Virat Kohli won 39 of first 50 matches as ODI capt: Joint highest with Clive Lloyd and Ricky Ponting

[AMSS]

It's KulCha not YuKu

ChaKu it is.

 

[BlackShadow]

ChaKu it is.

Ku>>>>Cha

So, Kulcha it is.

 

[Bhaijaan]

ChaKu it is.

I like Chaku more.

Thanks.

Chaku it is from now on.

 

[big_gamer007]

Lloyd was not so much innovative as diplomatic.

His lasting legacy was creating a unified locker room that learned to put aside tribal/island differences.

Nope ask anyone about Clive Lloyd and more than 95% would remember him for winning world cups..

Only the die hard cricket fans remember Lloyd for creating fast bowlers and the readers amongst those die hard like yourself remember him of creating harmony in dressing room..

My original post said the same if kohli wants to be remembered as great captain he needs to win WC.. is simple..

People remember Martin Crowe for World Cup 1992 using spinner.
Ranatunga for winning WC.
Steve Waugh for 99 WC
IK for 92 win
Lloyd for 75 and 79
Kapil for 83
Ponting for multiple WC win
Border for 87
Dhoni for 2011 and 2007(amongst Indians)

No doubt these captains have achieved more things but they were immortalised when they won the WC.. That is what kohl needs to do win 2019 WC to be immortalised amongst cricket captains.. These records don’t matter..

If you ask cricket fans about ganugkynwinning 16-17 matches during the super sub rule or India’s winning streak under Dravid I think don’t think many people will remember those things.. Similarly 40/51 matches no one will remember few years down the line.

 

[Madplayer]

This guy is not that good tactically. Even if you watched his on field captaincy today you would know.

 

[Plumb]

What happened to the best captai? Lol couldn’t figure out 4 or 5 fielders in circle? Looked panicked on field isn’t it? Now the arguments ll be oo what can he do of bowlers leak runs

 

[Madplayer]

What happened to the best captai? Lol couldn’t figure out 4 or 5 fielders in circle? Looked panicked on field isn’t it? Now the arguments ll be oo what can he do of bowlers leak runs

Most people are making tons of excuses for his on field ineptness as a tactician and leader who holds the team together when the chips are down. He is an average captain with a gun batting line up and the best bowling attack ever for India. He will win a lot of matches, only few because of his captaincy skills.

 

[The_Odd_One]

His blind fans can call him the best captain when he stops running to Dhoni for everything.

 

[Ab Fan]

Faf
Morgan
Kane

Three current captains which are better than Kohli irrespective of result Kohli is producing.

 

[ManFan]

Faf
Morgan
Kane

Three current captains which are better than Kohli irrespective of result Kohli is producing.

Kane and Morgan are average with Morgan lucky to have a great batting line-up.

Faf is tactically very capable but has a shady past when it comes to winning.

 

[Ab Fan]

Kane and Morgan are average with Morgan lucky to have a great batting line-up.

Faf is tactically very capable but has a shady past when it comes to winning.

Both Kane and Morgan are much better tacticians than Kohli.

Morgan is a brilliant, brilliant captain and is one of the reason why he is having a place in England team.

 

[The_Odd_One]

Faf
Morgan
Kane

Three current captains which are better than Kohli irrespective of result Kohli is producing.

Sarfraz is also far better than Kohli. His bowling changes and on field tactics are brilliant.

 

[Ab Fan]

Sarfraz is also far better than Kohli. His bowling changes and on field tactics are brilliant.

Yes, I forgot Sarfaraz as well. He doesnt have the personality and charm of a leader but a much better tactician than Kohli.

 

[ManFan]

Both Kane and Morgan are much better tacticians than Kohli.

Morgan is a brilliant, brilliant captain and is one of the reason why he is having a place in England team.

Agree with the first statement. Kohli is not a great captain like Smith and is simply there because no one can merit the top spot like the best performer in the XI. However, that is not all there is to captaincy, as it is multi-dimensional.

Morgan is a fine captain but calling him brilliant is a little much. Any LOI captain after Cook can seem brilliant just like anyone following Azhar Ali can seem God-send.

However, unlike Morgan, Sarfraz has shown his ability to handle mountains of pressure, even if in between his form has suffered and the occasional defeat such as the 0-5 against NZ.

Morgan is a probably the best LOI captain after Kohli. However, his on-field leadership leaves a lot to be desired. For all of England’s success at home and now abroad (9-1 against AUS in the last seven months), they suffer from a lack of inspiration and mental strength, that which has been their not-so-hidden kryptonite.

 

[The_Odd_One]

Yes, I forgot Sarfaraz as well. He doesnt have the personality and charm of a leader but a much better tactician than Kohli.

Sarfraz is a very charismatic leader. There is a reason that from Shafiq to Shadab, all of his teammates look up to him. He's also very supportive of youngsters. He has poor communication skills and does not have a rockstar look but we don't need that from him. Afridi had those things and he was a poor captain.

 

[ManFan]

Nope ask anyone about Clive Lloyd and more than 95% would remember him for winning world cups..

Only the die hard cricket fans remember Lloyd for creating fast bowlers and the readers amongst those die hard like yourself remember him of creating harmony in dressing room..

My original post said the same if kohli wants to be remembered as great captain he needs to win WC.. is simple..

