David Gower's 50 Greatest Cricketers of All Time

[Slog]

Interesting Kapil Dev doesnt figure anywhere near the top btw whereas all other elite all rounders are in top 20. So much for him being forced into the club of Imran, Hadlee, Botham and Sobers (sobers is again a step up)

 

[Robert]

So the greatest all-rounder cricketer, aka Kaptaan doesn't even make it into the top 10.

Um, yeah he did, look at #2.

 

[Sachin136]

Um, yeah he did, look at #2.

I think he is referring to Imran Khan who is at #11 in the rankings.

 

[Sachin136]

By the way when considering how good "cricketers" these players are, does David Gower consider captaincy?

Interesting Kapil Dev doesnt figure anywhere near the top btw whereas all other elite all rounders are in top 20. So much for him being forced into the club of Imran, Hadlee, Botham and Sobers (sobers is again a step up)

You can't take all of these rankings at face value as it is just an opinion. He isn't "being forced into" the class of those other all-rounders.

 

[Mainul]

By nationality, he names:

Australia - Thomson, Lindwall, Gilchrist, G. Chappell, Ponting, McGrath, Border, O'Reilly, Miller, Benaud, Lillee, Warne, Bradman
England - Knott, Pietersen, Larwood, Trueman, Sutcliffe, Compton, Rhodes, Hutton, Barnes, Botham, WG Grace, Hammond, Hobbs
India - Kapil Dev, Sehwag, Gavaskar, Tendulkar
Pakistan - Miandad, Wasim, Imran
New Zealand - Hadlee
South Africa - Steyn, de Villiers, G. Pollock, B. Richards, Kallis
Sri Lanka - Sangakkara, Muralitharan
West Indies - Garner, Worrell, Ambrose, Headley, Roberts, Marshall, Lara, Richards, Sobers

Very biased pick ups indeed.He didn't pick some Indians and Pakistanis who deserved to be there.Poor 50s.

 

[IndianWillow]

Interesting Kapil Dev doesnt figure anywhere near the top btw whereas all other elite all rounders are in top 20. So much for him being forced into the club of Imran, Hadlee, Botham and Sobers (sobers is again a step up)

Opinion of one person. Could be because Kapil wasn't that good against England. So Dev>Holding now as per the list? Steve Waugh has gone missing, I suppose every one in the top 50 is greater than Steve?

 

[Slog]

Opinion of one person. Could be because Kapil wasn't that good against England. So Dev>Holding now as per the list? Steve Waugh has gone missing, I suppose every one in the top 50 is greater than Steve?

Tbh all neutral experts/observers put Dev is a lower category than the other great all rounders.

 

[Mamoon]

Um, yeah he did, look at #2.

Talking about Imran.

 

[IndianWillow]

Tbh all neutral experts/observers put Dev is a lower category than the other great all rounders.

Mostly due to stats. Not much credit is given to Kapil's exploits in the WI and Aus. External conditions like Kapil's lack of support bowlers or playing for a weak side or bowling 70% in Asia is not considered. Botham is mostly known for his Ashes exploits, he was a flop against the WI side.

 

[TheNightWatchman]

No Dravid Waqar in the list.

Exactly what I was thinking

 

[Stallion__]

Imran and Hadlee are clearly ahead but stats wise, Kapil and Botham don't differ much. Botham though, do have some iconic match winning performances thats why he is rated higher.

But Botham and 12 and Kapil at 48 if unfair to Kapil. Difference isn't so big imo (He probably has over-rated his team-mate Botham here).

The issue Kapil has is the lack of match-winning performances (apart from few), understandably so, since he never had good enough support from the other end. Most of his 5 wicket hauls were expensive ones earned after bowling 25-30 overs. Even his 9-for against WI ended in India's loss

But he was a better bowler than that, and troubled some of the most proficient players of pace like Greenidge, Gooch, Gower, Border etc.

 

[Pantani]

Very biased pick ups indeed.He didn't pick some Indians and Pakistanis who deserved to be there.Poor 50s.

There's an over-representation of Australia and England players because Gower gives a lot of priority to pre-1940s cricket, when of course, Australia and England were the only decent sides around.

 

[Pantani]

So Dev>Holding now as per the list?

I think it's fair enough to argue that Kapil was a better cricketer than Holding. Holding was a better bowler, but Kapil was a good batsman and also a captain as well.

 

[Robert]

Mostly due to stats. Not much credit is given to Kapil's exploits in the WI and Aus. External conditions like Kapil's lack of support bowlers or playing for a weak side or bowling 70% in Asia is not considered. Botham is mostly known for his Ashes exploits, he was a flop against the WI side.

I would put Kapil ahead of Botham as a bowler for the reasons you give here.

I would put Botham ahead of all the all-rounders as a batter, because of those 14 centuries and because he played more than half his cricket in England where the ball does so much. Sir Ian is also known for his exploits against India, in case you had forgotten that 70 batting average.

 

[IndianWillow]

Imran and Hadlee are clearly ahead but stats wise, Kapil and Botham don't differ much. Botham though, do have some iconic match winning performances thats why he is rated higher.

But Botham and 12 and Kapil at 48 if unfair to Kapil. Difference isn't so big imo (He probably has over-rated his team-mate Botham here).

The issue Kapil has is the lack of match-winning performances (apart from few), understandably so, since he never had good enough support from the other end. Most of his 5 wicket hauls were expensive ones earned after bowling 25-30 overs. Even his 9-for against WI ended in India's loss

But he was a better bowler than that, and troubled some of the most proficient players of pace like Greenidge, Gooch, Gower, Border etc.

Yep, fast bowlers love to hunt in pairs. Imran had Sarfraz and Wasim, Botham had Willis, Foster and Dilley, Hadlee had Chatfield and Snedden, but Kapil had the likes of Binny, Madanlal and Cheta Sharma. Even in the spin department, Imran had Qadir, Qasim and Tauseef, Botham had Underwood, Emburey and Edmonds, but Kapil had Shastri (other spinners of the 80s like Siva, Ayub, Maninder and Hirwani were one day wonders). Both home and away, India was reduced to a one man bowling army headed by Kapil. Others would chip in occasionally, but 80% of the time Kapil would be fighting a lone battle. These do not show up in the stats though. Kapil could not win a match with a performance like 9/83 against the WI because other bowlers and batsmen did not show up.

 

[Harsh Thakor]

1. Don Bradman
2. Garry Sobers
3. Sachin Tendulkar
4. Shane Warne
5. Viv Richards
6. Brian Lara
7. Jack Hobbs
8. Wally Hammond
9. Malcolm Marshall
10. W.G. Grace
11. Imran Khan
12. Ian Botham
13. Sydney Barnes
14. Jacques Kallis
15. Barry Richards
16. Dennis Lillee
17. Len Hutton
18. Wilfred Rhodes
19. Richie Benaud
20. Denis Compton
21. Keith Miller
22. Bill O' Reilly
23. Andy Roberts
24. Richard Hadlee
25. Graeme Pollock
26. Sunil Gavaskar
27. Wasim Akram
28. Allan Border
29. Glenn McGrath
30. Muttiah Muralitharan
31. George Headley
32. Curtley Ambrose
33. Javed Miandad
34. Ricky Ponting
35. Frank Worrell
36. Herbert Sutcliffe
37. Greg Chappell
38. Fred Tru,an
39. AB De Villiers
40. Dale Steyn
41. Kumar Sangakkara
42. Adam Gilchrist
43. Ray Lindwall
44. Harold Larwood
45. Joel Harner
46. Virender Sehwag
47. Kevin Pietersen
48. Kapil Dev
49. Jeff Thomson
50. Alan Knott

A great list overall and basically very fair.I think he gives due respect to the modern generation.Of what I have read on the net he is analytical about Mcgrtah,Lara,Akram,Ambrose etc.
In these respects I really admire the list

Positive points.

