Greatest ODI batsman of this millennium (2000 onwards)

[Ab Fan]

Who do you think is the greatest ODI batsman of this millenium? The contenders are as follows :-

Ricky Ponting

Sachin Tendulkar

Kumar Sangakkara

Mahendra Singh Dhoni

AB de Villiers

Virat Kohli

Hashim Amla

Rohit Sharma

David Warner

Babar Azam

Any other??

 

[Xoib]

Sachin for me with Ponting a close second the bottom half of that list benefited from playing majority of their games on flat motorways

 

[MenInG]

Who do you think is the greatest ODI batsman of this millenium? The contenders are as follows :-

Ricky Ponting

Sachin Tendulkar

Kumar Sangakkara

Mahendra Singh Dhoni

AB de Villiers

Virat Kohli

Hashim Amla

Rohit Sharma

David Warner

Babar Azam

Any other??

Who is your choice?

 

[Ab Fan]

Who is your choice?

Can we have a poll to find out the result? I will pick my choice too.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

I'm gonna say Kohli for now just because his record over a sustained period of time is phenomenal and unmatched.

But I genuinely feel that when all is said and done, Babar Azam will overtake him.

 

[Marooned]

Ponting easily.

 

[Waleed93]

Virat Kohli, followed by Sachin and then the rest.

Kohli is the ODI GOAT, his record in this format is simply out of this world.

If Babar manages to match and sustain Kohli level consistency for the next few years, and if Pakistan play enough ODIs, I see him going past most names on the list.

 

[Aman]

Babar Azam making this list is laughable.

He hasn't even played 100 ODIs yet and most of his 100s are against the likes of WI, Zimbabwe and SL.

 

[Aman]

I'm gonna say Kohli for now just because his record over a sustained period of time is phenomenal and unmatched.

But I genuinely feel that when all is said and done, Babar Azam will overtake him.

Doubt it, he will never be as dominant as Kohli was. And this is coming from someone who isn't a big fan of Kohli.

Given Kohli's decline, I'd favor Ponting or Sachin. Call it recency bias, there was a period where Kohli was scoring what felt like a century every other match. Since then he's fallen off a cliff so it's given the edge to Ponting and Sachin for me.

 

[Aman]

Sachin for me with Ponting a close second the bottom half of that list benefited from playing majority of their games on flat motorways

Yeah, this is a big reason why I'm favoring Sachin and Ponting. ODIs are bit of a joke these days with most games played on absolute roads and then there's 2 new balls. It's why so many players have big ton tallys when it use to mean more a decade back.

 

[sweep_shot]

Babar.
Kohli.
Tendulkar.
Dhoni.
Williamson.
Sangakara.
Kallis.
Ponting.
Jayawardene.
ABD.
Amla.
De Kock.

Just a few names come to mind.

 

[Mobashir]

Between Ponting and ABDV for me as of now.

Ponting dominated a different era with different averages and SR's. There was still this notion of getting out etc.

ABDV scored mountain of runs like no other did regarding the SR.

Babar can get there but he will have to do something no one can do for that.

 

[Nasty Naz]

I don't know if ABD is #1 but he warrants serious consideration IMO. Pretty sure he is the only one on the list with a 100+ SR & 50+ AVG. His peak from 2009 & on is absolutely mind blowing and his 2015 year surely has to sit at top of any seasons by batsmen with a 79.53 & 137 SR (!!) in 18 ODI matches. Those numbers are wild if its T20 but in ODI's, that is bonkers. One of the biggest reasons we've seen such a crazy transformation in the LOI format. A shame those stacked SA teams didn't win a WC.

 

[shamaan]

Babar Azam making this list is laughable.

He hasn't even played 100 ODIs yet and most of his 100s are against the likes of WI, Zimbabwe and SL.

How many centuries does Kohli have against Sri Lanka,West Indies,Bangladesh???

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

Doubt it, he will never be as dominant as Kohli was. And this is coming from someone who isn't a big fan of Kohli.

Given Kohli's decline, I'd favor Ponting or Sachin. Call it recency bias, there was a period where Kohli was scoring what felt like a century every other match. Since then he's fallen off a cliff so it's given the edge to Ponting and Sachin for me.

Well you don't know that. He's averaging 60 with a SR of 91. That's unreal and probably only matched by Kohli in the history of this format. Also important to note that Kohli has gone into decline at a fairly early age for a batter of his calibre. There's nothing to say that Babar will go into decline during his early 30s aswell.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

Babar Azam making this list is laughable.

He hasn't even played 100 ODIs yet and most of his 100s are against the likes of WI, Zimbabwe and SL.

What's laughable about averaging 60 with a SR of 91?

Also, Babar has as many centuries against Sri Lanka as he does against Australia, and as many against Zimbabwe as he does against England. So stop floating this myth that he only scores against lower ranked teams. Because it is factually incorrect. Most of his runs have come against England (816), followed by West Indies (639) and then Australia (588).

 

[QalandarFan]

AB De Villiers hand down for me the man scored 25 hundreds in ODI cricket and not one came at less than a run a ball. Pure match winner, he could flip a game on it's head by himself with ease. I've never seen a player quite like AB and don't think we ever will see another like him. The shots he played with the ease with which he played them, he was a magician with the bat. He retired too early imo.

 

[QalandarFan]

I'm gonna say Kohli for now just because his record over a sustained period of time is phenomenal and unmatched.

But I genuinely feel that when all is said and done, Babar Azam will overtake him.

Unfortunately the problem with that is I just don't know if Pakistan (or other countries in general) will play that many ODI's anymore. I mean what we've played 10 ODI's in total in the past 2 years I believe and I get with Covid thing slowed down and all. But Virat already has 12K runs, imo Babar needs to get at least 12K runs to overtake Kohli and right now he's at about 4500.

