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An all-time India Test XI

Ab Fan

Ab Fan

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Alright then. We had one for odis. What would be your India all time test XI?

3 Pacers, 2 spinners( a must for India) and 1 wkt keeper.

Here is mine:

Sehwag
Gavaskar
Dravid
Tendulkar
Laxman
Dhoni
Kapil dev( C)
Ashwin( to add that batting a bit more)
Kumble
Z Khan
Srinath

I thought of adding Bedi over Ash but Ash provides you a useful batsmen too. What's your take on this?

Should Ganguly be there as he was arguably India's best ever test captain? Your take on having any of VK or Rahane or any current test bat?
 
Mohinder Amarnath
Ravi Shastri

need to be included.
 
Youngsters showing their age :)))

A proper Indian XI:

Sehwag
Gavaskar
Dravid
Tendulkar
M. Amarnath
MS Dhoni w *
V. Mankad
K. Dev
A. Kumble
Zaheer Khan
Srinath

Fantastic side. Maybe Ashwin could replace Kumble in time. Almost unbeatable in Asia (Ash replaces Khan there). 8 batsmen, 5 proper bowlers. Only thing lacking is a great quick.
 
bujhee kom said:
Youngsters showing their age :)))

A proper Indian XI:

Sehwag
Gavaskar
Dravid
Tendulkar
M. Amarnath
MS Dhoni w *
V. Mankad
K. Dev
A. Kumble
Zaheer Khan
Srinath

Fantastic side. Maybe Ashwin could replace Kumble in time. Almost unbeatable in Asia (Ash replaces Khan there). 8 batsmen, 5 proper bowlers. Only thing lacking is a great quick.
Click to expand...

India not having great test history doesn't help either for us.
 
Except Kapil and Sunny most are modern greats, shows that historically we have been very average team.

By the time Kohli retires he will comfortably surpass Laxman to make it into ATG XI
 
CanadianG00se said:
Except Kapil and Sunny most are modern greats, shows that historically we have been very average team.

By the time Kohli retires he will comfortably surpass Laxman to make it into ATG XI
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Without doubt post 2000 has been India's greatest period.
 
1. Gavaskar
2. Sehwag
3. Dravid
4. Tendulkar
5. Hazare (c)
6. Kapil Dev
7. Dhoni
8. Kumble
9. Zaheer
10. Srinath
11. Bedi
 
Sachin136 said:
Not having Amarnath and Laxman is criminal.
Click to expand...

yknow right only XI can play so there will be some who will miss the cut just by an inch. Al though id swap Laxman with Hazare( not even sure who is he) and Bedi with Ashwin.
 
How the heck are people excluding Laxman?

The guy has played some of the greatest innings ever.
 
Ab Fan said:
India not having great test history doesn't help either for us.
Click to expand...

CanadianG00se said:
Except Kapil and Sunny most are modern greats, shows that historically we have been very average team.

By the time Kohli retires he will comfortably surpass Laxman to make it into ATG XI
Click to expand...

bujhee kom said:
Without doubt post 2000 has been India's greatest period.
Click to expand...

Most posters here do not know much about India's stellar Test history. It was ranked #1 way back in 1973-74, series victories in WI and England in the early 1970s.

Replace Srinath or Khan with Chandrashekar. His spin is going to win you a lot of matches.

On spin-friendly wickets, a trio of the all-time great spinners would be devastating.
 
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Napa said:
Most posters here do not know much about India's stellar Test history. It was ranked #1 way back in 1973-74, series victories in WI and England in the early 1970s.

Replace Srinath or Khan with Chandrashekar. His spin is going to win you a lot of matches.

On spin-friendly wickets, a trio of the all-time great spinners would be devastating.
Click to expand...

Sustained success has only been apparent in the modern era for India. That is evident - yes they had moments of genius beforehand but not akin to consistently good sides.
 
CanadianG00se said:
No coincidence its when Tendulkar arrived and BCCI became powerful.

TENDULKAR is by far the GREATEST thing happened to INDIAN CRICKET
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I would say its all an impact of the 83 WC. The nation really got into the sport once we won something significant. After that, Tendulkar helped to bring more sponsors into Indian cricket.
 
