Do Pakistanis have a bad reputation, and if so, why?

[Jadz]

Pakistanis tend to feature in news reports quite often, but the coverage is usually negative. If Pakistani men are not being portrayed as paedophiles, preying on vulnerable English (White) girls - they are being depicted as either terrorists, or terrorist-sympathisers.

Pakistani women are routinely portrayed as down-trodden, oppressed, uneducated and weak, incapable of 'integrating' into wider society on account of their hapless - and illiterate - state.

At the same time, Pakistanis, or Muslims more generally, are viewed as hypocrites, in that they clearly declare their faith - by wearing scarves or by sporting lengthy beards - but, behave in a manner contrary to those proclamations. For example, they may seem distant, remote and unapproachable, even arrogant, whilst their business practices would appear to indicate that many commit fraud, under-pay or exploit their employees, and thus, do not adhere to the Islamic precepts and principles they claim to believe in.

Immigrants do receive bad publicity, especially in light of the Referendum of last year when Britain voted to leave the EU; are Pakistanis, though, subjected to more bad press than the rest? And if so, why? Do Pakistanis deserve to be treated with disdain and mistrust, by politicians and by corporate news media? Or, is there a more sinister, anti-Muslim, narrative at play?

 

[ManFan]

Every stereotype has a hint of truth in it. Education is needed for Pakistanis to prosper both at home and away.

 

[Jadz]

Every stereotype has a hint of truth in it. Education is needed for Pakistanis to prosper both at home and away.

Well said.

 

[CricketCartoons]

Every stereotype has a hint of truth in it. Education is needed for Pakistanis to prosper both at home and away.

Yes, just a hint.. a grain of truth. Not the whole truth.

 

[Syed1]

I think you are talking about Brit Pakistanis.

 

[Jadz]

I think you are talking about Brit Pakistanis.

Yes. American, Australian and Canadian Pakistanis tend to be more educated than their British counterparts.

 

[troodon]

Osama being caught in Pak has ruined Pak's image around the world.

 

[Pakistanian]

Down here in the American south, people generally get along with Pakistanis and respect us however there are a lot islamophobes and racists who despise any Brown person especially a Muslim. As for your questions, no ethnicity or community deserves to be stereotyped or discriminated, so that is a really weird question.

 

[Syed1]

Yes. American, Australian and Canadian Pakistanis tend to be more educated than their British counterparts.

That is true, but I feel Pakistanis are more integrated in these societies. However, even second third generation Pakistanis in Britain remain secluded within the Pakistani bubble and do not integrate well with society. Obviously second-third gen Pakistanis are better educated than their parents so it is baffling why they won't break out of the bubble. Maybe you can explain why?

Unfortunately, some Pakistanis have been involved in heinous crimes and that has destroyed the image of the entire community.


One thing to note, you will find very few second-third gen Pakistanis in Canada (I can only speak for here) taking deep interest in Pakistan the country, its politics and cricket. They have at best a cursory knowledge of what's going on and they are more interested in Canadian sports/politics etc.

While most of the Brit Pakistani posters you find on here are second-third gen and they are as close to Pakistan as their parents were.

 

[Varun]

One thing to note, you will find very few second-third gen Pakistanis in Canada (I can only speak for here) taking deep interest in Pakistan the country, its politics and cricket. They have at best a cursory knowledge of what's going on and they are more interested in Canadian sports/politics etc.

While most of the Brit Pakistani posters you find on here are second-third gen and they are as close to Pakistan as their parents were.

With that said, would you not agree that the average British Pakistani would stick out massively when put in a Lahore or Karachi setting?

 

[Pakistanian]

That is true, but I feel Pakistanis are more integrated in these societies. However, even second third generation Pakistanis in Britain remain secluded within the Pakistani bubble and do not integrate well with society. Obviously second-third gen Pakistanis are better educated than their parents so it is baffling why they won't break out of the bubble. Maybe you can explain why?

Unfortunately, some Pakistanis have been involved in heinous crimes and that has destroyed the image of the entire community.


One thing to note, you will find very few second-third gen Pakistanis in Canada (I can only speak for here) taking deep interest in Pakistan the country, its politics and cricket. They have at best a cursory knowledge of what's going on and they are more interested in Canadian sports/politics etc.

While most of the Brit Pakistani posters you find on here are second-third gen and they are as close to Pakistan as their parents were.

But there are many Brit Paks that have gone on to gain global fame like Riz Ahmed, Zayn Malik, and Amir Khan. I think they've done well as a community despite coming from mostly small town backgrounds and settling in the neglected northern parts of England.

Brit Paks feel closer to Pakistan makes sense cause of the proximity, the time zones are only 5 hrs apart and it's just a 7 hr flight. It's why a lot east coast Italians and Greeks have strong ties with the 'old country'.

 

[Extra_Cover]

I think you are talking about Brit Pakistanis.

This! On this forum we get confused a lot when we mention Pakistanis. The main reflection of Pakistanis are people of Pakistan, you can read about them on Dawn, Jang, etc. The news you read in Daily Mail, Mirror are british Pakistanis which reflect a very minor population of the overall picture.

But I do agree that overall Pakistanis are a little backward on education front which as per me would solve this immirgrant problem in the long run.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Every stereotype has a hint of truth in it. Education is needed for Pakistanis to prosper both at home and away.

True, but it can be applied to almost every community.

As to the topic itself, yes Pakistanis have a bad reputation, and some of it is deserved. They could probably get more credit for some of the good traits as well, and that would be equally deserved.