Kohli has played 34 ODI's in a single calendar year twice. The most Babar has ever played in a year is 20 and that was the world cup year. Plus Babar is almost 28 so I just don't know if he'll end up playing the sheer amount of ODI's in his peak right now that Kohli got the benefit of playing and unfortunately that will weigh against him strongly. He'll have to have an extended peak like Younis did in Tests if he wants to crack the 12K run mark because I don't see it happening for at least 10 years with the low number of international matches Pakistan plays.

Hopefully, I'm wrong and Pakistan starts scheduling more matches in upcoming years, but I've been hoping that forever and it never really happens lol.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

Unfortunately the problem with that is I just don't know if Pakistan (or other countries in general) will play that many ODI's anymore. I mean what we've played 10 ODI's in total in the past 2 years I believe and I get with Covid thing slowed down and all. But Virat already has 12K runs, imo Babar needs to get at least 12K runs to overtake Kohli and right now he's at about 4500.

Kohli has played 34 ODI's in a single calendar year twice. The most Babar has ever played in a year is 20 and that was the world cup year. Plus Babar is almost 28 so I just don't know if he'll end up playing the sheer amount of ODI's in his peak right now that Kohli got the benefit of playing and unfortunately that will weigh against him strongly. He'll have to have an extended peak like Younis did in Tests if he wants to crack the 12K run mark because I don't see it happening for at least 10 years with the low number of international matches Pakistan plays.

Hopefully, I'm wrong and Pakistan starts scheduling more matches in upcoming years, but I've been hoping that forever and it never really happens lol.

Babar does not have to play 350 ODIs or score 13000 runs to be considered the best ODI batter of all-time. Its highly likely that he will end up with stellar career stats anyway. But he does have to have a marked impact on the side's success. The runs and centuries he scores should win Pakistan matches. And ultimately, he has to win Pakistan an ICC trophy. Obviously its early to say too much, but those are some of the barometers of success that distinguish the best from the rest.

 

[Aman]

What's laughable about averaging 60 with a SR of 91?

Also, Babar has as many centuries against Sri Lanka as he does against Australia, and as many against Zimbabwe as he does against England. So stop floating this myth that he only scores against lower ranked teams. Because it is factually incorrect. Most of his runs have come against England (816), followed by West Indies (639) and then Australia (588).

Babar needs to score these runs when the world is watching. No one is watching these series against SL, WI or Zimbabwe. It's kind of like Sanga who didn't get acknowledged until later on in his career (ODIs) when he was scoring against everyone. He had gotten better but more importatnly it was against big name teams. Babar has the same issue in that he doesn't play for a big 3 team where most of their series even against minnows are followed.

Kohli has feasted against weak teams but he also has plenty of stand out performances which got him to that level.

And when I mean dominating, I don't mean middling 80-90 SR tons like Kane scores. Kohli dominated bowlers.
The only one I can think of from Babar is his 100 against us in the WC, even then that was a group stage match.

 

[Aman]

Babar needs to score these runs when the world is watching. No one is watching these series against SL, WI or Zimbabwe. It's kind of like Sanga who didn't get acknowledged until later on in his career (ODIs) when he was scoring against everyone. He had gotten better but more importatnly it was against big name teams. Babar has the same issue in that he doesn't play for a big 3 team where most of their series even against minnows are followed.

Kohli has feasted against weak teams but he also has plenty of stand out performances against top teams which got him to that level.

And when I mean dominating, I don't mean middling 80-90 SR tons like Kane and Amla score. Kohli dominated bowlers. To me that makes a player stand out more.

The only one I can think of from Babar is his 100 against us in the WC, even then that was a group stage match.

^

 

[Aman]

Babar.
Kohli.
Tendulkar.
Dhoni.
Williamson.
Sangakara.
Kallis.
Ponting.
Jayawardene.
ABD.
Amla.
De Kock.

Just a few names come to mind.

Kane lol? Taylor and Guptill have arguably been more impressive.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

Babar needs to score these runs when the world is watching. No one is watching these series against SL, WI or Zimbabwe. It's kind of like Sanga who didn't get acknowledged until later on in his career (ODIs) when he was scoring against everyone. He had gotten better but more importatnly it was against big name teams. Babar has the same issue in that he doesn't play for a big 3 team where most of their series even against minnows are followed.

Kohli has feasted against weak teams but he also has plenty of stand out performances which got him to that level.

And when I mean dominating, I don't mean middling 80-90 SR tons like Kane scores. Kohli dominated bowlers.
The only one I can think of from Babar is his 100 against us in the WC, even then that was a group stage match.

No offence but your response strikes me as a remarkably ignorant one.

For one thing, it doesn't seem like you bothered to read my second paragraph at all before you started writing because I very clearly dispelled the myth that Babar only scores against small teams.

Secondly, Babar amassed 474 runs at the last World Cup in what was his first appearance. That's more runs than any Pakistani batter has ever scored in a single tournament. And oh yeah, that tally included a hundred against New Zealand at Headingly aswell where he completely outclassed the New Zealand attack on a tricky pitch, when the world was watching. But it also included half-centuries against England, South Africa and Bangladesh in matches that Pakistan won.

So respectfully, you don't know what you are talking about.

 

[Blistering Barnacle]

It's kind of like Sanga who didn't get acknowledged until later on in his career (ODIs) when he was scoring against everyone. He had gotten better but more importatnly it was against big name teams. Babar has the same issue in that he doesn't play for a big 3 team where most of their series even against minnows are followed.

Kohli has feasted against weak teams but he also has plenty of stand out performances which got him to that level.

And when I mean dominating, I don't mean middling 80-90 SR tons like Kane scores. Kohli dominated bowlers.
The only one I can think of from Babar is his 100 against us in the WC, even then that was a group stage match.

Sangakarra was considered a great test batsman for a long time. He wasn't that great in ODIs for most of his career but improved in them later on.

As far as Babar, your arguments are weak. He's already acknowledged as one of the best players of this generation.

