11 inches of reasons to play Shaheen Shah Afridi not Hasan Ali

[Junaids]

I am bemused by the selection of Hasan Ali in place of Shaheen Shah Afridi at Johannesburg.

The Wanderers ranks with the WACA as the bounciest wicket on earth. Dale Steyn has often commented on how hard it was for him as a short fast bowler to learn to bowl the right length there.

To succeed at The Wanderers you need to bowl full enough to draw the batsman forward and then surprise him with lift from a full length. The taller the bowler, the easier this is.

Get your length wrong and you leak runs fast. Get it right and you’re hard to score off.

The wicket was made for Shaheen Shah Afridi, because at 6 foot 6 he has plenty of margin for error with his length.

But he has been dropped in favour of Hasan Ali, who at 5 foot 7 is the shortest fast bowler in world cricket.

It’s baffling, but it’s also horrifying. If Pakistan could lose the series 2-1 instead of 3-0 its reputation remains largely intact.

But that’s not going to happen with a 4 man pace attack in which all four are under 6 foot in height. At The Wanderers of all places!

 

[Abdullah719]

It was being reported that SSA is unfit. Not sure about that.

 

[ravisurya]

Hassan is 5'7 ??

 

[Junaids]

It was being reported that SSA is unfit. Not sure about that.

If he is, then Ehsan Adil or Wahab Riaz or Rahat Ali should be there.

You need at least one very tall fast bowler at The Wanderers. Minimum!

 

[topspin]

Ehsan Adil should have been added to the squad but Wahab and Rahat are as woeful as they come.

 

[TeymurBlake]

Ehsan Adil could have been really a solid option for this game.

 

[Bhaijaan]

If it was all about height then Malcolm Marshall would never become the GOAT.

 

[shortbread]

Hasan Ali is like facing a bowling machine, capable but no brains to back it up.

Doesn't have the smarts!

 

[BreadPakoda]

Bhuvi was the MoM when India won last time while both Bumrah and Shami took 5-fors. All of them along with Steyn, who averages 21 here, 1 lesser than his career average, are roughly 5 ft 10.

Ntini, who is 5ft 8, and shorter than all 4 named above is the most successful bowler at this ground. 53 wickets at 21!! Even better than Donald towering him at 6ft 3 who had okish returns of 44 wickets @ 28.

How does one explain all this?

 

[Mamoon]

It is not a our height, it is about quality. Hasan is bog average unless there is reverse-swing on offer.

Shaheen is good and exciting, but he is hardly the new Rabada or Cummins. These are desperately embarrassing times for Pakistan cricket.

 

[MeanAndGreen]

You can keep coming up with excuses but there is no hiding from the fact that there is a severe dearth of quality in PAK cricket at the moment.


Definition of mediocrity.

 

[Shandarchowka]

Shaheen is a work in progress. He will return as a much better bowler when we tour South Africa next time. Hasan Ali has earned his place with his performances over the past 2 years. Hope it answers the questions of [MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION].

 

[JibranAnsari]

Horses for courses is not the term familiar to our team management. Playing yasir shah in the last two matches is the prime example.

 

[hadi123]

It's good Shaheen was rested. No point burning him out in a dead rubber, we need to keep him fresh, I expect him to play a big part in ODI series.

Lol at people saying Ehsan Adil. Mediocre bowler, hasn't even been that good in Domestic.

 

[Abdullah]

Shaheen is a work in progress. He will return as a much better bowler when we tour South Africa next time. Hasan Ali has earned his place with his performances over the past 2 years. Hope it answers the questions of [MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION].

Agreed, Shaheen was properly trundling last game because his body is not used to 5 day cricket.
He has played 2 first class game and now 3 tests

 

[topspin]

If it was all about height then Malcolm Marshall would never become the GOAT.

Height isn't a factor when you have the bowling skills and pace of Malcolm Marshall and Dale Steyn but in the case of Abbas (let alone Hasan Ali) it is on grassless wickets in Australia and SA.

 

[Shandarchowka]

Hasan Ali is like facing a bowling machine, capable but no brains to back it up.

Doesn't have the smarts!

Is that how he won Pakistan the Champions Trophy and helped become #1 T20 team in the world?

 

[Junaids]

It's good Shaheen was rested. No point burning him out in a dead rubber, we need to keep him fresh, I expect him to play a big part in ODI series.

Lol at people saying Ehsan Adil. Mediocre bowler, hasn't even been that good in Domestic.

That’s the whole point.

Ehsan Adil’s Bowling type (tall fast-medium extracting bounce from a good length) is useless in Asia, including domestic.

But he has a BRILLIANT record in South Africa: in the 2011-12 Under-19 Tri-Series in South Africa the three standout players were Quinton De Kock, Ehsan Adil and Usman Qadir.

 

[Shandarchowka]

That’s the whole point.

Ehsan Adil’s Bowling type (tall fast-medium extracting bounce from a good length) is useless in Asia, including domestic.

But he has a BRILLIANT record in South Africa: in the 2011-12 Under-19 Tri-Series in South Africa the three standout players were Quinton De Kock, Ehsan Adil and Usman Qadir.

