Talent ranking of our batsmen?

[ads101]

In the ODI format. Not on performance but on how talented posters think they are (for example I think Sarfraz is arguably our best batsman in ODIs but is near the bottom). Would be interesting to see. I've used batsmen from the current era and who may be relevant in the future

From best to worst:
Babar Azam
Umar Akmal
Jamshed
Haris Sohail
Umar Amin
Maqsood
Sharjeel
Fakhar
Sarfraz
Shehzad

Personally by now, I would have thought Jamshed, Maqsood and Umar Akmal would have been regulars in the team, a bit surprised how much they've fallen. Never thought Sarfraz would have become as good a ODI bat as he's become.

What's your ranking?

 

[Muhammad10]

Agree with most of your rankings, except Jamshed is a bit higher than he should be (low-ish ODI strike-rate and his game deteriorated badly), while Sharjeel is too low. The hitting ability Sharjeel possesses, particularly against pace, is a rare trait in Pakistani batsmen.

 

[Arham_PakFan]

In the ODI format. Not on performance but on how talented posters think they are (for example I think Sarfraz is arguably our best batsman in ODIs but is near the bottom). Would be interesting to see. I've used batsmen from the current era and who may be relevant in the future

From best to worst:
Babar Azam
Umar Akmal
Jamshed
Haris Sohail
Umar Amin
Maqsood
Sharjeel
Fakhar
Sarfraz
Shehzad

Personally by now, I would have thought Jamshed, Maqsood and Umar Akmal would have been regulars in the team, a bit surprised how much they've fallen. Never thought Sarfraz would have become as good a ODI bat as he's become.

What's your ranking?

IMO Umar Akmal is/was more talented than Babar,posessed all the shots in the book,including attacking strokes.
Unfortunately he doesn't possess much of a brain,either,and Babar has far outperformed him.Still to be seen whether Babar makes full use of his talent.

 

[WC-Passion]

Umar isn't seen as talented by most posters but "mediocre and limited". Personally think people only say this because the guy lacks common sense when batting, rather than trying to say that he has no natural ability. Jamshed should be significantly lower, Haris and Sharjeel should be higher.

 

[Chief Destroyer]

Sharjeel is numero uno. Babar if you're rating their complete batsmanship.

 

[Hamza_]

Sharjeel is numero uno. Babar if you're rating their complete batsmanship.

Sharjeel

 

[Chief Destroyer]

Sharjeel

What?

 

[ego-gambit]

You need batsmen or match winners like fakhar zaman why place him so low

 

[Suleiman]

Sharjeel is #1 without a doubt. Didn't have fitness (But improved after), not the tightest technique but it was his sheer God gifted hand-eye coordination and timing which makes up 90% of his output.

So many times in this CT saw deliveries going to the leg side to our players, just look at that Fakhar innings in the final earlier on where he couldn't get the ball away when angled into his pads, and I was like "damn, if that were Sharjeel, he'd have calypso flicked that for 4 or 6"

2nd is actually Umar Akmal, Morkel straight six off a bouncer comes to mind.

Are you guys noticing a trend here?

Next is Amin. Has serious talent, just no stomach for a fight.

Then Maqsood, natural timer of the ball. Gifted with size.

Then comes Babar. Wouldn't say the most talented, he's more of a product of careful coaching and investment.

Sarfraz is 2nd last. Azhar is last.

Ironically as you go from most to least talented you notice that the most talented have p much all got plaguing issues be it lack of work ethic, greed, laziness that prevents them from maximizing on potential. Yet the least talented are the hardest workers and were instrumental to our victory.

 

[pakistanigoneaussie]

Talent is more than just hitting big shots, its also picking up length early for me that's a great indicator of talent

so on that basis id rate it like this

1. Umar
2. Nasir
3. Sharjeel/Haris
4. Babar

 

[Ahson8]

Lol at Fakhar, Sharjeel & Sarfraz below Maqsood & Jamshed.
Also UA's 'talent' is overrated.

