Are Alastair Cook's defensive tactics going to cost him the captaincy?

[Cricfan4eva]

England's ODI side has given their fans plenty to smile about with their aggressive display. Morgan and then Buttler have instilled that no fear attitude in their game and it has gotten them great success.

However in tests its completely different. Cook is a good captain but only if England are winning, the moment England come under pressure he becomes very defensive. He doesn't have a great test team but he isn't inspiring them.

Last game they had to chase a very big total given the conditions so one could argue their tactic was justifiable but with just 100 behind in this test, what led to this blockathon? On a wearing pitch you are going to lose wickets to good ball, so why not take a positive approach.

England maybe now facing a prospect of an embarrassing innings defeat if others dont put up resistance.

Will this pile on pressure for Cook's removal as captain?

 

[Navdeep Srivastava]

Cook was never good as a captain but he is extremly lucky to have Anderson, Broad , Woakes type fast bowlers and Stroke as allrounder, their is never a shortage of wk batsman like, butler, bairstow and Root is already atg material . These players are winning matches inspite of his dumb captaincy, but somewhere down the line luck will stop shining.

 

[Bilal7]

Cook is a very average captain. Anyone captaining England would have a similar record to his.

 

[Sherlock]

Like if this is breaking news

He was always defensive and rarely, if anytime, captained on the front foot.

 

[Boi]

He should be sacked. Give Root the captaincy.

 

[Adijazz1706]

I'm not sure who they would make captain instead, we live in a time when Du Plessis is the only good captain imo

 

[The_Odd_One]

He is in fact one of the worst and the most defensive captains out there. How many times has he declared so late shows that he is extremely defensive.

 

[James]

He is no tactical maestro. But he has quietly led this side to some huge successes.

As captain, winning an away Test series in India and also winning an away Test series in South Africa have been great achievements. Not many captains from any country have achieved both of these things during their tenure. Maybe just Ponting? Not sure. But it is very rare.

Cook does not have the most consistent record as a captain on the whole, and in particular losing the Ashes 0-5 in Australia was deeply embarrassing. But he has played some fantastic captain's knocks, particularly in India actually, and given some of his results on tour it is unreasonable to dismiss him entirely as a captain.

 

[Bilal7]

He is in fact one of the worst and the most defensive captains out there. How many times has he declared so late shows that he is extremely defensive.

Being defensive isn't a bad thing. Being timid is. Cook is a timid captain and nothing exhibits this better than his complete lack of trust in his spinners.

He may have won series in India and South Africa but he's lost just as many high profile series as he's won and his captaincy did not have an impact in any of the wins, and to be fair, neither did it cause any of those losses.

Root should be given the captaincy sooner rather than later. That'll free Cook up to grind out a few thousand more runs and run Sachin close.

 

[The_Odd_One]

Being defensive isn't a bad thing. Being timid is. Cook is a timid captain and nothing exhibits this better than his complete lack of trust in his spinners.

He may have won series in India and South Africa but he's lost just as many high profile series as he's won and his captaincy did not have an impact in any of the wins, and to be fair, neither did it cause any of those losses.

Root should be given the captaincy sooner rather than later. That'll free Cook up to grind out a few thousand more runs and run Sachin close.

He was lucky to win those series in India and SA. India was going through a transition in 2012. Most of the SA batsmen were in poor form and De Kock was not a permanent member of test team.

 

[GLORY OF '92]

He was lucky to win those series in India and SA. India was going through a transition in 2012. Most of the SA batsmen were in poor form and De Kock was not a permanent member of test team.

Wish all captains had that luck eh.

He is the only option. Root is too fragile to captain.

 

[The_Odd_One]

Wish all captains had that luck eh.

He is the only option. Root is too fragile to captain.

Timing plays an important role.

India drew a series in Australia when McGrath and Warne did not play.

SA recently won the series in Australia without AB and Steyn playing because Australia had the weakest batting line-up in recent memory.

In 2012, the likes of Sehwag, Gambhir, and Tendulkar were past their prime. India was introducing new players. Vijay, Kohli, Ashwin, etc. were not the same players then.

In SA, both AB and Amla were out of form. Steyn was injured. De Kock was not in the team.

England did well on these tours but they caught these teams at the right team.

