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Afghanistan is Pakistan’s principal enemy

I really don’t need to read a book: his legacy seems to inspire the separatists of today who consider the APS massacre to be a false flag and who don’t recognize the borders of the country. His final act of defiance was how he should be remembered by any one who believes in the physical idea of Pakistan

You mean the same way attaturk inspires Erdogan and the same way Thomas Jefferson represents the right wing in America
And also the same way malcolm x inspired Tupac Shakur
 
The idea of a natural friendship is fanciful.

Historically, the area which now comprises of Afghanistan has never been able to survive as a state by itself. The land is harsh, and even now there are little natural resources (e.g. oil) to allow the country to sustain itself.

So, whenever these guys would fall short of food or money, they would march across the Khyber, and raid Punjab and other parts of Northern India.

Its the fault of our own warped history that we don't mind the brutal 'skirmishes' hundreds of years ago that caused actual massacres - instead we honour Ghazni, Ghauri, Abdali et all, but cry that the skirmishes after 1947 are enough to sow the seeds of an everlasting hatred.

Point being that the Afghans, if left to their own state, will always look to push beyond their borders - its what they have historically had to resort to survive. Even now with the opium trade, they are still unable to make ends meet.

So you have a state on your borders that will forever be restless. No natural friendship there.

The state of Pakistan is also not blameless - but you would argue that the state has simply been proactive in trying to exert control over a people that have historically never let the plains of Punjab rest in peace.

And how do you think 30 odd million Pashtuns, plus the other millions Non pashto speaking pashtuns ended up in Pakistan today, there was no pashtun in what is modern day KPK before 1000AD, why will we not honour our ancestors for Not expanding eastwards, if they Did not We wouldn't be Pakistani today.
 

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And how do you think 30 odd million Pashtuns, plus the other millions Non pashto speaking pashtuns ended up in Pakistan today, there was no pashtun in what is modern day KPK before 1000AD, why will we not honour our ancestors for Not expanding eastwards, if they Did not We wouldn't be Pakistani today.

Who are your ancestors? The expansionist Pashtuns and Turks? Or the farmers whose lands and villages were raided?
 
Akki, you are right, not many would read his essay. A lot of fanciful nonsense about how Hinduism is borrowed from the Iranians.

It is true that the people of ancient India and Iran had many cultural and ethnic links. However the poor Iranians got serially conquered by Arabs, Mongols and Turks so that very little of the ancient people remain, especially the paternal line. That is the reason the paternal line (Y-chromosome R) is still strongly present in India and Europe while is very limited in modern Iran and Turkey.

Again I don't care of you dasyus want to read it or not. We're two different people. Deal with it.
 

3.8 is higher than 3.2 last I checked.

When Pakistan had growth rates of above 6, it was dropping just as fast as Afghanistan is now. When growth rates start approaching <3, the rate of decrease begins to slow down. Afghanistan's growth rate will tailor off just as Pakistan has.

Thanks for dropping by.
 
Who are your ancestors? The expansionist Pashtuns and Turks? Or the farmers whose lands and villages were raided?

Umm, Pashtuns are indigenous people to the region. What are you talking about "expansionist"?

Pashtuns are descendants of the ancient Pakhtas people, an early Indo-Aryan nomadic tribe who lived on the eastern frontier of Arachosia as early as the 1st millennium BCE. Arachosia was one of the five Indus provinces of the Achaemenid Persian Empire under Darius. Arachosia covered what is today from southern KP to northern Balochistan and Kandahar to Multan. Greek historian Herodotus mentioned these people in his writings as “Pactyan”

According to Yu. V. Gankovsky, modern-day Pashtuns formed when the Pakhtas tribe and White Huns (Hephthalites) merged together, forming a group of eastern Iranic tribes, which became the initial ethnic stratum of the Pashtun ethnogenesis in the middle of the 1st millennium CE (~500AD) and is connected with the dissolution of the Hephthalite (White Huns) confederacy in ~550 AD.
 
Again I don't care of you dasyus want to read it or not. We're two different people. Deal with it.

