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Greatest ODI all-rounder ever?

Ted123

Tape Ball Star
Joined
Sep 26, 2017
Runs
653
Here are the top 10 contenders in no order in my view:

Sanath Jayasuriya( SL)
Kapil Dev( Ind)
Imran Khan( Pak)
Abdul Razzak( Pak)
Lance Klusenar( SA)
Jacques Kallis (SA)
Shane Watson(Aus)
Andrew Flintoff( Eng)
Chris Cairns( NZ)
Shakib-ul-hasan( BD)
 
Dev followed by Jayasuriya.Won it with the weaker sides.

Great list by OP.
 
Kapil for me. Even more impressively he did it with hardly any bowling support whatsoever. What a legend.
 
Imran Khan/Kapil Dev/Jacques Kallis


The rest can fight for second place
 
Dev or Klusner

Probably Dev because he was so ahead of his time with the bat, had a strike rate of 95
 
Stats (min 3000 runs 125 wickets):

[table=class:grid][tr][td]Player[/td][td]Span[/td][td]Mat[/td][td]Runs[/td][td]HS[/td][td]Bat Av[/td][td]100[/td][td]Wkts[/td][td]Bowl Av[/td][td]5[/td][td]Ct[/td][td]St[/td][td]Ave Diff[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]JH Kallis (Afr/ICC/SA)[/td][td]1996-2014[/td][td]328[/td][td]11579[/td][td]139[/td][td]44.36[/td][td]17[/td][td]273[/td][td]31.79[/td][td]2[/td][td]131[/td][td]0[/td][td]12.56[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]L Klusener (SA)[/td][td]1996-2004[/td][td]171[/td][td]3576[/td][td]103*[/td][td]41.10[/td][td]2[/td][td]192[/td][td]29.95[/td][td]6[/td][td]35[/td][td]0[/td][td]11.15[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]SR Watson (AUS)[/td][td]2002-2015[/td][td]190[/td][td]5757[/td][td]185*[/td][td]40.54[/td][td]9[/td][td]168[/td][td]31.79[/td][td]0[/td][td]64[/td][td]0[/td][td]8.74[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]A Flintoff (ENG/ICC)[/td][td]1999-2009[/td][td]141[/td][td]3394[/td][td]123[/td][td]32.01[/td][td]3[/td][td]169[/td][td]24.38[/td][td]2[/td][td]47[/td][td]0[/td][td]7.63[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Imran Khan (PAK)[/td][td]1974-1992[/td][td]175[/td][td]3709[/td][td]102*[/td][td]33.41[/td][td]1[/td][td]182[/td][td]26.61[/td][td]1[/td][td]36[/td][td]0[/td][td]6.79[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Shakib Al Hasan (BDESH)[/td][td]2006-2017[/td][td]180[/td][td]5080[/td][td]134*[/td][td]34.79[/td][td]7[/td][td]226[/td][td]29.95[/td][td]1[/td][td]42[/td][td]0[/td][td]4.83[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]A Symonds (AUS)[/td][td]1998-2009[/td][td]198[/td][td]5088[/td][td]156[/td][td]39.75[/td][td]6[/td][td]133[/td][td]37.25[/td][td]1[/td][td]82[/td][td]0[/td][td]2.49[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]CH Gayle (ICC/WI)[/td][td]1999-2017[/td][td]273[/td][td]9394[/td][td]215[/td][td]37.42[/td][td]22[/td][td]163[/td][td]35.20[/td][td]1[/td][td]115[/td][td]0[/td][td]2.21[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]SM Pollock (Afr/ICC/SA)[/td][td]1996-2008[/td][td]303[/td][td]3519[/td][td]130[/td][td]26.45[/td][td]1[/td][td]393[/td][td]24.50[/td][td]5[/td][td]108[/td][td]0[/td][td]1.95[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]SR Tendulkar (INDIA)[/td][td]1989-2012[/td][td]463[/td][td]18426[/td][td]200*[/td][td]44.83[/td][td]49[/td][td]154[/td][td]44.48[/td][td]2[/td][td]140[/td][td]0[/td][td]0.35[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]CL Hooper (WI)[/td][td]1987-2003[/td][td]227[/td][td]5761[/td][td]113*[/td][td]35.34[/td][td]7[/td][td]193[/td][td]36.05[/td][td]0[/td][td]120[/td][td]0[/td][td]-0.7[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]SR