Time for a radical takeover

[TheSultan]

It’s patently obvious to me that Babar has no clue about the modern game. Not only that we have only 3 specialist batsmen.

It’s even more clear to me that the only people in Pakistan who understand the modern game are the ones who in Leagues around the world. Even Naseem was transformed after spending one season under Dwayne Bravo in the CPL.

So we need more of these guys in.

Imad as captain - we don’t have any decent spinners let’s face it. Imad’s darts will do for now.

Azam Khan, Amir, bring them all in. Amir can be a very useful 3rd / 4th seamer.

Rizwan out, Imam out, Fakhar out.

Enough of this meek defensive nonsense.

The guys above are not the long term solution but exactly what the team needs right now.

Time for takeover!

Discuss

 

[Rana]

Pakistan that I loved was ruined by Misbah ul Haq due to his evil intentions to ruin Sarfaraz Ahmed.

Before Misbah’s dirty politics, the players played for the crest on the shirt, not for their agents and personal milestones

 

[TheSultan]

Completely agree about Misbah. The guy is a walking Pak team obliterator.

 

[hoshiarpurexpress]

Misbah was the worst thing to happen for the Pakistan LOI team. He killed the flair, passion and natural aggression of Pakistan. They glgave got it back now with their current bowling attack. Babar needs to be a bit more imaginative.

 

[Savak]

Misbah was the worst thing to happen for the Pakistan LOI team. He killed the flair, passion and natural aggression of Pakistan. They glgave got it back now with their current bowling attack. Babar needs to be a bit more imaginative.

Babar has had 4 years as captain. He is not going to develop any more. Time has shown that he is to set and comfortable in his defensive ways and he keeps getting away with it because of being the best batsman in the side and the fact there is no clear successor

 

[SamNJ]

I think they will make Imam the captain if Babar doesn't add trophies.

 

[pratiktc]

If Azam khan is the answer, then the question cannot be international cricket.

Pak is still a quality side. Fully expect that even after resting 2 of main 3 pacers, they should beat Sri Lanka easily

 

[BunnyRabbit]

Seems like a Karachi Kings fan rather than Pak Cricket's.

 

[MenInG]

Pakistan that I loved was ruined by Misbah ul Haq due to his evil intentions to ruin Sarfaraz Ahmed.

Before Misbah’s dirty politics, the players played for the crest on the shirt, not for their agents and personal milestones

Having had the honour of meeting and interacting with Misbah on many occasions, I can see that this is the worst sort of character assassination I have come across in many years.

You may not like his style of leadership etc, but to label him evil is vile in itself.

 

[PakLFC]

We have too few specialist batsmen in the side. The one that showed some promise was Muhammad Haris who for some reason doesn't play. We should have at least five specialist batsmen in the side not bits and pieces players like Shadab who contributes nothing. Surely, we must have better spinners in Pak then this guy who has no googly, leg break or wrong un. He is the first one who should be shown the door followed by Imam and Fakhar even Ifti. Rizwan although decent in tests is not an ODI player. No way should we even consider bringing back Amir for heaven sake.

 

[CerebralPatriot]

Excellent post.

The only thing I disagree with is captaincy. Although Imad has wonderful leadership skills, we will need someone who has experience leading these group of boys and the only appropriate option is Sarfraz so I'd take him over Azam who we can groom for the next world cup

 

[YousafTheBeast]

Out :- Imam, Rizwan, Faheem, Shadab.

In :- Shafique, Harris, Jamal, Abrar.

Problem with our team is that apart from Fakhar and Ifthikar, no one else has that ability to go from something like 30 off 30 balls to 90 off 60 balls. No one else has the ability to hit the big shot, if you look at the top 7 of India’s team that played against us, they all hit big shots, they’ve got that release shot that takes the pressure off of them and the non striker.

In our team, we have players playing for personal milestones. If Pakistan needed 16 to win of the last 3 balls, and someone like Imam was batting on 99, he’d probably take a single, run down to the pavilion do the sajda then silence his critics as if he won us the game. We have TOO many players in our xi that are playing for their spots rather than for the team. After every win against crappy teams, they’re giving interviews and words like “fearless”, “attacking”, and “positive” are thrown around but you don’t see any of that when it’s up against the big teams.

We need a captain with authority, Babar was our best bet, someone that the youngsters look up to, someone that’s respected in the dressing room, he had all the ingredients to be a great leader of the team but my god his on field decisions are so bad even the women in your house are calling it out.

Forget about this years WC, you have 4 years to build another squad. The likes of Fakhar, Rauf (age?) and Ifthikar won’t be there. We have more problems than answers.

 

[Rana]

Having had the honour of meeting and interacting with Misbah on many occasions, I can see that this is the worst sort of character assassination I have come across in many years.

You may not like his style of leadership etc, but to label him evil is vile in itself.

Misbah may well be a lovely person to meet in real life, and a great human being in his day to day dealings. My comment is about the cricket politics he played, and I believe he is extremely divisive in this regard.

I stick by what I say, we all witnessed how he bent over backwards to ensure Rizwan does enough to kick out Sarfaraz. He took as much time as he could to make sure Rizwan scores something meaningful to end Sarfaraz’s career.

Things were never the same after Misbah did what he did. He will be held accountable for the rest of his life for this

 

[Extra_Cover]

Talk about wrist slitters and have a look at this thread. A month before world cup which only comes once in 4 years and we have fans shouting "time for a radical takeover".

For all the fantasy going around in this thread how about we get behind the current team and support them in the WC for a change? We have invested years in keeping this team together so I have no clue where the argument for a radical change comes from right before the big tournament. Just support this team and radical change can come after the world cup.

 

[Rana]

Talk about wrist slitters and have a look at this thread. A month before world cup which only comes once in 4 years and we have fans shouting "time for a radical takeover".

For all the fantasy going around in this thread how about we get behind the current team and support them in the WC for a change? We have invested years in keeping this team together so I have no clue where the argument for a radical change comes from right before the big tournament. Just support this team and radical change can come after the world cup.

There is no wrist slitting. Some may have started to voice their opinions now

Others have been screaming for the past 3-4 years

 

[shah9425]

This post made me laugh

 

[TheSultan]

Excellent post.

The only thing I disagree with is captaincy. Although Imad has wonderful leadership skills, we will need someone who has experience leading these group of boys and the only appropriate option is Sarfraz so I'd take him over Azam who we can groom for the next world cup

I can get behind that. Sarfraz as captain

 

[TheSultan]

Talk about wrist slitters and have a look at this thread. A month before world cup which only comes once in 4 years and we have fans shouting "time for a radical takeover".

For all the fantasy going around in this thread how about we get behind the current team and support them in the WC for a change? We have invested years in keeping this team together so I have no clue where the argument for a radical change comes from right before the big tournament. Just support this team and radical change can come after the world cup.

So we’ve identified the problems and you still want to go in to a World Cup with the problems?

Every ICC tournament we hear the same thing. It’s too late to change. Change afterwards. The change never comes because guess what, we’re not in the 4 year cycle of icc tournaments anymore. There’s literally an ICC tournament round the corner all the time. Different format yes, but the core of the team and more importantly the mentality stays the same.

And after said ICC tournament, most teams take a little break, bring their 2nd XIs out. What happens Pakistan play against them and the mental midgets make merry for fans like you then celebrating “babar is back”, “rizwan has proved his doubters wrong”, “I’m gonna be real why does Imam get so much hate”.

Change - the world won’t end.

 

[Rana]

So we’ve identified the problems and you still want to go in to a World Cup with the problems?

