Would India have been able to compete with Australia if they had Smith, Warner, Bancroft, Pattinson?

[cricketworm]

No worries. This thread will be bumped when Aus has all the best players and India will still manage to win test series or at least draw the series. This team is special Virat and co are coming back to Australia and will win it.

India will reach at stage that there wont be any excuses left to give them credit.

 

[Tusker]

No worries. This thread will be bumped when Aus has all the best players and India will still manage to win test series or at least draw the series. This team is special Virat and co are coming back to Australia and will win it.

India will reach at stage that there wont be any excuses left to give them credit.

Believe me our self loathing "fans" will find unique ways to discredit any achievement. Example: But the grass on pitch was only 5mm ... must be minimum 10mm.

 

[Reyansh2017]

You are right that they can fail as well, no doubt on it. However, there are more chances that they would have performed, particularly with both playing together, than failing because they were great players.

Nobody will deny that aus will be a better team with them but your claim that india has no chance of winning or drawing when they play is laughable.

 

[latecut]

No worries. This thread will be bumped when Aus has all the best players and India will still manage to win test series or at least draw the series. This team is special Virat and co are coming back to Australia and will win it.

India will reach at stage that there wont be any excuses left to give them credit.

India held all time great Australia 1-1 in Australia in 2003-04. Even then some jealous people managed to find fault in that win stating that McGrath did not play that series. Do they mean to say that the team boasting all time greats had become a B team in the absence of McGrath.

India beat Australia 2-1 at home and that team had McGrath as well. The jealous people would pooh pooh this result because it was achieved at home. What stopped their own teams to achieve similar results at home against that team.

 

[jnaveen1980]

India held all time great Australia 1-1 in Australia in 2003-04. Even then some jealous people managed to find fault in that win stating that McGrath did not play that series. Do they mean to say that the team boasting all time greats had become a B team in the absence of McGrath.

India beat Australia 2-1 at home and that team had McGrath as well. The jealous people would pooh pooh this result because it was achieved at home. What stopped their own teams to achieve similar results at home against that team.

Winning a Test match in Australia is not easy especially for an Asian team. Full strength, half strength whatever it is. You have to win session by session. It is gruelling, exhausting, daunting, mentally very challenging. It requires great resolve to stay focused and get the job done. India sent a rubbish batting line up with just 2 batsmen. 9 passengers in the first test. So the task was all the more difficult.

 

[Slog]

Bro...why so angry?

You said, Aussie side was missing McGrath, Warne and Lee in 2003 series. But it is factually incorrect. Brett Lee played the entire series, except the 1st test in Brisbane.

Also it was a 1-1 tied series due to Indians played some brilliant cricket against the best side in the world.

1st test Brisbane - Tie
2nd test Adelaide - Ind won
3rd test MCG - Aust won
4th test SCG - Tie

Love the way our Asian neighbours defend Aust when ever India tours there and does well. Its always bcoz XYZ players were missing

Lol st me being angry

You clearly are. Just accept the facts and enjoy your test victory

I’m surprised why you are so defensive even after the test victory. I know it wasn’t the strongest Aussie side but that’s not your concern and you should enjoy the victory regardless

 

[Mp812]

When Pakistan blanked out a Zimbabwe team ( minus two main players) 5 - 0, the general response was " We can only play what team is put in front of us ".
Wonder why that is not valid reasoning now now ?

 

[latecut]

The three seamers ( sharmas and shamis and boomrahs ) have broken a record for the highest number of wickets in a calendar year .
The 10 times better bowlers you talk of ....Do they have names ?

Sharmas and Shamis and Boomrahs have taken more test wickets in SENA countries in one year than what all Bangladesh Phhaaast bowlers have taken in SENA countries in 18 years.

 

[jnaveen1980]

The three seamers ( sharmas and shamis and boomrahs ) have broken a record for the highest number of wickets in a calendar year .
The 10 times better bowlers you talk of ....Do they have names ?