Not surprising, the science of population genetics is too heavy for you.

3.8 is higher than 3.2 last I checked.

Learn the difference between a level and the rate of change of that level.

No more replies unless I see something intelligent.
 
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And how do you think 30 odd million Pashtuns, plus the other millions Non pashto speaking pashtuns ended up in Pakistan today, there was no pashtun in what is modern day KPK before 1000AD, why will we not honour our ancestors for Not expanding eastwards, if they Did not We wouldn't be Pakistani today.

Not entirely true. Pashtuns arose from the region of Arachosia. one of the provinces of the Achaemenid Persian Empire under Darius. Arachosia stretched from southern KP to northern Balochistan and from Kandahar to Multan. Greek historian Herodotus mentioned these people in his writings as “Pactyan”
 
Not surprising, the science of population genetics is too heavy for you.

Where is your evidence? I provided several studies on page 2 for you to read, but you decided to ignore it. Why? I love how these Gangetic Dasyus are getting so up tight. You're probably just mad because science has finally proven what you've so desperately been trying to avoid all this time.

Deal with it buddy. We ain't the same. :lol:

DASYU!

29497979_1853395591387083_6063915959872126976_n.jpg
Photo: Results of ADMIXTURE analysis (K8) of world populations with a zoom-in on Iranian, Parsis, Pakistanis and other South Asian populations.
Source: https://genomebiology.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s13059-017-1244-9

Learn the difference between a level and the rate of change of that level.
No more replies unless I see something intelligent.

Why are you replying to something I posted to uSaqaf? Who are you again?
 
Umm, Pashtuns are indigenous people to the region. What are you talking about "expansionist"?

Pashtuns are descendants of the ancient Pakhtas people, an early Indo-Aryan nomadic tribe who lived on the eastern frontier of Arachosia as early as the 1st millennium BCE. Arachosia was one of the five Indus provinces of the Achaemenid Persian Empire under Darius. Arachosia covered what is today from southern KP to northern Balochistan and Kandahar to Multan. Greek historian Herodotus mentioned these people in his writings as “Pactyan”

According to Yu. V. Gankovsky, modern-day Pashtuns formed when the Pakhtas tribe and White Huns (Hephthalites) merged together, forming a group of eastern Iranic tribes, which became the initial ethnic stratum of the Pashtun ethnogenesis in the middle of the 1st millennium CE (~500AD) and is connected with the dissolution of the Hephthalite (White Huns) confederacy in ~550 AD.

Indigenous to which region? You can make an argument that Pashtuns are indigenous to Afghanistan, at a stretch you can say they are native to KP having lived there for long enough.

Pashtun's have never been indigenous to Punjab - so every Pashtun raid/invasion into Punjab and beyond has to be seen historically as aggressive.

All I have said throughout the thread that Pashtun's have historically raided into Punjab as their 'native' land was not enough to provide for them - hence the need to raid spoils from rich and fertile Punjab. Nothing historically inaccurate. The fact that there is military unrest through the Pashtun belt is keeping in line with hundreds of years of history - it is not a modern day phenomenon.

On your other nonsense, I'm sure that the Pakistan movement was spearheaded by Jinnah's campaign to say that we are culturally different from mainland India as we are 'Vedic'...:rolleyes

Jinnah himself was ancestrally a Khoja from Paneli, Gujarat. He was as 'Dasyu' as they come..
 
Indigenous to which region?

The region of Arachosia which is today a region that stretches from southern KP to northern Balochistan and from Kandahar to Multan. Greek historian Herodotus mentioned these people in his writings as “Pactyan”

You can make an argument that Pashtuns are indigenous to Afghanistan, at a stretch you can say they are native to KP having lived there for long enough.

Umm no.

Pashtun's have never been indigenous to Punjab - so every Pashtun raid/invasion into Punjab and beyond has to be seen historically as aggressive.

What is your definition of Punjab first and foremost? Are you talking about the historical Punjab territory around Lahore/Amritsar districts or are you referring to the fake British invented Punjab which occupies the former independent territories/regions of Bahawalpur, the Seraiki belt and Potohar?

