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Fact-finding team publishes a report on Kashmir after spending 5 days; Modi govt. arresting children

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A fact-finding team spent 5 days in Kashmir after Article 370 was nullified. It says Modi led Govt is arresting children. The Union Press of Delhi refused to publish this report

Source: https://countercurrents.org/2019/08/kashmir-caged-fact-finding-report

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i read this on twitter but what i found is that the indians replying to the post had no sympathy whatsoever.

They were actually blaming the victims.

What really ****** me off was that they did raids at night to take the children but while doing so they molested the women.... Now put yourself in their boots what would you do if they did that to you?

India is doomed if they continue this.
 
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"Nahi bhai this must be fake news as well..... we will only believe it if the source is Hindustan Times or Times of India" - Indian cyber and joshila warriors
 
God knows what is happening in Kashmir at this very moment. Imagine what more than 600k of army personnel would be doing under the blanket of blackout. Also can you imagine that not all people wearing an army uniform would be an army personnel. I read somewhere that they are smuggling RSS goons under the disguise of army personnel to carry out atrocities in there.

All this curfew and blackout suggests only one thing to me, that India is definitely hiding something bad in there.
 
I was also reading somewhere that another fact finding team from US got their visa to Kashmir rejected 3 times by Indian Government. I wonder what facts they would also have uncovered.
 
While the points on arrest look true, there seems to be some massive political bias and confirmation bias as well, Baba Amte from NAPM would had been absolutely devastated to read such a biased political finding, how did Vimal Bhai even allow this?

Kashmir is caged but then how did they have conversation with Kashmiri girls in every village or migrants?

Liberals need to be smarter, I hope the conservatives don’t catch the logical fallacy here.

Expected much more from Kavita but again disappointed with CPI.
 
See the link below the same activists from the OP mentioned fact finding team were not allowed to share pics and videos they captured during their trip.

https://www.outlookindia.com/websit...-from-showing-videos-of-kashmir-unrest/336224

PS - the link is Indian

The point is arrests seem true, don’t think they will lie on that, but all other statements that they have produced here if you read em will realize are bias.

They should had stuck to arrests and this would be huge news, might not bother BJP fans but defn the middle ones would criticize the govn.
 
Fact finding mission of Kavita Krishnan and co.

They were kicked out of press club today for peddling inaccurate news.
 
i read this on twitter but what i found is that the indians replying to the post had no sympathy whatsoever.

They were actually blaming the victims.

What really ****** me off was that they did raids at night to take the children but while doing so they molested the women.... Now put yourself in their boots what would you do if they did that to you?

India is doomed if they continue this.

If its on twitter, it must be true.
 
Well yeah... this was expected.

Poor kids and women, may Allah give them sabr, ameen.

Wonder why the world isn’t seeing this and condemning these act of cowardice.
 
The soldier who marched up to the journalist’s doorstep to riddle him with buckshot must’ve been a particularly valorous, intrepid specimen. One hears they usually just stick the barrel of the pellet gun out of a hole in their vehicles and fire away.
 
Fact finding mission of Kavita Krishnan and co.

They were kicked out of press club today for peddling inaccurate news.

Can you let me know how for certainty you can say inaccurate news? I just want to know something that surely you know and I don't which is why you have stated as kind of fact this being inaccurate news.
 
If its on twitter, it must be true.

lol...it is a feeding frenzy out there on twitter and the net, of Pakistanis lapping up and believing any and every picture of 'atrocity' from anywhere in the world, being passed off as today's or yesterday's picture from Kashmir. Never mind that a picture has been debunked as coming from Palestine or Syria, on that very thread, when someone else loads up series of pictures from the original event showing clearly that it is a fake Kashmir pic. Even seemingly sensible Pakistanis will totally disregard that and keeping talking of going right away to sacrifice their own life for Jihad to liberate Kashmir brothers and sisters.

It is fascinating to look at the twitter feeds on Kashmir, and see for yourself how the Pakistani psyche is so easy to manipulate (in the name of 'Muslim genocide' or 'Jihad'). And if anyone is wondering why such a wonderful promising nation Pakistan, which at one point was so far ahead of India in every development metric, has since Zia-ul-Haq regressed to both intellectual and economic near bankruptcy, tweets on Kashmir offer live demonstration of this devolution.