As far as the original OP's question, I'd say it's difficult to compare across eras. Guys like Ponting and Sachin are legends, whereas there's a long way to go still for the best players of this generation to retire so we can look back on their feats.

 

[Aman]

No offence but your response strikes me as a remarkably ignorant one.

For one thing, it doesn't seem like you bothered to read my second paragraph at all before you started writing because I very clearly dispelled the myth that Babar only scores against small teams.

Secondly, Babar amassed 474 runs at the last World Cup in what was his first appearance. That's more runs than any Pakistani batter has ever scored in a single tournament. And oh yeah, that tally included a hundred against New Zealand at Headingly aswell where he completely outclassed the New Zealand attack on a tricky pitch, when the world was watching. But it also included half-centuries against England, South Africa and Bangladesh in matches that Pakistan won.

So respectfully, you don't know what you are talking about.

Nice of you to omit the fact - 7 players ranked ahead of Babar (including the likes of Shakib and Finch - neither of them you would call elite batsmen) and scored 500 runs + in that WC. With 3 others scoring 600+. 11 scored 400+.

Again, this is a batsmen's era and Babar still has a lot to do to be in these discussions. I literally pointed out that ton against us in the group stages.

You're letting your emotions and bias cloud your judgement otherwise you wouldn't be putting someone who hasn't even played 100 ODIs yet and has score almost 60% of his 100s against lower ranked teams in the discussion of best batsmen since 2000.

Difference is I actually have a high bar to get into this discussion and would only really include Ponting, Sachin and Kohli in this with maybe AB around 4, Dhoni around the 5. The rest are not on their level. Likes of Amla, Sanga, Root, Smith, Kane, Babar etc are not in this discussion.

 

[moghul]

Who do you think is the greatest ODI batsman of this millenium? The contenders are as follows :-

Ricky Ponting

Sachin Tendulkar

Kumar Sangakkara

Mahendra Singh Dhoni

AB de Villiers

Virat Kohli

Hashim Amla

Rohit Sharma

David Warner

Babar Azam

Any other??

Tendulkar and then Ponting

 

[Nikhil_cric]

DeVilliers for me. Best ODI batsman of the 2010's.

 

[sweep_shot]

Kane lol? Taylor and Guptill have arguably been more impressive.

Taylor was overrated.

Guptill was a minnow basher.

Kane is already a Kiwi ATG.

 

[jeetu]

ODI batsman since 2000 (min 5000 runs)

Player	Span	Mat	Runs	Ave	SR	100	50
V Kohli (INDIA)	2008-2022	260	12311	58.07	92.92	43	64
AB de Villiers (Afr/SA)	2005-2018	228	9577	53.5	101.09	25	53
JE Root (ENG)	2013-2021	152	6109	51.33	86.84	16	35
MS Dhoni (Asia/INDIA)	2004-2019	350	10773	50.57	87.56	10	73
HM Amla (SA)	2008-2019	181	8113	49.46	88.39	27	39
RG Sharma (INDIA)	2007-2022	230	9283	48.6	89.01	29	44
MEK Hussey (AUS)	2004-2012	185	5442	48.15	87.16	3	39
LRPL Taylor (NZ)	2006-2022	236	8607	47.55	83.32	21	51
KS Williamson (NZ)	2010-2020	151	6173	47.48	81.75	13	39
F du Plessis (SA)	2011-2019	143	5507	47.47	88.6	12	35
SR Tendulkar (INDIA)	2000-2012	234	9855	46.7	85.75	25	52
Q de Kock (SA)	2013-2022	129	5658	46	95.97	17	28
JH Kallis (Afr/ICC/SA)	2000-2014	251	9029	45.6	74.27	12	70
S Dhawan (INDIA)	2010-2022	149	6284	45.53	93.37	17	35
DA Warner (AUS)	2009-2020	128	5455	45.45	95.53	18	23
ML Hayden (AUS/ICC)	2000-2008	148	5847	45.32	80.82	10	34
S Chanderpaul (WI)	2000-2011	181	6237	44.87	72.19	9	44
MJ Clarke (AUS)	2003-2015	245	7981	44.58	78.98	8	58
Misbah-ul-Haq (PAK)	2002-2015	162	5122	43.4	73.75	0	42
RR Sarwan (WI)	2000-2013	181	5804	42.67	75.74	5	38
RT Ponting (AUS/ICC)	2000-2012	284	10496	42.49	83.74	25	65
MJ Guptill (NZ)	2009-2022	189	7041	42.16	87.61	17	37
KC Sangakkara (Asia/ICC/SL)	2000-2015	404	14234	41.98	78.86	25	93
AD Mathews (SL)	2008-2021	218	5835	41.67	83.3	3	40
Mohammad Yousuf (Asia/PAK)	2000-2010	256	8671	41.09	75.24	13	57
AJ Finch (AUS)	2013-2022	135	5255	41.05	88.21	17	29
SR Watson (AUS)	2002-2015	190	5757	40.54	90.44	9	33
MS Atapattu (SL)	2000-2007	179	5992	40.21	69.31	9	40
SC Ganguly (Asia/INDIA)	2000-2007	185	6658	40.1	75.43	13	43
R Dravid (Asia/ICC/INDIA)	2000-2011	236	7419	39.88	72.38	5	63
EJG Morgan (ENG/IRE)	2006-2021	246	7701	39.69	91.25	14	47
G Gambhir (INDIA)	2003-2013	147	5238	39.68	85.25	11	34
Inzamam-ul-Haq (Asia/PAK)	2000-2007	178	5264	39.57	76.1	4	36
TM Dilshan (SL)	2000-2016	325	10149	39.33	86.5	22	46
PR Stirling (IRE)	2008-2022	136	5047	38.82	86.42	12	26
CH Gayle (ICC/WI)	2000-2019	294	10422	38.6	87.64	25	54
GC Smith (Afr/SA)	2002-2013	197	6989	37.98	80.81	10	47
IR Bell (ENG)	2004-2015	161	5416	37.87	77.16	4	35
Shakib Al Hasan (BAN)	2006-2022	221	6755	37.73	82.25	9	50
HH Gibbs (SA)	2000-2010	209	6997	37.41	85.35	19	33
JP Duminy (SA)	2004-2019	199	5117	36.81	84.55	4	27
Mushfiqur Rahim (BAN)	2006-2022	233	6697	36.79	78.96	8	41
Tamim Iqbal (BAN)	2007-2022	225	7826	36.74	78.55	14	52
AC Gilchrist (AUS/ICC)	2000-2008	211	7243	36.58	100.54	11	45
Yuvraj Singh (Asia/INDIA)	2000-2017	304	8701	36.55	87.67	14	52
ST Jayasuriya (Asia/SL)	2000-2011	247	8307	35.65	91.59	21	35
BRM Taylor (ZIM)	2004-2021	205	6684	35.55	76.64	11	39
PD Collingwood (ENG)	2001-2011	197	5092	35.36	76.98	5	26
SK Raina (INDIA)	2005-2018	226	5615	35.31	93.5	5	36
V Sehwag (Asia/ICC/INDIA)	2000-2013	250	8272	35.2	104.35	15	38
Shoaib Malik (PAK)	2000-2019	282	7519	34.81	81.82	9	44
DPMD Jayawardene (Asia/SL)	2000-2015	409	11808	34.32	79.23	17	73
WU Tharanga (Asia/SL)	2005-2019	235	6951	33.74	75.92	15	37
MN Samuels (WI)	2000-2018	207	5606	32.97	75.11	10	30
Mohammad Hafeez (PAK)	2003-2019	218	6614	32.9	76.61	11	38
Younis Khan (PAK)	2000-2015	265	7249	31.24	75.29	7	48
BB McCullum (NZ)	2002-2016	260	6083	30.41	96.37	5	32
H Masakadza (ZIM)	2001-2019	209	5658	27.73	73.21	5	34
Shahid Afridi (Asia/ICC/PAK)	2000-2015	305	5995	23.5	122.32	4	28

