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Time to urgently develop a couple of young tall right-arm pacers - away from Domestic Cricket

Junaids

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You may be pleasantly surprised to discover that this is not a Mohammad Asif thread. Quite the opposite.

Mickey Arthur's mantra on team composition and pace bowling is well-known. This is what he wrote in his book "Taking the Mickey" about the team which toured Pakistan nine years ago:

"We had a simple plan of attack, at the centre of which were three fast bowlers who could all reach 140 km/h on a consistent basis. Kallis would be our fourth seamer, and he too was still capable of bowling at serious pace."

Modern cricket has moved on a little since then. Pitches in England have become drier due to improving drainage while in Australia and South Africa they are increasingly looking to make matches go 5 days by reducing the bounce and grassiness.

All of this has meant that fast bowlers who are tall thrive - from Hazlewood to Broad to Abbott - while shorter bowlers like Trent Boult and Mohammad Amir struggle to find a length which they cannot be hit from.

Meanwhile Pakistan has a major problem with its right-arm pacemen. The all-leftie attack failed both in England and at Brisbane, but Imran Khan and Sohail Khan just are not nearly good enough, unless having New Zealand and Australia declare on you in four consecutive Tests is viewed as "good enough".

Mickey Arthur nailed their deficits.

Sohail Khan delivers one good spell - at around 134K - then gets slower and less accurate with every successive spell.

Imran Khan is far too slow - rarely reaching 130K - but also has hopeless control of line and length. His bowling to Dave Warner in both innings at Sydney was a masterclass in bowling the wrong length.

And Mohammad Asif is not the future. He's better than they are, but a new 2 year cycle is under way, building up to England in Spring in 16 months and South Africa in 23 months' time. This is no time to go backwards.

So not only does Pakistan need to start again, they need to get moving FAST.

They are really covered for left-arm quicks, so I'm not going to go there, other than to say that Ghulam Mudassar really needs to work on his batting - 45 runs in 22 First Class innings should be considered an absolute obstacle to national selection. Pakistan needs to start being able to save Tests like Melbourne and Hamilton when the tail is at the crease.

So we are back to a need for right-arm quicks. Preferably tall ones. And they need to be quick enough and good enough with the bat and in the field.

Whoever is picked needs to be removed from the domestic scene and put in the hands of the national coaches to work on 4 domains:

Pace and fitness
Technique
Batting
Fielding

It is obvious from the atrophy of Ehsan Adil and the incompetence of Imran Khan than languishing in domestic cricket will not fix those areas in a young player. They need to go the way of Wasim Akram and Waqar Younis - removed from domestic cricket and groomed with intensive coaching and nets with the national team.

I nominated Ehsan Adil, who meets my height criteria (minimum 6'4) and has bowled in the 140's in the past and used to show signs of being a decent batsman.

[MENTION=138980]TalentSpotterPk[/MENTION] has nominated:

1) Waqas Ahmed

2) Irfanullah Shah

3) Sameen Gul

4) Mohammad Irfan Junior

Why not just skip a generation and go to them now, as soon as the Australia tour is over?

Sohail Khan is roughly the same age as Mohammad Asif, and will only get worse.

Imran Khan is never going to grow taller or to put on 15K of speed.

The destinations are clear: England in May 2018 and South Africa in December 2018.

So shouldn't Pakistan just get on with it, and move to those tall, right-arm youngsters?
 
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Why do this when the PCB can just run "talent hunts" where nothing actually happens and it generates nice headlines.
 
Why do this when the PCB can just run "talent hunts" where nothing actually happens and it generates nice headlines.

You're so well aware of how cricket works here, haha.

Talent hunts, and when the chief selector is nowhere to be seen in domestic matches.
 
You may be pleasantly surprised to discover that this is not a Mohammad Asif thread. Quite the opposite.

Mickey Arthur's mantra on team composition and pace bowling is well-known. This is what he wrote in his book "Taking the Mickey" about the team which toured Pakistan nine years ago:

"We had a simple plan of attack, at the centre of which were three fast bowlers who could all reach 140 km/h on a consistent basis. Kallis would be our fourth seamer, and he too was still capable of bowling at serious pace."

Modern cricket has moved on a little since then. Pitches in England have become drier due to improving drainage while in Australia and South Africa they are increasingly looking to make matches go 5 days by reducing the bounce and grassiness.