Waugh (AUS)[/td][td]1986-2002[/td][td]325[/td][td]7569[/td][td]120*[/td][td]32.90[/td][td]3[/td][td]195[/td][td]34.67[/td][td]0[/td][td]111[/td][td]0[/td][td]-1.76[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Abdul Razzaq (Asia/PAK)[/td][td]1996-2011[/td][td]265[/td][td]5080[/td][td]112[/td][td]29.70[/td][td]3[/td][td]269[/td][td]31.83[/td][td]3[/td][td]35[/td][td]0[/td][td]-2.12[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Shoaib Malik (PAK)[/td][td]1999-2017[/td][td]257[/td][td]6926[/td][td]143[/td][td]35.70[/td][td]9[/td][td]154[/td][td]38.45[/td][td]0[/td][td]90[/td][td]0[/td][td]-2.75[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]SB Styris (NZ)[/td][td]1999-2011[/td][td]188[/td][td]4483[/td][td]141[/td][td]32.48[/td][td]4[/td][td]137[/td][td]35.32[/td][td]1[/td][td]73[/td][td]0[/td][td]-2.83[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]CL Cairns (ICC/NZ)[/td][td]1991-2006[/td][td]215[/td][td]4950[/td][td]115[/td][td]29.46[/td][td]4[/td][td]201[/td][td]32.80[/td][td]1[/td][td]66[/td][td]0[/td][td]-3.34[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]N Kapil Dev (INDIA)[/td][td]1978-1994[/td][td]225[/td][td]3783[/td][td]175*[/td][td]23.79[/td][td]1[/td][td]253[/td][td]27.45[/td][td]1[/td][td]71[/td][td]0[/td][td]-3.65[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Mohammad Hafeez (PAK)[/td][td]2003-2017[/td][td]195[/td][td]5959[/td][td]140*[/td][td]32.92[/td][td]11[/td][td]136[/td][td]36.90[/td][td]0[/td][td]73[/td][td]0[/td][td]-3.98[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]ST Jayasuriya (Asia/SL)[/td][td]1989-2011[/td][td]445[/td][td]13430[/td][td]189[/td][td]32.36[/td][td]28[/td][td]323[/td][td]36.75[/td][td]4[/td][td]123[/td][td]0[/td][td]-4.39[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]RJ Shastri (INDIA)[/td][td]1981-1992[/td][td]150[/td][td]3108[/td][td]109[/td][td]29.04[/td][td]4[/td][td]129[/td][td]36.04[/td][td]1[/td][td]40[/td][td]0[/td][td]-6.99[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Wasim Akram (PAK)[/td][td]1984-2003[/td][td]356[/td][td]3717[/td][td]86[/td][td]16.52[/td][td]0[/td][td]502[/td][td]23.52[/td][td]6[/td][td]88[/td][td]0[/td][td]-7[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]CZ Harris (NZ)[/td][td]1990-2004[/td][td]250[/td][td]4379[/td][td]130[/td][td]29.00[/td][td]1[/td][td]203[/td][td]37.50[/td][td]1[/td][td]96[/td][td]0[/td][td]-8.5[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Shahid Afridi (Asia/ICC/PAK)[/td][td]1996-2015[/td][td]398[/td][td]8064[/td][td]124[/td][td]23.57[/td][td]6[/td][td]395[/td][td]34.51[/td][td]9[/td][td]127[/td][td]0[/td][td]-10.93[/td][/tr][/table]
 
Yes, I was just wondering since the first few posts didn't really mention him.

Stats are really good.

He had relatively a short career for his era. His number of runs are in the same range as Pollock, IK and Kapil despite being a much better batsman. If he had 6k runs rather than 3K runs, it would have looked much better.
 
Shahid Afridi.. 7-12 (best bowling figures)
and 100(36) fastest century for 20 years. Speaks a lot about him. What a super star he was.
 
How are people calling K Dev best with a 23 batting average?

Strike Rate and impact towards the game. Won the WC for his team with players who won't even make it to Indian alltime odi XI.
 
Should include WK Batsmen as well as they are also doing their best in two facets of the game.

