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Which nation has the best all-time ODI XI?

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Harsh Thakor

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1.Australia

Mark Waugh
Adam Gilchrist
Ricky Ponting
Dean Jones
Damyn Martyn
Steve Waugh
Michael Bevan/Gary Gilmour
Shane Warne
Michele Starc
Dennis Lillee
Glen Mcgrath



2.West Indies

Greenidge
Haynes
Viv Richards
Brian Lara
Clive Lloyd
Gary Sobers
Jeff Dujon
Malcolm Marshall
Andy Roberts /Michael Holding
Joel Garner
Curtly Ambrose


3.Pakistan

Saed Anwar
Majid Khan/Mudassar Nazar
Zaheer Abbas
Javed Miandad
Inzamam ul Haq
Imran Khan
Sarafraz Ahmed
Wasim Akram
Abdur Razzaq
Abdul Qadir
Waqar Younus



4.South Africa

Barry Richards
Hashim Amla
Herschelle Gibbs
Graeme Pollock
Jacques Kallis
Mike Procter
Shaun Pollock
Mark Boucher
Dale Steyn
Imran Tahir
Alan Donald




By a margin of a whisker I would plump for Australia.West Indies has a more powerful pace attack but Australian attack has more variety having the great Spin bowler Shane Warne .West Indies have better batsmen in terms of talent but I still feel Australian batsmen are more organized for ODI format, could also improvise more and had slightly better match temperament.Pakistan has outstanding talent with the most potent attack but lacks as strong a batting line up as Australia and West Indies.Still on it's day it could well spring a surprise.Man to man South Africa are the strongest in terms of all rounders but I feel many of the great players lacked enough ODI experience.Barry Richards,Mike Procter and Graeme Pollock hardly played one day cricket.It also does not have a great spinner like Warne or Qadir.
 
Sachin
Viru
Kohli
Ganguly
Yuvi
Dhoni
Kapil Dev
Bhajji
Kumble
Srinath
Zaheer

Batting wise this is the best batting line up ever in history of ODI cricket for any team.. Overall not as strong as Aussie line up but can certainly be compared to other teams you have mentioned.. Wish we had a world class fast bowler like McGrath or Wasim and another all rounder like klusener/Razzaq.

If Bumrah does well in next couple of years can replace one of the spinners with Bumrah..
 
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shokz1408 said:
Lol @ Sarfraz ahead of Rashid Latif and Moin Khan.
Click to expand...

Sarfraz is the best wicket keeper batsman Pakistan has ever had in all forms of the game. Also made a good account of himself during the 2015 WC where he was the best bat in the team.
 
shokz1408 said:
Lol @ Sarfraz ahead of Rashid Latif and Moin Khan.
Click to expand...

May be you can make a case for Moin as Sarfraz has only played 70 odd odis but what has Rashid ever done to be our best odi keeper batsman?

Sarfraz in his small career in tournaments (wont even go to his leadership skills):
46* in Asia cup final (highest scorer) - Pak Won the cup eventually
49 vs SA in WC 2015 and set the tone - Pak won the match
Only centurion for Pak in 2015 WC - Pak won the match
61 not out against SL in do and die match - Pak won the cup eventually

Just on his batting, I would give him 8/10 in odi tournaments and that makes him my first choice as Pak wk batsman in All time X1.
 
Australia:

Gilchrist
M. Waugh
Ponting
Jones
S. Waugh (c)
Bevan
Symonds
Warne
B. Lee
Lillee
McGrath
 
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Australia 1999/2003/2007 side mix and match you get the winning combo. Their tenacity is unmatched. You can have all the talent. But when it comes to coming from the behind very few could match Australia. Even when Windies was dominating they had this character all along.
 
Perfect top 4, but I probably would put WI at top; though I think IND will soon replace PAK in top 3, if SAF had already not done so.