All of this has meant that fast bowlers who are tall thrive - from Hazlewood to Broad to Abbott - while shorter bowlers like Trent Boult and Mohammad Amir struggle to find a length which they cannot be hit from.

Meanwhile Pakistan has a major problem with its right-arm pacemen. The all-leftie attack failed both in England and at Brisbane, but Imran Khan and Sohail Khan just are not nearly good enough, unless having New Zealand and Australia declare on you in four consecutive Tests is viewed as "good enough".

Mickey Arthur nailed their deficits.

Sohail Khan delivers one good spell - at around 134K - then gets slower and less accurate with every successive spell.

Imran Khan is far too slow - rarely reaching 130K - but also has hopeless control of line and length. His bowling to Dave Warner in both innings at Sydney was a masterclass in bowling the wrong length.

And Mohammad Asif is not the future. He's better than they are, but a new 2 year cycle is under way, building up to England in Spring in 16 months and South Africa in 23 months' time. This is no time to go backwards.

So not only does Pakistan need to start again, they need to get moving FAST.

They are really covered for left-arm quicks, so I'm not going to go there, other than to say that Ghulam Mudassar really needs to work on his batting - 45 runs in 22 First Class innings should be considered an absolute obstacle to national selection. Pakistan needs to start being able to save Tests like Melbourne and Hamilton when the tail is at the crease.

So we are back to a need for right-arm quicks. Preferably tall ones. And they need to be quick enough and good enough with the bat and in the field.

Whoever is picked needs to be removed from the domestic scene and put in the hands of the national coaches to work on 4 domains:

Pace and fitness
Technique
Batting
Fielding

It is obvious from the atrophy of Ehsan Adil and the incompetence of Imran Khan than languishing in domestic cricket will not fix those areas in a young player. They need to go the way of Wasim Akram and Waqar Younis - removed from domestic cricket and groomed with intensive coaching and nets with the national team.

I nominated Ehsan Adil, who meets my height criteria (minimum 6'4) and has bowled in the 140's in the past and used to show signs of being a decent batsman.

[MENTION=138980]TalentSpotterPk[/MENTION] has nominated:

1) Waqas Ahmed

2) Irfanullah Shah

3) Sameen Gul

4) Mohammad Irfan Junior

Why not just skip a generation and go to them now, as soon as the Australia tour is over?

Sohail Khan is roughly the same age as Mohammad Asif, and will only get worse.

Imran Khan is never going to grow taller or to put on 15K of speed.

The destinations are clear: England in May 2018 and South Africa in December 2018.

So shouldn't Pakistan just get on with it, and move to those tall, right-arm youngsters?

I agree that the promising seamers need to be removed from PAK Domestic circuit because history tells us that all of our greats were developed and honed their skills in the county game.

But I would add that Pakistan needs Mohammad Asif for two reasons:

1) He never played much FC and had a 5+ year break and this means that his body can last another 4-5 years easily.

2) I have heard his speak and this guy really known the art of fast bowling and his advise would be golden for the youngsters.


I would even stick my neck out and say that post retirement he should be given a role at the NCA to work with young pacers.

Wasim "Lock your wrist and flick" is a fine mentor but not a hands-on coach which Asif can be developed into.
 
Also wanted to add that Modern Batsmen seem to be troubled by bounce (everywhere) so it makes sense to have taller bowlers in your arsenal in general
 
it all looks good on paper
and its all good to read here on PP, in reality, no one is international standard
 
it all looks good on paper
and its all good to read here on PP, in reality, no one is international standard
Mohammad Irfan has impressed the Sydney Thunder so much so that they were willing to offer him a place in their main side, but the BBL squads had already been confirmed so no such deal was allowed.
 
it all looks good on paper
and its all good to read here on PP, in reality, no one is international standard

Detached from the mediocrity of Pak Domestic Circuit and under the watch eyes of an Excellent Coach, Fitness Instructor and a Dietitian why can't they be turned into "above average" at least?


Also instead of sending them to Australia or some other high performance centre, why can't we invite someone like Ian Pont to NCA to work with 4-5 promising guys?
 
Detached from the mediocrity of Pak Domestic Circuit and under the watch eyes of an Excellent Coach, Fitness Instructor and a Dietitian why can't they be turned into "above average" at least?