1.It does great justice to Andy Roberts,the most complete pace bowler with Dennis Lillee of his time.Statistics hardly did true justice to Andy who was a more complete paceman than Imran Khan ,Michael Holding or Richard Hadlee.Few paceman had such a wide variety like his bouncers at different speeds.

2.He correctly places Wasim Akram above Glaen Mcgrath as a cricketer because of his prowess with the bat and greater variety with the ball.Again better than Jenkins who placed wasim at 34th and Glen Mcgrath at 11th place.Wasim was by a whisker more eligible for selection in an all-time world xi.

3.Does Justice to Jacques Kallis who again was rated very low by Geoff Armstrong and Cristopher Martin Jenkins who put him in 52 nd place.Morally Kallis was Sober's runner-up as an all-rounder.

4.Does justice to Brian Lara who was rated in 21 st place by Geoff Armstrong and Cristopher Martin Jenkins behind Denis Compton,George Headley,Walter Hammond etc but placed Tendulkar and Viv Richards were placed in the top 10 by Martin Jenkins.In pure test cricket Lara was arguably the best batsman after Bradman.

Flaws of analysis.

1.It underestimates W.G.Grace who could have been at no 1 if you ***** the staggering level of his acheivements.Imagine scoring 344 on a pitch of uncut grass , 1000 runs 28 times in an English first-class season and the double of 1000 runs and 100 wickets 8 times. .Scoring 54211 runs and taking 2876 wickets is alos a phenomenal achievement.Considering the wickets he played averaging 39.85 was a phenomenal figure.W.G.should have atleast been in the top 3,if you respect his impact and contribution .

2.Obliterates the name of Michael Holding.No pace bowler ever posessed a smoother or better action or bowled as consistently fast through the air. He was literally 'a whispering death.,steaming in like Rolys Royce car but creating the impact of thunder.Holding bowled the best ever spell and best ever over in test cricket.

3 Erronously places Malcolm Marshall above Imran Khan and Jacques Kallis.Imran's great achievements as a leader and greatness as an all-rounder place him in the Tendulkar or Viv Richards bracket as a cricketer while Kallis was almost Sober's equal as an all-rounder.I am almost certain had Kallis played in the 1980's he would have eclipsed Botham,Hadlee or Kapil Dev.

4.Places Ray Lindwall too low down the order who to me was more complete than even Denis Lillee.Lindwall could well have deserved a pace in the top 20,on par with Lillee.Remember Trueman,Davidson Compton nad Gravaney rated Ray as the best post-war pace bowler they ever saw.In that light Armostrong and Martin Jenkins were much fairer in ranking Lindwall.

5.Ranks Jack Hobbs too low who should have been place atleast at no 4.I think Hobbs was arguably the most complete batsman of all if you ***** his mastery on wet wickets.61,237 runs with 197 centuries is a staggering performance.Hobs to me is above Tendulkar or Viv Richards.

6.Sydney Barnes should be atleast in the top 10,being arguably the greatest fast bowler ever taking 7 wickets per test at 16.89.

6.He should have placed Sunil Gavaskar a place ahead of Barry Richards as well as Greame Pollock if you fairly respect international performances.

7.Adam Gilchrist should be atleast in the top 13-15.He was the greatest match-winner of his day ranked in the top 10 by Armstrong and Martin Jenkins.Gichrist may even edge Imran or Marshall in the rankings.


8.Total injustice to Murlitharan who has to be in the top 12. Warne at 4 and Murli at 30 is ridiculous.

 

[Harsh Thakor]

Imran and Hadlee are clearly ahead but stats wise, Kapil and Botham don't differ much. Botham though, do have some iconic match winning performances thats why he is rated higher.

But Botham and 12 and Kapil at 48 if unfair to Kapil. Difference isn't so big imo (He probably has over-rated his team-mate Botham here).


The issue Kapil has is the lack of match-winning performances (apart from few), understandably so, since he never had good enough support from the other end. Most of his 5 wicket hauls were expensive ones earned after bowling 25-30 overs. Even his 9-for against WI ended in India's loss

But he was a better bowler than that, and troubled some of the most proficient players of pace like Greenidge, Gooch, Gower, Border etc.

Botham at his peak was the closest to Gary Sobers as an all-rounder and the best match-winner amongst all great all-rounders.Infact only because of his great capataincy can Imran rate ahead of Botham.Botham's figures as an all-rounder are staggering from 1977-82 and his best performances in tests and series even eclipsed the best of Sobers.Overall however Kallis came closest to Sobers as an all-rounder while Botham's inconsistency after 1985 went against his being rated only behind Sobers amongst all-rounders.Read what Sir Gary said about Ian or even Alan Donald,Shaun Pollock and Martin Crowe rated him.Many included Botham in the all-time xi to substitute Sobers.18 cricketers put Botham in their all-time xi,including many overseas.As an all-rounder purely he would atleast be Imran's equal or possibly edge him at his peak.Remember the games he turned with both bat and ball-5 wkts and a century a record 5 times..His 1980 Jubilee test and 1981 Ashes performances were the best by any all-rounder ever.

 

[Saj]

No Mudassar Nazar?

 

[Harsh Thakor]

I liked Martin Crowe's list more. Some great names misses in this one.

Grimmet, Walcott, Barrington, Laker, Dravid, Donald, Waqar. Perhaps Kumble as well.

Though its difficult to cross any names in such lists to adjust others.


Its his opinion of course.
But if I were to make few changes, I will do this

-) Trumper for Thomson
-) Weekes for Sehwag
-) Laker for Larwood

and would try to pick Holding in somehow (can't figure out in place of whom).

Also certainly wrongly left out Sir George Headley,arguably 2nd only to the Don.Also Holding for Garner and Kanhai for Pieterson.

 

[Stallion__]

Botham at his peak was the closest to Gary Sobers as an all-rounder and the best match-winner amongst all great all-rounders.

We have to take the whole career into consideration while talking about players.

Botham was the best batsman of the 4, but I would put him third best for bowling capability.

Botham has amazing first 5 years, on many occasions would single-handedly beat the opposition 11 both with bat and ball, like that Golden Jubilee test.

But similarly, at his peak, Imran was as devastating as any bowler ever has been. Had a bowling average of 14 during 6 years in mid-80s and was the second best batsman in Pakistani team.


Problem with Botham is that he faded away a bit too early or else could have been the best of the 4.

Mentioned it in another thread, his career was divided into 4 distinct parts.

First 10-11 tests. He got a dream start to his career, few centuries in first 10 tests along with lot of 5-fors with the bowling average in mid 10s.

From tests 10-50. Was very good player even during this period, not as good as in first 10 tests but would still be a match winner for his team.

Most of his best performances came during his first 50 tests.

Then from 50-80 tests, he was good as an allrounder, but not good enough to make it into the team as a bowler or a batsman alone. Gave few and occasional match-winning performance.

Last 20 tests, was just a bits and pieces player during this period. Nothing special.


During his first 50 tests, he was on his way to challenge Sobers, but just wasn't the same player during second half of his career.

Now if you compare that with Hadlee or Imran who maintained their standards for much longer than Botham, it would be unfair not to rate them ahead of Botham.

Plus all those 5 performances, no doubt were superb, but none of them is against WI, the best team of his period.

He don't have a single century against them and had worst bowling record against them as compared to his record against other teams.

Rest of the three allrounders have troubled WI, but Botham haven't, so that also takes the shine off his career.


Ex-cricketers do praise him because they recollect his peak period. And during his peak, no doubt he was unstoppable. Players like Kapil who gave consistent performances for longer period of time (130 tests) often gets under-rated because they don't have any such peak periods but on the other hand, they don't have the poor run of form like Botham have during later part of his career. Specially in country like India, where there is no fast bowling culture, it sounds even a bigger achievement. (though I still think Botham was better than Kapil but we should give Kapil his due credit).

