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Charleston church shooter Dylann Roof sentenced to death [update#96]

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Markhor

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RIP to the victims of another appalling mass shooting. This was a prominent civil rights era church with one of the largest black congregations in the south.

What will the gun lobby say now ? People should now take guns into churches ? This situation in Charleston is also inflamed by the racial tensions that are high right now with there being a recent police shooting of an unarmed black man, Walter Scott, and there will be fears of retaliation.

Guardian report:

The killing of nine people by a young white man at a historic black church in Charleston, South Carolina, has sent shockwaves across the United States, as the nation confronts a breaking point over race and gun violence following yet another mass shooting.

Investigators described a suspected hate crime at the hands of Dylan Roof, whom they apprehended as reports emerged that he had been given a handgun by his father for his 21st birthday. Pictures also surfaced from a Facebook page depicting him with the flags of apartheid South Africa and white government-era Rhodesia emblazoned on his jacket.

Six women and three men were killed during the stealth attack – including a pastor and local politician who had been a vocal advocate for gun control and police reform – inside a prayer group meeting at the Emanuel African Methodist Episcopal church on Wednesday evening in this metropolis known as the “holy city” of the American south.

Further chilling details of the shooting began to emerge on Thursday, as TV news quoted the relative of one of three survivors who claimed the gunman reloaded his weapon five times and stated: “I have to do it ... You rape our women and you’re taking over our country and you have to go.”

A sweeping, multi-agency manhunt for the shooter culminated in police arresting Roof in Shelby, North Carolina, nearly 15 hours after the attack. Police said a citizen reported the vehicle to law enforcement, citing “suspicious activity”. An officer with the Shelby police department pulled Roof over and arrested him during the traffic stop. Mullen said Roof was cooperative and is in custody in Shelby, where he will be questioned before he is returned to Charleston.

Police say they believe Roof acted alone in the attack, and any motive remained unclear.

Carson Cowles, who identified himself as Roof’s uncle, told Reuters that Roof’s father had recently given him a .45-caliber handgun as a birthday present and that Roof had seemed adrift.

“I don’t have any words for it,” the 56-year-old was reported to have said in a telephone interview. “Nobody in my family had seen anything like this coming.”
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AFG_Brit said:
Why the term " hate crime" and not "terrorism"?
www.bbc.co.uk/newsbeat/article/3318...ings-why-is-it-a-hate-crime-and-not-terrorism



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Because terrorism is a term which is saved for Muslims. It would get very confusing to the average redneck in the US or the underclass skinhead in Europe if everyone was labelled a terrorism, it's not a good thing for their agenda against Muslim nations and a particular religion.

People often discuss minorities in Pakistan such as Shia's getting targetted but we can see this has been normal in the US since it's illegitimate birth until the present day. Blacks are being targetted by white police officers and now black churches are seeing massacres.
 
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Charleston church shooting suspect Dylann Roof captured; victims identified
.

CHARLESTON, S.C. — Dylann Roof, who police say opened fire and killed nine people during a prayer service at a historic African American church here, has been arrested.

Roof, a 21-year-old from Eastover, S.C., was taken into custody Thursday morning, not long after law enforcement officials identified him as the sole suspect in the Wednesday night massacre, the deadliest attack on a place of worship in the United States in 24 years.

The oldest victim was 87; the youngest was 26. They included a library manager, a track and field coach and a state senator, Clementa Pinckney, who also served as senior pastor at Emanuel African Methodist Episcopal Church, where the shooting occurred.

Charleston Police Chief Greg Mullen said Roof was arrested during a traffic stop in Shelby, N.C., just after 11 a.m., roughly 14 hours after officers responded to the shooting at at Emanuel AME. Mullen said Roof “was cooperative with the officer who stopped him” in Shelby, about 250 miles by road northwest of Charleston.

“Any death of this sort is a tragedy; any shooting involving multiple victims is a tragedy,” President Obama said at the White House. “There is something particularly heartbreaking about a death happening in a place in which we seek solace and we seek peace, in a place of worship.”

Although he acknowledged that many facts are not yet known, the president also said that insufficient gun laws were partially to blame.

“Once again innocent people were killed because someone who wanted to inflict harm had no trouble getting their hands on a gun,” he said.

“Now is the time for mourning and for healing,” the president added. “But let’s be clear: At some point we as a country will have to reckon with the fact that this type of mass violence does not happen in other advanced countries.”