Also instead of sending them to Australia or some other high performance centre, why can't we invite someone like Ian Pont to NCA to work with 4-5 promising guys?

there is alot of ifs n buts
in reality, PCB always just sits back and let things happen till someone emerge out of nowhere.
Wasim in 1985
Waqar in 1989
Shoaib in around 1996-97
PCB was just relax and enjoying things as they had got Asif & amir, but all went downhill in 2010 and after that no one came through and we are still waiting for that to happen.
Same goes with batsmen, there is no planning at all in PCB and they dont know how to groom youngsters.
 
Mohammad Irfan has impressed the Sydney Thunder so much so that they were willing to offer him a place in their main side, but the BBL squads had already been confirmed so no such deal was allowed.

lets see if they are still interested in him next year or not.
and lets see what he can do and if he ll b playing in PSL or not .
 
lets see if they are still interested in him next year or not.
and lets see what he can do and if he ll b playing in PSL or not .
He is a supplementary player for Lahore Qalandars.

Nick Cummins (Director of Sydney Thunder) was praising Irfan quite a bit.
 
He is a supplementary player for Lahore Qalandars.

Nick Cummins (Director of Sydney Thunder) was praising Irfan quite a bit.

lets see if her get game in PSL or not and IF he is able to perform against big players.

got any clips of his bowling?
 
Irfan is the only standout from that list.

I need to see Waqas bowl live to rate him.

Haven't seen much of Irfanullah. Sameen needs to learn swing and improve his pace.

Adil wasn't collapsing as much last time I saw him, don't know far he's come in his development.
 
Why do this when the PCB can just run "talent hunts" where nothing actually happens and it generates nice headlines.

it all looks good on paper
and its all good to read here on PP, in reality, no one is international standard

Detached from the mediocrity of Pak Domestic Circuit and under the watch eyes of an Excellent Coach, Fitness Instructor and a Dietitian why can't they be turned into "above average" at least?


Also instead of sending them to Australia or some other high performance centre, why can't we invite someone like Ian Pont to NCA to work with 4-5 promising guys?
My point exactly.

The talent is already identified.

But five years ago, Ehsan Adil was better than Josh Hazlewood. Pakistan needs to groom its young pace bowlers with structured coaching alongside the national team.
 
My point exactly.

The talent is already identified.

But five years ago, Ehsan Adil was better than Josh Hazlewood. Pakistan needs to groom its young pace bowlers with structured coaching alongside the national team.
Your thoughts on Mohammad Irfan?
 
You have a point, that's the exact reason I'm not too excited about Hasan Ali, he is too short to be effective and will not last long at International level. As they say, size does matter.
 
The three I think have potential are.

1 Ehsan Adil: He is tall. Seams the ball both ways and a great line and length fast medium bowler. We saw how well he bowled against NZ in UAE which had the likes of McCullum . Though he didn't get any wickets but the line n length, pace and seam was very nice.

Ideally he should have been the spearhead of pace bowling in the team by now since he debuted in 2012. But unfortunately there is no idea of grooming and developing players in Pakistan. We are taking about the nation which relies only on natural talent and abilities of a player :sigh: .

2 Mohammad Irfan : Heard a lot about him . Going by the posts here he seems to have a lot of potential. He is quite tall and should be next in line.

3 Sameen Gul : He is a good right arm seamer . He is a good line n length bowlers.He's got a good inswing delivery. He should be under consideration.

These are the 3 right arm seamers whom I have good hope about. They should be worked with a good bowling coach ( don't if there is one back in Pakistan) and should be given some chances here and there in the national team . Ehsan Adil should be in the national team from the next very series and the other two should be fast tracked into team in the next two years.
 
You have a point, that's the exact reason I'm not too excited about Hasan Ali, he is too short to be effective and will not last long at International level. As they say, size does matter.
I think that that is true of both Hasan Ali and Mohammad Amir, to be honest.

Amir is too short to be anything other than a third seamer who can bat at Number 8 and average 30 with the ball and 25 with the bat. If he thinks he will have a Wasim Akram-like career, he's a fool.

It's even worse for Hasan Ali. The only fast bowlers as short as him to make it in my 40 years of watching international cricket were Malcolm Marshall and Ryan Harris.

Someone needs to tell Hasan Ali some Home Truths. He has ZERO chance of being a Test standard fast bowler. His only hope is to reinvent himself as a batsman like the off-spinner Kevin Pietersen did and the leg-spinner Steve Smith did.

