Gulf in class between India and Pakistan widens

[zayn]

In ICC events gone by we've at least remained competitive. Today though we were truly humbled and showed everything that is wrong with our game. I dread to think what these encounters would produce in the future as India continue to improve, while our progress stagnates.

We can clutch at straws by blaming dropped chances and what not, but that's part and parcel of the game. Yes the selection was poor (too many righties and spraygun), but even better selection would have made minimal difference. The problems with our cricket run a lot deeper than that.

To put it bluntly; we have very limited batsman that struggle to find gaps, rotate strike nor do we have the power, innovation in our game to accelerate at the end of an innings. We haven't got accurate new ball bowlers that can swing the ball both ways (a partner for Amir even) as is required in this format, and was perfectly demonstrated by Hazlewood the other day. Bowlers that spray it around at 150k are redundant in the modern game, something we Pakistanis need to understand. Fielding and fitness, let's not even go there. I think club teams here in England have better fitness.

We need wholesale changes. Playing cricket on the slow low pitches of UAE has absolutely drained the flair and strokeplay out of our batsmen, and provides absolutely no encouragement for our quicks. If we can't play in Pakistan then at least arrange our home series in the likes of England, as these are the pitches we will face in global tournaments.

The issues with our domestic cricket are well documented so I won't go into detail on that. I'd like to see us back a nucleus of players for the foreseeable future and drop players with a limited ceiling, even if that means we are beaten handsomely by teams. It can't get any more painful than what we've seen today anyway. Okay Babar, hasan might not have been amazing today but they've​ got room for improvement. The likes of shehzad and riaz have none and are the end product of playing on UAE pitches. It's not their fault, I'm sure they work hard to improve but you can only improve so far as resources allow.

We need to really take our fitness seriously; our running between the wickets was an absolute embarrassment. Look at the sort of training athletes such as Kohli, Anthony Joshua, Cristiano Ronaldo go through these days and adopt that. Bench pressing and throwing a few weights around doesn't help you in cricket. It's all about being lean, quick and making the most of your body weight.

Here's hoping to a victory over SA and SL

 

[PakLFC]

The gulf in class has been there for years. We are much closer to Bangladesh now then India and that's a fact.

 

[jnaveen1980]

Send your players to county to make them more professional and technically better. That is where lot of old cricketers improved their game.

 

[PakLFC]

Send your players to county to make them more professional and technically better. That is where lot of old cricketers improved their game.

I don't think any county will want our third rate unfit players.

 

[geraltofrivia]

In ICC events gone by we've at least remained competitive. Today though we were truly humbled and showed everything that is wrong with our game. I dread to think what these encounters would produce in the future as India continue to improve, while our progress stagnates.

We can clutch at straws by blaming dropped chances and what not, but that's part and parcel of the game. Yes the selection was poor (too many righties and spraygun), but even better selection would have made minimal difference. The problems with our cricket run a lot deeper than that.

To put it bluntly; we have very limited batsman that struggle to find gaps, rotate strike nor do we have the power, innovation in our game to accelerate at the end of an innings. We haven't got accurate new ball bowlers that can swing the ball both ways (a partner for Amir even) as is required in this format, and was perfectly demonstrated by Hazlewood the other day. Bowlers that spray it around at 150k are redundant in the modern game, something we Pakistanis need to understand. Fielding and fitness, let's not even go there. I think club teams here in England have better fitness.

We need wholesale changes. Playing cricket on the slow low pitches of UAE has absolutely drained the flair and strokeplay out of our batsmen, and provides absolutely no encouragement for our quicks. If we can't play in Pakistan then at least arrange our home series in the likes of England, as these are the pitches we will face in global tournaments.

The issues with our domestic cricket are well documented so I won't go into detail on that. I'd like to see us back a nucleus of players for the foreseeable future and drop players with a limited ceiling, even if that means we are beaten handsomely by teams. It can't get any more painful than what we've seen today anyway. Okay Babar, hasan might not have been amazing today but they've​ got room for improvement. The likes of shehzad and riaz have none and are the end product of playing on UAE pitches. It's not their fault, I'm sure they work hard to improve but you can only improve so far as resources allow.