Sidilicious said:
I would say its all an impact of the 83 WC. The nation really got into the sport once we won something significant. After that, Tendulkar helped to bring more sponsors into Indian cricket.
Click to expand...

That has changed the Indian cricket forever. With funds pouring in now we can expect more and more talent coming in than lets say during 80s and 90s.
 
Indian tradition is spinners and I'll honor that for sure, so my Indian Test team always should have 3 spinners.

Most of the players pick themselves- only few choices are 2nd pacer - I'll pick Zak over Srinath for that. One reason is that he is lefti, but more importantly he could use the old ball which wasn’t Srinath’s strength. Besides, Zak was a better bat.

For the spin options - ideally best 3 spinners to pick on absolute bowling merit should be Bedi, Pras and Gupte (Subhas). However, for better team combination, I’ll pick V Mankor over Bedi (though BSB is arguably best ever SLAO, but V Mankor was a Kapil, Botham level spin all rounder if his time), and I’ll pick Kumble over Gupte for his volume and his contribution to Indian wins.

Among batting, only open spot is No. 5, where popular choice looks like VVS, because I am sure most posters never saw GR Vishi.

For WK as well, if I am to go for a batting WK, it should be Engineer, not MS. But, I’ll go for a specialist WK, who was probably best ever against spin and certainly not novice with bat.

My team -

Sehwag
Gavaskar
RD
ST
GR Vishi
AV Mankad
Kapil
Kirmani+
Kumble
Prassanna
Zak
—————
12th Ashwin

For 16 member squad, other 4 are Srinath, VVS, Marchant, Bedi


Really tough call for Captaincy, because top 6 Indian Captains in in my book are Pataudi, Ganguly, MS, Wadekar, Azhar and Lala - none made the team. Probably, I should go for Sunny as Captain, but he was ultra defensive and used his Captaincy for personal benifit, which I don’t like.

I’ll take Kapil as Captain and ST as deputy. Like Javed, ST was a fantastic deputy, but he wasn’t decisive enough when given the task. He’ll make a fantastic deputy of a capable Captain.

May be on home condition, Ashwin should replace Pras, though I am not sure what he’ll do on wickets that doesn’t turn squire from 2nd hour of Day 1 and against batsmen who doesn’t start sweating on first sight of turn.
 
Although neither Vijay Hazare or Vijay Merchant played enough tests, their stellar record will ensure they are always in conversation when it comes to kite flying activities like selecting an ATG eleven. Both of them averaged 48 with some tough centuries against England and Australia. Merchant in fact averaged 72 in FC cricket and could have been the first Indian test batsmen to average over 50 if only he played longer.

Nevertheless, I won't blame anyone choosing VVS over this overlooked duo. VVS was a very special player. The only other debate would be around the spinner and once again, it comes down to preference. I'd choose Chandra ahead of everyone. He was devastating.

Sehwag
Gavaskar
Dravid
Sachin
Vijay Merchant/Vijay Hazare
VVS Laxman
Kapil Dev
MS Dhoni
Zaheer Khan
Srinath
Chandra
 
How is this ATG 11 gonna get another ATG team all out? Kapil, Zaheer, Srinath and Chandra? Good luck. Fearsome batting lineup though
 
aliasad1998 said:
How is this ATG 11 gonna get another ATG team all out? Kapil, Zaheer, Srinath and Chandra? Good luck. Fearsome batting lineup though
Click to expand...

Depends on which ATG line up. If it's Pakistan, it'd be easy. Probably tougher against Australia but hardly impossible.
 
AMSS said:
Depends on which ATG line up. If it's Pakistan, it'd be easy. Probably tougher against Australia but hardly impossible.
Click to expand...