As for those who are back pointing the finger at British Pakistanis, I look forward to seeing where this conversation leads as always.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Osama being caught in Pak has ruined Pak's image around the world.

Nope. Pakistan's image was poor well before that. if the admin will allow I can post some Pak1 jokes which will demonstrate this truth quite comprehensively, and these have been around long before 9/11.

 

[www787]

With that said, would you not agree that the average British Pakistani would stick out massively when put in a Lahore or Karachi setting?

if you are talking about appearance (the way dress, hairstyle) then no. Most "burgers" try to emulate British style of dressing.

 

[Pakistanian]

Osama being caught in Pak has ruined Pak's image around the world.

First of most all most people here can't even point Pakistan out on a map or even have any memory of where Osama was killed. More over Islamophobia and anti brown racism applies to all Muslims and brown people. Also racism towards south asians especially Indians has existed long before 9/11 with dot busters and all that, ask any desi person that worked as a cab driver convenience store clerk in the 90s and before that.

 

[KingKhanWC]

The Western media aren't the bastions of truth or leaders in telling others who is good or not.

The OP shouldn't worry about what western media thinks. If you go to Afghansitan, Libya, Iraq, Palestine, Syria, Pakistan or many other parts of the world, it's Americans who are seen as bad not Pakistanis.

 

[Mamoon]

First of most all most people here can't even point Pakistan out on a map or even have any memory of where Osama was killed. More over Islamophobia and anti brown racism applies to all Muslims and brown people. Also racism towards south asians especially Indians has existed long before 9/11 with dot busters and all that, ask any desi person that worked as a cab driver convenience store clerk in the 90s and before that.

Well the general populace of America are renowned for their ignorance and can't even pinpoint their neighbors Canada on a map. They cannot be used as a yardstick of how Pakistan and Pakistanis are viewed by the world in general.

To put some numbers to it, 20% of the people in the U.S. have made heavy contributions in making their country the benchmark in technology and innovation, but the other 80% know little beyond cheese burgers. If we dig deeper into the 20% that have made America the superpower, the whites are probably no more than 5%.

 

[Mamoon]

Nope. Pakistan's image was poor well before that. if the admin will allow I can post some Pak1 jokes which will demonstrate this truth quite comprehensively, and these have been around long before 9/11.

It was the straw that broke the camel's back, but it is indeed true that the image of Pakistan went south decades before that. Before the 70's, Pakistan was viewed differently from the Middle East and was considered a progressive society. However, the rabid islamization that was started by Bhutto and perfected by his prodigy Zia caused almost irrevocable damage.

Things started to take look somewhat brighter in the 90's, especially with the positive image of Benazir in the Western media, but then 9/11 and the capture of Osama in Pakistan meant that it would probably take a century for Pakistan to make a good impression on the West again.

 

[Mamoon]

The Western media aren't the bastions of truth or leaders in telling others who is good or not.

The OP shouldn't worry about what western media thinks. If you go to Afghansitan, Libya, Iraq, Palestine, Syria, Pakistan or many other parts of the world, it's Americans who are seen as bad not Pakistanis.

But no one will go to these countries. Millions of Pakistanis including you are living in the Western countries and not Afghanistan, Iraq or Libya, and the majority of them are bothered about the handicap that their nationality proves to be in various facets of life on a daily basis.

 

[KingKhanWC]

But no one will go to these countries. Millions of Pakistanis including you are living in the Western countries and not Afghanistan, Iraq or Libya, and the majority of them are bothered about the handicap that their nationality proves to be in various facets of life on a daily basis.

Thats them, makes no difference to me.

America is more hated/seen in a more negative light around the world than Pakistan. Do you disagree?

 

[Mamoon]

Thats them, makes no difference to me.

America is more hated/seen in a more negative light around the world than Pakistan. Do you disagree?

Well it's great that it doesn't affect you, but most people tend to think differently and have different circumstances.

As far as who is seen in a more negative light, the world recognizes America as a superpower (albeit declining) and the world leader when it comes to technology and innovation. They are despised for their hypocrisies and their neoconservative ideologies, but that is still better than being recognized as a failing third world terrorist country with insignificant human and socioeconomic development.

Another problem is that the countries (barring Russia and China) that hold the U.S. in a negative light are quite insignificant compared to the countries that hold Pakistan in a negative light.

Considering all things, Pakistan is much, much worse off than the U.S. and almost every Pakistani would love to be in the former's shoes.

 

[KingKhanWC]

Well it's great that it doesn't affect you, but most people tend to think differently and have different circumstances.

As far as who is seen in a more negative light, the world recognizes America as a superpower (albeit declining) and the world leader when it comes to technology and innovation. They are despised for their hypocrisies and their neoconservative ideologies, but that is still better than being recognized as a failing third world terrorist country with insignificant human and socioeconomic development.

Another problem is that the countries (barring Russia and China) that hold the U.S. in a negative light are quite insignificant compared to the countries that hold Pakistan in a negative light.

Considering all things, Pakistan is much, much worse off than the U.S. and almost every Pakistani would love to be in the former's shoes.

Maybe they would and yes it doesn't matter to me so ask those it does matter to.

Pakistan will not drop a bomb on your house or overthrow your government. It pretty much keeps itself to itself.

 

[saadibaba]

"Patriotism is the last refuge of the scoundrel" - Samuel Johnson

I consider myself a global citizen first and a Pakistani later. I think all of us would benefit from such an approach. We as individuals are what makes impressions and reputations on others. Stereotypes exist and always will, but mostly in the superficial perspective. Once a person gets to meet and know the other, the impression or reputation will mostly be based on their own character and not from which country they belong to or what religion they follow.