Smith is lucky not to play this series lol These 3 beat the record of Holding, Marshall, Garner for a calendar year. Anyone who plays and loses a test in Bangladesh cannot really be great

 

[jnaveen1980]

This type of posts r what forces me to make post in India related thread.

[MENTION=139164]MABA[/MENTION] red, look at new revelation dude. Smith actually has a poor technique against moving balls and he would've struggled to score on wickets where Mr walking wicket outside Asia aka Rohit just scored 60 odd in the last test.

But hey who cares. Anything can be turned into reality in the great place called lala land by my friendly neighbours. It doesn't matter that this same Smith averages 80 in Australia and smashed bowlers who r ten times better than these Sharmas and Shamis.

It also doesn't matter that this very same Smith averages 130 in New Zealand, a place that is infamous for swing and seam movement.

All these things don't matter. What matters is few YouTube clips where he struggled against broad or whoever. Lol. But does anyone care about the fact that in this very YouTube there r hundreds of clips where Kohli looked worse than a tailender against moving balls?

"infamous for swing and seam movement" some of the most ignorant comments i have read in a long time in this one post.

 

[Mamoon]

Smith could take apart Ishant and Shami. Look at his record vs India lol.

It often takes one bowler to negate a batsman. Of all the bowlers in the world today, Bumrah has the best skill-set to tame Smith.

 

[Hasan123]

It often takes one bowler to negate a batsman. Of all the bowlers in the world today, Bumrah has the best skill-set to tame Smith.

Would be a good battle. A shame we were denied the chance to see it.

 

[BDfanforever]

LOL at those who thinks Smith and Warner would not have been a factor against IND. Last time when Aus visited India, Steven Smith was the highest run scorer even in that series. The guy is still ranked number 3 even after missing all these times.

 

[Canford Cliffs]

LOL at those who thinks Smith and Warner would not have been a factor against IND. Last time when Aus visited India, Steven Smith was the highest run scorer even in that series. The guy is still ranked number 3 even after missing all these times.

So just bcoz Smith was highest scorer in that series means he would hv scored here too? What kind of logic is this? Australia lost that series when Smith was the highest scorer proving that cricket is a team game. No doubt India would hv won here even with Steve Smith in the team.

 

[The Viper]

Smith would have definitely helped Aus. But you have to remember this bowling attack of India has been very good. Guys that normally score well at home like Khawaja and Shaun Marsh struggled. Smith is not a home track bully and would have scored but that as prolific as he had been in the past.

 

[wrongun]

Maybe one of the Ozzie posters can throw in some light? [MENTION=129939]wrongun[/MENTION] @RandomAussie [MENTION=190]OZGOD[/MENTION] [MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION]

Pattinson hasn't played a Test in about 3 years I think. He's been constantly injured (a common take for our quicks and reason many Aussies do not trust our "high performance manager" position or these stupid workload rules for bowlers at all) for some time.

He just came back to FC cricket this season so I don't think he was seriously considered for the India series, given that we had other pace options fit. The plan for him will simply to see if he can play a proper string 9maybe even the whole Shield) of FC matches before he is considered for selection.

If he can do that, he will be in the frame for the Ashes tour mid year.

We may see him selected for some ODI cricket before then. I doubt we'll see him even for the SL Tests.

He's about 1 serious injury away from never playing again, according to himself in interviews so no-one will be pressuring or rushing him.

 

[BreadPakoda]

Pattinson hasn't played a Test in about 3 years I think. He's been constantly injured (a common take for our quicks and reason many Aussies do not trust our "high performance manager" position or these stupid workload rules for bowlers at all) for some time.

He just came back to FC cricket this season so I don't think he was seriously considered for the India series, given that we had other pace options fit. The plan for him will simply to see if he can play a proper string 9maybe even the whole Shield) of FC matches before he is considered for selection.

If he can do that, he will be in the frame for the Ashes tour mid year.

We may see him selected for some ODI cricket before then. I doubt we'll see him even for the SL Tests.

He's about 1 serious injury away from never playing again, according to himself in interviews so no-one will be pressuring or rushing him.

Thanks. A shame though, he's such a fine bowler.