Including Keeper best All rounder is

Gilly
Dhoni

Without Keeper

K Dev
S Jayasuriya
L Klusener
J Kallis
 
Strike Rate and impact towards the game. Won the WC for his team with players who won't even make it to Indian alltime odi XI.

This.

Prior to 83 WC most players excluding Kapil never had any belief that they would reach Semis let alone win the whole thing. Kapil not only installed the belief of winning the WC among his team mates but also played one of the best knocks in WC history. His stats are not great because he was lone work horse and has to do bulk of bowling. If Kapil had bowling partners like Imran had, his stats would be far better than what it is now. I still rate Imran Khan better All rounder in test format, but in Odis Kapil’s destructive batting was something else that only Viv could’ve matched.
 
Dev is overrated. His ODI exploits were basically pinch hitting sans 1 knock v a (then) associate. His bowling was solid but not world beating. More posts after coffee.
 
How are people calling K Dev best with a 23 batting average?

What was average score of teams in 80s? How much players averaged in 6-7 batting position? How quickly they scored?

You don't need to answer that. Just putting it for thought process. Anyway, top all rounder is also due to very good bowling performance and very good fielder. ICC ranking doesn't account for fielding. He was occupying the rank 1 for roughly 10 years. Add his good fielding to that.
 
How are people calling K Dev best with a 23 batting average?

You are probably looking at 23 from current era. Anyway, here is how he was ranked as a batsman.

Kapil_batting.jpg

It's rare to have a gun bowler ranked among the top 20 batsmen for such a long period. He was among the top 20 rank in 80s as a batsman. I may or my not rate him among the top 20, but it gives you some idea about why even an average of 23 may be not bad in that era if you are scoring it quickly.
 
Razzaq has to be up there surely? Some excellent bowling spells and his clean hitting under pressure winning Pak many a game that seemed lost.
 
Without looking closely into stats, Klusner.

PS Watson has some phenomenal stats backing him up well
 
Last edited:
Chris Cairns was pretty good as well in both formats
more than stats should look at impact, whether ODI or tests
 
Kapil's batting average is too low while Imran and Kallis batted too slow.

So, Klusner remains the obvious choice. Phenomenal batting average and SR in combination with great WC performances and ability to tear apart top class bowling attacks consistently.
 
If we are rating folks as best alrounder on the basis of one WC, then going by CT Fakhar Zaman should be rated as the best batsman in the history of ODIs if he retires tomorrow.
 
WC performance alone can't justify player's position. However everyone would agree that you need at least one good WC in order to be considered GOAT in shorter format.
 
If we are rating folks as best alrounder on the basis of one WC, then going by CT Fakhar Zaman should be rated as the best batsman in the history of ODIs if he retires tomorrow.

You talking about Klusenar?? Many rate Klusenar as SA's greatest odi cricketer.

His finishing skills are only next to Bevan and Dhoni and then he is a good fifth bowler too.

He has played 163 odis and carried the team in Wc 1999 like anything.

It was SA's best chance to win the WC and he was their best player in the team.
 
You talking about Klusenar?? Many rate Klusenar as SA's greatest odi cricketer.

His finishing skills are only next to Bevan and Dhoni and then he is a good fifth bowler too.

He has played 163 odis and carried the team in Wc 1999 like anything.

It was SA's best chance to win the WC and he was their best player in the team.

Klusener was a butcher with the bat in that WC. Absolutely gun... but his bowling was more of stop gap tbh. Imran, Kapil and Kallis were all better bowlers than him.
 
I'd go for Kapil, who was a limited overs cricketer ahead of his time. He possessed the whole lot, hard hitting batsman, effective swing bowler, and a superlative fielder. Second on my list would also be a somewhat... ahem left-field choice in more ways than one in Sanath Jayasuriya.
 
Klusener was a butcher with the bat in that WC. Absolutely gun... but his bowling was more of stop gap tbh. Imran, Kapil and Kallis were all better bowlers than him.

Imran and Kapil are better bowlers because bowling was their primary job.

Klusenar was at par with Kallis in the bowling department.
 
Surprise no mention of Hardik Pandya.

The Kpail Dev Overrating is tremendous here. you just have to be indian and you are automatically overrated on pakpassion.
 