Hasan Ali needs to bat and bat and bat and bat in the nets every time he gets an ODI national team call-up. Because if he can turn himself into a guy who can average 35 with the bat and 38 with the ball, he could have a useful Test career at Number 6 (or even Number 7 if Sarfraz Ahmed moves up one slot). He would be the 4th seamer outside Asia and the 3rd seamer in Asia.
 
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Your thoughts on Mohammad Irfan?
Too promising to leave stagnating in Pakistan.

Already much faster than Imran Khan and a bit faster than Sohail Khan.

He needs to be in every single touring squad for both Pakistan and Pakistan A. Right now, today, he should be in the squad bowling in the nets to the top batsmen, and getting a proper fitness regime from the national team coaches.
 
Amir will come out good eventually, he is not short, although not tall either, and too skillful to fail. International cricket is tough and six year break is a long one. He needs more time but will be back on top.
 
If all went well, you could hope to add the following to every single touring party from now onwards:

Competing to bat at 7 and bowl as 4th seamer
Aamer Yamin
Hammad Azam

Competing to be the two right-arm fast bowlers
Mohammad Irfan Jr
Sameen Gul
Ehsan Adil
Irfanullah Shah

Just call all 6 of them up now, added to squads containing Amir, Wahab and Hasan Ali.

Give the batting, bowling, fielding and fitness coaches extensive time with them, and see who makes the grade.

We've already identified the talent. Now it needs to be worked on aggressively by the best coaches at the PCB's disposal.

Two years is not long to get someone like Sameen Gul trained up from being a rough diamond to a guy who can stand up to Quinton De Kock on the rampage at Johannesburg and then come in at 220-8 with 6 overs left and save the match.

It will require a lot of work - and it won't happen if he isn't groomed.
 
Amir will come out good eventually, he is not short, although not tall either, and too skillful to fail. International cricket is tough and six year break is a long one. He needs more time but will be back on top.
I'm not suggesting throw him out. I'm saying be realistic about his potential.

I'd love to see this team at Johannesburg at the end of next year:

6. Hammad Azam
7. Sarfraz Ahmed (c/wk)
8. Mohammad Amir (now averaging 30 with the ball and 25 with the bat).
9. Yasir Shah
10. Sameen Gul
11. Mohammad Irfan Jr
 
I would not Include Hammad, he is useless IMO.
I'm well aware that left in domestic cricket he has been bowling 125K pies.

But I'm also aware that he batted really well this season.

So I say give him and Aamer Yamin to the top coaches and see whether they can get his pace up to 135K and whether they can get his batting to improve.

Pakistan doesn't just need extra quicks. It needs a guy who can bat in the Top Six and bowl 3 x 4 over spells of decent quick bowling every day, even for figures of 12-2-35-0.

The only candidates I know are Hammad Azam and Aamer Yamin. But Yamin is too short for the bowling side of the job and also has had a terrible season with the bat.
 
I agree we should go the old fashion way in selection, don't pick fast bowlers based on stats, see the potential and pick'em. Then how about Faheem Ashraf and Imaad Butt as fast bowling all rounders compared to Yamin and Hammad ?
 
I agree we should go the old fashion way in selection, don't pick fast bowlers based on stats, see the potential and pick'em. Then how about Faheem Ashraf and Imaad Butt as fast bowling all rounders compared to Yamin and Hammad ?
Aamad isn't good enough to bat in the top eight in Test Cricket and Fahim doesn't have the pace to trouble any batsman.
 
My point exactly.

The talent is already identified.

But five years ago, Ehsan Adil was better than Josh Hazlewood. Pakistan needs to groom its young pace bowlers with structured coaching alongside the national team.

thats rite, before his FC debut :rosco:91::91:
 
I think that that is true of both Hasan Ali and Mohammad Amir, to be honest.

Amir is too short to be anything other than a third seamer who can bat at Number 8 and average 30 with the ball and 25 with the bat. If he thinks he will have a Wasim Akram-like career, he's a fool.

It's even worse for Hasan Ali. The only fast bowlers as short as him to make it in my 40 years of watching international cricket were Malcolm Marshall and Ryan Harris.

Someone needs to tell Hasan Ali some Home Truths. He has ZERO chance of being a Test standard fast bowler. His only hope is to reinvent himself as a batsman like the off-spinner Kevin Pietersen did and the leg-spinner Steve Smith did.

