Pakistan asks India to ‘hand over’ Mohammad Ali Jinnah House in Mumbai

[santos11]

Islamabad has asked New Delhi to respect its “ownership rights” to Jinnah House, the sprawling residence once owned by Pakistan’s founder Mohammad Ali Jinnah, following a BJP legislator’s demand that the structure should be demolished.

The house with grand columns, walnut panelling and Italian marble was built on 2.5 acres in Malabar Hills and its estimated value is $400 million. The residence has been at the centre of a long-running legal dispute over ownership between Jinnah’s daughter and the Indian and Pakistani governments.

“Pakistan has repeatedly expressed its desire to take possession of the property. The government of India should respect the ownership rights of the government of Pakistan in this regard,” Pakistan’s Foreign Office spokesman Nafees Zakaria told a weekly news briefing in Islamabad on Thursday.

“We also expect that the Indian government will fulfill its obligation of protecting that property and its upkeep,” he said.

Zakaria was responding to a question about BJP legislator Mangal Lodha’s demand that Jinnah House be razed and replaced with a cultural centre. Lodha contended that the house was a “symbol of the Partition” and the place where the “conspiracy” to divide the Indian subcontinent was hatched.

The spokesman said the ownership of Jinnah House had already been taken up with Indian authorities and was “an ongoing matter”.

“The property belongs to the founder of Pakistan and should be given to Pakistan. On various occasions, the Indian government has promised to handover the property to the government of Pakistan but (they) have not fulfilled their commitment as yet,” he added.

Pakistan had earlier said it wanted to use Jinnah House as its consulate in Mumbai. However, the issue was linked to India being allowed to reopen a consulate in the Pakistani port city of Karachi. With bilateral ties at an all-time low over the past few years, both sides have not been able to make progress on this issue.

http://m.hindustantimes.com/world-n...e-in-mumbai/story-YerfhRTqnV2O6ZNh4IUYWI.html

Bungalow is worth 400 Million USD, mind-blowing amount.

 

[Pakpak]

I'd make it our consulate if its possible.

 

[Zak_Fan]

440 million ?? Wow.

 

[cricketjoshila]

I'd make it our consulate if its possible.

Its never going to be handed over to Pakistan.Never.It will mean acknowledging Pakistan's ownership rights to it and will then set a precedence of giving ownership rights to people who moved to Pakistan in 1947.

 

[cricketjoshila]

440 million ?? Wow.

Its in one of the most posh localities in Mumbai,Malabar Hill.The going rate is close to $25k per sqmt there.

 

[Madplayer]

This is quite unrealistic tbh.

Pakistan should rather demand their ancient statue of the dancing girl from India which was given to India for exhibition but India later denied returning it. That statue is of great monetary and cultural worth. Last i heard some lawyer had filed a petition in some court of Pakistan to hasten the return of the statue.

 

[cricketjoshila]

This is quite unrealistic tbh.

Pakistan should rather demand their ancient statue of the dancing girl from India which was given to India for exhibition but India later denied returning it. That statue is of great monetary and cultural worth. Last i heard some lawyer had filed a petition in some court of Pakistan to hasten the return of the statue.

Incorrect.It was taken to India by Mortimer Wheeler.Before Partition i believe.

 

[hafeezrocks]

In BJP's India, a call to demolish Jinnah's house in Mumbai


https://www.dawn.com/news/1323149

Apparently, there have been calls from BJP leaders in Mumbai to demolish this House.

 

[Pakpak]

Incorrect.It was taken to India by Mortimer Wheeler.Before Partition i believe.

There are two versions, one which Madplayer says and the second one is the Wheeler one.

In any case its ours. Just like Kohinoor is Indias.

 

[cricketjoshila]

There are two versions, one which Madplayer says and the second one is the Wheeler one.

In any case its ours. Just like Kohinoor is Indias.

How is it yours?

 

[cricketjoshila]

In BJP's India, a call to demolish Jinnah's house in Mumbai


https://www.dawn.com/news/1323149

Apparently, there have been calls from BJP leaders in Mumbai to demolish this House.

Yes there has been. Its a govt property now. If its demolished and the land developed billions can be made by the govt.

 

[Pakpak]

How is it yours?

