Does playing in UAE really mean home advantage for Pakistan?

[Pakhs]

Before Pakistan stopped playing at home they had the best win/loss ratio than any other team at home. Even players like kamran akmal used to average 50 with the bat at home for Pakistan. I am of a opinion if Pakistan was still playing at true home (Pakistan) they would be very close to number 1 team at present.

I think until Pakistan start playing at home again they shouldn't be included in any rankings discussion.

 

[shariqnoor]

No they wouldn't. Pakistan lost a series to Zimbabwe. Anything achieved before or after that is by default rendered useless. The fact that Pakistan only lost 1 series in 26 years at home, that too to the GOAT West Indies team, should be discarded to the bin because Pakistan lost to Zimbabwe. This 2.545 W/L ratio is also pathetic because....yes you guessed it right - we lost to Zimbabwe.

 

[ARK Rafay]

Before Pakistan stopped playing at home they had the best win/loss ratio than any other team at home. Even players like kamran akmal used to average 50 with the bat at home for Pakistan. I am of a opinion if Pakistan was still playing at true home (Pakistan) they would be very close to number 1 team at present.

I think until Pakistan start playing at home again they shouldn't be included in any rankings discussion.

View attachment 83811

Obviously not that much advantage in contrast to Pakistan (Home). Players coming from clubs and streets of Pakistan and playing Domestic Cricket in Pakistan. But playing International Cricket in U.A.E. This makes a huge difference.

 

[Pakhs]

No they wouldn't. Pakistan lost a series to Zimbabwe. Anything achieved before or after that is by default rendered useless. The fact that Pakistan only lost 1 series in 26 years at home, that too to the GOAT West Indies team, should be discarded to the bin because Pakistan lost to Zimbabwe. This 2.545 W/L ratio is also pathetic because....yes you guessed it right - we lost to Zimbabwe.

That was a pretty good Zimbabwe side against a very unsettled and unfocused Pakistan side. My point is even Pakistan average players looked million dollars at home. One example is Kamran Akmal who was averaging 50 as a test match player and his career ended due to not being able to play in Pakistan (He continues to scored run in Pakistan at domestic level).

 

[Mamoon]

Our home form from 1990s onwards was utterly pathetic.

In the 1990s, we lost Test series to Sri Lanka, Australia, South Africa and Zimbabwe. In the 2000s, we lost Test series to England (2000), India (2004) and South Africa (2007), although we did beat England (2005), South Africa (2003) and India (2006).

Overall, we were embarrassingly rubbish in Pakistan in the last two decades and I think it is a more relevant time period than looking at our home record in the 70s and 80s in an era of dodgy home umpiring and rampant ball-tampering. Thus, our overall W/L ratio at home does not tell the full story.

Playing our Tests in the UAE has actually benefited us. We managed to draw quite a few games that we would have lost in Pakistan. The slow UAE pitches have successfully negated nearly all touring pacers who would have no doubt troubled us more on the relatively livelier wickets of Pakistan. The likes of England, Australia and South Africa would have undoubtedly won more games in Pakistan.

This also puts into perspective the tendency of our fans to belittle India's remarkable home record in the last 5 years because of doctored pitches. However, India can afford to doctor pitches because their batsmen are competent enough to see them through - if we doctor pitches, more often than not, it is going to backfire because you cannot trust Pakistani batting on challenging wickets against any bowling attack.

So keeping the above in mind, the answer to this thread is a yes.

 

[Mamoon]

That was a pretty good Zimbabwe side against a very unsettled and unfocused Pakistan side. My point is even Pakistan average players looked million dollars at home. One example is Kamran Akmal who was averaging 50 as a test match player and his career ended due to not being able to play in Pakistan (He continues to scored run in Pakistan at domestic level).

Kamran's career ended because of Sydney Test - it did not end because of not playing in the UAE. Had he played in the UAE, he would have scored runs there as well. Hafeez also averages 50+ in the UAE and Sarfraz probably averages close to that figure as well, and both are mediocre batsmen.

 

[the_outsider]

That was a pretty good Zimbabwe side against a very unsettled and unfocused Pakistan side.

Not really. It was an utterly mediocre Zimbabwe team. Their highest rated test batsman in 2014 was #35 in rankings and their highest rated bowler was #65.