Every ICC tournament we hear the same thing. It’s too late to change. Change afterwards. The change never comes because guess what, we’re not in the 4 year cycle of icc tournaments anymore. There’s literally an ICC tournament round the corner all the time. Different format yes, but the core of the team and more importantly the mentality stays the same.

And after said ICC tournament, most teams take a little break, bring their 2nd XIs out. What happens Pakistan play against them and the mental midgets make merry for fans like you then celebrating “babar is back”, “rizwan has proved his doubters wrong”, “I’m gonna be real why does Imam get so much hate”.

Change - the world won’t end.

The change comes and doesn’t end until the massive failure after the next 4 years

 

[Major]

another knee jerk reaction thread.

the guy sitting on bench or out of the team is always the best player according to pakistani fans.

Imad wasim as captain? lol never gonna happen.

Guy thought Rizwan is not a t20 player, and Rizwan ends up winning ICC t20 player of the year award.

 

[BouncerGuy]

another knee jerk reaction thread.

the guy sitting on bench or out of the team is always the best player according to pakistani fans.

Imad wasim as captain? lol never gonna happen.

Guy thought Rizwan is not a t20 player, and Rizwan ends up winning ICC t20 player of the year award.

Imad should be in the team but not as a captain. That is a way out-of-the-box thing to do. He deserves a spot the team but not to be a captain. IMO

 

[CerebralPatriot]

another knee jerk reaction thread.

the guy sitting on bench or out of the team is always the best player according to pakistani fans.

Imad wasim as captain? lol never gonna happen.

Guy thought Rizwan is not a t20 player, and Rizwan ends up winning ICC t20 player of the year award.

How is it a knee jerk reaction? We just experienced our most humiliating defeat ever and even before we were being embarrassed both at home and away.

Radical changes are a must.

Also T20 player of the year means nothing

 

[Extra_Cover]

There is no wrist slitting. Some may have started to voice their opinions now

Others have been screaming for the past 3-4 years

You have been voicing your opinion fair and square. The players are voicing it through their performances (numbers speak for themselves). If any neutral guy has to pick between "your" opinion and "real" numbers / stats then they would side with the facts which are real.

The fact is Babar is number 1 ranked player at the moment in ODIs, Imam at 5 and Fakhar at 10. Fact is Rizwan is arguably the best keeper we have ever had and he is a top ranked T20 player so bound to do recently in ODIs which he has off late. The fact is the numbers speak volumes for these players. So get off the high horse and look at the real numbers rather than finger pointing at X, Y or Z will be better than them.

 

[BouncerGuy]

The stats don't lie. India played 2 world test championship finals by playing tests at home. It makes no difference when a player performs at home or away. You need to perform wherever you are.

 

[Rana]

You have been voicing your opinion fair and square. The players are voicing it through their performances (numbers speak for themselves). If any neutral guy has to pick between "your" opinion and "real" numbers / stats then they would side with the facts which are real.

The fact is Babar is number 1 ranked player at the moment in ODIs, Imam at 5 and Fakhar at 10. Fact is Rizwan is arguably the best keeper we have ever had and he is a top ranked T20 player so bound to do recently in ODIs which he has off late. The fact is the numbers speak volumes for these players. So get off the high horse and look at the real numbers rather than finger pointing at X, Y or Z will be better than them.

There you go pal. You are equally as guilty as those who brought that 228 run humiliation. It’s because you fail to see the truth, and if your version of what is true is based on ‘stats suggest this’, well best of luck because reality doesn’t care about stats accumulated against B string sides on roads. When reality hits, it hits hard!

It takes one honest look to be able to admit Rizwan isn’t the best keeper batsman we have ever had. Stop with this false propaganda.

It takes one honest look to admit Babar’s no.1 ranking is probably flawed as there are plenty of better white ball batsman than he is.

I keep reiterating again and again, be honest as a cricketing nation if you wish to advance.

 

[Rana]

The stats don't lie. India played 2 world test championship finals by playing tests at home. It makes no difference when a player performs at home or away. You need to perform wherever you are.

So what stopped Pakistan to make the WTC final? They had an easy run at home against the best teams of the world?

 

[Rana]

another knee jerk reaction thread.

the guy sitting on bench or out of the team is always the best player according to pakistani fans.

Imad wasim as captain? lol never gonna happen.

Guy thought Rizwan is not a t20 player, and Rizwan ends up winning ICC t20 player of the year award.

Guy was right

Rizwan isn’t a T20 player. Those who did the Hundred draft agree with that opinion

 

[BouncerGuy]

So what stopped Pakistan to make the WTC final? They had an easy run at home against the best teams of the world?

What kept Pakistan away was the players' performance. If players cannot perform in home conditions then we do not deserve to play final. The player has to perform no matter what. no excuses. But also 1 match failure doesn't mean to kick him out as well. We as Pakistani fans are very impatient. One minute up next minute down. LOL

 

[Extra_Cover]

So we’ve identified the problems and you still want to go in to a World Cup with the problems?

Every ICC tournament we hear the same thing. It’s too late to change. Change afterwards. The change never comes because guess what, we’re not in the 4 year cycle of icc tournaments anymore. There’s literally an ICC tournament round the corner all the time. Different format yes, but the core of the team and more importantly the mentality stays the same.

And after said ICC tournament, most teams take a little break, bring their 2nd XIs out. What happens Pakistan play against them and the mental midgets make merry for fans like you then celebrating “babar is back”, “rizwan has proved his doubters wrong”, “I’m gonna be real why does Imam get so much hate”.

Change - the world won’t end.

Oh you are so wrong on the bolded part. At each and every world cup we have our management go through similar knee jerk moments like its fans do. We have not had a settled team going into a world cup for decades now. Let me refresh your memories below.

The following are players who played less than 50 ODIs and were part of 2019 world cup squad.
1.Fakhar 2.Asif Ali 3.Haris Sohail 4.Imam 5.Shadab 6.Imad 7.Hasan Ali 8.Hasnain 9.Shaheen

This was even worse in 2015 world cup. The following are players with less than 50 ODIs
1. Ehsan Adil (debut) 2.Sarfraz 3.Rahat Ali (debut) 4.Irfan 5.Nasir Jamshed 6.Sohail Khan (5 ODIs) 7.Junaid Khan 8.Sohaib Maqsood 9.Yasir Shah (debut) 10.Haris Sohail

This time around the players we got in the team with less than 50 ODIs include:
1.Shaheen 2.Naseem 3.Haris Rauf 4.Ifti 5.Agha Salman 6.Rizwan

On the face you would assume that we got an inexperienced team going into the tournament but the reality is that most of the teams were playing T20s for the past 3 years to fit in 2 T20WCs during that time resulting in less ODIs being played.

 

[Major]

Imad should be in the team but not as a captain. That is a way out-of-the-box thing to do. He deserves a spot the team but not to be a captain. IMO

Bro, our issue is spinner not able to actually spin the ball.

For the past two years we are seeing the same dramaybaazi. If nawaz doesnt do well replace him with imad, if imad doesnt do well replace him with nawaz.

Point is, both suck. Both have failed to do anything. Its just a blind belief that as soon as someone is out of team or squad he is the best player for us.

We need spinners. Not darters, but spinners for odi cricket, players that can actually turn the ball.

 

[Major]

Thabk god pcb is run by sane people and not by kids who want radical change after every defeat

Keep crying, rizwan is going no where, keep whining about him on social media. He will play and nothing can stop him

 

[BouncerGuy]

Bro, our issue is spinner not able to actually spin the ball.

For the past two years we are seeing the same dramaybaazi. If nawaz doesnt do well replace him with imad, if imad doesnt do well replace him with nawaz.

