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Greatest ever South African cricketers

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Junaids

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Those of you who listen to BBC Test Match Special may have noticed that in the last week interviews with both Graeme Pollock and Mike Procter have been described as being with the "greatest ever South African cricketer."

So here is my version:

1 Mike Procter: terrific balanced all-rounder, much better bowler than Kallis.
2 Barry Richards: greatest batsman of the last 65 years.
3 Graeme Pollock: legendary left-hander.
4 Jacques Kallis: great batting all-rounder.
5 Neil Adcock: greatest Saffa pace bowler.
6 AB De Villiers: ATG batsman
7 Dale Steyn: ATG bowler
8 Shaun Pollock: great bowling all-rounder
9 Hashim Amla: great batsman
10 Allan Donald: exceptional quick bowler.
 
Junaids said:
Those of you who listen to BBC Test Match Special may have noticed that in the last week interviews with both Graeme Pollock and Mike Procter have been described as being with the "greatest ever South African cricketer."

So here is my version:

1 Mike Procter: terrific balanced all-rounder, much better bowler than Kallis.
2 Barry Richards: greatest batsman of the last 65 years.
3 Graeme Pollock: legendary left-hander.
4 Jacques Kallis: great batting all-rounder.
5 Neil Adcock: greatest Saffa pace bowler.
6 AB De Villiers: ATG batsman
7 Dale Steyn: ATG bowler
8 Shaun Pollock: great bowling all-rounder
9 Hashim Amla: great batsman
10 Allan Donald: exceptional quick bowler.
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Okay.

Good selection.
 
Steyn, Kallis and perhaps pollock would be my ATG from SA at this point

Donald would be if it weren't for relative lack of longevity (not by his own fault).. Very very good bowler
 
SA were my second fav team in 90's with so many dynamic all rounders it was amazing i guess usually the list is based on overall performance but Lance Klusner ,Brain Mcmillan,Pat Symcox,Rhodes -even these players were much more entertaining than the current lot.
 
1) Jacques Kallis.
2) Dale Steyn.
3) Allan Donald.
4) Graeme Smith.
5) Hashim Amla.
6) AB de Villers.
7) Shaun Pollock

These would be my greatest South African cricketers, with the top five being ATGs and the other two being borderline-ATGs.

Graeme Pollock played what, 20 test matches? Too small a sample size for me, even Hussey and Pujara looked incredible for their first few matches. Mike Procter played a grand total of seven test matches.
 
Junaids said:
Those of you who listen to BBC Test Match Special may have noticed that in the last week interviews with both Graeme Pollock and Mike Procter have been described as being with the "greatest ever South African cricketer."

So here is my version:

1 Mike Procter: terrific balanced all-rounder, much better bowler than Kallis.
2 Barry Richards: greatest batsman of the last 65 years.
3 Graeme Pollock: legendary left-hander.
4 Jacques Kallis: great batting all-rounder.
5 Neil Adcock: greatest Saffa pace bowler.
6 AB De Villiers: ATG batsman
7 Dale Steyn: ATG bowler
8 Shaun Pollock: great bowling all-rounder
9 Hashim Amla: great batsman
10 Allan Donald: exceptional quick bowler.
Click to expand...

I would replace Smith in there somewhere.

Maybe Amla's place for being a great captain and ATG batsmen opener.
 
Strange to see no Graeme Smith in your list while some who played very less Test cricket are there in your top 10 based on their FC/County performance.
 
Dr_Bassim said:
I would replace Smith in there somewhere.

Maybe Amla's place for being a great captain and ATG batsmen opener.
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List is based on Tests and so based on Test performance Amla should be selected ahead of AB. AB is overall a better bat in all formats combined but no way near Amla/Kallis/Smith in Test cricket.
 
Strike Rate said:
List is based on Tests and so based on Test performance Amla should be selected ahead of AB. AB is overall a better bat in all formats combined but no way near Amla/Kallis/Smith in Test cricket.
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Yes, in tests Amla stays and AB is like not even close.
 
