Do you believe that the Pakistan General Elections will be held in a fair manner?

[IMMY69]

Whatever it is, it doesnt give you a moral compass.

Well it’s certainly some mind bending concoction...

 

[Mian]

I just follow the polls:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_Pakistani_general_election,_2018#Punjab

If you have polls about Tamil Nadu, of course I would also consider them.

You my friend need to do some research before following just the numbers. Most of these Polls are from May to first week of June and things changed a lot after that. Punjab politics isn't about party votebank only it's about electables and there is a reason many electables who joined PMLN in 2013 when they saw them winning left them in last 2 months of 2018 when they saw them losing and joined PTI. IPOR was a paid survey PMLN stand no chance in South Punjab as mentioned on link you sent (if you want i can bet PMLN will be humiliated in South).

 

[DeadBall]

Mamoon was a decent poster once and talked with facts but now he is just like those people finding saazish behind everything. I truly believe his dislike for IK (he mentioned multiple times) is the reason he is trying to side with anyone who oppose IK or PTI be it criminals, corrupt politicians, convicts, indians or the africans

Think the line between constructive criticism and obsession got blurred somewhere along the way. Seems it is being done just for the attention of late, be it politics or cricket, but hey, someone's got to do it.

 

[Mian]

Why do you remain in denial and continue to spout rubbish?

A rich millionaire steel baron who didn’t keep paperwork is unbelievable. There are records such as bank accounts, title deeds, loan agreements, tax returns etc etc etc that can and should be available, going back decades.

Then, as others have already mentioned, the lies from father, sons and daughter but yet you still think it’s some deep state military PTI conspiracy!!

What are you smoking?

Jinnah, Iqbal and others Tax receipts are available from 50s and 60s but somehow Sharif family isn't able to find any docs except Qatari letter. Maybe Army burned all their docs?

 

[Mian]

Think the line between constructive criticism and obsession got blurred somewhere along the way. Seems it is being done just for the attention of late, be it politics or cricket, but hey, someone's got to do it.

oh so he is doing same in cricket section too? i am not active there so wasn't sure.

 

[DeadBall]

oh so he is doing same in cricket section too? i am not active there so wasn't sure.

Yes, he has equally comical posts there too. Wonder if he is available for children's birthday parties.

 

[Bewal Express]

Jinnah, Iqbal and others Tax receipts are available from 50s and 60s but somehow Sharif family isn't able to find any docs except Qatari letter. Maybe Army burned all their docs?

[MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION]
I challenged you to provide figures for taxes paid by the Sharifs on their incomes in the 60s and 70s and as always these days you ran. So once again can you give us some figures

 

[Mian]

Yes, he has equally comical posts there too. Wonder if he is available for children's birthday parties.

haha i remember one of his prediction about Mitch Johnson in cricket section when he was eating English batsmen alive in Ashes Mamoon thought he is gonna kill Pakistani batsmen in UAE in the end Pakistan won both Tests with a big lead and Johnson wanted to leave UAE asap. Mamoon hate for South African/Pakistani players and love for English/Indian players in Cricket is kinda similar to his hate for IK/PTI and love for Sharifs/PMLN in politics.

 

[Napa]

Who is the writer of this article? I said I might be wrong and if in India this means a person is lying then Jai Hind.

You made a false claim, then added a layer of confusion by saying Dhume was the author. Many posters in this thread took your post to be true and continued with your theme.

If you make a false claim a qualification "I might be wrong" is not enough. Check and if the claim is false, then post saying that the claim is false.

Reflexively blaming India and peddling conspiracy theories will not lead to any sort of development.

 

[Mian]

You made a false claim, then added a layer of confusion by saying Dhume was the author. Many posters in this thread took your post to be true and continued with your theme.

If you make a false claim a qualification "I might be wrong" is not enough. Check and if the claim is false, then post saying that the claim is false.

Reflexively blaming India and peddling conspiracy theories will not lead to any sort of development.

Facebook is showing us the sponsored content written by Sadanand Dhume for AEI and being shared by ThePrint and they are running it as promoted content by paying for it as an ad. Why indians are so obsessed with Pakistan?

Imran Khan as prime minister would be bad news for Pakistan’s democracy

Three reasons why Imran Khan is bad for Pakistan’s democracy

https://theprint.in/opinion/imran-k...ld-be-bad-news-for-pakistans-democracy/84976/

http://www.aei.org/publication/three-reasons-why-imran-khan-is-bad-for-pakistans-democracy/

 

[Napa]

Facebook is showing us the sponsored content written by Sadanand Dhume for AEI and being shared by ThePrint and they are running it as promoted content by paying for it as an ad. Why indians are so obsessed with Pakistan?

Imran Khan as prime minister would be bad news for Pakistan’s democracy

Three reasons why Imran Khan is bad for Pakistan’s democracy

https://theprint.in/opinion/imran-k...ld-be-bad-news-for-pakistans-democracy/84976/

http://www.aei.org/publication/three-reasons-why-imran-khan-is-bad-for-pakistans-democracy/

The claim that the OP Economist article was written by an Indian hasn't still been backed up by any evidence.

 

[Mamoon]

There is no doubt that Nawaz Sharif is corrupt, but he has been punished on weak grounds.

Firstly, he was dismissed as PM based on Article 62-63, a ridiculous clause that is extremely vague and impossible to impose impartially.

If it is applied across the board without any bias, PTI will once again be reduced to a “taanga party”, a term combined by Sheikh Rasheed many years ago, a crook who is now one of the stars of Naya Pakistan.

For those who do not understand Urdu, taanga party means a party that is so small that it can fit in a horse cart or a buggy.

If Article 62-63 is applied impartially, nearly 80% of the lotas (new name: electables) in PTI will not be able to survive. In fact, Imran himself will not be able to escape Article 62-63, because he is no shape or from sadiq & ameen.

