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England and the Spirit of Cricket

RahimA

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What is it about England and the spirit of cricket. Why do they believe that everyone has to play within this mythical boundary but it doesn't apply to them.

Most Pakistani fans on here will remember when Steve Harmison threw the ball at Inzi in 2005 in his follow through and when Inzi jumped to evade the ball and it hit the stumps the England players appealed for a run out and it was upheld - Darryl Hair was the umpire (no surprises there) - but surely England should have withdrawn the appeal as Inzi was not trying to gain an advantage - unlike yesterday!

There was obviously the Stuart Broad not walking in the test match vs Australia when he knew he clearly nicked it and should have been given out (but this is a different topic and enough has been written about this and I don't want to begin a discussion about the merits of walking).

There was the Ian Bell case when India last toured and the England camp moaned again about a decision when it basically came down to Bell not knowing the rules.

Paul Collingwood appealing against New Zealand following a collision between batsmen and bowler and not withdrawing his appeal when asked by the umpires. Yes, he did say he regretted the incident after the game but in the middle of the pitch during a game when tensions are running high this situation showed how difficult it is to make a decision in a split second.

I'm sure there are countless other examples which fellow readers will come up but why do England always seem to moan about these decisions when it goes against them but are happy to put it down to the 'heat of the moment' when one of their own transgresses.

It is just sour grapes by England that when they look to step over the line as Cook calls it and get called out by opposing teams then it is unfair but they can do what they like when they like!
 
Most Pakistani fans on here will remember when Steve Harmison threw the ball at Inzi in 2005 in his follow through and when Inzi jumped to evade the ball and it hit the stumps the England players appealed for a run out and it was upheld - Darryl Hair was the umpire (no surprises there) - but surely England should have withdrawn the appeal as Inzi was not trying to gain an advantage - unlike yesterday!

Most neutral fans remember Harmison threw the ball at the stumps and run Inzi out and it was the third umpire that gave it out, not Hair.
 
England fans need to get over it. SL were right in what they did, most of us would have done the same thing.
 
Also, anybody recall when that Colly didn't allow Grant Elliott to continue batting post a collision with some other bloke?
 
Also, anybody recall when that Colly didn't allow Grant Elliott to continue batting post a collision with some other bloke?
The spirit of the game argument only applies when it favors England :mv #justsayin #whingers
 
The spirit of the game argument only applies when it favors England :mv #justsayin #whingers

That's right. In turn when they toured NZ shortly after we got Collingwood splatted on the floor prompting an easy run-out, yet Dan allowed him to continue playing.

Of course, if we didn't do that there would have been a huge media storm with the Poms accusing us of ethical tampering or some such.
 
What is it about England and the spirit of cricket. Why do they believe that everyone has to play within this mythical boundary but it doesn't apply to them.

Who are "they" exactly? I don't hear the England team complaining about the Buttler run-out.
 
Most neutral fans remember Harmison threw the ball at the stumps and run Inzi out and it was the third umpire that gave it out, not Hair.
[MENTION=732]Gilly[/MENTION] Yes you are correct that the third umpire saw that Inzi had jumped out of his crease however it was Hair at square leg who referred the decision, why didn't Darryl Hair approach the captain and ask England to withdraw the appeal as was the case yesterday. Surely Hair as an umpire could see that it was an evasive move rather than an attempt to run or an overbalance where sometimes players fall out of the crease as they attempt to sweep spinners or step out of the crease to play the ball further forward. So in my eyes it was a decision by Hair with the technicality confirmed by the third umpire.

Maybe, I'm biased against Hair just like he was against sub-continental sides #just saying
 
Who are "they" exactly? I don't hear the England team complaining about the Buttler run-out.

This is the response from Alistair Cook - captain of England after the game yesterday. This has been lifted from the CricInfo website. For me this is a complaint against the action taken by the Sri Lankan side and Cook (and presumably his team) believe that this was unsporting conduct from Angelo Matthews and his side.

As I said earlier it's appears to be OK to ask for a run out after throwing a ball in the follow through and when an accidental collision occurs in the middle of the pitch as long as the decision favours England

Alastair Cook, the England captain, denounced the incident as "a pretty poor act" and suggested he would not have behaved in the same manner.

"I thought it was disappointing," Cook said. "There's a line and that line was crossed here. I've never seen it before in the game and I was pretty disappointed by it. As captain of your country, there are certain ways you want your team to operate. And obviously he is fine with it. He has said he will do it again.

"You don't know what you would do if you were put in that situation, in the heat of the moment, until you are. I'd like to think I wouldn't do it, but I suppose you just don't know.