Kallis is their greatest cricketer, followed by Smith, ABD and Steyn..
 
Strike Rate said:
Strange to see no Graeme Smith in your list while some who played very less Test cricket are there in your top 10 based on their FC/County performance.
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Junaids always gives a lot of preference to County cricket i guess their performances their was very good.
 
JaDed said:
Junaids always gives a lot of preference to County cricket i guess their performances their was very good.
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Yea i have noticed this too.

County cricket was very strong in old days with so many overseas legends playing in different teams but still i can't rate county performers ahead of those who performed in international cricket.
 
Beyond the names which have been mentioned already, here are two who should get a bit more credit:

Shaun Pollock

Makhaya Nitini
 
Strike Rate said:
Yea i have noticed this too.

County cricket was very strong in old days with so many overseas legends playing in different teams but still i can't rate county performers ahead of those who performed in international cricket.
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True neither would I because the expectation and crowd pressure plus the nationalism factor comes to play while playing International unlike county but that's just IMO.
 
I Put Graeme smith on that list as ATG batsmen ahead of AB.
 
Clive Rice should have made this list, even if he didn't get to play Test cricket.

Also, Smith over Amla.
 
Bilal7 said:
1) Jacques Kallis.
2) Dale Steyn.
3) Allan Donald.
4) Graeme Smith.
5) Hashim Amla.
6) AB de Villers.
7) Shaun Pollock

These would be my greatest South African cricketers, with the top five being ATGs and the other two being borderline-ATGs.

Graeme Pollock played what, 20 test matches? Too small a sample size for me, even Hussey and Pujara looked incredible for their first few matches. Mike Procter played a grand total of seven test matches.
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Hashim Amla in the top 5 South African players of all time?
 
JaDed said:
True neither would I because the expectation and crowd pressure plus the nationalism factor comes to play while playing International unlike county but that's just IMO.
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Agree otherwise Zaheer Abbas should be labeled ATG for his legendary performances in county cricket.
 
Strike Rate said:
So you will have AB over Amla in Tests? kabhi to apni wo waali glasses utar dya ker bhai :yk
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It's greatest South African cricketer ever, not greatest Test/ODI/T20/County cricketer, so I have the liberty to not put Amla in there. :yk
 
[MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION] is right

Clive Rice should be there without a doubt. Great Allrounder.
 
Bilal7 said:
1) Jacques Kallis.
2) Dale Steyn.
3) Allan Donald.
4) Graeme Smith.
5) Hashim Amla.
6) AB de Villers.
7) Shaun Pollock

These would be my greatest South African cricketers, with the top five being ATGs and the other two being borderline-ATGs.

Graeme Pollock played what, 20 test matches? Too small a sample size for me, even Hussey and Pujara looked incredible for their first few matches. Mike Procter played a grand total of seven test matches.
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Actually this is a very good list . I'd put Kirsten at 8. This of course only being the players I've watched
 
Shaun Pollock is probably the most underrated among them all.. great bowler!
 
Junaids said:
1 Mike Procter: terrific balanced all-rounder, much better bowler than Kallis.
2 Barry Richards: greatest batsman of the last 65 years.
3 Graeme Pollock: legendary left-hander.
4 Jacques Kallis: great batting all-rounder.
5 Neil Adcock: greatest Saffa pace bowler.
6 AB De Villiers: ATG batsman
7 Dale Steyn: ATG bowler
8 Shaun Pollock: great bowling all-rounder
9 Hashim Amla: great batsman
10 Allan Donald: exceptional quick bowler.
Click to expand...

Clive Rice?
 
If we go by performances in FC alone, Vince van der Bijl is perhaps best of all.

Unfortunately none of them got enough/ any test exposure..
 
It's quite weird how many great all-rounders South Africa produce.