Also certainly wrongly left out Sir George Headley,arguably 2nd only to the Don.Also Holding for Garner and Kanhai for Pieterson.

Kanhai somehow slips under the radar in these lists. Holding is must in such lists, led the best bowling attack that has ever been.
Gower has picked Headley though (at 31), though he should be in top 20.

 

[Harsh Thakor]

We have to take the whole career into consideration while talking about players.

Botham was the best batsman of the 4, but I would put him third best for bowling capability.

Botham has amazing first 5 years, on many occasions would single-handedly beat the opposition 11 both with bat and ball, like that Golden Jubilee test.

But similarly, at his peak, Imran was as devastating as any bowler ever has been. Had a bowling average of 14 during 6 years in mid-80s and was the second best batsman in Pakistani team.


Problem with Botham is that he faded away a bit too early or else could have been the best of the 4.

Mentioned it in another thread, his career was divided into 4 distinct parts.

First 10-11 tests. He got a dream start to his career, few centuries in first 10 tests along with lot of 5-fors with the bowling average in mid 10s.

From tests 10-50. Was very good player even during this period, not as good as in first 10 tests but would still be a match winner for his team.

Most of his best performances came during his first 50 tests.

Then from 50-80 tests, he was good as an allrounder, but not good enough to make it into the team as a bowler or a batsman alone. Gave few and occasional match-winning performance.

Last 20 tests, was just a bits and pieces player during this period. Nothing special.


During his first 50 tests, he was on his way to challenge Sobers, but just wasn't the same player during second half of his career.

Now if you compare that with Hadlee or Imran who maintained their standards for much longer than Botham, it would be unfair not to rate them ahead of Botham.

Plus all those 5 performances, no doubt were superb, but none of them is against WI, the best team of his period.

He don't have a single century against them and had worst bowling record against them as compared to his record against other teams.

Rest of the three allrounders have troubled WI, but Botham haven't, so that also takes the shine off his career.


Ex-cricketers do praise him because they recollect his peak period. And during his peak, no doubt he was unstoppable. Players like Kapil who gave consistent performances for longer period of time (130 tests) often gets under-rated because they don't have any such peak periods but on the other hand, they don't have the poor run of form like Botham have during later part of his career. Specially in country like India, where there is no fast bowling culture, it sounds even a bigger achievement. (though I still think Botham was better than Kapil but we should give Kapil his due credit).



Kanhai somehow slips under the radar in these lists. Holding is must in such lists, led the best bowling attack that has ever been.
Gower has picked Headley though (at 31), though he should be in top 20.

Sorry for mistake on Headley.Stlill agree he should have been around 20.Still disagree on Botham, Taking 28 -5 wkts hails with 383 wkts and scoring 14 centuries and 5200 runs speaks for itself.True he failed against Windies basically but remember his 8-103 and 81 in the same test at Lords in 1983.Also remember his Ashes performances in 1985 and 1986-87.Imran was without doubt the best from 1981-1988 but was a great bowler and great batsmen in different periods of his career.I still feel Botham could win more matches with both ball and bat and was a more attacking ,match-wining batsmen.Ofcourse overall Imran was significant ahead as a pace bowler and capatin.Would probably make the 2nd all-time xi with Kallis and right there with Tendulkar and Richards as a cricketer.Jacques Kallis to me would rate ahead of Imran as an-allrounder and could challenge Tendulkar as a cricketer overall.

 

[Stallion__]

True he failed against Windies basically but remember his 8-103 and 81 in the same test at Lords in 1983.Also remember his Ashes performances in 1985 and 1986-87.Imran was without doubt the best from 1981-1988 but was a great bowler and great batsmen in different periods of his career.I still feel Botham could win more matches with both ball and bat and was a more attacking ,match-wining batsmen.Ofcourse overall Imran was significant ahead as a pace bowler and capatin.Would probably make the 2nd all-time xi with Kallis and right there with Tendulkar and Richards as a cricketer.Jacques Kallis to me would rate ahead of Imran as an-allrounder and could challenge Tendulkar as a cricketer overall.

Wasn't that WI Lord's match the same one where Greenidge got double hundred? Botham's heroics got neutralized by even better performance.

I agree with the impact part of Botham. Specially with the bat, was counter-attacking batsman, could take the game away quickly. Rate him a better batsman than Imran despite him having lesser average.

Match-winning performances were there from him, a lot of them, but consistency was missing. Could look like the best cricket ever in one match but amateurish in another.

Impact wise, he was better than his stats. Has a significant contribution in most of the test matches England won during his career.
Maybe I under-rate him a bit more because of WI factor.

As for Kallis, well yeah, he can make a claim for being a better player than both Sachin and Imran. He isn't favorite of many people on PP, but I feel, the balance the SA team has because of Kallis, isn't appreciated enough. Has got most MoM ever in test matches, shows how much influence he has on SA fortunes.

Btw how to you rate Botham as compared to Hadlee?

 

[Harsh Thakor]

Wasn't that WI Lord's match the same one where Greenidge got double hundred? Botham's heroics got neutralized by even better performance.

I agree with the impact part of Botham. Specially with the bat, was counter-attacking batsman, could take the game away quickly. Rate him a better batsman than Imran despite him having lesser average.

Match-winning performances were there from him, a lot of them, but consistency was missing. Could look like the best cricket ever in one match but amateurish in another.

Impact wise, he was better than his stats. Has a significant contribution in most of the test matches England won during his career.
Maybe I under-rate him a bit more because of WI factor.

As for Kallis, well yeah, he can make a claim for being a better player than both Sachin and Imran. He isn't favorite of many people on PP, but I feel, the balance the SA team has because of Kallis, isn't appreciated enough. Has got most MoM ever in test matches, shows how much influence he has on SA fortunes.

Btw how to you rate Botham as compared to Hadlee?

yes ,it was that same match when Greenidge scored one of the 3-4 best double hundreds ever in the game.Glad that you recognize my points fairly.Appreciate the balance in your reply.Yes,consistency was a vital factor and Botham could be erratic.Both had an x factor.Botham was a great slip catcher,also.No doubt.Imran was more consistent overall.

Kallis did not have x factor like Sobers,Imran and Botham but at his best could turn or win games with both bat and ball.On figures he is the best of all allrounders and amongst the best 3-4 cricketers but the game is not all about stats and Kallis lacked the flair and flamboyance to consistently win matches.Still he can give Tendulkar or Imran a run for their money with his phenomenal utilitarian qualities.

I rate Botham above Hadlee as an all-rounder and cricketer.Hadlee was hardly in the same class with the bat.Hadlee was more consistent but could not win games with the bat.

 

[Stallion__]

yes ,it was that same match when Greenidge scored one of the 3-4 best double hundreds ever in the game.Glad that you recognize my points fairly.Appreciate the balance in your reply.Yes,consistency was a vital factor and Botham could be erratic.Both had an x factor.Botham was a great slip catcher,also.No doubt.Imran was more consistent overall.

Kallis did not have x factor like Sobers,Imran and Botham but at his best could turn or win games with both bat and ball.On figures he is the best of all allrounders and amongst the best 3-4 cricketers but the game is not all about stats and Kallis lacked the flair and flamboyance to consistently win matches.Still he can give Tendulkar or Imran a run for their money with his phenomenal utilitarian qualities.

I rate Botham above Hadlee as an all-rounder and cricketer.Hadlee was hardly in the same class with the bat.Hadlee was more consistent but could not win games with the bat.

Ok, thanks for the reply.

Agree with most of it.

Hadlee actually was in Davidson, Benaud or maybe Wasim's category (better than Wasim though) with the bat, but was probably best of the 4 as a bowler.

Its difficult to rate him as an allrounder because of lack of his batting credentials as compared to other allrounders but could easily be rated among other great fast bowlers.