Point is, both suck. Both have failed to do anything. Its just a blind belief that as soon as someone is out of team or squad he is the best player for us.

We need spinners. Not darters, but spinners for odi cricket, players that can actually turn the ball.

It is a harsh reality that we do not have a quality spinner in domestic circles as well. Where is an off-spinner like Saeed Ajmal..? Deadly in the start, middle, and end..... No, We do not have one at the moment. Until we work on some boys, we are left stranded like this before every tournament.

 

[Extra_Cover]

There you go pal. You are equally as guilty as those who brought that 228 run humiliation. It’s because you fail to see the truth, and if your version of what is true is based on ‘stats suggest this’, well best of luck because reality doesn’t care about stats accumulated against B string sides on roads. When reality hits, it hits hard!

It takes one honest look to be able to admit Rizwan isn’t the best keeper batsman we have ever had. Stop with this false propaganda.

It takes one honest look to admit Babar’s no.1 ranking is probably flawed as there are plenty of better white ball batsman than he is.

I keep reiterating again and again, be honest as a cricketing nation if you wish to advance.

Would this mean I'm equally as responsible for T20WC 10 wicket win over India or I'm equally as responsible for attaining the number 1 ODI team ranking?

People see facts and not opinions. These are facts what you come up with is opinion.

 

[Rana]

Would this mean I'm equally as responsible for T20WC 10 wicket win over India or I'm equally as responsible for attaining the number 1 ODI team ranking?

People see facts and not opinions. These are facts what you come up with is opinion.

You want your opinion to take credit for a 10 wicket win in a T20 or a flawed No.1 ranking due to playing under strength sides, then be my guest. You can take credit for pakistan most likely winning their first two games of the World Cup as well, I’ll give you that. But then, the harsh reality will creep in.

And that’s where I will stand tall. Believe that!

 

[Major]

It is a harsh reality that we do not have a quality spinner in domestic circles as well. Where is an off-spinner like Saeed Ajmal..? Deadly in the start, middle, and end..... No, We do not have one at the moment. Until we work on some boys, we are left stranded like this before every tournament.

We probably do have. The domestic structure being reduce to less teams and too much focus on pace bowling led to this.

Abrar ahmad as a mystery spinner might be needed

 

[Muhammad Saad]

We just lack severe talent , how many batters with 45+ avg with 85+ s/r in domestic circuit? None , how many quality spinners with big turn and good control we have in our domestic cricket? None or may be Usama Mir only , lack of quality spinners means domestic batters are underprepared against quality spinners in spin friendly wickets, nothing to do with Babars captaincy or Misbah annihilation of our cricket.

It’s all about lack of future and lack of money in Pak cricket and youngsters are not attracted towards it anymore.

 

[Extra_Cover]

You want your opinion to take credit for a 10 wicket win in a T20 or a flawed No.1 ranking due to playing under strength sides, then be my guest. You can take credit for pakistan most likely winning their first two games of the World Cup as well, I’ll give you that. But then, the harsh reality will creep in.

And that’s where I will stand tall. Believe that!

I never took any credit. You mentioned that I'm responsible for the humiliating loss against India so by that logic I would also be responsible for good things that have happened recently in Pakistan cricket.

You want to stand tall when our team is losing you are a weird type of Pakistan cricket fan I guess. I simply support my team and the players playing in the team. Further as mentioned numerous times below this is a well settled team so I wish them all the best. Any player who is not playing is automatically deemed to a better player which is a flawed logic, case in point remember the time when you were the most vocal supporter of Sharjeel Khan (how the mighty has fallen).

 

[Muhammad Saad]

PJL was a great initiative for Pak cricket which has sadly replaced by oldies playing domestic cricket in increased number of teams this season

 

[TheSultan]

Oh you are so wrong on the bolded part. At each and every world cup we have our management go through similar knee jerk moments like its fans do. We have not had a settled team going into a world cup for decades now. Let me refresh your memories below.

The following are players who played less than 50 ODIs and were part of 2019 world cup squad.
1.Fakhar 2.Asif Ali 3.Haris Sohail 4.Imam 5.Shadab 6.Imad 7.Hasan Ali 8.Hasnain 9.Shaheen

This was even worse in 2015 world cup. The following are players with less than 50 ODIs
1. Ehsan Adil (debut) 2.Sarfraz 3.Rahat Ali (debut) 4.Irfan 5.Nasir Jamshed 6.Sohail Khan (5 ODIs) 7.Junaid Khan 8.Sohaib Maqsood 9.Yasir Shah (debut) 10.Haris Sohail

This time around the players we got in the team with less than 50 ODIs include:
1.Shaheen 2.Naseem 3.Haris Rauf 4.Ifti 5.Agha Salman 6.Rizwan

On the face you would assume that we got an inexperienced team going into the tournament but the reality is that most of the teams were playing T20s for the past 3 years to fit in 2 T20WCs during that time resulting in less ODIs being played.

You’re using the wrong metrics to prove the wrong point. It has absolutely nothing to do with experience and no of ODIs played.

It’s what is the difference in playing XI to the playing XI that preceded it months before.

2015 WC what did we change from the debacle of the 2013 CT and the 2 years following it? Misbah was still captain, the core team was pretty much the same.

The 2019 team was pretty much the same team that played the 2017 CT, not much change (that was probably not such a bad thing but we could have had some changes to improve things).

2022 WC we pretty much had the same team going in to the first game that was there for months. Babar still captain, rizwan still opening. Khushdil, Asif Ali and co were still there.

In some of these world cups the actual change to the status quo in the MIDDLE of the tournament actually helped: sarfraz 2015, Fakhar 2017 CT, Haris 2022 WC.

Next time use the right metrics and you might prove a point

 

[hoshiarpurexpress]

Still a knee jerk reaction though to change Babar. He is still a decent captain and he should get the World cup to prove himself. Team has reached Semi Final and Final in T-20s under him.. Became No.1 Ranked LOI side etc. So I understand defeat to arch rivals hurts, but Pakistan can still pull Champions Trophy style rabbit out of the bag.
Babar just needs to be a bit more imaginative as I said earlier, and Mickey should help him to build 4-5 Plans in the game. Cover all scenarios and if Plan A and B fail, then go to C. That is where he lacks a bit.

 

[Rana]

I never took any credit. You mentioned that I'm responsible for the humiliating loss against India so by that logic I would also be responsible for good things that have happened recently in Pakistan cricket.

You want to stand tall when our team is losing you are a weird type of Pakistan cricket fan I guess. I simply support my team and the players playing in the team. Further as mentioned numerous times below this is a well settled team so I wish them all the best. Any player who is not playing is automatically deemed to a better player which is a flawed logic, case in point remember the time when you were the most vocal supporter of Sharjeel Khan (how the mighty has fallen).

Seeing how Pakistan fared chasing 356 yesterday, I would pick Sharjeel over the two. Even now. He plays one way, and he plays for his team. He isn’t scared or worried about what the bowlers are doing, he sees ball…he hits ball. Plain and simple. That’s what I am a supporter of, it can be Sharjeel or anyone that plays with this mindset.

Also, you could be my guest to take credit for those wins if you like, not that I claimed you did. But you might as well, because you won’t own up when you are proven wrong with Pakistan crashing out due to a flawed method which I and others like me have been screaming about since Misbah took over in 2019.

And yes, standing tall over this Pakistan team’s defeat (which I struggle to have affection for) is unfortunate, but I can’t help it to think that I could see the wrongs (not just me but others too) yet I have felt marginalised for my strong views.