In no particular order, but great nonetheless:

1. Kallis (can't believe OP didn't tag him as an ATG. Yes, he most definitely is)
2. Shaun Pollock (very underrated)
3. Klusener (Player of the tournament in 1999 WC, 'nuff said)
4. Procter (can't really comment)
5. Clive Rice (930 FC wickets @ 22.49 and a batting avg of 40. Crazy!)
6. Hansie Cronje (underrated and a cheat. Worth mentioning though)
7. Brian McMillan
Another great article on the subject: http://www.theroar.com.au/2012/11/14/a-bakers-dozen-the-best-south-african-all-rounders-ever/
 
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Ozymandiasza said:
It's quite weird how many great all-rounders South Africa produce.

In no particular order, but great nonetheless:

1. Kallis (can't believe OP didn't tag him as an ATG. Yes, he most definitely is)
2. Shaun Pollock (very underrated)
3. Klusener (Player of the tournament in 1999 WC, 'nuff said)
4. Procter (can't really comment)
5. Clive Rice (930 FC wickets @ 22.49 and a batting avg of 40. Crazy!)
6. Hansie Cronje (underrated and a cheat. Worth mentioning though)
7. Brian McMillan
Another great article on the subject: http://www.theroar.com.au/2012/11/14/a-bakers-dozen-the-best-south-african-all-rounders-ever/
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The bitter truth though is that currently they have none..
 
Amla, de Villiers and Philander would be top 3 in the most overrated South African cricketers of all-time list.

Gibbs would be top 3 in the most underrated list. What a gutsy player he was, unlike most of his countrymen.

Gibbs, Smith, Klusener and Donald are the only four gutsy South African cricketers I have seen.
 
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Ozymandiasza said:
5. Clive Rice (930 FC wickets @ 22.49 and a batting avg of 40. Crazy!)
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In 1984 there was an all-rounder contest held in England. Rice, Botham, Imran, Kapil, Hadlee and Marshall entered.

Rice won.

He was clearly the best batter, and his medium-fast bowling was effective. I understand that before his back injury he was properly quick, too.
 
Mamoon said:
Amla, de Villiers and Philander would be top 3 in the most overrated South African cricketers of all-time list.

Gibbs would be top 3 in the most underrated list. What a gutsy player he was, unlike most of his countrymen.

Gibbs, Smith, Klusener and Donald are the only four gutsy South African cricketers I have seen.
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Good list. I would exclude Donald though. I don't believe anyone will forget or forgive him for dropping his bat. Donald can possibly be considered for the ultimate and original South African choker.
 
Ozymandiasza said:
Good list. I would exclude Donald though. I don't believe anyone will forget or forgive him for dropping his bat. Donald can possibly be considered for the ultimate and original South African choker.
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Yes that moment sticks out like a sore thumb, possibly the worst 'brain-****' I've seen in international cricket in my lifetime and would be a prime candidate for spot-fixing in today's world, but over the course of his career, he probably could have run through a brick wall for the team. Think Ntini deserves a mention as well, very bighearted cricketer.
 
Mamoon said:
Yes that moment sticks out like a sore thumb, possibly the worst 'brain-****' I've seen in international cricket in my lifetime and would be a prime candidate for spot-fixing in today's world, but over the course of his career, he probably could have run through a brick wall for the team. Think Ntini deserves a mention as well, very bighearted cricketer.
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I'm not sure if you guys get to hear Ntini commentating? Either way, probably one of the best commentators I've ever heard. He is extremely insightful and a joy to listen to.
 
Ozymandiasza said:
I'm not sure if you guys get to hear Ntini commentating? Either way, probably one of the best commentators I've ever heard. He is extremely insightful and a joy to listen to.
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Didn't know he's commentating now, is he doing it in the current series? Ntini was quite the character, no wonder he's a joy to listen to.
 
Mamoon said:
Yes that moment sticks out like a sore thumb, possibly the worst 'brain-****' I've seen in international cricket in my lifetime and would be a prime candidate for spot-fixing in today's world, but over the course of his career, he probably could have run through a brick wall for the team. Think Ntini deserves a mention as well, very bighearted cricketer.
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You missed Kirsten too.Not one of the greatest match winner but a very gutsy opener.
 