Hasan Ali needs to bat and bat and bat and bat in the nets every time he gets an ODI national team call-up. Because if he can turn himself into a guy who can average 35 with the bat and 38 with the ball, he could have a useful Test career at Number 6 (or even Number 7 if Sarfraz Ahmed moves up one slot). He would be the 4th seamer outside Asia and the 3rd seamer in Asia.

As I said a few week so go, If anyone thinks that Hasan Ali is the answer than I am not sure about what the question is.
 
You're so well aware of how cricket works here, haha.

Talent hunts, and when the chief selector is nowhere to be seen in domestic matches.
what are you talking about bro? our chief selectors are always present in the final.:inzi
 
a board and team management that couldn't find better back up bowlers for Amir and Asif than the likes of IK,Sohail and Rahat and Amir walked into the team straight away after suffering 6 years of ban because there wasn't anyone better than him...this OP sounds like too much for PCB and their great team.
 
When the likes of Mohammad Akram are in the NCA you don't have any hope for improvements for the fast bowlers going there.
 
You can not develop bowlers like this , the players need to play competitive cricket and learn the art of bowling. You can not develop them in nets and in laboratories. There is no short cut , the only answer is the overhauling of the system. The pitches where fast bowlers must work hard to average below 25 , we are only pointing out fast bowlers here what about the spinners? The pitches on which we play our domestic don't have anything for spinners. Look at the stats of spinners this year. Your idea has excited a many here but this wont bear any results at all.
 
As [MENTION=57110]JibranAnsari[/MENTION] said, you will end up with a bunch of divas with inflated egos and no ability to soak up pressure when they start getting smashed in their first competitive match. Not only that, but you want to throw them straight into the fire against England/South Africa where 140 km/h will get you sprayed to all parts of the ballpark. In this age of T20, international teams don't fear 140.
 
what are you talking about bro? our chief selectors are always present in the final.:inzi

I saw Inzi at Gaddafi during the QeA Trophy when I watched parts of one of the D/N games that was telecast during every round.

I highly doubt he goes around announcing where he is going, though. And there's multiple games that happen at the same time, I don't believe he can be at four places at once.
 
This guy looks very tall, how tall is he? - Is he playing FC... Now NCA and those millions of support stuff should develop guy like him, otherwise what is the point of that academy.
Yes he's played FC cricket, is also a supplementary player for LQ.
 

Yes he's played FC cricket, is also a supplementary player for LQ.

I would have taken him to AUS, as long as he can bowl 20 overs a day(speed does not matter 125 will do),he could not bowl worse than avg of 70 and ECO of 7, he is tall, can get something out of the good and full length...Even Bird had a funny action and only 125k pace...Every time we go to AUS, 6'5" tall medium pacers take all the wickets bowling at 130, this time it was HW and Bird, when we will learn...

Pakistan should think out of the box, this 12-0 in 20 years is not going to get over by run of the mill medium pacers, who barely touch 6' :facepalm:
 
I would have taken him to AUS, as long as he can bowl 20 overs a day(speed does not matter 125 will do),he could not bowl worse than avg of 70 and ECO of 7, he is tall, can get something out of the good and full length...Even Bird had a funny action and only 125k pace...Every time we go to AUS, 6'5" tall medium pacers take all the wickets bowling at 130, this time it was HW and Bird, when we will learn...

Pakistan should think out of the box, this 12-0 in 20 years is not going to get over by run of the mill medium pacers, who barely touch 6' :facepalm:
He's to raw for international selection, currently. Has a few technical glitches in his bowling, if rectified he would have the potential to bowl 140 kph+.
 
Blame people like Basit Ali who are allowing under 6ft and below 140k pacers through to U19 and domestic. They really have no clue what they are doing do they. Spend all their lives playing catch up then still end up behind the curve.
 
Don't really understand this thread or the posts on here. Looks like we have moved on from the obsession with pace to a new obsession - height. Let's be serious here guys, 5'10 onwards is a pretty good height to bowl fast. Dale Steyn is your best and most recent example. What these guys really lack is fitness and ability. We've had Irfan who towers over everyone in the stadium go wicket less time and again, why? Because of poor fitness and ability.

I remember Bhatti. He was an okayish bowler despite his height and it was his lack of ability that brought him down, not height.
 
