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US State Dept. places Pakistan on special watch list for 'severe violations of religious freedom'

Abdullah719

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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">JUST IN: U.S. State Department places Pakistan on special watch list for severe violations of religious freedom <a href="https://t.co/sjopa3KkFi">pic.twitter.com/sjopa3KkFi</a></p>— Reuters Pakistan (@ReutersPakistan) <a href="https://twitter.com/ReutersPakistan/status/948927068254818305?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">January 4, 2018</a></blockquote>
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The so-called 'major non-NATO ally' better put its foot down and cut its ties with the United States in the next 6 months.

The latter will be back with a begging bowl, I guarantee you.
 
Is it really unjustified though? The motives behind such a move and the timing can be questioned but are we really going to pretend that Pakistan doesn't belong on a list of countries that systematically institute egregious violations of religious freedoms?

As much as there is to be said about the hypocrisy of the US putting Pakistan on this watchlist, or why it's only being done now (if the US was principled, Pakistan would have been on this watchlist since at least 1973 or the day this watchlist began, whichever happened later. What I'm more interested in is whether or not there's going to be any follow up since Saudi Arabia seems to be on that list and that doesn't seem to have made any difference.
 
Pakistaniyoon abhi bhi waqt hai jaag jao



They are building a narrative against Pakistan like they did against Iraq, Syria, Libya etc etc etc. Unfortunate for the US those countries didn't have the sixth biggest armed forces on the planet and were nuclear armed, plus they did not have the backing of China who have massive stakes in Pakistan and can't see it fail.
 
Is it really unjustified though? The motives behind such a move and the timing can be questioned but are we really going to pretend that Pakistan doesn't belong on a list of countries that systematically institute egregious violations of religious freedoms?

I think that has been debated ad-nauseum and there may or may not be reasonable consensus that it is, but it's one thing if the United Nations come out with such a statement and watchlist, and it's another when the conniving US of A do the same, the timing notwithstanding.
 
The so-called 'major non-NATO ally' better put its foot down and cut its ties with the United States in the next 6 months.

The latter will be back with a begging bowl, I guarantee you.

Saudis are on the list too, doesn't mean anything I reckon. But you're right about the begging bowl.
 
I think that has been debated ad-nauseum and there may or may not be reasonable consensus that it is, but it's one thing if the United Nations come out with such a statement and watchlist, and it's another when the conniving US of A do the same, the timing notwithstanding.

That's sort of my point. We can question the timing of this move or the moral standing of the US to point fingers at other countries over human rights violations, and there's some good points to be made for both sides of the argument. What can not, however, be disputed is that purely based on facts and merit, Pakistan does belong on a list of countries that suppress religious freedom.
 
Well they're right.

What the practical consequences are of such a move I don't know.
 
Is it really unjustified though? The motives behind such a move and the timing can be questioned but are we really going to pretend that Pakistan doesn't belong on a list of countries that systematically institute egregious violations of religious freedoms?

As much as there is to be said about the hypocrisy of the US putting Pakistan on this watchlist, or why it's only being done now (if the US was principled, Pakistan would have been on this watchlist since at least 1973 or the day this watchlist began, whichever happened later. What I'm more interested in is whether or not there's going to be any follow up since Saudi Arabia seems to be on that list and that doesn't seem to have made any difference.

I think putting Pakistan in this list is justified. But India should be in this list even before Pakistan. We all know how bad the minorities conditions are in India way worst than Pakistan. But India is not in this list and Pakistan is and that makes this list lost all its significance which is a shame.
 
Well they're right.

What the practical consequences are of such a move I don't know.

Wasnt it the Yanks and their pink faced President who banned entry from numerous Muslim nations? These hypocrites aren't the worlds policemen and especially not any moral authority, ignore the clowns of US government.
 
Pakistaniyoon abhi bhi waqt hai jaag jao



They are building a narrative against Pakistan like they did against Iraq, Syria, Libya etc etc etc. Unfortunate for the US those countries didn't have the sixth biggest armed forces on the planet and were nuclear armed, plus they did not have the backing of China who have massive stakes in Pakistan and can't see it fail.

Sir maazrat kay saath yeh woh Begh***t hain jo galiyan bhi daingay siyasat danoon ko aur vote bhi uni chamaron ko day ker elect bhi kerwadetay hain.
 