Wouldn't trouble the Pakistani batting lineup anywhere except India where it would still be difficult. India would be a hard team to beat because of their batting lineup but for me that mediocre (for an ATG side) bowling lineup means that they have the weakest ATG 11 out of the top 6 teams. And a good bowling lineup in Test cricket is simply more important than a great batting lineup. Decently batsmen with amazing bowlers is much better than an average bowling lineup with ATG batsmen. The Indian ATG bowling lineup is just awful for an ATG team. I would back India to chase a 4th innings total the most though
 
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aliasad1998 said:
Wouldn't trouble the Pakistani batting lineup anywhere except India where it would still be difficult. India would be a hard team to beat but bevauss of their batting lineup but for me that mediocre (for an ATG side) bowling lineup means that atleast for me they have the weakest ATG 11 out of the top 6 teams. And a good bowling lineup in Test cricket is simply more important than a great batting lineup. Decently batsmen with amazing bowlers is much better than an average bowling lineup with ATG batsmen. The Indian ATG bowling lineup is just awful for an ATG team.
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See, that's where we disagree. While India's bowling is admittedly less awesome compared to let's say, Australia or South Africa, I find myself similarly underwhelmed looking at Pakistan's batting in its ATG XI. Saying that decent batting with awesome bowling makes a better team than vice versa makes NO sense at all. It's not a mathematical equation where you can make conclusive statements.

I can say with equal validity that while Indian batting would stonewall or pulverize the Pakistani bowling without a fuss, our seemingly underwhelming bowling would be more than enough to take care of the mediocre pakistani ATG batting. That India have historically enjoyed a longer stay at the top of test ranking than pakistan only confirms it.
 
Here is mine. I have included some oldies who deserve credit too.

V.Sehwag
S.Gavaskar
R.Dravid
S.Tendulkar
S.Ganguly/ M.A.K.Pataudi (C)
G.R.Vishwanath/V.V.S.Laxman
M.S.Dhoni(WK)
Kapil Dev
A.Kumble
Zaheer Khan
Javagal Srinath/B.Chandrashekar
 
AMSS said:
See, that's where we disagree. While India's bowling is admittedly less awesome compared to let's say, Australia or South Africa, I find myself similarly underwhelmed looking at Pakistan's batting in its ATG XI. Saying that decent batting with awesome bowling makes a better team than vice versa makes NO sense at all. It's not a mathematical equation where you can make conclusive statements.

I can say with equal validity that while Indian batting would stonewall or pulverize the Pakistani bowling without a fuss, our seemingly underwhelming bowling would be more than enough to take care of the mediocre pakistani ATG batting. That India have historically enjoyed a longer stay at the top of test ranking than pakistan only confirms it.
Click to expand...

Pakistan's ATG pace bowling attack is fairly uncontroversially Wasim, Waqar, Imran, who all played at the same time, a time when Pakistan was second only to the Windies in Tests, and India was nowhere to be seen, even though many of the ATG Indian batsmen played during this time.

India has really come into its own as a Test nation in the Dhoni era, which features only one or two ATG Test batsmen. The significance of India having a better Test record historically on account of its exceptional batting is accordingly rather problematic.

To see how the countries stack up ATG wise it may be worth looking at how many Pakistani bowlers would make into an Indian ATG attack and how many Indian batsmen a Pakistani batting lineup.

Not only would Imran, Wasim and Waqar be preferred over India's pace greats. So would arguable also Pakistan's 2nd tier of Fazal Mahmoud, Mohammed Asif, Aqib Javed, and Shoaib Akthar. There is literally no space for Indian pacers, though an argument could be made for Kapil as an allrounder.

With India it is not quite as dominant. Tendulkar, Dravid, Sehwag and Gavaskar would all walk into and over a Pakistani ATG XI, but there is still space for Miandad and Younis over a Laxman, Dhoni, Ganguly, or Kohli.

The only truly exceptional Indian ATG bats are Gavaskar, Tendulkar, and Sehwag by virtue of his unique destructiveness. This is not to take anything away from Dravid, who was comfortable better than Sachin and Viru at times, but Dravid is not a significant upgrade career wise on a Youhana.
 
New Yorker said:
Pakistan's ATG pace bowling attack is fairly uncontroversially Wasim, Waqar, Imran, who all played at the same time, a time when Pakistan was second only to the Windies in Tests, and India was nowhere to be seen, even though many of the ATG Indian batsmen played during this time.

India has really come into its own as a Test nation in the Dhoni era, which features only one or two ATG Test batsmen. The significance of India having a better Test record historically on account of its exceptional batting is accordingly rather problematic.

To see how the countries stack up ATG wise it may be worth looking at how many Pakistani bowlers would make into an Indian ATG attack and how many Indian batsmen a Pakistani batting lineup.