People who state that the only thing that matters is financial honesty are missing or ignoring two key elements:

Firstly, Article 62-63 does not imply financial honesty only. Secondly, Imran has failed to prove himself as financially honest.

For four years now, he has been sprinting from his foreign funding/embezzlement case, and he has been accused by Akbar S Babar, one of the founding members of PTI and one of the original passengers of the taanga party.

If Imran stops dancing to the tunes of the GHQ, he can easily be disqualified based on that, and of course Article 62-63.

Those who are stating that Nawaz Sharif failed to provide evidence are missing the point. Whatever evidence that he would have provided to explain his properties would have been deemed insufficient, because the decision to get rid of him was a strategic one - a decision that was taken long before Nawaz was even asked to present his evidence, which was just a formality.

Nawaz Sharif’s case was no different to Sheikh Rasheed’s, who didn’t provide any more or less evidence than Nawaz, but he was not disqualified. A clear indication of how selective and biased the so-called accountability is.

Also, people stating that Zardari will end up in jail with Nawaz in the future are making a weak argument. They cannot answer when will it happen and why justice hasn’t been served yet? The answer to this is simple - nothing will happen to him as long as he is on good terms with the military.

Accountability means nothing when it is (1) applied selectively and (2) when it is in the hands of the military.

Selective accountability and military supremacy are the signs of a weak democracy, and that is why Imran Khan is the biggest threat to democracy right now.

Five years ago, he was happy to accuse the military for aiding Nawaz in the 2013 elections, but now that they have started to back and engage in pre-poll rigging to favor him, he has declare Army the only corruption-free organization in the country.

So basically, the Army is not corrupt as long as they are supporting him. This is our savior and the man who will transform this country.

 

[Mian]

Long boring essays with same one point "GHQ is behind every mess in Pakistan". Come on Mamoon your saazishi theories are getting boring now give them a new touch to make them interesting.

 

[Zeeraq]

Those who are stating that Nawaz Sharif failed to provide evidence are missing the point. Whatever evidence that he would have provided to explain his properties would have been deemed insufficient, because the decision to get rid of him was a strategic one - a decision that was taken long before Nawaz was even asked to present his evidence, which was just a formality.

This is one of the most ridiculous excuse I've heard. If he had provided evidence (which he did not), it would've been really easy for him to proof that he is innocent and is being targeted.

 

[IMMY69]

This is one of the most ridiculous excuse I've heard. If he had provided evidence (which he did not), it would've been really easy for him to proof that he is innocent and is being targeted.

Corrupt PMLN supporters:-

He could have provided evidence but it wouldn’t have mattered as the army was after him!

But yes he is corrupt so let’s continue voting for them because it doesn’t matter that the army was behind him throughout his career but they are not behind him now.

PMLN can do corruption and steal from the poor and whether the army is behind them or not they shall continue to vote for him.

PTI, a party for change.. A party that is strong on independent institutions and one that wants to eradicate corruption. A party that has yet to be in power. Army is behind them so they shall not vote for them....

The entire thing is illogical...

PMLN has dubious electables but they vote for them. So they criticise IK for being naive and not having political nouse and so cannot win a election. So now IK brings electables in to his party and suddenly he is as bad as the rest. So they continue to vote for PMLN (you can replace PMLN with PPP, same difference).

 

[Terry Bollea]

By looking at these posts, I wonder why the West will be afraid of a strong Pakistan when it doesn't even matter to them who is in the power. The problem which this article highlights is that the fact that it is against human rights when there are planted elections and it has even been reported by HRCP and not just the West or India as people here are saying that

 

[Moh@n]

I hear you [MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION]

Imran is no angel either. Look at this, straight from the horse's mouth:

"I formed an offshore company in the UK and evaded British tax, because that was my right as a foreigner".

I don't know how any Junooni can possibly defend this.

[UTUBE]vUQg42_Tt88[/UTUBE]

 

[Mian]

I hear you [MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION]

Imran is no angel either. Look at this, straight from the horse's mouth:

"I formed an offshore company in the UK and evaded British tax, because that was my right as a foreigner".

I don't know how any Junooni can possibly defend this.

[UTUBE]vUQg42_Tt88[/UTUBE]

Modi bhakts should stop meddling in Pakistan politics.

 

[Moh@n]

Modi bhakts should stop meddling in Pakistan politics.

I don't think posting an opinion on a thread on PP is the definition of meddling with politics.

 

[Mian]

I don't think posting an opinion on a thread on PP is the definition of meddling with politics.

Well Indians are already doing it at a very high level check post number 63

 

[Terry Bollea]

Well Indians are already doing it at a very high level check post number 63

So? Indians are human as well. If Pakistanis can post on IoK and whats happening with Indian Muslims, Why can't Indians post on Pak politics?

 

[pakistan cricket fan]

Did i just read Nawaz is not a Indian stooge
Ramzan sugar mill 300 illegal Indians working there and day after is was burned down when it came on the news.
Invites Modi terrorist to his granddaughter wedding.
And hase a meeting with terrorist Modi right hand Sajjan Jindal in Murree [MENTION=142451]Mian[/MENTION] [MENTION=1269]Bewal Express[/MENTION] [MENTION=21699]Pakpak[/MENTION]

 

[Mian]

Did i just read Nawaz is not a Indian stooge
Ramzan sugar mill 300 illegal Indians working there and day after is was burned down when it came on the news.
Invites Modi terrorist to his granddaughter wedding.
And hase a meeting with terrorist Modi right hand Sajjan Jindal in Murree [MENTION=142451]Mian[/MENTION] [MENTION=1269]Bewal Express[/MENTION] [MENTION=21699]Pakpak[/MENTION]

They are crying because their biggest asset ab jail main ser raha he

 

[pakistan cricket fan]

They are crying because their biggest asset ab jail main ser raha he

I hope he stays there forever soon will his chor friend Asif Zardar be with him.