"I haven't been in the situation, as captain of England, where I have had to make a 'spirit of cricket' call. Paul Collingwood had one a few years ago and admitted afterwards that, in the heat of the moment, he probably made a mistake.

"If he was properly trying to steal a single, I could possibly understand it. But he was half a yard out of his crease. It's pretty disappointing."
 
Inzi had not even jumped out of the crease his feet were in the air whilst still being well inside the crease trying to evade being hit by the ball thrown at full speed by Harmisson. The English media and the cricketers only complain about the spirit of the game when it suits them.
 
Alastair Cook, the England captain, denounced the incident as "a pretty poor act" and suggested he would not have behaved in the same manner.

Fair enough.

We will have to see how he reacts in a similar situation. Though in the test series I think if SL want to live by this particular sword, they can expect to die by it too.
 
To be fair to england in the inzi incident it was only way they could get him out as Inzi pretty much raped the england bowlers all series! ;)
 
I don't think we have to worry about Cook making an aggressive decision to try and win a game
 
To be fair to england in the inzi incident it was only way they could get him out as Inzi pretty much raped the england bowlers all series! ;)

Sorry brother, I know you didn't mean it that way, but using that R word casually misrepresents its gravity.
 
I don't think we have to worry about Cook making an aggressive decision to try and win a game

The quicker ECB gets rid of him as a captain of their ODI side, the better their chances will be in the coming WC.
 
This is a serious straw man argument. Who is 'England' and what are they complaining about? Or is this just a complex you have in your mind?
 
Don't forget about the number of times the England batsmen have clearly edged the ball to keeper but have not walked. Where is the spirit?
 
spirit of cricket and England..lol..never has existed and never will..its a myth that the English pretend to be the ever moral guardians of the game, but then introduce, bodyline, abusing umpires on the field, not walking when cleary nicking, appealing for things that most teams wouldn't and so forth. The hypocrisy is beyond funny now.
 
This is a serious straw man argument. Who is 'England' and what are they complaining about? Or is this just a complex you have in your mind?

You'll get used to it around here. An individual action or comment gets generalised into an entire team's actions over decades, and of all their fans since time began.

Sometimes I try to counter this process, but more often I just shake my head.

Don't let the negative attitudes in this place into your mind - you'll get depressed. There are plenty of thoughtful posters too.
 
I can't think of many international teams or even individuals that regularly play in the spirit of cricket. Only MS Dhoni's recall of Ian Bell qualifies from recent years. So I don't think any of us have room to comment here to be honest.
 
I can't think of many international teams or even individuals that regularly play in the spirit of cricket. Only MS Dhoni's recall of Ian Bell qualifies from recent years. So I don't think any of us have room to comment here to be honest.

KP, during IPL allowed another team to change a player after the toss, it was good in spirit of cricket
 
I can't think of many international teams or even individuals that regularly play in the spirit of cricket. Only MS Dhoni's recall of Ian Bell qualifies from recent years. So I don't think any of us have room to comment here to be honest.

We dropped Sachin five times in a WC semi final to help him get to his 100th 100, but he still couldn't do it.
 
I can't think of many international teams or even individuals that regularly play in the spirit of cricket. Only MS Dhoni's recall of Ian Bell qualifies from recent years. So I don't think any of us have room to comment here to be honest.

I don't believe any team can try and take the high ground over playing in the spirit of cricket. In Dhoni's example the only reason as to why Bell was recalled was due to discussions over the tea break - if there was not an extended break in play then Bell would not have been recalled.
 
I don't believe any team can try and take the high ground over playing in the spirit of cricket. In Dhoni's example the only reason as to why Bell was recalled was due to discussions over the tea break - if there was not an extended break in play then Bell would not have been recalled.

Very true. In the heat of the moment most men would succumb to their initial reactions and desires and that is to win the game at all costs.
 
Very true. In the heat of the moment most men would succumb to their initial reactions and desires and that is to win the game at all costs.

And this is why we know that bowlers will cross the 15 degree mark for that extra spin to win a match for their country.

Can't say I can blame them. If I got selected to play for Australia I'd push every single line to try and win a match.
 
And this is why we know that bowlers will cross the 15 degree mark for that extra spin to win a match for their country.

Can't say I can blame them. If I got selected to play for Australia I'd push every single line to try and win a match.

Or bite the ball in front of everyone.
 
Or bite the ball in front of everyone.

Every team has a specialist ball tamperer. Most are subtle because there is an unwritten acceptance of a certain level of tampering- as long as you don't get caught.

Afridi quite obviously was not the man Pakistan normally use.
 
As others have said england push the boundaries as much as any team going around, they aren't worse than anybody else by any means but cook is also in no position to be having a whinge about gamesmanship either.