Not only would Imran, Wasim and Waqar be preferred over India's pace greats. So would arguable also Pakistan's 2nd tier of Fazal Mahmoud, Mohammed Asif, Aqib Javed, and Shoaib Akthar. There is literally no space for Indian pacers, though an argument could be made for Kapil as an allrounder.

With India it is not quite as dominant. Tendulkar, Dravid, Sehwag and Gavaskar would all walk into and over a Pakistani ATG XI, but there is still space for Miandad and Younis over a Laxman, Dhoni, Ganguly, or Kohli.

The only truly exceptional Indian ATG bats are Gavaskar, Tendulkar, and Sehwag by virtue of his unique destructiveness. This is not to take anything away from Dravid, who was comfortable better than Sachin and Viru at times, but Dravid is not a significant upgrade career wise on a Youhana.
Click to expand...

Let's talk about the 1989 Test series between India and Pakistan. The Pakistan team had the best bowling line up any Pakistan team ever had. Imran, Wasim and Waqar. The series happened in Pakistan. The crowd were at the notorious worst! The Indian team were at their lowest with a captain who wasn't sure of his place in the side, rookie bowlers and not the best batting line up by Indian standards.

The result : A draw!

Our best batsmen, Gavaskar, Sehwag and Dravid werent even in the team.

And you are saying the same bowling line up will beat our best batting line up when not playing in Pakistan?
 
Pakistan's batsmen tend to do well v India. India has a mediocre ATG attack - the weakest of the big 8.
 
Sehwag
Gavaskar
Dravid
Tendulkar
Kohli
Dhoni
Kapildev
Ashwin
Kumble
Shami/Zak
Srinath

Kohli is better than Laxman. I understand Laxman played some brilliant knock, but he also gets out cheaply many times,
 
Silly logic. Kohli isn't half the test batsmen yet as Laxman is and he isn't being picked for his usual batting position.

At 5, you have to bat with tailenders and Kohli is definitely not coming anywhere close to Laxman in that regard.

People need to regard Laxman's value as a test player and at his given batting position.

Kohli is a run machine but Laxman kind of players are magical ones.

He should be batting at 5 as he is best suited there.
 
Ab Fan said:
Silly logic. Kohli isn't half the test batsmen yet as Laxman is and he isn't being picked for his usual batting position.

At 5, you have to bat with tailenders and Kohli is definitely not coming anywhere close to Laxman in that regard.

People need to regard Laxman's value as a test player and at his given batting position.

Kohli is a run machine but Laxman kind of players are magical ones.

He should be batting at 5 as he is best suited there.
Click to expand...

Batting order can be adjusted.

Laxman was an Aus basher. I watched Laxman staring from 90's. He used to get cleaned up so many times that it was embarrassing. What he is great at is the ability to play big knocks when the team really needs him.

I still prefer Kohli. Kohli might not have a great Test record. But his record is still better than Laxman's record.

Kohli's average in Tests is 49.55
Laxman's average in Tests is 45.97
 
troodon said:
Sehwag
Gavaskar
Dravid
Tendulkar
Kohli
Dhoni
Kapildev
Ashwin
Kumble
Shami/Zak
Srinath

Kohli is better than Laxman. I understand Laxman played some brilliant knock, but he also gets out cheaply many times,
Click to expand...

At no 5 or 6 in a test lineup, you need a blocker and an innings builder. GR Vishwanath was far better than Laxman and Kohli in this.

and no Ganguly in your team?? I am surprised, troodon.

Someone said this about Douglas Jardine, but I shall borrow it - If the fate of India depended on the result of a cricket test between a World XI and India, I would choose either Ganguly or Pataudi as India captain.
 
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gani999 said:
At no 5 in a test lineup, you need a blocker and an innings builder. GR Vishwanath was far better than Laxman and Kohli in this.

and no Ganguly in your team?? I am surprised, troodon.

Someone said this about Douglas Jardine, but I shall borrow it - If the fate of India depended on the result of a cricket test between a World XI and India, I would choose either Ganguly or Pataudi as India captain.
Click to expand...

Ganguly does not merit a place in the team based on his average and impact as a player. You cannot have specialist captains when choosing all time XI for a country.

I only put Kohli at NO.5. I can easily drop Dravid to No.5 and put Sachin at 3 and Kohli at 4.
 