If we look carefully, for an all-time PAK 15 (ODI), this'll be my squad -

Mazid, Saeed
Zaheer, Javed, Ul Haq
Khan, ARazzak
Latif
Wasim, Saq, WY
-------------------------------------
Shoaib, A Qadir, Asif Iqbal, MoYo

With an honorable mention of Afridi, Mushtaq (Md.), Gul, Salim Maliq and may be Sohail & MoHa.

NOT A SINGLE player debuted in this millennium and the youngest left cricket 5 years back (trying to come back for PSL now though).

If we make the same for IND, this'll be my 15

Sehwag, SRT, Kohli
Ganguly, Azhar
UV, Kapil, MS
Bhajjii, Kumble, Zak
--------------------------
Srinath, Dravid, Bedi & Prabhakar

With honorable mention to Shastri, Vengsarker, Amarnath, Binney, Agarkar, Rohit, Dhawan.....

If we carefully notice, half of starting XI started career in last 18 years, and some of them are still active; while there are players like Bumrah, Rohit, Dhawan ... might make in 15 at the end of career - MEANS the game is continuing in IND and BCCI actually producing players.

For PAK, instead of PCB, that job was done by TCCB (ECB), and it stopped by late 90s, so are the gravy train - natural talunt stopped at Hammad Azam & Fahim Ashraf level since A Razzak.


Regarding WI VS AUS - I think, AUS has much larger pool, but the top XI I'll give it to WI. There top few players were unreal. It's an interesting debate like soccer - Brazil had been Brazil and they'll always remain Brazil (A sure favorite for Semi Finals at least). Same can be said for Germany - because these are true super power of soccer; every generation they had ATGs and their every WC brings new superstar (if fit, Jesus is going make a name like Neymar or fat Ronaldo this year & next time). BUT, take Holland, failed to qualify for 78, 82, 86, 2002, 2018 WC; but in between they have made Finals in 74, 78, 2010, SF in 98, 2014, QF in 94; won EURO in 1988 .....

Because their players come by generations. A Dutch all-time XI can beat any team, any All-time team of any country in history - that's an unreal starting XI from: Var Der Saar, Koeman, Rudd Kroll, Riziger, Arie Haan, Rensenbrink, Suurbier, Rijkaard, Neskiens, Bergkamp, Seedorf, De Bore, Kluivert, RVN, RVP, Robben, Snijdier ..... AND Off course, my all time favorite, the man established total football - Johan Cruyff. Take those 15-20 out, I can't name 11 for Dutch B team, and I literally spend religious time for soccer.

That WI XI for me 'll be

1. GG
2. Haynes
3. Viv
4. BC
5. Hooper (Can't take Sobers - 0 (2) was his only ODI innings - but, guy was the best List A player in Counties by some distance, a dream ODI player)
6. Lloyd
7. Doujon
8. MDM
9. Mike Holding
10. Curtley
11. Garner
---------------------------------
Bishop, Roberts, Gayle, Kanhai (shouldn't be there for just 1 WC & 7 Games, but I am biased ..... he is Rohan Kanhai)

That first XI is too good man, just too good. And, just like PAK - only player in my 15 debuted in this millennium is Gayle, that too 18 years back.

People should realize why I have a love affair with WICB & PCB ............
 
MMHS said:
Perfect top 4, but I probably would put WI at top; though I think IND will soon replace PAK in top 3, if SAF had already not done so.

If we look carefully, for an all-time PAK 15 (ODI), this'll be my squad -

Mazid, Saeed
Zaheer, Javed, Ul Haq
Khan, ARazzak
Latif
Wasim, Saq, WY
-------------------------------------
Shoaib, A Qadir, Asif Iqbal, MoYo

With an honorable mention of Afridi, Mushtaq (Md.), Gul, Salim Maliq and may be Sohail & MoHa.

NOT A SINGLE player debuted in this millennium and the youngest left cricket 5 years back (trying to come back for PSL now though).