I think putting Pakistan in this list is justified. But India should be in this list even before Pakistan. We all know how bad the minorities conditions are in India way worst than Pakistan. But India is not in this list and Pakistan is and that makes this list lost all its significance which is a shame.

This sort of bickering from Pakistan about Indians, and from Indians about Pakistanis is what will give this supposed watch-list more importance than it deserves.
 
I think putting Pakistan in this list is justified. But India should be in this list even before Pakistan. We all know how bad the minorities conditions are in India way worst than Pakistan. But India is not in this list and Pakistan is and that makes this list lost all its significance which is a shame.

Like I've always maintained, India is essentially Pakistan on steroids so yeah, they should be on the list. They're not on it for the same reason we weren't until now - they're on good terms with the US. This isn't necessarily an exhaustive list of countries that suppress religious freedom, it's a list of a few such countries that aren't on good terms with the US and are resisting US attempts to strongarm them.
 
Like I've always maintained, India is essentially Pakistan on steroids so yeah, they should be on the list. They're not on it for the same reason we weren't until now - they're on good terms with the US. This isn't necessarily an exhaustive list of countries that suppress religious freedom, it's a list of a few such countries that aren't on good terms with the US and are resisting US attempts to strongarm them.

Why should anybody be on any such list made up by the US? I dont understand why people see the US has some sort of God like body who can judge others?
 
Anyone tried practising Islam openly in Texas, I thought so

You have muslim bans
Obama accused on being Muslim throughout his presidency
Muslim women on playboy
 
I think its a dominating thing, in the past the Yanks have got whatever they pleased from Pakistan but now Pakistan said no.

Pakistan never wanted to join the USA war on terror, but they were threatened with " we will bomb you back to the stone ages". Pakistan had no choice to join.

Now after 17 years of bombing, nothing has been achieved apart from more extremism in Afghanistan, even puppets of usa Karzai admit this, the taliban is gaining back their territory, Helmand which the USA conquered is back in Taliban hands.

Apart from wasting billions what has USA achieved in 17 years? Now they trying to lay all the blame on Pakistan for their incompetence.

I for one are ever grateful to AQ Khan who built Pakistan's nuclear weapon and China who has invested massively in the country. Im convinced USA will play a dirty game with Pakistan from North and the South. Indian has 10 consulates in Afghanistan and have no Indians living there, why on earth have they got 10 consulates?

Those yanks will try to suffocate our economy with sanctions we will need to be vigilant...
 
Why should anybody be on any such list made up by the US? I dont understand why people see the US has some sort of God like body who can judge others?

The US can make a list of anything it wants to serve as a tool of foreign policy, just like any other country can (for instance, China started making a yearly report of the human rights situation in the US after years of the US doing the same to them). Pakistan can also make a list of countries it doesn't like if it wants to.
 
Anyone tried practising Islam openly in Texas, I thought so

You have muslim bans
Obama accused on being Muslim throughout his presidency
Muslim women on playboy

Yeah, islam is practiced openly here. You can see some Muslims praying in public too.
 
The US can make a list of anything it wants to serve as a tool of foreign policy, just like any other country can (for instance, China started making a yearly report of the human rights situation in the US after years of the US doing the same to them). Pakistan can also make a list of countries it doesn't like if it wants to.

Exactly, their opinion and meaningless.
 
Exactly, their opinion and meaningless.
While it's just an opinion, it's an opinion of a state whose opinions tend to carry a lot of weight on the international stage so unlike the opinion of, say, Bhutan or Namibia, the US' opinions can have consequences for smaller, weaker nations like Pakistan.
 
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Is it really unjustified though? The motives behind such a move and the timing can be questioned but are we really going to pretend that Pakistan doesn't belong on a list of countries that systematically institute egregious violations of religious freedoms?

As much as there is to be said about the hypocrisy of the US putting Pakistan on this watchlist, or why it's only being done now (if the US was principled, Pakistan would have been on this watchlist since at least 1973 or the day this watchlist began, whichever happened later. What I'm more interested in is whether or not there's going to be any follow up since Saudi Arabia seems to be on that list and that doesn't seem to have made any difference.