Kohli is not as good as VVS. How disrespectful to suggest such a thing.

1) Gavasker
2) Ganguly (c)
3) Dravid
4) Sachin
5) VVS
6) Dhoni (wk)
7) Dev
8) Harbhajjan
9) Kumble
10) Zaheer
11) Srinath

Sehwag was a tail-ender against the moving ball and will not make my greatest Indian XI. Ganguly is needed because he is India's greatest test captain.
 
Bilal7 said:
Kohli is not as good as VVS. How disrespectful to suggest such a thing.

1) Gavasker
2) Ganguly (c)
3) Dravid
4) Sachin
5) VVS
6) Dhoni (wk)
7) Dev
8) Harbhajjan
9) Kumble
10) Zaheer
11) Srinath

Sehwag was a tail-ender against the moving ball and will not make my greatest Indian XI. Ganguly is needed because he is India's greatest test captain.
Click to expand...

Harbhajan ?????

Seriously?????

You sure that was not a typo, man?
 
gani999 said:
Harbhajan ?????

Seriously?????

You sure that was not a typo, man?
Click to expand...

He was a great spinner in Asia and has also done well in South Africa, IIRC.

However, you would know better than me regarding Bhajjan's career.
 
troodon said:
Batting order can be adjusted.

Laxman was an Aus basher. I watched Laxman staring from 90's. He used to get cleaned up so many times that it was embarrassing. What he is great at is the ability to play big knocks when the team really needs him.

I still prefer Kohli. Kohli might not have a great Test record. But his record is still better than Laxman's record.

Kohli's average in Tests is 49.55
Laxman's average in Tests is 45.97
Click to expand...

Sangakkara and Kallis average more than Sachin. Younis averages more than Dravid.

Funnt how average is never a factor when a Don vs Sachin comparison pops up.
 
Bilal7 said:
Kohli is not as good as VVS. How disrespectful to suggest such a thing.

1) Gavasker
2) Ganguly (c)
3) Dravid
4) Sachin
5) VVS
6) Dhoni (wk)
7) Dev
8) Harbhajjan
9) Kumble
10) Zaheer
11) Srinath

Sehwag was a tail-ender against the moving ball and will not make my greatest Indian XI. Ganguly is needed because he is India's greatest test captain.
Click to expand...

Sehwag gets in easy. Why on earth will Ganguly open in a test match?
 
Bilal7 said:
He was a great spinner in Asia and has also done well in South Africa, IIRC.

However, you would know better than me regarding Bhajjan's career.
Click to expand...

He was good, but his 30+ average in tests kind of brings him down in my estimate.

I would choose E. Prasanna or Ashwin in place of him.
 
If anybody deserves to be dropped from all of your teams, it's Dhoni. And some of you are anointing him captain as well...good god.
 
Sehwag as opener, Dravid as 3, Tendulkar as 4 are irreplaceable and also kapil as no.7.
 
Varun said:
If anybody deserves to be dropped from all of your teams, it's Dhoni. And some of you are anointing him captain as well...good god.
Click to expand...

Dhoni was a terrible test captain and not even a great keeper. But if not Dhoni, then who?

He was a useful batter. Avgs a good 37 in tests.
 
Ab Fan said:
Dhoni was a terrible test captain and not even a great keeper. But if not Dhoni, then who?

He was a useful batter. Avgs a good 37 in tests.
Click to expand...

I was actually keeping Syed Kirmani as backup - purely for his keeping.
 
Bilal7 said:
Sangakkara and Kallis average more than Sachin. Younis averages more than Dravid.

Funnt how average is never a factor when a Don vs Sachin comparison pops up.
Click to expand...

Don is way way better than Sachin. No one denies that.

Sachin was only the best batsman of his generation. I would say between 1996-2004, he was the best batsman in the world. 1996-1999 was his absolute peak.
 
gani999 said:
The greatest No 3 in the history of test cricket bats at No 5 in your dream team??:)))
Click to expand...

Dravid could even open and still be effective. He is very versatile.

I don't know how can anyone select VVS over Kohli. No disrespect to VVS, he was very talented, but to me VVS underachieved for all the talent he had.

The thing with VVS is, he will have some unbelievable peaks followed by long strings of below average performances.