People remember Martin Crowe for World Cup 1992 using spinner.
Ranatunga for winning WC.
Steve Waugh for 99 WC
IK for 92 win
Lloyd for 75 and 79
Kapil for 83
Ponting for multiple WC win
Border for 87
Dhoni for 2011 and 2007(amongst Indians)

No doubt these captains have achieved more things but they were immortalised when they won the WC.. That is what kohl needs to do win 2019 WC to be immortalised amongst cricket captains.. These records don’t matter..

If you ask cricket fans about ganugkynwinning 16-17 matches during the super sub rule or India’s winning streak under Dravid I think don’t think many people will remember those things.. Similarly 40/51 matches no one will remember few years down the line.

I agree with your statements above that for any captain to be considered amongst the pantheon of cricketing leadership, they need to do something extraordinary, like winning a WC. (Part of the reason why IK was able to collect as many funds for his hospital).

However, we were judging and discussing the effects and legacy of certain captains that go beyond the spectrum of normal fandom. In that, Lloyd’s single biggest contribution to his team, which led them to two consecutive WC’s and three consecutive finals, was the harmony he created in the dressing room.

An example is after the 79’ WC, when even amongst all the joy of the West Indians and global recognition (reason why Mobuto put up ten million for “The Rumble in The Jungle” because he wanted to put Zaire on the map, which to do so with war would have been more expensive), Lloyd was handed a hundred dollars. A HUNDRED DOLLARS as reward for winning the World Cup, which adjusted for inflation, would still be considered criminally “underpaid”.

Lloyd led his merry men to WSC and they followed his every step. They left their board, which many took as behavior of financial pirates at that time but they wouldn’t have had it not been for Lloyd. Lloyd understood that the West Indians were desperate people, hoping to remove themselves from the shackles of colonialism and embrace their culture. To do this however, they needed something that they could boast in their workplace as belonging to them. The champions of world cricket suited that narrative and proceeded to ignite the “Fire in Babylon”.

This is a Captain with a capital C. Someone who is the visionary, who could rid the tag of “Calypso Cricket”, something branded as entertaining but not successful. Lloyd realized the biggest hurdle standing in all of his ways was his group’s tribalism and sense of ethnic pride. So he took it upon himself to establish that they were known as The West Indians and not as Barbuduans, Antiguan, or Guaneyese. What was the result?

Fifteen years without losing a series, one loss in twenty years due to abysmal umpiring, two world cups, countless ATG WI cricketers and a culture of celebration of “black pride”.

 

[Ahmad Shah]

But this great captain has not so impressive record against Pakistan
Total 3 ODIs
One victory
Two defeats
Basically it's 2-1 in Pakistan favor


He won against Pakistan in group stage in champion trophy 2017
Defeated by Pakistan in Asia cup 2014 and CHAMPIONS Trophy Final 2027

 

[Madplayer]

The people in this thread making excuses for him should have a look at his on field tactics. He is clueless and this has happened far too often for it to be considered a non-issue.

The captain's main job is to be a tactician on the field. Everything else is secondary. He is average in this department. Secondly, he also goes missing when his team is being punished in the field which shows lack of leadership skills.

 

[Slim]

So the OP asked for Kohli to be removed as captain in the next ODI right after this thread. Hilarious.

 

[Robert]

Nope ask anyone about Clive Lloyd and more than 95% would remember him for winning world cups..

Only the die hard cricket fans remember Lloyd for creating fast bowlers and the readers amongst those die hard like yourself remember him of creating harmony in dressing room..

My original post said the same if kohli wants to be remembered as great captain he needs to win WC.. is simple..

People remember Martin Crowe for World Cup 1992 using spinner.
Ranatunga for winning WC.
Steve Waugh for 99 WC
IK for 92 win
Lloyd for 75 and 79
Kapil for 83
Ponting for multiple WC win
Border for 87
Dhoni for 2011 and 2007(amongst Indians)

No doubt these captains have achieved more things but they were immortalised when they won the WC.. That is what kohl needs to do win 2019 WC to be immortalised amongst cricket captains.. These records don’t matter..

If you ask cricket fans about ganugkynwinning 16-17 matches during the super sub rule or India’s winning streak under Dravid I think don’t think many people will remember those things.. Similarly 40/51 matches no one will remember few years down the line.

The World Cup has never been as important as test cricket for me. I remember Big Clive for batting with that railway sleeper and for making WI nearly invincible. I remember Border for numerous gritty centuries and bristling aggression turning a terrible team into a strong one. I remember Ponting for losing three Ashes series. I remember Dhoni for losing a test series in England 0-4.

I remember watching England lose the ‘87 and ‘92 WC finals and that hurt, but not as much as losing the Adelaide test after scoring 500.

 

[big_gamer007]

The World Cup has never been as important as test cricket for me. I remember Big Clive for batting with that railway sleeper and for making WI nearly invincible. I remember Border for numerous gritty centuries and bristling aggression turning a terrible team into a strong one. I remember Ponting for losing three Ashes series. I remember Dhoni for losing a test series in England 0-4.

I remember watching England lose the ‘87 and ‘92 WC finals and that hurt, but not as much as losing the Adelaide test after scoring 500.

Everyone has their preferences and since you grew up in an era when Tests were supreme you will obviously fondly remember those days.

However majority of fans care about world cups.. Hence the appeal, it’s the pinnacle of the sport..
Ultimately it’s the fans who drive any sport and cricket is no different.


For you and few others it might be ashes and that is perfectly fine. But for majority World Cup is he ultimate prize.

 

[Bhaijaan]

4 SENA wins for King Kohli in 2018.

Well done Sir