And yeah, Kallis lose marks for exuberance much like Dravid, but of course, his bowling (slip catching too) was a great asset to his team, much under-valued aspect of his game.

 

[Harsh Thakor]

[SIZE=4


]1. Don Bradman
2. Garry Sobers
3. Sachin Tendulkar
4. Shane Warne
5. Viv Richards
6. Brian Lara
7. Jack Hobbs
8. Wally Hammond
9. Malcolm Marshall
10. W.G. Grace
11. Imran Khan
12. Ian Botham
13. Sydney Barnes
14. Jacques Kallis
15. Barry Richards
16. Dennis Lillee
17. Len Hutton
18. Wilfred Rhodes
19. Richie Benaud
20. Denis Compton
21. Keith Miller
22. Bill O' Reilly
23. Andy Roberts
24. Richard Hadlee
25. Graeme Pollock
26. Sunil Gavaskar
27. Wasim Akram
28. Allan Border
29. Glenn McGrath
30. Muttiah Muralitharan
31. George Headley
32. Curtley Ambrose
33. Javed Miandad
34. Ricky Ponting
35. Frank Worrell
36. Herbert Sutcliffe
37. Greg Chappell
38. Fred Tru,an
39. AB De Villiers
40. Dale Steyn
41. Kumar Sangakkara
42. Adam Gilchrist
43. Ray Lindwall
44. Harold Larwood
45. Joel Harner
46. Virender Sehwag
47. Kevin Pietersen
48. Kapil Dev
49. Jeff Thomson
50. Alan Knott[/SIZE]

My top 50 cricketers chosen by David Gower of all in my tentative personal order of merit

1 Gary Sobers
2.Don Bradman
3.W.G.Grace.
4.Jack Hobbs
5.Sydney Barnes
6.Shane Warne
7.Viv Richards
8.Sachin Tendulkar
9.Imran Khan
10.Brian Lara
11. Jacques Kallis
12.Muthiah Murlitharan
13.Wasim Akram
14.Malcom Marshall
15.Adam Gilchrist
16.Walter Hammond
17.Victor Trumper
18.Ian Botham
19.Dennis Lillee
20.Glen Mcgrath
21.Len Hutton
22.George Headley
23.Keith Miller
24.Ray Lindwall
25.Fred Trueman
26.Richard Hadlee
27.Sunil Gavaskar
28.Curtly Ambrose
29.Graeme Pollock
30.Barry Richards
31.Wilfred Rhodes
32.Ricky Ponting
33.Andy Roberts
34.Harold Larwood
35.Herbert Sutcliffe
36.Bill O'Reilly
37..Kapil Dev
38.Greg Chappell
39.Alan Border
40.Javed Miandad
41. Kumar Sangakaara
42.Denis Compton
43.Frank Worrel
44.Kevin Pieterson
45.Joel Garner
46.Virendra Sehwag
47.Dale Steyn
48.A.B.Devilliers
49.Jeff Thomson
50.Alan Knott

Viv Richard's great match-winning prowess in tests and O.D.I.s perhaps edges Tendulkar's longevity,Kalli's phenomenal all-round figures puts him in the top dozen ,Imran's x factor and captaincy made me rate him above Kallis,Sydney Barnes's records make him the best bowler of all,Sobers as a pure cricketer surpassed the Don ,W.G.Grace was the greatest first class cricketer of all,Hobbs dominated his era more than any batsman ever did bar Bradman,Wasim's batting talent in addition to phenomenal bowling skills placed him ahead of Marshall,Mcgrath,Lillee ,Roberts and Ambrose,Gilchrist was the best match-winner of his day.

 

[Harsh Thakor]

1. Don Bradman
2. Garry Sobers
3. Sachin Tendulkar
4. Shane Warne
5. Viv Richards
6. Brian Lara
7. Jack Hobbs
8. Wally Hammond
9. Malcolm Marshall
10. W.G. Grace
11. Imran Khan
12. Ian Botham
13. Sydney Barnes
14. Jacques Kallis
15. Barry Richards
16. Dennis Lillee
17. Len Hutton
18. Wilfred Rhodes
19. Richie Benaud
20. Denis Compton
21. Keith Miller
22. Bill O' Reilly
23. Andy Roberts
24. Richard Hadlee
25. Graeme Pollock
26. Sunil Gavaskar
27. Wasim Akram
28. Allan Border
29. Glenn McGrath
30. Muttiah Muralitharan
31. George Headley
32. Curtley Ambrose
33. Javed Miandad
34. Ricky Ponting
35. Frank Worrell
36. Herbert Sutcliffe
37. Greg Chappell
38. Fred Tru,an
39. AB De Villiers
40. Dale Steyn
41. Kumar Sangakkara
42. Adam Gilchrist
43. Ray Lindwall
44. Harold Larwood
45. Joel Harner
46. Virender Sehwag
47. Kevin Pietersen
48. Kapil Dev
49. Jeff Thomson
50. Alan Knott

Sorry,by mistake I left out Richie Benaud and put Victor Trumper in the list of top 50 cricketers chosen by David Gower of all .Below I have re-shuffled Gower's top 50 in my tentative personal order of merit.All of Gower's selected 50 are here but in a different order.Please reject past post and only read this one.

1.W.G.Grace
2.Gary Sobers
3.Don Bradman.
4.Jack Hobbs
5.Sydney Barnes
6.Shane Warne
7.Viv Richards
8.Sachin Tendulkar
9.Imran Khan
10.Brian Lara
11. Jacques Kallis
12.Muthiah Murlitharan
13.Wasim Akram
14.Malcom Marshall
15.Adam Gilchrist
16.Walter Hammond
17.Ian Botham
18.Dennis Lillee
19.Glen Mcgrath
20.Len Hutton
21.George Headley
22.Keith Miller
23.Ray Lindwall
24.Fred Trueman
25.Richard Hadlee
26.Sunil Gavaskar
27.Curtly Ambrose
28.Graeme Pollock
29.Barry Richards
30.Wilfred Rhodes
31.Ricky Ponting
32.Richie Benaud
33.Andy Roberts
34.Harold Larwood
35.Herbert Sutcliffe
36.Bill O'Reilly
37..Kapil Dev
38.Greg Chappell
39.Alan Border
40.Javed Miandad
41. Kumar Sangakaara
42.Denis Compton
43.Frank Worrel
44.Kevin Pieterson
45.Joel Garner
46.Virendra Sehwag
47.Dale Steyn
48.A.B.Devilliers
49.Jeff Thomson
50.Alan Knott

Viv Richard's great match-winning prowess in tests and O.D.I.s perhaps edges Tendulkar's longevity,Kalli's phenomenal all-round figures puts him in the top dozen ,Imran's x factor and captaincy made me rate him above Kallis,Sydney Barnes's records make him the best bowler of all,Sobers as a pure cricketer surpassed the Don ,W.G.Grace made an impact to the game no cricketer ever did,Hobbs dominated his era more than any batsman ever did bar Bradman,Wasim's batting talent in addition to phenomenal bowling skills placed him ahead of Marshall,Mcgrath,Lillee ,Roberts and Ambrose,Gilchrist was the best match-winner of his day,Greg Chappell marginally had more class than Miandad or Border as a batsman .