Surprise no mention of Hardik Pandya.

The Kpail Dev Overrating is tremendous here. you just have to be indian and you are automatically overrated on pakpassion.


Yes there are some who ovverate Indian players and there are people like you who hate on Indian players no matter what they do.
 
The problem with Dev was that he was never the top bowler or top batsman. His batting average was like 23. Now, before anyone brings his SR into discussion. An average of 23 is still very poor no matter if he batted at almost 100 SR. Afridi has even higher SR at similar average and we all know what a liability he was most of the time.

There has never been a standout ODI all-rounder. I will pick among Kallis, Pollock, Klusener, and Watson.
 
The problem with Dev was that he was never the top bowler or top batsman. His batting average was like 23. Now, before anyone brings his SR into discussion. An average of 23 is still very poor no matter if he batted at almost 100 SR. Afridi has even higher SR at similar average and we all know what a liability he was most of the time.

There has never been a standout ODI all-rounder. I will pick among Kallis, Pollock, Klusener, and Watson.

Danke. My point exactly. Kapil is overrated here. It is probably Klusner or Flintoff for genuine two-bow impact. Watson, Cairns....
 
What about Bevan? If Tendulkar is in the list, then Bevan should be too. Good differential between batting and bowling averages!
 
The problem with Dev was that he was never the top bowler or top batsman. His batting average was like 23. Now, before anyone brings his SR into discussion. An average of 23 is still very poor no matter if he batted at almost 100 SR. Afridi has even higher SR at similar average and we all know what a liability he was most of the time.

Why do you think that he was not a top bowler. He was ranked 1-2 for 1-2 years in his career. He was mostly ranked among the top 5-6 in ODI bowling during his entire career.

Anyway, Top all rounder doesn't have to be top batsman or top bowler. It's about bringing enough in batting, bowling and fielding.

About Afridi - Afridi was ranked among the top 20 batsmen for zero days. Kapil was among the top 20 rank in batting for a entire decade. Clearly, 23 average in 80s is not the same as doing it in current era.

If you still want to see how they stack up in all round performance,

all round.jpg


It's clear that Kapil held top rank in all round category in pretty much entire 80s. He did it due to being among the top 20 batsmen in entire 80 and among the top 5-6 bowler at the same time. His fielding was top class as well and that's not even accounted in ICC ranking.

It's fine to put some other names, but Afridi's example due to batting average is a wrong one here.
 
What about Bevan? If Tendulkar is in the list, then Bevan should be too. Good differential between batting and bowling averages!

They were not all rounders. I personally think that for getting rated as an all rounder you have to break into top 25-30 rank in both skills, otherwise we will start calling even 50th rank bowler or batsman an all rounder due to having a very strong one skill.
 
Not surprised actually that no one is mentioning Viv, because he was so good with bat, hardly anyone noticed his bowling.
 
Not surprised actually that no one is mentioning Viv, because he was so good with bat, hardly anyone noticed his bowling.

Forgot to mention - Viv won a MoM for his fielding (Neheru Cup SF) and won an WC final with 3 direct hit run outs............
 
Forgot to mention - Viv won a MoM for his fielding (Neheru Cup SF) and won an WC final with 3 direct hit run outs............

Viv is the greatest cricketer any of us have ever seen. (Note seen - who here saw Bradman or Sobers - beyond fleetingly)
 
It is Lance Klusener... he was a proper bowler who could be relied on to bowl 10 overs and a dynamite lower order batsman. He performed in the 99 World Cup in a legendary way.

I am surprised by Kapils name coming up as he was more of a handy ODI batsman with 1 ton against Zimbabwe.
 
Come on is this even a argument after the CT Gary Hafeez Sobers. Although I must say Shahid Afridi is a close second.

cl_afridi-funny.jpg
 
Why do you think that he was not a top bowler. He was ranked 1-2 for 1-2 years in his career. He was mostly ranked among the top 5-6 in ODI bowling during his entire career.

Anyway, Top all rounder doesn't have to be top batsman or top bowler. It's about bringing enough in batting, bowling and fielding.

About Afridi - Afridi was ranked among the top 20 batsmen for zero days. Kapil was among the top 20 rank in batting for a entire decade. Clearly, 23 average in 80s is not the same as doing it in current era.