Mohenjadaro is in Modern day Pakistan. Not India. If India can claim diamonds from Britain so can we.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Mohenjadaro is in Modern day Pakistan. Not India. If India can claim diamonds from Britain so can we.

Everything that was to be divided, even in museums and libararies were divided and a list was made in 1947.Please read about it.

 

[Pakpak]

Everything that was to be divided, even in museums and libararies were divided and a list was made in 1947.Please read about it.

If it was taken like Madplayer said then its ours. If you're correct then and there was an agreement then that's different.

 

[cricketjoshila]

If it was taken like Madplayer said then its ours. If you're correct then and there was an agreement then that's different.

The division in things in libararies and museums is officially documented.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Anyways the topic is South Court Building.I want to know how can Pakistan claim ownership rights over it? Diplomatic request is a different thing.

 

[TSA321]

April fools I'm guessing.

 

[cricketjoshila]

April fools I'm guessing.

No its not.

 

[boomboomcheema]

Should be Pakistan Consulate and our own building.

 

[JaDed]

Should be Pakistan Consulate and our own building.

Mumbai is not the capital of India,why would the consulate not be in the capital between countries with such frosty ties.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Mumbai is not the capital of India,why would the consulate not be in the capital between countries with such frosty ties.

They can open consulates in other cities if the host govt permits. But the demand that they own that property has no basis.

 

[JaDed]

They can open consulates in other cities if the host govt permits. But the demand that they own that property has no basis.

Yes they can,but our ties aren't that great for multiple location also it can't be shifted from Delhi to Mumbai.And yes GOP has no say in the property but it can easily be made into a tourist attraction(ofcourse politically wouldn't happen), BJP is just wasting time and energy of everyone by bringing out absolute useless topics to debate on.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Yes they can,but our ties aren't that great for multiple location also it can't be shifted from Delhi to Mumbai.And yes GOP has no say in the property but it can easily be made into a tourist attraction(ofcourse politically wouldn't happen), BJP is just wasting time and energy of everyone by bringing out absolute useless topics to debate on.

That property is lying almost useless since 2003. The MLA who raised the issue is a Billionaire Property developer,may be he wants to build something there who knows.

 

[www787]

Usual suspect missed the most important point of this article. Few radical Hindu from BJP wants to demolish a historical house just because it belongs to a founder of a Pakistan.

facts: it will never be handed over to Pakistan, or will be allow to be turn into consulate of Pakistan.

But what should be worrisome for any secular Indian and Indian Muslim that radical Hindu wants to demolish a historical house for sole purpose because it belonged to Jinnah.

 

[world cup captain]

I like to stay out of such discussions but this is too far. I’ve read a few posts here and I can’t believe that there is any opposition to this. The Pakistani government should just buy the property if the Indian government rejects the request.

 

[from_da_lost_dim3nsion]

Hand over please and if we could get Kashmir with that it would be really appreciated .

 

[cricketjoshila]

I like to stay out of such discussions but this is too far. I’ve read a few posts here and I can’t believe that there is any opposition to this. The Pakistani government should just buy the property if the Indian government rejects the request.

The property belongs to the govt of India and you cant buy it if the owner doesnt want to sell it.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Usual suspect missed the most important point of this article. Few radical Hindu from BJP wants to demolish a historical house just because it belongs to a founder of a Pakistan.

facts: it will never be handed over to Pakistan, or will be allow to be turn into consulate of Pakistan.

But what should be worrisome for any secular Indian and Indian Muslim that radical Hindu wants to demolish a historical house for sole purpose because it belonged to Jinnah.

Jinnah had said so many wonderful things about Hindus.Right?He is seen as a the most divisive figure in sub continental history and that feeling is across the political and religious segment.He left India saying he cant live with Hindus etc etc.

Yes he was a brilliant lawyer politician founder of pakistan and a brilliant petsonality over all but all that is no reason why a man who insulted what is 80% of Indias population to be given any exceptions to law.He is not a hero in India.

That property should be used any which way the govt wants to use it.

 

[www787]

Jinnah had said so many wonderful things about Hindus.Right?He is seen as a the most divisive figure in sub continental history and that feeling is across the political and religious segment.He left India saying he cant live with Hindus etc etc.

Yes he was a brilliant lawyer politician founder of pakistan and a brilliant petsonality over all but all that is no reason why a man who insulted what is 80% of Indias population to be given any exceptions to law.He is not a hero in India.