 

[Zeeraq]

So? Indians are human as well. If Pakistanis can post on IoK and whats happening with Indian Muslims, Why can't Indians post on Pak politics?

At least you've agreed it's Indian-occupied-Kashmir. Thanks for acknowledging the truth!

 

[yasir]

Somebody is spilling the beans, this time it’s not me ...Yeh tu gaya, keeping 200 million people quite is why Army championed in 4 decades...

https://www.dawn.com/news/1421562/i...ecurity-agencies-meddling-in-judicial-affairs

 

[Mian]

Somebody is spilling the beans, this time it’s not me ...Yeh tu gaya, keeping 200 million people quite is why Army championed in 4 decades... ����

https://www.dawn.com/news/1421562/i...ecurity-agencies-meddling-in-judicial-affairs

So this Anti Ahmedi and Pro Mumtaz Qadri Judge is the darling of liberals now oh why i am not surprised? Wo apni khaer manaaye his case was going into supreme judicial council and he had to divert attention while liberals needed a shaheed for jamhuryat.

 

[enkidu_]

Somebody is spilling the beans, this time it’s not me ...Yeh tu gaya, keeping 200 million people quite is why Army championed in 4 decades... ����

https://www.dawn.com/news/1421562/i...ecurity-agencies-meddling-in-judicial-affairs

Islamabad High Court’s Justice Shaukat Aziz Siddiqui, a former president of the Rawalpindi Bar who openly celebrated Gov Salman Taseer’s murder in 2011, revoked Pervez Musharraf’s bail that was properly granted earlier by Justice Mushir Alam, a’ Sindh High Court judge in Karachi.

As an attorney in 2007, Justice Shaukat Aziz Siddiqui represented and helped bail out Maulana Abdul Aziz who was charged in multiple cases in connection with the Lal Masjid standoff.

Another credit of Justice Shoukat Saddiqui is that he is real brother of Irfan Siddiqui media advisor of P.M.

On the instructions of Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif, Justice Shaukat Siddiqui was allotted House No 91-H in Sector F/6-3 of Islamabad. After sometime, the judge used his connections to find a better place to live, and got allotted House No 1-A, in Sector F/7-3. However, the honorable judge was not satisfied even with that house and his private secretary wrote a letter to the department concerned demanding change of residence for the third time. Eventually, he got House No 2-A in Sector F/7-4.
(...)
The IHC bench was hearing four petitions filed for restraining the PTI from holding a sit-in on November 2nd 2016. Justice Shaukat Aziz Siddiqui while hearing the petitions remarked that “it appears from Imran Khan’s statements that he wanted to paralyze the government and Nov 2 sit-in is not just a protest rally”.

He has also summoned Imran Khan on 31 October 2016 to explain his intentions to IHC.

https://azharayaz.wordpress.com/201...is-criticizing-justice-shaukat-aziz-siddiqui/

the liberals' new Messiah

 

[Mian]

https://azharayaz.wordpress.com/201...is-criticizing-justice-shaukat-aziz-siddiqui/

the liberals' new Messiah

Hahaha their new darling

 

[Loralai]

Somebody is spilling the beans, this time it’s not me ...Yeh tu gaya, keeping 200 million people quite is why Army championed in 4 decades... ����

https://www.dawn.com/news/1421562/i...ecurity-agencies-meddling-in-judicial-affairs

bhookey mar gaye mein aur tu
loot ke khaa gaye GHQ

 

[waqar goraya]

Somebody is spilling the beans, this time it’s not me ...Yeh tu gaya, keeping 200 million people quite is why Army championed in 4 decades... ����

https://www.dawn.com/news/1421562/i...ecurity-agencies-meddling-in-judicial-affairs

In addition to Mian's post when he was elected as Rawalpindi bar association President he vowed not to accept invitation to be judge , only to back track a little later.

First, he appeased religious fundamentals by giving verdicts against Ahmadis, Mumtaz Qadri, blasphemy. And now he is trying to cash political support from N league.

The way he describes minute details of alleged workings, maneuverings of army in superior courts , he himself seems to be heading a secret agency. He has questioned every other judge of IHC and SC by his widespread allegations. While he himself faces Supreme Judicial Council inquiry, which will be an open court proceeding.

In short, he is neither a bacon of liberalism nor a guardian of tolerance. He is trying to amass support of religious and political segments to put pressure on Supreme Judicial Council.

 

[Mian]

In addition to Mian's post when he was elected as Rawalpindi bar association President he vowed not to accept invitation to be judge , only to back track a little later.

First, he appeased religious fundamentals by giving verdicts against Ahmadis, Mumtaz Qadri, blasphemy. And now he is trying to cash political support from N league.

The way he describes minute details of alleged workings, maneuverings of army in superior courts , he himself seems to be heading a secret agency. He has questioned every other judge of IHC and SC by his widespread allegations. While he himself faces Supreme Judicial Council inquiry, which will be an open court proceeding.

In short, he is neither a bacon of liberalism nor a guardian of tolerance. He is trying to amass support of religious and political segments to put pressure on Supreme Judicial Council.

Looks like the details were written by Irfan Siddiqui his cousin and speech writer of Nawaz and Maryam

 

[Mamoon]

Somebody is spilling the beans, this time it’s not me ...Yeh tu gaya, keeping 200 million people quite is why Army championed in 4 decades...

https://www.dawn.com/news/1421562/i...ecurity-agencies-meddling-in-judicial-affairs

Was about to post this. Wait till he is dubbed a traitor now.

 

[yasir]

In addition to Mian's post when he was elected as Rawalpindi bar association President he vowed not to accept invitation to be judge , only to back track a little later.

First, he appeased religious fundamentals by giving verdicts against Ahmadis, Mumtaz Qadri, blasphemy. And now he is trying to cash political support from N league.