If you still want to see how they stack up in all round performance,

View attachment 76932


It's clear that Kapil held top rank in all round category in pretty much entire 80s. He did it due to being among the top 20 batsmen in entire 80 and among the top 5-6 bowler at the same time. His fielding was top class as well and that's not even accounted in ICC ranking.

It's fine to put some other names, but Afridi's example due to batting average is a wrong one here.

I might have phrased it wrong. I meant best bowler or batsman overall.

Are you comparing ODI batsmen of Afridi's time with ODI batsmen of Kapil's time? It was far easier to be among the top 20 ODI batsman in the 70s and 80s than 90s onwards.

Kapil scored 3783 runs in 198 innings, which is 19 runs per inning. Afridi scored 8064 in 369 which is 22 runs per inning.

Even in the wickets column, Kapil took just 253 wickets in 221 innings as compared to Afridi's 395 in 372 innings (half of Afridi's career was a part-timer).

Kapil was just lucky to be in the right place at the right time when the competition was poor.

Kapil is not even among the top 20 ODI bowlers or top 40 ODI batsmen of all time.
 
I might have phrased it wrong. I meant best bowler or batsman overall.

Are you comparing ODI batsmen of Afridi's time with ODI batsmen of Kapil's time? It was far easier to be among the top 20 ODI batsman in the 70s and 80s than 90s onwards.

Kapil scored 3783 runs in 198 innings, which is 19 runs per inning. Afridi scored 8064 in 369 which is 22 runs per inning.

Even in the wickets column, Kapil took just 253 wickets in 221 innings as compared to Afridi's 395 in 372 innings (half of Afridi's career was a part-timer).

Kapil was just lucky to be in the right place at the right time when the competition was poor.

Kapil is not even among the top 20 ODI bowlers or top 40 ODI batsmen of all time.

If Kapil is not on the top 20 ODI bowlers, then where is Imran. Following is the comparison of the bowling rankings of Kapil and Imran over their ODI careers
Screen Shot 2017-10-29 at 10.10.26.jpg

You can see clearly was ranked higher than Imran throughout their ODI careers.
 
Imran Khan. By some distance. Then you can have Pollock, Kallis, Dev, Afridi, Jayasuriya, Razzaq, Flintoff, etc in any which order you please.
 
Zulu, Kapil, kallis, Jayasurya all deserve to be mentioned.. Depending on conditions any of them could be the best..

Don't know why people are mentioning IK maybe coz he's Pakistani? But in ODI's he doesn't deserve to be mentioned as a top AR..
 
Kapil Dev. By some distance. Then you can have Klusener, Kalis, Razzaq and Pollock. Also was a huge fan of Big Mac growing up.
 
How are people calling K Dev best with a 23 batting average?

Check the list of top 20 run getters of 1980s.

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/en...0;spanval1=span;template=results;type=batting

Kapil was among top 15. Most of the teams had batsmen averaging in 25-35 range during those years. John Wright, Srikanth, Rameez Raja, Ranatunga, Desilva, Gower, Azhar, Border, Gatting or Saleem Malik, you had so many specialist bats who were regulars in ODIs with averages of 26-33.

And then Richards with SR of 91, Abbas with SR of 87, Malik with SR of 86, rest all ~75 or below and you had Kapil with SR of 101.
 
80's AR Stats (min 1000 runs , 90 Wickets)
It should have been 100 Wickets , but then Ian Botham would have been left out.