 

[Mamoon]

Not really. It was an utterly mediocre Zimbabwe team. Their highest rated test batsman in 2014 was #35 in rankings and their highest rated bowler was #65.

He is talking about the 1998 Zimbabwean side that beat Pakistan. It was far better than any team Zimbabwe have put up in the 2000s, but they should not have beaten Pakistan in Pakistan. A highlight of Aamer Sohail's shoddy captaincy.

 

[enkidu_]

I think the UAE was in fact a blessing in disguise, the slow wickets fit Pak's post-double Ws bowling more, as our best Test bowlers have been spinners (Saeed Ajmal for few years; and more recently Yasir Shah), while we don't have good (=/= Wahab Riaz) express pacers anymore to trouble the opposition on flat roads.

In fact in the last few 4-5 years the only pacer to have traditional Pak average (-25) is Mohammad Abbas, a medium/swing bowler who's career just began basically and played the majority of his matches oustide the UAE, all others averaging +30 (Amir, etc).

All our recent emphatic wins in Tests in the last few years (whitewashing England in 2012, etc) would have been impossible in the conditions described in OP.

 

[Pakhs]

Not really. It was an utterly mediocre Zimbabwe team. Their highest rated test batsman in 2014 was #35 in rankings and their highest rated bowler was #65.

I dont remember Pak losing to Zimbabwe at home in 2014? They did lose a test match around that time but that was in Zimbabwe.

 

[the_outsider]

Before Pakistan stopped playing at home they had the best win/loss ratio than any other team at home. Even players like kamran akmal used to average 50 with the bat at home for Pakistan. I am of a opinion if Pakistan was still playing at true home (Pakistan) they would be very close to number 1 team at present.

I think until Pakistan start playing at home again they shouldn't be included in any rankings discussion.

View attachment 83811

Pakistan's home record in the 60s-80s was excellent. But since then it has been quite average.

In fact, Pakistan's record in the UAE since 2009 has actually been better (W/L of 2.16)
than their record in Pakistan in the last 9 odd years the team played there (W/L of 1.75).

So to keep saying that UAE is somehow handicapping the Pakistan team is nothing but an excuse. And to say that they shouldn't be included in ranking discussions is nothing but a cop-out.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

From 95 -07 I think Pakistan had a terrible record at home and lost more series than they won. Before that Pakistan were unbeatable at home. I think the UAE has been a better venue for Pakistan as the likes of misbah and co could pile on the runs and then watch the opposition wilt under the scoreboard pressure , heat and the turning ball. The next 5 tests against OZ and especially NZ will give a clearer picture.

 

[the_outsider]

I dont remember Pak losing to Zimbabwe at home in 2014? They did lose a test match around that time but that was in Zimbabwe.

I was referring to the 2nd test in Harare in 2013. Since it's the most recent and most relevant test match between the two sides.

I don't care about Pakistan losing to Zimbabwe in 1998. That doesn't take anything away from Pakistan.

But no team should lose to Zimbabwe of 2013, home or away.

 

[Pakhs]

I was referring to the 2nd test in Harare in 2013. Since it's the most recent and most relevant test match between the two sides.

I don't care about Pakistan losing to Zimbabwe in 1998. That doesn't take anything away from Pakistan.

But no team should lose to Zimbabwe of 2013, home or away.

But we are only talking about Pak home performance relative to UAE. whatever happened elsewhere doesnt matter good or bad. I still think given Pak win/lose ratio is better than any other team at home given a long enough span means playing in Pakistan would be better than playing in UAE. So UAE is not real home advantage.

 

[happydavy]

More than the rankings, it's pretty cruel on the players to not have the opportunity to play before their family and friends in home stadiums.

 

[the_outsider]

But we are only talking about Pak home performance relative to UAE. whatever happened elsewhere doesnt matter good or bad. I still think given Pak win/lose ratio is better than any other team at home given a long enough span means playing in Pakistan would be better than playing in UAE. So UAE is not real home advantage.

But it doesn't make sense to club in all eras of performances together. It never does. I always encourage the use of statistics for any discussion but the stats have to be relevant as well.

Teams evolve. The entire game has evolved.

