Yasir Shah proves once again he is the GOAT spinner in the world today

[shariqnoor]

I like Yasir a lot but calling him the GOAT is extremely over the top. Yasir has some strengths and has done well but he's in some ways exactly like Ashwin. Bowls great when the pitch is completely to his advantage but is mediocre when the conditions aren't to his liking. Plus Yasir's bowling becomes completely ineffective the moment he starts getting hit. Always wondered why batsmen around the world don't attack him more. We saw at OT, Sydney, Melbourne how he got massacred when the ball didn't spin and batsmen started hitting him at will. he doesn't have many variations and does not know how to stem the flow of runs.

Even today if somebody asks me to pick either Yasir or pre-ban Ajmal, I'd pick Ajmal in a heart beat. Ajmal would not only build pressure, take wickets but stem the flow of runs in any format like no one could. He was our only world class bowler since 2010. Having said that, I give credit to Yasir for extracting the maximum when the conditions suit him perfectly and then he becomes a match winner.

 

[R0H1T]

More than anything it shows how poor decision was it to play 3 seamers. Add another decent spinner to the line up and Yasir would have ended with figurs of 3-100 or 4-120 with SL being dismissed around 350-380.

Pakistan is just giving extra runs by playing trundlers who can't buy wickets more than 1-2 wickets for 100 overs.

Possibly, there's also the chance that had Chandi taken his review SL would've scored 500+ & not been all out.

 

[sensible-indian-fan]

GOAT spinner?

)

He is literally unselectable outside Asia where it doesn't spin (averages 100+ at 4 rpo on non turning pitches).

Herath, Lyon, Ashwin and Jaddu don't have the same issues. Maharaj has been insanely good playing only outside Asia.

However Yasir is one of the very best in Asia. Delivers inspite of immense load.

 

[abughio]

There are many aspects to see.. before calling him great
1. He was lone spinner. Which ultimately make him claiming 3wickets for sure
2. Fellow bowlers were useless
3. Srilankan threw their wickets.opener and last two were gifts for sure
4. Questionable outside asia

 

[shaz619]

The likes of Ashwin will never win Tests for India outside WI, SL and India; the rank turner specialist is not worthy of shining Yasir Shah's shoes that's why he gets binned on flat decks

 

[shaz619]

Applies to you exactly.

No, specifically you. Can't understand cricket beyond numbers

 

[shaz619]

Number of tests won by Ashwin in AUS/ENG/NZ/SA = 0


Number of tests won by Shah in AUS/ENG/NZ/SA = 2

Just the facts guys

 

[ToeCrusher2]

Jadeja is the best spinner in the world today, Ashwin is second best, soon Kuldeep yadav will become the best wrist spinner in the world

 

[shaz619]

Ashwin lacks the skill and toughness to grind it out like Shah.

Ashwin is too dependent on help from the wicket and generally a lot weaker mentally as well so that will not help him, it also explains why he has not won any Tests in AUS/ENG/NZ/SA

Just not good enough am afraid

 

[cricketjoshila]

No, specifically you. Can't understand cricket beyond numbers

Numbers are a measure of performance.Alas your dramatic words, hype and all this shoo Shhaa cannot change the stats.

 

[ToeCrusher2]

Number of tests won by Ashwin in AUS/ENG/NZ/SA = 0


Number of tests won by Shah in AUS/ENG/NZ/SA = 2

Just the facts guys

Number of tests lost by shah against WI =2

Number of tests lost by ashwin against WI =0

Two can play this game

 

[shaz619]

Numbers are a measure of performance.Alas your dramatic words, hype and all this shoo Shhaa cannot change the stats.

Number of tests lost by shah against WI =2

Number of tests lost by ashwin against WI =0

Two can play this game

That would work but Yasir helped his team win both those series and bowled quiet well what a moronic example lmao you guys are never known for being the sharpest tools in the box. Anyhow, along with series wins against WI which you seem to value so much; Shah also helped his country draw level against England in England, Ashwin got nothing to show besides wins in SL/WI/India

 

[shaz619]

Numbers are a measure of performance.Alas your dramatic words, hype and all this shoo Shhaa cannot change the stats.