 

[Buffet]

It's between - SRT, Ponting, Kohli & AB.

 

[Ab Fan]

Joe Root also has an average of 50+ but I found it very hard to include him because I just couldn't think of him been able to shine out truly as a batsman among his other teammates.

Kane had 1-2 such knocks where he was able to build his presence but the strike rate and average is low to get in there.

Taylor could make a case here as a contender although not very likely that people would pick him. Jos Buttler has only 3800 runs at average of 38 and S/R of 118, looks like he has done it more in T20 format than in ODIs.

 

[Xoib]

Babar is a bit unfortunate I feel to play odi cricket in this era where flat motorways and 2 new balls negate the difference between an ATG like Kohli and just a decent bat like Bairstow also number of odis played are much less .

Odi is Babar best format and had he played in 2000-2010 I could have easily seen him score 12-15k with an average of 40-42 with a SR of 75-80 putting him in a league just shade below Sachin.

 

[VForVendetta]

1 Ponting
2 AB
3 Kohli
4 Sachin
5 Gayle
6 Gibbs

 

[Bhaag Viru Bhaag]

Ponting
Sachin
Dhoni
Kohli
AB

 

[Kroll]

Kohli for sure followed by ABDV.

 

[Hextro]

Nice of you to omit the fact - 7 players ranked ahead of Babar (including the likes of Shakib and Finch - neither of them you would call elite batsmen) and scored 500 runs + in that WC. With 3 others scoring 600+. 11 scored 400+.

You are being Intellectually dishonest with this portion of your comment. 6 out of the 7 you've mentioned above had played 1-3 more innings than Babar which led to them having a higher overall run tally, Babar didn't score more runs than these guys because he didn't have the opportunity to. Let's take a look at Finch's stats and compare them with Babar's for example. Finch scored 507 runs in 10 innings compared to Babar who scored 474 in 8 innings. Finch scored an average of 50.7 runs per match whereas Babar scored an average of 59.25 per match. The same trend continues with most of the batsmen that scored more runs than Babar in the 2019 world cup.

See the problem with your method of judging Babar's performance in the 2019 world cup? I'm by no means saying that Babar was the best batsman in the 2019 world cup all I'm saying is that he was clearly better than most of the batsmen you've mentioned above.

You're letting your emotions and bias cloud your judgement otherwise you wouldn't be putting someone who hasn't even played 100 ODIs yet and has score almost 60% of his 100s against lower ranked teams in the discussion of best batsmen since 2000.

I thought the myth of Babar only doing well against low ranked teams was busted a long time ago but it seems like that myth is clearly still around.

Babar's stats vs the top 5 ranked ODI teams(Aus, Eng, Nz, Sa, Ind)

Innings - 54, Runs - 2500, average - 52.08, Strike rate - 89.99, hundreds - 7.

Kohli's stats vs the top 5 ranked ODI teams(Aus, Eng, Nz, Sa, Pak)

Innings - 141, Runs - 6707, average - 54.08, Strike rate - 92.23, hundreds - 22.

Babar has very good stats against top teams and he hasn't even been able to fully utilize his current form against said teams like Kohli was able to in 2018. I remember in 2020 Babar averaged less than 45 against top teams but the current version of Babar is a different beast altogether.

Difference is I actually have a high bar to get into this discussion and would only really include Ponting, Sachin and Kohli in this with maybe AB around 4, Dhoni around the 5. The rest are not on their level. Likes of Amla, Sanga, Root, Smith, Kane, Babar etc are not in this discussion.

I actually agreed with you until you mentioned Dhoni amongst the greatest ODI batsmen of all time. I agree that Babar needs to play at least 150 ODI innings before we can start mentioning his name among the greatest ODI batsmen of all time.

Dhoni can't make the list of the greatest batsmen of all time because his stats against top teams are very weak. Also, Dhoni has never scored a hundred away from home in any format.