Pakistani love for Hashim Amla is similar to Indian love of Tendulkar. Yet, can't deny he is one of the best players of spin. Last tour of India was horrible for him but I'm sure he will be back for revenge.
 
Nikhil_cric said:
Actually this is a very good list . I'd put Kirsten at 8. This of course only being the players I've watched
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Nicest thing you've ever said to me. Kirsten, Ntini and Klusenar would make my top ten but these three are nowhere near ATG status.

Convict said:
Hashim Amla in the top 5 South African players of all time?
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Who else would replace him in the top five? I don't care about what players did in county cricket. This is a list of greatest South African cricketers and they need to have done something for South Africa to feature in it.
 
Ab Fan said:
You missed Kirsten too.Not one of the greatest match winner but a very gutsy opener.
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You are right, slipped my mind for some reason. Kirsten has generally been forgotten by people today because of Smith, but he was a very good opener in his own right.
 
Forgot to say, Jonty Rhodes should be added to the all time best as he changed SA fielding side completely to different level.
 
Raf Pragmatic said:
Pakistani love for Hashim Amla is similar to Indian love of Tendulkar. Yet, can't deny he is one of the best players of spin. Last tour of India was horrible for him but I'm sure he will be back for revenge.
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It is, but at least Tendulkar is Indian, he is their player.

Pakistani's love for Amla (and now Moeen; watch out for Khawaja next) is absolutely cringeworthy. Especially when some of them pray that he scores runs against them so that his average is not disturbed.
 
Based on cricketers I have seen play since 1992
1)steyn
2)Kallis
3)Donald
4)pollock
5)Smith
6)Amla
 
Raf Pragmatic said:
Forgot to say, Jonty Rhodes should be added to the all time best as he changed SA fielding side completely to different level.
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Not only for SA but he did a lot for fielding in general. He made fielding s*xy and it became a specialized job because of him, but in context of the thread, other cricketers have greater achievements.

Was an excellent batsman as well in the latter half of his career.
 
Bilal7 said:
Nicest thing you've ever said to me. Kirsten, Ntini and Klusenar would make my top ten but these three are nowhere near ATG status.



Who else would replace him in the top five? I don't care about what players did in county cricket. This is a list of greatest South African cricketers and they need to have done something for South Africa to feature in it.
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Bilal7 my friend if I think you're right I have no problem admitting it :amla . Besides I'm a nice guy who just likes to troll occasionally . You mustn't take it to heart :afridi
 
Bowlers :

1. Steyn
2. Donald
3. Pollock
4. Ntini.
5. Morkel

Batsmen
1. ABD
2. Amla
3. Kallis
4. Smith


I don't rate older era players due to the highly bogus endorsements from their peers.
 
Can we have a list of greatest South African captains? Surely Amla will be number one, undisputedly.
 
Mamoon said:
Didn't know he's commentating now, is he doing it in the current series? Ntini was quite the character, no wonder he's a joy to listen to.
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Yes, he's a commentator on SABC (South African Broadcasting Corporation). I haven't heard him on Super Sport (the stream most broadcasters including the SABC leech off of).
 
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Hashim Amla shouldn't have made the list - but I do agree with rest of the names there!
 
Raf Pragmatic said:
Pakistani love for Hashim Amla is similar to Indian love of Tendulkar. Yet, can't deny he is one of the best players of spin. Last tour of India was horrible for him but I'm sure he will be back for revenge.
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Except a few there is no love for Amla but there is no hate either. People want to hate Amla for his beard and want Pakistanis to join in but that's not going to happen. Amla is a very good bat and a non controversial player so why would someone hate him? You have got to be really immature to hate him because some random guy on a forum admires Amla for his beard. Plus if Steyn can say Amla is a great inspiration for him do then why can't he be an inspiration for someone else too? I have seen Pakistani posters here wishing Ahmad Shehzad fails so he could rub on his fans? Really? You want a Pakistani batsman to fail si you could score some browny points on a forum? That's pathetic you know.
 
