Now is the perfect time to compare Babar Azam, Mohammad Rizwan, and Shaheen Shah Afridi with the greats of the past

[tiger_khan]

In my opinion people are unfair when they are comparing a young cricketer with a career of only two to three years with the past Legends' entire body of work

however when cricketers have passed the age of 30 and have captained their teams I think that's an appropriate time to compare their performances, their skills and their achievements with the players of the past

both Barber and Rizwan have passed 30 and have by now captained Pakistan

it's only fair now to compare their performances with the legends of the past who have also served Pakistan

some of us have had the advantage of seeing live the batting of the legends of the past and the current lot. I dare say that both Babar and Rizwan, who in my opinion have passed their prime, don't even come close to the past legends

Shaheen although is only 25 but when you compare him with our bowling legends of the past when they were 25 there's not a lot to compare with

at the end of the day whether batting or bowling in high-level cricket, it's all about knowing the right length of deliveries and knowing the field placement. unfortunately our current lot is far behind in this game of understanding the cricket and to remedy their ailments

it is common in many other sports. for example Italian soccer team has 1 generation of great players followed by a generation of mediocre players. Pakistan is going through a similar phase of mediocrity. we will just have to be patient and a new lot of talented people will take over our current overhyped players

PS: many Pak famous players don't even know how to use DRS properly. Some of them, I suspect don't even know the LBW rules properly...

 

[BouncerGuy]

why do we need to compare them???

Till they retire, I think.. Better

 

[jnaveen1980]

why do we need to compare them???

Till they retire, I think.. Better

Babar with Salman butt
Rizwan with Ijaz butt

 

[Varun]

Inzamam-ul-Haq > Babar Azam
Kamran Akmal > Mohammad Rizwan
Umar Gul > Shaheen Shah Afridi

 

[jnaveen1980]

Inzamam-ul-Haq > Babar Azam
Kamran Akmal > Mohammad Rizwan
Umar Gul > Shaheen Shah Afridi

I think keepingwise even a stool is better than Kamran

 

[jnaveen1980]

Isn't Kamran an FTB? Outside subcontinent his records are not that great.

 

[BouncerGuy]

Kamran Akmal > Mohammad Rizwan

No way...

 

[RyanRyan10]

With which players, you want to compare them?

 

[Rana]

Inzamam-ul-Haq > Babar Azam
Kamran Akmal > Mohammad Rizwan
Umar Gul > Shaheen Shah Afridi

Can’t say I disagree with any of those comparisons

You went too far ahead with Inzimam

It’s disputable wether Babar was better than Saleem Malik

 

[BouncerGuy]

Can’t say I disagree with any of those comparisons

You went too far ahead with Inzimam

It’s disputable wether Babar was better than Saleem Malik

This Kamran akmal is better than rizwan??? What a joke

 

[BouncerGuy]

Rizwan’s ODI average alone is higher than Kamran’s entire legacy.

 

[saimayubera]

Kamran is a bit overrated cause he saved two series against India (2005 and 2006). Also had a hand in saving a match in 2007 but that series was won 1-0 anyway.

w/o Kamran India might have won all 4 of the series.

 

[Rana]

Rizwan’s ODI average alone is higher than Kamran’s entire legacy.

Don’t take it personally

Rizwan’s average in ODI is higher than Inzimam and Lara

So he’s at their level??

 

[Mirpuri Don]

Babar and Afridi are still too young, an ATG like Ambrose began at the age Afridi is right now, not comparing them but it’s often said fast bowlers reach their peak in their late 20s or early 30s while Afridi is only 25.

For Rizwan we can say he has reached his full potential, a bit below peak Kamran and slightly above Sarfraz as WK batsman (all three being clutch/pressure players.)

 

[tiger_khan]

why do we need to compare them???

Till they retire, I think.. Better

I think it's appropriate to compare them now because the team is going through a transition phase in one form of the game might as well do the comparisons for all the formats now

i wish them fortune in the coming series. hopefully they will be able to perform well and retain their positions in all the formats but I also want to calibrate my expectations with reality. if one has seen our past batters at the age of 30 there's just no comparison and that's one of the many reasons that they are struggling

of course there could be multiple factors behind their struggling performances which we are not aware of but I am just assessing them based on the results

to be honest if they were to evolve and improve, they would have done by now

 

[RidiculousMan]

This Kamran akmal is better than rizwan??? What a joke

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Kamran was like Rizwan but very inconsistent + a poor wk too by Rizwan standards

 

[tiger_khan]

This Kamran akmal is better than rizwan??? What a joke

View attachment 158580

View attachment 158581

I have brought this up in the past, if stats were the only measure of picking up players or evaluating them then Microsoft Excel would be the chief selector of all the selection committees of the best teams in the world

Kamran was definitely a poor wicket keeper but when it comes to batting he was probably one of the best wicket keeping batsmen Pakistan has produced. He was a very well-rounded batsman. played both the fast and spin bowlers well. Also, had shots on both sides of the wicket

Rizwan has his own unique style which has served him well personally but the oppositions have figured him out now. that's what happens when a batter concentrates mostly on one side of the wicket.