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...ng-at-historic-charleston-african-ame-church/

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dylannarrest2-original.jpg
 
Markhor said:
What will the gun lobby say now ? People should now take guns into churches ?
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Whole argument about right to wear arms and ability to fight government if need arises is a non-sense in current situation. Government has atom bomb, chemical weapon and all that. Should we ask every citizen should have rights to carry those weapons to fight government?

Clearly, carrying guns is not really serving the same purpose right now as they did centuries ago. NRA has too much lobbying power
 
Buffet said:
Whole argument about right to wear arms and ability to fight government if need arises is a non-sense in current situation. Government has atom bomb, chemical weapon and all that. Should we ask every citizen should have rights to carry those weapons to fight government?

Clearly, carrying guns is not really serving the same purpose right now as they did centuries ago. NRA has too much lobbying power
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It's not about just having guns.

It's about having guns + an I don't give a **** attitude towards mental health, health in general, safety protocols, poverty, etc and this very American concept of having to conquer something which I will never understand. All Americans live the metaphor of Moby Dick. Whether it's having this desire to conquer a whale, the wilderness, other cultures, or a school or a church.
 
RIP to all the victims of the shooting.

America is one of the greatest countries in the history of mankind, I am sure it will overcome all challenges.
 
Respect for Obama to not wilt under the pressure of being potentially accused of political grand standing. Thought he weaved his anti gun argument well with his sympathy speech.

If he ends up achieving something as monumental as this before he leaves, that would be a legacy worth going all out for.
 
filthyfulltoss said:
It's not about just having guns.

It's about having guns + an I don't give a **** attitude towards mental health, health in general, safety protocols, poverty, etc and this very American concept of having to conquer something which I will never understand. All Americans live the metaphor of Moby Dick. Whether it's having this desire to conquer a whale, the wilderness, other cultures, or a school or a church.
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Not all Americans for sure. Covering my extended family, I know only 3 folks who will fit your description.

Conquer wilderness etc was present in big way in past for different reasons.
 
Sattarbuksh said:
RIP to all the victims of the shooting.

America is one of the greatest countries in the history of mankind, I am sure it will overcome all challenges.
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Why because it gave you a visa? :)

America was founded on the genocide of Native Indians. It was then built on the back of slavery and has been behind the most terrorism the world has ever seen but as you long as you get leave your former Muslim homeland and eat burgers at McDonalds it will be your saviour.
 
CHz2vztWoAAjXeY.jpg

I highly doubt a black guy who had just massacred people in a religious building would get getting the same gentle treatment by the police.
 
KingKhanWC said:
View attachment 57629

I highly doubt a black guy who had just massacred people in a religious building would get getting the same gentle treatment by the police.
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John Lee Malvo, the DC sniper responsible for 27 shooting deaths. The pictures look pretty comparable.

malvo_incourt.jpeg.size.xxlarge.letterbox.jpeg
 
Sattarbuksh said:
John Lee Malvo, the DC sniper responsible for 27 shooting deaths. The pictures look pretty comparable.
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Oh the guys they arrested who were asleep in their car at the time. I hate to think what would have happened if they were awake.
 
FYI I believe the majority of any country should chose their own law be it Shariah or laws based on Secularism.

America may be freedom for you to eat your burger king and spout idiotic hate against Islam but unfortunately it hasn't been freedom for it's victims around the world. Speak for yourself and not for others because you are entitled to make a fool of yourself only as we have seen on this thread. Perhaps you would like to start a thread on America = Freedom, in fact I challenge you. Come on I'm only a backward Muslim who believes in Sharia and you're an enlightened free secular genius.

Best we stick to the topic. Can you tell me why so this white man went into a black church to kill? Was it for political reasons? If so why he isn't he labelled a terrorist? Good luck.
 
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Sattarbuksh said:
hmmm which country wasnt founded on genocide and salvery?

Take the muqadas mulk Saudi Arabia as an example, what do you think happened to the Jews of Medina? Read the story of Banu Qurayza, Banu Nadir, and Khaybar.
Fast forward to today, America gives equal rights to all, while Saudi Arabia has no synagogue in Medina to this day.
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Why would Madina have synagogue? There are no Jews in Madina.
 
KingKhanWC said:
FYI I believe the majority of any country should chose their own law be it Shariah or laws based on Secularism.