The way he describes minute details of alleged workings, maneuverings of army in superior courts , he himself seems to be heading a secret agency. He has questioned every other judge of IHC and SC by his widespread allegations. While he himself faces Supreme Judicial Council inquiry, which will be an open court proceeding.

In short, he is neither a bacon of liberalism nor a guardian of tolerance. He is trying to amass support of religious and political segments to put pressure on Supreme Judicial Council.

Well the whole Institution of Amry appease religious fundamentalist, they created this industry in Pakistan and ruin everything. Most of the time insiders spill the beans. This is the case here.

Thee is no credibility of Army or judges, whole world knows that but nobody dare to talk about it in Pakistan media, because of heavy hand of PEMERA, if Amry is so sure of their honesty they would not had to use entire country’s machinery to crush every opposing views. They cannot take little criticism but want to play politics, first grow some balls, before venturing into politics

 

[Loralai]

Well the whole Institution of Amry appease religious fundamentalist, they created this industry in Pakistan and ruin everything. Most of the time insiders spill the beans. This is the case here.

Thee is no credibility of Army or judges, whole world knows that but nobody dare to talk about it in Pakistan media, because of heavy hand of PEMERA, if Amry is so sure of their honesty they would not had to use entire country’s machinery to crush every opposing views. They cannot take little criticism but want to play politics, first grow some balls, before venturing into politics

[MENTION=5869]yasir[/MENTION] bhai they have completely failed. Leaving their interference in politics aside for a while, they failed us militarily repeatedly (started war in 1965 and didn't win, cost us half our country and humiliated us in 1971 and then again humiliated in Kargil and have failed to keep the country safe from terrorists).

These people are corrupt and should be held accountable. How can they be so incompetent even after having majority of budget on defence for so long.

 

[Bewal Express]

Did i just read Nawaz is not a Indian stooge
Ramzan sugar mill 300 illegal Indians working there and day after is was burned down when it came on the news.
Invites Modi terrorist to his granddaughter wedding.
And hase a meeting with terrorist Modi right hand Sajjan Jindal in Murree [MENTION=142451]Mian[/MENTION] [MENTION=1269]Bewal Express[/MENTION] [MENTION=21699]Pakpak[/MENTION]

Inds are mortified that their main asset has gone. This was the guy that couldn't bring himself to admit that Yadav was spy. Why, You may ask? Well isnt the answer obvious.

 

[Bewal Express]

[MENTION=5869]yasir[/MENTION] bhai they have completely failed. Leaving their interference in politics aside for a while, they failed us militarily repeatedly (started war in 1965 and didn't win, cost us half our country and humiliated us in 1971 and then again humiliated in Kargil and have failed to keep the country safe from terrorists).

These people are corrupt and should be held accountable. How can they be so incompetent even after having majority of budget on defence for so long.

You keep calling for the army to held accountable, i dont disagree but when you mafia bosses are caught red handed as in the Panama scandal, you cant bring yourself to comment. Why?

 

[Mamoon]

Did i just read Nawaz is not a Indian stooge
Ramzan sugar mill 300 illegal Indians working there and day after is was burned down when it came on the news.
Invites Modi terrorist to his granddaughter wedding.
And hase a meeting with terrorist Modi right hand Sajjan Jindal in Murree [MENTION=142451]Mian[/MENTION] [MENTION=1269]Bewal Express[/MENTION] [MENTION=21699]Pakpak[/MENTION]

The military establishment has been very successful in planting India as an enemy in the heads of our people, because anti-India sentiment is the only way they can bully the country. Hence, any person or any politician who strives for cordial relationships with India is dubbed as an Indian stooge and a traitor.

Our people want our politicians to exhibit anti-India sentiment and stand on podiums and shout "hum India ke saath ye kar lengay, hum India ke saath wo kar lengay" and make such hollow and baseless claims etc. The common man in Pakistan thrives on anti-India demagogy, and that is the result of the influence of our military since 1947.

Exhibiting anti-India sentiment is the key to being in the goods of the general public in Pakistan, as well the good books of the military.

 

[waqar goraya]

Well the whole Institution of Amry appease religious fundamentalist, they created this industry in Pakistan and ruin everything. Most of the time insiders spill the beans. This is the case here.

Thee is no credibility of Army or judges, whole world knows that but nobody dare to talk about it in Pakistan media, because of heavy hand of PEMERA, if Amry is so sure of their honesty they would not had to use entire country’s machinery to crush every opposing views. They cannot take little criticism but want to play politics, first grow some balls, before venturing into politics

My post was about legal and moral credibility of the said judge. And you are generalizing your criticism on army.
Your simple point is that army has also supported some religious elements so if this so called honorable, whistle blower has also time and again chosen to be on extremist side, I as a liberal can ignore that fact and celebrate his epochal words against army and in support of poor Nawaz.

 

[Loralai]

You keep calling for the army to held accountable, i dont disagree but when you mafia bosses are caught red handed as in the Panama scandal, you cant bring yourself to comment. Why?

I have commented and believe all major institutions and individuals must be held to account, not just Nawaz Sharif. The fact that Nawaz has been held to account, along with the circumstances surrounding his trial and punishment, are simply very suspicious. His corruption is not a new thing but why is he only being punished now?

I hope you realise that army is the biggest player in our politics right now and they need to be held to account. We can't sweep their role under the rug and pretend that we are living in a true democracy given what is happening in Pakistan.

Army needs thorough investigation. Where are Raheel Sharif and Musharraf's assets? How can Musharraf seat happily in UAE whilst there is an arrest warrant out for him in Pak?

 

[waqar goraya]

Looks like the details were written by Irfan Siddiqui his cousin and speech writer of Nawaz and Maryam

Anything against army , in any manner, from anyone , in any context and we desi liberals can have our field day!

 

[Mian]

Anything against army , in any manner, from anyone , in any context and we desi liberals can have our field day!