 

[Robert]

Will this pile on pressure for Cook's removal as captain?

No. But I think he will quit soon anyway and hand the armband to Root. I think that will be excellent because

1. without the worry of captaincy his run-making power will come back
2. Root will be a more aggressive skipper, and he may drop down to #5 in the order where he averages 70.

 

[Hasan123]

People say Cook can play for another 10 years or so. I firmly believe he will call it quits in 2 or 3 years. The reason is he has been playing for England for nearly 11 years home and away without missing a game. He has a young family and he's not going to get significantly better than he is now. He has been captain for a long time as well that takes a lot out of you.

 

[The_Odd_One]

People say Cook can play for another 10 years or so. I firmly believe he will call it quits in 2 or 3 years. The reason is he has been playing for England for nearly 11 years home and away without missing a game. He has a young family and he's not going to get significantly better than he is now. He has been captain for a long time as well that takes a lot out of you.

But he plays one format only. Also, I do not think he plays in any T20 leagues. He is one of the fittest players. Batsmen also have longer careers than bowlers.

 

[EliteCynical]

Being defensive isn't a bad thing. Being timid is. Cook is a timid captain and nothing exhibits this better than his complete lack of trust in his spinners.

He may have won series in India and South Africa but he's lost just as many high profile series as he's won and his captaincy did not have an impact in any of the wins, and to be fair, neither did it cause any of those losses.

Root should be given the captaincy sooner rather than later. That'll free Cook up to grind out a few thousand more runs and run Sachin close.

Wonder if he'd play under any other captain, having led them for so long and successfully.
Also, i think Root may not be ready for captaincy. I think it may affect his batting. I wouldn't mind gambling with Stokes or Bairstow. I know it is a long shot, but looks like those are 2 guys who seem to have the x factor (IMO)

 

[MMHS]

Cook was always defensive, no surprise in his delay at Rajkot. PAK batsmen goofed up after lunch at Birmingham, other wise Cook did enough to lose that series also 1-2.

But, I am not sure if Root is the right candidate. I find him a bit loose under pressure - often tries to hit out of trouble rather than hanging on with the skin of his teeth. These type of players often struggles on personal performance when given Captaincy, particularly when chips are down. Chappel I, Border, Lloyd were great Captain, but at the same time they fought against the tied when everyone left the boat.

May be I'll be proved wrong, but my hunch is Root won't last long as Captain - last 2 English players appointed as Captain as their best player - both ended in tears (Botham & KP).

If I had the preference, I would have appointed Stokes as Captain - really impressed by his fighting attitude (on & off the game). Also, I always like all-rounder Captains or specialist bowlers with some batting skills - some of the best I had seen or studied were either genuine all-rounder or batting/bowling all-rounders - Benaud, Grieg, Tiger Pataudi, Mushtaq, Imran, Armstrong, May, Dexter, Illingworth, Reid, Imran, Kardar, Jandin....

Normally, batting Captains are defensive - Chappel, Tubby, Tony Lewis, Lloyd were few exceptions.

 

[Pantani]

No. But I think he will quit soon anyway and hand the armband to Root. I think that will be excellent because

1. without the worry of captaincy his run-making power will come back
2. Root will be a more aggressive skipper, and he may drop down to #5 in the order where he averages 70.

This is what I was thinking too, I have been seeing murmurs that he wants to step down.

I don't know about Root moving down the order though. Who goes up? Bairstow's got the gloves so you don't want him to bat higher than five. Stokes is a key bowler so you don't want him to have the responsibility of batting long top order innings on top of expecting 40 overs per test out of him. Moeen Ali probably isn't good enough to bat at 3 but since he's been thrown all around the batting order throughput his career without a care for how the unsettledness affects his batting, might as well stick him at 3. I would play Root at 4 maybe.

I wonder if Ian Bell will make a bit of a comeback, because an elegant 32 ending with an uppish drive caught at cover is exactly what this England side could use at 3.

 

[Cricfan4eva]

He is no tactical maestro. But he has quietly led this side to some huge successes.

As captain, winning an away Test series in India and also winning an away Test series in South Africa have been great achievements. Not many captains from any country have achieved both of these things during their tenure. Maybe just Ponting? Not sure. But it is very rare.