Dhoni's stats vs the top 5 ranked ODI teams(Aus, Eng, Nz, Sa, Pak)

Innings - 181, Runs - 6207, average - 44.97, Strike rate - 85.48, hundreds - 5.

The reason Dhoni has a high average is that he was a finisher. Overall Dhoni scores an average of just 34.2 runs per innings vs the top 5 ranked ODI teams. Compare that with Babar or Kohli who score an average of 46.2 and 47.5 runs per innings vs the top 5 ranked ODI teams respectively. That too at a considerably higher strike rate.

 

[Mamoon]

You are being Intellectually dishonest with this portion of your comment. 6 out of the 7 you've mentioned above had played 1-3 more innings than Babar which led to them having a higher overall run tally, Babar didn't score more runs than these guys because he didn't have the opportunity to. Let's take a look at Finch's stats and compare them with Babar's for example. Finch scored 507 runs in 10 innings compared to Babar who scored 474 in 8 innings. Finch scored an average of 50.7 runs per match whereas Babar scored an average of 59.25 per match. The same trend continues with most of the batsmen that scored more runs than Babar in the 2019 world cup.

See the problem with your method of judging Babar's performance in the 2019 world cup? I'm by no means saying that Babar was the best batsman in the 2019 world cup all I'm saying is that he was clearly better than most of the batsmen you've mentioned above.



I thought the myth of Babar only doing well against low ranked teams was busted a long time ago but it seems like that myth is clearly still around.

Babar's stats vs the top 5 ranked ODI teams(Aus, Eng, Nz, Sa, Ind)

Innings - 54, Runs - 2500, average - 52.08, Strike rate - 89.99, hundreds - 7.

Kohli's stats vs the top 5 ranked ODI teams(Aus, Eng, Nz, Sa, Pak)

Innings - 141, Runs - 6707, average - 54.08, Strike rate - 92.23, hundreds - 22.

Babar has very good stats against top teams and he hasn't even been able to fully utilize his current form against said teams like Kohli was able to in 2018. I remember in 2020 Babar averaged less than 45 against top teams but the current version of Babar is a different beast altogether.



I actually agreed with you until you mentioned Dhoni amongst the greatest ODI batsmen of all time. I agree that Babar needs to play at least 150 ODI innings before we can start mentioning his name among the greatest ODI batsmen of all time.

Dhoni can't make the list of the greatest batsmen of all time because his stats against top teams are very weak. Also, Dhoni has never scored a hundred away from home in any format.

Dhoni's stats vs the top 5 ranked ODI teams(Aus, Eng, Nz, Sa, Pak)

Innings - 181, Runs - 6207, average - 44.97, Strike rate - 85.48, hundreds - 5.

The reason Dhoni has a high average is that he was a finisher. Overall Dhoni scores an average of just 34.2 runs per innings vs the top 5 ranked ODI teams. Compare that with Babar or Kohli who score an average of 46.2 and 47.5 runs per innings vs the top 5 ranked ODI teams respectively. That too at a considerably higher strike rate.

Babar played less games in the 2019 World Cup but he is also responsible for that, not just the other players.

He had the opportunity to chase down the targets against India and Australia in very good batting conditions but he failed on both occasions. He was also part of the collapse against West Indies in the opening that destroyed Pakistan’s NRR and meant that Pakistan was on the ropes ever since.

He had a good World Cup but he wasn’t even among the top 3 best batsmen in the tournament and he was not unlucky to play less matches than others. He was in control of his own fate.

Having said that, he is batting at a very high level these days in ODI cricket particularly and feels invincible at times. He is hitting his peak years and the next 5-6 years could be golden for him.

He is pretty much the best ODI batsman Pakistan has ever had and would be bitterly disappointed if he doesn’t end up as the one of the best ever in world cricket.

Exciting times for Pakistan cricket as far as his individual performances are concerned but not much to look forward to in terms of the overall stature of the team. They continue to look like a very mediocre and unprofessional cricket team.

 

[Hextro]

Babar played less games in the 2019 World Cup but he is also responsible for that, not just the other players.

He had the opportunity to chase down the targets against India and Australia in very good batting conditions but he failed on both occasions. He was also part of the collapse against West Indies in the opening that dbattestroyed Pakistan’s NRR and meant that Pakistan was on the ropes ever since.

He had a good World Cup but he wasn’t even among the top 3 best batsmen in the tournament and he was not unlucky to play less matches than others. He was in control of his own fate.

There hasn't been a batsman in cricket history that scores a century every match. You yourself have admitted time and time again that Pakistan had a very poor batting lineup in the 2019 world cup if we exclude Babar. We can't and shouldn't expect a single player to carry the entire team. There are 10 other players there for a reason.

Pakistan's 2nd highest run scorer in the 2019 world cup was Imam who scored only 305 runs(205 if you exclude his dead rubber century against Bangladesh).

 

[Rellu_Katta]

Its too close to call but on the brackets its

1 - (Pointing)
2 - 3 - (ABD or MSD)
Babar shouldnt be in this bcz he has played half of this time period.. for same reason, Sachin Tendulkar and Kholi should not in be in this list too (not they both dont deserve it, its just not fair)


if we look from 2010 to 2022 easily Kholi ..and he will end up being the top3 of ODI GREAT of all time once he hangs up his boots.

 

[as-95]

1) Ponting
2) Kohli

Would never inclide Sachin in a list like this. Total stat padder who played for records. Will never be remembered for the match winning ability like Kohli/Ponting are.