The Pakistan team that was so strong at home had multiple ATGs in Imran, Abbas, Qadir, Wasim, Waqar and other world class players like Miandad, Anwar, Inzi, Saqlain, all spread throughout the 70s to 90s. They would have won whether they played in Pakistan or the UAE.

Can you honestly say that the performance of that team can be compared directly with the performance of the current Pakistan team? Apart from YK, Yousuf and Shoaib, Pakistan hasn't had a single world class player in the 2000s.

The difference in W/L ratio you see in Pakistan and UAE is not due to the venue. It is due to the difference in quality of players.

 

[Pakhs]

But it doesn't make sense to club in all eras of performances together. It never does. I always encourage the use of statistics for any discussion but the stats have to be relevant as well.

Teams evolve. The entire game has evolved.

The Pakistan team that was so strong at home had multiple ATGs in Imran, Abbas, Qadir, Wasim, Waqar and other world class players like Miandad, Anwar, Inzi, Saqlain, all spread throughout the 70s to 90s. They would have won whether they played in Pakistan or the UAE.

Can you honestly say that the performance of that team can be compared directly with the performance of the current Pakistan team? Apart from YK, Yousuf and Shoaib, Pakistan hasn't had a single world class player in the 2000s.

The difference in W/L ratio you see in Pakistan and UAE is not due to the venue. It is due to the difference in quality of players.

I am a believer in things evening out over a long enough time period. There is no good reason to believe that Pakistan wouldn't have continued there dominance at home. Yes there would be ups and downs but over all they would maintain their dominance. The players you mentioned all had greater records at home than away including UAE. Pakistan would always find player good enough to play at Lahore and Karachi etc.

 

[Darkrai]

No. Because Pakistani youngsters do not grow up playing in UAE, they grow up playing in Pakistan.

 

[MMHS]

NO, it's definitely not home advantage. But, I guess it's better than playing in PAK, where everything including wicket is against home team.

I kept saying that PAK's No. 1 ranking in Test is only because of playing in UAE - at least wickets denied both teams, but there is enough time for the dominant side (most cases PAK) to force a result. The slow burning tactics Misbah used in UAE, I can bet most of his wins would have ended in lame draws in PAK, with home side dominating, just running out of time to force a result.

I can explain the situation perfectly. In PAK, most places, it's impossible to play more than 5.5 hours in winter, that's considering no fog - add slow over rate and time wasting, we are basically talking about 350-370 overs Test max. That's just not enough time to force a result on decent wicket, unless other side is in suicide mood. Add to that slowness of wickets, and dead surface (it doesn't break in PAK like IND, just gets slower & lower, spinners hardly can do anything if batsmen are in dead bat mood), crowd disturbance, fog, smog, terrorist attack .......... it'll be miracle if a Test on decent wicket ends in direct result. Other solution is there, which they tried sometimes for devastating effect - make the wickets a mine field, where more or less 300 overs are enough for a result, just like recent QeA style wickets. Result, that takes the home advantage out - at home PAK is playing on alien condition.

I can categorically prove this from history. That ZIM series was lost in 1st Test, on a shockingly green wicket & PAK being put in (some Mabwanga took 6-7 wickets ) - next 2 were severely interrupted by fog. ENG 2001, on absolute rubbish, PAK dominated an ENG side which should have lost 3-0, in 1st 2 Tests, Poms kicked their way to survive 370-380 overs Test. Last one was a 450 overs Test, and they had one good day - won in under street light. SAF 1996, 1st 2 Tests, home side was in better position, but ran out of time; 3rd Test had to be played on a greener top that St Georges Park, SAF won in. It's no surprise that from 1990 to 2005, PAK actually lost 3 series at home to SRL, one against ZIM, should have lost one Test against BD of 2002, barring an outstanding innings (& something else, Latif can tell better), lost a series against Poms in 2000 (should have won the Faisalabad Test 2004-05 as well to make it 3-0, it had ~400 overs in total), lost a series to SAF, AUS, and failed to beat K Srikkant's IND in 1989. Should have lost the SRL series in 1990-91 as well - won by a whisker with other 2 Tests ending in draw, and even in 1994, ZIM got away with 1 draw and loss by the edge of ear.