Alas, it is what it is.

 

[shah9425]

Sarfraz time is over get used to it he should just stick to test
Rizwan is not going anywhere
Imad as a captain are u kidding me

 

[Extra_Cover]

Seeing how Pakistan fared chasing 356 yesterday, I would pick Sharjeel over the two. Even now. He plays one way, and he plays for his team. He isn’t scared or worried about what the bowlers are doing, he sees ball…he hits ball. Plain and simple. That’s what I am a supporter of, it can be Sharjeel or anyone that plays with this mindset.

Also, you could be my guest to take credit for those wins if you like, not that I claimed you did. But you might as well, because you won’t own up when you are proven wrong with Pakistan crashing out due to a flawed method which I and others like me have been screaming about since Misbah took over in 2019.

And yes, standing tall over this Pakistan team’s defeat (which I struggle to have affection for) is unfortunate, but I can’t help it to think that I could see the wrongs (not just me but others too) yet I have felt marginalised for my strong views.

Alas, it is what it is.

We are going back and forth with no real discussion here. On stats, history, form and experience alone England, Australia and India are superior sides to Pakistan. So there is no one here claiming that Pakistan will go all the way for certain.

What is being claimed or being discussed in here is that Pakistan with current setup is better than the Pakistan team filled with multiple opinions. Hence we should go for the current settled and arguably the "better" Pakistan team in the world cup.

 

[CerebralPatriot]

Thabk god pcb is run by sane people and not by kids who want radical change after every defeat

Keep crying, rizwan is going no where, keep whining about him on social media. He will play and nothing can stop him

Good keep Rizwan for the world cup. The longer he plays the more he will expose himself and the more people will realise what destruction he has caused to this team

 

[Rana]

We are going back and forth with no real discussion here. On stats, history, form and experience alone England, Australia and India are superior sides to Pakistan. So there is no one here claiming that Pakistan will go all the way for certain.

What is being claimed or being discussed in here is that Pakistan with current setup is better than the Pakistan team filled with multiple opinions. Hence we should go for the current settled and arguably the "better" Pakistan team in the world cup.

Let me end this for you.

This isn’t a knee-jerk reaction thread. This is a marginalised voice that is now becoming eminent on the back of one of the most humiliating defeats in the history of ODI cricket, that too on the eve of the Cricket World Cup

 

[Extra_Cover]

You’re using the wrong metrics to prove the wrong point. It has absolutely nothing to do with experience and no of ODIs played.

It’s what is the difference in playing XI to the playing XI that preceded it months before.

2015 WC what did we change from the debacle of the 2013 CT and the 2 years following it? Misbah was still captain, the core team was pretty much the same.

When your entire bowling setup is made up of debutants then core of the team remaining same is not the correct argument.

The 2019 team was pretty much the same team that played the 2017 CT, not much change (that was probably not such a bad thing but we could have had some changes to improve things).

Although we were largely the same team from 2017CT its still not right because if I can recollect correctly here we went into 2019 world cup with 10+ straight or back to back consecutive losses we were thrashed by England and co before world cup so we should have thought about that and should have changed which we did slightly by brining in Shaheen but not to a bigger extent.

2022 WC we pretty much had the same team going in to the first game that was there for months. Babar still captain, rizwan still opening. Khushdil, Asif Ali and co were still there.

Pakistan almost went all the way in 2022 so it was a pretty decent tournament from our regards, isn't it then?

In some of these world cups the actual change to the status quo in the MIDDLE of the tournament actually helped: sarfraz 2015, Fakhar 2017 CT, Haris 2022 WC.

Next time use the right metrics and you might prove a point

 

[Rana]

Good keep Rizwan for the world cup. The longer he plays the more he will expose himself and the more people will realise what destruction he has caused to this team

Exactly

And I hope they play Rizwan in Australia instead of Sarfaraz too.

 

[Rana]

@TheSultan @CerebralPatriot

The path you boys have taken is the Agnipath. Stay firm boys

 

[mominsaigol]

What we need at the end of the day is technically solid players who have high ceilings to be improved for the future.

Saud, saim ayub and Abdullah fall into this category, any problems related to their SR or their style of play can all be ironed out because they aren't technically limited.

Imam is a very very good accumulator and plays the shots he has to perfection but his technique and lack of aggressive stroke play makes him a liability in the death overs, its why he should be in test only. He's limited due to being a technically limited player who can't hit aggressive shots not because he's selfish.

Fakhar on the other hand has a stance that prevents him from playing various shots amd teams have now figured him out, even minnows like Nepal, Fakhar is never gonna score again, those 180's are long gone, no more leg side volleys amymore.

Rizwan is a dancer at the crease lol, his technique will cause him to get exposed this world cup. His technique is a million times worse then imam and fakhar.

But don't bring back azam or sharjeel, their gonna fail 100% lol, for the same technically reasons.

 

[Extra_Cover]

Exactly

And I hope they play Rizwan in Australia instead of Sarfaraz too.

Rizwan has played 2 test matches in Australia with an average of 44.25 and high score of 95.

 

[CerebralPatriot]

What we need at the end of the day is technically solid players who have high ceilings to be improved for the future.

Saud, saim ayub and Abdullah fall into this category, any problems related to their SR or their style of play can all be ironed out because they aren't technically limited.

Imam is a very very good accumulator and plays the shots he has to perfection but his technique and lack of aggressive stroke play makes him a liability in the death overs, its why he should be in test only. He's limited due to being a technically limited player who can't hit aggressive shots not because he's selfish.

Fakhar on the other hand has a stance that prevents him from playing various shots amd teams have now figured him out, even minnows like Nepal, Fakhar is never gonna score again, those 180's are long gone, no more leg side volleys amymore.

Rizwan is a dancer at the crease lol, his technique will cause him to get exposed this world cup. His technique is a million times worse then imam and fakhar.

But don't bring back azam or sharjeel, their gonna fail 100% lol, for the same technically reasons.

For some reason this notion that Sharjeel is technically poor exists when it is completely untrue. Technically he is miles ahead for Fakhar, Rizwan and I would say even Imam who can't play a ball coming in to save his life. Although I choose Masood over Sharjeel in my XI, Sharjeel could easily fit in and can prove to be an X factor this world cup.

Azam too is another X factor type player however as I said in the other thread, Sarfraz's experience and leadership probably gives him an edge however I wouldn't complain seeing Azam

 

[CerebralPatriot]

Rizwan has played 2 test matches in Australia with an average of 44.25 and high score of 95.

And Yasir Shah has a 100 in Australia. These useless stats don't mean anything, what matters is match winning knocks. Something Rizwan in incapable of

 

[sweep_shot]

Pakistan that I loved was ruined by Misbah ul Haq due to his evil intentions to ruin Sarfaraz Ahmed.

Before Misbah’s dirty politics, the players played for the crest on the shirt, not for their agents and personal milestones

Misbah has fundamentally changed Pakistan team. I agree.

Pre-Misbah PCT and post-Misbah PCT are polar opposites.

 

[Rana]

Rizwan has played 2 test matches in Australia with an average of 44.25 and high score of 95.

Chal teen aur khel le…

Don’t mind watching a live trampoline session of Rizzy GOAT

 

[Rana]

Misbah has fundamentally changed Pakistan team. I agree.

Pre-Misbah PCT and post-Misbah PCT are polar opposites.

The post Misbah team

Is not my team. It’s like a replica of my beloved. I cannot love the replica

 

[mominsaigol]

For some reason this notion that Sharjeel is technically poor exists when it is completely untrue. Technically he is miles ahead for Fakhar, Rizwan and I would say even Imam who can't play a ball coming in to save his life. Although I choose Masood over Sharjeel in my XI, Sharjeel could easily fit in and can prove to be an X factor this world cup.