Neither Pakistanis nor people from any other nation should either gloat or depress themselves over their country's global reputation. That only goes so far. This attitude gives rise to jingoism and ultimately incoherence and belligerence. We should interact with each other as human beings, as members of a global tribe. Our successes and failures intricately and closely linked with each other than we can even imagine.

 

[Yossarian]

Yes. American, Australian and Canadian Pakistanis tend to be more educated than their British counterparts.

And that's been explained numerous times on this forum as to why/how. Basically its to do with the demographics of those (1st generation) who went to the UK versus those went to the USA/Canada/Australia.

Indians also have these differences between UK based Indians and those in the US/Canada/Australia.

There are also differences in the demographics of 1st generation Pakistanis in the UK and their 1st generation Indian counterparts.

Lastly, in the UK, Pakistanis being primarily Muslims, and Indians being primarily Sikhs and Hindus, also has an impact on the level of integration in British society between these two groups, primarily due to alcohol (a key ingredient of British social life), men/women socialising together, backgrounds (ie initial 1st gen demographics and their knock on effect)

All of the above has been discussed and explained numerous times.

Basically, you can't discuss the topic of the OP without bearing in mind the points I've listed above.

 

[Buffet]

Pakistanis don't have a bad reputation among general public here. I know several first and second generation Pakistani origin immigrants. They are contributing positively and doing pretty well.

 

[humzy]

There are not many Pakistani's in Australia so the reputation usually stems from two things:

Cricket: Always showing a chaotic country
News Reports: Always showing a chaotic country

So the reputation I have seen is that of a poor chaotic country that no one would want to step foot in. India probably has a worse reputation though.

 

[Pakistanian]

There are not many Pakistani's in Australia so the reputation usually stems from two things:

Cricket: Always showing a chaotic country
News Reports: Always showing a chaotic country

So the reputation I have seen is that of a poor chaotic country that no one would want to step foot in. India probably has a worse reputation though.

So Usman Khawaja hasn't helped the image of Pakistanis in Australia?

 

[humzy]

So Usman Khawaja hasn't helped the image of Pakistanis in Australia?

They consider him to be 100% Australian considering he was raised here from a young age. Background is usually irrelevant if you are liked by the Australian public while also grew up here.

 

[Pakistanian]

They consider him to be 100% Australian considering he was raised here from a young age. Background is usually irrelevant if you are liked by the Australian public while also grew up here.

Yeah but he's still of Pakistani descent, so apparently your Australianess is only valid if you're "liked" by Aussies but if you do something wrong then you rep the parent country lmao. That sounds like conditional citizenship. You're contradicting your own logic here lol.

 

[humzy]

Yeah but he's still of Pakistani descent, so apparently your Australianess is only valid if you're "liked" by Aussies but if you do something wrong then you rep the parent country lmao. That sounds like conditional citizenship. You're contradicting your own logic here lol.

This isn't my logic, this is the logic of the public who are not that intelligent in general.

 

[Hadi Rizvi]

So Usman Khawaja hasn't helped the image of Pakistanis in Australia?

I think Pakistanis have some way to go before we're recognized by everyone. I've met quite a few people who've told me that they've no idea where Pakistan is located. On the other hand though, I've met a couple of Australians who said Assalamoalaikum to me when they saw the decor (bearing PAK flag) in my car.

So, in my opinion, I don't think people here have a certain opinion for Pakistanis. Its based more on personal experiences but one thing is for sure; Indians aren't given the same respect as Pakistanis. I may be wrong but that's what I've noticed in recent times. Maybe its because a lot of Indian students (along with some Chinese) have come here through fake documents and they've been in the news.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

It was the straw that broke the camel's back, but it is indeed true that the image of Pakistan went south decades before that. Before the 70's, Pakistan was viewed differently from the Middle East and was considered a progressive society. However, the rabid islamization that was started by Bhutto and perfected by his prodigy Zia caused almost irrevocable damage.

Things started to take look somewhat brighter in the 90's, especially with the positive image of Benazir in the Western media, but then 9/11 and the capture of Osama in Pakistan meant that it would probably take a century for Pakistan to make a good impression on the West again.

Most English people don't really distinguish between different people from the subcontinent, certainly they wouldn't be aware of the politics over there. I doubt the majority even knew whether Pakistan was a progressive society before the 70's, I know I certainly didn't.

For example, the Pak1 jokes I mentioned, here's one from comic Chubby Brown : A Pak1 jumps in the sea for a swim on the coast and gets into difficulty and is washed up on shore uncoscious. "Quick - someone give that man the kiss of life, he's drowning!" he shouts. The coastguard retorts "No chance mate. Have you smelled his @$&&ing breath?!"

So the negative connotation here would be the spicy food which is eaten in the subcontinent, not politics or religion. If anything, Indian food would be described as even more smelly than Pakistan's as they use far heavier spices.

 

[CricketCartoons]

So the negative connotation here would be the spicy food which is eaten in the subcontinent, not politics or religion. If anything, Indian food would be described as even more smelly than Pakistan's as they use far heavier spices.

Food insults are a symptom, not a cause of racism. When people of X community call people of Y community daalkhors, is it because they hate anyone who consumes daal, or just that they hate Y and project their hatred using Y's dietary habits?

 

[Yossarian]

Food insults are a symptom, not a cause of racism. When people of X community call people of Y community daalkhors, is it because they hate anyone who consumes daal, or just that they hate Y and project their hatred using Y's dietary habits?