 

[pakistanigoneaussie]

Lol at Fakhar, Sharjeel & Sarfraz below Maqsood & Jamshed.
Also UA's 'talent' is overrated.

people conflate talent with peformance or mental ability

There is a reason why many in the world went gaga over Umar when he first came on, no other Pak batsmen got that reception since Inzi

 

[ads101]

Sharjeel is #1 without a doubt. Didn't have fitness (But improved after), not the tightest technique but it was his sheer God gifted hand-eye coordination and timing which makes up 90% of his output.

So many times in this CT saw deliveries going to the leg side to our players, just look at that Fakhar innings in the final earlier on where he couldn't get the ball away when angled into his pads, and I was like "damn, if that were Sharjeel, he'd have calypso flicked that for 4 or 6"

2nd is actually Umar Akmal, Morkel straight six off a bouncer comes to mind.

Are you guys noticing a trend here?

Next is Amin. Has serious talent, just no stomach for a fight.

Then Maqsood, natural timer of the ball. Gifted with size.

Then comes Babar. Wouldn't say the most talented, he's more of a product of careful coaching and investment.

Sarfraz is 2nd last. Azhar is last.

Ironically as you go from most to least talented you notice that the most talented have p much all got plaguing issues be it lack of work ethic, greed, laziness that prevents them from maximizing on potential. Yet the least talented are the hardest workers and were instrumental to our victory.

I put technique and footwork part of talent. Maybe I shouldn't. I know hard work goes into that (though arguably as does practising timing the ball improves your timing to an extent to even if there is an upper level). A lot of the guys who established their technique also did it at younger ages too, I'm sure some could just pick up technique easier.

Sharjeel has poor technique, hits much more to the leg side, terrible footwork. On top terrible fitness, but I guess that's not so much talent. He goes by what you said, which I feel his a bit lazy. I'm not too fond of players like that not working on their game like that, hence maybe I've rated him lower than he should be. I just see a player who is quite limited, probably more by the fault of himself than anyone else.

 

[ads101]

Agree with most of your rankings, except Jamshed is a bit higher than he should be (low-ish ODI strike-rate and his game deteriorated badly), while Sharjeel is too low. The hitting ability Sharjeel possesses, particularly against pace, is a rare trait in Pakistani batsmen.

I rate Jamshed on talent from what I saw early on in his career, had all the shots, good technique, didn't struggle to find the gaps. Looked a lot more balanced and in control than Sharjeel. And the Indian series was a series where everyone was struggling with the bat except for him. They were truly pressure knocks against India and Australia when the rest were struggling, it really looked he was carrying the line up despite his little experience. It's shocking he's degraded so far. His strike rate was really healthy before 2013.

 

[SarfiBabarHaris]

Babar and Haris easily the most complete batsmen in Pakistan.

Both capable of averaging 50+ in odis and tests which cant be said about other batsmen.

 

[MMHS]

How things changes - Ahmed's position in OP is probably justified now, since he hasn't developed a bit (in fact regressed) from his teen age days. He was a wonderful player, more in the mold of Ponting than Tendulkar, but sadly now has become a bottom handed slogger, who doesn't even have the courage to go after. Bad mentoring - may be, but I feel it's more to do with his return in ODI under Misbah - one by one the way attacking players were thrown under the bus (or below No. 5) that Ahmed found his clue to the way for staying in playing XI. Otherwise, his 1st ODI hundred was as good as it comes from a PAK opener in recent times.

If talent is measured on individual incident (that's execution of one shot at a time), I have to put Amin above anyone. He can play on either feet, in any direction, of any type of bowler & he has got the most time to play a shot - despite all his shot comings, I have hardly seen him beaten by pace, may be once against Starc in UAE.

These ranking doesn't mean anything - in such ranks, Azhar Ali probably won't make top 10 even in this bankrupt days of PAK batting resources, but he is genuinely world's best Test opener now. On contrary, by most - 3/4 names in top 10, even may be in top 5 will be Umar, Amin & Maqsood ................

