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Faf du Plessis and Azhar Ali: Same age, same recent and old records, different futures

Junaids

Senior T20I Player
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Jan 12, 2013
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The cases of Azhar Ali and FAF du Plessis really sum up eloquently everything that is wrong about Pakistan cricket's absurd and self-destructive deference towards age.

In less than a month both men will be 35 years old.

Both men averaged 46 in Test cricket until age caught up with them two years ago.

Both men average 27 in the last two years, at the ages of 33, 34 and 35.

Next week FAF du Plessis' Test career will be ended. While Azhar Ali is the "new" Pakistan captain.

And here is the detail which proves my point:

Until 2 years ago:
FAF du Plessis: 47 Tests, 7 hundreds and 17 fifties, 3012 runs at 46.33.
Azhar Ali: 15 Tests, 14 hundreds and 27 fifties, 5129 runs at 46.62.

In the last 2 years:
FAF du Plessis: 17 Tests, 2 hundreds and 4 fifties, 851 runs at 27.45
Azhar Ali: 15 Tests, 2 hundreds and 4 fifties, 756 runs at 27.00

In the last two years:
FAF du Plessis has averaged 18.88 less than he did previously.
Azhar Ali has averaged 19.62 less than he did previously.


It's a stark, stark contrast in cricketing cultures.

And it shows how difficult it is for Pakistan to punch its weight in international cricket.

It's not as if Pakistan's thirty-somethings were some sort of golden generation which needs to be kept together. Yet the new Chief Selector has just convened a 19 man squad in which 11 players are in their thirties (and three more have only just finished school).

And the back-up players appear to be Fawad Alam, Salman Butt, Kashif Bhatti and Imran Khan!
 
Correction - until 2 years ago Azhar Ali had played 62 Tests!
 
Azhar is much better in tests than Faf and still I believe he can resurrect his career
 
Azhar is much better in tests than Faf and still I believe he can resurrect his career
Pardon?

They BOTH averaged 46 until the age of 32.

They BOTH average 27 since the age of 32.

There is absolutely no basis for saying that Azhar Ali was EVER a better batsman than FAF du Plessis because their records are identical......except that FAF played in far more low-scoring matches in difficult batting conditions.

If anything, that suggests that if one of them was better than the other, it was FAF.

Not to mention that he was a natural captain, whereas Azhar Ali isn't.
 
Pardon?

They BOTH averaged 46 until the age of 32.

They BOTH average 27 since the age of 32.

There is absolutely no basis for saying that Azhar Ali was EVER a better batsman than FAF du Plessis because their records are identical......except that FAF played in far more low-scoring matches in difficult batting conditions.

If anything, that suggests that if one of them was better than the other, it was FAF.

Not to mention that he was a natural captain, whereas Azhar Ali isn't.

You are free to disagree and hide behind stats. Faf was just a decent test bat when both were in prime. Azhar was a pretty solid No. 3 who scored in all conditions. Being a captain is just an irrelevant thing. Yes Faf was much better captain than Azhar but no he never was better test bat than Azhar

I am not going to debate though.
Thanks..
 
Double Hundred in Australia, 40+ batting average at no. 3, 1.5x Number of Hundreds etc. etc.

Remind me of Azhar Ali's record in South Africa. Faf's debut hundred is better than any innings Azhar has played in Australia, their averages are basically the same, and Azhar's number of hundreds is very much due to having played more games. Fab debuted late because there was no space for him in a batting lineup with Amla, Kallis and AB De Villiers combined with a restrictive quota system.
 
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Much better based on what exactly?

Pardon?

They BOTH averaged 46 until the age of 32.

They BOTH average 27 since the age of 32.

There is absolutely no basis for saying that Azhar Ali was EVER a better batsman than FAF du Plessis because their records are identical......except that FAF played in far more low-scoring matches in difficult batting conditions.

If anything, that suggests that if one of them was better than the other, it was FAF.

Not to mention that he was a natural captain, whereas Azhar Ali isn't.
[MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION], I wonder why you don't take into account Faf's record in Asia like you do with Hafeez outside Asia? I see a bias in most cricket fans, not just you. If an Asian player fails in SENA people never get tired talking about it, if SENA player fails in Asia it is conveniently brushed under the carpet.