Blame people like Basit Ali who are allowing under 6ft and below 140k pacers through to U19 and domestic. They really have no clue what they are doing do they. Spend all their lives playing catch up then still end up behind the curve.

What world are you in Bro? They look at stats and fitness. If a guy is picking up wickets and looks fit enough to bowl long spells, then why not select him.. Also your comment is pretty baseless considering most guys selected for Under 19's are still growing. Not just in Pakistan, everywhere in the world.
 
Don't really understand this thread or the posts on here. Looks like we have moved on from the obsession with pace to a new obsession - height. Let's be serious here guys, 5'10 onwards is a pretty good height to bowl fast. Dale Steyn is your best and most recent example. What these guys really lack is fitness and ability. We've had Irfan who towers over everyone in the stadium go wicket less time and again, why? Because of poor fitness and ability.

I remember Bhatti. He was an okayish bowler despite his height and it was his lack of ability that brought him down, not height.

You need to reread what Junaids had written. The height affects the length of the delivery and when the pacer is rubbish this is amplified.

He is totally right we have lost our way of knowing what the right fit is for a fast bowler.

Nobody is saying Irfan height because that is abnormally too tall for an athlete.

Either bowl really fast or have tremendous ability and be under 6ft or be 6-6'4 and above 140ks.

How often does a Steyn come about? Its so rare so your argument is weak just like the coaches and selectors in Pakistan.
 
What world are you in Bro? They look at stats and fitness. If a guy is picking up wickets and looks fit enough to bowl long spells, then why not select him.. Also your comment is pretty baseless considering most guys selected for Under 19's are still growing. Not just in Pakistan, everywhere in the world.
Nobody looks purely at statistics when selecting a player.

Statistics are mere indicator that allows the selectors to know whether a talented player is doing well or/and in form.
 
They don't have to be tall. They just need to be able to bowl both lengths with equal effectiveness i.e. short, short of a length and full when the situation demands it. You cannot be one dimensional
 
Shoaib was only 6 feet, that is not very tall at all for a fast bowler but he had a good fast yorker, good fast short of a length ball, a fast bouncer, the batsman knew he could bowl any delivery every time and it made him more effective.

In contrast Amir just bowls short of a length or full, he does not have an effective bouncer and neither does he use it frequently.
 
Shoaib was only 6 feet, that is not very tall at all for a fast bowler but he had a good fast yorker, good fast short of a length ball, a fast bouncer, the batsman knew he could bowl any delivery every time and it made him more effective.

In contrast Amir just bowls short of a length or full, he does not have an effective bouncer and neither does he use it frequently.

Stop mentioning once in a generation type bowlers. You might as well start talking about Malcolm Marshall.

We are talking about a constant supply of pacers to pick from. We might get the Shoaib or Waqar or Steyn every 2 decades but day to day we need to decide the criteria for a fast bowler.
 
These suggestions are too idealistic for Pakistan. These could be good for any country where Board plan things for future, selectors and administration care for the players and the country's reputation , they do the job what they are paid for , no for Pakistan.
 
Shoaib was only 6 feet, that is not very tall at all for a fast bowler but he had a good fast yorker, good fast short of a length ball, a fast bouncer, the batsman knew he could bowl any delivery every time and it made him more effective.

In contrast Amir just bowls short of a length or full, he does not have an effective bouncer and neither does he use it frequently.

Nope. He is 5'10" or 5'11" and an exception to the rule. If you have someone that height and able to bowl 155KM+ in Domestics lets us know.
 
The biggest problem that Pakistan cricket has is the WICKETS we produce for domestic cricket.... which are dead..... Pakistan players only know how to play on dead wickets.... take an example now in Australia on fast wickets the players dont now how to bat and bowl on these wickets .... the batsmen cannot bat consistantly and the bowlers have no idea how to bowl on fast wickets... Pakistan need to make fast bouncy tracks in domestic cricket so the players are able to learn how to play on these tracks.....
 
Stop mentioning once in a generation type bowlers. You might as well start talking about Malcolm Marshall.

We are talking about a constant supply of pacers to pick from. We might get the Shoaib or Waqar or Steyn every 2 decades but day to day we need to decide the criteria for a fast bowler.