Amla is indeed a great inspiration for other cricketers, especially the younger generation.

He has mastered the art of chickening out of captaincy mid-series when the going got tough and not having the heart to lead an unsettled side. Of course, an art initiated by Afridi in the first place.
 
Leaving captaincy is indeed a poor act but if you feel you're not upto the challenge it's better to step away. Dhoni did the same when he realized he can't carry on he retired in the middle of the tour and retired.
 
My list is pretty much the same as Bilal's but I'll go with a different order.

1.Steyn - Greatest match winner in Saffer history and the only one who bottles it. Among the top 3 pacers to ever play cricket. -ATG

2.Kallis - Terrific batsman and a good fifth bowler. Amazing slip catcher. Was the bedrock of SAs batting for 15 years. -ATG

3. Smith - best opener and captain SA ever had.

4.Donald - White Lightnin. Nuff said.

5.Pollock - Very good bowling allrounder but never really dominated either with bat or ball.

6. AB - has played some terrific knocks like the 90 odd against a rampaging Johnson on a fast, bouncy pitch and against Ajmal in the UAE. Was the only batsman with decent scores in India.

7. :amla - Very good batsman but mostly an accumulator.

8. Kirsten - Gutsy opener who could play genuine fast bowling
 
Yes Dhoni did the same, but only after taking India to the number one Test ranking, winning the World Cup, World T20 and Champions Trophy.

Amla has proved to be a fair-weather captain; took over a settled team but then Steyn's body started to fail him, Philander lost form and de Villiers lost motivation to play Tests.

He was left with an unsettled squad and inexperienced squad with the likes of Morris, Bavuma, Abbott, Morris, Rabada etc. and he showed that he does not have the heart to steer a young team through these difficult times, essentially proving all those right who called/call him a mentally weak cricketer who can only operate when he is in his comfort zone.

Fair-weather captains and comfort-zone cricketers are anything but inspirational.
 
Mamoon said:
Amla is indeed a great inspiration for other cricketers, especially the younger generation.

He has mastered the art of chickening out of captaincy mid-series when the going got tough and not having the heart to lead an unsettled side. Of course, an art initiated by Afridi in the first place.
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I respect your opinion and agree that Amla is overrated on this forum but you're comparing him to :afridi :facepalm:
Sorry but that's just a ridiculous comparison .
Afridi quit test cricket and made a comeback four years later to play one test and retire once more when he realised that he doesn't have the courage or patience to play test cricket .

When has Amla ever done anything remotely close to that. Captaincy is simply not his cup of tea and he made a decision to quit well in advance to focus on his batting not to run away from responsibility.

Criticism of Amla is fine considering that a few think he's the Asian Bradman but comparing him to :afridi is a massive insult .
 
Nikhil_cric said:
I respect your opinion and agree that Amla is overrated on this forum but you're comparing him to :afridi :facepalm:
Sorry but that's just a ridiculous comparison .
Afridi quit test cricket and made a comeback four years later to play one test and retire once more when he realised that he doesn't have the courage or patience to play test cricket .

When has Amla ever done anything remotely close to that. Captaincy is simply not his cup of tea and he made a decision to quit well in advance to focus on his batting not to run away from responsibility.

Criticism of Amla is fine considering that a few think he's the Asian Bradman but comparing him to :afridi is a massive insult .
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I am only comparing the cowardly act of running away from captaincy mid-series when the going got tough. That is where the comparison ends.

Afridi made a pompous return to Test cricket but midway in the Lord's Test, he found out that he did not have the heart to lead the team in this format, and ran away.

If you want Afridi ****** version: he resigned because he found out that Butt, Asif and Amir are involved in fixing.

Amla too was quite confident when he took over as captain, and had thrown his hat in the ring himself. What he presumed was that he'd take over a settled squad that was number one in the world, and simply captain a winning team that was largely on autopilot mode. However, cricket can be a funny game and he didn't foresee that 3/4 key players will lose their way for various reasons, and as mentioned above, he didn't have the guts and the heart to shepherd an unsettled side.