Or that those dietry habits are associated with that community, whether true or not (eg "the French eat frogs" - I regularly travel to France for work and have yet to see a frenchman eating a frog. Despite that, in the UK, the (derogatory) nickname for French people is "frogs")

 

[CricketCartoons]

Or that those dietry habits are associated with that community, whether true or not (eg "the French eat frogs" - I regularly travel to France for work and have yet to see a frenchman eating a frog. Despite that, in the UK, the (derogatory) nickname for French people is "frogs")

So the dietary habits are the cause of racism, they are not the manifestation of racism.

 

[Ocelot]

I think this 'integrating' thing is overrated, it's not mandatory to have a good reputation. If you:

- Keep you head down and mind your own business.
- Play by the rules and work hard.
- Don't stick out like a sore thumb. Don't be in press for bad stuff. Tone down overt religious affiliations.
- Be courteous. Don't judge anyone based on race, habits.
- Be always professional in relations.
- Personally, don't be an overzealous 'hee hee haa haa'. It's better to come across as dry and humourless than as a clown.

If you follow these, no one would hate you, even you're not integrating and getting drunk in pubs. People would even look up to you, regardless of background.

 

[Yossarian]

So the dietary habits are the cause of racism, they are not the manifestation of racism.

The English calling the French "frogs" is nothing to do with racism. They are not different 'races'. Both are predominantly made up of white northern Europeans.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Or that those dietry habits are associated with that community, whether true or not (eg "the French eat frogs" - I regularly travel to France for work and have yet to see a frenchman eating a frog. Despite that, in the UK, the (derogatory) nickname for French people is "frogs")

This is true. It has little to do with Politics or even religion in most cases. Let me give another joke as a further example.

Q: What do you call a Pak1 who doesn't own a corner shop?

A: Doctor


Now if you study this joke, the butt of it would apply equally to Indians, and more recently Sri Lankans in this country. A doctor is obviously a very respectable profession, but now it is associated with people from the subcontinent, it has become less so. If you think about it, even shopkeeper was considered perfectly respectable in the days before immigration. Britain was proudly known as a nation of shopkeepers.

Mods and admin, I hope you can see that the jokes which some might find distasteful are being discussed to shed some light on a fascinating OP.

 

[CricketCartoons]

The English calling the French "frogs" is nothing to do with racism. They are not different 'races'. Both are predominantly made up of white northern Europeans.

Ok, then. Sorry, I was discussing in the context of racism. Seems your statement had nothing to do with it.

 

[Snak3eye5]

Maybe they would and yes it doesn't matter to me so ask those it does matter to.

Pakistan will not drop a bomb on your house or overthrow your government. It pretty much keeps itself to itself.

The Us is not doing drone strikes without reason. They're pretty much cleaning house of any radical insurgents. They overthrow dictator regimes that are mass murdering their own people.

 

[CricketCartoons]

The Us is not doing drone strikes without reason. They're pretty much cleaning house of any radical insurgents. They overthrow dictator regimes that are mass murdering their own people.

Agreed. Libya and Iraq are now better after US intervention, than they were under their murderous dictators.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Ok, then. Sorry, I was discussing in the context of racism. Seems your statement had nothing to do with it.

Talking about the French, they often used to be depicted as beret wearing mustachioed men riding a bike wearing a string of garlic round their necks. Until the advent of multiculturalism people who ate garlic were often considered to have smelly breath. Now of course, everyone in the UK uses garlic in their cooking so that image has faded. I'll see if I can find an image and post it to illustrate.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Not riding a bike, but you get the picture.

 

[CricketCartoons]

Talking about the French, they often used to be depicted as beret wearing mustachioed men riding a bike wearing a string of garlic round their necks. Until the advent of multiculturalism people who ate garlic were often considered to have smelly breath. Now of course, everyone in the UK uses garlic in their cooking so that image has faded. I'll see if I can find an image and post it to illustrate.

So the source of racism towards the communities with unfavourable diets is the food itself, and not their race or country or religion.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

So the source of racism towards the communities with unfavourable diets is the food itself, and not their race or country or religion.

I don't know about that, I was just answering the assertion that prior to Bin Laden, or the 70's, there wasn't a negative view of Pakistanis. I think there was, the reasons would have to be discerned. But I wouldn't say it was diet alone, as the other example shows, even respectable professions like doctor or store owner can be viewed negatively when associated with a person from the subcontinent.

 

[Snak3eye5]

There are not many Pakistani's in Australia so the reputation usually stems from two things:

Cricket: Always showing a chaotic country
News Reports: Always showing a chaotic country

So the reputation I have seen is that of a poor chaotic country that no one would want to step foot in. India probably has a worse reputation though.

You need to expand on the very last sentence. Either you are not informed or little ignorant. How is the reputation of Indians worse. ? It's true that to most people in the west can't differentiate between anyone from the subcontinent. But the general perception of Indians is that they immigrate into any country and work as doctors engineers skilled labor.

I work for a Fortune 500 company in the Us that is a overrun with Indians working as developers, directors, scrubs masters, Vice Presidents, software engineers.in the field of technology. And this isn't even in Silicon Valley but a smaller city close to Chicago. Don't want to give too much info my whereabouts. The fact is Indians don't come in creating terrorist cells or creating any chaos for the residents.

If you've seen recent news I forget who said if it was Trump or Haley who said India is a thriving democracy that threatens no one and has to keep an eye on Pakistan.
It wasn't me that said it. People read that stuff and you can pass judgements based on where they get their intel from true or not. But that's the general perception. India quite honestly bothers no one and is focusing on education, their pharma, auto industry, space programs and building good relations with everyone without stepping on anyone's toes. India got a red carpet welcome in Israel recently on one of its recent visits between Modi and Israel prime minister.Thats what you hear...