Irfan is more or less equal to any other bowler on flat wickets in the subcontinent. We need bowlers who can succeed in all conditions
 
Shoaib was only 6 feet, that is not very tall at all for a fast bowler but he had a good fast yorker, good fast short of a length ball, a fast bouncer, the batsman knew he could bowl any delivery every time and it made him more effective.

In contrast Amir just bowls short of a length or full, he does not have an effective bouncer and neither does he use it frequently.

Shoalb and Waqar were not 6', they were 5'10" or 11", both of them had really poor record in AUS, avg of 45 or so....In 1999, at his peak Shoiab had taken only 6 wickets in test series... They both were phenomenal else where except AUS, there height has something to do with it...Where as Akram was 6'3", he was able to lift the ball at fuller length and was successful with avg of 23/24...

You have to lift the ball at fuller length, there is very little lateral movement, lifting delivery at good and full length causes edges, other option is good heavy ball, that again is lifting short ball, like Johnson and Thomo to unsettle the batsmen...

Every series we loose by bunch of tall medium pacers to Auses, this time it was HW and Bird...Have you ever seen a short pacer in AUS team?? - There is a reason for that...Also, WI was sweeping AUS with tall fast bowlers, they were able to finish test in Perth in 3 days, there was a time AUS stopped scheduling test in Perth with WI...What was Ambrose figures in Perth 1/7, yes Seven wickets with one run, you can go can check, it was not seaming but lifting the ball from full length that was making batsmen really uncomfortable...For that you need height...
 
Shoalb and Waqar were not 6', they were 5'10" or 11", both of them had really poor record in AUS, avg of 45 or so....In 1999, at his peak Shoiab had taken only 6 wickets in test series... They both were phenomenal else where except AUS, there height has something to do with it...Where as Akram was 6'3", he was able to lift the ball at fuller length and was successful with avg of 23/24...

You have to lift the ball at fuller length, there is very little lateral movement, lifting delivery at good and full length causes edges, other option is good heavy ball, that again is lifting short ball, like Johnson and Thomo to unsettle the batsmen...

Every series we loose by bunch of tall medium pacers to Auses, this time it was HW and Bird...Have you ever seen a short pacer in AUS team?? - There is a reason for that...Also, WI was sweeping AUS with tall fast bowlers, they were able to finish test in Perth in 3 days, there was a time AUS stopped scheduling test in Perth with WI...What was Ambrose figures in Perth 1/7, yes Seven wickets with one run, you can go can check, it was not seaming but lifting the ball from full length that was making batsmen really uncomfortable...For that you need height...

Shoaib has 2 five wicket hauls in tests in Australia and has won an ODI Series for Pakistan in Australia, he used to get very good bounce in Australia.
 
Pitches in Pakistan needs to improve and work on technique rather other things.


If someone knows some players and pointed them out then we just simply need to work out the plan. but who will?
 
To be fair we have far better prospects than what we had after Asif/Amir ban , we now have atleast 3 bowlers capable of bowling in excess of 145k (Atif Jabbar , Adeel Khan and Ghulam Mudasser) then couple of bowlers who can really make the ball talk (Waqas Ahmed , Ehtasham Sultan) and then the usual domestic bullies like M.Abbas , Sadaf Hussain , Mir Humza , Shahzad Azam who perform season after season.
 
One thing that strikes my mind is why Pak domestic batters have abysmal technique even after playing on such underprepared pitches where the ball seams all day? surely they must have learn how to survive on such pitches by now but yet we still see them getting out while defending.
 
Key ingredient for becoming a decent Test prospect is your typical right arm fast-med outswing bowler capable of hitting 140ks regularly.
 
Saw a bit of Ahmad Bashir in today's televised match of National OD Cup. He looks a good bowler. He gets some good inswing on some deliveries and also moves it a bit the other way. He has a good fast run-up and I think a good speed to begin with.

He needs to work on his follow through and increase his speed. He has the ingredients to become a good fast bowler.
 
Saw a bit of Ahmad Bashir in today's televised match of National OD Cup. He looks a good bowler. He gets some good inswing on some deliveries and also moves it a bit the other way. He has a good fast run-up and I think a good speed to begin with.

He needs to work on his follow through and increase his speed. He has the ingredients to become a good fast bowler.

And just to add , he looks very enthusiastic with his bowling. He hits the deck hard and hasn't got a lazy attitude like Rahat.
 
We have a lot of left arm bowlers. Need some right arm bowlers who can hit the deck for vartiey.
 
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