If we make the same for IND, this'll be my 15

Sehwag, SRT, Kohli
Ganguly, Azhar
UV, Kapil, MS
Bhajjii, Kumble, Zak
--------------------------
Srinath, Dravid, Bedi & Prabhakar

With honorable mention to Shastri, Vengsarker, Amarnath, Binney, Agarkar, Rohit, Dhawan.....

If we carefully notice, half of starting XI started career in last 18 years, and some of them are still active; while there are players like Bumrah, Rohit, Dhawan ... might make in 15 at the end of career - MEANS the game is continuing in IND and BCCI actually producing players.

For PAK, instead of PCB, that job was done by TCCB (ECB), and it stopped by late 90s, so are the gravy train - natural talunt stopped at Hammad Azam & Fahim Ashraf level since A Razzak.


Regarding WI VS AUS - I think, AUS has much larger pool, but the top XI I'll give it to WI. There top few players were unreal. It's an interesting debate like soccer - Brazil had been Brazil and they'll always remain Brazil (A sure favorite for Semi Finals at least). Same can be said for Germany - because these are true super power of soccer; every generation they had ATGs and their every WC brings new superstar (if fit, Jesus is going make a name like Neymar or fat Ronaldo this year & next time). BUT, take Holland, failed to qualify for 78, 82, 86, 2002, 2018 WC; but in between they have made Finals in 74, 78, 2010, SF in 98, 2014, QF in 94; won EURO in 1988 .....

Because their players come by generations. A Dutch all-time XI can beat any team, any All-time team of any country in history - that's an unreal starting XI from: Var Der Saar, Koeman, Rudd Kroll, Riziger, Arie Haan, Rensenbrink, Suurbier, Rijkaard, Neskiens, Bergkamp, Seedorf, De Bore, Kluivert, RVN, RVP, Robben, Snijdier ..... AND Off course, my all time favorite, the man established total football - Johan Cruyff. Take those 15-20 out, I can't name 11 for Dutch B team, and I literally spend religious time for soccer.

That WI XI for me 'll be

1. GG
2. Haynes
3. Viv
4. BC
5. Hooper (Can't take Sobers - 0 (2) was his only ODI innings - but, guy was the best List A player in Counties by some distance, a dream ODI player)
6. Lloyd
7. Doujon
8. MDM
9. Mike Holding
10. Curtley
11. Garner
---------------------------------
Bishop, Roberts, Gayle, Kanhai (shouldn't be there for just 1 WC & 7 Games, but I am biased ..... he is Rohan Kanhai)

That first XI is too good man, just too good. And, just like PAK - only player in my 15 debuted in this millennium is Gayle, that too 18 years back.

People should realize why I have a love affair with WICB & PCB ............
Click to expand...

MUST apologize to couple of flying Dutchmen - I missed them, some how : Rudd Gulit & Marco Van Basteeeeeeeen.
 
MMHS said:
For PAK, instead of PCB, that job was done by TCCB (ECB), and it stopped by late 90s, so are the gravy train - natural talunt stopped at Hammad Azam & Fahim Ashraf level since A Razzak.
Click to expand...

Hey what are you saying about Faheem.... :(
 
Australia or West Indies easy, as they have a balance of great bowlers and batsman. Pakistan doesn't have the quality of batsman overall to compete, and India don't have the bowlers. I guess the era that you prefer also makes a difference as ODI cricket has changed so drastically it's hard for me to compare the first two decades to the game after that.
 
MMHS said:
Good, but not great. I am apologizing to Gulit & Basten man - have some sense :)
Click to expand...

Wasn't comparing them to Gulit and Basten, just quoted that post as did not want to quote the previous essay. I personally think at least Cocu, Davids and Nistelroy would make the list of the 15-20 players mentioned above.

P.S . Just saw you mentioned RVN in the list. Anyway we can continue this discussion somewhere else some other time.
 