You're right:

Number of tests won by Ashwin in AUS/ENG/NZ/SA = 0


Number of tests won by Shah in AUS/ENG/NZ/SA = 2

 

[shaz619]

Ashwins stats are padded because he bowls on rank turners and is cushioned by the likes of Jadeja who support him, otherwise he's just an average spinner who is never backed to bowl on flat decks away from home because his peers know he is not capable of winning you Tests when the wicket is dead this is why Yasir is on another planet being a polar opposite to Ashwin, he is the GOAT spinner in the world today.

 

[sachin100]

Ashwins stats are padded because he bowls on rank turners and is cushioned by the likes of Jadeja who support him, otherwise he's just an average spinner who is never backed to bowl on flat decks away from home because his peers know he is not capable of winning you Tests when the wicket is dead this is why Yasir is on another planet being a polar opposite to Ashwin, he is the GOAT spinner in the world today.

A goat spinner who is the worst spinner ever to visit Australia.

 

[majiz]

Herath is best spinner in world, easily

 

[New Yorker]

A goat spinner who is the worst spinner ever to visit Australia.

Murli averaged 75 in Australia. Shah averages 84.

 

[New Yorker]

Herath is best spinner in world, easily

Herath doesn't get enough recognition, certainly. Would have liked him to do better outside of Asia.
But I fail to see on what basis one can draw any clear lines among the top four-five spinners today.

 

[shaz619]

A goat spinner who is the worst spinner ever to visit Australia.

Unfortunately for you he has still won Tests for his country outside asia and the west indies. Ravi Rank on the other hand did not have a great tour in AUS and also won you zero tests in England, he also struggles to get selected on flat pitches and is cushioned in your team thanks to support from Jadeja. On the flat surfaces of the UAE Ashwin would collapse after day 1 if India lost the toss and take his ball home, the mental midget can only bowl on favourable surfaces.

 

[shaz619]

Herath is best spinner in world, easily

He definitely deserves respect, unlike Ashwin and co who are an insult to spin bowling he has won a Test outside asia/WI for his country

 

[majiz]

He definitely deserves respect, unlike Ashwin and co who are an insult to spin bowling he has won a Test outside asia/WI for his country

Yeah,Last day herath dynamite is modern cricket treasure
Ashwin is crap and only one who comes close to herath is lyon

 

[rashmin]

Number of tests won by Ashwin in AUS/ENG/NZ/SA = 0


Number of tests won by Shah in AUS/ENG/NZ/SA = 2

Just the facts guys

Yep living in fantasy has nothing to do with reality.

 

[sensible-indian-fan]

Yeah,Last day herath dynamite is modern cricket treasure
Ashwin is crap and only one who comes close to herath is lyon

Nothing wrong with that view.

May I know why you feel that way (as in one is crap and another is best)? Is it because of the 5fer in Durban turner Herath took and an average of 30 odd in Aus in 2012?

Both are nice feats.

Cos apart from that, Ash outbowled Herath everywhere and even in both the series they both played together. Herath didn't do well in recent tour of SA and was lukewarm in Eng. Only time will tell how Ash goes outside Asia in other countries apart from Aus. 4th innings, both are equally lethal. In fact, Ashwin's numbers are much better as in average, wickets, SR.

Not saying your view isn't valid. Herath is a gun bowler. Just asking for the reasoning. Curiosity.

 

[hadi123]

I'm Pakistani but I do not think he is a GOAT, or even close. When things are going his way, he thrives but when the going gets tough like it did in Australia/Old Trafford he looks clueless. He always smiles and laughs it off but he needs to perform when the conditions don't suit him for me to rate him higher.

 

[mummad]

He always smiles and laughs it off but he needs to perform when the conditions don't suit him for me to rate him higher.

Seems like a nice guy.

 

[hadi123]

Seems like a nice guy.

Yes he does but International cricket is not about being a nice guy. He needs to start delivering on pitches that don't suit him.