 

[Nasty Naz]

ODI batsman since 2000 (min 5000 runs)

Player	Span	Mat	Runs	Ave	SR	100	50
V Kohli (INDIA)	2008-2022	260	12311	58.07	92.92	43	64
AB de Villiers (Afr/SA)	2005-2018	228	9577	53.5	101.09	25	53
JE Root (ENG)	2013-2021	152	6109	51.33	86.84	16	35
MS Dhoni (Asia/INDIA)	2004-2019	350	10773	50.57	87.56	10	73
HM Amla (SA)	2008-2019	181	8113	49.46	88.39	27	39
RG Sharma (INDIA)	2007-2022	230	9283	48.6	89.01	29	44
MEK Hussey (AUS)	2004-2012	185	5442	48.15	87.16	3	39
LRPL Taylor (NZ)	2006-2022	236	8607	47.55	83.32	21	51
KS Williamson (NZ)	2010-2020	151	6173	47.48	81.75	13	39
F du Plessis (SA)	2011-2019	143	5507	47.47	88.6	12	35
SR Tendulkar (INDIA)	2000-2012	234	9855	46.7	85.75	25	52
Q de Kock (SA)	2013-2022	129	5658	46	95.97	17	28
JH Kallis (Afr/ICC/SA)	2000-2014	251	9029	45.6	74.27	12	70
S Dhawan (INDIA)	2010-2022	149	6284	45.53	93.37	17	35
DA Warner (AUS)	2009-2020	128	5455	45.45	95.53	18	23
ML Hayden (AUS/ICC)	2000-2008	148	5847	45.32	80.82	10	34
S Chanderpaul (WI)	2000-2011	181	6237	44.87	72.19	9	44
MJ Clarke (AUS)	2003-2015	245	7981	44.58	78.98	8	58
Misbah-ul-Haq (PAK)	2002-2015	162	5122	43.4	73.75	0	42
RR Sarwan (WI)	2000-2013	181	5804	42.67	75.74	5	38
RT Ponting (AUS/ICC)	2000-2012	284	10496	42.49	83.74	25	65
MJ Guptill (NZ)	2009-2022	189	7041	42.16	87.61	17	37
KC Sangakkara (Asia/ICC/SL)	2000-2015	404	14234	41.98	78.86	25	93
AD Mathews (SL)	2008-2021	218	5835	41.67	83.3	3	40
Mohammad Yousuf (Asia/PAK)	2000-2010	256	8671	41.09	75.24	13	57
AJ Finch (AUS)	2013-2022	135	5255	41.05	88.21	17	29
SR Watson (AUS)	2002-2015	190	5757	40.54	90.44	9	33
MS Atapattu (SL)	2000-2007	179	5992	40.21	69.31	9	40
SC Ganguly (Asia/INDIA)	2000-2007	185	6658	40.1	75.43	13	43
R Dravid (Asia/ICC/INDIA)	2000-2011	236	7419	39.88	72.38	5	63
EJG Morgan (ENG/IRE)	2006-2021	246	7701	39.69	91.25	14	47
G Gambhir (INDIA)	2003-2013	147	5238	39.68	85.25	11	34
Inzamam-ul-Haq (Asia/PAK)	2000-2007	178	5264	39.57	76.1	4	36
TM Dilshan (SL)	2000-2016	325	10149	39.33	86.5	22	46
PR Stirling (IRE)	2008-2022	136	5047	38.82	86.42	12	26
CH Gayle (ICC/WI)	2000-2019	294	10422	38.6	87.64	25	54
GC Smith (Afr/SA)	2002-2013	197	6989	37.98	80.81	10	47
IR Bell (ENG)	2004-2015	161	5416	37.87	77.16	4	35
Shakib Al Hasan (BAN)	2006-2022	221	6755	37.73	82.25	9	50
HH Gibbs (SA)	2000-2010	209	6997	37.41	85.35	19	33
JP Duminy (SA)	2004-2019	199	5117	36.81	84.55	4	27
Mushfiqur Rahim (BAN)	2006-2022	233	6697	36.79	78.96	8	41
Tamim Iqbal (BAN)	2007-2022	225	7826	36.74	78.55	14	52
AC Gilchrist (AUS/ICC)	2000-2008	211	7243	36.58	100.54	11	45
Yuvraj Singh (Asia/INDIA)	2000-2017	304	8701	36.55	87.67	14	52
ST Jayasuriya (Asia/SL)	2000-2011	247	8307	35.65	91.59	21	35
BRM Taylor (ZIM)	2004-2021	205	6684	35.55	76.64	11	39
PD Collingwood (ENG)	2001-2011	197	5092	35.36	76.98	5	26
SK Raina (INDIA)	2005-2018	226	5615	35.31	93.5	5	36
V Sehwag (Asia/ICC/INDIA)	2000-2013	250	8272	35.2	104.35	15	38
Shoaib Malik (PAK)	2000-2019	282	7519	34.81	81.82	9	44
DPMD Jayawardene (Asia/SL)	2000-2015	409	11808	34.32	79.23	17	73
WU Tharanga (Asia/SL)	2005-2019	235	6951	33.74	75.92	15	37
MN Samuels (WI)	2000-2018	207	5606	32.97	75.11	10	30
Mohammad Hafeez (PAK)	2003-2019	218	6614	32.9	76.61	11	38
Younis Khan (PAK)	2000-2015	265	7249	31.24	75.29	7	48
BB McCullum (NZ)	2002-2016	260	6083	30.41	96.37	5	32
H Masakadza (ZIM)	2001-2019	209	5658	27.73	73.21	5	34
Shahid Afridi (Asia/ICC/PAK)	2000-2015	305	5995	23.5	122.32	4	28

Yup, so my point stands with ABD being the only player to average 50+ with 100+ SR. Truly a special player. Probably the most centuries for a player that wasn't a top order batsmen (1-3).

The remaining players with a 100+ SR in that list are Afridi/Sehwag/Gilchrist

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

Nice of you to omit the fact - 7 players ranked ahead of Babar (including the likes of Shakib and Finch - neither of them you would call elite batsmen) and scored 500 runs + in that WC. With 3 others scoring 600+. 11 scored 400+.

Again, this is a batsmen's era and Babar still has a lot to do to be in these discussions. I literally pointed out that ton against us in the group stages.