 

[HuzaifaE]

It often takes one bowler to negate a batsman. Of all the bowlers in the world today, Bumrah has the best skill-set to tame Smith.

Smith showed practically no kryptonite to his batting. Its a strange assumption to assume Bumrah would be the one to come out on top if we're going off nothing but conjecture.

 

[latecut]

How Smith bats in Australian wickets depends of the bowling. He feasted on English pace bowling attack in Ashes but failed against South African pacers. I feel that Indian pace attack at present is comparable to South African pace attack rather than English pace attack. And that reflects in their record for the year as well. So there is little doubt that Smith would have struggled against Indian bowling. Same would have happened with Warner.

Look at the Marsh brothers. They batted like Bradman against England bowling in Ashes last year but they are struggling against Indian bowlers.

 

[Corridor of Uncertainty]

Ifs and buts.

India is making use of an opportunity provided to them. Most teams including Pakistan will have failed.

Pakistan had a great chance in SA - with Philander not playing, AB gone, weakest batting line up in ages and look how Pakistan have capitalized.

So the entire debate is sour grapes.

 

[Mamoon]

Smith showed practically no kryptonite to his batting. Its a strange assumption to assume Bumrah would be the one to come out on top if we're going off nothing but conjecture.

Actually Smith did have a kryptonite, i.e. hostile fast bowling.

Since his extraordinary transformation as a batsman in 2013/14, his average has been a stupendous 65. Against South Africa, his average drops to 40 with only one hundred across three series.

In fact, the average further slides to 29-30 over the last two series. South Africa have had the best pace attack along with Australia during his surreal peak, and of course he doesn't get to play against Starc and Cummins.

His technique has made him unflappable against fast medium bowling (unless there is prodigious lateral movement), but it has also made him vulnerable against 90 mph bowlers with the ability to move the ball. South Africa have been able to exploit this weakness of his especially in the last two series.

It is quite possible that a batsman of his caliber would have found a way to tame Smith, but it is also unreasonable to assume that he would have continued to batter India with Bumrah leading the attack. He has been nothing special against the only opposition with genuine quality fast bowlers and that is the threat that Bumrah carries today.

 

[ind_win]

His technique has made him unflappable against fast medium bowling (unless there is prodigious lateral movement), but it has also made him vulnerable against 90 mph bowlers with the ability to move the ball. South Africa have been able to exploit this weakness of his especially in the last two series.

Well-said and noted observation.
Even I felt like that.
He is not rushed by medium pacers while the opposite is in the case of high-pace bowlers.

 

[Mamoon]

Actually Smith did have a kryptonite, i.e. hostile fast bowling.

Since his extraordinary transformation as a batsman in 2013/14, his average has been a stupendous 65. Against South Africa, his average drops to 40 with only one hundred across three series.

In fact, the average further slides to 29-30 over the last two series. South Africa have had the best pace attack along with Australia during his surreal peak, and of course he doesn't get to play against Starc and Cummins.

His technique has made him unflappable against fast medium bowling (unless there is prodigious lateral movement), but it has also made him vulnerable against 90 mph bowlers with the ability to move the ball. South Africa have been able to exploit this weakness of his especially in the last two series.

It is quite possible that a batsman of his caliber would have found a way to tame Smith, but it is also unreasonable to assume that he would have continued to batter India with Bumrah leading the attack. He has been nothing special against the only opposition with genuine quality fast bowlers and that is the threat that Bumrah carries today.

Bumrah*

 

[ind_win]

Bumrah*

Well-said and noted observation.

 

[big_gamer007]

Who knows maybe India would have whitewashed with those two in the team.. Maybe we would have got whitewashed.. All these speculations means zilch no one can predict what could have happened.

This is golden chance for India to win a series in Australia and if they capitalize then fair play to kohli and the team and they deserve the accolades. If they don't win then they will be rightfully criticized.

The insecurities been shown in this thread boggles my mind.

 

[Aman]

3-0 Australia and Indians know this deep down.