 

[mummad]

Yes he does but International cricket is not about being a nice guy. He needs to start delivering on pitches that don't suit him.

But he is overrated by fans,he can only play to his potential though.

 

[hadi123]

But he is overrated by fans,he can only play to his potential though.

Yeah I agree he is overrated by Pakistan fans and I am one myself. Even on this pitch he took a lot of wickets but he bowled just under 56 overs. 56. That's 6 overs more than one innings in an ODI pitch. For me to rate him higher, he should be taking 6 wickets in less than that many overs.

 

[mummad]

Yeah I agree he is overrated by Pakistan fans and I am one myself. Even on this pitch he took a lot of wickets but he bowled just under 56 overs. 56. That's 6 overs more than one innings in an ODI pitch. For me to rate him higher, he should be taking 6 wickets in less than that many overs.

As few people already mentioned his fellow bowlers are mediocre so he is able to get more wickets when bowled so many overs.This is same SL side which struggled against Zim in Sl plus they are without their best player Matthews.

He also giveaway too many runs.especially in overseas tour he was going above 4.5 constantly that's pretty bad even if he takes wickets.

 

[hadi123]

As few people already mentioned his fellow bowlers are mediocre so he is able to get more wickets when bowled so many overs.This is same SL side which struggled against Zim in Sl plus they are without their best player Matthews.

He also giveaway too many runs.especially in overseas tour he was going above 4.5 constantly that's pretty bad even if he takes wickets.

Agreed. In conditions like these a second spinner ie Asghar in the 11 would really help him. Threatening spin from both ends seems to be the way to go in this series as SL have shown but Pakistan didn't learn. Seriously disappointed by our captain/management.

 

[Buffet]

I don't think that his wickets should be discounted because other bowlers are crap in Pakistani bowling unit. It's not easy to bowl and keep pressure if others are not doing well.

Having said that,

Manchester - 213/1 with ER 3.9 - Pakistan lost
Sharjah against NZ - 193/4 with ER 4.4 - Pakistan lost
Melbourne - 207/3 -- ER 5.0 - Pakistan lost
Birmingham - 172/2 -- ER 4.0 - Pakistan lost
Sydney - 167/1 -- ER 4.2 & 124/1 -- ER 8.8 --- Pakistan lost

If you notice, it's not about not taking wickets, but you are going to give 100-200 runs at ER of 4,5 or even 8 then you are allowing opposition lots of time to bowl you out. Pakistan could have easily avoided defeat in some of these games if Yasir was not thrashed so badly.

Yasir, as a bowler, have won many games due to his performance and he has lost many games due to his performance. He doesn't provide any control when things are not going his way and Pakistan ends up losing tests which could have been drawn.

Yasir has to learn to bowl with some control for making it to the next level. None of the spinners are ATG level right now, but Yasir is a very good test bowler.

 

[Mamoon]

I'm Pakistani but I do not think he is a GOAT, or even close. When things are going his way, he thrives but when the going gets tough like it did in Australia/Old Trafford he looks clueless. He always smiles and laughs it off but he needs to perform when the conditions don't suit him for me to rate him higher.

Pakistani fans need to accept that he is not good enough overseas and lower their expectations. Next year we are playing England in early summer so he is going to struggle like he did at Old Trafford and Edgbaston. Pakistan is not going to avoid heavy defeats overseas if it continues to bank on Yasir to provide them with the key moments because he won't. He won't get a pitch like Lord's and The Oval every time.

Our pace bowlers were poor in England and Australia and if that trend continues, we should brace ourselves for more whitewashes.

 

[Hasan123]

Pakistani fans need to accept that he is not good enough overseas and lower their expectations. Next year we are playing England in early summer so he is going to struggle like he did at Old Trafford and Edgbaston. Pakistan is not going to avoid heavy defeats overseas if it continues to bank on Yasir to provide them with the key moments because he won't. He won't get a pitch like Lord's and The Oval every time.