Azam too is another X factor type player however as I said in the other thread, Sarfraz's experience and leadership probably gives him an edge however I wouldn't complain seeing Azam

Sharjeel can't play spin, he's a killer player against fast though.

 

[Major]

Sharjeel can't play spin, he's a killer player against fast though.

He sold the country. Wont play ever again

 

[Bhaijaan]

I think it’s time to bring back Umer Akmal & Mohammad Amir

 

[CerebralPatriot]

Sharjeel can't play spin, he's a killer player against fast though.

Another myth. He dominated Santner on a turning pitch in the 2016 world cup

 

[salman24]

Very knee jerk reaction. Some slight adjustments may need to be made but you have 3 batters out of the top 10 in the world.

If we had people like the ones in this thread we would've lost the 2019 Champion Trophy. We had a similarly devastating loss to India in the group stages. The people in this group would've changed the whole team after that loss but guess what that team went on to win the tournament.

I won't be too surprised if a similar thing happens in this tournament. PCT is always like this. They can beat anyone and lose to anyone by any margin.

 

[YousafTheBeast]

He sold the country. Wont play ever again

We need a down vote for this post

 

[mominsaigol]

He sold the country. Wont play ever again

I already agree and am against sharjeel playing lol. I never rated him as a player. His stats are bang Average. Everyone's solution is to replace fakhar a technically limited player with sharjeel an even more technically limited player .

My solution to to bring technically sound players and give them a permanent run, they'll groom to become atg.

Abdullah isn't the same mould as Imam or fakhar. He isn't technically limited and he has no problem accelerating as well as staying for a very very long time at the crease getting those massive scores. Imam can only dream of getting a test 200. Groom someone like Abdullah and all SR issues will disappear eventually, Imam is the same mould because he doesn't have the technique to play boundary scoring shots, that's all.

Same with saud, and saim ayub, their raw but raw in experience and game awareness, so all issues regarding Sr or staying at the crease are easy to iron out.

In fakhar's case he can't play anything away from him besides an overpitched delivery even if his life depended on it. In order to iron out that issue he'd have to change his stance, his technique and everything in between altogether which at his age is impossible now. Theirs a reason fakhar and Imam struggle same with rizwan.

But people don't understand this aspect and think Abdullah, Saim and Saud are off the same mould.

 

[mominsaigol]

Another myth. He dominated Santner on a turning pitch in the 2016 world cup

Brother your solution to bring these failures such as azam Khan and sharjeel solely because they can smash and are pseudo shahid afridi's is heavily misguided, one of these so called solutions being a match fixer in the first place.

I have seen sharjeel play, his backfoot is fine, other then that he's bang Average. He is not better then fakhar by any means, same with azam Khan, azam Khan is going to get the same treatment from international teams innthe same way Afghanistan gave him a reality check no matter how many times you play him, he can play 100 matches and it won't make a difference.

Your solution is to replace fakhar and rizwan, 2 technically limited player with even more technically limited players, one of which who sold the country. The whole sharjeel plays for the team is nonsense and doesn't apply to match fixers.

Amir is the only exception due to being 17, young and having salman butt showcase his nepotism and outright threatening his position if amir doesn't oblige. Amir was too young to understand the idea that he could have complained and exposed butt and even then if salman butt denied it and no proof was found, Amir would have to leave. So Amir was in a precarious position hence I give him sympathy due to age, and the forced position he was in.

Sharjeel was a grown man who himself initiated the spot fixing, he wasn't influenced by anyone. Get the whole playing for his country nonsense out of your head.

 

[VForVendetta]

Good keep Rizwan for the world cup. The longer he plays the more he will expose himself and the more people will realise what destruction he has caused to this team

Wasn't he already exposed enough last year in back to back tournaments? Isn't he one of the biggest reasons(other than his bff) why Pak couldn't ultimately clinch those titles? So what has changed since then? Was he replaced by Harris?No. Did he bring a radical change to his playing style (ala Hafeez 17-21)? No. The truth is, he is part of the clique, one of the chosen ones, a golden boy, so whether he embarrasses himself again on a major tournament or not won't change anything. As long as PCB will remain gutless & let the clique run the show nothing will change. If anything he is probably going to become your next captain!

 

[VForVendetta]

What we need at the end of the day is technically solid players who have high ceilings to be improved for the future.

Saud, saim ayub and Abdullah fall into this category, any problems related to their SR or their style of play can all be ironed out because they aren't technically limited.

Imam is a very very good accumulator and plays the shots he has to perfection but his technique and lack of aggressive stroke play makes him a liability in the death overs, its why he should be in test only. He's limited due to being a technically limited player who can't hit aggressive shots not because he's selfish.

Fakhar on the other hand has a stance that prevents him from playing various shots amd teams have now figured him out, even minnows like Nepal, Fakhar is never gonna score again, those 180's are long gone, no more leg side volleys anymore.

Rizwan is a dancer at the crease lol, his technique will cause him to get exposed this world cup. His technique is a million times worse then imam and fakhar.

But don't bring back azam or sharjeel, their gonna fail 100% lol, for the same technically reasons.

I have to disagree with you here. What your team requires are a bunch of guys who can be impactful & decisive, technical correctness doesn't ensure match winning capacity in this era. Of course I am only talking about white ball cricket. You need to look at all the top dogs & their biggest match winners in the last 10/15 years to understand what I am trying to convey. Dhawan doesn't really possess a supreme technique compared to Fakhar, only marginally better. That didn't stop him from becoming an icc tournament monster for 6 years. Finch is another guy who had horrible technique; Warner, Roy, Hales, Head, Guptill, Taylor, Rohit, Dilshan, Gayle I could go on & on. Not a single one of these guys possess proper technique like Virat, Kane or Root. That hasn't really hindered these guys from winning match after match. White ball batting has arrived on such a state today where technique & copybook don't really matter. What matters is intent & impact.

Because Pak cricket culture is extremely outdated, timid & conservative where it's still stuck more or less with the "92" formula it becomes really difficult for players of such caliber to flourish. If you have a guy who can strike the ball powerfully & just play without fear you should get that boy in the main setup & keep encouraging him. Pak have found few of these guys. No I don't mean Asif or Khushdil, specially the latter one is horrendous, should never ever be featured again in international cricket. Harris, Ayub & Haider could have been those guys. Yes Harris is in the squad, but that's exactly where he has been since forever, when will he be allowed to play atleast 10 games freely without the anxiety of getting dropped? Why isn't Ayub already in the squad, specially considering Fakhar & Imam aren't exactly setting the world on fire these days. Finally Haider, what a horrible way of nurturing a proper talent! I know critics will say he was given opportunities which he squandered. But where did he play? A proper top order batsman was reduced to a mere finishing role at 6/7 simply because the golden boys wouldn't let go of their position. Even though he made that impressive debut as a top order batsman & all the great performances in under 19 circuit & psl which brought him into the international arena came from that same order. Just because the guy has a long handle they thought he would be the ideal finisher. After last wc if they would have rectified their errors & brought these guys in the team there is a possibility minimum one of them if not two would have already settled themselves in the main eleven.