Cook does not have the most consistent record as a captain on the whole, and in particular losing the Ashes 0-5 in Australia was deeply embarrassing. But he has played some fantastic captain's knocks, particularly in India actually, and given some of his results on tour it is unreasonable to dismiss him entirely as a captain.

So the approach with only 100 behind seems justified? It's not a one off, this has been the second instance. Which is a stark difference to England's ODI approach where they take opposition head on... Cook was good but is he past it now as far as captaincy is concerned?

 

[Markhor]

Graeme Swann says pretty regularly on TMS that Cook doesn't know how to handle spinners and that in his time, Swann would just set the fields himself.

Cook's always been a lead by example captain, he is respected by his players but tactically he is ordinary.

I don't think Joe Root as captain is a good idea however - anyone who knows Root sees a little cheeky brother type personality rather than a leader of men. Maybe he could grow into the role, but your best player isn't always the best skipper.

 

[Hawkeye]

Cook has been pretty average.

I remember his defensive captaincy in England too.

 

[Bilal7]

Timing plays an important role.

India drew a series in Australia when McGrath and Warne did not play.

SA recently won the series in Australia without AB and Steyn playing because Australia had the weakest batting line-up in recent memory.

In 2012, the likes of Sehwag, Gambhir, and Tendulkar were past their prime. India was introducing new players. Vijay, Kohli, Ashwin, etc. were not the same players then.

In SA, both AB and Amla were out of form. Steyn was injured. De Kock was not in the team.

England did well on these tours but they caught these teams at the right team.

Come on, England played very well to beat both India and South Africa. Sachin et all were over the hill but it's not like everyone was walking out of India with series wins. The English spinners, KP and Cook were all excellent in that series.

In the series against South Africa, you could say that they got lucky with the Saffers still shaken by the Indian tour and missing their best bowlers. However just a correction, Amla was the best batsman in that series.

Wonder if he'd play under any other captain, having led them for so long and successfully.
Also, i think Root may not be ready for captaincy. I think it may affect his batting. I wouldn't mind gambling with Stokes or Bairstow. I know it is a long shot, but looks like those are 2 guys who seem to have the x factor (IMO)

Graeme Swann says pretty regularly on TMS that Cook doesn't know how to handle spinners and that in his time, Swann would just set the fields himself.

Cook's always been a lead by example captain, he is respected by his players but tactically he is ordinary.

I don't think Joe Root as captain is a good idea however - anyone who knows Root sees a little cheeky brother type personality rather than a leader of men. Maybe he could grow into the role, but your best player isn't always the best skipper.

S. Smith, Williamson and Kohli were anything but captaincy material when they were appointed and they've grown into the role over time and have been decent captains, albeit not very good ones. Root will make a decent captain too which will be an upgrade from Cook who is mediocre.

Stokes and Bairstow will be burdened too much at too young a stage in their careers by the captaincy. Don't think the ECB sees either of them as realistic options.

 

[Adil_94]

Cook will stay on till the next Ashes if England get battered down under again i think he will call it quits from international Cricket.

 

[Hasan123]

But he plays one format only. Also, I do not think he plays in any T20 leagues. He is one of the fittest players. Batsmen also have longer careers than bowlers.

England play a lot of tests so he is spending a lot of time away from his family. He himself has hinted before the India series that he may give up the captaincy. If he was to do that don't see him staying as a player only for a long period of time.

 

[Mamoon]

I find him almost identical to Misbah as Captain, but of course twice the player.

 

[Robert]

Graeme Swann says pretty regularly on TMS that Cook doesn't know how to handle spinners and that in his time, Swann would just set the fields himself.

I agree, and look how Monty was ineffective in NZ without Swann to set the fields for him and Cook.

Swann was the brains of the side, in addition to being a gun spinner, fine slip catcher and counterattacking #8. Certainly our most important player of the last decade.

 

[JaDed]

After Saffers defeat England next year,he will retire like earlier English captains.

 

[Amjid Javed]

Cook has always been a re-active skipper rather then a proactive one, Hes done a fairly good job as captain overall. Yes england won in India last time round but overall since then then the long term think of how england teams were going to play In UAE/Asain conditions has been a poor one.. Would root have done a better job with these players? Am not sure!

 

[Bilal7]

I find him almost identical to Misbah as Captain, but of course twice the player.

