Assessment of Foreign Players in PSL 2017 (Group Stages)

[msb314]

1) Darren Sammy

Assessment: Seems to get sympathy points for wanting to play the final in Lahore but otherwise has done nothing for Zalmi this PSL so far.

Verdict: Discard

2) Shane Watson

Assessment: His batting has been a huge letdown compared to last season's PSL and his dibbly dobbly medium pace bowling was always going to be ineffective on UAE pitches.

Verdict: Discard

3) Sunil Narine

Assessment: Pick of the foreign bowlers so far - also shown potential with some good lower order hitting to add firepower to the Qalandar's side.

Verdict: Keep

4) Brendan McCullum

Assessment: Despite being an aggressive captain - he only once influenced the game with his captaincy in the low scoring thriller vs. Zalmi. His batting has been horrendously poor and his lack of runs clearly impacted Qalandar's campaign.

Verdict: Discard

5) Kevin Pietersen

Assessment: Too hit and miss for my liking - played a blinder against Qalandar's when chasing 201 and a few good 30-40's in other games but should look to be more consistent.

Verdict: Keep

6) Rilee Roussow

Assessment: Hig a blistering start to his PSL career in the first few matches with some match winning knocks. Has cooled down since then and has shown a tendency to throw his wicket away - even during easy chases. Should just relax a bit more.

Verdict: Keep

7) Chris Gayle

Assessment: Barring a decent knock today - has been in horrendous form and not made any contributions too Karach Kings totals. Should put more value on his wicket and stay at the crease more for the remainder of the tournament.

Verdict: Discard

8) Kumar Sangakkara.

Assessment: Made some decent contributions for the Kings but otherwise has not made a bang for a player who is exceptionally good against spin and in Asian conditions. Age is catching up to him but looks to be a good mentor and coach for the youngers players like Babar. Effective when chasing totals in the >130 range.

Verdict: Keep (just...)

9) Kieron Pollard

Assessment: Find of the tournmanet so far for Kings. Played some great knocks for them whilst chasing and playing the finisher role.

Verdict: Keep

10) Brad Haddin

Assessment: Not good enough for T20's despite playing one good knock.

Verdict: Discard

11) Chris Jordan

Assessment: Same as Sammy

Verdict: Discard

12) Jason Roy

Assessment: The best player for Qalandar's who was helping them provide strong starts in all games when he was playing - their campaign fell apart as soon as he left.

Verdict: Keep

13) Grant Elliot

Assessment; Despite not being the most high profile player in the PSL - he has shown a good whilst chasing for Qalandar's and can hit the big shots too. Maybe needs to move up the order.

Verdict: Keep

14) Eoin Morgan

Assessment: One good knock for Zalmi but otherwise has done nothing for them this campaign. Playing on reputation it seems like.

Verdict: Keep (just...)

15) DR Smith

Assessment: Despite being labelled as a hack - has been the best player for IU this campaign and rightfully leads the run scoring charts for this year's PSL.

Verdict: Keep

16) Ravi Bopara

Assessment: Had a tremendous tournament last year but is struggling very badly this time round. Not a single substantial score from his this campaign.

Verdict: Discard

17) Tamim Iqbal

Assessment: Played one good knock but has otherwise struggled for consistency in a shortened campaign for him.

Verdict: Keep (just...)


18) Sam Billings

Assessment: One knock wonder like so many others but to be fair to him - has not been given enough chances.

Verdict: Keep (just...)

19) Mahmadullah

Assessment: Useful contributions as an all-rounder but nothing substantial - useful as a fringe player for the Gladiators.

Verdict: Keep

20) Tymal Mills

Assessment: Pick of the foreign fast bowlers in the PSL so far - very unlucky against Hassan Ali last game. Great pace and has picked up vital wickets too. Good find by the Gladiators.

Verdict: Keep


The rest of the foreign players have not played enough games to warrant a good conclusion.

Please discuss!

 

[cricketerB94]

Grant Elliott: Discard.
Agree with others.

 

[Square Drive]

Watson's batting has been quite decent IMO. Would keep him.

Harsh on Jordan who was given limited chances, and a bit lenient towards Elliott who flopped for the majority of the tournament.

Rest seems fine.

 

[msb314]

Grant Elliott: Discard.
Agree with others.