As i always say in Pakistan liberalism = Bughaz e Amry

 

[waqar goraya]

As i always say in Pakistan liberalism = Bughaz e Amry

I have watched the video too where he is addressing N league forum of Rawalpindi Bar association. He sounds way too personal and critical.
If he was so unrighteous why he remained silent for over two years? Ok i can accept that it was not necessary to report these things then but why on earth when references against you is all ready to be heard?

His allegations don't hold any weight because he is himself facing trial. If this was true then almost every judge in judiciary is working on army's directions something which did not happen even during Zia and Musharraf's regimes. And in this era of digital age and mass media it is simply impossible to conceive that all of these judges are getting directions from army except honorable Justice Shaukat Siddiqi.

 

[Mian]

I have watched the video too where he is addressing N league forum of Rawalpindi Bar association. He sounds way too personal and critical.
If he was so unrighteous why he remained silent for over two years? Ok i can accept that it was not necessary to report these things then but why on earth when references against you is all ready to be heard?

His allegations don't hold any weight because he is himself facing trial. If this was true then almost every judge in judiciary is working on army's directions something which did not happen even during Zia and Musharraf's regimes. And in this era of digital age and mass media it is simply impossible to conceive that all of these judges are getting directions from army except honorable Justice Shaukat Siddiqi.

And i was wondering how he knows what's happening in SC and Accountability court who is feeding him? he himself is an IHC judge

 

[KingKhanWC]

You made a false claim, then added a layer of confusion by saying Dhume was the author. Many posters in this thread took your post to be true and continued with your theme.

If you make a false claim a qualification "I might be wrong" is not enough. Check and if the claim is false, then post saying that the claim is false.

Reflexively blaming India and peddling conspiracy theories will not lead to any sort of development.

In Indian English when someone says 'I may be wrong but I think...' is a claim? lol


It's you who made the claim insisting the writer isnt Indian but have no clue who it is?

Even if he isn't Indian, we know the Indian media and government are pro-Nawaz. He is an Indian asset and India enjoys a leader who will ruin Pakistan. Its the same old nonsense being spouted by the Indian media, Pak army are evil etc, Imran Khan is pro army, Nawaz has been set up.

Nobody takes Indian views on Pakistan elections seriously apart from Nawaz Sharif supporters.

 

[yasir]

So this Anti Ahmedi and Pro Mumtaz Qadri Judge is the darling of liberals now oh why i am not surprised? Wo apni khaer manaaye his case was going into supreme judicial council and he had to divert attention while liberals needed a shaheed for jamhuryat.

There is no moral or ethical credibility of most judges and Army generals. But don't forget most of the times, its insiders that spill the beans. We have history of people working with Army on not so moral, ethical or legal projects and then split when they have personal disputes. From NS to now IK, all these good/bad Taliban, fringe religious group aka terrorist, Army working with judges, Mr Zia, Mr Baig, Mr Gul, Musharik/Kayani...List is very long, should we dis-credit everything just because those people had no morals?? - Pakistan is full of bad Eggs, specially these two institutions. When they fight we with each other, we get to witness their 50 shades of grey

 

[yasir]

https://azharayaz.wordpress.com/201...is-criticizing-justice-shaukat-aziz-siddiqui/

the liberals' new Messiah

There is no moral or ethical credibility of most judges and Army generals. But don't forget most of the times, its insiders that spill the beans. We have history of people working with Army on not so moral, ethical or legal projects and then split when they have personal disputes. From NS to now IK, all these good/bad Taliban, fringe religious group aka terrorist, Army working with judges, Mr Zia, Mr Baig, Mr Gul, Musharik/Kayani...List is very long, should we dis-credit everything just because those people had no morals?? - Pakistan is full of bad Eggs, specially these two institutions. When they fight we with each other, we get to witness their 50 shades of grey

 

[waqar goraya]

And i was wondering how he knows what's happening in SC and Accountability court who is feeding him? he himself is an IHC judge

The biggest joke is that he is himself hearing cases which somehow involve agencies where he has criticized them.

So, if according to his words cases are being distributed among judges on the orders of agencies then why on earth every other case he hears involves agencies themselves

 

[Mian]

The biggest joke is that he is himself hearing cases which somehow involve agencies where he has criticized them.

So, if according to his words cases are being distributed among judges on the orders of agencies then why on earth every other case he hears involves agencies themselves

haha yea he is hearing missing persons case.

 

[yasir]

My post was about legal and moral credibility of the said judge. And you are generalizing your criticism on army.
Your simple point is that army has also supported some religious elements so if this so called honorable, whistle blower has also time and again chosen to be on extremist side, I as a liberal can ignore that fact and celebrate his epochal words against army and in support of poor Nawaz.

What is legal or moral credibility of Army? - Have we not seen what they have done in last 40 years? They are doing exactly same thing what they did in 1980s, yet people are only focusing on NS, and overlook what Army is doing even now to manipulate and install their new breed of NS...Are we going to solve anything by recycling through religious groups, politicians and not going after the true culprit?? - This cycle will continue for another 20 years. Conversion has to be about the true Don of the Country. People slip from main target and go after pity things, this group, this person is the only problem, once we can take care of it, things will be alright. World is not that simple!!

 

[Zeeraq]

I have commented and believe all major institutions and individuals must be held to account, not just Nawaz Sharif. The fact that Nawaz has been held to account, along with the circumstances surrounding his trial and punishment, are simply very suspicious. His corruption is not a new thing but why is he only being punished now?

I hope you realise that army is the biggest player in our politics right now and they need to be held to account. We can't sweep their role under the rug and pretend that we are living in a true democracy given what is happening in Pakistan.

Army needs thorough investigation. Where are Raheel Sharif and Musharraf's assets? How can Musharraf seat happily in UAE whilst there is an arrest warrant out for him in Pak?