Warner and Smith would have broken down the Indian bowlers and left the scraps for the rest to feast on.

 

[AAli98]

Its like taking candy of a kid, the likes of Haris handscome finch are glorified tailenders at this level... even mohammed Sami would have run through this ameture aussie line up.

 

[BaankeJi]

India have always competed well against Aussies. Even against mighty Australians. So answer is yes.

 

[Snow]

India did really well even last time around, losing 2-0, and almost winning one of those games. India should have won 2008 as well if not cheating.

 

[Dingolfy]

3-0 Australia and Indians know this deep down.

Warner and Smith would have broken down the Indian bowlers and left the scraps for the rest to feast on.

LOL. Warner is a flat track bully and would be toast at the first sight of movement. He was jumping like a cat on hot tin roof against Umesh Yadav and Bhuvneshwar Kumar in Dharmashala in 2017 and was struggling to put bat against ball in the recent ODI series. He would make no difference against a rampaging Bumrah.

 

[SportsWarrior]

Warner averaged in mid thirties and Smith in early twenties when they last faced good bowling attack. What makes you all think they wouldn't have faced same fate? There is a good chance they would have been successful but equally good chance they would have failed based on both their and Indian bowlers form

 

[Aman]

LOL. Warner is a flat track bully and would be toast at the first sight of movement. He was jumping like a cat on hot tin roof against Umesh Yadav and Bhuvneshwar Kumar in Dharmashala in 2017 and was struggling to put bat against ball in the recent ODI series. He would make no difference against a rampaging Bumrah.

Warner averaged in mid thirties and Smith in early twenties when they last faced good bowling attack. What makes you all think they wouldn't have faced same fate? There is a good chance they would have been successful but equally good chance they would have failed based on both their and Indian bowlers form

 

[Dingolfy]

Only If you have bothered to read what i have written. He averaged a beastly 24.12 against India last time and was struggled like a school kid on Dharmashala ( most Australian pitch in India) against the 135 pies from Bhuvaneshwar Kumar.
The runs he made earlier made was against crappy bowling and you know this time even Ishant Sharma is averaging under 30s. Warner would be in the hut before he even know it.

 

[Aman]

Only If you have bothered to read what i have written. He averaged a beastly 24.12 against India last time and was struggled like a school kid on Dharmashala ( most Australian pitch in India) against the 135 pies from Bhuvaneshwar Kumar.
The runs he made earlier made was against crappy bowling and you know this time even Ishant Sharma is averaging under 30s. Warner would be in the hut before he even know it.

Dharmashala isn't Australia, Warner and Smith would have feasted on Indian bowling like they always have in Australia. They have 8 100s between them in 22 innings...

Smith becomes Bradman against your lot. No answer for him

 

[SportsWarrior]

In their last series which was against south africa.

 

[Dingolfy]

Dharmashala isn't Australia

Exactly! He couldnt even handle the bounce and movement on an Indian pitch against a much slower Bhuvi and you expect him to score in Australia against a marauding Bumrah who bowls at 140 plus even at the end of the day!

Warner and Smith would have feasted on Indian bowling like they always have in Australia. They have 8 100s between them in 22 innings...

In 2015. There is a thing called recent form, dear. That is why Ishant- the 100 mph-Sharma is averaging under 30s from last 3 years and running through every damn team he played against.

Smith becomes Bradman against your lot. No answer for him

How much did he score against South African bowling in the last few series? And if one guy's batting could win the series, then we would have won the England series by now.

 

[jagatk]

3-0 Australia and Indians know this deep down.

Warner and Smith would have broken down the Indian bowlers and left the scraps for the rest to feast on.

Last time Indians toured with a an absolute rubbish bowling attack and still lost only 2-0 and one of the losses was due to attempting an improbable chase which we could have drawn easily, so try harder.

 

[latecut]

The present Indian test team has five out of eleven players with experience of less than ten tests each, still this team is winning the test series against Australia in Australia. Burnol time for others.

 

[Varun]

If Australia come over to India full strength and we remove our 2 best players in India - Ashwin and Jadeja - we'll still win if not whitewash them. Fact.