Elliot is a useful bits and pieces players who can occasionally play a blinder with the bat or at very least play a supporting role with the bat when others are taking charge. His bowling is decent and economical as well so I would be inclined to keep him.

 

[msb314]

Elliot is a useful bits and pieces players who can occasionally play a blinder with the bat or at very least play a supporting role with the bat when others are taking charge. His bowling is decent and economical as well so I would be inclined to keep him.

[MENTION=100918]Square Drive[/MENTION]

 

[msb314]

Watson's batting has been quite decent IMO. Would keep him.

Harsh on Jordan who was given limited chances, and a bit lenient towards Elliott who flopped for the majority of the tournament.

Rest seems fine.

Fair enough but did nothing in the 3 games he did play in.

 

[Square Drive]

Yeah I'd probably still keep Elliott tbh.

Useful cricketer.

 

[Hasan123]

Watson should be kept, his batting has been fine especially as he's batting lower down the order.

Want to see some South African players and more of the England players.

 

[WC-Passion]

Would have been interesting to see Finn play. Roy was massive for us, the only real consistent player.

 

[msb314]

Watson should be kept, his batting has been fine especially as he's batting lower down the order.

Want to see some South African players and more of the England players.

I'd like to see more Australians too like Warner, Smith, Maxwell and Starc.

 

[msb314]

Would have been interesting to see Finn play. Roy was massive for us, the only real consistent player.

Oh yeah what happened to Finn?

 

[Hasan123]

I'd like to see more Australians too like Warner, Smith, Maxwell and Starc.

No chance of Smith,Warner, and Starc.

Maxwell depends on if he's playing test cricket or not

 

[msb314]

No chance of Smith,Warner, and Starc.

Maxwell depends on if he's playing test cricket or not

Why not?

 

[Gotham Cronie]

Do you have replacements?

 

[MMHS]

I think, PSL's scouting strategy was flawed for 2nd year - we are talking strictly about foreigners here. They went for retired or out of favor big names, which was fine for first year as players like Gayle, KP, Sanga, Watson, Mahela .... ads status to the brand. By 2nd year, it wasn't required much & these players got older by a year in wrong direction.

It might be difficult to hire top players from ENG, AUS, SAF who are paid multiple times from IPL & International/domestic schedules also have to be considered; but I think, in 3rd edition, what PSL teams need to do is to hire young & aspirant regular fringe players who would like to use PSL as a launching pad for their career. Also, chances are high that these players won't be called for their national teams, therefore they'll be part of the squad for full time. May be, each franchise can keep one high profile former great as the mentor, but rest should be discarded. 5 teams can keep one such player like Mac, Sanga, KP, Watson, Sammy - no need to keep anyone over 30.

Smith, Samuels, Haddin, Elliot, Mahmudullah .... these players will perform from their experience, but they are not serving the purpose. Even, there is no point hiring someone like Sakib, who is an IPL regular - rather from BD players like Sabbir, Kayes, Liton, Soumyua, Taskin, Miraj will be more hungry & committed. Similarly, that's true for players like Hope, Dorwich, Chase, Perera, Dickwala, Dhanajaya, few SAF AUS, Afghan & Kiwi as well. It's English off season, therefore only from England few high profile names should be available.

Somehow, PSL has to bring it's average age around 25 - otherwise, these league will become a mixed version of MCL.

 

[msb314]

Do you have replacements?

No - all the players who should be discarded will go back in the draft pool. Franchises should pick on their needs and past experiences.

After two disastrous campaigns - Qalandars should be very careful who they pick. Hopefully they learnt their lession and avoid hacks like Umar Akmal and McCullum.

 

[msb314]

I think, PSL's scouting strategy was flawed for 2nd year - we are talking strictly about foreigners here. They went for retired or out of favor big names, which was fine for first year as players like Gayle, KP, Sanga, Watson, Mahela .... ads status to the brand. By 2nd year, it wasn't required much & these players got older by a year in wrong direction.

It might be difficult to hire top players from ENG, AUS, SAF who are paid multiple times from IPL & International/domestic schedules also have to be considered; but I think, in 3rd edition, what PSL teams need to do is to hire young & aspirant regular fringe players who would like to use PSL as a launching pad for their career. Also, chances are high that these players won't be called for their national teams, therefore they'll be part of the squad for full time. May be, each franchise can keep one high profile former great as the mentor, but rest should be discarded. 5 teams can keep one such player like Mac, Sanga, KP, Watson, Sammy - no need to keep anyone over 30.