Has had the services of some of England's best players ever throughout his career while Misbah has built this team up from scratch, when they were at their lowest point. Misbah is twice the captain.

 

[Mamoon]

Has had the services of some of England's best players ever throughout his career while Misbah has built this team up from scratch, when they were at their lowest point. Misbah is twice the captain.

It hasn't always been easy. England team has gone through plenty of transitions. He started with players like Swann, Pietersen, Trott, Prior and Bell etc. but they all left in quick succession for different reasons.

Root has been the only constant in the batting unit over the last fours years alongside Cook. Finding an opening partner for Cook was the biggest problem for England.

A lesser man would have lost the plot in 2014 under the amount of pressure he was after the Ashes thumping and the media backing Pietersen and asking Cook to be sacked. However, he steered England through all the chaos and rebuilt the squad with fresh players like Stokes, Bairstow, Moeen, Buttler, Woakes etc. and showed a lot of resilience.

The common thing between both Misbah and Cook is that although they are defensive, they don't allow the opposition win easily most of the time because they play attritional cricket and stretch the game. Misbah of course has been helped by the fact that between 2013 and 2016, Pakistan did not tour a single quality team outside Asia.

 

[Robert]

Has had the services of some of England's best players ever throughout his career while Misbah has built this team up from scratch, when they were at their lowest point. Misbah is twice the captain.

Really?

 

[Bilal7]

It hasn't always been easy. England team has gone through plenty of transitions. He started with players like Swann, Pietersen, Trott, Prior and Bell etc. but they all left in quick succession for different reasons.

Root has been the only constant in the batting unit over the last fours years alongside Cook. Finding an opening partner for Cook was the biggest problem for England.

A lesser man would have lost the plot in 2014 under the amount of pressure he was after the Ashes thumping and the media backing Pietersen and asking Cook to be sacked. However, he steered England through all the chaos and rebuilt the squad with fresh players like Stokes, Bairstow, Moeen, Buttler, Woakes etc. and showed a lot of resilience.

The common thing between both Misbah and Cook is that although they are defensive, they don't allow the opposition win easily most of the time because they play attritional cricket and stretch the game. Misbah of course has been helped by the fact that between 2013 and 2016, Pakistan did not tour a single quality team outside Asia.

For Misbah, it has never been easy. Hasn't captained a single test in Pakistan, received the band at the team's lowest point and still managed to beat Cook's England at home and draw against his team away.

Really?

Along with the guys he mentioned above, he's also had Anderson and Broad as permanent fixtures and these two make a great duo.

 

[Mamoon]

For Misbah, it has never been easy. Hasn't captained a single test in Pakistan, received the band at the team's lowest point and still managed to beat Cook's England at home and draw against his team away.



Along with the guys he mentioned above, he's also had Anderson and Broad as permanent fixtures and these two make a great duo.

UAE conditions are very similar to Pakistan's. We still have home advantage. England won't lose their home advantage if they start playing their home matches in Ireland or Scotland, or other Western Europe countries like France or Belgium.

Asian teams playing England in these countries will still be at a considerable disadvantage, just like non-Asian teams are disadvantaged when they Pakistan Pakistan in the UAE.

Besides, even if the lack of matches in Pakistan have made life difficult for Misbah, not touring a quality team outside Asia for 3 years has certainly made life easier for Misbah, so it works both ways.

Now that we have started touring difficult countries, we have started to crumble. Same would have happened had we toured earlier. We couldn't even win the series in Zimbabwe in 2013 when the conditions were quite tough for batting.

 

[Slog]

UAE conditions are very similar to Pakistan's..

Not true

But yes for a touring team it is like an away tour

 

[street cricketer]

Not true

But yes for a touring team it is like an away tour

I miss test matches in Pakistan.

Happened to stumble upon the highlights of the Irfan Pathan first over hatrick against Pakistan at Karachi in youtube today (didn't search for the highlights of the rest of the match). Guy was seaming and swinging it like crazy, almost like banana swing. Wondered how that was possible at Karachi..Usually you expect dry wickets at Karachi, not the one that was in that match.

 

[Slog]

I miss test matches in Pakistan.