 

[Harsh Thakor]

1. Don Bradman
2. Garry Sobers
3. Sachin Tendulkar
4. Shane Warne
5. Viv Richards
6. Brian Lara
7. Jack Hobbs
8. Wally Hammond
9. Malcolm Marshall
10. W.G. Grace
11. Imran Khan
12. Ian Botham
13. Sydney Barnes
14. Jacques Kallis
15. Barry Richards
16. Dennis Lillee
17. Len Hutton
18. Wilfred Rhodes
19. Richie Benaud
20. Denis Compton
21. Keith Miller
22. Bill O' Reilly
23. Andy Roberts
24. Richard Hadlee
25. Graeme Pollock
26. Sunil Gavaskar
27. Wasim Akram
28. Allan Border
29. Glenn McGrath
30. Muttiah Muralitharan
31. George Headley
32. Curtley Ambrose
33. Javed Miandad
34. Ricky Ponting
35. Frank Worrell
36. Herbert Sutcliffe
37. Greg Chappell
38. Fred Tru,an
39. AB De Villiers
40. Dale Steyn
41. Kumar Sangakkara
42. Adam Gilchrist
43. Ray Lindwall
44. Harold Larwood
45. Joel Harner
46. Virender Sehwag
47. Kevin Pietersen
48. Kapil Dev
49. Jeff Thomson
50. Alan Knott

Sorry,by mistake I left out Richie Benaud and put Victor Trumper in the list of top 50 cricketers chosen by David Gower of all .Below I have re-shuffled Gower's top 50 in my tentative personal order of merit.All of Gower's selected 50 are here but in a different order.Please reject past post and only read this one.

1.W.G.Grace
2.Gary Sobers
3.Don Bradman.
4.Jack Hobbs
5.Sydney Barnes
6.Shane Warne
7.Viv Richards
8.Sachin Tendulkar
9.Imran Khan
10.Brian Lara
11. Jacques Kallis
12.Muthiah Murlitharan
13.Wasim Akram
14.Malcom Marshall
15.Adam Gilchrist
16.Walter Hammond
17.Ian Botham
18.Dennis Lillee
19.Glen Mcgrath
20.Len Hutton
21.George Headley
22.Keith Miller
23.Ray Lindwall
24.Fred Trueman
25.Richard Hadlee
26.Sunil Gavaskar
27.Curtly Ambrose
28.Graeme Pollock
29.Barry Richards
30.Wilfred Rhodes
31.Ricky Ponting
32.Richie Benaud
33.Andy Roberts
34.Harold Larwood
35.Herbert Sutcliffe
36.Bill O'Reilly
37..Kapil Dev
38.Greg Chappell
39.Alan Border
40.Javed Miandad
41. Kumar Sangakaara
42.Denis Compton
43.Frank Worrel
44.Kevin Pieterson
45.Joel Garner
46.Virendra Sehwag
47.Dale Steyn
48.A.B.Devilliers
49.Jeff Thomson
50.Alan Knott

Viv Richard's great match-winning prowess in tests and O.D.I.s perhaps edges Tendulkar's longevity,Kalli's phenomenal all-round figures puts him in the top dozen ,Imran's x factor and captaincy made me rate him above Kallis,Sydney Barnes's records make him the best bowler of all,Sobers as a pure cricketer surpassed the Don ,W.G.Grace made an impact to the game no cricketer ever did,Hobbs dominated his era more than any batsman ever did bar Bradman,Wasim's batting talent in addition to phenomenal bowling skills placed him ahead of Marshall,Mcgrath,Lillee ,Roberts and Ambrose,Gilchrist was the best match-winner of his day,Greg Chappell marginally had more class than Miandad or Border as a batsman .

 

[SL_Fan]

Top 10 I would go with

Bradman
Sobers
Imran
Viv
Sachin
Kallis
Hadlee
Warne
Murali
McGrath

 

[Hitman]

Sorry,by mistake I left out Richie Benaud and put Victor Trumper in the list of top 50 cricketers chosen by David Gower of all .Below I have re-shuffled Gower's top 50 in my tentative personal order of merit.All of Gower's selected 50 are here but in a different order.Please reject past post and only read this one.

1.W.G.Grace
2.Gary Sobers
3.Don Bradman.
4.Jack Hobbs
5.Sydney Barnes
6.Shane Warne
7.Viv Richards
8.Sachin Tendulkar
9.Imran Khan
10.Brian Lara
11. Jacques Kallis
12.Muthiah Murlitharan
13.Wasim Akram
14.Malcom Marshall
15.Adam Gilchrist
16.Walter Hammond
17.Ian Botham
18.Dennis Lillee
19.Glen Mcgrath
20.Len Hutton
21.George Headley
22.Keith Miller
23.Ray Lindwall
24.Fred Trueman
25.Richard Hadlee
26.Sunil Gavaskar
27.Curtly Ambrose
28.Graeme Pollock
29.Barry Richards
30.Wilfred Rhodes
31.Ricky Ponting
32.Richie Benaud
33.Andy Roberts
34.Harold Larwood
35.Herbert Sutcliffe
36.Bill O'Reilly
37..Kapil Dev
38.Greg Chappell
39.Alan Border
40.Javed Miandad
41. Kumar Sangakaara
42.Denis Compton
43.Frank Worrel
44.Kevin Pieterson
45.Joel Garner
46.Virendra Sehwag
47.Dale Steyn
48.A.B.Devilliers
49.Jeff Thomson
50.Alan Knott

Viv Richard's great match-winning prowess in tests and O.D.I.s perhaps edges Tendulkar's longevity,Kalli's phenomenal all-round figures puts him in the top dozen ,Imran's x factor and captaincy made me rate him above Kallis,Sydney Barnes's records make him the best bowler of all,Sobers as a pure cricketer surpassed the Don ,W.G.Grace made an impact to the game no cricketer ever did,Hobbs dominated his era more than any batsman ever did bar Bradman,Wasim's batting talent in addition to phenomenal bowling skills placed him ahead of Marshall,Mcgrath,Lillee ,Roberts and Ambrose,Gilchrist was the best match-winner of his day,Greg Chappell marginally had more class than Miandad or Border as a batsman .

Why not create a thread about your list?

 

[IndianWillow]

Sorry,by mistake I left out Richie Benaud and put Victor Trumper in the list of top 50 cricketers chosen by David Gower of all .Below I have re-shuffled Gower's top 50 in my tentative personal order of merit.All of Gower's selected 50 are here but in a different order.Please reject past post and only read this one.

1.W.G.Grace
2.Gary Sobers
3.Don Bradman.
4.Jack Hobbs
5.Sydney Barnes
6.Shane Warne
7.Viv Richards
8.Sachin Tendulkar
9.Imran Khan
10.Brian Lara
11. Jacques Kallis
12.Muthiah Murlitharan
13.Wasim Akram
14.Malcom Marshall
15.Adam Gilchrist
16.Walter Hammond
17.Ian Botham
18.Dennis Lillee
19.Glen Mcgrath
20.Len Hutton
21.George Headley
22.Keith Miller
23.Ray Lindwall
24.Fred Trueman
25.Richard Hadlee
26.Sunil Gavaskar
27.Curtly Ambrose
28.Graeme Pollock
29.Barry Richards
30.Wilfred Rhodes
31.Ricky Ponting
32.Richie Benaud
33.Andy Roberts
34.Harold Larwood
35.Herbert Sutcliffe
36.Bill O'Reilly
37..Kapil Dev
38.Greg Chappell
39.Alan Border
40.Javed Miandad
41. Kumar Sangakaara
42.Denis Compton
43.Frank Worrel
44.Kevin Pieterson
45.Joel Garner
46.Virendra Sehwag
47.Dale Steyn
48.A.B.Devilliers
49.Jeff Thomson
50.Alan Knott

Viv Richard's great match-winning prowess in tests and O.D.I.s perhaps edges Tendulkar's longevity,Kalli's phenomenal all-round figures puts him in the top dozen ,Imran's x factor and captaincy made me rate him above Kallis,Sydney Barnes's records make him the best bowler of all,Sobers as a pure cricketer surpassed the Don ,W.G.Grace made an impact to the game no cricketer ever did,Hobbs dominated his era more than any batsman ever did bar Bradman,Wasim's batting talent in addition to phenomenal bowling skills placed him ahead of Marshall,Mcgrath,Lillee ,Roberts and Ambrose,Gilchrist was the best match-winner of his day,Greg Chappell marginally had more class than Miandad or Border as a batsman .