 

[Marshland]

Few know of Pakistan culturally down under including NZ. I guess they're more abundant in the states along with other nationalities from South Asia.

 

[Mughal]

This is not about pakistanis rather all people who lack sense of making proper sense of things are in the same boat. People need to learn to be sensible and if they do not then despite having God given abilities or potentials to be sensible they remain senseless. For a detailed explanation of things see Here.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

There are not many Pakistani's in Australia so the reputation usually stems from two things:

Cricket: Always showing a chaotic country
News Reports: Always showing a chaotic country

So the reputation I have seen is that of a poor chaotic country that no one would want to step foot in. India probably has a worse reputation though.

I would agree. Images from both India and Pakistan generally depict a poor country with a lot of mess and dirt. This is the abiding image in westerners minds and probably contributes a lot to negative image.

 

[humzy]

I would agree. Images from both India and Pakistan generally depict a poor country with a lot of mess and dirt. This is the abiding image in westerners minds and probably contributes a lot to negative image.

Which is a shame because both countries have a lot to offer in terms of tourism and culture if they sorted themselves out.

Pakistan more so, it has some beautiful scenery and a rich food culture.

 

[saeedhk]

Pakistanis are notorious in many parts of the world as they come up with new tricks for making money, defrauding insurance companies and their involvement in drug-peddling and a general lack of morals and ethics.

Terror attacks, suppression of women rights, and acid attacks in Pakistan further tarnish the reputation of Pakistan.


In the last 5 years, a wave of refugees, mainly from the Punjab province of Pakistan, has made life difficult for Pakistanis in HK.

These refugees (economic migrants) are heavily involved in criminal activities such as drug trafficking and gangs.Just today, two refugees from Pakistan were arrested for selling drugs and another 4 were arrested for possessing weapons in two separate police raids.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Pakistanis are notorious in many parts of the world as they come up with new tricks for making money, defrauding insurance companies and their involvement in drug-peddling and a general lack of morals and ethics.

Terror attacks, suppression of women rights, and acid attacks in Pakistan further tarnish the reputation of Pakistan.


In the last 5 years, a wave of refugees, mainly from the Punjab province of Pakistan, has made life difficult for Pakistanis in HK.

These refugees (economic migrants) are heavily involved in criminal activities such as drug trafficking and gangs.Just today, two refugees from Pakistan were arrested for selling drugs and another 4 were arrested for possessing weapons in two separate police raids.

So much for the attempts by some members to try and fob off the blame onto British Pakistanis. All of those examples are from Pakistan itself, and highly un-Islamic activities to boot. Those crooks sound like they would be more at home in some Italian or Russian crime syndicate.

 

[Jadz]

Pakistanis are notorious in many parts of the world as they come up with new tricks for making money, defrauding insurance companies and their involvement in drug-peddling and a general lack of morals and ethics.

Terror attacks, suppression of women rights, and acid attacks in Pakistan further tarnish the reputation of Pakistan.


In the last 5 years, a wave of refugees, mainly from the Punjab province of Pakistan, has made life difficult for Pakistanis in HK.

These refugees (economic migrants) are heavily involved in criminal activities such as drug trafficking and gangs.Just today, two refugees from Pakistan were arrested for selling drugs and another 4 were arrested for possessing weapons in two separate police raids.

Your post reminded me of recent comments made to me by friends regarding Pakistanis: one - an Iraqi Christian - works for a Pakistani, and she explained how arrogant he is, how he refuses to pay her, shouts at and bullies her, and how, every single Friday, he visits the mosque for prayers dressed in his best clothes.

My Lebanese Muslim friend told me how Pakistanis hate each other, and when I queried her as to why she thought this, she said it was because of an incident involving a Pakistani woman who was looking for a teacher for her child, and when my friend suggested a Pakistani teacher, the woman said she did not want a Pakistani teacher.

Another incident involved a taxi driver, he was bewailing the rudeness and arrogance of Muslims, saying they treated him like a servant, whereas other immigrants were not so disrespectful.

In all instances, I apologised on behalf of Pakistanis and Muslims, but, nevertheless, felt deeply troubled by what I had heard. Hence, this thread.

My own experiences with Pakistanis and Muslims have not been good, generally speaking. I find them to project a self-righteous attitude, as well as exhibiting an aura of entitlement that seems to indicate they are exalting themselves against other people. I have met very, very few Pakistanis or Muslims who conduct themselves with humility and modesty. In consequence, I have no interactions with Pakistanis - except for on this forum.

These are my own personal observations and experiences, and no doubt interpreted according to my own level of - limited - understanding. Apologies in advance if anyone finds my comments hurtful or offensive - I am merely offering my truthful testimony here.

 

[Pakistanian]

Your post reminded me of recent comments made to me by friends regarding Pakistanis: one - an Iraqi Christian - works for a Pakistani, and she explained how arrogant he is, how he refuses to pay her, shouts at and bullies her, and how, every single Friday, he visits the mosque for prayers dressed in his best clothes.

My Lebanese Muslim friend told me how Pakistanis hate each other, and when I queried her as to why she thought this, she said it was because of an incident involving a Pakistani woman who was looking for a teacher for her child, and when my friend suggested a Pakistani teacher, the woman said she did not want a Pakistani teacher.