All I have said throughout the thread that Pashtun's have historically raided into Punjab as their 'native' land was not enough to provide for them - hence the need to raid spoils from rich and fertile Punjab. Nothing historically inaccurate. The fact that there is military unrest through the Pashtun belt is keeping in line with hundreds of years of history - it is not a modern day phenomenon.

Everyone raided everyone back in those days. That's how the world worked. Next.

On your other nonsense, I'm sure that the Pakistan movement was spearheaded by Jinnah's campaign to say that we are culturally different from mainland India as we are 'Vedic'...:rolleyes Jinnah himself was ancestrally a Khoja from Paneli, Gujarat. He was as 'Dasyu' as they come..

You do realize that western Gujarat was part of the Indus Valley civilization right? :lol:

As for the formation of Pakistan, it was never made on a "Vedic" basis, but to use the present-day theory of two-nation theory (Muslims vs Hindus) is futile. It worked well when the British-Brahman elite were occupying us. Since 1947, we have neither of those two...so how can you use the religious two-nation theory to solve Pakistan's internal problems?

After 1947, Pakistan should have adopted a nationalist Indus ideology rather than this fictitious "Islamic Republic" nonsense.
 
Again the “Indus Valley Civilisation”. Get a life man.

Use your time in something more useful than these long and muddled up lectures on Indus Valley civilisation.

As for the rest of your racist and ignorant comments, they make me think that you are probably one of those “Afghani Fans” that were also proving their “point” during the match. Seriously...

I am wondering why the Mods have even allowed this up till now?
 
Afghanistan has condemned an alleged rocket firing by the Pakistani army on its soil resulting in civilian casualties and damage to their houses.

In a statement released late on Wednesday, the Foreign Ministry said the rockets were fired on eastern Kunar province, along a disputed border that Pakistan is fencing since mid-2017.

A police spokesman in the province said at least four civilians were killed and nine others, including women and children, were wounded in the rocket firings on Wednesday. Two houses were also damaged.

Kabul called on Islamabad to refrain from "unacceptable" artillery attacks and arbitrary installations, as it can cause further escalations between the two countries.

A lawmaker from Kunar, Wazhma Safi, said if Pakistan continued to fire over the border, the issue would be discussed at the diplomatic level. She said she believes Taliban rebels, backed by Pakistan, were behind the attack on Afghan soil.

Afghan forces stationed there responded to the attacks, Abdul Ghani Musamem, a spokesman for the governor of Kunar province.

In Pakistan, police accused Afghan forces of initiating an exchange of fire a day earlier. Mamoond district police chief Shahzada Kaukab said a rocket fired from Afghan forces struck a home in the district on Tuesday, wounding a woman and damaging her home.

Mamoond district was once a haven for local rebel and Taliban fighters. Pakistan says the army has cleared the area in recent years, although violence persists. Rebels who were not killed have mostly fled across the rugged mountains into neighbouring Afghanistan.

The development comes as a fresh round of peace negotiations between the Afghan government and the Taliban are expected this month in the Qatari capital Doha. The so-called intra-Afghan talks were delayed due to postponement of a prisoner exchange between the sides agreed as part of a deal between the United States and the Taliban.

Under the February 29 signing of the US-Taliban peace agreement, the Afghan government is to release 5,000 Taliban prisoners and the Taliban are to release 1,000 Afghan national defence and security personnel.

So far, the government has freed 4,015 men and the Taliban has freed 669, according to the Afghan government.

The Pakistani and Afghan governments often accuse each other of initiating fire in the border region, where rebel groups are often interlinked on both sides of the border.

Pakistan and Afghanistan are divided by the Durand Line, a 2,400km (1,500-mile) frontier with villages straddling the border and mosques and houses having one door in Pakistan and another in Afghanistan.

Afghanistan and Pakistan are in dispute over whether the border is officially recognised. In addition, Kabul accuses Islamabad of supporting the Taliban forces fighting against the US-backed Afghan government, a claim Pakistan denies.