That property should be used any which way the govt wants to use it.

Electing Hindu radicals as politician justify what he had said and i am glad he fought for the freedom of Muslims in India.

That property is in India. India can do whatever they deemed is appropriate for their society. Most Pakistani and majority of secular Indian ( i don't see you as secular as long as you support radicalism in your nation) would want to preserve that property as an historical site.

 

[Major]

Yes they can,but our ties aren't that great for multiple location also it can't be shifted from Delhi to Mumbai.And yes GOP has no say in the property but it can easily be made into a tourist attraction(ofcourse politically wouldn't happen), BJP is just wasting time and energy of everyone by bringing out absolute useless topics to debate on.

who even said about shifting the consulate?

Many countries have consulates in multiple cities.

This is done to make it easier for the people applying for visas. Many have to travel large distances to get to the capital for submitting passport and all.

anyways, the main reason why a consulate woulnd't be allowed to operate is because India would demand for a consulate in Karachi. Problem results in the spying that goes around.

 

[Major]

Jinnah had said so many wonderful things about Hindus.Right?He is seen as a the most divisive figure in sub continental history and that feeling is across the political and religious segment.He left India saying he cant live with Hindus etc etc.

Yes he was a brilliant lawyer politician founder of pakistan and a brilliant petsonality over all but all that is no reason why a man who insulted what is 80% of Indias population to be given any exceptions to law.He is not a hero in India.

That property should be used any which way the govt wants to use it.

and in todays world he justified in what he did The cow slaughtering ban is just one example.

 

[Major]

Quaid e azam also had a house in new delhi. It has become the dutch embassy.

I only saw the building from the outside gate, it was a beutiful white building

 

[troodon]

India should not handover the house. If so, everyone deserves right to their ancestral properties.

Pak can give those 440million and buy it from India.

 

[bleaf27]

Haha this is a joke , the house is in India and Jinnah's house has no relevance to India so why would India honor or keep it ? I am missing the point. Many Indian politicians had properties in Present day Pakistan , what about those ? India should choose to do whatever it deems right

 

[www787]

Haha this is a joke , the house is in India and Jinnah's house has no relevance to India so why would India honor or keep it ? I am missing the point. Many Indian politicians had properties in Present day Pakistan , what about those ? India should choose to do whatever it deems right

Many Indian Politicians were neither Gandhi or Jinnah.

Jinnah had more relevance to India then you would ever have.

 

[Jin Chacha]

Why is the house the property of govt of India and not of Jinnah's daughter? Shouldn't she be the rightful owner rather than India or Pakistan.

 

[bleaf27]

Many Indian Politicians were neither Gandhi or Jinnah.

Jinnah had more relevance to India then you would ever have.

Would love to know that relevance

 

[www787]

Would love to know that relevance

Jinnah fought for the freedom of India and for the rights of minority of India.

 

[PakLFC]

Would Pak like his home to be dug up or something? India can also ask for certain old buildings in Pak today to be handed over as well. It is not practical to think this way from either side, let them remain where they originally were.

 

[KingKhanWC]

Should be the property of Jinnah's family.

But his house means little when the man helped carve out a whole country from within a country.

 

[TalentSpotterPk]

What do you mean by Hand Over ?

India hamaray Abu Ji ka hai ?


We can request India to kindly give us official access to Quaid's residence on Lease for Next 50 or 100 years.

They ll be kind if they agree.


That too if Quaid's Daughter Dina Wadia agrees.

 

[cricketjoshila]

and in todays world he justified in what he did The cow slaughtering ban is just one example.

So you be happy in Pakistan.Why bother about what is happening in India??Or what we do in Mumbai? Isnt that the point?

 

[cricketjoshila]

What do you mean by Hand Over ?

India hamaray Abu Ji ka hai ?


We can request India to kindly give us official access to Quaid's residence on Lease for Next 50 or 100 years.

They ll be kind if they agree.


That too if Quaid's Daughter Dina Wadia agrees.

Finally someone understands the point.Thank You.

FYI Indian govt has been maintaning the house for last 70 years.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Quaid e azam also had a house in new delhi. It has become the dutch embassy.