Another incident involved a taxi driver, he was bewailing the rudeness and arrogance of Muslims, saying they treated him like a servant, whereas other immigrants were not so disrespectful.

In all instances, I apologised on behalf of Pakistanis and Muslims, but, nevertheless, felt deeply troubled by what I had heard. Hence, this thread.

My own experiences with Pakistanis and Muslims have not been good, generally speaking. I find them to project a self-righteous attitude, as well as exhibiting an aura of entitlement that seems to indicate they are exalting themselves against other people. I have met very, very few Pakistanis or Muslims who conduct themselves with humility and modesty. In consequence, I have no interactions with Pakistanis - except for on this forum.

These are my own personal observations and experiences, and no doubt interpreted according to my own level of - limited - understanding. Apologies in advance if anyone finds my comments hurtful or offensive - I am merely offering my truthful testimony here.

Those are sweeping generalizations based off a few personal experiences and personal opinions. Ironically arabs have the same or even worse reputation in America.

Also you don't have to apologize on their behalf or make any generalizations, those are symptoms of a collectivist mindset.

 

[KingKhanWC]

The Us is not doing drone strikes without reason. They're pretty much cleaning house of any radical insurgents. They overthrow dictator regimes that are mass murdering their own people.

I highly doubt you would be saying this if one of the 300+ children blown to pieces in Pakistan(alone) was one of yours. If you still would , then I respect your view.

 

[KingKhanWC]

Your post reminded me of recent comments made to me by friends regarding Pakistanis: one - an Iraqi Christian - works for a Pakistani, and she explained how arrogant he is, how he refuses to pay her, shouts at and bullies her, and how, every single Friday, he visits the mosque for prayers dressed in his best clothes.

My Lebanese Muslim friend told me how Pakistanis hate each other, and when I queried her as to why she thought this, she said it was because of an incident involving a Pakistani woman who was looking for a teacher for her child, and when my friend suggested a Pakistani teacher, the woman said she did not want a Pakistani teacher.

Another incident involved a taxi driver, he was bewailing the rudeness and arrogance of Muslims, saying they treated him like a servant, whereas other immigrants were not so disrespectful.

In all instances, I apologised on behalf of Pakistanis and Muslims, but, nevertheless, felt deeply troubled by what I had heard. Hence, this thread.

My own experiences with Pakistanis and Muslims have not been good, generally speaking. I find them to project a self-righteous attitude, as well as exhibiting an aura of entitlement that seems to indicate they are exalting themselves against other people. I have met very, very few Pakistanis or Muslims who conduct themselves with humility and modesty. In consequence, I have no interactions with Pakistanis - except for on this forum.

These are my own personal observations and experiences, and no doubt interpreted according to my own level of - limited - understanding. Apologies in advance if anyone finds my comments hurtful or offensive - I am merely offering my truthful testimony here.

What is your background? Then perhaps we can offer some truthful testimonies of our own.

 

[gani999]

So the negative connotation here would be the spicy food which is eaten in the subcontinent, not politics or religion. If anything, Indian food would be described as even more smelly than Pakistan's as they use far heavier spices.

I don't think the average Brit has any problem with strong smelling Indian food given the popularity of Indian cuisine and the number of Indian restaurants in the UK.

The fact that a sizeable number of 'Indian' restaurants are actually run by Pakistanis and Bangladeshis would also attest to that.

So I don't see where the negative connotation is coming from.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

I don't think the average Brit has any problem with strong smelling Indian food given the popularity of Indian cuisine and the number of Indian restaurants in the UK.

The fact that a sizeable number of 'Indian' restaurants are actually run by Pakistanis and Bangladeshis would also attest to that.

So I don't see where the negative connotation is coming from.

I take it you aren't from Britain then, if you saw no negative connotation in that joke.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Your post reminded me of recent comments made to me by friends regarding Pakistanis: one - an Iraqi Christian - works for a Pakistani, and she explained how arrogant he is, how he refuses to pay her, shouts at and bullies her, and how, every single Friday, he visits the mosque for prayers dressed in his best clothes.

My Lebanese Muslim friend told me how Pakistanis hate each other, and when I queried her as to why she thought this, she said it was because of an incident involving a Pakistani woman who was looking for a teacher for her child, and when my friend suggested a Pakistani teacher, the woman said she did not want a Pakistani teacher.

Another incident involved a taxi driver, he was bewailing the rudeness and arrogance of Muslims, saying they treated him like a servant, whereas other immigrants were not so disrespectful.

In all instances, I apologised on behalf of Pakistanis and Muslims, but, nevertheless, felt deeply troubled by what I had heard. Hence, this thread.

My own experiences with Pakistanis and Muslims have not been good, generally speaking. I find them to project a self-righteous attitude, as well as exhibiting an aura of entitlement that seems to indicate they are exalting themselves against other people. I have met very, very few Pakistanis or Muslims who conduct themselves with humility and modesty. In consequence, I have no interactions with Pakistanis - except for on this forum.

These are my own personal observations and experiences, and no doubt interpreted according to my own level of - limited - understanding. Apologies in advance if anyone finds my comments hurtful or offensive - I am merely offering my truthful testimony here.

I don't know what to make of your friend's comments, their stories seem to be negative regarding Pakistanis, but then you go on to include Muslims in general in your criticisms when regarding your own experiences.

Difficult for me to judge, I have certainly seen misplaced arrogance in Muslims and Pakistanis, so I can see where you are coming from, but as a Brit, I also find myself it natural to assume a sense of superiority through British history and influence in the world. With this triple whammy of intellectual and cultural input, I find it really difficult to understand the humility of whichever people you would refer to as exemplars. Maybe if you could point those people out it would give us a yardstick to see where we are falling short.