Both are fair-weather captains, hence the comparison.
 
Sticking to players after readmission - Top 5

1 - Steyn
2 - Kallis
3 - Donald
4 - Pollock
5 - Smith
 
Amla didn't take it on a settled team. The team has already lost Kallis and Snith the two greatest players of South African history. Steyn is just unfair and would be back so he won't firm a decision overs someone's short term fitness. And philander is unfit too and would be back. I bet you won't find Tebdylat inspirational too then because he left captaincy twice or thrice and didn't steer his team in difficult times? Or your hate is exclusive to beards, Amla abs South Africa so you won't apply sane theory to anyone else?tebdulkar didn't even quit captaincy only but even was thinking to retire in 1997. But hey he doesn't have beard right?

In case of Dhoni it's even more ridiculous. He had captained India when all was well but as soon as big guns retired he couldn't manage to go a single tour. Retired in between.
 
kallis is the greatest cricketer from south africa and there is no contest. he is also one the best three cricketers ever.
 
Mamoon said:
I am only comparing the cowardly act of running away from captaincy mid-series when the going got tough. That is where the comparison ends.

Afridi made a pompous return to Test cricket but midway in the Lord's Test, he found out that he did not have the heart to lead the team in this format, and ran away.

If you want Afridi ****** version: he resigned because he found out that Butt, Asif and Amir are involved in fixing.

Amla too was quite confident when he took over as captain, and had thrown his hat in the ring himself. What he presumed was that he'd take over a settled squad that was number one in the world, and simply captain a winning team that was largely on autopilot mode. However, cricket can be a funny game and he didn't foresee that 3/4 key players will lose their way for various reasons, and as mentioned above, he didn't have the guts and the heart to shepherd an unsettled side.

Both are fair-weather captains, hence the comparison.
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Actually the SA team that Amla got was not the no.1 team and it had just lost 2-1 at home to AUS who had become #1.

And they had lost Smith and Kallis at that point and they were already a team in transition . There were question marks about that SA team anyway. I don't think Amla particularly cared about captaincy and AB I remember was quite surprised and possibly upset as he was the popular choice after Smith retired.

Funnily enough AB's performance s have declined since that Australia series . Faf has not scored meaningful runs either and Steyn has been ravaged by injuries .

And when his own form started suffering, he quit captaincy to focus on his batting and that's something cricketers have done in the past. Nothing cowardly about that IMO. Its not like he has retired mid series and abandoned the team .
 
When Amla took over, South Africa was the number one side in the world, so it was settled. Yes it had lost Smith but keep in mind that barring the double-hundred in the UAE, Smith had been in decline.

He averaged 35 in his last year and over 12 Tests, in spite of the double-hundred in the UAE where he was generously aided by our fielders.

Similarly, Kallis was averaging around 32 in his last year and had been in decline after the tour of England in 2012. On paper both were huge losses but in practical terms, they were over the hill.

SA were still going strong and Amla himself along with de Villiers, Steyn, Philander, Morkel, du Plessis and Petersen (mediocre player, but had a purple patch around that time) were carrying the South African team. However, it fell apart quickly in Amla's captaincy.

Tendulkar was a very weak captain and a timid character, but he achieved so much with the bat that those weaknesses aren't highlighted. However, if he would have proved to be a great captain, his stature as a cricketer would have been higher. In fact, he could have gone down as the greatest cricketer ever rather than the best batsman since Bradman (according to many people).

Juxtaposing Dhoni's captaincy with Amla is what you call ridiculous. Yes Dhoni should have timed his retirement better and retiring after the Australian series would have been better, but he has achieved so much as captain that he can be excused for this act.

Dhoni in ODIs showed that he can handle retirement of the big guns. I don't think anyone lauds him specifically for his captaincy in Tests, but it is his overall captaincy across all formats. He hasn't been a legendary Test player or captain, but still managed to take his team to number one ranking.
 
Nikhil_cric said:
Actually the SA team that Amla got was not the no.1 team and it had just lost 2-1 at home to AUS who had become #1.