I only saw the building from the outside gate, it was a beutiful white building

Yes the Dutch Embassy has taken that house on lease.The House in Mumbai had the UK deputy high commision as a tenant till 2003.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Electing Hindu radicals as politician justify what he had said and i am glad he fought for the freedom of Muslims in India.

That property is in India. India can do whatever they deemed is appropriate for their society. Most Pakistani and majority of secular Indian ( i don't see you as secular as long as you support radicalism in your nation) would want to preserve that property as an historical site.

Please dont speak for Indians.They can speak for themselves in India.Though the millions who migrated from Pakistan and Bangladesh to India wont have very nice things to say.

Regarding his fight for muslims,well you got Pakistan.Isnt thats where it ends?You be happy in Pakistan we be happy in India. No one bothers the other?

 

[www787]

Please dont speak for Indians.They can speak for themselves in India.Though the millions who migrated from Pakistan and Bangladesh to India wont have very nice things to say.

Regarding his fight for muslims,well you got Pakistan.Isnt thats where it ends?You be happy in Pakistan we be happy in India. No one bothers the other?

Calm down, your usual diverting from your own initial statement won't work.

You had mentioned what Jinnah had said about Hindu? And I simply responded to that he was right to fight for the minority after seeing radical Hindu extremists are getting elected as politician in 2017.

Neither side had pleasant thing to say about partition, my ancestors weren't sent off to their new homes with boxes of sweets.

Regarding anyone speaking to preserve the historical site anywhere in the world is a common right of every individual. And since the house is related to a person who is regarded highly by me I have a right to speak my opinion, which is just an opinion.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Calm down, your usual diverting from your own initial statement won't work.

You had mentioned what Jinnah had said about Hindu? And I simply responded to that he was right to fight for the minority after seeing radical Hindu extremists are getting elected as politician in 2017.

Neither side had pleasant thing to say about partition, my ancestors weren't sent off to their new homes with boxes of sweets.

Regarding anyone speaking to preserve the historical site anywhere in the world is a common right of every individual. And since the house is related to a person who is regarded highly by me I have a right to speak my opinion, which is just an opinion.

My initial statement stands that Jinnah said a lot of things about Hindus and India.So to expect that his house deserves a special place in the same nation and among the same people is wrong.Dont forget that Jinnah was ready to give up on Pakistan if he was made the PM.Where were the rights then?

Neither side has pleasant things to say about the partition then why expect Indians to do anything special for Jinnah who was the architect of the partition.

Having an opinion and Demanding the place as Owners like Pakistan did are two different things.Pakistan says respect our ownership rights.Pakistan doesnt have any ownership rights over anything in India.Everything they had rights over was divided in 1947.Finished.

Btw the Indian govt has preserved the house for 70 years,even during the bloody partition or during the 4 wars we fought.

ever wondered why?

 

[Yossarian]

Why is the house the property of govt of India and not of Jinnah's daughter? Shouldn't she be the rightful owner rather than India or Pakistan.

In numerous parts of the world, where, due to conflict, people left their lands and properties behind, the displaced owners (or their descendants) are now being allowed to retake possession of their properties and lands (or be compensated for it). On that basis, Jinnah's daughter is the rightful owner and the property should be returned to her (or she be compensated by being allowed to sell it at market value).

 

[Specialisttailender]

Good luck lol.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Why is the house the property of govt of India and not of Jinnah's daughter? Shouldn't she be the rightful owner rather than India or Pakistan.

NO.Because at the time of Partition she was estranged from Jinnah and apparently disowned.When Jinnah migrated to Pakistan, under the Enemy Property Act all properties of people who migrated to Pakistan went to Govt of India.Pakistan also has a similar law so does Bangladesh.

If M.A Jinnah had transferred the rights to Dina Wadia before leaving India,she would have been the owner.

Now Pakistan govt claims that since Jinnah willed everything he had to Pakistan the house belongs to them, but Jinnah had relinquished the rights to the house when he moved to Pakistan

 

[bleaf27]

NO.Because at the time of Partition she was estranged from Jinnah and apparently disowned.When Jinnah migrated to Pakistan, under the Enemy Property Act all properties of people who migrated to Pakistan went to Govt of India.Pakistan also has a similar law so does Bangladesh.

If M.A Jinnah had transferred the rights to Dina Wadia before leaving India,she would have been the owner.

