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Pakistan of 1990s and India of 2010s - Are both underachievers?

Mian

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Both teams started by winning the first world cup of the mentioned decades (1992, 2011) and losing the next two when they were favorites and had consistent performers.

Both of these teams won the world cups when their best players were at the end of their careers Miandad, Imran (1992) Sachin, Sehwag (2011)

And both world cup winning teams gave us some upcoming great players Inzamam (1992), Kohli (2011)

In my opinion both Pakistan and India had better and consistent team units after 92 and 2011 but they just didn't click at the right time so in my view they both underachieved.
 
Probably.. its like Waqar is our Kohli does absolutely nothing in WCs.
 
Probably.. its like Waqar is our Kohli does absolutely nothing in WCs.

Waqar wasn't part of 92 team and and his peak was already over before the start of next wc...
 
Don't wanna make excuses but India really missed Dhawan here. He may not be gifted like and Rohit but dude was beast in ICC tourneys and had much more grit and fight in him.

Ultimately India's weak middle order came to bite them back in this as the top order carried the team throughout the tourney.
 
Don't wanna make excuses but India really missed Dhawan here. He may not be gifted like and Rohit but dude was beast in ICC tourneys and had much more grit and fight in him.

Ultimately India's weak middle order came to bite them back in this as the top order carried the team throughout the tourney.

True Dhawan in ICC tourneys is >>> Kohli
 
Both teams started by winning the first world cup of the mentioned decades (1992, 2011) and losing the next two when they were favorites and had consistent performers.

Pakistan was played 2 finals out of those 3 world cups...
 
Pakistan's 90 was much stronger than India's inflated side we had all bases covered India has a non existent middle order
 
Yes, we choked in ICC tournaments but to me this generation achieved unthinkable. Beating Australia in a Test series at their home for the first time every by an Asian side.
 
I was going to make a similar thread, but you beat me to it!
After 1999 wc, pak team declined and were terrible in 2003 and 2011 wcs.
I see the same thing happenng with india, as kohli, sharma and dhawan will all be 34/35 years old next wc, if they are selected and the new youngsters are not that good, just overhyped t20 players!
 
The Indian golden age of cricket does seem like it's winding down. Their best players are pretty old and so far we haven't seen any suggestion that the guys behind them are even close in terms of talent.
 
I was going to make a similar thread, but you beat me to it!
After 1999 wc, pak team declined and were terrible in 2003 and 2011 wcs.
I see the same thing happenng with india, as kohli, sharma and dhawan will all be 34/35 years old next wc, if they are selected and the new youngsters are not that good, just overhyped t20 players!

Bear in mind that Pakistan cricket also shot itself in the foot in the noughties by not rebuilding. The core from 1999 World Cup carried on playing until 2003; in fact many of them kept playing till 2007.

India must rebuild quickly. If they go into the next WC with a top order of 36 yo Rohit, 37 yo Dhawan, and 34 yo Kohli, then it's clear they haven't learnt the lessons of Pakistan's abject decline.
 
Yes, we choked in ICC tournaments but to me this generation achieved unthinkable. Beating Australia in a Test series at their home for the first time every by an Asian side.

Australian side without two of their best players. Imagine Indian team without Rohit and Kohli.
 
Bear in mind that Pakistan cricket also shot itself in the foot in the noughties by not rebuilding. The core from 1999 World Cup carried on playing until 2003; in fact many of them kept playing till 2007.

India must rebuild quickly. If they go into the next WC with a top order of 36 yo Rohit, 37 yo Dhawan, and 34 yo Kohli, then it's clear they haven't learnt the lessons of Pakistan's abject decline.

All of them are gun players and will probably get better. Dhawan was a big miss today
 
India with this middle order of Karthik, Pant, Pandya, Dhoni is nowhere close to the Pak side of 90s in my opinion.

India does have world class top 3 (Dhawan when fit) and an outstanding bowler in Bumrah but with such a middle order its not even the best Indian team let alone Pak of 90s which had match winner from top to bottom.
 
Bear in mind that Pakistan cricket also shot itself in the foot in the noughties by not rebuilding. The core from 1999 World Cup carried on playing until 2003; in fact many of them kept playing till 2007.