You simply cannot drop a match winner like Kohli from any format. He can will the team to victory. Even in Tests, Kohli had tremendous performances in Australia, all over Asia. In NZ and SA, he was good. Only in England Kohli was pathetic. That was 3 or 4 yrs ago.

If Kohli has a terrific series in the upcoming England series, you will have to put him on par with Sachin.
 
troodon said:
Dravid could even open and still be effective. He is very versatile.

I don't know how can anyone select VVS over Kohli. No disrespect to VVS, he was very talented, but to me VVS underachieved for all the talent he had.

The thing with VVS is, he will have some unbelievable peaks followed by long strings of below average performances.

You simply cannot drop a match winner like Kohli from any format. He can will the team to victory. Even in Tests, Kohli had tremendous performances in Australia, all over Asia. In NZ and SA, he was good. Only in England Kohli was pathetic. That was 3 or 4 yrs ago.

If Kohli has a terrific series in the upcoming England series, you will have to put him on par with Sachin.
Click to expand...

All over Asia? He has never faced Pakistan at home or away. Just the two tests in South Africa and New Zealand as well. Failed spectacularly in England and the pitches he batted on in Australia were some really flat roads. Match-winner? Hasn't won his team a single match in Australia, England, South Africa, New Zealand and Pakistan/UAE.

Yes, all he needs to match Sachin is a terrific series in England. :))
 
India's best test XI( since 1970):-

Gavaskar
Sehwag
Dravid
Tendulkar
Kohli
Dhoni(wkt)
Kapil
Ashwin(c)
Kumble
Shami/Zaheer
Bumrah

Reserves:-

Sir Ravindra Jadeja
VVS Laxman
Javagal Srinath
Rishabh Pants

Ashwin will be my test captain as he is officially the Richie Benaud of this era.
 
Gavaskar
Sehwag
Dravid
Tendu
Kohli
VVS
Dhoni
Kapil
Ashwin
Zak
Bumrah

3+1 attack, with tendu/Sehwag rolling a few overs.

In Indian conditions can add Kumble or prassanna in place of VVS
 
I don't agree with Dhoni's inclusion in Test 11. We had better keepers for subcontinent and better keeper batsmen across all conditions. Just purely as a Keeper Saha has not been any less, Kirmani obviously has been better. As a wicket keeper batsman Farokh Engineer was quality and ahead of his era .
 
Gavaskar
Sehwag
Dravid
Tendu
Kohli
Kapil (c)
Engineer (w)
Ashwin
Z Khan
Bumrah
Bedi
 
Gavaskar
Sehwag
Dravid
Tendulkar
Kohli
MS Dhoni (WK/C)
Kapil
Ashwin
Kumble
Shami
Bumrah

Would replace Kumble with Srinath in SENA.
 
I am making a team considering Indian Conditions that support spin bowling.

1. Sunil Gavaskar
2. Virender Sehwag.
3. Rahul Dravid
4. Sachin Tendulkar
5. VVS Laxman
6. Kapil Dev ( Captain )
7. Mahinder Singh Dhoni ( WK )
8. Vinoo Mankad
9. Zaheer Khan
10. Bishan Singh Bedi
11. Anil Kumble
 
Segwag
Gavaskar
Dravid
Tendy
Kohli (c)
Dhoni
Jadeja
Kapil
Ashwin
Bhumrah
Srinath

Probably one of current Indian quick would replace Srinath. Betting deep Xi.
 
I find Srinath a little overrated by Indians. Zaheer was clearly more skillful and was better overseas, won India a test series in England.

In 90s, India won nothing overseas and overseas wins depends on performance of your fast bowlers.
 
Dhoni as a Test captain is completely out of question. His record as captain is pretty ordinary and very defensive and one dimensional.
 
I haven't picked an AT X1 for years but here goes: (For home & away)

Gavaskar
Sehwag
Dravid
Tendulkar
Kohli
MSD (w) *
Dev
Mankad
Kumble
Srinath
Zaheer

Not much has changed. VK has come in and Ashwin may replace Mankad. In time Bumrah and co may replace the quicks at 10/11. Still, for all conditions that is a fine side.
 
The bowling line up India have today is their best of all time and atleast one or two players should make it into the side
 
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