 

[Billy1999]

If you rated Ricky on talent alone

He wouldn't have played a single test

Talent is just a word us Pakistan fans have contributed towards the dictionary

 

[Ahson8]

people conflate talent with peformance or mental ability

There is a reason why many in the world went gaga over Umar when he first came on, no other Pak batsmen got that reception since Inzi

I'd have agreed with you anywhere between 2009-2012 or even up till 2-3 yrs back but it's also important to note Umar has regressed terribly in last couple of years. I wouldn't say he is higher than Fakhar, Sharjeel, Haris or even Sarfraz now

 

[pakistanigoneaussie]

I'd have agreed with you anywhere between 2009-2012 or even up till 2-3 yrs back but it's also important to note Umar has regressed terribly in last couple of years. I wouldn't say he is higher than Fakhar, Sharjeel, Haris or even Sarfraz now

yeah but i think again you are confusing raw talent with things like work ethic and temprement

the most obvious being that Umar has gone from being very agile to fat and crazy(ier)

I doubt he has lost his hand eye cordination or ability to judge length, its all the other things that have done in him.

Now i know a single shot isnt a best example of talent but this shot shows 1: his insane hand eye cordination, and 2: his ability to pick up length on the up, that too from a giant in Mourne Morkel

<iframe frameborder="0" width="480" height="270" src="//www.dailymotion.com/embed/video/x2yifu5" allowfullscreen></iframe><br /><a href="http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2yifu5_umar-akmal-huge-six-vs-morne-morkel_sport" target="_blank">Umar Akmal huge Six Vs Morne Morkel</a> <i>by <a href="http://www.dailymotion.com/syedkomail98" target="_blank">syedkomail98</a></i>

I dont think any Pak player is capable of that shot

Now I hope people dont read this as "YOU WANT HIM BACK IN THE SIDE," Because i dont untill he has at the very least a year in first class cricket where he peforms, but this topic was never about that, just about raw talent

 

[Ahson8]

yeah but i think again you are confusing raw talent with things like work ethic and temprement

the most obvious being that Umar has gone from being very agile to fat and crazy(ier)

I doubt he has lost his hand eye cordination or ability to judge length, its all the other things that have done in him.

Now i know a single shot isnt a best example of talent but this shot shows 1: his insane hand eye cordination, and 2: his ability to pick up length on the up, that too from a giant in Mourne Morkel

<iframe frameborder="0" width="480" height="270" src="//www.dailymotion.com/embed/video/x2yifu5" allowfullscreen></iframe><br /><a href="http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2yifu5_umar-akmal-huge-six-vs-morne-morkel_sport" target="_blank">Umar Akmal huge Six Vs Morne Morkel</a> <i>by <a href="http://www.dailymotion.com/syedkomail98" target="_blank">syedkomail98</a></i>

I dont think any Pak player is capable of that shot

Now I hope people dont read this as "YOU WANT HIM BACK IN THE SIDE," Because i dont untill he has at the very least a year in first class cricket where he peforms, but this topic was never about that, just about raw talent

Yes, I get your point but again that shot was about 3 years ago. When Maqsood came on to the scene his hand eye coordination was pretty good too but after injury he wasn't the same player. Even Shehzad used to pick length a lot better a few years back but now he is absolutely terrible. Similarly I feel Umar's ability and technique has also regressed in the past couple of years, not as much as Maqssod or Shehzad but it definitely has to an extent.

The Umar Akmal of 2009 had more talent and potential than the current Umar Akmal and that's sad.

Apart from that the guy also has no work ethic or temparement and going by his Twitter account it seems like his IQ is quite low as well, which is why I've pretty much given up on him after having backed him for a long time now.

 

[pakistanigoneaussie]

Yes, I get your point but again that shot was about 3 years ago. When Maqsood came on to the scene his hand eye coordination was pretty good too but after injury he wasn't the same player. Even Shehzad used to pick length a lot better a few years back but now he is absolutely terrible. Similarly I feel Umar's ability and technique has also regressed in the past couple of years, not as much as Maqssod or Shehzad but it definitely has.

The Umar Akmal of 2009 had more talent and potential than the current Umar Akmal and that's sad.

Apart from that the guy also has no work ethic or temparement and going by his Twitter account it seems like his IQ is quite low as well, which is why I've pretty much given up on him after having backed him for a long time now.