America may be freedom for you to eat your burger king and spout idiotic hate against Islam but unfortunately it hasn't been freedom for it's victims around the world. Speak for yourself and not for others because you are entitled to make a fool of yourself only as we have seen on this thread. Perhaps you would like to start a thread on America = Freedom, in fact I challenge you. Come on I'm only a backward Muslim who believes in Sharia and you're an enlightened free secular genius.

Best we stick to the topic. Can you tell me why so this white man went into a black church to kill? Was it for political reasons? If so why he isn't he labelled a terrorist? Good luck.
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Luckily you don't generalise from a single incident.lol
 
Cricket lover 27 said:
Why would Madina have synagogue? There are no Jews in Madina.
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It wouldn't, because there are no Jews left in a city which once had a flourishing Jewish community.

The point is every country has genocide and slavery in their past. Its how you learn from it and move forward.
 
Gilly said:
I just find your responses amusing, it appears you have a real hatred towards America.

Just to save you some wind, I don't really care either.
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lol. You think it's based on one incident. Yes I have a hatred for their policies which have resulted in millions of deaths around the world and interference in dozens of nations for their own personal greed. Most Americans are good people but the governments over time have made America the worlds biggest terrorist.

If you change your mind, start a thread, there is plenty of material to support my view.
 
Buffet said:
Whole argument about right to wear arms and ability to fight government if need arises is a non-sense in current situation. Government has atom bomb, chemical weapon and all that. Should we ask every citizen should have rights to carry those weapons to fight government?

Clearly, carrying guns is not really serving the same purpose right now as they did centuries ago. NRA has too much lobbying power
Click to expand...

There are two aspects to this kind of incident. One as you mention why guys are s freely available, it's 21st century not 17th.

The other issue which press in not going after forcefully is terrorism. When a Muslim guy does something, it is terrorism, he is inspired by Muslim extremist groups but not consider a Physio or mental patient. Black guy does it, it's law and order issue, poor neighborhoods effect, not enough jobs, education what not .

With white guys they isolate the guy from rest of the society, all religious and racist groups are not drag into the mix. The guy is Physio, he is not inspired by white racist group or religious extremists?? - how is that possible??


We cannot over come this until we recognize the problem. Why media is not going after racist hate group in this case??



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yasir said:
There are two aspects to this kind of incident. One as you mention why guys are s freely available, it's 21st century not 17th.

The other issue which press in not going after forcefully is terrorism. When a Muslim guy does something, it is terrorism, he is inspired by Muslim extremist groups but not consider a Physio or mental patient. Black guy does it, it's law and order issue, poor neighborhoods effect, not enough jobs, education what not .
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Stereotype is happening due to scale around the world. Let me put one hypothetical scenario,

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Imagine there was one black racial group establishing a rule some where and thousands of blacks from Europe, Canada, Aus, USA and other places were traveling to join that group to kill non-blacks. Many blacks were also killing non-blacks in their home country in name of race openly. Important point is that it should be an ongoing phenomenon in name of race and done openly.

-----------------

Don't you think that crime by blacks will get generalized as terror a lot more than other racial groups in our hypothetical situation? It's wrong but not difficult to understand why it's happening.

Also, not all crimes by non-Muslims in US are taken as mental illness or law and order situation. Many incidents have been charged as terror plots. Having said that disproportionate number of cases involving Muslims does get reported as terrorist plots.
 
Sattarbuksh said:
It wouldn't, because there are no Jews left in a city which once had a flourishing Jewish community.

The point is every country has genocide and slavery in their past. Its how you learn from it and move forward.
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There was no genocide of Jews. It was an exodus.
 
Was the criminal White or non white?

White? ---> declare mentally insane/ has had a difficult up bringing

Non White? ---> Is it a Muslim? ---> Declare Terrorist
 
Kean0 said:
Was the criminal White or non white?

White? ---> declare mentally insane/ has had a difficult up bringing

Non White? ---> Is it a Muslim? ---> Declare Terrorist
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Basically.

Also, our reaction to these crimes being reported.

1. Does the accused have a Muslim name? Yes? Damn it not again. See 2a below. No? Ok, but let's check if he's a convert.

2. Is he a convert? Yes? 2a - Ah damn. Time to sympathise and be ready t defend yourself and a billion others of your region. No? 2b - Phew. Time to sympathise and question media handling of the issue.
 