And they had lost Smith and Kallis at that point and they were already a team in transition . There were question marks about that SA team anyway. I don't think Amla particularly cared about captaincy and AB I remember was quite surprised and possibly upset as he was the popular choice after Smith retired.

Funnily enough AB's performance s have declined since that Australia series . Faf has not scored meaningful runs either and Steyn has been ravaged by injuries .

And when his own form started suffering, he quit captaincy to focus on his batting and that's something cricketers have done in the past. Nothing cowardly about that IMO. Its not like he has retired mid series and abandoned the team .
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I have already answered that. Firstly, both Smith and Kallis were over the hill at that point, and years later now it probably seems that they were huge losses, they actually weren't in practical terms. South Africa had 5/6 better performers in the team at that point.

Australia has always had South Africa's number in South Africa, won't look too much into it. The last hurrah of that great South African team was in Sri Lanka in 2014, Amla's first assignment as captain. Quite a few key players lost form afterwards.
 
It is cowardly in my view. He showed that he doesn't have the stomach to lead an unsettled side and when the going gets tough. Misbah, Clarke and Cook are recent examples of captains who didn't surrender when everything was falling apart. Misbah took over a team in turmoil and steadied them, while the latter had to deal with crisis and pulled their team through it. Amla failed to do so, because he is mentally weak.
 
Another way to look at it would be to see that he got a lot of criticism from various sections of the cricketing world, mainly because he is not a natural leader and does not possess the finer arts of captaincy, and therefore stepped aside for the benefit of the team. He was also struggling with the bat and that was also massively hurting the team.

But to prove that he is 'gutsy', he should have continued his weak performances, rather than accepting that captaincy isn't really his forte? The team is better off in every way since he stepped down. AB isn't a great captain but he is more experienced than Amla and can offer more. Amla's batting has naturally also improved.

Just an opinion.

I'm also guessing that the 'inspirational' tags refer to his humble personality and the fact that he is proud of his identity while completely being respectful of the norms around him, rather than his performances in World Cup matches and what not.
 
Abdullah719 said:
Another way to look at it would be to see that he got a lot of criticism from various sections of the cricketing world, mainly because he is not a natural leader and does not possess the finer arts of captaincy, and therefore stepped aside for the benefit of the team. He was also struggling with the bat and that was also massively hurting the team.

But to prove that he is 'gutsy', he should have continued his weak performances, rather than accepting that captaincy isn't really his forte? The team is better off in every way since he stepped down. AB isn't a great captain but he is more experienced than Amla and can offer more. Amla's batting has naturally also improved.

Just an opinion.

I'm also guessing that the 'inspirational' tags refer to his humble personality and the fact that he is proud of his identity while completely being respectful of the norms around him, rather than his performances in World Cup matches and what not.
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To prove that he is gutsy and mentally strong, he should have performed with the bat while being captain, as so many other captains have done. Since his performance dwindled, it shows that he doesn't possess these qualities.

Also as captain, you need to have a thick skin to withstand criticism. He failed on that front as well.

I don't have any issues with people finding him inspirational due to his personality, but I personally find him severely lacking charisma and presence.
 
Mamoon said:
To prove that he is gutsy and mentally strong, he should have performed with the bat while being captain, as so many other captains have done. Since his performance dwindled, it shows that he doesn't possess these qualities.

Also as captain, you need to have a thick skin to withstand criticism. He failed on that front as well.

I don't have any issues with people finding him inspirational due to his personality, but I personally find him severely lacking charisma and presence.
Click to expand...

He did perform earlier with the bat as captain but once he went out of form, it was looking difficult for him to retain his touch. The pressure of captaincy was having an impact. The feet weren't moving and run-scoring was very tough for him. His batting seems to rely a lot on clarity of mind (I feel this is what enables him to play some of his very long innings) and that is difficult to achieve when you're thinking about what moves you need to be taking to win a Test match. It wouldn't have been good for the team for him to continue as captain anyway, seeing that he is not very strong tactically.