 

[tiger_khan]

With which players, you want to compare them?

anyone whom i have seen batting for Pakistan at the age of 30 and was a regular member of Pak team

age 25 for the bowler

 

[tiger_khan]

Can’t say I disagree with any of those comparisons

You went too far ahead with Inzimam

It’s disputable wether Babar was better than Saleem Malik

those who have seen saleem malik live, i can understand why would he be compared with Babar

malik was also a beautiful driver of the cricket ball. but he was a phenomenal better off spin bowling. also, although he did not have a great back foot game against fast bowlers but he has done well in Australia too

malik had a great cricketing mind by the time he was 30. was performing pretty well against the Great bowlers of his time - both the spinners and the quickies. although Babar has done very well against the quickies but his game against the spinners is far from what it should be at the age of 30.

 

[tiger_khan]

Inzamam-ul-Haq > Babar Azam
Kamran Akmal > Mohammad Rizwan
Umar Gul > Shaheen Shah Afridi

your comparison is only with the players less than two decades ago.

their skillset is not even comparable with the players from past 35 years

we are struggling with a serious drought...

 

[jnaveen1980]

Babar Azam has not played a single test against India. NOt sure how it would have panned out had he played. Old players did play a lot of test matches.

 

[The Bald Eagle]

I think there is still a long way to go for Shaheen.

 

[saimayubera]

Babar and Afridi are still too young, an ATG like Ambrose began at the age Afridi is right now, not comparing them but it’s often said fast bowlers reach their peak in their late 20s or early 30s while Afridi is only 25.

For Rizwan we can say he has reached his full potential, a bit below peak Kamran and slightly above Sarfraz as WK batsman (all three being clutch/pressure players.)

Afridi ain't 25 though. KPK people fake their ages.

 

[hur rizvi]

Babar doesn’t match up against greats of the past simply because he hasn’t done anything meaningful in tests.

Shaheen is same bowling wise but he hasn’t done anything tough competition as he has to be compared against some ATGs from Pakistan. Batting wise Pakistan haven’t produced any ATgs

 

[hur rizvi]

Afridi ain't 25 though. KPK people fake their ages.

He’s probably closer to 30. If he gets his act together and end up with 200 wickets in tests and Odis both I would consider it a good service for Pakistan but it doesn’t look probable at this stage

 

[saimayubera]

He’s probably closer to 30. If he gets his act together and end up with 200 wickets in tests and Odis both I would consider it a good service for Pakistan but it doesn’t look probable at this stage

Tests not possible. Don't even know if he is interested. Plus pitches will be dustbowls from now on so even less opportunities.

ODIs should be doable.

 

[tiger_khan]

He’s probably closer to 30. If he gets his act together and end up with 200 wickets in tests and Odis both I would consider it a good service for Pakistan but it doesn’t look probable at this stage

Seems unlikely that he is lying about his age.

He has played for Pak under-19. At the international under-19 level, I think that they been doing bone-scanning for age verification for a while now.

Now, the only way a cricketer can lie about his age to the stats keeper is when he doesn't play under-19 cricket for his country.


I see a few experts on TV whom I have played with. Interestingly, they are the same age as me officially. I know for a fact that they were 5 to 6 years older than me when we played together

The easiest way to hide your age back then was to never pass the matriculation (high school) exams.

 

[Buffet]

He’s probably closer to 30. If he gets his act together and end up with 200 wickets in tests and Odis both I would consider it a good service for Pakistan but it doesn’t look probable at this stage

200+ wickets in test is asking for too much.

 

[Buffet]

There is a gap in skill set with each generation of Pakistani players, batting and bowling both in the last 3 decades.

 

[Muhammad Saad]

There is a gap in skill set with each generation of Pakistani players, batting and bowling both in the last 3 decades.

spot on, if you compare the top 5/6 pak players each last 3 decades then you can see a visible skill gap in both batting and bowling (actually the decline in bowling is far more evident than decline in batting)

 

[Muhammad Saad]

90s wasim , waqar , shoaib saqlain razzaq mushtaq
2000s shoaib, gul, rana naveed, kaneria,
2010s asif, Amir, yasir, ajmal,
2020s Shaheen, Naseem , Rauf, Abrar, Sajid Nauman ,Rauf

Till 2010s the bowling decline was slow but evident but post 2020 it’s declining rapidly

 

[saimayubera]

There is a gap in skill set with each generation of Pakistani players, batting and bowling both in the last 3 decades.