Ehsan Adil?! Are you crazy Mr [MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION]. Please tell me you are or that you're just trolling.

 

[BreadPakoda]

Seriously, Ntini disagrees with this thread. 5ft 8 and the best bowler at this ground.

 

[Corridor of Uncertainty]

Hasan's mind is scrambled. Without speculation, I feel it may be off field issues. His tweet said a lot.

In this way, he will become a convenient scapegoat for Sarfaraz.

Or I may be completely wrong.

 

[Cric1234]

What about Sadaf Hussain why has he never been given a chance tall accurate bowler capable of extracting awkward bounce he's quicker than Abbas aswell.

 

[Junaids]

Seriously, Ntini disagrees with this thread. 5ft 8 and the best bowler at this ground.

And Ntini was used to bowling here.

Hasan Ali has no experience on tracks with this bounce, and it shows.

 

[Prince of Pakistan]

We are just not good enough. Post 2010 we have relied on our spinners to give us successes.

Last pacer who troubled any side was Junaid Khan in the Asia Cup. Apart from him every pacer has been taken to the cleaners.

Loss of pace is a consequence of not feeling confident.

 

[Rayyman]

And Ntini was used to bowling here.

Hasan Ali has no experience on tracks with this bounce, and it shows.

How will he get experience without playing?

 

[jadaja]

For some people it is always about people who are not playing.They all of sudden become Bradmans and Holdings.

When will people like OP realize, it doesn't matter who plays they are not going to make any difference.The quality is not there.

 

[Junaids]

How will he get experience without playing?

Send him on an A team tour.

Send him out early before the Test series.

But don’t throw him into a Test match in alien conditions and expect anything other than 20-0-120-0.

 

[Birdman]

I think Pakistan should have played SSA here. This is a no pressure game and the management should have given him the room to be himself. All the practices and bowling in the nets will never amount to being there in the middle and bowling to top class batsmen. This is a learning period for the young man and he should have played in this game instead of Hassan Ali or even Aamir.
You don't get many chance to bowl at test quality batsmen in foreign conditions and this no pressure game would have helped him immensely.

 

[Junaids]

For some people it is always about people who are not playing.They all of sudden become Bradmans and Holdings.

When will people like OP realize, it doesn't matter who plays they are not going to make any difference.The quality is not there.

But it is.

Both Rahat Ali and Ehsan Adil have done well in South Africa before.

The squad was sent out with two fast bowlers too few, and with only one quick bowler 6 feet tall or above.

It’s absurd!

 

[jnaveen1980]

Hasan is a bang average bowler. He reminds me of Bilawal bhatti. Afridi is way better. If Hasan is a forced selection then Pak has more worrying problems.

 

[shortbread]

Is that how he won Pakistan the Champions Trophy and helped become #1 T20 team in the world?

Test bowling is different, very different!

Maybe I am wrong, but I dont see him set up a batsman, capable of taking wickets or control the flow of runs. Perhaps there are other issues, but Hasan is simply running up and bowling with no real logic behind the process.

Hasan's pace is what batsmen like, it's not threatening but the right pace that comes onto the bat and help them score. So either he needs to be really intelligent with his deliveries or generate swing/movement to deceive batsmen.

I understand it's not fair laying into someone who's maybe struggling for form, but with his experience he can atleast be disciplined and economical. Restricting the run flow to under 4 an over isn't a lot to ask for someone who's been playing test cricket for 2 years now!

Thats why I said its like facing a bowling machine, the batsmen haven't been challenged by Hasan's bowling this whole series.

 

[Birdman]

Send him on an A team tour.

Send him out early before the Test series.

But don’t throw him into a Test match in alien conditions and expect anything other than 20-0-120-0.

This is a dead rubber and best time for a youngster who is really good to play against quality batsmen.

 

[Invincible Gujjar]

Ehsan adil wahab riaz and rahat ali should have played instead of these trundlers.really pathetic.

 

[Shandarchowka]

Test bowling is different, very different!

Maybe I am wrong, but I dont see him set up a batsman, capable of taking wickets or control the flow of runs. Perhaps there are other issues, but Hasan is simply running up and bowling with no real logic behind the process.

Hasan's pace is what batsmen like, it's not threatening but the right pace that comes onto the bat and help them score. So either he needs to be really intelligent with his deliveries or generate swing/movement to deceive batsmen.

I understand it's not fair laying into someone who's maybe struggling for form, but with his experience he can atleast be disciplined and economical. Restricting the run flow to under 4 an over isn't a lot to ask for someone who's been playing test cricket for 2 years now!

Thats why I said its like facing a bowling machine, the batsmen haven't been challenged by Hasan's bowling this whole series.

I completely agree with you on all points. Maybe you're right about Hasan in test matches. However, I believe Hasan has the x factor and he can still be a good enough bowler in tests especially in combination with Amir and Abbas.

 

[Junaids]

This is a dead rubber and best time for a youngster who is really good to play against quality batsmen.

There’s no such thing in Tests as a Dead Rubber.

India was 2-0 down in South Africa a year ago and pulled it back to 2-1.