You can see right there how seemingly sensible and educated Pakistanis, who despite being shown actual pictures that debunk the fake Kashmir atrocity pictures, still get agitated and right there talk of taking arms and going on Jihad immediately to defeat the Indian Army. No wonder 'non state actors' are worshipped like celebrities in Pakistan today.

Just go into any Kashmir thread and quietly watch the sequence. Someone puts a fake pic. Someone else comes up and says this pic just cannot be Kashmir because the shoulder patch of the cops is from Telangana/Hyderabad in South India and this pic is from a medical college students agitation in Telangana, where students obstructing traffic were being taken away few months ago.

Someone else comes and puts pics from that actual Telangana protest event corroborating that a fake pic is being circulated from that series as 'Kashmir girl being taken away by Indian Army for use as sex slave'. Yet, most Pakistanis (except maybe 1 in a hundred) will prefer to believe an obvious lie, that by now has become a huge chorus in twitter.

Even if a Kashmiri from abroad chimes in and says,'Guys I may not support what is happening in Kashmir, but this pic is totally fake', most Pakistanis by then disregard any rational thought because at that point they are already in a state of frenzy and in total Jihad mode :) to rescue this Kashmiri sister from Srinagar that is being taken away to be sold by the Army as a sex slave! 'Of what use is the Pakistan Army'...'Of what use is Imran Khan'...'Of what use is OIC Ummah'...'Dil ro raha hai yeh pic dekh kar, hum bebas hai, majboor hai, hamare hukumaranon ne chudiyaan pehen rakhi hai'...'Good Lord why have you left us Pakistanis alone in such pain, look at our Kashmiri sister being sold away here as sex slave by notorious Indian Army right before our eyes'...etc etc...heart breaking lament. Mind numbing delusion.

The landscape, the cops, the shoulder badge/patch of the cops, the girl in the picture, all clearly point to South India! And people are also pointing out that this is fake. None of that matters.

I always thought Indians were the biggest dramebaaz on the planet. I think we are actually in good company.
 
lol...it is a feeding frenzy out there on twitter and the net, of Pakistanis lapping up and believing any and every picture of 'atrocity' from anywhere in the world, being passed off as today's or yesterday's picture from Kashmir. Never mind that a picture has been debunked as coming from Palestine or Syria, on that very thread, when someone else loads up series of pictures from the original event showing clearly that it is a fake Kashmir pic. Even seemingly sensible Pakistanis will totally disregard that and keeping talking of going right away to sacrifice their own life for Jihad to liberate Kashmir brothers and sisters.

It is fascinating to look at the twitter feeds on Kashmir, and see for yourself how the Pakistani psyche is so easy to manipulate (in the name of 'Muslim genocide' or 'Jihad'). And if anyone is wondering why such a wonderful promising nation Pakistan, which at one point was so far ahead of India in every development metric, has since Zia-ul-Haq regressed to both intellectual and economic near bankruptcy, tweets on Kashmir offer live demonstration of this devolution.

You can see right there how seemingly sensible and educated Pakistanis, who despite being shown actual pictures that debunk the fake Kashmir atrocity pictures, still get agitated and right there talk of taking arms and going on Jihad immediately to defeat the Indian Army. No wonder 'non state actors' are worshipped like celebrities in Pakistan today.

Just go into any Kashmir thread and quietly watch the sequence. Someone puts a fake pic. Someone else comes up and says this pic just cannot be Kashmir because the shoulder patch of the cops is from Telangana/Hyderabad in South India and this pic is from a medical college students agitation in Telangana, where students obstructing traffic were being taken away few months ago.

Someone else comes and puts pics from that actual Telangana protest event corroborating that a fake pic is being circulated from that series as 'Kashmir girl being taken away by Indian Army for use as sex slave'. Yet, most Pakistanis (except maybe 1 in a hundred) will prefer to believe an obvious lie, that by now has become a huge chorus in twitter.