I should add though that those on this forum acting like the majority of the english cricket media or english cricket fans are blaming the sri lankans for this must be reading different stuff to me.
 
Print a copy of this thread and send it to Cook. He is the biggest whinny cricketer. Shaking hands and cussing - he has no spirit of cricket in him. Sore loser. The media and ignorant fans feed of him. Pathetic.
 
This is a serious straw man argument. Who is 'England' and what are they complaining about? Or is this just a complex you have in your mind?

You'll get used to it around here. An individual action or comment gets generalised into an entire team's actions over decades, and of all their fans since time began.

Sometimes I try to counter this process, but more often I just shake my head.

Don't let the negative attitudes in this place into your mind - you'll get depressed. There are plenty of thoughtful posters too.

I'd like to start by saying that I'm not an internet troll and this is my first topic and conversation. The whole point of a forum like this is to air your opinion on the game and discuss what is happening within the game and controversial incidences are normally the best to talk about.

I consider England to be the team and management that play cricket and they are complaining that one of their players was wronged out of his wicket despite being warned on at least one occasion. I feel that when things do not go their way they like to have a moan about certain elements and about their opposition without looking at their own players and support staff. I lost count of the number of times the TV cameras used to pick up on Andy Flower visiting the umpires room when a decision went against England - why put undue pressure whilst the days play is going on.

OK, the examples I used were from a few years back but here are some of when Cook has been captain of England.

Stuart Broad not walking - as a captain who believes in fair play and the spirit of cricket he should have admonished Broad and said that England like to play the game in the right way and in the spirit so players will walk when they know they have nicked it

The same occurred yesterday when Joe Root knew he had gloved it and refused to walk - this is what Jonathan Agnew said in his BBC Sport article.

There is also the case of James Anderson threatening physical violence to an opposing player (George Bailey) during the tests against Australia. Again, I ask is this sporting behaviour and a way to take the moral high ground. Cook should have found out what Anderson said and in a press conference said that things are said in the middle but never should one player threaten another with physical violence. I know Clarke retorted back and was seen as the aggressor but that was only because he was picked up on the stump mic. Share Warne said that Anderson started it and there has been no denial of this from the England camp so it must be true.

This would only work if Cook believed in fair play and honesty so when he tries to get on his high horse and accuse other players of sportsmanship he should look at his own team and players and ask 'Are we whiter than white and do we play the game fairly?' - the answer of course is no so he should therefore not accuse other players or teams of unsporting gestures saying that we would never do something like that.

This beggers the questions of what Cook believes is right or wrong, he obviously feels that players under his charge cheating the umpires and the paying public is fair game and players threatening another player is condonable behaviour.

When in fact the England team does push the boundaries and cross the line when playing the game of cricket.

All teams cheat and try to get ahead of the game by pushing the boundaries when they can and if they get away with it they are non plussed ybut I believe that they shouldn't pick what is morally right and wrong and put others down when it is done against them as a team.
 
Tbh Cook had no grounds to say what he did (as his predecessors were not angels) and the English media are taking these out of proportion as usual.

Every team is guilty of it so crying about these matters is pointless.
 
Not sure WG Grace, the 'godfather' of english cricket played the game to the high standards expected in the modern era

Phil Tuffnell also used to play while constantly high on pot
 
where was the spirit of cricket when Cooks team was pissing on the pitch.
Rather see a player chew a cricket ball then start pissing on the pitches after winning
 
OP getting out his own biases based on selective proof.
Violates the spirit of logical argument by employing shallow demagoguery.
 
All he needed to do was reach out and slide his bat in.

He failed to do that countless number of times and had too many comical run outs. This was not an exception. That's what I was insinuating here.
 
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England allrounder David Willey has questioned Bhuvneshwar Kumar and Kuldeep Yadav's ploy of stopping right at the end of their delivery stride during the first T20I in Manchester, saying it wasn't 'necessarily in the spirit of cricket.' Twice in the 10th over, Kuldeep didn't complete his delivery after running in, finishing his run-up with what seemed like a 'Mankading' warning for the non-striker Alex Hales.

In the press conference ,KLRahul said Indian bowlers' 'decision' to stop and give a Mankaded type warning', questioning England batsmen's tendency to back up too far from the non-striker's end.
"And he [Kuldeep] didn't do anything which... you know you cannot do it as a bowler, you can run a batsman out, he [Hales] was taking few strides too many and it is a long boundary and if he gets that much start he can keep rotating the strike and keep getting two runs which will frustrate the bowler in return, so its only fair," he said.
 
Indian were unable to keep up with English spirit of cricket yesterday :Robert
 
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