Our pace bowlers were poor in England and Australia and if that trend continues, we should brace ourselves for more whitewashes.

Hasan Ali will surely do better than Rahat,Wahab,and Imran did on the last tour of England.

 

[Mamoon]

Hasan Ali will surely do better than Rahat,Wahab,and Imran did on the last tour of England.

Unless the pace bowlers really turn up, that series in England is going to be shambles.

 

[Hasan123]

Unless the pace bowlers really turn up, that series in England is going to be shambles.

It could be, but again you are ovverating England just like you did on the last tour. This England team isn't anything special in tests and more then likely they be coming off a trading in the ashes so they will be a unsettled line up.

It will be closer than you think.

 

[CricFan2012]

It could be, but again you are ovverating England just like you did on the last tour. This England team isn't anything special in tests and more then likely they be coming off a trading in the ashes so they will be a unsettled line up.

It will be closer than you think.

no.

Last series England didn't have Anderson for a few matches IIRC, and we won one where he wasn't there.

 

[Hasan123]

no.

Last series England didn't have Anderson for a few matches IIRC, and we won one where he wasn't there.

I wouldn't be surprised if Anderson retired after the ashes.

 

[Hamza_]

[MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION] Problem is our pace attack is too bad, Abbas gets some reverse on these tracks but he is slow. Wahab and Amir are passangers. Yasir had to bowl alot of overs as a result and as others dont get wickets he is the only one who gets a few after bowling alot (First and Second Innings).

Yasir gets really effective in 3rd and 4th innings when wicket assists him. If our pacers can get a break through early on in 1st innings it makes things better, Also no one seems to utilize reverse or try to take wickets as if all pacers are there to bowl like machines from the other end with Yasir. Ehtisham and Shaheen look decent prospects for fast bowling, Wahab needs to go for good.

In my opinion Shadab is the real deal when it comes to spin bowling options. He is sort of bowler who uses alot of variations and has sharp googly, So his variations will take pitch out of equation to an extent and make him more successful overseas but he is very young and inexperienced.

 

[Mamoon]

It could be, but again you are ovverating England just like you did on the last tour. This England team isn't anything special in tests and more then likely they be coming off a trading in the ashes so they will be a unsettled line up.

It will be closer than you think.

The conditions favored us last year. The only Test where there was extra bounce and movement was the Old Trafford Test and we suffered our record defeat in England. In hindsight, we should have actually won the series 3-1 because the Edgbaston Test was right up our street as well but we bolted under pressure on day 5.

England in early summer is different from England in late summer, and Anderson was nursing an injury and Stokes only played 1 Test. I don't expect Anderson to retire before the 2019 Ashes.

Yes England are vulnerable and we have a better chance of beating them than SA later next year, but I am not hopeful.

 

[Mamoon]

[MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION] Problem is our pace attack is too bad, Abbas gets some reverse on these tracks but he is slow. Wahab and Amir are passangers. Yasir had to bowl alot of overs as a result and as others dont get wickets he is the only one who gets a few after bowling alot (First and Second Innings).

Yasir gets really effective in 3rd and 4th innings when wicket assists him. If our pacers can get a break through early on in 1st innings it makes things better, Also no one seems to utilize reverse or try to take wickets as if all pacers are there to bowl like machines from the other end with Yasir. Ehtisham and Shaheen look decent prospects for fast bowling, Wahab needs to go for good.

In my opinion Shadab is the real deal when it comes to spin bowling options. He is sort of bowler who uses alot of variations and has sharp googly, So his variations will take pitch out of equation to an extent and make him more successful overseas but he is very young and inexperienced.

Our pace attack is the reason why we were whitewashed in Australia in spite of putting up good scores. Winning matches on non-turning wickets has become impossible for us given how toothless the pacers are.

Wahab and Rahat are rubbish, Hasan is too raw at the moment and Abbas is not exactly a strike bowler. As far as Amir is concerned, he doesn't have the heart for it. When the conditions favor him his tail goes up, but when there is nothing in the pitch, you can see that he is not giving his 100%. He will probably get helpful pitches in England next year though, so we might see him among the wickets.