Even if a Kashmiri from abroad chimes in and says,'Guys I may not support what is happening in Kashmir, but this pic is totally fake', most Pakistanis by then disregard any rational thought because at that point they are already in a state of frenzy and in total Jihad mode :) to rescue this Kashmiri sister from Srinagar that is being taken away to be sold by the Army as a sex slave! 'Of what use is the Pakistan Army'...'Of what use is Imran Khan'...'Of what use is OIC Ummah'...'Dil ro raha hai yeh pic dekh kar, hum bebas hai, majboor hai, hamare hukumaranon ne chudiyaan pehen rakhi hai'...'Good Lord why have you left us Pakistanis alone in such pain, look at our Kashmiri sister being sold away here as sex slave by notorious Indian Army right before our eyes'...etc etc...heart breaking lament. Mind numbing delusion.

The landscape, the cops, the shoulder badge/patch of the cops, the girl in the picture, all clearly point to South India! And people are also pointing out that this is fake. None of that matters.

I always thought Indians were the biggest dramebaaz on the planet. I think we are actually in good company.

Not going to write an essay but ask a simple question here.

Why curfew/blackout? This is a golden opportunity for India to expose Pakistan's lies by opening Kashmir to the world, why don't they do that?
 
lol...it is a feeding frenzy out there on twitter and the net, of Pakistanis lapping up and believing any and every picture of 'atrocity' from anywhere in the world, being passed off as today's or yesterday's picture from Kashmir. Never mind that a picture has been debunked as coming from Palestine or Syria, on that very thread, when someone else loads up series of pictures from the original event showing clearly that it is a fake Kashmir pic. Even seemingly sensible Pakistanis will totally disregard that and keeping talking of going right away to sacrifice their own life for Jihad to liberate Kashmir brothers and sisters.

It is fascinating to look at the twitter feeds on Kashmir, and see for yourself how the Pakistani psyche is so easy to manipulate (in the name of 'Muslim genocide' or 'Jihad'). And if anyone is wondering why such a wonderful promising nation Pakistan, which at one point was so far ahead of India in every development metric, has since Zia-ul-Haq regressed to both intellectual and economic near bankruptcy, tweets on Kashmir offer live demonstration of this devolution.

You can see right there how seemingly sensible and educated Pakistanis, who despite being shown actual pictures that debunk the fake Kashmir atrocity pictures, still get agitated and right there talk of taking arms and going on Jihad immediately to defeat the Indian Army. No wonder 'non state actors' are worshipped like celebrities in Pakistan today.

Just go into any Kashmir thread and quietly watch the sequence. Someone puts a fake pic. Someone else comes up and says this pic just cannot be Kashmir because the shoulder patch of the cops is from Telangana/Hyderabad in South India and this pic is from a medical college students agitation in Telangana, where students obstructing traffic were being taken away few months ago.

Someone else comes and puts pics from that actual Telangana protest event corroborating that a fake pic is being circulated from that series as 'Kashmir girl being taken away by Indian Army for use as sex slave'. Yet, most Pakistanis (except maybe 1 in a hundred) will prefer to believe an obvious lie, that by now has become a huge chorus in twitter.

Even if a Kashmiri from abroad chimes in and says,'Guys I may not support what is happening in Kashmir, but this pic is totally fake', most Pakistanis by then disregard any rational thought because at that point they are already in a state of frenzy and in total Jihad mode :) to rescue this Kashmiri sister from Srinagar that is being taken away to be sold by the Army as a sex slave! 'Of what use is the Pakistan Army'...'Of what use is Imran Khan'...'Of what use is OIC Ummah'...'Dil ro raha hai yeh pic dekh kar, hum bebas hai, majboor hai, hamare hukumaranon ne chudiyaan pehen rakhi hai'...'Good Lord why have you left us Pakistanis alone in such pain, look at our Kashmiri sister being sold away here as sex slave by notorious Indian Army right before our eyes'...etc etc...heart breaking lament. Mind numbing delusion.

The landscape, the cops, the shoulder badge/patch of the cops, the girl in the picture, all clearly point to South India! And people are also pointing out that this is fake. None of that matters.

I always thought Indians were the biggest dramebaaz on the planet. I think we are actually in good company.

Implying that Pakistanis are gullible yet you choose to take the Indian media’s word on that Kashmir is ’peaceful’ atm. Oh the irony!