Regarding Fakhar, I am afraid it's just not his amateur technique, sure it's one of the biggest reasons of his recent failures, but there's a bit more I feel. He is surrounded by a bunch of selfish meek accumulators who are always playing for their personal glory, stats & ranking. What's even more frightening is that those guys are never held responsible or get called out for their timid approach. Even if someone dares to raise some questions they are hounded by thousands of fans, pr, media & most unfortunately by those guys themselves. So basically they don't even have to try to improve & add another gear. Which always leaves Fakhar as the sole one responsible to take risks, to unsettle opposition from the get go. Whether he gets that start or not, the other three never try & go their merry go round way. This is absolutely not fair, this is not the way a top tier batting should function. Not just SENAI, no team plays with this bizzare strategy where only one guy has to go hard & the rest of them can play the way they wish irrespective of match situation & demand. Maybe this has caught Up Fakhar, confused him & made him timid. Because ultimately he is also thinking about safety first, otherwise there is no other rational explanation to the way he played the last innings.

Anyways miracles obviously happen like they happened in 92 or 17 but under current skipper & his clique with their outdated timid approach I don't expect Pak to lift the wc, infact reaching knockouts is going to be a sure-fire struggle.

 

[CerebralPatriot]

Wasn't he already exposed enough last year in back to back tournaments? Isn't he one of the biggest reasons(other than his bff) why Pak couldn't ultimately clinch those titles? So what has changed since then? Was he replaced by Harris?No. Did he bring a radical change to his playing style (ala Hafeez 17-21)? No. The truth is, he is part of the clique, one of the chosen ones, a golden boy, so whether he embarrasses himself again on a major tournament or not won't change anything. As long as PCB will remain gutless & let the clique run the show nothing will change. If anything he is probably going to become your next captain!

He was and you are right things will unlikely change however the impact of being knocked out of a world cup before the semi's may just help convince even casual fans what a disaster he has been and finally bring in some kind of big changes

 

[mominsaigol]

I have to disagree with you here. What your team requires are a bunch of guys who can be impactful & decisive, technical correctness doesn't ensure match winning capacity in this era. Of course I am only talking about white ball cricket. You need to look at all the top dogs & their biggest match winners in the last 10/15 years to understand what I am trying to convey. Dhawan doesn't really possess a supreme technique compared to Fakhar, only marginally better. That didn't stop him from becoming an icc tournament monster for 6 years. Finch is another guy who had horrible technique; Warner, Roy,Hales,Head, Guptill, Taylor,Rohit, Dilshan,Gayle I could go on & on. Not a single one of these guys possess proper technique like Virat, Kane or Root. That hasn't really hindered these guys from winning match after match. White ball batting has arrived on such a state today where technique & copybook don't really matter. What matters is intent & impact.
Because Pak cricket culture is extremely outdated,timid & conservative where it's still stuck more or less with the "92" formula it becomes really difficult for players of such caliber to flourish. If you have a guy who can strike the ball powerfully & just play without fear you should get that boy in the main setup & keep encouraging him. Pak have found few of these guys. No I don't mean Asif or Khushdil,specially the latter one is horrendous, should never ever be featured again in international cricket. Harris, Ayub & Haider could have been those guys. Yes Harris is in the squad,but that's exactly where he has been since forever, when will he be allowed to play atleast 10 games freely without the anxiety of getting dropped? Why isn't Ayub already in the squad, specially considering Fakhar & Imam aren't exactly setting the world on fire these days. Finally Haider, what a horrible way of nurturing a proper talent! I know critics will say he was given opportunities which he squandered. But where did he play? A proper top order batsman was reduced to a mere finishing role at 6/7 simply because the golden boys wouldn't let go of their position.Even though he made that impressive debut as a top order batsman & all the great performances in under 19 circuit & psl which brought him into the international arena came from that same order. Just because the guy has a long handle they thought he would be the ideal finisher. After last twc if they would have rectified their errors & brought these guys in the team there is a possibility minimum one of them if not two would have already settled themselves in the main eleven.
Regarding Fakhar, I am afraid it's just not his amateur technique, sure it's one of the biggest reasons of his recent failures, but there's a bit more I feel. He is surrounded by a bunch of selfish meek accumulators who are always playing for their personal glory, stats & ranking. What's even more frightening is that those guys are never held responsible or get called out for their timid approach. Even if someone dares to raise some questions they are hounded by thousands of fans, pr, media & most unfortunately by those guys themselves. So basically they don't even have to try to improve & add another gear. Which always leaves Fakhar as the sole one responsible to take risks, to unsettle opposition from the get go. Whether he gets that start or not, the other three never try & go their merry go round way. This is absolutely not fair,this is not the way a top tier batting should function. Not just SENAI, no team plays with this bizzare strategy where only one guy has to go hard & the rest of them can play the way they wish irrespective of match situation & demand. Maybe this has caught Up Fakhar, confused him & made him timid.Because ultimately he is also thinking about safety first, otherwise there is no other rational explanation to the way he played the last innings.
Anyways miracles obviously happen like they happened in 92 or 17 but under current skipper & his clique with their outdated timid approach I don't expect Pak to lift the wc, infact reaching knockouts is going to be a surefire struggle.

The thing is, in order to strike and play at high strike rates and be impactful you need to have the shots, array of strokes and the technique aka front foot and backfoot movement to play those shots in the first place, something that is lacking with Imam.

It isn't a competition between who's technique is better or not per say. The players that you mentioned all have good technique, it's just that technique is different to kholi and Williamson.

Gayle had power, was an extremely sweet timer and he had an extremely solid backfoot play, his front foot was lacking but it didn't matter too much he made do with what he had.

The players you mentioned are technically limited, but only in certain things that don't matter too much, gayle has a weak front foot, but he can defend and his backfoot and power play allows him to pretty much hit sixes freely.

Imam on the other hand is technically limited to the point that he can't even hit a lofted shot even if his life depended on it due to having developed zero lofted strokes.

You don't need to have the perfect and most compact technique, Imam and Babar even accumulate and mostly stick to the same few shots they have, same with the players you mentioned. But you need to have a certain array of shots that fit the era of today where 300 is now on par, shots which require good technique to play

The players you mentioned had those strokes. Imam does not, and In the case of fakhar, fakhar isn't good at playing his array of shots consistently.

 

[TheSultan]

Very knee jerk reaction. Some slight adjustments may need to be made but you have 3 batters out of the top 10 in the world.

If we had people like the ones in this thread we would've lost the 2019 Champion Trophy. We had a similarly devastating loss to India in the group stages. The people in this group would've changed the whole team after that loss but guess what that team went on to win the tournament.

I won't be too surprised if a similar thing happens in this tournament. PCT is always like this. They can beat anyone and lose to anyone by any margin.

They don’t even do slight changes - that’s why a takeover is necessary.

And please - 3 players in the top 10 nonsense. Rankings are made up by a computer algorithm that utilises only the data you feed it. Hardly anyone else played as many ODIs

Rizwan has played 2 test matches in Australia with an average of 44.25 and high score of 95.