Happened to stumble upon the highlights of the Irfan Pathan first over hatrick against Pakistan at Karachi in youtube today (didn't search for the highlights of the rest of the match). Guy was seaming and swinging it like crazy, almost like banana swing. Wondered how that was possible at Karachi..Usually you expect dry wickets at Karachi, not the one that was in that match.

the first 2 tests of the series were the flattest wickets in the history of flat wickets (prolly top 5 ive seen)

so pcb and curators received lot of criticism and they left literal shoots of grass on the pitch

also by coincidence it was cloudy that week too

i was there for third and fourth day

 

[AamchiMumbaikar]

After Saffers defeat England next year,he will retire like earlier English captains.

He will be 32 in a month. Retirement is a long away away unless he has personal issues.

 

[JaDed]

He will be 32 in a month. Retirement is a long away away unless he has personal issues.

Personal/Psychological issues of an Englishman is pretty common ,lets see though.

 

[Mamoon]

Not true

But yes for a touring team it is like an away tour

It is not Pakistan but you don't get more similar conditions anywhere else. In fact, it is better for our batsmen as well as spinners than playing in Pakistan.

For the pacers, Pakistani pitches are better. They were quicker with more bounce. UAE pitches are too slow.

 

[Robert]

After Saffers defeat England next year,he will retire like earlier English captains.

We beat them in their back yard. What makes you think they will win in ours?

 

[JaDed]

We beat them in their back yard. What makes you think they will win in ours?

English team has 1 year of up and then 1 year of low hasn't that been going on for a while?Also It all depends on Broad's fitness and Cooks captaincy.

 

[Bilal7]

UAE conditions are very similar to Pakistan's. We still have home advantage. England won't lose their home advantage if they start playing their home matches in Ireland or Scotland, or other Western Europe countries like France or Belgium.

Asian teams playing England in these countries will still be at a considerable disadvantage, just like non-Asian teams are disadvantaged when they Pakistan Pakistan in the UAE.

Besides, even if the lack of matches in Pakistan have made life difficult for Misbah, not touring a quality team outside Asia for 3 years has certainly made life easier for Misbah, so it works both ways.

Now that we have started touring difficult countries, we have started to crumble. Same would have happened had we toured earlier. We couldn't even win the series in Zimbabwe in 2013 when the conditions were quite tough for batting.

England didn't tour South Africa, India or the UAE between the years 2012 and 2016. Not sure if they have toured Sri Lanka since their last series draw there.

So no, it really doesn't balance out because Cook had the luxury of playing with a better team, in his home conditions and toured the difficult countries just as much as Pakistan did.

Misbah almost won a test series against Cook when he stepped out of the UAE and the NZ loss cannot be marked down under his name because he only played a single game.

 

[Chrish]

Cook alone doesn't decide the tactics on the field.. As for current performance, is it supposed to be surprising?

Eng have competed better than the teams of similar backgrounds.

 

[rollingstoned]

We beat them in their back yard. What makes you think they will win in ours?

Saf also won the last time they went to England, and generally tend to compete well there. England played well in Saf but they were fortunate especially in that Joburg test that both Steyn and Philander were missing. It should be a close series with England's batting depth giving them an edge though it would not surprise me if SA won.

 

[Mainul]

Not true

But yes for a touring team it is like an away tour

UAE conditions and pitches are similar to Pakistan's. Difference is that

1.In Pakistan there are a few pitches which have grass on it and favor fast bowling and fast bowlers enjoy some life on it .But there is no life on UAE pitches.This is an advantage rather than disadvantage.I don't think that Pakistani batsmen would have done anything good on those Pakistani pitches against South African ,Australian and English pacers.

2. Pakistan play only on 2 stadiums , at best 3 in UAE(Dubai, Sharjah,Abu Dhabi) and has been doing that for last 7 years.So they have become so much familiar to these pitches.In Pakistan there are 7 to 8 regular international venues,perhaps more than that with different conditions.

Even Pakistan achieved better results in UAE as their home in tests than playing in Pakistan.There is no disadvantage except lack of crowd support in UAE which can negatively influence Pakistan.

But i don't mean that playing in UAE is more pleasant than playing at home.I am just trying to say that UAE has become truly a home with home advantages for Pakistan.