In 2017, Pakistan said it had started building a fence along the border as part of efforts aimed at curbing fighting. But the move sparked condemnation in Kabul.

Meanwhile, German Foreign Minister Heiko Maas in a phone conversation with Afghan's foreign minister offered to host intra-Afghan peace talks if both sides agree, said ministry spokesman Gran Hewad.

Meanwhile, several rockets landed near a ceremony in the Afghan city of Ghazni on Thursday, where President Ashraf Ghani was delivering a speech, local media outlet Tolo News reported.

Two rockets landed as close as 200 metres from the area where the ceremony was going on, wounding at least three people, with one in critical condition, provincial councillor Khaliqdad Akbari said.

Helicopters were seen hovering over the city following the attack. All roads leading to the city were closed to traffic a day earlier.

https://www.aljazeera.com/amp/news/...&utm_source=twitter&__twitter_impression=true
 
The Foreign Office (FO) on Thursday rejected Afghanistan's insinuation that the military was conducting "illegal fencing" along the Pakistan-Afghan border, adding that it was being done to address "serious security concerns".

In a statement. FO spokesperson Zahid Hafeez Chaudhri said that the fencing was "fully in accordance with the established norms of international law without encroaching into Afghan territory".

On Tuesday, the Afghan Ministry of Foreign Affairs said they had protested the move through diplomatic channels.

In a statement carried by Tolo News, the Afghan foreign ministry spokesperson said: "Any action which has been taken by Pakistan, the Foreign Ministry of the Islamic Republic of Afghanistan has recorded its protest through the Afghan embassy in Islamabad to Pakistan’s Ministry of Foreign Affairs and the Pakistani Embassy in Kabul."

The report also quoted the deputy governor of Kunar as saying Pakistan was putting up fencing in a "shifty way" and claimed that residents living in remote areas of Kunar had also complained in phone calls to the media.

Reacting to the report, the FO spokesperson said that the Afghan side would be well-advised to engage on border matters through the relevant institutional mechanisms to "address any misconceptions".

"Regrettably, Pakistan’s suggestion for conducting joint topographic surveys had not been positively responded to by the Afghan side," he said.

The spokesperson also reaffirmed that Pakistan respected the territorial integrity of Afghanistan and conducted its relations with the brotherly country in accordance with the principles of the United Nations charter and expected "reciprocity from the Afghan side".

On July 30, at least three people, including a woman, were killed and over 20 injured on the Pakistan side in a clash between an unruly mob and security forces at the Friendship Gate border crossing in Chaman, while a heavy exchange of fire also took place between Pakistani and Afghan security forces.

The FO had later said that Afghan forces had opened "unprovoked" fire on civilians gathered on Pakistan's side of the Friendship Gate and the incident resulted in casualties after Pakistani troops responded to the fire "only in self-defence".

https://www.dawn.com/news/1574189/fo-rejects-allegations-of-illegal-fencing-along-pak-afghan-border
 
Senior Afghan peace official Abdullah Abdullah has arrived in Pakistan for meetings with a country seen as vital to the success of Afghan talks aimed at ending decades of war.

Kicking off his three-day visit to Islamabad on Monday, Abdullah, a former foreign minister and chairman of Afghanistan’s High Council for National Reconciliation, met with Pakistan’s Foreign Minister Shah Mahmood Qureshi and is also due to meet Prime Minister Imran Khan.

Relations between Pakistan and Afghanistan have long been rocky, with Afghanistan and its international allies for years accusing Pakistan of backing Taliban rebels as a way to limit the influence of its rival India in Afghanistan.

Pakistan denies that and in turn accuses Afghanistan of letting anti-Pakistan rebels plot attacks from Afghan soil, which Afghanistan denies.

Abdullah’s visit “will provide an opportunity for wide-ranging exchange of views on the Afghan peace process and strengthening of Pakistan-Afghanistan bilateral relations and people-to-people interaction,” Pakistan’s Foreign Ministry said in a statement. “Pakistan fully supports all efforts for the peace, stability and prosperity of the Afghan people.”
 
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