Yasir Shah has made a century in Australia. Nuff said

 

[TheSultan]

I have to disagree with you here. What your team requires are a bunch of guys who can be impactful & decisive, technical correctness doesn't ensure match winning capacity in this era. Of course I am only talking about white ball cricket. You need to look at all the top dogs & their biggest match winners in the last 10/15 years to understand what I am trying to convey. Dhawan doesn't really possess a supreme technique compared to Fakhar, only marginally better. That didn't stop him from becoming an icc tournament monster for 6 years. Finch is another guy who had horrible technique; Warner, Roy,Hales,Head, Guptill, Taylor,Rohit, Dilshan,Gayle I could go on & on. Not a single one of these guys possess proper technique like Virat, Kane or Root. That hasn't really hindered these guys from winning match after match. White ball batting has arrived on such a state today where technique & copybook don't really matter. What matters is intent & impact.
Because Pak cricket culture is extremely outdated,timid & conservative where it's still stuck more or less with the "92" formula it becomes really difficult for players of such caliber to flourish. If you have a guy who can strike the ball powerfully & just play without fear you should get that boy in the main setup & keep encouraging him. Pak have found few of these guys. No I don't mean Asif or Khushdil,specially the latter one is horrendous, should never ever be featured again in international cricket. Harris, Ayub & Haider could have been those guys. Yes Harris is in the squad,but that's exactly where he has been since forever, when will he be allowed to play atleast 10 games freely without the anxiety of getting dropped? Why isn't Ayub already in the squad, specially considering Fakhar & Imam aren't exactly setting the world on fire these days. Finally Haider, what a horrible way of nurturing a proper talent! I know critics will say he was given opportunities which he squandered. But where did he play? A proper top order batsman was reduced to a mere finishing role at 6/7 simply because the golden boys wouldn't let go of their position.Even though he made that impressive debut as a top order batsman & all the great performances in under 19 circuit & psl which brought him into the international arena came from that same order. Just because the guy has a long handle they thought he would be the ideal finisher. After last twc if they would have rectified their errors & brought these guys in the team there is a possibility minimum one of them if not two would have already settled themselves in the main eleven.
Regarding Fakhar, I am afraid it's just not his amateur technique, sure it's one of the biggest reasons of his recent failures, but there's a bit more I feel. He is surrounded by a bunch of selfish meek accumulators who are always playing for their personal glory, stats & ranking. What's even more frightening is that those guys are never held responsible or get called out for their timid approach. Even if someone dares to raise some questions they are hounded by thousands of fans, pr, media & most unfortunately by those guys themselves. So basically they don't even have to try to improve & add another gear. Which always leaves Fakhar as the sole one responsible to take risks, to unsettle opposition from the get go. Whether he gets that start or not, the other three never try & go their merry go round way. This is absolutely not fair,this is not the way a top tier batting should function. Not just SENAI, no team plays with this bizzare strategy where only one guy has to go hard & the rest of them can play the way they wish irrespective of match situation & demand. Maybe this has caught Up Fakhar, confused him & made him timid.Because ultimately he is also thinking about safety first, otherwise there is no other rational explanation to the way he played the last innings.
Anyways miracles obviously happen like they happened in 92 or 17 but under current skipper & his clique with their outdated timid approach I don't expect Pak to lift the wc, infact reaching knockouts is going to be a surefire struggle.

Love this post. Great points

 

[Third Man]

Misbah may well be a lovely person to meet in real life, and a great human being in his day to day dealings. My comment is about the cricket politics he played, and I believe he is extremely divisive in this regard.

I stick by what I say, we all witnessed how he bent over backwards to ensure Rizwan does enough to kick out Sarfaraz. He took as much time as he could to make sure Rizwan scores something meaningful to end Sarfaraz’s career.

Things were never the same after Misbah did what he did. He will be held accountable for the rest of his life for this

It's fine to criticize Rizwan and his pathetic game and attitude, but to tout Sarfaraz as some sort of savior at the tender age of 36 (official) is rather asinine.

 

[TheSultan]

The thing is, in order to strike and play at high strike rates and be impactful you need to have the shots, array of strokes and the technique aka front foot and backfoot movement to play those shots in the first place, something that is lacking with Imam.

It isn't a competition between who's technique is better or not per say. The players that you mentioned all have good technique, it's just that technique is different to kholi and Williamson.

Gayle had power, was an extremely sweet timer and he had an extremely solid backfoot play, his front foot was lacking but it didn't matter too much he made do with what he had.

The players you mentioned are technically limited, but only in certain things that don't matter too much, gayle has a weak front foot, but he can defend and his backfoot and power play allows him to pretty much hit sixes freely.

Imam on the other hand is technically limited to the point that he can't even hit a lofted shot even if his life depended on it due to having developed zero lofted strokes.

You don't need to have the perfect and most compact technique, Imam and Babar even accumulate and mostly stick to the same few shots they have, same with the players you mentioned. But you need to have a certain array of shots that fit the era of today where 300 is now on par, shots which require good technique to play

The players you mentioned had those strokes. Imam does not, and In the case of fakhar, fakhar isn't good at playing his array of shots consistently.

I think both you and @VForVendetta make fascinating arguments about technique and array of shots. I agree with you about Imam.

Brother V is correct about Saim and Haris. These guys have displayed an array of shots and good enough technique. We knew about their array of shots a year ago. What have we done to develop them? Nothing. Have we given them ample opportunities? No. I keep hearing “they are not ready, too raw”. What does that even mean? When selfish Babar had the writing on the wall in the last World Cup, and we were about to be dumped out(along with his captaincy) he finally out of desperation for something to work picked Haris. And he responded in high pressure games. Yet - he’s still “not ready”.

Immediately after the t20 World Cup, you knew you had the Asia Cup and World Cup coming up in about 10 months time. You should have set things in motion then and said to these two - we’re gonna give you all of the upcoming matches to prove yourself. We had a lot ODIs on the horizon. But what do we do, concentrate on Babar, Imam and Rizwan with a dash of chacha.

 

[mominsaigol]

I think both you and @VForVendetta make fascinating arguments about technique and array of shots. I agree with you about Imam.

Brother V is correct about Saim and Haris. These guys have displayed an array of shots and good enough technique. We knew about their array of shots a year ago. What have we done to develop them? Nothing. Have we given them ample opportunities? No. I keep hearing “they are not ready, too raw”. What does that even mean? When selfish Babar had the writing on the wall in the last World Cup, and we were about to be dumped out(along with his captaincy) he finally out of desperation for something to work picked Haris. And he responded in high pressure games. Yet - he’s still “not ready”.

Immediately after the t20 World Cup, you knew you had the Asia Cup and World Cup coming up in about 10 months time. You should have set things in motion then and said to these two - we’re gonna give you all of the upcoming matches to prove yourself. We had a lot ODIs on the horizon. But what do we do, concentrate on Babar, Imam and Rizwan with a dash of chacha.

Bro I already advocated numerous upon numerous times to bring in saim for opening and haris for finishing. Just like Rome wasn't built in a day, saim and haris ain't developing in a day.

Our forumn players expect them to come in and just be miracle workers and once they fail they will rush to drop them. People have no understanding on how it works.

Atm imam is a better player then saim due to having more experience. However unlike imam, Saim isn't technically limited. He is extremely extremely extremely compact and the moment you start giving him imam level golden boy treatment, this lad is easily surpassing imam in odi, just like Abdullah surpassed imam in test, simply because they aren't technically limited and have a variety of strokes, just lack experience. Imam is technically limited in that he can't play lofted strokes even if his life depended on it.

As for haris, Haris is technically limited in the same way imam is, haris clearly has faults, however haris doesn't lack shots, and he is a utility player that can be rotated anywhere from no 1 to 7, unlike imam who hogs the no 1 slot and can't function anywhere else. Hatis also gas a superior mindset to imam in general.

Saim is an important opener and must be developed but our management likes chicken hearted milestone obsessed accumulators ag the Top with a bits and pieces middle that is atrocious.

Saim, Abdullah, Saud, Haris and maybe Tayyab(Not sure haven't seen much, but he seems to be a genuine no 5 and not a bits and pieces agha player)

^^ These boys are key for the future. Fakhar and rizwan are hilarious, and imam and Babar are world class players. But babar and imam are world class accumulators, that require hand holding. We have mistaken them for kholi or devillers type players. Theirs a reason these boys go missing in big games and run chases. They can only contribute towards the end goal, not single handedly take you towards it like kholi can.

