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Has there ever been a captain like Kohli who has consistently picked the wrong team?

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jagatk

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Since his Test Captaincy debut where he picked Karn Sharma ahead of Ashwin, he has gone on to drop Rahane for Rohit Sharma in SA, dropped Bhuvi in SA, dropped Pujara for Dhawan in England, Not playing a second spinner in the First Test in England only to overcompensate and get it horribly wrong picking 2 spinners on a green track at lords, to now picking spraygun ahead of bhuvi or jadeja on a track expected to be difficult to bat on.

Has there been a captain who has so consistently got it wrong? And given how bad he seems to be at this, should he remain the captain?
 
jagatk said:
Since his Test Captaincy debut where he picked Karn Sharma ahead of Ashwin, he has gone on to drop Rahane for Rohit Sharma in SA, dropped Bhuvi in SA, dropped Pujara for Dhawan in England, Not playing a second spinner in the First Test in England only to overcompensate and get it horribly wrong picking 2 spinners on a green track at lords, to now picking spraygun ahead of bhuvi or jadeja on a track expected to be difficult to bat on.

Has there been a captain who has so consistently got it wrong? And given how bad he seems to be at this, should he remain the captain?
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Ashwin played there.
 
jagatk said:
Since his Test Captaincy debut where he picked Karn Sharma ahead of Ashwin, he has gone on to drop Rahane for Rohit Sharma in SA, dropped Bhuvi in SA, dropped Pujara for Dhawan in England, Not playing a second spinner in the First Test in England only to overcompensate and get it horribly wrong picking 2 spinners on a green track at lords, to now picking spraygun ahead of bhuvi or jadeja on a track expected to be difficult to bat on.

Has there been a captain who has so consistently got it wrong? And given how bad he seems to be at this, should he remain the captain?
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Before indulging in anti-Kohli posts I would suggest getting your facts right first.

Dhoni was the captain who dropped Ashwin for Karn Sharma in that Adelaide test. Kohli was captain in the last test of that Australia series following Dhoni's resignation and retirement after the 3rd test in that series.
 
dhoni was a quitter and worst captain than fixer azhar - in terms of supporting cotorie players.
At least kohli picks "his" players who are up to some standard, most of the times.

As for this match, one mistake I think kohli did was not picking kumar in the place of umesh.
shami not taking wickets really impacted Indian chances.
Umesh yadav, when will he learn.
And kumar should have played in the place of umesh - every run = 2 runs on this pitch.
 
topspin said:
Before indulging in anti-Kohli posts I would suggest getting your facts right first.

Dhoni was the captain who dropped Ashwin for Karn Sharma in that Adelaide test. Kohli was captain in the last test of that Australia series following Dhoni's resignation and retirement after the 3rd test in that series.
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Kohli was the captain for the first (Adelaide) and the fourth Tests. Dhoni only played two Tests, i.e. second and third.
 
topspin said:
Before indulging in anti-Kohli posts I would suggest getting your facts right first.

Dhoni was the captain who dropped Ashwin for Karn Sharma in that Adelaide test. Kohli was captain in the last test of that Australia series following Dhoni's resignation and retirement after the 3rd test in that series.
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Kohli was the captain in that Test.Dhoni wasn't even in Australia by then IIRC
 
topspin said:
Before indulging in anti-Kohli posts I would suggest getting your facts right first.

Dhoni was the captain who dropped Ashwin for Karn Sharma in that Adelaide test. Kohli was captain in the last test of that Australia series following Dhoni's resignation and retirement after the 3rd test in that series.
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Before you begin your Jai Jai Kohli nonsense maybe check what you mean by facts, Dhoni didn't play the first test, Kohli was the captain.
 
jagatk said:
Before you begin your Jai Jai Kohli nonsense maybe check what you mean by facts, Dhoni didn't play the first test, Kohli was the captain.
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Nonetheless, Dhoni was still the official captain. It is highly unlikely that Kohli was the one to decide the playing XI.
 
Rahane is a much better test captain and Rohit is a miles better LO captain than Kohli. Will cost us dear in the WC next year with his impulsive decisions. :dw
 
I can possibly see the merit of picking Bhuvenshwar ahead of Yadav because he provides more control with the ball, but it's hardly as disgraceful a decision as India picking two spinners at Lord's during the summer.