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DeadBall said:
Wasn't comparing them to Gulit and Basten, just quoted that post as did not want to quote the previous essay. I personally think at least Cocu, Davids and Nistelroy would make the list of the 15-20 players mentioned above.

P.S . Just saw you mentioned RVN in the list. Anyway we can continue this discussion somewhere else some other time.
Click to expand...

Cocu was durable & safe player, not spectacular. Davids was explosive, but too lose for a CM/DM - almost like our Steve G, looks brilliant, but not fluid - you can't put them in every system; they need the manager to form team to slot them in. Indeed a top class DM/CM - but there is Frank Rijkaard, Johan Neskiens, Clerence Seedorf ......
 
babajee said:
Club level trundler then.. there’s a difference :)
Click to expand...

Dil pay maat le yaar, don't break my heart.

He is a good kid, I like him (kept him in XI of first Test, backed Ul Haq also for selecting him on PSL show) - trying to establish himself in a PAK team that's ranking 6 to 9 these days and playing ugly cricket (if it wasn't PAK - I would have hardly seen any game of PAK to watch Misbah, Azhar batting and Yasir, Zulfi bowling - there is an issue of first love, unfortunately) ....... we are taking about all time PAK XI - arguably a squad that'll fight for 3-2 either way against the other 2 sides mentioned here ....... now, see the difference. Don't let your emotions get better of your good taste.
 
And you skipped ABDV and Klusenar from SA odi XI list :salute
 
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Problem with India and Pakistan is their ATG XIs still have average batting/bowling.

Australia/WI easily winning this contest followed by South Africa and Sri Lanka.
 
The_Odd_One said:
Australia

Gilchrist
Watson
Ponting
Jones
Bevan
Hussey
Symonds
Starc
Lee
Warne
McGrath
Click to expand...

You dropped Mark Waugh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Great team, but DK should be there & Greg Chappel MUST be there. Strac started like a champion, but for 2 years - Lillee was a Champion for 2 decades. Have you checked GSC's record - 3rd best ODI player till 90s after Viv & Zed, level with Lloyd. Bevan & Hussey are for similar role - one has to go.

My I will be

Gilly, Mark
Panta, Greg, Jones, Bevan
Symonds
Lee, Warne, DK, Mac
------------------------

Pair it with GG, Haynes, Viv, BC, Hooper, Lloyd, Jeff, Marshall, Mike, Ambi & Garner - I think, WIN wins 4-3, in a 7 game series.

AUS's disadvantage is that, they are too good against every team at home on their wickets - BUT, not against WI - check records, till mid 90s, still Aussies had great teams every generation - not a single time they could beat WIN in WSC, at least 7 times I can recall (Poms did once I think). Because, these WI back-foot punchers would crash what ever Aussies bowl at them and those 40 overs on AUS wickets are unplayable man, simply unplayable.

In fact, it'll be a better contest in WIN, because of Warne.
 
We judge one day performance by world cup results. Based on that no way South Africa deserve to be ahead of India. They haven't even made a final yet. And it's not like most of their best players didn't play together. As for west indies Vs Australia I'll go for Australia. West indies team will be made of mostly player's from 1980's. While Australian team will be made of player's from 2000s.but that Australian team succeded in winning the world cup thrice. And the Indian team west indies lost to is nowhere near Pakistan of 1999.sa of 1999 or India of 2003.
 
Australia easily. Ponting, Lee, McGrath, Gilchrist, Bevan are all ODI ATGs, with Warne and Hayden borderline. Unlike WI, the Aus players faced much better opposition in their career (Lanka, Pak, WI, Ind all were mostly decent teams from 1990-2007, and Saf were one of the greatest in bilaterals)
 
Aus quite comfortably for mine

Gilly (w/k)
Watson
Ponting (c)
G Chappell
Bevan
Symo
Hussey
Starc
Lee
Warney
McGrath
 
Would be interesting had Sobers got to play ODIs. Only played in one I think.