Our management won't develop them and will keep saying stuff like, their raw and what not, not realising development takes time. Why aren't these boys given the golden treatment?

Last but not Least about imad waseem that everyone keeps shoving statistics into me to discredit my claims.

Imad waseem is a genuine all rounder, he literally went not out scoring numerous half centuries in an England series with a 1st string side consisting of wood, plunket, rasheed, moeen Ali, Chris woakes and jofra Archer.

The reason his bowling Average is poorer then shadab and nawaz is because in 2018-2019 he was bowling to 1st string sides and England tore imad apart in their iconic 444 score, however England was tearing everyone apart.

Shadab and nawaz's averages are inflated due to 2nd string padding against weak batting line ups. Imad and shadab both played the t20 game against NZ, Shadab did nothing while imad tore apart the entire 2nd string side. We saw how nawaz functioned when he couldn't even defend 16 of the final over against India lol.

Imad is 100x the bowler and batsmen then faheem, shadab and nawaz combined. He's a genuine allrounder and he doesn't have any fitness issues, the man is gearing to go and just angry at management at this point because he ain't a Babar buddy.

 

[PakLFC]

How many times are such takeovers gonna occur!?

 

[Cricket Warrior]

Chairman: Ehsaan Mani
Cheif Selector: Wasim Akram / Shoaib Akhtar
ODI Captain: Mohammad Rizwan
T20 Captain: Shaheen Afridi
Test Captain: Shaan Msood

these are the changes which can fix most of the issues for Pakistan Cricket.

 

[saqib.rai]

Chairman: Ehsaan Mani
Cheif Selector: Wasim Akram / Shoaib Akhtar
ODI Captain: Mohammad Rizwan
T20 Captain: Shaheen Afridi
Test Captain: Shaan Msood

these are the changes which can fix most of the issues for Pakistan Cricket.

Yes exactly

Make someone test captain who has an average of 28 even after playing 30 test matches. Reasoning: he can speak English. Why not give Pakistani nationality to a gore unemployed in his country and make him captain? Would speak better English than Shan Masood

Take mediocrity to another level

 

[Cricket Warrior]

Yes exactly

Make someone test captain who has an average of 28 even after playing 30 test matches. Reasoning: he can speak English. Why not give Pakistani nationality to a gore unemployed in his country and make him captain? Would speak better English than Shan Masood

Take mediocrity to another level

Do you remember Babar's batting average in his first 20 matches?

Have you given Shaan Masood enough consistent opportunities to display his skills in the longer format?

If a guy consistently scoring runs in domestic and county cricket so it means he has the ability!

By the way shaheen and rizwan also cant speak english but the are in my list.

 

[saqib.rai]

I have to disagree with you here. What your team requires are a bunch of guys who can be impactful & decisive, technical correctness doesn't ensure match winning capacity in this era. Of course I am only talking about white ball cricket. You need to look at all the top dogs & their biggest match winners in the last 10/15 years to understand what I am trying to convey. Dhawan doesn't really possess a supreme technique compared to Fakhar, only marginally better. That didn't stop him from becoming an icc tournament monster for 6 years. Finch is another guy who had horrible technique; Warner, Roy, Hales, Head, Guptill, Taylor, Rohit, Dilshan, Gayle I could go on & on. Not a single one of these guys possess proper technique like Virat, Kane or Root. That hasn't really hindered these guys from winning match after match. White ball batting has arrived on such a state today where technique & copybook don't really matter. What matters is intent & impact.

Because Pak cricket culture is extremely outdated, timid & conservative where it's still stuck more or less with the "92" formula it becomes really difficult for players of such caliber to flourish. If you have a guy who can strike the ball powerfully & just play without fear you should get that boy in the main setup & keep encouraging him. Pak have found few of these guys. No I don't mean Asif or Khushdil, specially the latter one is horrendous, should never ever be featured again in international cricket. Harris, Ayub & Haider could have been those guys. Yes Harris is in the squad, but that's exactly where he has been since forever, when will he be allowed to play atleast 10 games freely without the anxiety of getting dropped? Why isn't Ayub already in the squad, specially considering Fakhar & Imam aren't exactly setting the world on fire these days. Finally Haider, what a horrible way of nurturing a proper talent! I know critics will say he was given opportunities which he squandered. But where did he play? A proper top order batsman was reduced to a mere finishing role at 6/7 simply because the golden boys wouldn't let go of their position. Even though he made that impressive debut as a top order batsman & all the great performances in under 19 circuit & psl which brought him into the international arena came from that same order. Just because the guy has a long handle they thought he would be the ideal finisher. After last wc if they would have rectified their errors & brought these guys in the team there is a possibility minimum one of them if not two would have already settled themselves in the main eleven.

Regarding Fakhar, I am afraid it's just not his amateur technique, sure it's one of the biggest reasons of his recent failures, but there's a bit more I feel. He is surrounded by a bunch of selfish meek accumulators who are always playing for their personal glory, stats & ranking. What's even more frightening is that those guys are never held responsible or get called out for their timid approach. Even if someone dares to raise some questions they are hounded by thousands of fans, pr, media & most unfortunately by those guys themselves. So basically they don't even have to try to improve & add another gear. Which always leaves Fakhar as the sole one responsible to take risks, to unsettle opposition from the get go. Whether he gets that start or not, the other three never try & go their merry go round way. This is absolutely not fair, this is not the way a top tier batting should function. Not just SENAI, no team plays with this bizzare strategy where only one guy has to go hard & the rest of them can play the way they wish irrespective of match situation & demand. Maybe this has caught Up Fakhar, confused him & made him timid. Because ultimately he is also thinking about safety first, otherwise there is no other rational explanation to the way he played the last innings.

Anyways miracles obviously happen like they happened in 92 or 17 but under current skipper & his clique with their outdated timid approach I don't expect Pak to lift the wc, infact reaching knockouts is going to be a sure-fire struggle.

If you look at Fakhar, Imam, Babar, Rizwan's stats in ODI Cricket- those players were really really hard to drop
So where do Saim, Haris and Haider fit?

I agree with you that those were useless runs (Imam especially) that didn't do the team any good BUT you need a very very strong captain to take such decisions.

This is why Ramiz wanted to make Babar a strong captain- so that he could take such bold decisions. However, now Ramiz is getting criticism left, right, centre for giving all authority to Babar.

Have you ever considered the argument that our toxic fans, media and ex-cricketers will not allow an environment to flourish where we look beyond stats and do what is beneficial for the team?

If Babar had dropped Imam and Fakhar before the World Cup and the results would have been similar, EVERYONE here would have been after Babar's neck.

At the end of the day, only 15 can be selected. So we would always have disagreements on who should have been selected/dropped.

But the main thing is to develop a cricketing environment where the captain/coach/selectors can make bold decisions and decisions beneficial to the team BUT SADLY toxic fans, media, ex-cricketers would never allow that to happen.

 

[saqib.rai]

Do you remember Babar's batting average in his first 20 matches?

Have you given Shaan Masood enough consistent opportunities to display his skills in the longer format?

If a guy consistently scoring runs in domestic and county cricket so it means he has the ability!

By the way shaheen and rizwan also cant speak english but the are in my list.

You need to realize that we do not play as many test matches as England/Australia/India to give a useless player 10 test matches in a go without him performing.

There are so many cricketers in First Class who are scoring consistently but hardly get a SINGLE chance. Shan Masood has got 30 TEST MATCHES. 30

Even after 30 test matches and 10 years, if you find faults in the system for your constant failures, then I do not know what to say to such an argument.