PAK is the worst place to play Test cricket, more so for a team like PAK, under PCB management. I should mention this - PAK's last home series was against SRL in 2009. Before that series, Intekhab threatened SRL with pace & bounce .... 1.5 Tests had score card like 650, 765/5d, 170/4, 650/6d, 115/0 (brash fire) ..... it cost, what could have been an excellent International career for Sohail Khan. Unless there is enough changes in usual rubbish moods operandi, it's better to stick in UAE, which is the 2nd worst venue in world for PTC.

 

[Pakhs]

NO, it's definitely not home advantage. But, I guess it's better than playing in PAK, where everything including wicket is against home team.

I kept saying that PAK's No. 1 ranking in Test is only because of playing in UAE - at least wickets denied both teams, but there is enough time for the dominant side (most cases PAK) to force a result. The slow burning tactics Misbah used in UAE, I can bet most of his wins would have ended in lame draws in PAK, with home side dominating, just running out of time to force a result.

I can explain the situation perfectly. In PAK, most places, it's impossible to play more than 5.5 hours in winter, that's considering no fog - add slow over rate and time wasting, we are basically talking about 350-370 overs Test max. That's just not enough time to force a result on decent wicket, unless other side is in suicide mood. Add to that slowness of wickets, and dead surface (it doesn't break in PAK like IND, just gets slower & lower, spinners hardly can do anything if batsmen are in dead bat mood), crowd disturbance, fog, smog, terrorist attack .......... it'll be miracle if a Test on decent wicket ends in direct result. Other solution is there, which they tried sometimes for devastating effect - make the wickets a mine field, where more or less 300 overs are enough for a result, just like recent QeA style wickets. Result, that takes the home advantage out - at home PAK is playing on alien condition.

I can categorically prove this from history. That ZIM series was lost in 1st Test, on a shockingly green wicket & PAK being put in (some Mabwanga took 6-7 wickets ) - next 2 were severely interrupted by fog. ENG 2001, on absolute rubbish, PAK dominated an ENG side which should have lost 3-0, in 1st 2 Tests, Poms kicked their way to survive 370-380 overs Test. Last one was a 450 overs Test, and they had one good day - won in under street light. SAF 1996, 1st 2 Tests, home side was in better position, but ran out of time; 3rd Test had to be played on a greener top that St Georges Park, SAF won in. It's no surprise that from 1990 to 2005, PAK actually lost 3 series at home to SRL, one against ZIM, should have lost one Test against BD of 2002, barring an outstanding innings (& something else, Latif can tell better), lost a series against Poms in 2000 (should have won the Faisalabad Test 2004-05 as well to make it 3-0, it had ~400 overs in total), lost a series to SAF, AUS, and failed to beat K Srikkant's IND in 1989. Should have lost the SRL series in 1990-91 as well - won by a whisker with other 2 Tests ending in draw, and even in 1994, ZIM got away with 1 draw and loss by the edge of ear.

PAK is the worst place to play Test cricket, more so for a team like PAK, under PCB management. I should mention this - PAK's last home series was against SRL in 2009. Before that series, Intekhab threatened SRL with pace & bounce .... 1.5 Tests had score card like 650, 765/5d, 170/4, 650/6d, 115/0 (brash fire) ..... it cost, what could have been an excellent International career for Sohail Khan. Unless there is enough changes in usual rubbish moods operandi, it's better to stick in UAE, which is the 2nd worst venue in world for PTC.

All this maybe true but stats say despite all of that Pak at home is the most difficult team to beat.

 

[Buffet]

The last 10-15 years of Pakistan's record in Pakistan before UAE came in picture,


Pakistan in Pakistan - lost series

1995 - Lost against SL
1997 - Lost against SA
1998 - Lost against Aus
1998 - Lost against Zim
2000 - Lost against SL
2000 - Lost against Eng
2004 - Lost against Ind
2007 - Lost against SA

 

[Buffet]

All this maybe true but stats say despite all of that Pak at home is the most difficult team to beat.

That was true before 1995. Not true after that.

 

[Buffet]

All this maybe true but stats say despite all of that Pak at home is the most difficult team to beat.

Stats after 1995 at home for all teams,



As I said earlier, Pakistan was doing great at home before 1995, but not after that.