 

[Bhaijaan]

Like said above Indians know it deep down they have been extremely lucky to not have facee a full strength Aussie side.

Even Maxwell needed to be in tbis geam who missed out due to some scandals.

Australia is literallt half its strength against India this series.

 

[latecut]

Some people are desperately hoping to pooh pooh Indian achievement in Australia with smoke of their heartburn clearly noticeable. Keep burning. No one gives a damn. India would have achieved this series win with or without the two banned cheats in Australian team.

 

[Tusker]

Like said above Indians know it deep down they have been extremely lucky to not have facee a full strength Aussie side.

Even Maxwell needed to be in tbis geam who missed out due to some scandals.

Australia is literallt half its strength against India this series.

Is that why you are running away - tail between your legs - from answering simple questions ? Also did someone stop the Aussie bowlers from bowling out the Indian batsmen cheaply ?

 

[wrongun]

Nothing should be taken away from India in this series.

They beat the best team we could put up, in home conditions, fair and square. The great thing about a long Test series is that it tests a nations resources in every way- the players from every which angle, the touring squad, the administrators planning & scheduling, the selectors certainly. It's a multi-dimensional challenge.

Having players out suspended is no different to injury and India have been excellent so no certainty players would have made a difference. India beat whoever was put in front of them.

If we selected ridiculous teams (and our selection is a national scandal and shambles to make Pakistan procedures look like a Swiss Watch next to it) the it's our fault again.

At this low ebb, this is the best we can do. India is better- by a long way too in my opinion, long enough that I won't take anything away or add any asterisk.

I agree it is shame what Oz cricket has come to in 2018 but this is a very good Indian team- they have been winning Tests away and competing in most of the rest all year and now their hard work and belief has made a breakthrough.

Bancroft is a marginal Test player at best. Smith & Warner are good but India's bowling attack is also very good- varied, penetrative and balanced. Pattinson is a non event as a Test player at this stage, not worth the conversation but all best to him on making it one day.

On this evidence I wouldn't over-rule the decision on an India victory. At best we might get back to umpires call- and at this stage, the umpire has called an Indian victory.

 

[Torborg]

Nothing should be taken away from India in this series.

They beat the best team we could put up, in home conditions, fair and square. The great thing about a long Test series is that it tests a nations resources in every way- the players from every which angle, the touring squad, the administrators planning & scheduling, the selectors certainly. It's a multi-dimensional challenge.

Having players out suspended is no different to injury and India have been excellent so no certainty players would have made a difference. India beat whoever was put in front of them.

If we selected ridiculous teams (and our selection is a national scandal and shambles to make Pakistan procedures look like a Swiss Watch next to it) the it's our fault again.

At this low ebb, this is the best we can do. India is better- by a long way too in my opinion, long enough that I won't take anything away or add any asterisk.

I agree it is shame what Oz cricket has come to in 2018 but this is a very good Indian team- they have been winning Tests away and competing in most of the rest all year and now their hard work and belief has made a breakthrough.

Bancroft is a marginal Test player at best. Smith & Warner are good but India's bowling attack is also very good- varied, penetrative and balanced. Pattinson is a non event as a Test player at this stage, not worth the conversation but all best to him on making it one day.

On this evidence I wouldn't over-rule the decision on an India victory. At best we might get back to umpires call- and at this stage, the umpire has called an Indian victory.

Even with the inclusion of Smith, Warner, and Bancroft, it would be marginal. I favour a 2-2 series draw with those inclusions, but I'm biased. <shrugs>

This is the strongest all-round Indian visiting team I've seen.

 

[Banter]

Why stop at the sandpaper cheats? Would India beat Aus if they had Border, Lillee, McGrath, Thompson, Warne, Chappell?

 

[Torborg]

Why stop at the sandpaper cheats? Would India beat Aus if they had Border, Lillee, McGrath, Thompson, Warne, Chappell?

Interesting question.

A balding old Dennis Lillee returned figures of 3/8 off 8 overs against the touring Pakistan side in 1999.