See a lot of media publications calling the attack a terrorist attack ...

Jon Stewart called it one on his show yesterday
 
AFG_Brit said:
What's the difference? How do you differentiate between the two?

Did you read the bbc link I posted?


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If there's lack of ideology or some cause he's furthering then it isn't terrorism as opposed to some lonewolf with hatred , bigotry, illness whatever .. also most of the incidents classed as terrorism have more than one guy involved giving an impression that it was organised.
 
RexRex said:
If there's lack of ideology or some cause he's furthering then it isn't terrorism as opposed to some lonewolf with hatred , bigotry, illness whatever .. also most of the incidents classed as terrorism have more than one guy involved giving an impression that it was organised.
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The flags on his Jacket doesn't tell you his ideology or the cause he is trying to promote? At least try to hide your biasness. I am sure the whole African American community is terrorized because of the incidents during the past few years.
 
Saeed said:
The flags on his Jacket doesn't tell you his ideology or the cause he is trying to promote? At least try to hide your biasness. I am sure the whole African American community is terrorized because of the incidents during the past few years.
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Where did I refer to the Charleston attacks ? I was speaking about the broader definitions ... this guy is definitely a candidate for the term due to his white supremacist leanings..
 
Today's lesson , White guys are never terrorists, they're lone wolves or nutters. Those black church victims weren't terrorised they were merely hated on
 
dirk diggler said:
Today's lesson , White guys are never terrorists, they're lone wolves or nutters. Those black church victims weren't terrorised they were merely hated on
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Terrorism is associated with political aims, hate crime is associated with racism.

Would it make people feel better if they called it a terrorist attack instead of a hate crime, is that going to make some sort of difference.
 
Gilly said:
Terrorism is associated with political aims, hate crime is associated with racism.

Would it make people feel better if they called it a terrorist attack instead of a hate crime, is that going to make some sort of difference.
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''Dalton Tyler, who said he was a friend of Mr Roof, told ABC News the suspect had spoken in support of racial segregation and had said "he wanted to start a civil war".



That sounds political to me doesnt it?
 
Zaz said:
''Dalton Tyler, who said he was a friend of Mr Roof, told ABC News the suspect had spoken in support of racial segregation and had said "he wanted to start a civil war".



That sounds political to me doesnt it?
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Like I said call it what you want it wont make any difference, its just a label.

He was not supporting one political aim against another but trying to incite hatred within one group.
 
Zaz said:
''Dalton Tyler, who said he was a friend of Mr Roof, told ABC News the suspect had spoken in support of racial segregation and had said "he wanted to start a civil war".

That sounds political to me doesnt it?
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To me too.
 
Zaz said:
''Dalton Tyler, who said he was a friend of Mr Roof, told ABC News the suspect had spoken in support of racial segregation and had said "he wanted to start a civil war".



That sounds political to me doesnt it?
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Doesn't matter he was white, so its all fine. The poor chap was just having a bad day, just move on already.


Now if he was Muslim/brown/black then that's a different story.....
 
Syed1 said:
Doesn't matter he was white, so its all fine. The poor chap was just having a bad day, just move on already.


Now if he was Muslim/brown/black then that's a different story.....
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Muslim victim mentality is strong..

The Chapel Hill shootings were all over the media for 2 weeks eventhough shooter was white and victims muslimss
 
Robert said:
Brilliant isn't he? And he calls it a terrorist attack.

Incredibly, the family of one of the murdered women have forgiven the terrorist. That's real Christianity.
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Isn't about Christianity but white supremacy, though a lot of white supremacists do justify their views using the bible and see themselves a protectors of European Christendom, so it does have a religion angle, but this terrorist attack has more to do with the white supremacist ideology which isn't challenged by the silent majority, the media nor governments around the world
 
RexRex said:
If there's lack of ideology or some cause he's furthering then it isn't terrorism as opposed to some lonewolf with hatred , bigotry, illness whatever .. also most of the incidents classed as terrorism have more than one guy involved giving an impression that it was organised.
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there is no lack of ideology on his part
 
Republican presidential candidate Rick Perry calls Charleston church shooting an 'accident' http://t.co/RlOIm5WJeE

Congratulations Rick Perry, there was some stiff competition but you just won the award for dumbest right wing response to the Charleston shooting.
 