Hudaibiya Paper Mills case have also been dismissed, Why did Justice Qazi Faiz Esa used a ridiculous excuse of time-barred to dismiss an open and shut case of corruption of Sharifs?

Is it a saazish according to you or not?

I do agree with you proceedings against Musharraf & other corrupt generals should start, but why did PPP & PML-N didn't do anything to substantial to bring Musharraf and these corrupt generals back?

 

[Zeeraq]

The biggest joke is that he is himself hearing cases which somehow involve agencies where he has criticized them.

So, if according to his words cases are being distributed among judges on the orders of agencies then why on earth every other case he hears involves agencies themselves

He should recuse himself from the case if he is not morally corrupt.

 

[waqar goraya]

What is legal or moral credibility of Army? - Have we not seen what they have done in last 40 years? They are doing exactly same thing what they did in 1980s, yet people are only focusing on NS, and overlook what Army is doing even now to manipulate and install their new breed of NS...Are we going to solve anything by recycling through religious groups, politicians and not going after the true culprit?? - This cycle will continue for another 20 years. Conversion has to be about the true Don of the Country. People slip from main target and go after pity things, this group, this person is the only problem, once we can take care of it, things will be alright. World is not that simple!!

So, this is your justification for accepting words of this judge?

This judge's appeasement of religious fundamentals, reference in supreme judicial council and political views are more recent than what Zia and Musgarraf did in the past. In fact clearly aligning himself with N league he is doing the same thing which you are accusing army of.

 

[waqar goraya]

There is no moral or ethical credibility of most judges and Army generals. But don't forget most of the times, its insiders that spill the beans. We have history of people working with Army on not so moral, ethical or legal projects and then split when they have personal disputes. From NS to now IK, all these good/bad Taliban, fringe religious group aka terrorist, Army working with judges, Mr Zia, Mr Baig, Mr Gul, Musharik/Kayani...List is very long, should we dis-credit everything just because those people had no morals?? - Pakistan is full of bad Eggs, specially these two institutions. When they fight we with each other, we get to witness their 50 shades of grey

No moral and ethical credibility of most of the judges except Justice Shaukat Siddiqi, who has sided with extremists , is facing reference in supreme judicial council and has clearly assumed the role of PML N spokes person.

 

[Moh@n]

Did i just read Nawaz is not a Indian stooge
Ramzan sugar mill 300 illegal Indians working there and day after is was burned down when it came on the news.
Invites Modi terrorist to his granddaughter wedding.
And hase a meeting with terrorist Modi right hand Sajjan Jindal in Murree [MENTION=142451]Mian[/MENTION] [MENTION=1269]Bewal Express[/MENTION] [MENTION=21699]Pakpak[/MENTION]

And you don't have a problem with these 260 terrorists contesting elections and the army doing nothing about it?

https://en.dailypakistan.com.pk/pak...hreek-fields-260-candidates-to-contest-polls/

 

[slipcatch]

And you don't have a problem with these 260 terrorists contesting elections and the army doing nothing about it?

https://en.dailypakistan.com.pk/pak...hreek-fields-260-candidates-to-contest-polls/

At one time Modi was a terrorist, too. That is another thing that court in India did not convict him.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

And you don't have a problem with these 260 terrorists contesting elections and the army doing nothing about it?

https://en.dailypakistan.com.pk/pak...hreek-fields-260-candidates-to-contest-polls/

Those are fundamentalists no doubt, but obviously they can't be terrorists otherwise they would be in jail rather than contesting elections. As slipcatch has pointed out above, if Modi can clear his name and win an election to be hailed a hero for India, then it is only fair to give Pakistan judiciary the same respect.

 

[Loralai]

And you don't have a problem with these 260 terrorists contesting elections and the army doing nothing about it?

https://en.dailypakistan.com.pk/pak...hreek-fields-260-candidates-to-contest-polls/

Yes we have real reservations about these candidates. They should not be allowed to take part and should be behind bars. It is failing of Electoral Commission and of the Pakistani state that these people are allowed to take part and a matter of shame that parties are seeking their favour rather than condemning them.

 

[slipcatch]

Yes we have real reservations about these candidates. They should not be allowed to take part and should be behind bars. It is failing of Electoral Commission and of the Pakistani state that these people are allowed to take part and a matter of shame that parties are seeking their favour rather than condemning them.

If you believe you can achieve Ahmedi rights of being labelled as Muslims by what you are trying to promote then you are doing huge disservice to Ahmedi community and Pakistan.

Everyone who has not been convicted and/or fall within the rules of Election of Pakistan is and should be allow to contest election. You are going against the narrative of Pakistan and Pakistani government on international level.

You can't ask for any religious person to be behind bar just because you do not agree with them. If you are allow to do that then Tomorrow those who do not agree with Ahmedi will be demanding the same, to put every Ahmedi in jail because they do not agree with them.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Yes we have real reservations about these candidates. They should not be allowed to take part and should be behind bars. It is failing of Electoral Commission and of the Pakistani state that these people are allowed to take part and a matter of shame that parties are seeking their favour rather than condemning them.

I would agree with you that it is a matter of shame that parties are seeking their favour ( if they are) but respectfully can't endorse the view that they should be behind bars. That has to be for the courts to decide at the end of the day, same as every other country.

 

[Loralai]

If you believe you can achieve Ahmedi rights of being labelled as Muslims by what you are trying to promote then you are doing huge disservice to Ahmedi community and Pakistan.

Everyone who has not been convicted and/or fall within the rules of Election of Pakistan is and should be allow to contest election. You are going against the narrative of Pakistan and Pakistani government on international level.

You can't ask for any religious person to be behind bar just because you do not agree with them. If you are allow to do that then Tomorrow those who do not agree with Ahmedi will be demanding the same, to put every Ahmedi in jail because they do not agree with them.