 

[90MPH]

Your post reminded me of recent comments made to me by friends regarding Pakistanis: one - an Iraqi Christian - works for a Pakistani, and she explained how arrogant he is, how he refuses to pay her, shouts at and bullies her, and how, every single Friday, he visits the mosque for prayers dressed in his best clothes.

My Lebanese Muslim friend told me how Pakistanis hate each other, and when I queried her as to why she thought this, she said it was because of an incident involving a Pakistani woman who was looking for a teacher for her child, and when my friend suggested a Pakistani teacher, the woman said she did not want a Pakistani teacher.

Another incident involved a taxi driver, he was bewailing the rudeness and arrogance of Muslims, saying they treated him like a servant, whereas other immigrants were not so disrespectful.

In all instances, I apologised on behalf of Pakistanis and Muslims, but, nevertheless, felt deeply troubled by what I had heard. Hence, this thread.

My own experiences with Pakistanis and Muslims have not been good, generally speaking. I find them to project a self-righteous attitude, as well as exhibiting an aura of entitlement that seems to indicate they are exalting themselves against other people. I have met very, very few Pakistanis or Muslims who conduct themselves with humility and modesty. In consequence, I have no interactions with Pakistanis - except for on this forum.

These are my own personal observations and experiences, and no doubt interpreted according to my own level of - limited - understanding. Apologies in advance if anyone finds my comments hurtful or offensive - I am merely offering my truthful testimony here.

Can you tell me truthfully what your background is. Also which part of Britain do you live.

Reason I ask is on a number of times you have made generalisations of Pakistanis, nearly all negative.
Now your adding that your friends also have nothing but bad experiences reg Pakistanis.

 

[Snak3eye5]

I highly doubt you would be saying this if one of the 300+ children blown to pieces in Pakistan(alone) was one of yours. If you still would , then I respect your view.

I see you're point. It's hard to justify, but if one has to see the harsh reality by stepping in the Us shoes that if the radical elements grow or spread then sooner than later it becomes a big problem for locals and, one which becomes a worse problem for surrounding neighbors and other countries...

 

[hussain.r97]

Most people in New Zealand are quite indifferent about Pakistanis. Not really positive or negative. However, the few people I have met who knew a bit about Pakistan generally have a very positive view. I think the negative view is mainly with British Pakistanis.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Your post reminded me of recent comments made to me by friends regarding Pakistanis: one - an Iraqi Christian - works for a Pakistani, and she explained how arrogant he is, how he refuses to pay her, shouts at and bullies her, and how, every single Friday, he visits the mosque for prayers dressed in his best clothes.

My Lebanese Muslim friend told me how Pakistanis hate each other, and when I queried her as to why she thought this, she said it was because of an incident involving a Pakistani woman who was looking for a teacher for her child, and when my friend suggested a Pakistani teacher, the woman said she did not want a Pakistani teacher.

Another incident involved a taxi driver, he was bewailing the rudeness and arrogance of Muslims, saying they treated him like a servant, whereas other immigrants were not so disrespectful.

In all instances, I apologised on behalf of Pakistanis and Muslims, but, nevertheless, felt deeply troubled by what I had heard. Hence, this thread.

My own experiences with Pakistanis and Muslims have not been good, generally speaking. I find them to project a self-righteous attitude, as well as exhibiting an aura of entitlement that seems to indicate they are exalting themselves against other people. I have met very, very few Pakistanis or Muslims who conduct themselves with humility and modesty. In consequence, I have no interactions with Pakistanis - except for on this forum.

These are my own personal observations and experiences, and no doubt interpreted according to my own level of - limited - understanding. Apologies in advance if anyone finds my comments hurtful or offensive - I am merely offering my truthful testimony here.

I have no idea about other things in this post but this Aura of entitlement and the fact that they believe they are exalting themselves againist others is a trait found in quite a few posters here on PP.

Surprisingly i met a few Pakistanis who were visiting Kolkata to watch a Indo Pak test in 2007 i believe including Chacha Cricket and i found them to be a very modest, humble and friendly bunch.

 

[MenInG]

I have no idea about other things in this post but this Aura of entitlement and the fact that they believe they are exalting themselves againist others is a trait found in quite a few posters here on PP.

Surprisingly i met a few Pakistanis who were visiting Kolkata to watch a Indo Pak test in 2007 i believe including Chacha Cricket and i found them to be a very modest, humble and friendly bunch.

And how are those posters any different from some we have from India?

 

[big_gamer007]

I mentioned this in another thread before that Pakistanis I have met (British) were more welcoming, humble and modest compared to British Indians.. British Pakistanis I met get excited seeing a fellow brown face they come to you and start taking and when they learn you are from India they become too happy and try and help you by showing you places to eat, or telling you where to go shopping or go for touristy stuff etc etc..

British Indians gernerally keep to themselves and do not approach any other brown face just for the sake of having same skin colour as them..

Overall I would say British Pakistanis atleast the ones I have met were very polite, courteous and great hosts.. Ofcourse there were some who just came to talk to me to get free ciggies but most of them were very helpful..

 

[cricketjoshila]

And how are those posters any different from some we have from India?

I do agree that some Indian posters indeed are arrogant but i dont see them having that sense of entitlement.I am particularly talking about that.Earlier i used to find it disturbing now i find it amusing as some of those posts are far removed from the ground situation and realities.

Tbh i have found Brit Pakistanis who friends of my cousins to be a very friendly bunch.