Smith, Samuels, Haddin, Elliot, Mahmudullah .... these players will perform from their experience, but they are not serving the purpose. Even, there is no point hiring someone like Sakib, who is an IPL regular - rather from BD players like Sabbir, Kayes, Liton, Soumyua, Taskin, Miraj will be more hungry & committed. Similarly, that's true for players like Hope, Dorwich, Chase, Perera, Dickwala, Dhanajaya, few SAF AUS, Afghan & Kiwi as well. It's English off season, therefore only from England few high profile names should be available.

Somehow, PSL has to bring it's average age around 25 - otherwise, these league will become a mixed version of MCL.

If we go that route - PSL will lose a lot of viewership and market share as casual fans will nto know who these players are.

The priority should be to bring in current stars - many of whom already play in IPL.

E.g. Warner, Smith. Maxwell, Starc, Finch, De Kock, Rabada, Du Plessis, ABD, Ross Taylor, Williamson, Corey Anderson, Neesham, Boult, Joe Root, Hales, Butler etc. You get the idea.

Hopefully no more Mahela, Watson, Haddins etc. They will serve no purpose anymore.

It was unfortunate that Roy had to leave and Andre Russel got injured. Morgan got a few chances but dissapointed as mentioned above but current stars are the way to go now that the PSL is somwhat established.

 

[MMHS]

If we go that route - PSL will lose a lot of viewership and market share as casual fans will nto know who these players are.

The priority should be to bring in current stars - many of whom already play in IPL.

E.g. Warner, Smith. Maxwell, Starc, Finch, De Kock, Rabada, Du Plessis, ABD, Ross Taylor, Williamson, Corey Anderson, Neesham, Boult, Joe Root, Hales, Butler etc. You get the idea.

Hopefully no more Mahela, Watson, Haddins etc. They will serve no purpose anymore.

It was unfortunate that Roy had to leave and Andre Russel got injured. Morgan got a few chances but dissapointed as mentioned above but current stars are the way to go now that the PSL is somwhat established.

Those are dream choice - this year Tymal Mills is paid $1.5mn US ..... I doubt how many of these players would like to come in PSL, which is just before IPL & risk injury. Also, these are regular Internationals - unless PSL can force an IPL like window, 99% of these players will be involved in International matches in FEB-MAR peak season. PSL is not going to create AB de Villers, Chris Gayle or Deon Beavo for sure.

Established star was an issue in 1st edition - but by 3rd year the franchise brand should be established. That's why sports in professional world is played in City/Region base, which has a connection to the people & the City/State - not like Habib Bank or Sui Gas. Shadab Khan was nobody 4 weeks back - but I am sure he is the most popular player around Islamabad City now.

If by 3rd year, still Karachi needs Gayle or Sanga to keep people interested, then PSL is a failure.

 

[Syed1]

Bhai ghar ghar ja ke yeh do char foreigner jama kiyay hain inko bhi discard karna hai tou phir Pindi mein Faysal Bank hi khel lehtay hain..

 

[Madplayer]

Those are dream choice - this year Tymal Mills is paid $1.5mn US ..... I doubt how many of these players would like to come in PSL, which is just before IPL & risk injury. Also, these are regular Internationals - unless PSL can force an IPL like window, 99% of these players will be involved in International matches in FEB-MAR peak season. PSL is not going to create AB de Villers, Chris Gayle or Deon Beavo for sure.

Established star was an issue in 1st edition - but by 3rd year the franchise brand should be established. That's why sports in professional world is played in City/Region base, which has a connection to the people & the City/State - not like Habib Bank or Sui Gas. Shadab Khan was nobody 4 weeks back - but I am sure he is the most popular player around Islamabad City now.

If by 3rd year, still Karachi needs Gayle or Sanga to keep people interested, then PSL is a failure.

I am sorry but i dont see how such a thing would work. I know fringe foreign players would be more committed but they wont get the viewership especially international vieweeship.

You need big names whether its the first season or 10th. Take popular foreign players out of IPL and no one would watch it either.