Deosai said:
Isn't about Christianity but white supremacy, though a lot of white supremacists do justify their views using the bible and see themselves a protectors of European Christendom, so it does have a religion angle, but this terrorist attack has more to do with the white supremacist ideology which isn't challenged by the silent majority, the media nor governments around the world
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I don't know if you are trolling but this is a ridiculous comment, to imply that white supremacy is accepted anywhere in mainstream America or any nation is just pure rubbish.
 
Deosai said:
Isn't about Christianity but white supremacy, though a lot of white supremacists do justify their views using the bible and see themselves a protectors of European Christendom, so it does have a religion angle, but this terrorist attack has more to do with the white supremacist ideology which isn't challenged by the silent majority, the media nor governments around the world
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I don't think you understood my post. I meant the Christianity of the black people in the church.
 
Gilly said:
I don't know if you are trolling but this is a ridiculous comment, to imply that white supremacy is accepted publicly anywhere in mainstream America or any nation is just pure rubbish.
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Fixed
 
Another mass shooting in America: racist kills 9 at historic black church

Gilly said:
Terrorism is associated with political aims, hate crime is associated with racism.

Would it make people feel better if they called it a terrorist attack instead of a hate crime, is that going to make some sort of difference.
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Purpose of terrorism is to terrorize community, it always has political ambitions, no matter how stupid they are. The guy who did this was politically motivated... He wanted to start race wars, to kick out colored people, it's sounds stupid and crazy like Taliban want to rule the world, but to them its rational. Who inspired such thoughts? - why not go after them like we went after foreign terrorists??

Why people are trying to distance this incident as mentally ill, tragedy or just hate crime? When a Muslim guy does the exact same thing, he is inspired by extremist but white guy does it, he is mentally ill, people automatically distance him from rest of the red culture inside USA. this incidence is poster child of conservative, racist culture. Like Talibans, Al-Qaudia are driven by Whhabi extremists culture.


Jon Stewart explains this very well below:


https://twitter.com/variety/status/611765896239972352


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yasir said:
Purpose of terrorism is to terrorize community, it always has political ambitions, no matter how stupid they are. The guy who did this was politically motivated... He wanted to start race wars, to kick out colored people, it's sounds stupid and crazy like Taliban want to rule the world, but to them its rational. Who inspired such thoughts? - why not go after them like we went after foreign terrorists??

Why people are trying to distance this incident as mentally ill, tragedy or just hate crime? When a Muslim guy does the exact same thing, he is inspired by extremist but white guy does it, he is mentally ill, people automatically distance him from rest of the red culture inside USA. this incidence is poster child of conservative, racist culture. Like Talibans, Al-Qaudia are driven by Whhabi extremists culture.


Jon Stewart explains this very well below:


https://twitter.com/variety/status/611765896239972352


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Its just a tag to identify the incident, people have been killed. Regardless of calling it terrorism or hate crime makes no difference to the crime it remains the same. This incident is domestic and is not influenced by any outside interest (at this point).

It could be described as a terrorist activity but the real reason to identify it as a hate crime is so people recognise why it happened and how to address the problem.

Describing it as a terrorist incident would make no difference other than attach it to incidents that are based on different sources and will still require separate methods of dealing with the origins of the incident.
 
Now I want to see FBI go after this buffoon's family, friends, relatives and who ever else that helped him become 'radicalised'.
 
Gilly said:
Its just a tag to identify the incident, people have been killed. Regardless of calling it terrorism or hate crime makes no difference to the crime it remains the same. This incident is domestic and is not influenced by any outside interest (at this point).

It could be described as a terrorist activity but the real reason to identify it as a hate crime is so people recognise why it happened and how to address the problem.

Describing it as a terrorist incident would make no difference other than attach it to incidents that are based on different sources and will still require separate methods of dealing with the origins of the incident.
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You don't get what I am or Jon is trying to say. These labels or words have specific meanings and narrative behind them. Media is deliberately using such language as hate crime or tragedy rather than terrorist activity by racially inspired incident.

Labeling it hate crime does not meaning anything, terrorism is hate based too, Al Quadi did not love America, they hate and want to destroy as many American as they can. Why we didn't call it just a hate crime by crazy person?