So very true, in fact, I heard the US signed the biggest arms deal in American history with the KSA recently.

You wanna know why..........

ARAMCO

'Nuff said

As far as Pakistan "deserving" that watchlist or not. I don't agree on that one. We're not restricting people to the point KSA does (believe me, I know what I'm saying).
 
So very true, in fact, I heard the US signed the biggest arms deal in American history with the KSA recently.

You wanna know why..........

ARAMCO

'Nuff said
Not so much Aramco as the hundreds of billions of Saudi sovereign wealth fund dollars invested in US markets.
As far as Pakistan "deserving" that watchlist or not. I don't agree on that one. We're not restricting people to the point KSA does (believe me, I know what I'm saying).

KSA is not the standard, it's an extreme case. Pakistan is still one of the worst countries in the world in terms of religious freedom. Take it from a Pakistani non Muslim who has had to pretend to be a Muslim for the better part of the last five years living in Paksitan.
 
Pakistaniyoon abhi bhi waqt hai jaag jao



They are building a narrative against Pakistan like they did against Iraq, Syria, Libya etc etc etc. Unfortunate for the US those countries didn't have the sixth biggest armed forces on the planet and were nuclear armed, plus they did not have the backing of China who have massive stakes in Pakistan and can't see it fail.

dont be delusional.

war must be approved by the congress and with an election year, no such measure will be taken.

if anything, examine the violation of human rights in pakistan and take measures to prevent it.
 
An Afghani-Hindi mutt knows more than me about pakistan apparently lol.


How would you feel if your 80 years old grandfather was jailed for 8 years in prison because of selling copies of Quran & Hadith to his Sect followers ? ?


Open your eyes. Everything is not about Politics or India Pakistan animosity.


Pakistan's foreign minister has admitted it on Geo News as to why USA has put Pakistan on this watch list. Watch " Aaj Shahzaib Khanzada K Saath 05-01-2018 program 17:32 min to 17:42 min "



Pakistan is signatory of The Universal Declaration of Human Rights.


The Universal Declaration of Human Rights which was adopted without dissenting vote by the General Assembly of the United Nations in 1948, states in Article 18 :


"Everyone has the right to freedom of thought, conscience and religion; this right includes freedom to change his religion or belief, and freedom, either alone on in community with others and in public or private, to manifest his religion or belief in teaching, practice, worship and observance."


This fundamental human right has been incorporated in the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights and has been reaffirmed by the Declaration on the Elimination of All Forms of Intolerance and Discrimination Based on Religion or Belief that was approved by the General Assembly of the United Nations in 1981.



When Pakistan is signatory of this than it is a binding on Pakistan.



Even India is kept into 2nd tier (for a reason)




Moreover this hasn't happened overnight. US has been observing Pakistan for last 19 years wrt The International Religious Freedom Act of 1998 (IRFA)



Cc
[MENTION=53290]Markhor[/MENTION] [MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION] [MENTION=26195]DW44[/MENTION] [MENTION=135038]Major[/MENTION]
 
State Department Names the World’s Worst Violators of Religious Freedom


WASHINGTON, D.C. – The U.S. Commission on International Religious Freedom (USCIRF) welcomed the State Department’s naming of “Countries of Particular Concern” (CPCs) for severe religious freedom violations. This group comprises nations that violate religious freedom in a “systematic, ongoing, egregious” manner and includes Burma, China, Eritrea, Iran, North Korea, Saudi Arabia, Sudan, Tajikistan, Turkmenistan, and Uzbekistan.

USCIRF’s Chairman Daniel Mark said that “The designation of these countries is a key step in ensuring continued U.S. engagement in support of international religious freedom. Although USCIRF agrees with the 10 countries on the State Department’s list, it does not go far enough. Secretary Tillerson should have also designated the Central African Republic, Nigeria, Pakistan, Russia, Syria, and Vietnam.”


The State Department also, for the first time, announced its “Special Watch List” -- a new category created by the Frank R. Wolf International Religious Freedom Act of 2016. The Special Watch List is for countries that engage in or tolerate severe violations of religious freedom but may not rise to the level of CPC. The department placed only Pakistan on this list.