 

[msb314]

Those are dream choice - this year Tymal Mills is paid $1.5mn US ..... I doubt how many of these players would like to come in PSL, which is just before IPL & risk injury. Also, these are regular Internationals - unless PSL can force an IPL like window, 99% of these players will be involved in International matches in FEB-MAR peak season. PSL is not going to create AB de Villers, Chris Gayle or Deon Beavo for sure.

Established star was an issue in 1st edition - but by 3rd year the franchise brand should be established. That's why sports in professional world is played in City/Region base, which has a connection to the people & the City/State - not like Habib Bank or Sui Gas. Shadab Khan was nobody 4 weeks back - but I am sure he is the most popular player around Islamabad City now.

If by 3rd year, still Karachi needs Gayle or Sanga to keep people interested, then PSL is a failure.

Bro - out of these players Ross Taylor, Neesham, Hales do not have current IPL contracts so they are certainly gettable.

I agree the PSL window being just before IPL is an issue so I think PSL should be pushed back a few weeks - like mid to late January. That way, many foreign players can get a window of rest between PSL and IPL. We can then hopefully attract many of the current star players mentioned above - the price just has to be right and they should definitely be targetted for PSL 2018.

 

[msb314]

Bhai ghar ghar ja ke yeh do char foreigner jama kiyay hain inko bhi discard karna hai tou phir Pindi mein Faysal Bank hi khel lehtay hain..

Bhai samjha karo - most off these players are has-beens or TTFs. Get rid of the underperformers by adding them back to the draft pool.

We should target the ABD's, Warner, Finch, Maxwell, Williamson, Butler, Du Plessis, Rabada, Miller, De Kock, Smith, Faulkner, Mathews, Corey Anderson, Neesham, Root, Hales, Stokes etc for PSL 2018 if you want to take the league to the next level.

Think big.

 

[ahmedwaqas92]

Bro - out of these players Ross Taylor, Neesham, Hales do not have current IPL contracts so they are certainly gettable.

I agree the PSL window being just before IPL is an issue so I think PSL should be pushed back a few weeks - like mid to late January. That way, many foreign players can get a window of rest between PSL and IPL. We can then hopefully attract many of the current star players mentioned above - the price just has to be right and they should definitely be targetted for PSL 2018.

We'd lose out on Aussie players then the Australian summer's LOI leg normally stretches until January which means some of them would become unavailable for PSL. Aussie stars bring a lot of attraction to a league and a move like this could be counter productive.

 

[Madplayer]

We'd lose out on Aussie players then the Australian summer's LOI leg normally stretches until January which means some of them would become unavailable for PSL. Aussie stars bring a lot of attraction to a league and a move like this could be counter productive.

Pushing PSL Back wont do jack. england australia or SA or any team for that matter can always have some series lined up between PSL and IPL and when that happens, players will choose to skip PSL rather than IPL. Best way is to get any popular players that are available rather than rescheduling the tournament.

 

[MMHS]

I am sorry but i dont see how such a thing would work. I know fringe foreign players would be more committed but they wont get the viewership especially international vieweeship.

You need big names whether its the first season or 10th. Take popular foreign players out of IPL and no one would watch it either.

Because, these foreigners are current players - not has beens.

I am not saying bring club cricketers, rather players at their prime & need a stage to perform. Apart from few names like KP, Sanga, Gayle or Watson; I don't think players like Smith, Haddin, Badree, Mahela, Mahmudullah, Mac, Elliot .... adds anything to viewership. For that, one icon name for every team is enough - may be 2, like Viv or Wasim as mentor. I am talking about the likes of Rossoue, Sabbir, Roy, Mills, Khwaja, Hope, Dickwala, Santnar type players - just missing the IPL cut, but they are more or less regular Internationals & young players - can end up higher.

If PSL can match IPL's payment somewhat, then many top class contemporary players will come, which is the best case scenario - IPL can do that, so they are building their brand along that line. But, there is no point trying to build a fake copy of IPL - brand building is not only about star names. Unilever saved millions through their concept of "new face hunt" through out globe - instead of paying obnoxiously to the established models & it worked - some of their new faces ended as super models.

PSL can find it's own way of selling cricket through it's quality, it's competitiveness, it's close contests & it's association with local (PAK City) people. Buying stars for OTT money is the tried & tested but extremely costly way, which is not possible for PSL, neither required. Cricket still is a Country dominant game - people will relate contemporary players than the retired bunch, when they'll see same players playing for other countries in live matches, rather than archives. It's true in every sports actually - it's not that there is only supporter for Real Mardrid, Barca, MU, PSG, MCity, Chelsea & Bayern or people watch La Liga only for CR, Messi, Neymar, Bale or Suarez.