 

[Banter]

Interesting question.

A balding old Dennis Lillee returned figures of 3/8 off 8 overs against the touring Pakistan side in 1999.

Well, its a known thing that Pakistan has trouble batting down under, its got to do with the science of water goes counter-clockwise when you flush it or something.

 

[Stalin]

Rishabh Pant
Hanuma Vihari
Mayank Agarwal
Jasprit Bumrah
Ravindra Jadeja
Kuldeep Yadav

Wondering what all the above mentioned players have in common? Yes, they're playing tests for the first time on Australian soil . I am leaving you at that.

 

[jadaja]

They have dominated their bowling and have ground them to death.This is a seriously good Indian team which had no luck in SA and England. If they had some luck the results would have been totally different.

Smith and Warner would have made difference but I don't think it would have changed much.

 

[Chrish]

Take away Kohli and Pujara from current line-up and see how many games they win..

 

[WengerOut]

Take away Kohli and Pujara from current line-up and see how many games they win..

India will be fine at home

 

[Chrish]

India will be fine at home

That’s not what OP is asking. The question here is if India were to compete against Aus in THIS series with these players available, what would happen?

And I don’t think India would have been fine without Pujara in homeseries against Australia themselves. They barely won with Pujara even gunning it.

 

[jadaja]

Did India ask Smith and Warner to cheat and do all those things.Smith would have been sitting bunny for Bumrah who knows.Warner would have been handled also.

 

[Torborg]

Well, its a known thing that Pakistan has trouble batting down under, its got to do with the science of water goes counter-clockwise when you flush it or something.

Lol. Good one, mate.

 

[Chrish]

Every team does ball tempering. Even sachin did it but he didn’t have balls to admit it.

These folks weren’t the first and they definitely won’t be last. Cricket Australia have shot themsrlves in the foot by handing a year ban due to fear of loosing sponsors but even they must be regretting it right now.

 

[Titan24]

Definitely would have competed well even with Warner and Smith in Australian team.

But, surely series would have been much more closely contested with Aussies having an upper hand due to being in their backyard.

Its also about the leadership which Smith could have provided and Paine is lacking.

Bancroft on the other hand is not that big an absence.

 

[Torborg]

Did India ask Smith and Warner to cheat and do all those things.Smith would have been sitting bunny for Bumrah who knows.Warner would have been handled also.

Smith would have averaged somewhere between 120 and 300, and Warner would have been irrelevant for the most part when he wasn't smashing double centuries in a day.

I'm glad that Kohli felt confident enough to play international cricket when Shane Warne retired. We're hospitable in Australia, so we could have accommodated your needs sooner if you asked nicely.

 

[Torborg]

Definitely would have competed well even with Warner and Smith in Australian team.

But, surely series would have been much more closely contested with Aussies having an upper hand due to being in their backyard.

Its also about the leadership which Smith could have provided and Paine is lacking.

Bancroft on the other hand is not that big an absence.

Smith was a weak leader. Paine is a specialist captain, with keeping as his secondary strength.

 

[Hitman]

Smith would have averaged somewhere between 120 and 300, and Warner would have been irrelevant for the most part when he wasn't smashing double centuries in a day.

I'm glad that Kohli felt confident enough to play international cricket when Shane Warne retired. We're hospitable in Australia, so we could have accommodated your needs sooner if you asked nicely.

Yea, Warne would have ended his career. Just like he ended the career of so many Indian batsmen with his bowling average of 47 odd against India.

 

[Chrish]

Anyways other than Khawaja there is no international standard batsman in current line-up. The next two best batsman are Pat Cummins and Tim Paine!

 

[soso_killer]

Compete? Yes. Win? No. But they've handled their business fair play. It's non of their business who's not in the starting XI, can only beat what's in front of you.

 

[K4Kohli]

3-0 Australia and Indians know this deep down.

Warner and Smith would have broken down the Indian bowlers and left the scraps for the rest to feast on.