I dont see how one can loose talent except with age

its the other things that have fallen apart, talent is just natural ability

Maqsood was never near his level either, he was a great timer of the ball but wasnt as good against the short ball and niether was his balance that great

 

[Ahson8]

I dont see how one can loose talent except with age

its the other things that have fallen apart, talent is just natural ability

Maqsood was never near his level either, he was a great timer of the ball but wasnt as good against the short ball and niether was his balance that great

His batting skill and technique isn't as good as it used to be. I think that plays a role.

If we're talking about purely raw unharnessed talent, then yes I assume he would be higher up the list, but I'm looking at the ability that he and all our other players currently possess.

I'm not sure if I'm even making sense any more to you because it's kinda hard to get this point across lol

 

[Hamza_]

What?

What have that guy done. I had followed him way before his debut.

 

[coy0607]

Talent is the most overrated thing in sports

 

[ManFan]

Will > Talent

 

[Red Devil]

Talent is the most overrated thing in sports

No, it isn't. All great players across all sports are generally very gifted players. Some players don't utilize their talent due to their lack of application but that doesn't mean that talent in itself is useless.

 

[Aman]

No, it isn't. All great players across all sports are generally very gifted players. Some players don't utilize their talent due to their lack of application but that doesn't mean that talent in itself is useless.

Ronaldo is the second best footballer in the world and he isn't exactly the most talented. It's his drive to be the best (and get out of a certain somebody's shadow ) and work ethic that's gotten him to #2 in the world.

Will > Talent

This.

IMO Guptill, Ryder and Taylor are more talented than KW, yet Kane is considered the far better batsmen.

 

[Aman]

Talent is more than just hitting big shots, its also picking up length early for me that's a great indicator of talent

so on that basis id rate it like this

1. Umar
2. Nasir
3. Sharjeel/Haris
4. Babar

This seems about right.

 

[super hitter]

Modern cricket is more about pressure handling so you can see their test performance to rank their techniques since the batting ability mostly depends on how they handle pressure

 

[Red Devil]

Ronaldo is the second best footballer in the world and he isn't exactly the most talented. It's his drive to be the best (and get out of a certain somebody's shadow ) and work ethic that's gotten him to #2 in the world.

This.

IMO Guptill, Ryder and Taylor are more talented than KW, yet Kane is considered the far better batsmen.

Not denying the importance of hard work and dedication but some level of natural ability is also essential. There's a reason why most top clubs have scouts trying to find talented players all over the world.

Ronaldo has achieved a lot due to his work ethic and sheer determination but no one can deny that he's also an immensely talented footballer. Most football fans will concur with this.

 

[Macho Mann]

the irony is, if you rate their performance, the list becomes worst to best excluding shahzad ofcourse

goes to show tht talent is not everything, you have to work hard and smart to achieve your goals

nobody gets a free ride because of 'talent'

 

[Aman]

Not denying the importance of hard work and dedication but some level of natural ability is also essential. There's a reason why most top clubs have scouts trying to find talented players all over the world.

Ronaldo has achieved a lot due to his work ethic and sheer determination but no one can deny that he's also an immensely talented footballer. Most football fans will concur with this.

He's talented but he definitely isn't among the most talented footballers I've seen. You have to agree there, his movements aren't natural or smooth like other footballers. Some of the action I've seen from the U20 WC has impressed me more than Ronaldo ever has. He's driven and an excellent finisher, though.

 

[MeanAndGreen]

He's talented but he definitely isn't among the most talented footballers I've seen. You have to agree there, his movements aren't natural or smooth like other footballers. Some of the action I've seen from the U20 WC has impressed me more than Ronaldo ever has. He's driven and an excellent finisher, though.

The teenage Ronaldo was one of the most sought after properties in world football and that's why he was given the No.7 at 18 for Man Utd. Hard work is what's taken him to the legendary level but he is definitely talented. He had a pretty unorthodox technique as well and that's why he couldn't sustain it into his 30s. He simply doesn't have the natural pace, elasticity and strength at this age to sustain his old shooting and dribbling technique and hence, has had to remodel his entire game.