We aren't talking about ordinary religious people.

We are talking about people like Ludhianwi, Ramzan Mengal, Khadim Hussain Rizvi and others.

These people are violent extremists by any stretch of the imagination.

Why are peaceful candidates like Jibran Nasir being punished but the likes of Rizvi and Mengal being provided with security cordons?

 

[slipcatch]

We aren't talking about ordinary religious people.

We are talking about people like Ludhianwi, Ramzan Mengal, Khadim Hussain Rizvi and others.

These people are violent extremists by any stretch of the imagination.

Why are peaceful candidates like Jibran Nasir being punished but the likes of Rizvi and Mengal being provided with security cordons?

who has punished Jibran Nasir?

He was dumb enough to block a motorcade of VIP person, if he were to do that in a western world he would be fined and jailed for doing the same.

Has he been banned from running for election? is there a ban on him?

Like I have said, your approach is totally counter productive for the community of Ahmedia.

 

[slipcatch]

We aren't talking about ordinary religious people.

We are talking about people like Ludhianwi, Ramzan Mengal, Khadim Hussain Rizvi and others.

These people are violent extremists by any stretch of the imagination.

Why are peaceful candidates like Jibran Nasir being punished but the likes of Rizvi and Mengal being provided with security cordons?

If Jibran Nasir wants to change the system, first he needs to get into Politics, the only way to do it, highlight the issues.

No one has banned him from running for the office.

 

[pakistan cricket fan]

Inds are mortified that their main asset has gone. This was the guy that couldn't bring himself to admit that Yadav was spy. Why, You may ask? Well isnt the answer obvious.

I think the meeting with Sajjan Jindal was about Kulbhushan Terrorist further you know what happend

 

[pakistan cricket fan]

The military establishment has been very successful in planting India as an enemy in the heads of our people, because anti-India sentiment is the only way they can bully the country. Hence, any person or any politician who strives for cordial relationships with India is dubbed as an Indian stooge and a traitor.

Our people want our politicians to exhibit anti-India sentiment and stand on podiums and shout "hum India ke saath ye kar lengay, hum India ke saath wo kar lengay" and make such hollow and baseless claims etc. The common man in Pakistan thrives on anti-India demagogy, and that is the result of the influence of our military since 1947.

Exhibiting anti-India sentiment is the key to being in the goods of the general public in Pakistan, as well the good books of the military.

When did i say that the PA is clean?
So what i wrote about Nawaz Shareef if this doesnt make hime stooge or traiter then i dont know what to say.
Thats why rubbish Indian media is supporting him.

 

[pakistan cricket fan]

And you don't have a problem with these 260 terrorists contesting elections and the army doing nothing about it?

https://en.dailypakistan.com.pk/pak...hreek-fields-260-candidates-to-contest-polls/

They are only contesting but they are not winning a single seat but in our neighbor country a terrorist is the PM off that country.

 

[Lonewarrior]

so the international media will tell us what to do and what not to do ? and the so called liberals are fine with it ? good very good.

 

[Napa]

Inds are mortified that their main asset has gone. This was the guy that couldn't bring himself to admit that Yadav was spy. Why, You may ask? Well isnt the answer obvious.

They are crying because their biggest asset ab jail main ser raha he

Guys, there is an essential flaw in your thinking.

You goal should be Pakistan developing economically. If that is to happen, you need some sort of peace with your biggest neighbor. If you can trade with India, your economy will benefit massively, but if you can't, you need to at least lower the tension.

India is not the cause for your poor economic development. Constant low-level war with India and your Army's domination of your economy are the real causes.

The low-level war doesn't affect India much as it is much bigger and international investors think India is safe to invest. It however is fatal for the Pakistani economy. India last year produced about 100X the number of cars Pakistan did.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automotive_industry_in_India
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automotive_industry_in_Pakistan

Get over India. Indians are not your enemy. If NS wants good relations with India, it does not mean that he is bad for Pakistan.

Your goal should be economic development, and IK will not get you there. At this point is should be obvious that IK will do anything to become PM, including letting the Army maintain its domination of the economy.

 

[IMMY69]

Guys, there is an essential flaw in your thinking.

You goal should be Pakistan developing economically. If that is to happen, you need some sort of peace with your biggest neighbor. If you can trade with India, your economy will benefit massively, but if you can't, you need to at least lower the tension.

India is not the cause for your poor economic development. Constant low-level war with India and your Army's domination of your economy are the real causes.

The low-level war doesn't affect India much as it is much bigger and international investors think India is safe to invest. It however is fatal for the Pakistani economy. India last year produced about 100X the number of cars Pakistan did.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automotive_industry_in_India
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automotive_industry_in_Pakistan

Get over India. Indians are not your enemy. If NS wants good relations with India, it does not mean that he is bad for Pakistan.

Your goal should be economic development, and IK will not get you there. At this point is should be obvious that IK will do anything to become PM, including letting the Army maintain its domination of the economy.

Yeah thanks for that.

Well done

 

[enkidu_]

[MENTION=142162]Napa[/MENTION] we already have neighbors with growing economies, the best candidate being China. Look at their exports as compared to India's, not even talking of other HDIs. Also economy is not everything, Nepal is the only other Hindu majority country in the world, but instead of helping a poor country of their own faith, they weaponize its ethnicities (the Madhesi's, originally from Bihar) to play its own geopolitical cards. In fact, do you know the conditions of Dalits/Adivasis (the indigenous populations Aryans invaded) ? Who are "your own" ?

According to the MPI, 645 million people in India, about 55 percent of the population, are poor – almost twice as many as the official poverty figures. In eight Indian states alone there are more ‘multidimensionally’ poor people – about 421 million – than in the 26 poorest sub-Saharan countries in Africa combined.