We need to really take our fitness seriously; our running between the wickets was an absolute embarrassment. Look at the sort of training athletes such as Kohli, Anthony Joshua, Cristiano Ronaldo go through these days and adopt that. Bench pressing and throwing a few weights around doesn't help you in cricket. It's all about being lean, quick and making the most of your body weight.

Here's hoping to a victory over SA and SL ��

Last time was 2011. Every ICC event post that was extremely one sided.

 

[Billy1999]

Azhar,Amir,Sarfraz,Yasir these guys should try and get county deals

 

[FlickedOffHips]

Yes, there is a gulf.

Pakistan cannot do anything about the dearth of talent in the short term. The easiest and most effective thing they can do is work on the basics, in which they are pretty poor.

For example, PAK batsmen wasted 10 of first 17 overs in juts Dot Balls. This is unforgivable. These guys should be locked in a room until they understand the importance of strike rotation. Make them write on chalkboards "I will try to take a single off every ball, even the good ones" like Bart Simpson, until it becomes second nature. Put up match footage. Name and shame.

Secondly, I think fielding matters much more if you are a weaker team. A weaker team only gets a couple of chances in the game to make headway into the opposition and get rid of opposition batsmen. If you don't take these catches you fall further behind. A stronger team should have many more opportunities in the game to make headway and get opposition out. Therefore the value of each dropped catch/missed run out is less to the stronger team. Pakistan must realise they are a weak team and there there is no room for error in the fielding department.

Finally, the decision making around team tactics need to improve. There were some bizarre bowling decisions on the field today. Pakistan are not good enough for "out of the box" thinking until they get "inside the box" thinking right.

 

[Savak]

Dot balls is a result of every batsman playing for themselves and their place in the side. It's a very tough balancing act, obviously the team management does not want to give unlimited chances to someone who is just not good enough and when the team is under pressure to win but at the same time no player can play with peace of mind and security until he knows he has an entire series or 2 whole series to prove himself.

 

[Mamoon]

Yes, there is a gulf.

Pakistan cannot do anything about the dearth of talent in the short term. The easiest and most effective thing they can do is work on the basics, in which they are pretty poor.

For example, PAK batsmen wasted 10 of first 17 overs in juts Dot Balls. This is unforgivable. These guys should be locked in a room until they understand the importance of strike rotation. Make them write on chalkboards "I will try to take a single off every ball, even the good ones" like Bart Simpson, until it becomes second nature. Put up match footage. Name and shame.

Secondly, I think fielding matters much more if you are a weaker team. A weaker team only gets a couple of chances in the game to make headway into the opposition and get rid of opposition batsmen. If you don't take these catches you fall further behind. A stronger team should have many more opportunities in the game to make headway and get opposition out. Therefore the value of each dropped catch/missed run out is less to the stronger team. Pakistan must realise they are a weak team and there there is no room for error in the fielding department.

Finally, the decision making around team tactics need to improve. There were some bizarre bowling decisions on the field today. Pakistan are not good enough for "out of the box" thinking until they get "inside the box" thinking right.

There is no doubt that strike rotation is the number one problem because our batsmen don't hit any less fours and sixes, but the fact is that strike rotation is one of the hardest skills in the game. It is far more difficult than it looks, and it is what separates a mediocre batsman from a great batsman.

Even tail-enders can hit fours and sixes, but the mediocre batsmen cannot find gaps and bisect the field. They simply don't have the ''time'' to judge the line and length and work the ball around. It is a combination of lack of skill/ability and lack of awareness. Also, fitness plays a big role too.

Pakistan's best ODI batsman is Malik, and it is not surprising that he is the best strike rotator in the team. He faced only 10 balls before getting run out, but he looked a class apart compared to the rest.

 

[TNAmarkFromIndia]

What's worse from Pakistan's point of view was that India was clearly not at their best today in terms of batting or fielding and still won by 124 runs. That just shows how far behind the eight ball Pakistan is as a side. They're playing an outdated brand of cricket and nearly every team, including Bangladesh, has evolved. It's 2017. Get with the times.

 

[WhenSultansBowled]

Every Pakistani fan knew thrashing was about to come. We are #8 ODI team which barely managed to qualify.

India, on other hand, are a well balanced and a professional side.

Pakistan are simply not good enough. A bunch of TTFs, wannabes and rookies.

Gulf will only widen further until next WC(where we may suffer another humiliation).