WI

Greenidge
Gayle
Lara
Viv
Sobers
Lloyd (c)
Dujon (w/k)
Marshall
Holding
Garner
Ambrose
 
SL_Fan said:
Would be interesting had Sobers got to play ODIs. Only played in one I think.

WI

Greenidge
Gayle
Lara
Viv
Sobers
Lloyd (c)
Dujon (w/k)
Marshall
Holding
Garner
Ambrose
Click to expand...

There is a thread on Barry Richards, and I admire the guy among very, very, very best as a complete batsman.

This guy BA Richards played 233 List A Games, mostly in Counties & AUS, for an average of 40+, and I guess his SR would be around 65-70, with most of his games in late 70s to early 80s - that 40/70 stats is outstanding for an opener.

Starting 10 years back, that guy Garry Sobers played 95 List A games and averaged 38+ and my hunch (no figure available for either) is his SR would be in between 70-75 as well (both had similar SR in Test) - that 38/70+ stats is almost unreal for 60s & early 70s for a No. 4-6, with most of those 95 games played when he was 30+, last one at 38.

NOW, in addition to that 38/70+ batting stats, add 109 wickets at 21.95 average & 3.27 economy - that guy Garry Sobers was THAT GOOD, and he was easily the best all-round fielder of 50s-60s (Collin Bland was a point specialist, Sir Garry was great from silly point to 2nd slip & he could have kept as well).

But, even without Sir Garry, WIN best XI is too good. Hypothetically, SAF will be as good as the other 2, if we consider the possible ODI output of BA Richards, G Pollock, Procter, Rice, Garth Le Roux, Ken Mcwean, Dennis Lindsey, Peter Kristen, Eddie Barlow and Vincent Van Der Bijl.

Also, remember - due to ban of SAF, at their younger age, Tony Greig & Allen Lamb migrated and played for England, Kepler Wessels to AUS and Tricos to ZIM. Not in 1979, but that SAF side led by Tony, would have walked away with 1975 WC unless an off day in the Final or SF.
 
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NZ XI could be
Guptil avg 42.99 Sr 86.38
McCullum (WK) avg 30.41 sr 96.37
Kane Williamson avg 46.87sr 83.22
Ross Taylor avg 46.28 sr 82.87
Martin Crowe avg 45.36 sr 44.65
Nathan Astle avg 35.92 sr 72.64
Chris Cairns
Vettori
Hadlee
Boult
Bond
 
No need to overthink here. Aus is the answer here.
 
On paper, Pakistan and South Africa look superb...

Pakistan:

1) Saeed Anwar
2) Zaheer Abbas
3) Javed Miandad
4) Mohammad Yousuf
5) Inzamam ul Haq
6) Sarfaraz Ahmed (wk)
7) Imran Khan (c)
8) Wasim Akram
9) Waqar Younis
10) Saqlain Mushtaq
11) Saeed Ajmal

South Africa:

1) Hashim Amla
2) Herschell Gibbs
3) Jacques Kallis
4) Faf du Plessis (c)
5) AB de Villiers
6) Quinton de Kock (wk)
7) Shaun Pollock
8) Lance Klusener
9) Dale Steyn
10) Allan Donald
11) Imran Tahir

... And even India are not that bad...

1) Sourav Ganguly
2) Sachin Tendulker
3) Virat Kohli
4) Azharuddin
5) Yuvraj Singh
6) MS Dhoni (c) (wk)
7) Kapil Dev
8) Harbhajjan Singh
9) Anil Kumble
10) Zaheer Khan
11) Javagal Srinath

... But Australia of the 00's decade don't even need fantasy teams utilizing players from different eras to be acknowledged as the best.
 
Pakistan would have gun OD bowlers

Wasim , waqar , saqlain , Imran , Qadir .

No let up !!
 
It would be difficult to choose any side other than Australia who have won the cup 5 times and 4 times in the last 20 years.
 
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