Come on, you know there are atrocities being committed, you just don’t want to admit to it.
 
While the points on arrest look true, there seems to be some massive political bias and confirmation bias as well, Baba Amte from NAPM would had been absolutely devastated to read such a biased political finding, how did Vimal Bhai even allow this?

Kashmir is caged but then how did they have conversation with Kashmiri girls in every village or migrants?

Liberals need to be smarter, I hope the conservatives don’t catch the logical fallacy here.

Expected much more from Kavita but again disappointed with CPI.

Lol!! Kavitha and the communists!! Apparently it's all locked down but there is "unanimous" anger. Which one is it? Is it locked down or did you speak to majority of kashmiris to call it "unanimous"?

Most of the stuff is better than many expected. I thought millions of kashmiris would throng the streets braving curfiew "like" conditions and get blinded or killed leaving this entire saga a humiliating and irreversible shame for India. However, Kashmiris are smarter than I thought. They chose life over delusion. Indian govt probably knew about this and made the move.
 
In the coming days, GOI and their magnificent propaganda machine will release fake videos and pics from Afghanistan or Syria and dangle them in front of the world. Once the communists and ultra liberals fall for it, which they always do, a GOI statement will discredit them. A key part of propaganda warfare.
 
Not going to write an essay but ask a simple question here.

Why curfew/blackout? This is a golden opportunity for India to expose Pakistan's lies by opening Kashmir to the world, why don't they do that?

India wants Pakistan to lose it. Have you seen Imran's speech? It was shambles. He ranted about Nazi, Dalit, Kashmir and so on and on with no coherence. There is absolutely nothing he can do and the usually suave and articulate Imran was seemingly giving an Indian independence speech. That's what happens when the obsession doesn't have a release. One loses it in front of the world
 
India wants Pakistan to lose it. Have you seen Imran's speech? It was shambles. He ranted about Nazi, Dalit, Kashmir and so on and on with no coherence. There is absolutely nothing he can do and the usually suave and articulate Imran was seemingly giving an Indian independence speech. That's what happens when the obsession doesn't have a release. One loses it in front of the world

Suddenly pakistanis have found love for Dalits. The dalits voted overwhelmingly for Modi.
 
IF these Indians were born in Germany and had Hitler as there leader, i swear these posters would had been supporting hitler for what he was doing to jews.

They would had given reasons like, oh the jews didnt help there country in the war effrot now they should pay for it bla bla bla.

We are true Arain race,

We are not killing the jews, we are just moving them to madagascar.
 
Suddenly pakistanis have found love for Dalits. The dalits voted overwhelmingly for Modi.

The idea is right. They need to drag India into the news somehow. But the execution reeks of desperation to the point of ridicule. The hyperboles are actually muting the Kashmir rhetoric. No body is even caring to respond to this
 
While the points on arrest look true, there seems to be some massive political bias and confirmation bias as well, Baba Amte from NAPM would had been absolutely devastated to read such a biased political finding, how did Vimal Bhai even allow this?

Kashmir is caged but then how did they have conversation with Kashmiri girls in every village or migrants?

Liberals need to be smarter, I hope the conservatives don’t catch the logical fallacy here.

Expected much more from Kavita but again disappointed with CPI.

It's not CPI, it is CPI (ML). AKA Naxals.

Naxals do not have any accountability as they will not stand for elections. Their position is that they are Marxist Leninists so they know better. While much of the report is true, you take Naxals seriously at your own peril.
 
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The idea is right. They need to drag India into the news somehow. But the execution reeks of desperation to the point of ridicule. The hyperboles are actually muting the Kashmir rhetoric. No body is even caring to respond to this

No ones caring to respond to this but UNSC will be discussing Kashmir for the first time in 50+ years. Big LOL!!
 
Why even bother sending Kavita to J&K. I am sure she got the email from Zaid in Delhi
 
No ones caring to respond to this but UNSC will be discussing Kashmir for the first time in 50+ years. Big LOL!!