Poverty levels are highest among India’s tribal population (81.4 percent), followed by Dalits (65.8 percent) and Other Backward Classes (58.3 percent). The poverty level among the rest of the population is 33.3 percent.

https://idsn.org/two-thirds-of-indias-dalits-are-poor/

How you help Pak if you can't help your own Dalits/Adivasis and Hindu neighbours, the Nepalis ?

More importantly, with Pakistan's TNT theory, compromise with Hindu-majority India, even more so with rising Hindu nationalism, is impossible, and if Imran Khan talks of peace with India many like me would stop supporting him too.

 

[pakistan cricket fan]

Some indians need to look at there own country where there PM is a terrorist.

 

[Moh@n]

They are only contesting but they are not winning a single seat but in our neighbor country a terrorist is the PM off that country.

Who cares? Pak is already on the gray list. When the world sees 260 terrorists contesting elections, their decision to put further sanctions is going to be all the more easy.

And unfortunately for Pakistan, nobody in the world buys their "Terrorist Modi" narrative so hard luck there because that is what matters in the end.

 

[Mian]

Who cares? Pak is already on the gray list. When the world sees 260 terrorists contesting elections, their decision to put further sanctions is going to be all the more easy.

And unfortunately for Pakistan, nobody in the world buys their "Terrorist Modi" narrative so hard luck there because that is what matters in the end.

who cares? so why are you in this thread? stop wasting your time on our internal issues

 

[Moh@n]

who cares? so why are you in this thread? stop wasting your time on our internal issues

Yes, who cares whether those 260 terrorists are going to win the elections or not.

Pray tell me, who actually cares?

 

[Mian]

Yes, who cares whether those 260 terrorists are going to win the elections or not.

Pray tell me, who actually cares?

your comment was on Pak that who cares so i am asking why you are wasting your time? maulvis and extremists have been contesting in Pakistan elections since creation but we never let them rule over us but i know a country who is being ruled by a mass murderer.

 

[Terry Bollea]

your comment was on Pak that who cares so i am asking why you are wasting your time? maulvis and extremists have been contesting in Pakistan elections since creation but we never let them rule over us but i know a country who is being ruled by a mass murderer.

That mass murderer is hated a lot by a lot of people in India and I think most of celebs hate him too but in Pakistan no one can even think of speaking against mullahs and extremists or else they wont be safe.

 

[Moh@n]

your comment was on Pak that who cares so i am asking why you are wasting your time? maulvis and extremists have been contesting in Pakistan elections since creation but we never let them rule over us but i know a country who is being ruled by a mass murderer.

No, my comment was a reply to the post I quoted.

And a random Pakistani on an internet forum calling Modi a murderer means zilch. Unfortunately for you the rest of the world doesn't think so and that is what matters.

 

[Mian]

No, my comment was a reply to the post I quoted.

And a random Pakistani on an internet forum calling Modi a murderer means zilch. Unfortunately for you the rest of the world doesn't think so and that is what matters.

unless our courts declare any of these guys terrorists your comments means nothing so live in your bubble stop commenting on our internal issues humara mulk, humari army and humari politics who are you to comment on it?

 

[Napa]

[MENTION=142162]Napa[/MENTION] we already have neighbors with growing economies, the best candidate being China. Look at their exports as compared to India's, not even talking of other HDIs.

If China is your hope for economic salvation, good luck to you.

Also economy is not everything, Nepal is the only other Hindu majority country in the world, but instead of helping a poor country of their own faith, they weaponize its ethnicities (the Madhesi's, originally from Bihar) to play its own geopolitical cards.

You completely missed my reasoning.

I did NOT say India will help Pakistan. I said Pakistan can help ITSELF economically by increasing security in its own country. Reducing tensions with India and curbing jihadists which the Army/ISI nurture to attack India (but can't have snakes in your backyard without yourself getting bitten as Hillary Clinton once said about Pakistan) will improve the security environment within Pakistan.

In fact, do you know the conditions of Dalits/Adivasis (the indigenous populations Aryans invaded) ? Who are "your own" ?

You are pretty much obsessed with this idea that Aryans invaded India. I have a news flash for you. Science tells us Indians invaded Finland. All Finns are haplogroup F, which originated in India. Actually, it is really Africans who invaded the entire world.

Indian Adivasi tribals like Chenchus show a similar level of R1a ancestry as modern Greeks and Iranians. Iyengar Brahmins have greater H ancestry compared to R1a ancestry. It doesn't matter who invaded who, stop trying to analyze the world based on ideas like "Aryans invaded India". What matters is where we are today.

India has different communities and there are powerful communities (like Pakistan's Sindhi Wadheras) who exploit weaker communities. However that is no reason for Pakistan to choose policies that benefit only its elite (Army etc) and harm its majority.

https://idsn.org/two-thirds-of-indias-dalits-are-poor/

How you help Pak if you can't help your own Dalits/Adivasis and Hindu neighbours, the Nepalis ?

Again, I did NOT say India will help Pakistan. I said Pakistan will help itself by focussing on economic development rather than a losing war with India.

More importantly, with Pakistan's TNT theory, compromise with Hindu-majority India, even more so with rising Hindu nationalism, is impossible, and if Imran Khan talks of peace with India many like me would stop supporting him too.

Enkidu, I have to say that this is the kind of crazy thinking which explains who Pakistan is so backward economically.

You are coming across as someone who thinks it is more important to fight with India than to develop economically backward Pakistan (something obvious from Pakistan's exports which are consistent with an underdeveloped nation).

http://www.worldstopexports.com/pakistans-top-10-exports/
http://www.worldstopexports.com/indias-top-10-exports/

Forget about fighting India, actually try to forget that India even exists. Then you can start thinking about how you can develop Pakistan economically.

If you falsely think Indian is the reason why Pakistan is economically backward, then sorry, but you will never develop.

 

[Napa]

Yeah thanks for that.

Well done ��

Thank you for the compliment. Your turn to say something sensible now.