He is not a similar character to Misbah, Clarke, and Cook. There is a difference between being tough characters in the dressing room and being able to uplift a team, as they are and the type of person he is. He comes across as a reserved person who prefers to be a contributing member rather than a leader. When I found out in 2014 that he was captain, I was very surprised. He can lead from the front with the bat (in the longer formats) but he doesn't seem like the type to give inspirational/motivational speeches to his team.
 
ridiculous and biased posting to get through you hatred is ridiculous. Everyone knew that SAF would not be the same team once Smith and Kallis retires. They became number one team because of them not despite them. One year's performance is irrelevant. Everyone knew SAF was entering in a torsional phase and would find it hard to replace these two legends. Your biased theory that Amla took the team when it was on top and quit it when it was on a decline is nothing but your personal bs!

Lol@Tendulkar has more things going which covered his failures that how he quit the captaincy! Another Baloney! You were talking how inspirational it was quit captaincy and not take the bull by horn and I pointed out that Tendulkar did that too that means you find him inspirational too? As expected you beat around the bushed because you have no substance in your post but just hatred for South Africa and Amla.

That is irrelevant whether Dhoni still captains ODIs or not he left Tests in mid of a tour and left a young team hanging.
 
Any list with Barry Richards in it should be thrown to the side like Mohammad Asif's career.

He played 4 tests. I know he did well there and that he did well in WSC. But he didn't play test cricket and that is designated as the highest form of the game. He sadly didn't play enough to make any list.

I can consider him one of the greatest commentators of all time though. A very underrated and knowledgeable commentator with a very good voice.

My list from the players I have seen would be:

Jacques Kallis
Dale Steyn
Shaun Pollock
Allan Donald
Graeme Smith
AB de Villiers
Hashim Amla
Makhaya Ntini
Gary Kirsten
Herschelle Gibbs


If only Cronje didn't fix, he would have made the list comfortably.
 
Bilal7 said:
1) Jacques Kallis.
2) Dale Steyn.
3) Allan Donald.
4) Graeme Smith.
5) Hashim Amla.
6) AB de Villers.
7) Shaun Pollock

These would be my greatest South African cricketers, with the top five being ATGs and the other two being borderline-ATGs.

Graeme Pollock played what, 20 test matches? Too small a sample size for me, even Hussey and Pujara looked incredible for their first few matches. Mike Procter played a grand total of seven test matches.
Click to expand...

Except, except, except.

Barry Richards and Mike Procter both played SuperTests nine year after South Africa was thrown out of cricket.

In the SuperTests they only played against West Indies and Australia - the next best two teams of the time - and their batting and bowling averages respectively were almost identical to in their official Tests:

Barry Richards batting averages:
Tests 1969-70: 72.57
SuperTests 1977-79: 79.25

Mike Procter bowling averages:
Tests: 15.02
SuperTests: 18.55

And Graeme Pollock played the unofficial West Indies team in 1983-85, which had the second best bowling attack in the world behind the real West Indies, and was still scoring centuries in his forties.
 
Junaids said:
Except, except, except.

Barry Richards and Mike Procter both played SuperTests nine year after South Africa was thrown out of cricket.

In the SuperTests they only played against West Indies and Australia - the next best two teams of the time - and their batting and bowling averages respectively were almost identical to in their official Tests:

Barry Richards batting averages:
Tests 1969-70: 72.57
SuperTests 1977-79: 79.25

Mike Procter bowling averages:
Tests: 15.02
SuperTests: 18.55

And Graeme Pollock played the unofficial West Indies team in 1983-85, which had the second best bowling attack in the world behind the real West Indies, and was still scoring centuries in his forties.
Click to expand...

Put them #1 and #2 in the supertests ranking and no one will argue with you. They did absolutely nothing in test matches and therefore do not deserve a mention here.

Why are we acting like they were victims of apartheid? They were white cricketers, right? Even though they might not have discriminated against Black people, their community was punished for a perfectly valid reason and people need to stop viewing them as heroes.
 
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