India must rebuild quickly. If they go into the next WC with a top order of 36 yo Rohit, 37 yo Dhawan, and 34 yo Kohli, then it's clear they haven't learnt the lessons of Pakistan's abject decline.
True, but you have to have new quality players to replace the current players. Pak didn't have them in the 2000s and india doesn't look like they have got them now!
 
India's last five ICC tournaments:

2014 - World T20 final vs Sri Lanka - Lost
2015 - World Cup semi-final vs Australia - Lost
2016 - World T20 semi-final vs West Indies - Lost
2017 - CT final vs Pakistan - Lost
2019 - World Cup semi-final vs New Zealand- Lost
 
India's last five ICC tournaments:

2014 - World T20 final vs Sri Lanka - Lost
2015 - World Cup semi-final vs Australia - Lost
2016 - World T20 semi-final vs West Indies - Lost
2017 - CT final vs Pakistan - Lost
2019 - World Cup semi-final vs New Zealand- Lost

It's time for India to stop facing BD in knock out like matches because whenever India beat them and throw them out of the tournament India also endup losing the trophy :)) It's a curse!
 
A bit early to reflect on the entire decade but perhaps history will see it that way. The similarities are stark... the "old guard" had one last hurrah in 2011 before the upcoming players in the WC-winning team had a stacked team but failed to win the # of tournaments they should have afterwards (with exception of ICCT I believe in 2013?). 1990s didn't have ICCT played throughout or surely Pakistan would have a good chance to snag one from Aus/SA (the top 2 teams of that decade IMO).

The big difference is that I'm sure W/L ratio wise India were quite superior to most other teams this decade - though someone else will have to back that up. Pakistan weren't; we were probably behind both Aus and SA - both juggernaut teams in their own right.
 
The silliest thing is that if Australia win this WC, they would technically be regarded as the best ODI team of this decade (2/3 WCs, QF appearance in the one they lost).
 
The silliest thing is that if Australia win this WC, they would technically be regarded as the best ODI team of this decade (2/3 WCs, QF appearance in the one they lost).

And if NZ or Eng win this WC we will have a different winner for last 6 ICC events starting from 2013

CT2013 India

2014 WT20 Lanka

WC2015 Aus

2016 WT20 West Indies

CT2017 Pakistan

WC2019 NZ/Eng

Feel sorry for SA they are not even in this list
 
A bit early to reflect on the entire decade but perhaps history will see it that way. The similarities are stark... the "old guard" had one last hurrah in 2011 before the upcoming players in the WC-winning team had a stacked team but failed to win the # of tournaments they should have afterwards (with exception of ICCT I believe in 2013?). 1990s didn't have ICCT played throughout or surely Pakistan would have a good chance to snag one from Aus/SA (the top 2 teams of that decade IMO).

The big difference is that I'm sure W/L ratio wise India were quite superior to most other teams this decade - though someone else will have to back that up. Pakistan weren't; we were probably behind both Aus and SA - both juggernaut teams in their own right.

We won Australasia Cups and Nehru Cup in 80s they were almost like CT but we messed up 87 wc :facepalm:
 
And if NZ or Eng win this WC we will have a different winner for last 6 ICC events starting from 2013

CT2013 India

2014 WT20 Lanka

WC2015 Aus

2016 WT20 West Indies

CT2017 Pakistan

WC2019 NZ/Eng

Feel sorry for SA they are not even in this list

SA :)) Sadly for them they seem like a minnow side sometimes now.
 
Instead of 2010s I feel this is similar to Pakistan's run from 2007 - 2012 in ICC events.

2007 WT20 - Finals
2009 WT20 - Winners
2009 CT - Semis
2010 WT20 - Semis
2011 WC - Semis
2012 WT20 - Semis

And Pakistan had a great and balanced team back then felt they were unlucky in the semis vs Aussies where Hussey went bullocks after Ajmal.
 
All of them are gun players and will probably get better. Dhawan was a big miss today

Kohli is already on decline, don't be fooled by his average. When has the last time you saw him dominate bowlers? He only scores meek run a ball 100s in bilaterals now.
 
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