That would be even more frustrating when they discuss and do nothing. See, the key to PR war is to keep it boiling. One doesn't put all the eggs in the basket, add a few tomatoes that don't belong in the basket right away. It should be escalated slowly and progressively so that the collective conscious has a change of heart gradually. There's a "closed" UNSC meeting proposed by China. The Polish incharge indicated he needs to speak to other members before setting one up. They will talk about Hong Kong if at all this meeting is actually convened. What will China say? As I said, I think this was a diplomatic blunder by Pakistan. Now where will they go if UNSC does nothing. Are they going to condemn Modi and India because he is the reincarnation of Hitler? Then why say it? By going to the extremes with all the hyperboles they dug a big hole which they won't be able to come out of. India wants to frustrate Pak to the point of Pak resorting to old ways of Jihadi freedom. We know it never works but will help India support their case. World will react to that. That will frustrate Pak more. See that's the game. That's why Indians aren't even saying a word right now.
 
Any nonsenical report is bound to make news.What can we expect from opposition when their whole mission is make govt look bad.
 
Any nonsenical report is bound to make news.What can we expect from opposition when their whole mission is make govt look bad.

Especially since your fascist Govt does such a good job of that themselves.
 
Especially since your fascist Govt does such a good job of that themselves.

If you want to crush 7 decades of cross border terrorism this needs to be done.People made to carry country's flags by pressure have to understand this.It is not fasicm , it is facing the realities of the situation.
 

heres a video, and yet you guys want to deny it

Pathetic people you INdians are. Scums.

Anyone who deny's this, i hope this happens with you and your family one day, and i hope no one stands up for you, your own country people

pathetic
 
That would be even more frustrating when they discuss and do nothing. See, the key to PR war is to keep it boiling. One doesn't put all the eggs in the basket, add a few tomatoes that don't belong in the basket right away. It should be escalated slowly and progressively so that the collective conscious has a change of heart gradually. There's a "closed" UNSC meeting proposed by China. The Polish incharge indicated he needs to speak to other members before setting one up. They will talk about Hong Kong if at all this meeting is actually convened. What will China say? As I said, I think this was a diplomatic blunder by Pakistan. Now where will they go if UNSC does nothing. Are they going to condemn Modi and India because he is the reincarnation of Hitler? Then why say it? By going to the extremes with all the hyperboles they dug a big hole which they won't be able to come out of. India wants to frustrate Pak to the point of Pak resorting to old ways of Jihadi freedom. We know it never works but will help India support their case. World will react to that. That will frustrate Pak more. See that's the game. That's why Indians aren't even saying a word right now.

I think the basic issue here is that IK is set in his ways. His hyperbole reminds me of the stuff he said before the Pakistani elections, and against his domestic opponents now like "I will commit suicide before going to the IMF for a loan", "I have Nawaz in a cell with no A/C in the summer" etc.

Such hyperbole may work in elections (assuming the elections were fair) but obviously will now work in the international arena. IK is stuck in his way of doing business, he is unable to make the transition for domestic politician to international statesman.

Leaders of countries are not as easy to fool as the domestic voters. They have surely noted the contradiction of IK calling Modi "Hitler", and also signing a letter absolving China of its persecution of the Muslim Uyghurs.
 
I think the basic issue here is that IK is set in his ways. His hyperbole reminds me of the stuff he said before the Pakistani elections, and against his domestic opponents now like "I will commit suicide before going to the IMF for a loan", "I have Nawaz in a cell with no A/C in the summer" etc.

Such hyperbole may work in elections (assuming the elections were fair) but obviously will now work in the international arena. IK is stuck in his way of doing business, he is unable to make the transition for domestic politician to international statesman.

Leaders of countries are not as easy to fool as the domestic voters. They have surely noted the contradiction of IK calling Modi "Hitler", and also signing a letter absolving China of its persecution of the Muslim Uyghurs.

He has international pedigree. His handling during Phulwama was more mature than Modi's. But now, he is frustrated that this happened under his watch, there is the push from the army with all this rhetoric, his anti corruption thunder had been stolen by India, the financial mess Pakistan is in. There are no solutions for these in the short term.
 
He has international pedigree. His handling during Phulwama was more mature than Modi's. But now, he is frustrated that this happened under his watch, there is the push from the army with all this rhetoric, his anti corruption thunder had been stolen by India, the financial mess Pakistan is in. There are no solutions for these in the short term.