 

[MMHS]

The last 10-15 years of Pakistan's record in Pakistan before UAE came in picture,


Pakistan in Pakistan - lost series

1995 - Lost against SL
1997 - Lost against SA
1998 - Lost against Aus
1998 - Lost against Zim
2000 - Lost against SL
2000 - Lost against Eng
2004 - Lost against Ind
2007 - Lost against SA

Add one Asia Cup game against SRL at Lahore, lost by 6 wickets and Sanga had a double (Sami probably a hattrick). Also, in history of 150 years Test cricket, only 2 teams have lost 3 Test home series from 1-0 advantage - ZIM against PAK in 1994, and the other one of course Rambo Raja's PAK, also in 1994 - that too after winning 1st Test by innings.

Absolute shambolic home performance, considering that AUS side played 2002 series in UAE & didn't play at all in 2006-07.

 

[the_outsider]

The last 10-15 years of Pakistan's record in Pakistan before UAE came in picture,


Pakistan in Pakistan - lost series

1995 - Lost against SL
1997 - Lost against SA
1998 - Lost against Aus
1998 - Lost against Zim
2000 - Lost against SL
2000 - Lost against Eng
2004 - Lost against Ind
2007 - Lost against SA

Stats after 1995 at home for all teams,

View attachment 83812

As I said earlier, Pakistan was doing great at home before 1995, but not after that.

[MENTION=142176]Pakhs[/MENTION] I think these stats would also indicate that it was the difference in team personnel and quality of players that has brought about the chance in W/L ratio.

Till 90s, Pak had great players and ATGs in the team so they won.

The teams since then have not had players of the calibre of Wasim, Waqar, Imran, Abbas, etc.

It has very little to do with the hosting country.

 

[Ab Fan]

Actually, Pakistan has been helped by playing their home games in UAE because in last 7-8 years, this team was carried by Younis Khan and Misbah-ul-haq and Younis batting was picture perfect to slow and dusty UAE conditions where pacers can be restricted due the slowness of the pitch while against spin, he himself was the master of the game.

That is one reason why Pakistan managed not to lose a single test series in UAE till UAE khan eventually decided to retire. Younis single- handedly carried the weak Pakistani team for years.

I am not sure of how Pakistan's performance will go in the upcoming few years because they dont have a master batsmen of spin for UAE conditions at this point.

 

[Savak]

Lol, even as spectators we have serious burnout seeing the Pakistani team play in UAE all the time.

 

[Savak]

Pakistani players like any players around the world love the ball coming on to the bat, unfortunately the players are so used to playing on slow grinding wickets, they struggle with batting confidence and shot making on fast wickets now.

Pakistani domestic wickets unfortunately in the last 10 years have been even worse than UAE wickets which explains why we have struggled to produce quality batsmen

 

[Pakhs]

[MENTION=142176]Pakhs[/MENTION] I think these stats would also indicate that it was the difference in team personnel and quality of players that has brought about the chance in W/L ratio.

Till 90s, Pak had great players and ATGs in the team so they won.

The teams since then have not had players of the calibre of Wasim, Waqar, Imran, Abbas, etc.

It has very little to do with the hosting country.

This seems like a valid argument, But I think Pak for some reason had a very unstable time in test cricket since 1995 onward but now that the team is settling down and seem to gel together playing at home will help the current set of players.

 

[Markhor]

The Pakistan Test team declined after 1994 with so many captaincy and personnel changes making us a very inconsistent team.

The Pakistan team of the 2010s has been more solid and given how poor teams are touring nowadays, we would've had a better home record.

Yes UAE has helped to neutralise opposition pacers and allow our batsmen to target weaker opposition spinners. But the slow nature of the surfaces encourages an attritional style of batting, inhibiting the sort of free flowing strokeplay many Pakistani batsmen were once known for. Also, our players don't grow up on these surfaces so our youngsters have to acclimatise to conditions like the tourists do.

So there's advantages and disadvantages to UAE as a "home" venue.

 

[Last Monetarist]

I think there's also the fact that there were a lot of off-field distractions which led to certain players underperform on occasion. [MENTION=79064]MMHS[/MENTION] is absolutely correct that the pitches and the weather certainly didn't help Pakistan, who would dominate opposition teams and throw away the series amidst bouts of madness.