I have been watching cricket since the 2003 WC and each subsequent generation of Indian players is superior to the one before while for Pakistanis it is opposite.

 

[bunda_bindaas]

I have been watching cricket since the 2003 WC and each subsequent generation of Indian players is superior to the one before while for Pakistanis it is opposite.

For India, the bowlers are getting better. Even accounting for Kumble's greatness.

But we are not close to getting anyone of Sachin or Dravid's calibre in Tests. That was a different era and without the technique-busting T20s, batsmen were free to refine their batting techniques, which they did.

 

[saimayubera]

For India, the bowlers are getting better. Even accounting for Kumble's greatness.

But we are not close to getting anyone of Sachin or Dravid's calibre in Tests. That was a different era and without the technique-busting T20s, batsmen were free to refine their batting techniques, which they did.

Yeah, although overall I think test batting is becoming good even if no one as good as Sachin-Dravid. During Sachin-Dravid era the 2nd opener apart from Sehwag was always an issue as was the WK-bat and there were no all rounders.

Now we have deeper lineups.

 

[light]

Inzamam-ul-Haq > Babar Azam
Kamran Akmal > Mohammad Rizwan
Umar Gul > Shaheen Shah Afridi

Bro, OP said great, not a guy like Akmal lmaoo ...

 

[bunda_bindaas]

Yeah, although overall I think test batting is becoming good even if no one as good as Sachin-Dravid. During Sachin-Dravid era the 2nd opener apart from Sehwag was always an issue as was the WK-bat and there were no all rounders.

Now we have deeper lineups.

Yes, this is true. Although at one point in time we had:

Gambhir, Sehwag, Dravid, Tendulkar, Laxman, Ganguly and Dhoni

Perhaps the best lineup we will ever have, although not at each player's peak.

 

[saimayubera]

Yes, this is true. Although at one point in time we had:

Gambhir, Sehwag, Dravid, Tendulkar, Laxman, Ganguly and Dhoni

Perhaps the best lineup we will ever have, although not at each player's peak.

Yeah but it didn't last long as Gambhir/Ganguly only coincided for like a few months in 2008.

No 6 remained an issue till this team ended in 2011 with Raina, Yuvraj, Pujara, Kohli all batting there.

 

[jnaveen1980]

How each players stack up against their contemporaries. For instance.. Babar & Kohli/Root/Kane etc . Babar is well short of them. That will give you better picture. Inzamam was not quiet comparable with his contemporaries. But i have seen him play in world XI teams

 

[SportsWarrior]

Inzamam-ul-Haq > Babar Azam
Kamran Akmal > Mohammad Rizwan
Umar Gul > Shaheen Shah Afridi

Lol Kamran was bad except few innings here and there. Just his keeping is enough to keep him out of any international cricket

Umar Gul was definitely better t20 bowler than Shaheen, but Shaheen is better in other two formats

Babar is inferior to Inzy, no doubt there.

 

[SportsWarrior]

Don’t take it personally

Rizwan’s average in ODI is higher than Inzimam and Lara

So he’s at their level??

Lara was a great batsman no doubt and so was Inzi. I loved inzamam but he was extremely poor in big tournaments except that great innings in 92



And Rizwan even at this stage is better than Inzy in major tournaments although he doesn't have that one magic innings

 

[SportsWarrior]

I have brought this up in the past, if stats were the only measure of picking up players or evaluating them then Microsoft Excel would be the chief selector of all the selection committees of the best teams in the world

Kamran was definitely a poor wicket keeper but when it comes to batting he was probably one of the best wicket keeping batsmen Pakistan has produced. He was a very well-rounded batsman. played both the fast and spin bowlers well. Also, had shots on both sides of the wicket

Rizwan has his own unique style which has served him well personally but the oppositions have figured him out now. that's what happens when a batter concentrates mostly on one side of the wicket.

Yet this is is record in tournaments. Sure he can produce one good innings once in a blue moon while consistently dropping catches. No one can be called "one of the best" with these record

 

[BouncerGuy]

Don’t take it personally

Rizwan’s average in ODI is higher than Inzimam and Lara

So he’s at their level??

I cleary mentioned Kamran here... your cry is quite visible when someone takes rizwan's name.. But truth is Kamran is not even 50% of what rizwan is atm... As a keeper, kamran was one of the worst, matching haris was still bad... Rizwan has performances in all formats and we all knwo, he is the best keeper in Pakistan atm.