 

[Slog]

UAE conditions and pitches are similar to Pakistan's. Difference is that

1.In Pakistan there are a few pitches which have grass on it and favor fast bowling and fast bowlers enjoy some life on it .But there is no life on UAE pitches.This is an advantage rather than disadvantage.I don't think that Pakistani batsmen would have done anything good on those Pakistani pitches against South African ,Australian and English pacers.

2. Pakistan play only on 2 stadiums , at best 3 in UAE(Dubai, Sharjah,Abu Dhabi) and has been doing that for last 7 years.So they have become so much familiar to these pitches.In Pakistan there are 7 to 8 regular international venues,perhaps more than that with different conditions.

Even Pakistan achieved better results in UAE as their home in tests than playing in Pakistan.There is no disadvantage except lack of crowd support in UAE which can negatively influence Pakistan.

But i don't mean that playing in UAE is more pleasant than playing at home.I am just trying to say that UAE has become truly a home with home advantages for Pakistan.

Yes. However for youngsters it is a big change which takes getting used to when they come from domestic Pakistani pitches to UAE pitches. Esp in the past 5-6 years the nature of Pakistani pitches have changed a lot so these are very different. So Pak youngsters dont get to pay their initial matches on same pitches where they did well in domestics

However my point was that for the touring team it is still alien conditions whereas majority of Pak team has played considerable number of matches on them so it isnt a case where the advantages you get from hoem series is totally gone

 

[Robert]

English team has 1 year of up and then 1 year of low hasn't that been going on for a while?Also It all depends on Broad's fitness and Cooks captaincy.

We have not lost a home series in five years.

 

[Junaids]

Saf also won the last time they went to England, and generally tend to compete well there. England played well in Saf but they were fortunate especially in that Joburg test that both Steyn and Philander were missing. It should be a close series with England's batting depth giving them an edge though it would not surprise me if SA won.

South Africa is really weak currently, and the quotas make them weaker still.

Their only players who would get into the England team now are Quinton De Kock and AB De Villiers.

 

[waterlemming]

We have not lost a home series in five years.

Lost to Sri Lanka 1-0 in 2014.

Would say that was the low point of Cook's captaincy right after the Lankan series loss and the loss at Lords to India. His batting was dire as well and he came back quite well to eventually beat India 3-1 in the series.

 

[JaDed]

We have not lost a home series in five years.

Engand lost in 2014 to Lanka a test series how is that 5 years ago??

 

[Robert]

Engand lost in 2014 to Lanka a test series how is that 5 years ago??

Did we? OK, I stand corrected. I remember stuff from thirty years ago better than a couple of years back.

 

[GLORY OF '92]

South Africa is really weak currently, and the quotas make them weaker still.

Their only players who would get into the England team now are Quinton De Kock and AB De Villiers.

Rabada too.
Abbott is pretty impressive.

 

[JaDed]

Did we? OK, I stand corrected. I remember stuff from thirty years ago better than a couple of years back.

Np, i do get your point though about England being strong at home but it has a lot to do with Anderson and Broad imo.

Also yeah i too remember things more clearly from 2 decades ago than say 2 years ago not sure why is that ,was jus speaking abt that with my parents.

 

[MMHS]

South Africa is really weak currently, and the quotas make them weaker still.

Their only players who would get into the England team now are Quinton De Kock and AB De Villiers.

So, I make a XII, with both teams with alternatives as per your assesment -

1. Cook/Cook
2. Hasib/Elgar
3. Root/Amla
4. Moeen/Faf
5. Jonhy/AB
6. Stokes/Bavuma
7. Josh/De Kok
8. Woakes/Phillander
9. Adil/Abbott
10. Ansari/Maharaj
11. Berbi/Rabada
12. Jimmi/Styen

By your logic (2 vs 9 players in a mixed XI) - this ENG side should win 4-1 against SAF & 5-0 in next Ashes tour.

This one sounds to me like your claim of Ansari being better than Jaddu or Kohli's mistake of not trying to chase at Rajkot; because - THAT COULD BE THE ONLY SNIFF OF WINNING CHANCE INDIA CAN HAVE IN THIS ONGOING SERIES.

 

[Cricfan4eva]

Did we? OK, I stand corrected. I remember stuff from thirty years ago better than a couple of years back.

Will England persist with Cook despite 4-0 or with less than a year left for the next Ashes England will want Root to get some experience? And what of Trevor Bayliss? Is his place going to be secure?