[table= class: grid, align: center]
[tr][td]Player [/td][td]Mat [/td][td]Runs [/td][td]Bat Av [/td][td]Bat SR [/td][td]100 [/td][td]50 [/td][td]Wkts [/td][td]Bowl Av [/td][td]Econ [/td][td]Bowl SR [/td][td]5W [/td][td]Ave Diff [/td][td]Wkts / Mat [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Imran Khan [/td][td]124 [/td][td]2653 [/td][td]33.58 [/td][td]75.62 [/td][td]1 [/td][td]12 [/td][td]144 [/td][td]22.95 [/td][td]3.88 [/td][td]35.4 [/td][td]1 [/td][td]10.63 [/td][td]1.16 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]V Richards [/td][td]156 [/td][td]5559 [/td][td]45.94 [/td][td]91.61 [/td][td]8 [/td][td]40 [/td][td]108 [/td][td]35.5 [/td][td]4.48 [/td][td]47.4 [/td][td]2 [/td][td]10.44 [/td][td]0.69 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]R Hadlee [/td][td]92 [/td][td]1465 [/td][td]21.54 [/td][td]76.38 [/td][td]0 [/td][td]3 [/td][td]133 [/td][td]19.78 [/td][td]3.26 [/td][td]36.3 [/td][td]5 [/td][td]1.75 [/td][td]1.45 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Kapil Dev [/td][td]143 [/td][td]2869 [/td][td]26.81 [/td][td]101.91 [/td][td]1 [/td][td]14 [/td][td]168 [/td][td]26.25 [/td][td]3.68 [/td][td]42.6 [/td][td]1 [/td][td]0.56 [/td][td]1.17 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]M Nazar [/td][td]112 [/td][td]2493 [/td][td]25.7 [/td][td]52.47 [/td][td]0 [/td][td]15 [/td][td]106 [/td][td]30.02 [/td][td]4.27 [/td][td]42.1 [/td][td]1 [/td][td]-4.32 [/td][td]0.95 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]R Shastri [/td][td]119 [/td][td]2323 [/td][td]29.03 [/td][td]65.52 [/td][td]2 [/td][td]14 [/td][td]109 [/td][td]35.47 [/td][td]4.21 [/td][td]50.4 [/td][td]0 [/td][td]-6.43 [/td][td]0.92 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]I Botham [/td][td]75 [/td][td]1452 [/td][td]24.2 [/td][td]82.26 [/td][td]0 [/td][td]7 [/td][td]91 [/td][td]30.76 [/td][td]4.08 [/td][td]45.1 [/td][td]0 [/td][td]-6.56 [/td][td]1.21 [/td][/tr]
[/table]

80's WC stats (min 100 runs , 10 wickets)
[table= class: grid, align: center]
[tr][td]Player [/td][td]Span [/td][td]Mat [/td][td]Runs [/td][td]Bat Av [/td][td]100 [/td][td]Wkts [/td][td]Bowl Av [/td][td]5W [/td][td]Ave Diff [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Abdul Qadir (PAK) [/td][td]1983-1987 [/td][td]13 [/td][td]118 [/td][td]59 [/td][td]0 [/td][td]24 [/td][td]21.08 [/td][td]1 [/td][td]37.91 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Imran Khan (PAK) [/td][td]1983-1987 [/td][td]14 [/td][td]430 [/td][td]43 [/td][td]1 [/td][td]17 [/td][td]13.05 [/td][td]0 [/td][td]29.94 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]SR Waugh (AUS) [/td][td]1987-1987 [/td][td]8 [/td][td]167 [/td][td]55.66 [/td][td]0 [/td][td]11 [/td][td]26.18 [/td][td]0 [/td][td]29.48 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]N Kapil Dev (INDIA) [/td][td]1983-1987 [/td][td]15 [/td][td]455 [/td][td]56.87 [/td][td]1 [/td][td]17 [/td][td]29.64 [/td][td]1 [/td][td]27.22 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]S Madan Lal (INDIA) [/td][td]1983-1983 [/td][td]8 [/td][td]102 [/td][td]34 [/td][td]0 [/td][td]17 [/td][td]16.76 [/td][td]0 [/td][td]17.23 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]MC Snedden (NZ) [/td][td]1983-1987 [/td][td]9 [/td][td]218 [/td][td]27.25 [/td][td]0 [/td][td]10 [/td][td]45.5 [/td][td]0 [/td][td]-18.24 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]RJ Shastri (INDIA) [/td][td]1983-1987 [/td][td]12 [/td][td]103 [/td][td]12.87 [/td][td]0 [/td][td]11 [/td][td]32.81 [/td][td]0 [/td][td]-19.94 [/td][/tr]
[/table]
 
80's AR Stats (min 1000 runs , 90 Wickets)
It should have been 100 Wickets , but then Ian Botham would have been left out.