You're letting your emotions and bias cloud your judgement otherwise you wouldn't be putting someone who hasn't even played 100 ODIs yet and has score almost 60% of his 100s against lower ranked teams in the discussion of best batsmen since 2000.

Difference is I actually have a high bar to get into this discussion and would only really include Ponting, Sachin and Kohli in this with maybe AB around 4, Dhoni around the 5. The rest are not on their level. Likes of Amla, Sanga, Root, Smith, Kane, Babar etc are not in this discussion.

Remind me again, how many of them were playing their first ever 50 over World Cup?

Nah mate. I've argued on concrete facts. You on the other hand are deliberately downplaying how good Babar is, which I don't get considering its fairly obvious that he is the best ODI batter in the world right now and has been for quite some time. On top of that you are also making factually incorrect assertions (he only scores against lower ranked teams).

Nobody here called him the greatest ODI batter of all-time, but averaging 60 even in this era is nothing short of remarkable because no one else averages that much.

You're crutching at straws mate. "He has 60% of his centuries against lower ranked teams" what a ridiculous stat lol! That still means that he has scored 40% of his centuries against higher-ranked teams. Have you bothered to look at his averages against higher ranked teams? Do I really have to repeat everything I already said?

If you don't like Babar just come out and say it. Don't hide behind ridiculous arguments that simply are not true such as: 'he is a minnow-basher'. Because they don't hold any weight.

Babar Azam is the best ODI batter in the world right now. And its highly likely that he will go down in history as one of the greatest ODI batters of all-time. You can stay in denial all you want, won't really change anything.

 

[Ab Fan]

Against SENA, India and Pakistan, the averages and strike rates for mentioned names are :-

Kohli 54@92
AB 52@97
Babar 52@89
Rohit 46@86
Warner 43@95
Root 45@95
Amla 41@84

https://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/e...1;spanval1=span;template=results;type=batting@;

 

[Abstraction1]

Babar is averaging at 60 at a SR of 90. That too after 80 games.

Those are astonishing numbers.

And lol @ that Aman guy. Someone draw him a picture.

 

[shamaan]

Babar numbers are astonishing.

 

[Moeey]

Right now? Babar.
Babar is better than prime kohli. Easily. He doesn't fail in big matches. He also plays for a weaker team.
Kohli with all advantages and strong side struggled in LOI knock outs.

As for all time odi I would go;

Viv richards
Ab devilliers
Punter
Warner
Babar
Amla
Dhoni
Kohli
Sachin

In that order.

 

[Moeey]

Babar numbers are astonishing.

Unreal. Knew it was good.
But not that good.

 

[shamaan]

Unreal. Knew it was good.
But not that good.

Exactly same here I new his stats were good but didn't know it was that good.

 

[Ab Fan]

Jos Buttler hits a 162 of 70 balls although vs Netherlands. Averages 40 at strike rate of 120 now.

Does he come into this discussion?

 

[The lone Ranger]

Right now? Babar.
Babar is better than prime kohli. Easily. He doesn't fail in big matches. He also plays for a weaker team.
Kohli with all advantages and strong side struggled in LOI knock outs.

As for all time odi I would go;

Viv richards
Ab devilliers
Punter
Warner
Babar
Amla
Dhoni
Kohli
Sachin

In that order.

I think You forgot to include Moeen Ali and Usman khawaja!

LoL at Z'babar being better than prime Kohli. He is not even better than KL Rahul let alone prime Kohli.

 

[QalandarFan]

Yup, so my point stands with ABD being the only player to average 50+ with 100+ SR. Truly a special player. Probably the most centuries for a player that wasn't a top order batsmen (1-3).

The remaining players with a 100+ SR in that list are Afridi/Sehwag/Gilchrist

What's even more incredible about AB is that during his prime - from the start of 2009 to the end of his career - his stats are as follows

Matches - 149
Runs - 7185
Average - 64
Strike Rate - 108
100's - 22
50's - 39

To average 65@110 for a 9 year stretch is absolutely mind blowing. If you go look at the advanced stats of what he averaged against some of the better teams of the time away from home as well it's even more incredible.

For example during this period in India he averaged 115 at a strike rate of 125, with 7 hundreds in 12 matches!!! In Australia he averaged 75 at a strike rate of 118. In New Zealand he averaged 119 at a strike rate of 110. This man was absolutely ridiculous. We will never see another batsman like him.

 

[QalandarFan]

I don't think we'll ever see another SENA player dominate in an Asian country let alone India the way AB did from 2010-2015 his numbers are absolutely mind boggling. To score 7 hundreds and just 1 fifty in 12 matches while striking at 125 and averaging 115... that's RIDICULOUS. I knew he was dominant in India but this DOMINANT?!? ODI GOAT!

 

[Cover Drive Six]

Kohli followed by ABD.

 

[Rainbow]

Ricky Ponting for sure. A complete batter who could craft an ODI inning and perform on important occasions. The Final of 2003 World Cup is an example.

Also, if the likes of Kohli, Villiers and Tendulkar are in this list, then Sehwag, Gilchrist and Ben Stokes should be included as well.

 

[Moeey]

I think You forgot to include Moeen Ali and Usman khawaja!

LoL at Z'babar being better than prime Kohli. He is not even better than KL Rahul let alone prime Kohli.

Yea we all saw what happened in the last t20 WC. Kohli used to be better. Not anymore. Babar is greater than all at the moment.

 

[introvert]

Ab de villiers was probably best odi bat of all time. Has brilliant record at no.5 as well which makes him more versatile than run machines like kohli, babar, root etc.

If we pick virat kohli's debut match as starting point and current date as end point to find odi stats for batting position 1 to 5 --- virat kohli averages 58.61 at 92.73 sr & Ab de Villiers averages 60.51 at 106.76 sr.