I think the pitch merited playing four fast bowlers even if Ashwin was available as the team management doesn't trust Kuldeep. Jadeja would be a complete passenger on these wickets. You'd rather keep the pressure on the brittle Australian batting with a strong pace attack. I guess what I mean to say is that the Australian batsmen would have preferred facing Jadeja on this pitch than Yadav.

India did well today, I'm afraid some of the complaints against Kohli just come across as the inane babbling of spoiled children.
 
Stalin said:
Rahane is a much better test captain and Rohit is a miles better LO captain than Kohli. Will cost us dear in the WC next year with his impulsive decisions. :dw
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Is Kohli really our ODI captain, or does he just do the toss?

Whenever I watch us play ODIs it's Dhoni directing traffic as always.
 
I dunno about getting selection wrong, in this test the pitch is uneven and I don't think bhuvi would be nay better with his much lower pace.
 
Maybe Kohli got the Pakistan cap on - we will blow them away with our gifted pace attack. Then show up with the likes of Wahab, Amir and Rahat. India has very good pace attack but certainly not 'blow them away' level - so best to hedge bets.

Having said that, the other team's bowlers haven't bowled yet.
 
Last Monetarist said:
I can possibly see the merit of picking Bhuvenshwar ahead of Yadav because he provides more control with the ball, but it's hardly as disgraceful a decision as India picking two spinners at Lord's during the summer.

I think the pitch merited playing four fast bowlers even if Ashwin was available as the team management doesn't trust Kuldeep. Jadeja would be a complete passenger on these wickets. You'd rather keep the pressure on the brittle Australian batting with a strong pace attack. I guess what I mean to say is that the Australian batsmen would have preferred facing Jadeja on this pitch than Yadav.

India did well today, I'm afraid some of the complaints against Kohli just come across as the inane babbling of spoiled children.
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What did playing 4 pacers gain us that playing 3 pacers wouldn't have, the overrate got bad so kohli had to turn to vihari and vijay who leaked runs, in a low scoring game which this will be who knows how big an effect this will have.

Even if you go with the we need 4 pacers logic, We saw last game that a tail that can bat is important, but for ashwin the first innings score could easily have been 150 all out, now he gets injured any smart captain would have figured playing bhuvi made far more sense and it is a damn stupid decision given how brittle our own batting lineup is.
 
barah_admi said:
I dunno about getting selection wrong, in this test the pitch is uneven and I don't think bhuvi would be nay better with his much lower pace.
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He can bat and on a low scoring bowling friendly wicket control means a lot more than wayward extra 5Kmph.
 
jagatk said:
What did playing 4 pacers gain us that playing 3 pacers wouldn't have, the overrate got bad so kohli had to turn to vihari and vijay who leaked runs, in a low scoring game which this will be who knows how big an effect this will have.
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Bingo, you'd see all finger spinners getting smashed on this track. Even Lyon won't be a threat if India don't throw their wickets away. This is not a sluggish drop-in wicket like the one at the MCG, fast bowlers would be more effective due to the uneven bounce.

Yes, I would have played Bhuvenshwar ahead of Yadav, but I'm not privy to the players' current form. It might just be a simple case of them thinking that Yadav was bowling better (and significantly quicker) in the nets.
 
Last Monetarist said:
Bingo, you'd see all finger spinners getting smashed on this track. Even Lyon won't be a threat if India don't throw their wickets away. This is not a sluggish drop-in wicket like the one at the MCG, fast bowlers would be more effective due to the uneven bounce.

Yes, I would have played Bhuvenshwar ahead of Yadav, but I'm not privy to the players' current form. It might just be a simple case of them thinking that Yadav was bowling better (and significantly quicker) in the nets.
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Nope the indian part timers kept getting smashed because tgey kept dropping it either too short or too full, vihari even bowled couple of juicy full tosses which were hammered away, neither jadeja nor Lyon would be doing that. Also vihari got a few balls to absolutely take off in terms of spin and bounce, imagine an accurate jadeja doing ball after ball of that stuff.

Personally i don't care what yadav does in nets, only the indian management seems to be unaware of the fact that he is wayward and gives away runs while rarely taking enough wickets to justify the run rate. This was a guy who got in the test squad only because he performed well against WI in tests, that was the basis for his selection.
 
jagatk said:
Nope the indian part timers kept getting smashed because tgey kept dropping it either too short or too full, vihari even bowled couple of juicy full tosses which were hammered away, neither jadeja nor Lyon would be doing that. Also vihari got a few balls to absolutely take off in terms of spin and bounce, imagine an accurate jadeja doing ball after ball of that stuff.