Steyn depromoted from #40 to #47?

 

[Hitman]

Gower played alongside Imran, and yet rates him at #11 while he rates Sachin at #3

 

[eradicator]

Poor Steyn , he is the best standout bowler in the current era of flat tracks and yet gets ranked in the 40s. These list for Cricketers of All times are too biased in favor of players of the bygone era. I dont know what a Modern day bowler or batsman is expected to do to be ranked in the Top 10 . More like their door have been forever shut on them because some of the players of the 60s-80s have the birthright to top rankings and they can never be shifted .

 

[eradicator]

I have seen Tendulkar ranked above all of the Asian Cricketers in most of these List by former Cricketers , so not a surprise to see Gower rating SRT over Imran.

 

[Hitman]

I have seen Tendulkar ranked above all of the Asian Cricketers in most of these List by former Cricketers , so not a surprise to see Gower rating SRT over Imran.

Don't worry, loyal fans of Imran and Wasim would say that David Gower is being paid off by the BCCI or that he is trying to brown nose Indian cricket.

 

[IndianWillow]

Poor Steyn , he is the best standout bowler in the current era of flat tracks and yet gets ranked in the 40s. These list for Cricketers of All times are too biased in favor of players of the bygone era. I dont know what a Modern day bowler or batsman is expected to do to be ranked in the Top 10 . More like their door have been forever shut on them because some of the players of the 60s-80s have the birthright to top rankings and they can never be shifted .

Averaging in the lows 20s versus Australia and England would have pushed Steyn into #10. There is a prevalent view that Steyn does not perform well against top sides and under pressure. (but it could be true that greats of the past may struggle equally badly if they were to bowl today...)

 

[Bilal7]

Mostly due to stats. Not much credit is given to Kapil's exploits in the WI and Aus. External conditions like Kapil's lack of support bowlers or playing for a weak side or bowling 70% in Asia is not considered. Botham is mostly known for his Ashes exploits, he was a flop against the WI side.

Will you remember this in comparison threads between Wasim/Waqar and McGrath/Steyn? Or will it then come down to the ridiculous theory of no country being a more difficult place to bowl/bat than any other, because players get used to their home conditions?

Top 10 I would go with

Bradman
Sobers
Imran
Viv
Sachin
Kallis
Hadlee
Warne
Murali
McGrath

Good list but no Marshall? Also Surprised that you rate Murali lower than Warne. Mine would be:

1) Bradman
2) Marshall
3) Imran
4) Sobers
5) Viv
6) Sachin
7) Wasim
8) Mcgrath
9) Murali
10) Warne

Don't worry, loyal fans of Imran and Wasim would say that David Gower is being paid off by the BCCI or that he is trying to brown nose Indian cricket.

No, us loyal fans will just laugh at your insecurity with regards to your idol.

 

[Hitman]

^^ I'm sorry I didn't make that list, I merely referred to it

 

[Hitman]

How about you read this -

http://www.pakpassion.net/ppforum/s...-60-Years-of-Asian-Heroes&p=842654#post842654

HaHaHa...that Zakhmi Kohni is not even half the man/cricketer Imran was/is and when we talk of Heroism; teenda is 10 times less then the Khan

Maybe they should also include Kapil in their list for great displays of Public Crying...

Such a shame the rest of the world thinks differently

 

[ChachaCricket]

Averaging in the lows 20s versus Australia and England would have pushed Steyn into #10. There is a prevalent view that Steyn does not perform well against top sides and under pressure. (but it could be true that greats of the past may struggle equally badly if they were to bowl today...)

When bowlers like Broad are getting 8 for 15. Bowlers of the past will struggle lol. Great bowlers from the past will feast on these technically inept batsmen.

 

[Stallion__]

Gower played alongside Imran, and yet rates him at #11 while he rates Sachin at #3

Don't worry, loyal fans of Imran and Wasim would say that David Gower is being paid off by the BCCI or that he is trying to brown nose Indian cricket.

^^ I'm sorry I didn't make that list, I merely referred to it

How about you read this -

http://www.pakpassion.net/ppforum/s...-60-Years-of-Asian-Heroes&p=842654#post842654




Such a shame the rest of the world thinks differently

 

[IndianWillow]

Will you remember this in comparison threads between Wasim/Waqar and McGrath/Steyn? Or will it then come down to the ridiculous theory of no country being a more difficult place to bowl/bat than any other, because players get used to their home conditions?



Good list but no Marshall? Also Surprised that you rate Murali lower than Warne. Mine would be:

1) Bradman
2) Marshall
3) Imran
4) Sobers
5) Viv
6) Sachin
7) Wasim
8) Mcgrath
9) Murali
10) Warne



No, us loyal fans will just laugh at your insecurity with regards to your idol.

Yes, I do include that factor in all my comparisons. This is one reason I rate Imran very highly (over the likes of Hadlee, Lillee etc) because he did extremely well in Asia. I did not incorporate this factor fully for Wasim and Waqar because these were two ATG bowlers bowling in tandem and that alone would reduce the disadvantage of the pitch factor. Very few bowlers (except the WI bowlers of the 80s) had as much luxury as Wasim and Waqar - these two supplemented and reinforced each other so well and these two bowlers shouldn't be complaining much about the pitch they bowled on. Imran didn't obviously enjoy as much luxury in - Sarfraz was good but not world class except in patches. Wasim Akram was still a young and fast bowler during Imran's time and had not reached his peak prowess. But Wasim and Waqar formed a very formidable pair of support bowlers - perhaps the best pair ever in the history of the game - due to this I don't give these bowlers full consideration of the fact that they bowled a lot in Asia.

 

[Hitman]

I didn't make that list. Throw off that candy to some of those sour loser Pak fans

 

[Bilal7]

^^ I'm sorry I didn't make that list, I merely referred to it

And? What about the lists in which Sachin isn't even ranked as the top five batsman of all time or those experts who prefer Lara and/or Ponting over Sachin when discussing batsmen from the 90's?

Are you forgetting that all of these lists are opinions? Yes, even the ones that support your agenda.

 

[Hitman]

And? What about the lists in which Sachin isn't even ranked as the top five batsman of all time or those experts who prefer Lara and/or Ponting over Sachin when discussing batsmen from the 90's?

Are you forgetting that all of these lists are opinions? Yes, even the ones that support your agenda.

Kindly refer to them.

 

[Bilal7]

Yes, I do include that factor in all my comparisons. This is one reason I rate Imran very highly (over the likes of Hadlee, Lillee etc) because he did extremely well in Asia. I did not incorporate this factor fully for Wasim and Waqar because these were two ATG bowlers bowling in tandem and that alone would reduce the disadvantage of the pitch factor. Very few bowlers (except the WI bowlers of the 80s) had as much luxury as Wasim and Waqar - these two supplemented and reinforced each other so well and these two bowlers shouldn't be complaining much about the pitch they bowled on. Imran didn't obviously enjoy as much luxury in - Sarfraz was good but not world class except in patches. Wasim Akram was still a young and fast bowler during Imran's time and had not reached his peak prowess. But Wasim and Waqar formed a very formidable pair of support bowlers - perhaps the best pair ever in the history of the game - due to this I don't give these bowlers full consideration of the fact that they bowled a lot in Asia.

This is a pretty weak argument. Yes, having an ATG bowler as your partner does help in certain aspects but is also detrimental in others. For example, it reduces the number of wickets you can pick.

Also, pitches do not become easier to bowl on just because you have a great bowler bowling from the other end. A flat pitch is a flat pitch, you are not going to be able to swing (Yes, has to do with conditions but you rarely find these conditions in Asia) or seam the ball around, nor will you find bounce or pace off the surface. The batsman will still treat you with disdain unless you are very good at what you do, regardless of how good the other bowler is bowling.