For example, we had to chase 140 against SA at Faisalabad and threw away our advantage by playing loose strokes, or in some cases being caught at deep midwicket off Pat Symcox. It was shoddy batting of the highest category. Or similarly, during the first test of the series against Australia the following year at Rawalpindi, we lost the series before tea on Day 1 as we somehow contrived to be 8 down for less than 150 on a batting pitch.

There are many examples when the team's unprofessionalism and blatant disregard for test cricket embarrassed the fans. The pathetic part is that the team was full of talented batsmen, and of course some ATG bowlers. In my view, it is one of the darkest periods in our cricket history.

 

[Hasan123]

[MENTION=53290]Markhor[/MENTION] has summed it up well. Playing in UAE is like playing on typical QEA wickets at times.

 

[MMHS]

I think there's also the fact that there were a lot of off-field distractions which led to certain players underperform on occasion. [MENTION=79064]MMHS[/MENTION] is absolutely correct that the pitches and the weather certainly didn't help Pakistan, who would dominate opposition teams and throw away the series amidst bouts of madness.

For example, we had to chase 140 against SA at Faisalabad and threw away our advantage by playing loose strokes, or in some cases being caught at deep midwicket off Pat Symcox. It was shoddy batting of the highest category. Or similarly, during the first test of the series against Australia the following year at Rawalpindi, we lost the series before tea on Day 1 as we somehow contrived to be 8 down for less than 150 on a batting pitch.

There are many examples when the team's unprofessionalism and blatant disregard for test cricket embarrassed the fans. The pathetic part is that the team was full of talented batsmen, and of course some ATG bowlers. In my view, it is one of the darkest periods in our cricket history.

Before 1990s, for 2 decades, PCT was much better than their home record. Yes, they didn't lose many at home (in fact never at Karachi before WY's team), but didn't win many either, because of the factors I mentioned. Before 1990s, Test cricket didn't produced so many direct W/L results, therefore hardly anyone bothered about the number of wins, it was all about Series; but results like 1-0 against SRL (91), 0-0 against IND (89), 0-0 against IND (1983), 0-0 against WIN (74), 2-0 against SRL (82), 1-0 against ENG (83, 88), 1-0 against AUS (79, 88, 94), 2-0 against ZIM (93) ..... even 3-0 against IND (82, 6 Test series), were poor results. Check the score cards, majority games were dominated by PAK at home, visitors just got away with ~75 overs/day Test, when in ENG/AUS, they used to play 96 overs/Day minimum.

When I explained this few years back, most people didn't realize the impact - you start a Test match with minimum 450 overs scheduled and it can end in 3 days, because team (s) behind after 1st day often know that either way they'll lose, so they play positively, and try to make a come back ... start same Test knowing that maximum you can play is 360 overs, it's a complete different ball game - side slightly behind will go to defensive tactics & time wasting from 1st day Tea; because now they know, there is not enough time for them to make a come back (simple, concede 100 runs lead, you'll hardly have time enough to post 250+ target in a 360 overs game), rather they try to bail out a boring draw. Make Test cricket 500+ overs game, I can bet, games will be played more positively - result might come in 3 days or 15th session, but teams will play to win, not to pass time.

I used to see PCB arranging Karachi/Hyderabad Test in OCT-NOV, then Lahore, Peshwar, Sialkot, Rawalpindi Tests in DEC-JAN .... and in their planning, they considered game'll continue till 5:30PM (after Magrib), without flood light....... One buzurg (won't name), came with a brilliant idea of differing Tea by 30 minutes, ta ke, jayada se jayada overs achhi roshni ke wakt khela jaye........ and the guy in commi box didn't have the guts or clue to ask him - in a 7 hours scheduled playing day (6 hours play + lunch & tea) - keya fayada differing Tea by 30 minutes, when we are losing 20 overs every day before or after Tea.....