Maybe he is just saying these things for domestic consumption rather than international impact.

NS was vilified in Pakistan for trying to improve relations with India. Maybe domestically IK doesn't want to appear soft on India.

The reality is that Pakistan is not going to advance economically until it improves its domestic security and sheds it terrorism tag, which requires it to stop supporting the Taliban in Afghanistan and improving its relations with India. IK may be improving his electoral prospects, but isn't helping his country in the long run with his hyperbole.
 
Maybe he is just saying these things for domestic consumption rather than international impact.

NS was vilified in Pakistan for trying to improve relations with India. Maybe domestically IK doesn't want to appear soft on India.

The reality is that Pakistan is not going to advance economically until it improves its domestic security and sheds it terrorism tag, which requires it to stop supporting the Taliban in Afghanistan and improving its relations with India. IK may be improving his electoral prospects, but isn't helping his country in the long run with his hyperbole.

Are you really kidding me? Do you even know how electoral population of Pakistan vote for their leaders? If you theory had any iota of truth then all the Religious parties in Pakistan would have been holding majority of vote bank but alas you are wrong.

Imran got majority in this round of election is mainly due to people not wanting to vote for either of PMLN and PPP. He retained his original votes from 2013 and gathered new votes as PMLN and PPP lost votes due to their horrible 10 collective years in government.

Now coming back to Imran and the way he handles himself in media and internationally. Imran is one of those guys who has literally given all he had towards the vision of justice in Pakistan. He would not hold back in an international debate to raise this topic, go look for yourself the hard interviews he has given to media channels across the world something Modi cannot even do domestically, infact where Imran was giving interviews to BBC, Al Jazeera during his election campaign Modi gave an interview to Akshay Kumar for his election campaign. That is the comparison of personalities between the two and the ability to speak openly and honestly.

Imran is a very persistent guy. By the looks of it he has taken this step by India very personally and when he means he would become ambassador of Kashmir rest assured he would do that. He would raise his voice on Kashmir subject whenever he gets the chance he would not let go of this topic now.

On the original topic of OP. There is a reason why fact finding missions are not allowed within Kashmir and there is a reason why there is a current blackout in Kashmir. People of India would rather choose to ignore the reality than confront the blackout which is more disturbing to see. Today the rest of India is happy with blackout, tomorrow they would be happy to stop food and medicine supplies to Kashmir and then it would also be fine with ethnical cleansing of Kashmiris. They would term it as if the Government has only targeted the terrorists and no innocents are killed when the fact is every Kashmiri is a terrorist now for State of India.
 
If you theory had any iota of truth then all the Religious parties in Pakistan would have been holding majority of vote bank but alas you are wrong.

Hello Mr. Extra Cover, let me introduce you to Mr. Non Sequitur.

Imran got majority in this round of election is mainly due to people not wanting to vote for either of PMLN and PPP. He retained his original votes from 2013 and gathered new votes as PMLN and PPP lost votes due to their horrible 10 collective years in government.

Okay.

Now coming back to Imran and the way he handles himself in media and internationally. Imran is one of those guys who has literally given all he had towards the vision of justice in Pakistan. He would not hold back in an international debate to raise this topic, go look for yourself the hard interviews he has given to media channels across the world something Modi cannot even do domestically, infact where Imran was giving interviews to BBC, Al Jazeera during his election campaign Modi gave an interview to Akshay Kumar for his election campaign. That is the comparison of personalities between the two and the ability to speak openly and honestly.

Talk is cheap, actions matter. You have a perverted notion of "the ability to speak openly and honestly" if you are applying it to IK who calls Modi "Hitler" but whose government signs a letter supporting China when it throws millions of Muslims into concentration camps, forcibly sterilizes Muslim women, forces Muslims to eat pork, starves them if they don't sign songs praising the government, separates children from their parents, etc.

Imran is a very persistent guy. By the looks of it he has taken this step by India very personally and when he means he would become ambassador of Kashmir rest assured he would do that. He would raise his voice on Kashmir subject whenever he gets the chance he would not let go of this topic now.

Bad news for Pakistan then, as it means its economy will remain in the dumps.