With regards to Mcgrath, he had a better supporting bowler than Wasim did, so he should be docked points if we were to judge them using your criteria.

 

[Bilal7]

Kindly refer to them.

I won't. If you are unaware that several ex-players prefer Lara and/or Ponting above Tendulker and others don't even rate him in the top three/top five batsmen of all time, you need to educate yourself.

Seeing how you were already schooled by Stallion in this very thread, with regards to Inzamam, you really should know your facts before posting.

 

[Hitman]

I won't. If you are unaware that several ex-players prefer Lara and/or Ponting above Tendulker and others don't even rate him in the top three/top five batsmen of all time, you need to educate yourself.

Seeing how you were already schooled by Stallion in this very thread, with regards to Inzamam, you really should know your facts before posting.

Well you can't refer to them? LOL, good enough

 

[Bilal7]

Well you can't refer to them? LOL, good enough

Australia captain Ricky Ponting has rated Brian Lara ahead of Sachin Tendulkar as he feels the West Indian batsman enabled his team win more matches.
"Sachin and Lara were the two stand-out batsmen for me. Lara won more games for his team than Sachin probably has. I'd lose more sleep as captain knowing Lara was coming in to bat next day than I would with Sachin," said Ponting. (Counter point: Ganguly says Sachin's bat will light up South Africa's Test skies)
"You always found a way to restrict Sachin if you needed to. Lara could turn it on in half an hour and take a game away from you. For me, it has never been about making hundreds, it is about winning games and series," Ponting was quoted as saying by the 'Evening Standard'.
Australia may have suffered an agonising defeat in the first Ashes Test against England but Ponting believes that the Aussies will win the series 2-1.
"I said 2-1 to Australia at the start and nothing has changed for me, no," he insisted.
"We've got a lot of hard work to do but it seems like things are on the right track. It is a Test match lost but for the Aussies it will reinforce them to think just how close they are and may be there's not that big a gulf between the teams.
"If they can take that away from the first Test it will do them good at Lord's this week. We have some very good young players. They are just starting to find their way and Ashes series tend to bring out the best in some," he added.

http://sports.ndtv.com/cricket/news/210908-for-ponting-brian-lara-was-much-more-dangerous-than-sachin-tendulkar

In b4 excuses.

 

[Sachin136]

http://sports.ndtv.com/cricket/news/210908-for-ponting-brian-lara-was-much-more-dangerous-than-sachin-tendulkar

In b4 excuses.

Can you link to some statements where ex-cricketers don't rate Sachin as one of the 5-10 greatest batsman, as you claim?

 

[Hitman]

http://sports.ndtv.com/cricket/news/210908-for-ponting-brian-lara-was-much-more-dangerous-than-sachin-tendulkar

In b4 excuses.

http://sports.ndtv.com/cricket/news...achin-tendulkar-as-the-best-he-played-against

 

[Bilal7]

Can you link to some statements where ex-cricketers don't rate Sachin as one of the 5-10 greatest batsman, as you claim?

Can you first link me to the statement in which I claim that some ex-cricketers don't rate Sachin in the top ten batsmen?

http://sports.ndtv.com/cricket/news...achin-tendulkar-as-the-best-he-played-against

From your source:

"I probably lost more sleep on the eve of games against (Brian) Lara because I knew he could single-handedly win games. The way I judge players has always been on their ability to win games by themselves. Lara could certainly do that and he did it probably more than what Sachin's done for India.

 

[Sachin136]

Can you first link me to the statement in which I claim that some ex-cricketers don't rate Sachin in the top ten batsmen?



From your source:

Yes I can, however you said top 5 and not top 10.

And? What about the lists in which Sachin isn't even ranked as the top five batsman of all time or those experts who prefer Lara and/or Ponting over Sachin when discussing batsmen from the 90's?

Are you forgetting that all of these lists are opinions? Yes, even the ones that support your agenda.

I won't. If you are unaware that several ex-players prefer Lara and/or Ponting above Tendulker and others don't even rate him in the top three/top five batsmen of all time, you need to educate yourself.

Seeing how you were already schooled by Stallion in this very thread, with regards to Inzamam, you really should know your facts before posting.

 

[UpInTheAir]

No Akhtar Afridi? List is a farce

 

[cricketworm]

I am so glad Sehwag is in the list. People started to notice how he changed the game just playing with high SR! Sehwag showed the way how to win on a flat track just giving enough time to bowlers to bowl out the opposition.

Gilly was the genius blaster of course but Sehwag did that opening it!

 

[cricketworm]

When bowlers like Broad are getting 8 for 15. Bowlers of the past will struggle lol. Great bowlers from the past will feast on these technically inept batsmen.

the other day people were saying these batsmen are feasting on flat track and they would struggle on better pitches of the past, now once they do get out cheaply, it's their ability that isn't good. lol

 

[Romali_rotti]

I won't. If you are unaware that several ex-players prefer Lara and/or Ponting above Tendulker and others don't even rate him in the top three/top five batsmen of all time, you need to educate yourself.

Seeing how you were already schooled by Stallion in this very thread, with regards to Inzamam, you really should know your facts before posting.

Barring Murali and Ponting who are these 'several' other players ? Ohh Pakistani players we know would automatically pick LARA , name me players from rest of the world barring Pakistan apart from Murali & Ponting.. I havent heard so I would like to know.

 

[SL_Fan]

Will you remember this in comparison threads between Wasim/Waqar and McGrath/Steyn? Or will it then come down to the ridiculous theory of no country being a more difficult place to bowl/bat than any other, because players get used to their home conditions?



Good list but no Marshall? Also Surprised that you rate Murali lower than Warne. Mine would be:

1) Bradman
2) Marshall
3) Imran
4) Sobers
5) Viv
6) Sachin
7) Wasim
8) Mcgrath
9) Murali
10) Warne



No, us loyal fans will just laugh at your insecurity with regards to your idol.

The list was for overall so Tests and ODIs champ. Marshall didn't do too well in ODIs. As for McGrath his record is flawless imo. Performed everywhere against everyone in every format. Turned up for big matches and series (Tests and WC). Hardly anyone got the better of him. As for Murali and Warne I would say Murali is the better bowler overall because Warne wasn't too flash in ODIs. But he did have more strings to his bow. More than handy with the bat. Excellent in the slips and arguably one of the best captains Aus never had. So a better overall cricketer for mine.

 

[soso_killer]

Are we talking Tests here or what?
Very strange Sehwag ahead of Langer, Kirsten and Smith for the opening slot? I highly doubt it. I understand Cook's omission as he is still playing but definitely better as well than Sehwag as well.
Sangakkara ahead of Dravid and Amla LOL.
And why does AB keep on making such lists and surprisingly very high as well. Cricket Australia had him in the top 10 IIRC yet AB is still well below SA greats i.e. Smith Amla and Kallis at this point in time.
What AB needs is an iconic/memorable series or innings that change the complexion of a series similar to what Smith has done on numerous occasions, Kallis as well. Amla did so in India, was instrumental in England then turned a series on its head in Australia. AB hasn't done so but consistently score runs, and that's not how I rate players at least not entirely anyway. As such S. Waugh should have made the list laughing all the way to the bank.
I'd remove Lillee for Donald, Garner for Holding. There's has been so many all round world class bowlers I guess perhaps I can tolerate some missing out. But that is definitely not the case for batsmen. Most are heavily reliant on conditions closer to home.