Chairman Mark said that “Pakistan continues to harass its religious minorities, has state-sanctioned discrimination against groups such as the Ahmadis, and tolerates extra-judicial violence in the guise of opposing blasphemy. As USCIRF has said for many years, Pakistan should be designated by the State Department as a CPC. Given the strong stance that President Trump has taken on Pakistan recently, the failure to designate Pakistan as a CPC this year comes as a surprise and disappointment.”

USCIRF commends Secretary of State Rex Tillerson for the excellent statement he made accompanying the August release of the State Department’s International Religious Freedom Report. There, he stated that religious freedom is a “core American value…and universal human right,” commenting further that it is a “human rights priority” for the Trump Administration. USCIRF was highly encouraged by his words and urges the Secretary of State to make additional CPC designations consistent with that bold and forceful statement.

The International Religious Freedom Act of 1998 (IRFA) mandated that the State Department make CPC designations and that USCIRF provide the department recommendations on which countries should be on the list. In April 2017, USCIRF recommended that 16 countries be designated CPCs: Burma, Central African Republic, China, Eritrea, Iran, Nigeria, North Korea, Pakistan, Russia, Saudi Arabia, Sudan, Syria, Tajikistan, Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan, and Vietnam.

The Frank Wolf Act also required designations for non-state actors engaged in particularly severe religious freedom violations as “entities of particular concern” (EPCs). In April 2017, USCIRF recommended that the Administration designate the following entities as EPCs: the Islamic State of Iraq and Syria (ISIS) in Iraq and Syria; the Taliban in Afghanistan; and al-Shabaab in Somalia. The Administration did not make its EPC designations at this time, but USCIRF looks forward to working with the White House and the State Department on expeditiously identifying EPCs and the tools to use against them.


http://www.uscirf.gov/news-room/pre...the-world-s-worst-violators-religious-freedom
 
While it's just an opinion, it's an opinion of a state whose opinions tend to carry a lot of weight on the international stage so unlike the opinion of, say, Bhutan or Namibia, the US' opinions can have consequences for smaller, weaker nations like Pakistan.
.

Explain please? In reality what can the US do to Pakistan? What weight can the apply which will make an iota of difference to Pakistan? Talk is cheap.
 
Explain please? In reality what can the US do to Pakistan? What weight can the apply which will make an iota of difference to Pakistan? Talk is cheap.

Economic sanctions for starters. The last thing Pakistan needs right now is a targeted attack at the economy. Pakistan barely survived the sanctions in the 90s which were imposed when Pakistan was on relatively more stable economic footing. Sanctions now could be absolutely ruinous.
 
Economic sanctions for starters. The last thing Pakistan needs right now is a targeted attack at the economy. Pakistan barely survived the sanctions in the 90s which were imposed when Pakistan was on relatively more stable economic footing. Sanctions now could be absolutely ruinous.

Any economic sanctions would have to go through the UNSC which will then be vetoed by China.
 
Yeah, islam is practiced openly here. You can see some Muslims praying in public too.

I could put down endless links from YouTube where American Muslims get intimidated by racist Americans

Most Islamiphobia especially British I.e the edl and Britain first are either funded by Americans or have their roots in American trumping ideology

Fox News is the biggest ** on tv and makes daily mail look like Dennis the menace
You have hijabis going on with American flags as hijabs as some kind of apology for being Muslim
 
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Like I've always maintained, India is essentially Pakistan on steroids so yeah, they should be on the list. They're not on it for the same reason we weren't until now - they're on good terms with the US. This isn't necessarily an exhaustive list of countries that suppress religious freedom, it's a list of a few such countries that aren't on good terms with the US and are resisting US attempts to strongarm them.

So Pakistan will do enough to get back on good terms with America. A few raids here, a few speeches there. A deal with Russia, a deal with China, maybe a couple of deals with Iran and Saudi Arabia, and life will go on with everyone happy. Fantastic.
 
Does US care about any religion other than Christianity? I believe this list will have a strong bias against nations where christians are either persecuted, or evangelism is prohibited.
 
Does US care about any religion other than Christianity? I believe this list will have a strong bias against nations where christians are either persecuted, or evangelism is prohibited.

Judaism may also be held dear in the USA, although this my own personal belief based on nothing more than conspiracy bias, possibly inherited through Pakistani genetics.
 
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