I think you would also know deep down that India would have won the series in England if not for the tosses, right

 

[ace58]

Take away Kohli and Pujara from current line-up and see how many games they win..

Kohli is having a terrible series if you exlude the perth test that india lost. And why would you exclude pujara? Just besaue he is having a good series? Why not also exclude mayank, bumrah, jadeja, pant who are doing well?

 

[Varun]

Take away Kohli and Pujara from current line-up and see how many games they win..

We'd still beat if not whitewash Australia at home.

 

[Chrish]

We'd still beat if not whitewash Australia at home.

India would have lost in homeseries against Australia if not for Pujara last time.

 

[rhony]

Smith would have averaged somewhere between 120 and 300, and Warner would have been irrelevant for the most part when he wasn't smashing double centuries in a day.

I'm glad that Kohli felt confident enough to play international cricket when Shane Warne retired. We're hospitable in Australia, so we could have accommodated your needs sooner if you asked nicely.

I know. What about that Bradman guy? He would have gone one better and averaged 100 in this series. That another dude Lillee would have been handful too. Indians are just lucky I guess

 

[Chrish]

Kohli is having a terrible series if you exlude the perth test that india lost. And why would you exclude pujara? Just besaue he is having a good series? Why not also exclude mayank, bumrah, jadeja, pant who are doing well?

If you remove Smith/ Warner, it’s only fair you remove two best Indian batsman. Whenever Kohli failed, Pujara came to rescue (home series against Aus/ SA, current series etc). And whenever Pujarw flopped, Kohli bossed it. It’s a cycle.

 

[rhony]

India would have lost in homeseries against Australia if not for Pujara last time.

There you go. So Kohli was irrelevant to the series. That's the best batsman in the world. So speculating about Smith is pointless.

 

[Varun]

India would have lost in homeseries against Australia if not for Pujara last time.

Yeah nah. We don't lose home series because of 1 player being there or not. Australia should consider themselves lucky they got that lottery wicket at Pune and the no-name spinner "O'Keefe" took a fluke bagful.

 

[Chrish]

Yeah nah. We don't lose home series because of 1 player being there or not. Australia should consider themselves lucky they got that lottery wicket at Pune and the no-name spinner "O'Keefe" took a fluke bagful.

I think you need to refresh your memory here. Rahul and Pujara were the only two batsmen who scored consistently in that series. Pujara was instrumental in two wins and one draw after Smith batted like Bradman. And even after than India barely won.

 

[Chrish]

There you go. So Kohli was irrelevant to the series. That's the best batsman in the world. So speculating about Smith is pointless.

Read my post above in reply to ace58.

I don’t wanna turn this into Smith vs Kohli thread but before his ban, Smith was the best test batsman on the globe.

 

[rhony]

Read my post above in reply to ace58.

I don’t wanna turn this into Smith vs Kohli thread but before his ban, Smith was the best test batsman on the globe.

Yes and Kohli was the best batsman in India before Aus visited Ind. He is the best batsman in the world now and wasn't as impactful. Every record including the recent ashes is dubious now. The Aussie world beating bowlers can't bowl with an old ball and now we know why. This discussion should have been if India lost. Instead they whooped the Aussies. Smith and Warner have sand papered themselves, Bancroft was never great, Bradman is dead and Lillee now bowls at 90 kmph. So get over it.

 

[Chrish]

Yes and Kohli was the best batsman in India before Aus visited Ind. He is the best batsman in the world now and wasn't as impactful. Every record including the recent ashes is dubious now. The Aussie world beating bowlers can't bowl with an old ball and now we know why. This discussion should have been if India lost. Instead they whooped the Aussies. Smith and Warner have sand papered themselves, Bancroft was never great, Bradman is dead and Lillee now bowls at 90 kmph. So get over it.

You do have an option of not reading someone’s posts if they make you uncomfortable.

Similarly if this is the best you can come with, I will save my time by not responding to it from now on.

 

[Chrish]

India would have competed well if those players weren’t missing from Aussie line up. I don’t predict Smith would average 200 and Warner 100 like last time. This Indian bowling attack is much more potent than the one that was belted last time around. Bumrah has been amazing. Instant is vastly improved bowler etc. Moreover wickets are more sporting compared to previous tour as well.