Once you recognize what it is only then you can go after the root cause. This and other black churches have being targeted for 200 years, in that region, it's not a crazy man job, it's racism inspired, it's a terrorist activity. What literature drive 21 year old guy to go for such a sucide mission? - it's a form of sucide bomb, that was unleashed on a minority community. How it is not terrorism??? - I bet you there are more people behind it, there are lot of people filled with such hate, it's a political ideology inspired by racial superiority ideas. It's not a nut person or mentally disable person job.


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yasir said:
You don't get what I am or Jon is trying to say. These labels or words have specific meanings and narrative behind them. Media is deliberately using such language as hate crime or tragedy rather than terrorist activity by racially inspired incident.

Labeling it hate crime does not meaning anything, terrorism is hate based too, Al Quadi did not love America, they hate and want to destroy as many American as they can. Why we didn't call it just a hate crime by crazy person?

Once you recognize what it is only then you can go after the root cause. This and other black churches have being targeted for 200 years, in that region, it's not a crazy man job, it's racism inspired, it's a terrorist activity. What literature drive 21 year old guy to go for such a sucide mission? - it's a form of sucide bomb, that was unleashed on a minority community. How it is not terrorism??? - I bet you there are more people behind it, there are lot of people filled with such hate, it's a political ideology inspired by racial superiority ideas. It's not a nut person or mentally disable person job.


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In the end it is violence, we break down violence to different areas like domestic violence like when a man beats his wife, its the same as when a man beats up another man because he cut him off in his car but we call that road rage. They are both the same thing where one person beats another person because there were enraged but we have different labels for each incident.

When they say its a hate crime it just means that when people see the heading hate crime they know that it was a crime inspired by a persons hate for another, in America that usually relates to a white person occasioning a crime against a colored person. When they use the term terrorist it usually means a crime inspired by religion usually Islamic. Then you have political violence where one political person may execute another, you get drug related crime, Bikie crime and many other crimes that attract their own unique handle.

Yes when we hear the word terrorist we associate it with Islamic violence and when we hear race hate we generally associate it with white supremacy or skinheads or other garbage. We could call them the same thing but we use language to make things easier to understand.

Race hate or terrorism are both equally heinous crimes.
 
Gilly said:
In the end it is violence, we break down violence to different areas like domestic violence like when a man beats his wife, its the same as when a man beats up another man because he cut him off in his car but we call that road rage. They are both the same thing where one person beats another person because there were enraged but we have different labels for each incident.

When they say its a hate crime it just means that when people see the heading hate crime they know that it was a crime inspired by a persons hate for another, in America that usually relates to a white person occasioning a crime against a colored person. When they use the term terrorist it usually means a crime inspired by religion usually Islamic. Then you have political violence where one political person may execute another, you get drug related crime, Bikie crime and many other crimes that attract their own unique handle.

Yes when we hear the word terrorist we associate it with Islamic violence and when we hear race hate we generally associate it with white supremacy or skinheads or other garbage. We could call them the same thing but we use language to make things easier to understand.

Race hate or terrorism are both equally heinous crimes.
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Good point. They are equally heinous. Yet they illicit a much different response from the general public and politicians.
 
The only issue with your argument [MENTION=732]Gilly[/MENTION] is that you are underestimating the power of labels.
 
Saqs said:
The only issue with your argument [MENTION=732]Gilly[/MENTION] is that you are underestimating the power of labels.
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Labels don't have any power at all, the person interpreting the label gives it power. To me a label may have no power at all but to you it may have immense power but that is due to how we perceive the label the label itself is inert.
 
Gilly said:
Labels don't have any power at all, the person interpreting the label gives it power. To me a label may have no power at all but to you it may have immense power but that is due to how we perceive the label the label itself is inert.
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Terrorists word has legal baring in USA. Plus the national narrative is different when some event is declared terrorism. That changes the national debate from a mentally disable one off event to a real political issue. Who we are trying to protect here?

Before 9/11 Oklahoma bomber Timothy was declared as terrorist. But now why media is hesitant to call non Muslim terrorist as terrorist? - all those torture laws, going after their finance network, their organization etc are not applicable to racist and religious groups of red America, why??


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yasir said:
Terrorists word has legal baring in USA. Plus the national narrative is different when some event is declared terrorism. That changes the national debate from a mentally disable one off event to a real political issue. Who we are trying to protect here?

Before 9/11 Oklahoma bomber Timothy was declared as terrorist. But now why media is hesitant to call non Muslim terrorist as terrorist? - all those torture laws, going after their finance network, their organization etc are not applicable to racist and religious groups of red America, why??