Now Pakistan govt claims that since Jinnah willed everything he had to Pakistan the house belongs to them, but Jinnah had relinquished the rights to the house when he moved to Pakistan

Good on you for doing such detailed research lad , didn't know a lot of those details.

 

[bleaf27]

In numerous parts of the world, where, due to conflict, people left their lands and properties behind, the displaced owners (or their descendants) are now being allowed to retake possession of their properties and lands (or be compensated for it). On that basis, Jinnah's daughter is the rightful owner and the property should be returned to her (or she be compensated by being allowed to sell it at market value).

I'm sorry but when two nations seperate and there's no accountability or agreement between the nations of retention of property , this cannot be argued. My gread grandparents migrated from present day Pakistan , Can I argue for possession of their land ?

 

[CricketCartoons]

NO.Because at the time of Partition she was estranged from Jinnah and apparently disowned.When Jinnah migrated to Pakistan, under the Enemy Property Act all properties of people who migrated to Pakistan went to Govt of India.Pakistan also has a similar law so does Bangladesh.

If M.A Jinnah had transferred the rights to Dina Wadia before leaving India,she would have been the owner.

Now Pakistan govt claims that since Jinnah willed everything he had to Pakistan the house belongs to them, but Jinnah had relinquished the rights to the house when he moved to Pakistan

Enemy Property Act was not applied to M.A Jinnah's house because of Nehru as a goodwill gesture. Both leaders had a better relationship which only went downhill with other leaders to come.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Enemy Property Act was not applied to M.A Jinnah's house because of Nehru as a goodwill gesture. Both leaders had a better relationship which only went downhill with other leaders to come.

The enemy property act was enacted in 1968 so how will Nehru use it?Nehru used a predecssor of the act the Evacuee property act.

 

[Gabbar Singh]

Why is the house the property of govt of India and not of Jinnah's daughter? Shouldn't she be the rightful owner rather than India or Pakistan.

The rightful owner was Jinnah's sister and her heirs. According to his will Jinnah had bequeathed Jinnah House to Fatima Jinnah and left nothing to his daughter. However before Nehru could decide what would happen to the house Jinnah was dead and the rightful owner, Fatima, was a Pakistani so the property was declared an evacuee property and taken over by the government.

Jinnah's daughter's case is actually based on Hindu inheritance law. She claims that Jinnah's will is not valid for his Indian property and moreover she claims that because only two generations previous the Jinnah's were Hindus so the Hindu inheritance law should apply (under the Hindu inheritance laws she would have a claim on the property even if Jinnah wrote her out of his will).

At the end of the day Jinnah did not want his daughter to have the house and neither does the Indian and Pakistani governments so her claim is incredibly weak.

To be honest India should just rent it to Pakistan so they can use it as a High Commission like the Brits did for many years up until the 1980s.

 

[Yossarian]

I'm sorry but when two nations seperate and there's no accountability or agreement between the nations of retention of property , this cannot be argued. My gread grandparents migrated from present day Pakistan , Can I argue for possession of their land ?

Yes.

 

[Bhaag Viru Bhaag]

If they are ready to buy it for 400 million USD then let them have it. Nothing is free these days. Its not as if they are going to keep it on the ship and take it back to Pakistan. The land will remain in India isn't it? Can't we buy property in England?

 

[cricketjoshila]

Yes.

Pakistan passed various laws to take custody of such properties.He cannot argue for possession of such properties

 

[CricketCartoons]

If they are ready to buy it for 400 million USD then let them have it. Nothing is free these days. Its not as if they are going to keep it on the ship and take it back to Pakistan. The land will remain in India isn't it? Can't we buy property in England?

What was the need for partition, if you cant let go things.

 

[tomato]

How do you guys want it packed?

 

[Abdullah719]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Indian parliamentarians' calls to demolish Jinnah House unfortunate & disturbing. History cannot be wished away by demolishing buildings.</p>— Imran Khan (@ImranKhanPTI) <a href="https://twitter.com/ImranKhanPTI/status/849870023543762944">April 6, 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[ahmedzee]

With all due respect to both the governments, the house should always belongs to the children.

 

[Gabbar Singh]

With all due respect to both the governments, the house should always belongs to the children.

Even if Jinnah wrote his daughter out of his will? Surely we all have the right to disinherited whoever we want?