 

[CricketCartoons]

I have no idea about other things in this post but this Aura of entitlement and the fact that they believe they are exalting themselves againist others is a trait found in quite a few posters here on PP.

This is true in my experience. Once met a Pakistani who was speaking in English with me, which I found very insulting. So I asked him to switch to Urdu, and he used such complicated words that I had to switch back in English. I guess he just wanted to humiliate me, when all I wanted was to find a common ground and become friends.

 

[imrankhannsu]

In UK I think Pakistanis in certain areas are not seen a good light.

Particularly in Birmingham and Bradford. I think this is because alot are involved with crime, cant speak in English well, dont integrate with other people. To some extent religious background which the media regularly associate with terrorism also paints a bad picture.

 

[mani1]

In UK I think Pakistanis in certain areas are not seen a good light.

Particularly in Birmingham and Bradford. I think this is because alot are involved with crime, cant speak in English well, dont integrate with other people. To some extent religious background which the media regularly associate with terrorism also paints a bad picture.

You missed out Glasgow "Gunchester" Ilford Newham etc

Here is an article about it remember Kris Donald

Violence was a way of life on the south side of Glasgow and simply straying on to a neighbouring gang's territory was enough to spark off a "pangaa'', which is Punjabi for a scrap according to Imran Yaqub.

As a teenager Yaqub was in the Young Shields, one of the most notorious gangs in Pollokshields. "Young Shields followed trouble, rather than trouble following Young Shields, " he said.

Known then to his fellow gang members as Minta, he was involved in countless territorial battles with other Asian gangs, was stabbed in the leg and finally landed in prison on an attempted murder charge.

Asian gangs have been a fixture of Glasgow life since the early 1960s.

The first gang was formed in the Gorbals to defend the newly-arrived immigrants, then mostly from the Pakistani Punjab.

http://www.asianimage.co.uk/news/1020787.asian_gang_life_in_glasgow/

As for terrorism its mainly a London thing

 

[mani1]

Newham (population; 318,000)

The borough recorded the worst values for deprivation, homelessness and cases of TB in the UK.

83.8% of people in Newham live in deprivation and 27.2% (19,700) of children live in poverty - which although high is around 10% lower than Tower Hamlets.


http://www.wharf.co.uk/news/local-news/child-poverty-worst-tower-hamlets-9377184
As for Integration watch the last Whites of the East End

 

[saeedhk]

Pakistanis in the U.K. are heavily involved in drug trafficking and other vices.

 

[GBK_Fan]

Pakistanis are notorious in many parts of the world as they come up with new tricks for making money, defrauding insurance companies and their involvement in drug-peddling and a general lack of morals and ethics.

Terror attacks, suppression of women rights, and acid attacks in Pakistan further tarnish the reputation of Pakistan.


In the last 5 years, a wave of refugees, mainly from the Punjab province of Pakistan, has made life difficult for Pakistanis in HK.

These refugees (economic migrants) are heavily involved in criminal activities such as drug trafficking and gangs.Just today, two refugees from Pakistan were arrested for selling drugs and another 4 were arrested for possessing weapons in two separate police raids.

Do you happen to work in a restaurant in HK? I met a Saeed from Pakistan when I last visited it a few years back.

On topic, Pakistanis in HK had a bad reputation going back a few years. I believe they were planning to make visas difficult for Pakistanis, not sure if that's still the case

 

[cricketjoshila]

Cpt. Rishwat

Which part of Pakistan do you trace your origin to?

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

I do agree that some Indian posters indeed are arrogant but i dont see them having that sense of entitlement.I am particularly talking about that.Earlier i used to find it disturbing now i find it amusing as some of those posts are far removed from the ground situation and realities.

Tbh i have found Brit Pakistanis who friends of my cousins to be a very friendly bunch.

I would agree that a lot of Pakistanis have a sense of entitlement, I have said as much myself in the past. But I see the same thing in North Indians so I don't think it's something you can cut off by drawing a border. South Indians from my experience tend to be more humble, at least for appearance sake. That said, I haven't met a whole load of them, so it may turn out that they are actually a very horrible lot below the surface. Who knows?

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Which part of Pakistan do you trace your origin to?

Punjab. My family over there are insufferably arrogant.

 

[cricketjoshila]

I would agree that a lot of Pakistanis have a sense of entitlement, I have said as much myself in the past. But I see the same thing in North Indians so I don't think it's something you can cut off by drawing a border. South Indians from my experience tend to be more humble, at least for appearance sake. That said, I haven't met a whole load of them, so it may turn out that they are actually a very horrible lot below the surface. Who knows?

I am not exactly from the north sir.I am from the east.I may be called that dark sickly bengali by many but neither i am dark nor sickly.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Punjab. My family over there are insufferably arrogant.

My cousins have friends from punjab in pakistan.i went out with them.Good bunch.

 

[CricketCartoons]

I do agree that some Indian posters indeed are arrogant but i dont see them having that sense of entitlement.I am particularly talking about that.Earlier i used to find it disturbing now i find it amusing as some of those posts are far removed from the ground situation and realities.

Just to add to this. What I hate most about Pakistanis is the (misplaced) sense of racial superiority of their mangoes..which is borne out of jealousy at the quality of our obviously superior mangoes.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

I am not exactly from the north sir.I am from the east.I may be called that dark sickly bengali by many but neither i am dark nor sickly.

I already knew you were from Bengal, I wasn't talking about you when I mentioned North Indians. In Britain there are quite a few Punjabi Indians, in fact I grew up with a fair few so know them pretty well.