Shadab is too raw for Test cricket at this point, especially overseas. He will concede a lot of runs and if both of your spinners are going at over 4 an over, it is going to be very difficult to prevent the opposition from posting big totals at a good run rate.

 

[Sidilicious]

Unless the pace bowlers really turn up, that series in England is going to be shambles.

Your pacers will be fine. Its your batting that will be an issue. As things stand, other than Azhar Ali, not sure which other batsman will stand up and score centuries. Amir and Hasan Ali combined will give you an in with the ball.

 

[Hamza_]

I also don't agree with playing one spinner only in place like UAE. Yasir's workload needs management, Asghar or any good spinner would be ideal for UAE.

Surely Asghar wohld have done better than rubbish Wahab.

Bowling is really toothless these days, Which is big factor why Yasir gets bulk of wickets. Infact in last few years we have been doing better in test matches due to our batting, Chasing runs against SL and posting good totals while bowling has lacked impact And bite.

 

[IndianHero]

lol these pakistanis over hype every one hahaha like Babar azam being Virat kohli and Yasir being GOAT ?? I bet he is not even near that hahaha, Misbah's mantra in UAE was -- > Keep two spinners in the team & sometimes expand field for good batsmen and get them out.. any below avg. spinner would have got wickets but it doesn't make them GOAT lol.. Yasir is NOTHING infront of Ashwin or Jadeja hahaha

 

[rashmin]

lol these pakistanis over hype every one hahaha like Babar azam being Virat kohli and Yasir being GOAT ?? I bet he is not even near that hahaha, Misbah's mantra in UAE was -- > Keep two spinners in the team & sometimes expand field for good batsmen and get them out.. any below avg. spinner would have got wickets but it doesn't make them GOAT lol.. Yasir is NOTHING infront of Ashwin or Jadeja hahaha

Right bro, they do not realize the reality, Ind won all the games in SL. The same SL team (minus experienced player like Matthews) is making Pak team look like a club level team in UAE. But hey, "We won CT final". I hope they seriously realize the pathetic potential of their sorry team.

 

[Sidilicious]

Amir is a coward who hides when the going gets tough. If Pakistan put up low scores I don't see him putting in the required effort. He rarely gives his 100%, and might get conveniently "injured" again.

Hasan Ali wears his heart on his sleeve but he is still too raw in Test cricket. However, he is going to give his 200% every ball. Abbas is decent but he is not a strike bowler.

Its very unlikely that our pace bowlers will match the performance of their English counterparts. If we draw or win that series, it will be a miracle.

Yeah, but in May, the pitches will still be fresh and the weather on the colder side. If Sarfaraz can win a toss or 2 and put England into bat, Amir and Hasan could do some damage.

But even if they do get England all out for 200, the likelihood that Pakistani batsmen will get at least a lead of 100 or so seems remote unless Azhar Ali gets some support from Asda Shafiq and Haris Sohail. Thats your best chance in getting a positive result.

 

[cricketjoshila]

You're right:

Number of tests won by Ashwin in AUS/ENG/NZ/SA = 0


Number of tests won by Shah in AUS/ENG/NZ/SA = 2

How many has he lost againist SL and WI?

 

[sachin100]

so much bruhaha about pak pace bowling and all i see is excuses from pak fans for their hapless display and on other hand sl trundlers outbowling atg pace bowlers of pak team

 

[hafizexpress]

ATG = All-Time Great; GOAT = Greatest Of All Time.

Both terms have no business in this discussion because clearly, neither of these three bowlers are at that level yet, and probably never will be.

Of course it is not easy to bowl 75 overs, but what Yasir did not pull off a superhuman effort. Any decent spinner would have put in a similar performance in such circumstances. Put Ashwin or Jadeja in place of Yasir in this Pakistan lineup and they will look as good.

However, partner Yasir with a genuine wicket-taking spinner and he will not look as good as he looks now. Yasir has never had to share his wickets with anyone since his debut. Zulfiqar Babar didn't take wickets and neither do the pacers.