[table= class: grid, align: center]
[tr][td]Player [/td][td]Mat [/td][td]Runs [/td][td]Bat Av [/td][td]Bat SR [/td][td]100 [/td][td]50 [/td][td]Wkts [/td][td]Bowl Av [/td][td]Econ [/td][td]Bowl SR [/td][td]5W [/td][td]Ave Diff [/td][td]Wkts / Mat [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Imran Khan [/td][td]124 [/td][td]2653 [/td][td]33.58 [/td][td]75.62 [/td][td]1 [/td][td]12 [/td][td]144 [/td][td]22.95 [/td][td]3.88 [/td][td]35.4 [/td][td]1 [/td][td]10.63 [/td][td]1.16 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]V Richards [/td][td]156 [/td][td]5559 [/td][td]45.94 [/td][td]91.61 [/td][td]8 [/td][td]40 [/td][td]108 [/td][td]35.5 [/td][td]4.48 [/td][td]47.4 [/td][td]2 [/td][td]10.44 [/td][td]0.69 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]R Hadlee [/td][td]92 [/td][td]1465 [/td][td]21.54 [/td][td]76.38 [/td][td]0 [/td][td]3 [/td][td]133 [/td][td]19.78 [/td][td]3.26 [/td][td]36.3 [/td][td]5 [/td][td]1.75 [/td][td]1.45 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Kapil Dev [/td][td]143 [/td][td]2869 [/td][td]26.81 [/td][td]101.91 [/td][td]1 [/td][td]14 [/td][td]168 [/td][td]26.25 [/td][td]3.68 [/td][td]42.6 [/td][td]1 [/td][td]0.56 [/td][td]1.17 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]M Nazar [/td][td]112 [/td][td]2493 [/td][td]25.7 [/td][td]52.47 [/td][td]0 [/td][td]15 [/td][td]106 [/td][td]30.02 [/td][td]4.27 [/td][td]42.1 [/td][td]1 [/td][td]-4.32 [/td][td]0.95 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]R Shastri [/td][td]119 [/td][td]2323 [/td][td]29.03 [/td][td]65.52 [/td][td]2 [/td][td]14 [/td][td]109 [/td][td]35.47 [/td][td]4.21 [/td][td]50.4 [/td][td]0 [/td][td]-6.43 [/td][td]0.92 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]I Botham [/td][td]75 [/td][td]1452 [/td][td]24.2 [/td][td]82.26 [/td][td]0 [/td][td]7 [/td][td]91 [/td][td]30.76 [/td][td]4.08 [/td][td]45.1 [/td][td]0 [/td][td]-6.56 [/td][td]1.21 [/td][/tr]
[/table]

80's WC stats (min 100 runs , 10 wickets)
[table= class: grid, align: center]
[tr][td]Player [/td][td]Span [/td][td]Mat [/td][td]Runs [/td][td]Bat Av [/td][td]100 [/td][td]Wkts [/td][td]Bowl Av [/td][td]5W [/td][td]Ave Diff [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Abdul Qadir (PAK) [/td][td]1983-1987 [/td][td]13 [/td][td]118 [/td][td]59 [/td][td]0 [/td][td]24 [/td][td]21.08 [/td][td]1 [/td][td]37.91 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Imran Khan (PAK) [/td][td]1983-1987 [/td][td]14 [/td][td]430 [/td][td]43 [/td][td]1 [/td][td]17 [/td][td]13.05 [/td][td]0 [/td][td]29.94 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]SR Waugh (AUS) [/td][td]1987-1987 [/td][td]8 [/td][td]167 [/td][td]55.66 [/td][td]0 [/td][td]11 [/td][td]26.18 [/td][td]0 [/td][td]29.48 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]N Kapil Dev (INDIA) [/td][td]1983-1987 [/td][td]15 [/td][td]455 [/td][td]56.87 [/td][td]1 [/td][td]17 [/td][td]29.64 [/td][td]1 [/td][td]27.22 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]S Madan Lal (INDIA) [/td][td]1983-1983 [/td][td]8 [/td][td]102 [/td][td]34 [/td][td]0 [/td][td]17 [/td][td]16.76 [/td][td]0 [/td][td]17.23 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]MC Snedden (NZ) [/td][td]1983-1987 [/td][td]9 [/td][td]218 [/td][td]27.25 [/td][td]0 [/td][td]10 [/td][td]45.5 [/td][td]0 [/td][td]-18.24 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]RJ Shastri (INDIA) [/td][td]1983-1987 [/td][td]12 [/td][td]103 [/td][td]12.87 [/td][td]0 [/td][td]11 [/td][td]32.81 [/td][td]0 [/td][td]-19.94 [/td][/tr]
[/table]

Great stuff mate. Could you add SR to the Wc stats too.
 