 

[coy0607]

this ISN'T a Pakistan V India thing - this is a Pakistan thing

theres a big gap between Pakistan and any good team, because Pakistan sucks! India, Aus, NZ, SA, Eng... any of these teams would trash the Pakistani team

 

[Syed1]

We need to go into self-imposed exile from international cricket or only participate in matches against Afg, Zim, Ire, Wi, SL and if we are brave BD.

Seeing this team play is bringing disrepute to the entire Pakistani national.

 

[TNAmarkFromIndia]

Every Pakistani fan knew thrashing was about to come.

Yes. After the match when they know the result now, but a lot of people here actually thought Pakistan could chase 300, either relying on India's bowling or the pitch or both.

 

[Snatch]

Would any of the Pakistani players make the current Indian ODI XI?

I'm not even convinced Amir would, let alone anyone else.

 

[Napa]

Would any of the Pakistani players make the current Indian ODI XI?

I'm not even convinced Amir would, let alone anyone else.

Shami was left out and the question is whether Amir is better than him. Amir certainly had a very good economy rate and troubled Rohit in the first over he bowled. He also ended up with zero wickets, which could be as he doesn't attack the batsmen by bowling at the stumps. Shami does attack the batsmen.

I would say Shami and Amir are about the same. Shami is also about the same as Bumrah, but behind Yadav and Bhuvi. Yadav is steadily becoming a better and better bowler, now bowls with good pace and is much more accurate than before. Easily the best fast bowler in the SC. Bhuvi can swing the ball better than Shami.

The fourth Indian pacer Pandya is on par with Shami as a bowler, he gets hit badly once in a while but gets an awful lot of wickets. As he is also possibly one of the most destructive batsman in the world today, he is an automatic selection ahead of Shami.

Shami may indeed be selected for a later game ahead of Bumrah. So Amir may or may not make it to the Indian team, it is not a sure thing either way. I have always been impressed by Amir, but his lack of wickets (not merely due to dropped catches) cannot be ignored.

 

[IAJ]

Yes. After the match when they know the result now, but a lot of people here actually thought Pakistan could chase 300, either relying on India's bowling or the pitch or both.

Of course you back your team to chase down any total even though it's a mediocre team. What else are fans supposed to do, just turn off the TV? When supporting your team you support with heart first.

 

[superman]

Its so bad you could replace india with bangladesh in the op. Has faheem not hit out crazy in the practice we would have been even more realistic

 

[saeedhk]

I have been highlighting that strike rotation is Pakistan's major issue in ODIs for the past 7 years. Strike rotation is an art which our batsmen lack.

Finding the gaps and rotating the strike requires a batsman to pick the lengths early and manoeuvre the ball ball by manufacturing deft touches, deflecting the ball into open spaces by angling the bat and showing awareness of the field placings. A tough job!

 

[superman]

I have been highlighting that strike rotation is Pakistan's major issue in ODIs for the past 7 years. Strike rotation is an art which our batsmen lack.

Finding the gaps and rotating the strike requires a batsman to pick the lengths early and manoeuvre the ball ball by manufacturing deft touches, deflecting the ball into open spaces by angling the bat and showing awareness of the field placings. A tough job!

The whole world sees this just not our batsman. I thought ma would fix this but no. Also we have a bowling coach and fielding why do we not have a batting coach?

 

[saeedhk]

The whole world sees this just not our batsman. I thought ma would fix this but no. Also we have a bowling coach and fielding why do we not have a batting coach?

Exactly. Our coaches whose job is to identify problematic areas in our batting have also failed to do so. Every Pakistani who watches cricket knows of this issues but our players and coaches don't.

 

[Amjid Javed]

Pakistan are a pathetic ODI team and have been for a long time now and games against India are rarely competative.

Going back to when roles were reversed India were never as **** poor as pakistan have been recently!

 

[explayer]

Send? Counties take on players with talent not hacks like these. Pick up talented players, get them to NCA, build schools like hostels to keep them there for taringing from best available coaches and fittness trainers and must must must educate them in english so they can go on net and learn about things. eductaion brings confidence. these jahils feel inferior infront of well eductaed well dressed well groomed opponets. these jahils cannot even groom themselves. did you see wahab? he looked like a hippi did u see sarfraz? it seems like he never been to a barber shop.