And that looks much, much better than losing 3-0. Especially since compared with what India faced there is no AB, no FAF and no Morne Morkel.

Remember New Zealand 2 years ago? A respectable 1-0 loss was turned into a humiliating 2-0 loss due to a crazy chase after Tea on the final day.

Never surrender a “Dead Rubber”!

 

[Junaids]

I completely agree with you on all points. Maybe you're right about Hasan in test matches. However, I believe Hasan has the x factor and he can still be a good enough bowler in tests especially in combination with Amir and Abbas.

Nope.

Amir and Abbas are two sub-6 foot, sub-140K short medium pacers.

They need to be paired with someone much taller and much quicker, not another shorty.

 

[jadaja]

But it is.

Both Rahat Ali and Ehsan Adil have done well in South Africa before.

The squad was sent out with two fast bowlers too few, and with only one quick bowler 6 feet tall or above.

It’s absurd!

We will change rules just for you.We will let Pakistan play with 10 bowlers when fielding and 10 batsmen when they are batting. Do you think Pakistan will win with these rules ???

 

[Junaids]

We will change rules just for you.We will let Pakistan play with 10 bowlers when fielding and 10 batsmen when they are batting. Do you think Pakistan will win with these rules ???

Pakistan sent 7 quick bowlers on the 1992 tour of England.

They sent 3.5 fit quick bowlers on this tour, to a venue where the hosts have played a four man pace attack.

Ehsan Adil should have been there today, not a fourth dwarf.

 

[Markhor]

Not against the point being made but what's Ehsan Adil's bowling record in the last few seasons of FC cricket ?

 

[jadaja]

There’s no such thing in Tests as a Dead Rubber.

India was 2-0 down in South Africa a year ago and pulled it back to 2-1.

And that looks much, much better than losing 3-0. Especially since compared with what India faced there is no AB, no FAF and no Morne Morkel.

Remember New Zealand 2 years ago? A respectable 1-0 loss was turned into a humiliating 2-0 loss due to a crazy chase after Tea on the final day.

Never surrender a “Dead Rubber”!

100% agree there is no dead rubber.This is test match , you play to win every match.

 

[Abdullah719]

Not against the point being made but what's Ehsan Adil's bowling record in the last few seasons of FC cricket ?

 

[Pete Rose]

Procavotive thread title

 

[Hawkeye]

Shaheen is a bit better but too raw. Hasan is mostly decent at best.

These are the best we have.

Your Cheemas, Ehsans, Mir Hamzas, Sadafs, Samiullah are bang average trundlers.

They're 50x worse than our current attack.

But as always, PPers LOVE those who are not even in the team and not international class.

 

[Shandarchowka]

I hope some of the 'elite' posters here saw how Hasan bowled after tea. Hasan is here to stay. He's a braveheart.

 

[tinkud]

Shaheen is a bit better but too raw. Hasan is mostly decent at best.

These are the best we have.

Your Cheemas, Ehsans, Mir Hamzas, Sadafs, Samiullah are bang average trundlers.

They're 50x worse than our current attack.

But as always, PPers LOVE those who are not even in the team and not international class.

How well Pakistan bowlers came back when they got reverse swing? Joy of test cricket and South African pitches throw up these beauties. Now bat well and grind out a victory.

Not a easy bowling unit at all. Just needed more practice matches at the start of the series and a little build up of confidence.

 

[MenInG]

Shaheen preferred over Hasan Ali - lets see if he justifies his presence.

 

[dhump]

Shaheen preferred over Hasan Ali - lets see if he justifies his presence.

Sad that Pakistan cricket is down to this point we are struggling to find a semi decent bowler to finish the quota.

 

[sahiwal_punjabi_786]

M hasnain is a talent and should have been played instead

 

[Savak]

Shaheen is incredibly over rated, doesn't use his height properly, does not move the ball. A wasted selection

 

[Saj]

The more I watch of Shaheen, the more I think he needs to work on his bowling and sort out some obvious and glaring technical issues.

 

[Sunny_majoka]

Taken wicket.

 

[BakuGM]

Both Hassan and Shaheen are struggling for form, I truly believe Hassan will come out the funk sooner or later as he has all the basics for being a good fast bowler. I have not watched Shaheen enough to pass a judgement but he has done well in the past so he probably has a form issue as well. It was a right decision to drop Hassan but maybe they could have tried Hasnain instead of Shaheen given he is also struggling for form.

 

[Markhor]

Hope people see why fast tracking kids without any domestic experience is counterproductive. This isn't the 80s and 90s anymore.

 

[Leeon1994]

We should try Hasnain in his place for the Afghanistan game.

After this world cup should probably replace him with Usman Shinwari.

 

[Sunzi]

I do think Shaheen is prettt erratic personally. Think with the squad we have it's a horse for courses, chop and change between the 3rd seamer as no one is inspiring confidence like, say, Amir. Wahab is quick and abke to swing the ball so will likely stay but he too is very expensive more time.

 

[The Viper]

He is bowling far too short. He needs to pitch the ball up more. Maybe Hasnain should be given a chance next game.