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I don't recall any attacks on American soil before 9/11 and that changed the whole landscape. Terrorist is used to describe attacks on America usually when their is influence from organisations outside the country. Any violent incident within the country and isolated to the country are usually considered a domestic problem. Action by islamists are considered to be an attack from outside of America and different to domestic incidents.

When you look at the nuts and bolts of it America sees Islamic terrorists as trying to destroy the country of America and incidents within its borders as acts that are trying to gain more power within America. I'm neither Islamic or American but I can see the difference between the two types of attacks and can understand why they are treated differently.

I don't really see what the problem is, America and its media will cater to the domestic market and that's not exclusive to America, each and every country do the same some better and some worse.
 
Gilly said:
Like I said call it what you want it wont make any difference, its just a label.

He was not supporting one political aim against another but trying to incite hatred within one group.
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it's not a political aim to cause civil unrest to bring about societal changes? okay...
 
filthyfulltoss said:
it's not a political aim to cause civil unrest to bring about societal changes? okay...
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You can call it political if you want, but it was not designed to bring down America but to attack groups within America. Islamic attacks on America are against every single American, this incident was only focussed on blacks in America. Its not an indiscriminate attack on America but a attack on blacks in America.
 
Gilly said:
You can call it political if you want, but it was not designed to bring down America but to attack groups within America. Islamic attacks on America are against every single American, this incident was only focussed on blacks in America. Its not an indiscriminate attack on America but a attack on blacks in America.
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I don't think you understand the definition of terrorism.
 
Gilly said:
Labels don't have any power at all, the person interpreting the label gives it power. To me a label may have no power at all but to you it may have immense power but that is due to how we perceive the label the label itself is inert.
Click to expand...

What I'm saying though is the disparity if response based on the label is quite telling, and shows you the power of the label at a groupthink level.
 
Saqs said:
What I'm saying though is the disparity if response based on the label is quite telling, and shows you the power of the label at a groupthink level.
Click to expand...

Labeling does impact the response but labeling didn't happen out of no where. Group thinking has been shaped up by actions and then label is piling it on top of that.
 
Mitt Romney: Take down the #ConfederateFlag at the SC Capitol. To many, it is a symbol of racial hatred. Remove it now to honor #Charleston victims.
 
Roof is a terrorist. He clearly states his intention to start a race war behind the shootings. He was apparently inspired by all the black on white crimes that media has been ignoring.
 
There is no doubt remaining he is a terrorist now though

Ticks all boxes
 
LOL Rick Perry calls the shooting an "accident" due to drug use. Manipulated by Obama to ban guns. Rick Perry makes George W. Bush sound like a scholar.
 
QazzarFan said:
LOL Rick Perry calls the shooting an "accident" due to drug use. Manipulated by Obama to ban guns. Rick Perry makes George W. Bush sound like a scholar.
Click to expand...

i think the revelations today will put a lot of the right wing nutters in quite a pickle.

It would be interesting to see what Fox and friends have to say. They spun it as an attack on Christians but now his manifesto is out in the open
 
Well Rick Perry had a ranch named ******head, with the asteriks representing a very distasteful and racist word (guess which one)
 
HAHAHA Fox actually denying there's a race angle and that this is actually a war on Christians.

Geez I wonder what the killer wearing the Apartheid South Africa and Rhodesian flags were about ?! This is a result of the culture Fox and the American right-wing have created - this sclerotic, obsessive, hate-filled fearmongering that this killer is a product of.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/uW2Gx7bgfpw" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
 
Its interesting how the racist apologists have come out with the line about white hate being sponsored by "black culture", bad lyrics, rap etc. Not that I condone that. But any comments about:

Breaking Bad revolving around two white male characters making a living from creating and selling drugs, and kill people to protect their livelihood. Games of Throne revolving around white tribes that engage in dodgy practices including murder, torture, incest, adultery, rape, murder, etc.

Not to mention one of the biggest audiences for this "disgusting rap" are white people !

And yet these people have the gall to talk about "black culture" ? The hypocrisy could be measured on the Richter Scale.
 
Not sure why I am more shocked about

The fact an Anglican church where Martin Luther king once spoke was attacked by this supremacist or that he burnt the American flag and loved the Germans
 
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