 

[MMHS]

Bro - out of these players Ross Taylor, Neesham, Hales do not have current IPL contracts so they are certainly gettable.

I agree the PSL window being just before IPL is an issue so I think PSL should be pushed back a few weeks - like mid to late January. That way, many foreign players can get a window of rest between PSL and IPL. We can then hopefully attract many of the current star players mentioned above - the price just has to be right and they should definitely be targetted for PSL 2018.

PSL will never be financially viable if it wants to sell stardom - that route is priced out. It's not only about being close to IPL or domestic window - it's about buying out their time. These players have family - at young age, if they can earn $2/3mn from 6 weeks, I am sure many of them won't bother to play in PSL even for twice the current money - rather spend that time with family; just like workers do overtime & executives take unpaid leave.

PSL has to find it's own strategy, which has to be different from IPL.

 

[JibranAnsari]

PSL does not have that kind of money to pay the current stars , all they can gather are the retired international big names or the current out of favor players. I am pretty sure next year we wont have sam billings and jason roy playing the psl.

 

[MMHS]

PSL does not have that kind of money to pay the current stars , all they can gather are the retired international big names or the current out of favor players. I am pretty sure next year we wont have sam billings and jason roy playing the psl.

That's exactly what I am trying to explain. What you are saying is outcome - PSL has to find a counter strategy to cover up.

I give a classic example from Football (Soccer). Ever since EPL started with media money, England football landscape changed - players are paid obnoxiously, bought for unworthy money & hyped by Pom media like there was Garincha, .......... now Sterling.

At the same time, French Govt. imposed a new Tax law - after a certain cap, it's 75% & most of their top players actually would have taken less or barely above what a top Championship (English Div. 2) player to home,after that tax cut. French football still had oligarch owners - billionaires, Sheikhs, biggest global sponsors, big gate and above all they had talent, much more than British hoofballers. But, French clubs didn't go to that rat race, rather they turned Ligue 1 as the best place for global youth - they are bringing them from all over the world, train them, develop them & above all, give them match time. Every Ligue 1 match has 5/6.... even 10 outstanding U19 players in starting XI & the quality of football is very good as well. I watch League 1 match just to see who is coming next. They simply don't bother which club/league is paying what - they have their own brand & strategy of bringing uncut diamonds, develop them & sell them by the age before 23 for even 100 times.

Next example is Portugal - they don't have the infrastructure or pulling power like French or Spanish Football, but their strategy had been using their duel language - Portuguese & Spanish. They have changed their work permit & football eligibility rules to bring unlimited Latin players in their early 20s, for less than 10% of salary per player compared to what Pep pays Sir Stones for average 2 howlers every match. A mid table Portuguese club's whole squad can be bought for what Sir Alex paid for Luke Shaw !!!!!

In Germany, BVB Dortmund won 2 titles against Bayern!!!!!!!!!!!

These are examples for one such sports where top clubs can buy out whole IPL, Leagues that can buy out Cricket universe - still there are popular leagues in Holland, Hungary.... even Albania. PSL can only survive & establish it's own identity by adopting own strategy to sell the game. May be it can't hold on to Billings & Roys, but it can help unleashing next Billings & Roys - trying to hold on to them won't take it much further, rather might crash it like North American Soccer League (Read New York Cosmos story for details). BPL tried to do that first time - it collapsed in a year, now they are trying to rectify it by associating clubs with fan-base, rather than stars with franchise.

 

[Adil_94]

i think people are taking PSL a little too serious like its an Intl tournament. These Franchise tournaments need big star names to get appeal and fan following thats what makes them special and different from bog standard domestic T20. the likes of Sammy and Gayle while they might not have fired consistently this tournament are still crowd pullers very popular with casual cricket fans or just T20 fans and big names in this format you need players like them to enhance the reputation of the league. Also PSL cant get Saffers Aussies or Kiwis who are in the national set up because the timing conflicts with their home international seasons. And also Indians for obvious reasons so that gives PSL a limited International talent pool. teams like England generally play cricket all year around so its hard to get their star players who play all formats like Root Stokes Buttler etc. So it can only get players from SA AUS and NZ who are either retired or arent in the national set up but have done well in T20 Cricket in the past. Windies cricketers are available so we should utilise them.