I would say series result would have been 80-20 in favor of Australia if Smith/ Warner were playing. However, credit where it’s due. Asian teams in the past have crumbled against weak Australian team but they have overcome this immense psychological hurdle and it’s indeed praiseworthy.

 

[rhony]

You do have an option of not reading someone’s posts if they make you uncomfortable.

Similarly if this is the best you can come with, I will save my time by not responding to it from now on.

It's not about making me or anyone uncomfortable. It's about assumptions that the result would be different if player X is in the team. A lot of posters already argued here Kohli was irrelevant in the last Aus Ind series in India. Smith or Warner wouldn't have stopped Pujara from scoring 500 runs. They wouldn't stop Bumrah from getting 20 wickets.

The reason Australia failed in this series is because of their toothless bowling. It's shocking that a country like Australia can't produce a half decent batsman that can score a hundred at home in a test series. India's main spinner has not played the last 3 games. India's opening batting pair was a joke in every test so far. Australia is losing because they can't take wickets in the middle overs. Australia is losing because they don't have techniques to face quality bowling. For all we know, Smith and Warner would have been Bumrah's bunnies.

 

[Chrish]

Australian bowling attack is toothless?? Someone please take this dude and make him watch a complete test game.

 

[Buffet]

Nothing should be taken away from India in this series.

They beat the best team we could put up, in home conditions, fair and square. The great thing about a long Test series is that it tests a nations resources in every way- the players from every which angle, the touring squad, the administrators planning & scheduling, the selectors certainly. It's a multi-dimensional challenge.

Having players out suspended is no different to injury and India have been excellent so no certainty players would have made a difference. India beat whoever was put in front of them.

If we selected ridiculous teams (and our selection is a national scandal and shambles to make Pakistan procedures look like a Swiss Watch next to it) the it's our fault again.

At this low ebb, this is the best we can do. India is better- by a long way too in my opinion, long enough that I won't take anything away or add any asterisk.

I agree it is shame what Oz cricket has come to in 2018 but this is a very good Indian team- they have been winning Tests away and competing in most of the rest all year and now their hard work and belief has made a breakthrough.

Bancroft is a marginal Test player at best. Smith & Warner are good but India's bowling attack is also very good- varied, penetrative and balanced. Pattinson is a non event as a Test player at this stage, not worth the conversation but all best to him on making it one day.

On this evidence I wouldn't over-rule the decision on an India victory. At best we might get back to umpires call- and at this stage, the umpire has called an Indian victory.

+1

Smith and Warner would have surely made Aus more competitive, but there is no guarantee that Aus would have won this series. Also, India simply can't control who is in starting XI. They can simply control how they play. They have played very well. They have out batted and out bowled Aus in their den.

People should give credit and move on.

 

[Buffet]

Australian bowling attack is toothless?? Someone please take this dude and make him watch a complete test game.

Aus has actually bowled well. It's just Pujara with his knocks ....

 

[Chrish]

Aus has actually bowled well. It's just Pujara with his knocks ....

Australian bowling attack is the only thing that has kept them remotely competitive, even winning a game. And it’s impossible to bowl effectively when there is no scorecard pressure on the opposition.

Add to that the immense workload because your players aren’t good enough to occupy the crease. So there is virtually no rest during those 5 days.

Indians have batted well. But saying Aus bowling is toothless implies lack of knowledge.

 

[Buffet]

Australian bowling attack is the only thing that has kept them remotely competitive, even winning a game. And it’s impossible to bowl effectively when there is no scorecard pressure on the opposition.

Add to that the immense workload because your players aren’t good enough to occupy the crease. So there is virtually no rest during those 5 days.

Indians have batted well. But saying Aus bowling is toothless implies lack of knowledge.

Agree with the bold part. If it was not for their bowling, they would have lost all 4 tests easily. Pujara batting time was too tiring for Aus bowlers and others capitalized on that.