Azhar Ali had some success in Australia and England previously, OTOH Faf is among the worst ever players in Asian conditions. Saw him bat in the recent India series? He wouldn't get a spot in most Ranji sides with such a clownish technique against spin and lack of spine. In fact I would go a step further and say that the likes of Umesh Yadav and Herath can give him some batting lessons. Even at his peak he used to struggle to get past single digit scores here. Were you unaware of his record in SC or do you think a player needn't prove himself in certain kind of conditions.

With overall identical records, I fail to see how Faf is in the same category as Azhar. Faf vs Hafeez would be a closer contest with the South African narrowly edging it.

faf.jpg
http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/player/44828.html?class=1;filter=advanced;home_or_away=2;home_or_away=3;opposition=25;opposition=6;opposition=7;opposition=8;orderby=default;template=results;type=batting

15 tests is quite a decent sample size don't you agree? Many of them played on flat pitches, against India he was the beneficiary of abnormally high number of dropped catches last year as well. He hasn't had even one decent series in his career to make an argument in his favour!!! On the contrary Azhar smashed a few records in Australia 3 years back.
 
[MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION], I wonder why you don't take into account Faf's record in Asia like you do with Hafeez outside Asia? I see a bias in most cricket fans, not just you. If an Asian player fails in SENA people never get tired talking about it, if SENA player fails in Asia it is conveniently brushed under the carpet.

Azhar Ali had some success in Australia and England previously, OTOH Faf is among the worst ever players in Asian conditions. Saw him bat in the recent India series? He wouldn't get a spot in most Ranji sides with such a clownish technique against spin and lack of spine. In fact I would go a step further and say that the likes of Umesh Yadav and Herath can give him some batting lessons. Even at his peak he used to struggle to get past single digit scores here. Were you unaware of his record in SC or do you think a player needn't prove himself in certain kind of conditions.

With overall identical records, I fail to see how Faf is in the same category as Azhar. Faf vs Hafeez would be a closer contest with the South African narrowly edging it.

View attachment 98441
http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/player/44828.html?class=1;filter=advanced;home_or_away=2;home_or_away=3;opposition=25;opposition=6;opposition=7;opposition=8;orderby=default;template=results;type=batting

15 tests is quite a decent sample size don't you agree? Many of them played on flat pitches, against India he was the beneficiary of abnormally high number of dropped catches last year as well. He hasn't had even one decent series in his career to make an argument in his favour!!! On the contrary Azhar smashed a few records in Australia 3 years back.

Faf is the worst player to tour in subcontinent even worst players against spin have their moments.
Daryll Cullinan who was Shane Warnes bunny still had a great record against Kumble and Murali in India and Srilanka respectively.
 
I have not quiet tracked Azhar Ali's career. But Faf definitely failed lived upto his potential. Played some clutch knocks. I will give him that. But he failed to stand up many times.
 
FAF’s comments after the Port Elizabeth defeat effectively confirm that he will retire either after the Fourth Test or the short series in the West Indies in four months.
 
Azhar's been an excellent servant for Pakistan. But I really wish he would retire, coupled with his chronic knee issues he's just not got the game anymore away from Asian pitches and that's just not good enough at the highest level.

I know there isn't a lot out there as replacements but Abid has done well and we can try some younger players for the other opening slot if not going with Imam or Shan.

Azhar's had a good 10 year run but unfortunately a lot of these senior players think they can now play on till their mid forties due the precedent set by Misbah and he won't be kicking him out anytime soon as they're great buddies.
 
Faf will retire soon. He has done a good job for South Africa but he is past his best.
 
The fact the proteas have stuck out for Faf for so long shows the depths of mediocrity their cricket has fallen too. Ten years ago South Africa having a player with Faf's recent form in their side was unthinkable.
 
Both need to be dropped forever.

Difference is Faf is looked as an old veteran in his country, and Azhar is looked as “talented youngster” in his. Everyone thinks they’re a youngster and can play till 40+ like Misbah.
 
Both need to be dropped forever.

Difference is Faf is looked as an old veteran in his country, and Azhar is looked as “talented youngster” in his. Everyone thinks they’re a youngster and can play till 40+ like Misbah.

Lol Azhar Ali and talented?
 
The truth is I have seen faf bigged up and Azhar Ali put down in these forums,the numbers show they are both pretty much equal so either faf is over rated or ahzar gets more stick then he deserves
 
Yeah, it is time up for Faf. He should call it off as he is not contributing anything with the bat.
 
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