Only viv richards comes close or beat him if we inflate his average and strike rate by current standards.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

Jos Buttler hits a 162 of 70 balls although vs Netherlands. Averages 40 at strike rate of 120 now.

Does he come into this discussion?

This list is meaningless if we keep extending it further into the millennium. ODI cricket of today has very little resemblance to the ODI cricket of early 00's.

At best we can pick out the ODI batter of the decade but even within decades , the format changes a lot. It is easier, relatively, to compareacross eras in the other 2 formats where the adjustments are more straightforward.

 

[Ab Fan]

Who do you think is the greatest ODI batsman of this millenium? The contenders are as follows :-

Ricky Ponting

Sachin Tendulkar

Kumar Sangakkara

Mahendra Singh Dhoni

AB de Villiers

Virat Kohli

Hashim Amla

Rohit Sharma

David Warner

Babar Azam

Any other??

Add Jos Buttler as well.

 

[mominsaigol]

Suprised to see no ab devillers. A guy with a 47 average, Mr 360 player and was by far the most dangerous batsmen of the 2015 era isn't on this list.

In his prime no one comes close to him, not even kholi. He sadly fizzled out though.

 

[TheSultan]

Who do you think is the greatest ODI batsman of this millenium? The contenders are as follows :-

Ricky Ponting

Sachin Tendulkar

Kumar Sangakkara

Mahendra Singh Dhoni

AB de Villiers

Virat Kohli

Hashim Amla

Rohit Sharma

David Warner

Babar Azam

Any other??

I don’t know why Lara isn’t in this list, he has some phenomenal test series in the early 2000s and some excellent performances in the mid-2000s-2007

Out of the list above I would pick Ponting and if Lara was in this list I would put him right up there too

 

[TheSultan]

I don’t know why Lara isn’t in this list, he has some phenomenal test series in the early 2000s and some excellent performances in the mid-2000s-2007

Out of the list above I would pick Ponting and if Lara was in this list I would put him right up there too

Edit - realise that this is ODIs. So…

Out of the list above I would pick Ponting with de Villiers a close second. Can’t believe Buttler and Stokes aren’t there. I would have them up there too.

I love Hash but accumulation doesn’t catch the eye. Same for Babar.

Reluctantly I would also have Dhoni up there

 

[Ab Fan]

Suprised to see no ab devillers. A guy with a 47 average, Mr 360 player and was by far the most dangerous batsmen of the 2015 era isn't on this list.

In his prime no one comes close to him, not even kholi. He sadly fizzled out though.

He is there. Average of 53 and a legendary batsman.

 

[Ab Fan]

Edit - realise that this is ODIs. So…

Out of the list above I would pick Ponting with de Villiers a close second. Can’t believe Buttler and Stokes aren’t there. I would have them up there too.

I love Hash but accumulation doesn’t catch the eye. Same for Babar.

Reluctantly I would also have Dhoni up there

Yes, Buttler should be in the list. Stokes has only one memorable knock which I do rate as one of the greatest knocks inspite of having a bit of luck too but still just one knock in an otherwise pretty small ODI career with hardly any peak to talk about.

 

[Ab Fan]

If I reduce this list to 5 names, the obvious choices( in no order) are :-

Ponting
Tendulkar
Dhoni
ABD
Kohli

Then a level below,

Rohit
Babar
Buttler

 

[PakPremi]

Kohl and ABD Villers for me but Babar will end up being the best.

 

[Unbiased-Fan]

Kohli and Devilliears

 

[Hitman]

Kohli.

 

[Bhaijaan]

1. Tendulkar
2. Kohli
3. Ponting
4. MS Dhoni
5. Rohit Sharma

 

[mominsaigol]

Kohli, De villers, Sachin and pointing.

For me pointing is the Kohli before Kohli if that makes sense.

 

[jeeteshssaxena]

Kohli by a country mile.


It’s laughable to compare someone like Ponting to Kohli just because he scored in World cup, compare his overall stats to his counterparts, does he stand out? No he does not.

The only one who is equal or better than Kohli is Richards all others are far away.

 

[Ab Fan]

Kohli and de Villiers.

Ponting is way behind. He won't have averaged 50 at strike rate of 100 like de Villiers does in the era of 2004-18.

 

[saqib.rai]

Kohli by a country mile.


It’s laughable to compare someone like Ponting to Kohli just because he scored in World cup, compare his overall stats to his counterparts, does he stand out? No he does not.

The only one who is equal or better than Kohli is Richards all others are far away.

RICKY PONTING by miles. Key role in 2003 and 2007 WORLD CUPS and 2006 and 2009 Champions Trophy WINS
4 ICC ODI TITLES since 2000

De Villiers never won anything to show for his numbers

Kohli scored single digits in 2015 WC semi, 2017 CT final, 2019 WC semi.
And India lost all 3 matches. All 3 were run chases as well, something his fans say he prefers

Sachin had too many 100s in losing causes. Which raises questions on whether he was selfish and played for himself or the team

 

[mominsaigol]

Kohli by a country mile.


It’s laughable to compare someone like Ponting to Kohli just because he scored in World cup, compare his overall stats to his counterparts, does he stand out? No he does not.

The only one who is equal or better than Kohli is Richards all others are far away.

Kohli isn't > by a country mile. Kohli is a master at chasing And RR management but he functions well because of his Indian team. Rohit providing 9 rr starts allows kohli to take time to settle.

Kohli isn't the type of player to get those 45 to 50 ball 100's.

Some players have performed better then him in some aspects like de villers, and pointing isn't way behind. Pointing played in a different era with the one ball in play although I have kohli > Pointing still.

Kohli is > but he isn't better by a country mile lol.

 

[mominsaigol]

Kohli and de Villiers.

Ponting is way behind. He won't have averaged 50 at strike rate of 100 like de Villiers does in the era of 2004-18.

Neither does kohli.

Pointing is a different type of player. Same with de villers and kohli.

All 3 are different, it's tough to compare.