 

[JibranAnsari]

Babar , akmal and sharjeel. The top 3.

 

[Titan24]

yeah but i think again you are confusing raw talent with things like work ethic and temprement

the most obvious being that Umar has gone from being very agile to fat and crazy(ier)

I doubt he has lost his hand eye cordination or ability to judge length, its all the other things that have done in him.

Now i know a single shot isnt a best example of talent but this shot shows 1: his insane hand eye cordination, and 2: his ability to pick up length on the up, that too from a giant in Mourne Morkel

<iframe frameborder="0" width="480" height="270" src="//www.dailymotion.com/embed/video/x2yifu5" allowfullscreen></iframe><br /><a href="http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2yifu5_umar-akmal-huge-six-vs-morne-morkel_sport" target="_blank">Umar Akmal huge Six Vs Morne Morkel</a> <i>by <a href="http://www.dailymotion.com/syedkomail98" target="_blank">syedkomail98</a></i>

I dont think any Pak player is capable of that shot

Now I hope people dont read this as "YOU WANT HIM BACK IN THE SIDE," Because i dont untill he has at the very least a year in first class cricket where he peforms, but this topic was never about that, just about raw talent

To me it looked like a predetermined shot but may be I am wrong. Considering his ability against pace bowlers I still cant understand why he was never tried as opener as he is technically not that shabby either.
Note: He isnt a very good player against spin.

 

[Titan24]

To me picking the lenght early and having a lot of time to play the ball is talent but gap finding is one of the most important talents.

Look at Hashim Amla, he has great hands but his ability to find gaps is amazing, Fakhar seems to have this ability unlike many other players currently in the team.

 

[Titan24]

Pure talent (Seeing the ball early, stroke play and ability to find gaps) wise I would rate as follows:

Umar Akmal (If only the guy has some brains... with some hardwork and passion to be the best he could have reached the heights of ABD, yes many people wont agree after seeing the way he looked in the last few outings, but as mudassar nazar said this guy doesnt practice, doesnt work hard and thats what we all saw in the last few innings of his).

Babar Azam (No weakness!! as such other than some nerves which he showed in CT 17 but he is still young. Can put the lose ball away and can defend the good ball and has the ability to make a good ball look bad)

Fakhar Zaman (The way he finds the gaps and that six to Rabada in CT 17 and that hitting against ashwin and jadeja at will is no less than Umar Akmal, seems to be a better player of spin than Sharjeel and Akmal Combined)

Sharjeel Khan (If only there would have been no spin bowling in the world, this guy is a beast of a batsman every one in the world would wanna see play and every format, just a treat to watch. Slightly short the ball goes away, slightly full the ball goes away, slightly wide to off stump ball goes and slightly leggish same treatment. He was even technically very good against pace.
But big time struggler agiansnt spin bowling which robbed him of few centuries at international level and thats the reason Fakhar got his first 100 is only 4 innings).

Ahmed Shehzad (Yes controversial but he has the ability to be a 360 degree player, if he can get his old mojo back, even look at few of his innings in PSL 2017. I remember Ramiz saying in the commentary box: He looks like a spoiled billionaire who can play a number of shots to the same ball. Really needs to work on getting across the line of the ball).

Umar Amin (The way he has improved and the glimpses of his all round strokes we have seen in Pakistan Cup 2017 along with a good head on his shoulders, he can do wonders for Pakistan in the future if only he remain working hard and play fearlessly at international level.

Haris Sohail (One of the most technically solid batsman around and is equally good against spin and pace, strike rotation is excellent rather best after Sarfaraz, can hit good strokes however for ODIs and T20s he needs to expand his range a bit for middle and the death overs. Dream batsman for any test team and top 4 positions batsman for any ODI team).

Only players who have played for Pakistan are included.

 

[The Googly]

I think Babar is very talented - I know some people have doubts. But he is a class player.

I don't rate Sharjeel.

Haris looked good - very unlucky with injuries.

Umar Akmal had talent but no brain - so is a zero as far as I am concerned. What a shame! If he had a work ethic, he had the talent to be a Javed Miandad. Just goes to show that without hard work, talent alone is useless.