Obviously it is not an ideal situation for Yasir because he might get injured given the extraordinary workload, but there are pros and cons to everything. The cons are self-explanatory, but pros are that he is taking more wickets than he normally would in a wicket-taking bowling unit.

Haha you have to repeat the same things over and over again for these stubborn people to understand. It is very clear that Yasir takes most of the wickets because he literally is the only wicket taker in the team. And if someone is gonna ball nearly 60 overs and not take a few wickets minimum, they're average bowlers at best.
And I do agree what he did was not a superhuman effort but I still give credit to him for at least carrying the bowling on his shoulders.

 

[Mamoon]

Haha you have to repeat the same things over and over again for these stubborn people to understand. It is very clear that Yasir takes most of the wickets because he literally is the only wicket taker in the team. And if someone is gonna ball nearly 60 overs and not take a few wickets minimum, they're average bowlers at best.
And I do agree what he did was not a superhuman effort but I still give credit to him for at least carrying the bowling on his shoulders.

Yes. Unfortunately he is the only bowler in the team at the moment who is consistent so people are understandably over-sensitive over his performance. As I said before, any wicket-taking bowler instead of Yasir will take loads of wickets in this current Pakistan team.

Obviously, that does not mean that Yasir should not be given any credit.

 

[shaz619]

How many has he lost againist SL and WI?

He has won plenty vs those teams BUT:

How many has Ashwin won in AUS/SA/ENG/NZ ?

 

[shaz619]

Yes. Unfortunately he is the only bowler in the team at the moment who is consistent so people are understandably over-sensitive over his performance. As I said before, any wicket-taking bowler instead of Yasir will take loads of wickets in this current Pakistan team.

Obviously, that does not mean that Yasir should not be given any credit.

"Any Wicket taking Bowler" as in Yasir across all conditions to be specific and not inferior Indians.

 

[Cric1234]

Yasir should have it easier in the future with 2 spinners in UAE who's the best option Asghar is too young and raw Shadab is risky another leg spinner in the first innings especially.
The best option is Raza Hasan who has experience and has come back better than ever and looks primed to come back.

 

[cricketjoshila]

He has won plenty vs those teams BUT:

How many has Ashwin won in AUS/SA/ENG/NZ ?

You are supposed to win againist no.8 no.9.

How many has he lost?

 

[shaz619]

You are supposed to win againist no.8 no.9.

How many has he lost?

He has won plenty vs those teams BUT:

How many has Rank Turner Specialist Ashwin won vital Tests against AUS/SA/ENG/NZ ?

 

[Nikhil_cric]

GOAT bowler?? ) The guy has a lot to prove even now to be compared to the likes of Warne/Murali .

 

[ToeCrusher2]

GOAT bowler?? ) The guy has a lot to prove even now to be compared to the likes of Warne/Murali .

He has a lot to prove to be even compared to kumble

 

[UN talkz]

2nd Best and No doubt about that.....
Warne was and is the best.... and will remain gor sometime.

 

[cricketjoshila]

2nd Best and No doubt about that.....
Warne was and is the best.... and will remain gor sometime.

2nd best?

Better than Kumble Chandra Qadir Gupte Macgill?

Lol you must be joking.

 

[JoniInsafian]

lol these pakistanis over hype every one hahaha like Babar azam being Virat kohli and Yasir being GOAT ?? I bet he is not even near that hahaha, Misbah's mantra in UAE was -- > Keep two spinners in the team & sometimes expand field for good batsmen and get them out.. any below avg. spinner would have got wickets but it doesn't make them GOAT lol.. Yasir is NOTHING infront of Ashwin or Jadeja hahaha

What makes Jadeja great?? Only bowls on rank turners, dropped abroad.... He has been playing for india for 6 years and only 150 wickets... Already overtaken by yasir

 

[JoniInsafian]

Jadeja has played 22 matches in India and 8 abroad.... Not a single one in non-spin friendly conditions since 2014... It's almost like India are trying to pad his average on purpose...