 

[rollingstoned]

South Africa is really weak currently, and the quotas make them weaker still.

Their only players who would get into the England team now are Quinton De Kock and AB De Villiers.

What rubbish. you keep peddling the quota conspiracy when the coloured players are quite good and the Saf team ain't really that weak. Also no, Amla, Steyn, Philander and Rabada will all get into the England team who don't have a much superior batting unit either just better depth. You are grossly overrating England and underrating Saf here.

 

[Mamoon]

England didn't tour South Africa, India or the UAE between the years 2012 and 2016. Not sure if they have toured Sri Lanka since their last series draw there.

So no, it really doesn't balance out because Cook had the luxury of playing with a better team, in his home conditions and toured the difficult countries just as much as Pakistan did.

Misbah almost won a test series against Cook when he stepped out of the UAE and the NZ loss cannot be marked down under his name because he only played a single game.

Isn't it interesting that when discussing the captaincy of Misbah and Cook, England suddenly become a better Test team than Pakistan, whereas otherwise, Pakistan is not only a better Test team than England but apparently the best Test team in the world?

And Cook did lead England in Australia 2014, against a rampant Johnson and a ruthless Australia. Misbah during that period didn't tour a single tough team outside Asia.

Besides, we would have lost the second Test with Misbah as well. He couldn't do anything about the loss in the first Test and it would have been no different in the second Test either.

It's not as if he was going to make it 1-1. He can't bat for Younis and co., and neither can he bowl for the team. We were simply not good enough for those green pitches, regardless of who led the team.

There is no point in demeaning Cook to prove Misbah is better and vice versa. As I originally said, both are good Test captains and very similar to each other. Cook though is a much better batsman and will go down as a bigger legend than Misbah outside Pakistan.

 

[Mainul]

Yes. However for youngsters it is a big change which takes getting used to when they come from domestic Pakistani pitches to UAE pitches. Esp in the past 5-6 years the nature of Pakistani pitches have changed a lot so these are very different. So Pak youngsters dont get to pay their initial matches on same pitches where they did well in domestics

However my point was that for the touring team it is still alien conditions whereas majority of Pak team has played considerable number of matches on them so it isnt a case where the advantages you get from hoem series is totally gone

Pakistan test team is quite settled and hardly a new comer came into the test team over the years.

Regarding pitches, yes, Pakistani pitches have become harder to score on for the last few years.There are very often low total scores with pacers getting lot of wickets in domestic matches.But i wonder still then Pakistani batsmen seems to be in a sea in New Zealand.Pakistani batsmen must have been accustomed on playing pacer friendly conditions! Do you have any explanation for this? Just curious to know.

 

[HitWicket]

What rubbish. you keep peddling the quota conspiracy when the coloured players are quite good and the Saf team ain't really that weak. Also no, Amla, Steyn, Philander and Rabada will all get into the England team who don't have a much superior batting unit either just better depth. You are grossly overrating England and underrating Saf here.

Don't think Philander would get in a combined tean to be fair. In reality you'd pick 3 from

Steyn
Broad
Rabada
Anderson
Philander
Woakes

 

[Robert]

To be fair to Chef, all the tactics in the world will not help much when your top five keeps getting knocked over for peanuts.

 

[The_Odd_One]

Cook had the same advantage which Ponting had with McGrath and Warne. Anderson and Broad are like ATGs in helpful conditions (England play most of their matches in these conditions).

 

[Mamoon]

Cook had the same advantage which Ponting had with McGrath and Warne. Anderson and Broad are like ATGs in helpful conditions (England play most of their matches in these conditions).

This advantage can be extended to any captain, no?

Smith because he had Steyn and also Philander, Misbah because he had Ajmal and now Yasir, Kohli because he has Ashwin and even Jadeja etc.

All of these bowlers bowl like ATGs at home/helpful conditions.

 

[Cricfan4eva]

If England go onto lose this test, its hard to see Cook retaining his place as captain.

England won the toss, England put up a good score but England put themselves at disadvantage by playing an extra pacer, to add to the team's troubles Cook underutilised them and overused his main weapons to the extent that they became non effective.

Cook was never an imaginative or exciting captain but over here he just seems clueless and he's probably squandered a good chance to win a test in this series.