Time has changed from that era and these days hardly anyone values a hard fought tight draw - hence, what I believe is if Test cricket is brought back to PAK under usual PCB planning, it'll be worst advertisement for Test cricket. Unless, it's made sure that a Test game has enough overs for a result, hosting Test in PAK isn't a good idea. 2nd option is even worse - on a soggy green top, to ensure result in 300 overs, PAK'll be sitting duck even against Post Mughabe's ZIM (they did lose one against Mughabe's ZIM on such wickets against Mofu and Sibanda...). 1st tactics on low scoring, under prepared track is to play aggressively and put some runs on board - IND does that brilliantly, SRL does that at home, even the 2 Tests we won against AUS & ENG, boys maintained a 4+ RR ......on such wickets, PAK with Azhar Ali as batting leader, will score 170 in 85 overs, then 161 in 80 ...........

I think, I have written 100+ times - best wicket for a team like PAK is the Oval wicket - last Test there ended after 435 overs, and what a Test it was ......... it should be an eye opener, why PAK playing Test at home isn't a good idea for them.

 

[Last Monetarist]

Before 1990s, for 2 decades, PCT was much better than their home record. Yes, they didn't lose many at home (in fact never at Karachi before WY's team), but didn't win many either, because of the factors I mentioned. Before 1990s, Test cricket didn't produced so many direct W/L results, therefore hardly anyone bothered about the number of wins, it was all about Series; but results like 1-0 against SRL (91), 0-0 against IND (89), 0-0 against IND (1983), 0-0 against WIN (74), 2-0 against SRL (82), 1-0 against ENG (83, 88), 1-0 against AUS (79, 88, 94), 2-0 against ZIM (93) ..... even 3-0 against IND (82, 6 Test series), were poor results. Check the score cards, majority games were dominated by PAK at home, visitors just got away with ~75 overs/day Test, when in ENG/AUS, they used to play 96 overs/Day minimum.

When I explained this few years back, most people didn't realize the impact - you start a Test match with minimum 450 overs scheduled and it can end in 3 days, because team (s) behind after 1st day often know that either way they'll lose, so they play positively, and try to make a come back ... start same Test knowing that maximum you can play is 360 overs, it's a complete different ball game - side slightly behind will go to defensive tactics & time wasting from 1st day Tea; because now they know, there is not enough time for them to make a come back (simple, concede 100 runs lead, you'll hardly have time enough to post 250+ target in a 360 overs game), rather they try to bail out a boring draw. Make Test cricket 500+ overs game, I can bet, games will be played more positively - result might come in 3 days or 15th session, but teams will play to win, not to pass time.

I used to see PCB arranging Karachi/Hyderabad Test in OCT-NOV, then Lahore, Peshwar, Sialkot, Rawalpindi Tests in DEC-JAN .... and in their planning, they considered game'll continue till 5:30PM (after Magrib), without flood light....... One buzurg (won't name), came with a brilliant idea of differing Tea by 30 minutes, ta ke, jayada se jayada overs achhi roshni ke wakt khela jaye........ and the guy in commi box didn't have the guts or clue to ask him - in a 7 hours scheduled playing day (6 hours play + lunch & tea) - keya fayada differing Tea by 30 minutes, when we are losing 20 overs every day before or after Tea.....

Time has changed from that era and these days hardly anyone values a hard fought tight draw - hence, what I believe is if Test cricket is brought back to PAK under usual PCB planning, it'll be worst advertisement for Test cricket. Unless, it's made sure that a Test game has enough overs for a result, hosting Test in PAK isn't a good idea. 2nd option is even worse - on a soggy green top, to ensure result in 300 overs, PAK'll be sitting duck even against Post Mughabe's ZIM (they did lose one against Mughabe's ZIM on such wickets against Mofu and Sibanda...). 1st tactics on low scoring, under prepared track is to play aggressively and put some runs on board - IND does that brilliantly, SRL does that at home, even the 2 Tests we won against AUS & ENG, boys maintained a 4+ RR ......on such wickets, PAK with Azhar Ali as batting leader, will score 170 in 85 overs, then 161 in 80 ...........

I think, I have written 100+ times - best wicket for a team like PAK is the Oval wicket - last Test there ended after 435 overs, and what a Test it was ......... it should be an eye opener, why PAK playing Test at home isn't a good idea for them.