It was far easier to be among the top 20 ODI batsman in the 70s and 80s than 90s onwards.

Why do you think it was far easier to among the top 15-20 ODI batsman for an all rounder in 80s? Others were not trying or some other reason? Comparing averages across decades of ODI is meaningless, you can only compare relative record. Ranking is relative for each era.
 
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Great stuff mate. Could you add SR to the Wc stats too.

Anyone who saw cricket in the 80s knows Imran Khan was far superior to the other 3 ARs. We have eyes and we saw the gulf in class between Khan and Dev. Statsguru fans make me laugh and demean the discussion.
 
Anyone who saw cricket in the 80s knows Imran Khan was far superior to the other 3 ARs. We have eyes and we saw the gulf in class between Khan and Dev. Statsguru fans make me laugh and demean the discussion.

Then why was Dev constantly ranked as the best all rounder in ODIs throughout the decade.

Unless you haven't realised, this thread is about ODIs
 
Then why was Dev constantly ranked as the best all rounder in ODIs throughout the decade.

Unless you haven't realised, this thread is about ODIs

I know this thread is about ODIs. Dev had his utility in terms of batting impact but Imran was a much more accomplished batsman. Dev gained points for consistency especially as he played for a generally weak team in that era. But the data (you seem to go by data, please let us know your age so we can see if you watched these guys live or not) details Khan was a much more allround player with superior returns.
 
I know this thread is about ODIs. Dev had his utility in terms of batting impact but Imran was a much more accomplished batsman. Dev gained points for consistency especially as he played for a generally weak team in that era. But the data (you seem to go by data, please let us know your age so we can see if you watched these guys live or not) details Khan was a much more allround player with superior returns.

Was he for his entire career? or his accomplishment as a batsman is mostly built on when he pretty started bowling a lot less?
 
Also, mixing format is wrong. Kallis was a gun test all rounder. I don't rate him that high in the ODI format. Kallis was more valuable for SA as a bowler bowling many tight overs. He lost many matches for SA due to not able to score quickly even when SA needed it. He started hitting big in the last few years. Wish he had made that change earlier.
 
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Klusener was the biggest ODI matchwinner as an all-rounder than I have seen. I will always have a peak-form Klusener in my ODI team if given the option.
 
Sanath seems to be underrated too. So the WC semis with the bowl and was always a good fifth bowling option.
 
Why do you think it was far easier to among the top 15-20 ODI batsman for an all rounder in 80s? Others were not trying or some other reason? Comparing averages across decades of ODI is meaningless, you can only compare relative record. Ranking is relative for each era.

How many ODI batsmen from the 80s and 70s make even the third string all time ODI XI?
 
How many ODI batsmen from the 80s and 70s make even the third string all time ODI XI?

Let's stick to just 80s , one decade, because we are taking about 80s.

Viv
Miandad
Greenidge
Lamb
Jones
Martin Crowe
Abbas
Gooch


8-9 names just from my memory. Most of them will make into the third string ODI XI.

You are way underestimating how difficult it can be for an all rounder to be among the top 10-20 batsman for entire decade. Just by number it will be easier in 80s because less players were playing in 80s, but even after normalizing it will be very hard for an all rounder to consistently be among the top 15-25 rank for entire 10 years.
 
Let's stick to just 80s , one decade, because we are taking about 80s.

Viv
Miandad
Greenidge
Lamb
Jones
Martin Crowe
Abbas
Gooch


8-9 names just from my memory. Most of them will make into the third string ODI XI.

You are way underestimating how difficult it can be for an all rounder to be among the top 10-20 batsman for entire decade. Just by number it will be easier in 80s because less players were playing in 80s, but even after normalizing it will be very hard for an all rounder to consistently be among the top 15-25 rank for entire 10 years.

Except Viv, Zaheer, Greenidge, and Miandad none on your list will make it.

How can you even rate a batsman who can n average scored 19 runs per inning?
 
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