 

[Nil Dhumrojal]

1) Darren Sammy

Assessment: Seems to get sympathy points for wanting to play the final in Lahore but otherwise has done nothing for Zalmi this PSL so far.

Verdict: Discard

2) Shane Watson

Assessment: His batting has been a huge letdown compared to last season's PSL and his dibbly dobbly medium pace bowling was always going to be ineffective on UAE pitches.

Verdict: Discard

3) Sunil Narine

Assessment: Pick of the foreign bowlers so far - also shown potential with some good lower order hitting to add firepower to the Qalandar's side.

Verdict: Keep

4) Brendan McCullum

Assessment: Despite being an aggressive captain - he only once influenced the game with his captaincy in the low scoring thriller vs. Zalmi. His batting has been horrendously poor and his lack of runs clearly impacted Qalandar's campaign.

Verdict: Discard

5) Kevin Pietersen

Assessment: Too hit and miss for my liking - played a blinder against Qalandar's when chasing 201 and a few good 30-40's in other games but should look to be more consistent.

Verdict: Keep

6) Rilee Roussow

Assessment: Hig a blistering start to his PSL career in the first few matches with some match winning knocks. Has cooled down since then and has shown a tendency to throw his wicket away - even during easy chases. Should just relax a bit more.

Verdict: Keep

7) Chris Gayle

Assessment: Barring a decent knock today - has been in horrendous form and not made any contributions too Karach Kings totals. Should put more value on his wicket and stay at the crease more for the remainder of the tournament.

Verdict: Discard

8) Kumar Sangakkara.

Assessment: Made some decent contributions for the Kings but otherwise has not made a bang for a player who is exceptionally good against spin and in Asian conditions. Age is catching up to him but looks to be a good mentor and coach for the youngers players like Babar. Effective when chasing totals in the >130 range.

Verdict: Keep (just...)

9) Kieron Pollard

Assessment: Find of the tournmanet so far for Kings. Played some great knocks for them whilst chasing and playing the finisher role.

Verdict: Keep

10) Brad Haddin

Assessment: Not good enough for T20's despite playing one good knock.

Verdict: Discard

11) Chris Jordan

Assessment: Same as Sammy

Verdict: Discard

12) Jason Roy

Assessment: The best player for Qalandar's who was helping them provide strong starts in all games when he was playing - their campaign fell apart as soon as he left.

Verdict: Keep

13) Grant Elliot

Assessment; Despite not being the most high profile player in the PSL - he has shown a good whilst chasing for Qalandar's and can hit the big shots too. Maybe needs to move up the order.

Verdict: Keep

14) Eoin Morgan

Assessment: One good knock for Zalmi but otherwise has done nothing for them this campaign. Playing on reputation it seems like.

Verdict: Keep (just...)

15) DR Smith

Assessment: Despite being labelled as a hack - has been the best player for IU this campaign and rightfully leads the run scoring charts for this year's PSL.

Verdict: Keep

16) Ravi Bopara

Assessment: Had a tremendous tournament last year but is struggling very badly this time round. Not a single substantial score from his this campaign.

Verdict: Discard

17) Tamim Iqbal

Assessment: Played one good knock but has otherwise struggled for consistency in a shortened campaign for him.

Verdict: Keep (just...)


18) Sam Billings

Assessment: One knock wonder like so many others but to be fair to him - has not been given enough chances.

Verdict: Keep (just...)

19) Mahmadullah

Assessment: Useful contributions as an all-rounder but nothing substantial - useful as a fringe player for the Gladiators.

Verdict: Keep

20) Tymal Mills

Assessment: Pick of the foreign fast bowlers in the PSL so far - very unlucky against Hassan Ali last game. Great pace and has picked up vital wickets too. Good find by the Gladiators.

Verdict: Keep


The rest of the foreign players have not played enough games to warrant a good conclusion.

Please discuss!

You miss to mention shakib al hasan

 

[Hasan123]

Why not?

Because we're not going to be able to offer them the money during there off season to tempt them .

 

[WC-Passion]

Oh yeah what happened to Finn?

I have no idea, Islamabad jut didn't pick him from what I saw.