I agree with everything. I remember for the 2000 series against England, the PCB scheduled 83-over days as they knew that the sun would set around 16h30 in late November, however, no one saw sense to start play half an hour earlier in the morning at 9h30 when the sun was already blazing. The upshot was we barely got 75 overs in as the light used to fade around 16h. India used to suffer the same problem during the nineties but they eventually started play around 9h30 in the morning themselves.

Regarding the pitches, I think the best pitches ever produced in Pakistan were for the South African tour to Pakistan in October 2003 in Lahore and Faisalabad. Genuinely good test wickets which assisted the fast bowlers for the first two days, flattened out on Day 3, and started turning on Days 4 and 5. Consequently we had two very competitive test matches.

 

[MMHS]

I agree with everything. I remember for the 2000 series against England, the PCB scheduled 83-over days as they knew that the sun would set around 16h30 in late November, however, no one saw sense to start play half an hour earlier in the morning at 9h30 when the sun was already blazing. The upshot was we barely got 75 overs in as the light used to fade around 16h. India used to suffer the same problem during the nineties but they eventually started play around 9h30 in the morning themselves.

Regarding the pitches, I think the best pitches ever produced in Pakistan were for the South African tour to Pakistan in October 2003 in Lahore and Faisalabad. Genuinely good test wickets which assisted the fast bowlers for the first two days, flattened out on Day 3, and started turning on Days 4 and 5. Consequently we had two very competitive test matches.

I am sure, that time around 2001-2002, Gen. Zia brought a pro curator (Atkinson probably) for PAK wickets and he prepared some fantastic wickets, not only SAF series, but the IND series as well similar time. Zia was an Army Sr. officer during Marshall Law, therefore he kicked out some incompetent people enjoying pay cheque for doing rubbish job - once he left, one by one those suckers came back.

 

[Chokli]

UAE is killing our cricket

 

[MMHS]

UAE is killing our cricket

What are other options? PAK’s best alternate “home” could have been Bangladesh, but PCB never tried that and now it’s impossible. I do belive there are enough off the field “fringe” benefits for PCB officials to stick with that stinky place, otherwise there is absolutely no reason why...... It’s been 10+ years, enough time to find couple of alternatives.

 

[Bigbb]

What are other options? PAK’s best alternate “home” could have been Bangladesh, but PCB never tried that and now it’s impossible. I do belive there are enough off the field “fringe” benefits for PCB officials to stick with that stinky place, otherwise there is absolutely no reason why...... It’s been 10+ years, enough time to find couple of alternatives.

I'm sorry but Bangladesh is one of the worst places to play cricket in. The pitches, the grounds and the atmosphere for non-bangla games are extremely poor.
I'd take UAE if the other option is Bangladesh.

 

[Chokli]

I'm sorry but Bangladesh is one of the worst places to play cricket in. The pitches, the grounds and the atmosphere for non-bangla games are extremely poor.
I'd take UAE if the other option is Bangladesh.

That's not true at all

 

[Bigbb]

That's not true at all

Just my opinion.

 

[Madplayer]

Bump.

Playing on these pitches has also contributed to Pakistan's downfall.

 

[Kianig89]

Yes lets.blame.on.everything lack.of crowds in.UAE is also.a reason for downfall

 

[MenInG]

NOTTINGHAM: Former Pakistan captain Wasim Akram on Friday lashed out at Pakistan’s spineless batting display against the West Indies at Trent Bridge in their opening World Cup match and said playing on flat wickets for years in the UAE has not served any purpose.

Talking to a private TV channel after the team’s defeat, Wasim said: “Pakistan batting was very poor today. We have been playing on flat wickets of Sharjah and Dubai for years and that is why we struggle when we get short balls on wickets like this. Today the batting shortcomings were totally exposed. Everyone has seen the match and people now know exactly where to bowl to Pakistani batsmen.

“After losing two initial wickets, players had to stay on the wicket but they couldn’t. They must learn how to stay on the wicket and see off the ball. In such conditions, you have to survive the initial overs,” the former captain highlighted.

Wasim insisted Pakistan would really have to work hard to make a comeback, adding that the team must bounce back in the tournament. Replying to a question, he said that he was happy to see Amir taking wickets and his return to form was a good sign for the team.

https://www.dawn.com/news/1485823/playing-on-flat-wickets-in-uae-has-hurt-pakistan-wasim-akram