Today the rest of India is happy with blackout, tomorrow they would be happy to stop food and medicine supplies to Kashmir and then it would also be fine with ethnical cleansing of Kashmiris.

You and Mr. Non Sequitur are developing quite a relationship, you should get a room.

I however find Mr. Non Sequitur quite tedious, so will refrain from replying unless he is banished from your future posts.
 
On the original topic of OP. There is a reason why fact finding missions are not allowed within Kashmir and there is a reason why there is a current blackout in Kashmir. People of India would rather choose to ignore the reality than confront the blackout which is more disturbing to see. Today the rest of India is happy with blackout, tomorrow they would be happy to stop food and medicine supplies to Kashmir and then it would also be fine with ethnical cleansing of Kashmiris. They would term it as if the Government has only targeted the terrorists and no innocents are killed when the fact is every Kashmiri is a terrorist now for State of India.

This!

I’m yet to come across an Indian with a reasonable answer as to why there’s a blackout and why fact finding missions aren’t allowed in Kashmir if the place is indeed ’normal’ and ’peaceful’.
 
This!

I’m yet to come across an Indian with a reasonable answer as to why there’s a blackout and why fact finding missions aren’t allowed in Kashmir if the place is indeed ’normal’ and ’peaceful’.

Mr. Extra Cover and I have already engaged in this discussion.

Screen Shot 2019-08-15 at 12.19.50 PM.jpg

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Alright but doesn’t that contradict the Indian claim that Kashmir is largely peaceful and that the Kashmiris are happy with the scrapping of Article 370?

May be true for most people in Jammu and Ladakh, but not true for Kashmir. If some Indian government official said that, they "misspoke".

Can't say I am happy that some Indians (Kashmiris) want to leave the country. It is not something I do not care about. However, they are given full democratic rights like other Indians and also get more development aid from the Central Government compared to other Indians. No good choices here, but I believe that the best choice is for India to keep Kashmir. Secession based on religious motives is not acceptable.
 
Hello Mr. Extra Cover, let me introduce you to Mr. Non Sequitur.



Okay.



Talk is cheap, actions matter. You have a perverted notion of "the ability to speak openly and honestly" if you are applying it to IK who calls Modi "Hitler" but whose government signs a letter supporting China when it throws millions of Muslims into concentration camps, forcibly sterilizes Muslim women, forces Muslims to eat pork, starves them if they don't sign songs praising the government, separates children from their parents, etc.

I agree that Imran went over the notion with Nazis comparison here. But to his benefit he is speaking the worst of his fears out openly, when a room is dark and doors are locked an outside person starts imagining his/her worst fears. Same is with Imran he is speaking openly and drawing comparisons with Nazis. I think this is the best opportunity for India to lift the blackout from Kashmir and expose Paksitani's lies the longer this goes on the more weight Indian Govt would give to Imran's narrative.

Also don't mistake Imran is an idiot. He is speaking that language and those words that would gather international media's attention. We all know Pakistan is not a superpower and all Pakistan at its current moment can do is garner international attention so he speaking colorful language and as a result of he might get Kashmir the international attention that he craves.


Bad news for Pakistan then, as it means its economy will remain in the dumps.

I personally prefer Imran over PMLN and PPP and I admit he is not going to save our economy. He came into power with one motto that is to hold corrupt people accountable and bring justice in the country the promise on which he would deliver. However, he is competent enough not to get the economy slide further down. He has the public support and international support to keep Pakistan's economy afloat and mitigate the risk of bankruptcy. In the next 5 years after his government the economy with steadily grow. Having said all of that you would see in the near future how he raises voices for Kashmiris whenever he gets the chance. And on the verge of Afghan peace process being completed successfully within a month he will get that chance to voice it again when international media will be listening. Over the years I have realised that Imran does have the natural ability to deliver a good speech so I expect him to deliver the message loud and clear but in an eloquent manner.

You and Mr. Non Sequitur are developing quite a relationship, you should get a room.

I however find Mr. Non Sequitur quite tedious, so will refrain from replying unless he is banished from your future posts.

I admit this was a far fetched conclusion but this is mind wandering in the dark as I have no ground facts to consider? Easy answer is lift the blackout and tell the world Kashmir is a better place now than before.