 

[Bhaijaan]

Are we talking Tests here or what?
Very strange Sehwag ahead of Langer, Kirsten and Smith for the opening slot? I highly doubt it. I understand Cook's omission as he is still playing but definitely better as well than Sehwag as well.
Sangakkara ahead of Dravid and Amla LOL.
And why does AB keep on making such lists and surprisingly very high as well. Cricket Australia had him in the top 10 IIRC yet AB is still well below SA greats i.e. Smith Amla and Kallis at this point in time.
What AB needs is an iconic/memorable series or innings that change the complexion of a series similar to what Smith has done on numerous occasions, Kallis as well. Amla did so in India, was instrumental in England then turned a series on its head in Australia. AB hasn't done so but consistently score runs, and that's not how I rate players at least not entirely anyway. As such S. Waugh should have made the list laughing all the way to the bank.
I'd remove Lillee for Donald, Garner for Holding. There's has been so many all round world class bowlers I guess perhaps I can tolerate some missing out. But that is definitely not the case for batsmen. Most are heavily reliant on conditions closer to home.

In form players tend to get overrated. Ponting around 2006, Sehwag around 2010, Sangakkara and ABD recently have been getting a lot of hype. It gets settled once the purple patch is over and the player is retired. I really like when people recognize G.Smith, IMO the best South African batsman overall in recent times. Kallis particularly in tests but if you talk about versatility, big match performances, iconic knocks Smith is right up there in both major formats.

 

[Hitman]

Why didn't he find Inzamam worthy of being in his top 50 list?

 

[Chrish]

Going by popular demand to sell the book,.

 

[Hitman]

Going by popular demand to sell the book,.

Absolutely, that's the most popular excuse. Just like it was when the 'great' Shane Warne rated that guy at #90 in his list of 'Top 100 Cricketers'

Such a shame, the greatest batsman against fast bowling, as said by his countryman Imran Khan ..... and yet no one outside Pakistan gives 2 hoots about him. Must be a BCCI conspiracy

 

[IndianWillow]

Absolutely, that's the most popular excuse. Just like it was when the 'great' Shane Warne rated that guy at #90 in his list of 'Top 100 Cricketers'

Such a shame, the greatest batsman against fast bowling, as said by his countryman Imran Khan ..... and yet no one outside Pakistan gives 2 hoots about him. Must be a BCCI conspiracy

Why are you so obsessed with Inzy? Not making top 50 list of all time is not as bad as it sounds especially when these lists are subjective opinions and not the opinion of a committee of experts.

 

[jimbob5]

Thommo in & S Waugh, Holding, Gooch, Waqar, Donald etc aren't. What did Thommo do? 200 wickets at an average of 28 & hang around too long-very good, but hardly deserving of top 50 all time status. Go back to sipping your wine Gower,

 

[Feroz Rawther]

the problem of just looking at mere numbers with out taking the context into account. that is why Kapil dev is placed at 48 where as Imran, Botham etc are placed 11,12 etc. For me Kapil was the best all rounder of the FAB 4 OF 80s.

 

[zabalestmsm]

1. Don Bradman
2. Garry Sobers
3. Sachin Tendulkar
4. Shane Warne
5. Viv Richards
6. Brian Lara
7. Jack Hobbs
8. Wally Hammond
9. Malcolm Marshall
10. W.G. Grace
11. Imran Khan
12. Ian Botham
13. Sydney Barnes
14. Jacques Kallis
15. Barry Richards
16. Dennis Lillee
17. Len Hutton
18. Wilfred Rhodes
19. Richie Benaud
20. Denis Compton
21. Keith Miller
22. Bill O' Reilly
23. Andy Roberts
24. Richard Hadlee
25. Graeme Pollock
26. Sunil Gavaskar
27. Wasim Akram
28. Allan Border
29. Glenn McGrath
30. Muttiah Muralitharan
31. George Headley
32. Curtley Ambrose
33. Javed Miandad
34. Ricky Ponting
35. Frank Worrell
36. Herbert Sutcliffe
37. Greg Chappell
38. Fred Tru,an
39. AB De Villiers
40. Dale Steyn
41. Kumar Sangakkara
42. Adam Gilchrist
43. Ray Lindwall
44. Harold Larwood
45. Joel Harner
46. Virender Sehwag
47. Kevin Pietersen
48. Kapil Dev
49. Jeff Thomson
50. Alan Knott


Sorry,by mistake I left out Richie Benaud and put Victor Trumper in the list of top 50 cricketers chosen by David Gower of all .Below I have re-shuffled Gower's top 50 in my tentative personal order of merit.All of Gower's selected 50 are here but in a different order.Please reject past post and only read this one.

1.W.G.Grace
2.Gary Sobers
3.Don Bradman.
4.Jack Hobbs
5.Sydney Barnes
6.Shane Warne
7.Viv Richards
8.Sachin Tendulkar
9.Imran Khan
10.Brian Lara
11. Jacques Kallis
12.Muthiah Murlitharan
13.Wasim Akram
14.Malcom Marshall
15.Adam Gilchrist
16.Walter Hammond
17.Ian Botham
18.Dennis Lillee
19.Glen Mcgrath
20.Len Hutton
21.George Headley
22.Keith Miller
23.Ray Lindwall
24.Fred Trueman
25.Richard Hadlee
26.Sunil Gavaskar
27.Curtly Ambrose
28.Graeme Pollock
29.Barry Richards
30.Wilfred Rhodes
31.Ricky Ponting
32.Richie Benaud
33.Andy Roberts
34.Harold Larwood
35.Herbert Sutcliffe
36.Bill O'Reilly
37..Kapil Dev
38.Greg Chappell
39.Alan Border
40.Javed Miandad
41. Kumar Sangakaara
42.Denis Compton
43.Frank Worrel
44.Kevin Pieterson
45.Joel Garner
46.Virendra Sehwag
47.Dale Steyn
48.A.B.Devilliers
49.Jeff Thomson
50.Alan Knott

Viv Richard's great match-winning prowess in tests and O.D.I.s perhaps edges Tendulkar's longevity,Kalli's phenomenal all-round figures puts him in the top dozen ,Imran's x factor and captaincy made me rate him above Kallis,Sydney Barnes's records make him the best bowler of all,Sobers as a pure cricketer surpassed the Don ,W.G.Grace made an impact to the game no cricketer ever did,Hobbs dominated his era more than any batsman ever did bar Bradman,Wasim's batting talent in addition to phenomenal bowling skills placed him ahead of Marshall,Mcgrath,Lillee ,Roberts and Ambrose,Gilchrist was the best match-winner of his day,Greg Chappell marginally had more class than Miandad or Border as a batsman .

Poor Alan Knott at #50 in both ha ha!

 

[Hitman]

Bump ....

Truly relished this thread once again that I made.

 

[sajeebmcj]

i will put kallis ahead of lara, sachin, shane warne, richards and others, just behind bradman,sobers. my top five players will be
1. bradman
2.sobers
3.imran khan=kallis
4.sachin tendulkar
5. wasim akram

.

 

[Corridor of Uncertainty]

I remember Gower was immense in the England-Pakistan series in Pakistan in the mid 80s. We had no idea how to get him out. Couple of 150s I think.

So I can understand if he has fewer Pakistanis in there

And this is the first list I have seen which has Sehwag in it. Takes a misunderstood genius to recognize another. Both were game changers and Sehwag rightly makes his list.

 

[blue_champion]

I remember Gower was immense in the England-Pakistan series in Pakistan in the mid 80s. We had no idea how to get him out. Couple of 150s I think.

So I can understand if he has fewer Pakistanis in there

And this is the first list I have seen which has Sehwag in it. Takes a misunderstood genius to recognize another. Both were game changers and Sehwag rightly makes his list.

Sehwag makes it as an opener in all the modern X1 lists......Every expert who has seen the game has heralded him as a game changer and a man who singlehandedly changed approach to test opening.

He is one of his kind.

No surprises on Sehwag making it to the list....the most exciting cricketer of the last 20 years hands down.

 

[Chrish]

Gower doesn't seem to be too fond of colleagues from his own era.

 

[Billy1999]

This book don't make no sense Gower

Botham at 12(Unless you've put him there as a friend as stated)

tbh I would rate Botham as the 60th greatest