or not, I frankly dont care. All I want is the freedom to choose what I insert or inject into my own body and it will be nothing, I can assure you.

 

[HitWicket]

He is not the only one. We have chinese and other scientists saying the same. We have ex Mi5 saying it and many more.

You believe it came from a bat, please take the vacccine, in fact take two, take mine also.

My main issue isn't what some believe or not, I frankly dont care. All I want is the freedom to choose what I insert or inject into my own body and it will be nothing, I can assure you.

In the end it's the science and research that people should be following, not random personal beliefs that don't have the backing of any verified science. If you could link to credible peer-reviewed research by any scientists indicating that the virus is man-made I'd be very surprised.

If the only person whose life was at increased risk from your decision not to take a vaccine, based on conspiracy theories that don't have the backing of any science, was yourself then I'd be fine. The issue is with the increased risk you are putting those who can't take the vaccine for reasons actually backed up by verified science at

 

[KingKhanWC]

In the end it's the science and research that people should be following, not random personal beliefs that don't have the backing of any verified science. If you could link to credible peer-reviewed research by any scientists indicating that the virus is man-made I'd be very surprised.

If the only person whose life was at increased risk from your decision not to take a vaccine, based on conspiracy theories that don't have the backing of any science, was yourself then I'd be fine. The issue is with the increased risk you are putting those who can't take the vaccine for reasons actually backed up by verified science at

Governments have been proven to be liars throughout this 'pandemic' and in the past. You prob still believe Saddam had WMD's. I dont listen to them bliindly.

Not my problem, if you're at risk, take care of yourself. I havent work a mask to this day, not adhered to any lockdown, have been very healthy. Ill do what I like, thanks. You or any government have no right to tell me to inject any vaccine. Move on.

 

[HitWicket]

Governments have been proven to be liars throughout this 'pandemic' and in the past. You prob still believe Saddam had WMD's. I dont listen to them bliindly.

Who mentioned governments? We're talking about independent, verified scientific research from all over the world.

Not my problem, if you're at risk, take care of yourself. I havent work a mask to this day, not adhered to any lockdown, have been very healthy. Ill do what I like, thanks. You or any government have no right to tell me to inject any vaccine. Move on.

You're complete lack of consideration for the health of others, and almost sadistic pride in increasing the risk on other lives is a pretty disgusting attitude (not that I expect you care of that judgement), and one that is partly responsible for us having such such a significant amount of infections and as a result deaths in this country.

 

[Technics 1210]

I am telling you. Facism is the new face of Liberalism. These lot want to forcefully inject our bodies with experimental horseshit just to line the pockets of an industry that thrives and sucks the blood out of the unhealthy and vulnerable.

 

[KingKhanWC]

Who mentioned governments? We're talking about independent, verified scientific research from all over the world.

Most take the advice, rules and confidence in government officials. They make the laws. I was referring to the general population. You must deluded into thinking most look at independent research.

Revealed: Sir Patrick Vallance has £600,000 shareholding in firm contracted to develop vaccines

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/20...ance-has-600000-shareholding-firm-contracted/

Revealed: Sir Patrick Vallance has £600,000 shareholding in firm contracted to develop vaccines

You're complete lack of consideration for the health of others, and almost sadistic pride in increasing the risk on other lives is a pretty disgusting attitude (not that I expect you care of that judgement), and one that is partly responsible for us having such such a significant amount of infections and as a result deaths in this country.

I will do what is best in my interest not someone I dont know. As I said, take my vaccine too but dont advise me or make a judgement on what I do with my life

People like you think they can force others by pressure, wake up, nobody cares what you say.