Mr. Sequitur, I would like to have your opinion on the blackout and human rights violations. You are one sequitur indian posters here so I would really like your opinion on the above and give me two perspectives; one from Indian Govt standpoint and one from humanitarian standpoint.
 
Mr. Sequitur, I would like to have your opinion on the blackout and human rights violations. You are one sequitur indian posters here so I would really like your opinion on the above and give me two perspectives; one from Indian Govt standpoint and one from humanitarian standpoint.

Thanks for your reply. From an Indian government standpoint there is the:

1. Practical. Any government, whether run by BJP or Congress cannot give away Kashmir as they would condemn themselves to losing elections for the next 50 years. The Indian public is committed to keeping Kashmir, and now the sentiment is "We cannot give away Kashmir as then our soldiers have died keeping it part of India would have died in vain."

As a practical matter, governments do not really give away major pieces of land unless they are themselves in chaos as happened in Indonesia when East Timor broke away.

2. Legal. This is a lot of lawyer talk. I think the legal situation for both sides is a bit dubious. Indira Gandhi should have made the Shimla Agreement watertight when she returned the Pakistani POWs, but she apparently she didn't.

As for the humanitarian aspect, there is loss of lives on both sides which is tragic. Will letting Kashmir go reduce the killing? It will in the short term, but in the longer term what is going to prevent Kashmir from becoming another Afghanistan? Non-democratic countries always end up in civil war, and at least Kashmiris have democracy if they stay in India. I don't think that Kashmir would remain a democracy in the longer term if it joined Pakistan (which is only occasionally a democracy).
 
Thanks for your reply. From an Indian government standpoint there is the:

1. Practical. Any government, whether run by BJP or Congress cannot give away Kashmir as they would condemn themselves to losing elections for the next 50 years. The Indian public is committed to keeping Kashmir, and now the sentiment is "We cannot give away Kashmir as then our soldiers have died keeping it part of India would have died in vain."

As a practical matter, governments do not really give away major pieces of land unless they are themselves in chaos as happened in Indonesia when East Timor broke away.

2. Legal. This is a lot of lawyer talk. I think the legal situation for both sides is a bit dubious. Indira Gandhi should have made the Shimla Agreement watertight when she returned the Pakistani POWs, but she apparently she didn't.

As for the humanitarian aspect, there is loss of lives on both sides which is tragic. Will letting Kashmir go reduce the killing? It will in the short term, but in the longer term what is going to prevent Kashmir from becoming another Afghanistan? Non-democratic countries always end up in civil war, and at least Kashmiris have democracy if they stay in India. I don't think that Kashmir would remain a democracy in the longer term if it joined Pakistan (which is only occasionally a democracy).

Thanks for this reply, appreciate it. Its kind of a catch 22 situation for India now on humanitarian grounds. The can keep the Kashmiri land by force and upon demonstration of force its risking a huge international media cryout and possible repercussions.

However, if they do not use force then Kashmiri's voices will be heard everywhere in the world, which would pretty much ask the UN councils to hold a plebiscite in region as they want to declare independence and had that term under the previous agreement. As India did not keep the legal end of the agreement, Kashmiris would also voice to have their plebiscite as legal clauses are not applicable anymore.

Interesting times ahead for India. Any idea when Indian Supreme court is going to give verdict over the resolution being revoked?
 
Thanks for this reply, appreciate it. Its kind of a catch 22 situation for India now on humanitarian grounds. The can keep the Kashmiri land by force and upon demonstration of force its risking a huge international media cryout and possible repercussions.

However, if they do not use force then Kashmiri's voices will be heard everywhere in the world, which would pretty much ask the UN councils to hold a plebiscite in region as they want to declare independence and had that term under the previous agreement. As India did not keep the legal end of the agreement, Kashmiris would also voice to have their plebiscite as legal clauses are not applicable anymore.

Interesting times ahead for India. Any idea when Indian Supreme court is going to give verdict over the resolution being revoked?

There are no perfect solutions to many intractable problems in life :(

I believe the Supreme Court will have a few hearings on different matters pertaining to Kashmir on August 16th.

https://www.thehindu.com/news/natio...d-kashmir-moves-on-friday/article29102917.ece
 
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