Personally i don't care what yadav does in nets, only the indian management seems to be unaware of the fact that he is wayward and gives away runs while rarely taking enough wickets to justify the run rate. This was a guy who got in the test squad only because he performed well against WI in tests, that was the basis for his selection.
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I still don't see it as a horrible decision, I can see the merit of playing Yadav on this pitch. It's not as clear-cut as you want to believe. Even if it's a new ground, the pitch seems to be fairly similar to the WACA. I will wait and see how Lyon bowls before reaching a conclusion on this decision. Lest it be forgotten, he averages almost 48 in Perth.

It's pretty clear to me you and a lot of Indian fans have issues with Kohli's personality and the manner in which he leads the team, so even if India do well (which they did today), there's very little credit in the bank.
 
One of the reasons for playing Umesh ahead of Bhuvi was the fact that Umesh has a 5fer at Perth and is in good bowling form (his recent 10fer comes to mind). Don't think Bhuvi would've done any better today.
 
Centurion said:
One of the reasons for playing Umesh ahead of Bhuvi was the fact that Umesh has a 5fer at Perth and is in good bowling form (his recent 10fer comes to mind). Don't think Bhuvi would've done any better today.
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His 5fer came with a 5 RPO run rate. Bhuvi wouldn't have been our most expensive bowler.
 
Mamoon said:
Kohli was the captain for the first (Adelaide) and the fourth Tests. Dhoni only played two Tests, i.e. second and third.
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Saurav said:
Kohli was the captain in that Test.Dhoni wasn't even in Australia by then IIRC
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jagatk said:
Before you begin your Jai Jai Kohli nonsense maybe check what you mean by facts, Dhoni didn't play the first test, Kohli was the captain.
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Regardless, the XI would have been selected by Dhoni.
 
He has done blunders & not playing a spinner here is one too . I guess he wants a 11 he thinks will perform & if BCCI gives him a free hand maybe they are more impressed with his captaincy then some of us are .
 
Mamoon said:
Nonetheless, Dhoni was still the official captain. It is highly unlikely that Kohli was the one to decide the playing XI.
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Dhoni wasn't even in Aus at the time.Anyone who knows Dhoni would know he'll never pick Karn over Ashwin
 
His management team consists of Shastri,Bharat Arun,Sanjay Bangar,R Sridhar.

What can be expected?
 
And yet he has won enough to ensure his tean at the top of the rankinhs for ladt 25 months. Count the number of captains who could achieve that distinction.

He has his flaws, looks clueless at times but under him we have seen some major improvements as well
- Scoring 500-600 regularly at home
- Best ever pace unit we have had in our history
- Not conceding 500-600 regularly outside India

I can provide reasons for each of those decisions and show why those were right when they were made. In hindsight with the resulrs before us, very easy to be judgmental.
 
to the question posed, yes, there are captains who consistently pick the wrong team.
every pakistani captain that has selected hafeez to open, fulfils the criteria.
 
why isnt Ashwin playing this match? Is that one of the mistakes OP is pointing to?
 
cricketindiafan said:
And yet he has won enough to ensure his tean at the top of the rankinhs for ladt 25 months. Count the number of captains who could achieve that distinction.

He has his flaws, looks clueless at times but under him we have seen some major improvements as well
- Scoring 500-600 regularly at home
- Best ever pace unit we have had in our history
- Not conceding 500-600 regularly outside India

I can provide reasons for each of those decisions and show why those were right when they were made. In hindsight with the resulrs before us, very easy to be judgmental.
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Tbh India being #1 has a lot more to do with other teams. The 2008--2011 Indian team captained by Dhoni would smash this Indian side to smithereens eventhough probably this side has had a longer reign.
 
Don't think Kohli made any mistake in this match in terms of team selection. Looking at the green pitch, there was always a temptation to go with 4 seamers. Bhuvi could hv tried but Yadav is more suited in these kind of hard surfaces due to his pace. People need to understand the difference in green pitches between Eng and Aust. With open stadiums in Eng and with wind, Bhuvi type of bowlers can get constant swing, especially with red Duke ball. The new Perth stadium, like MCG and Brisbane is an enclosed collosium. Hardly any wind and the air remains in the stadium. Its very tough to get swing under these conditions. And Kookaburra balls dont offer any swing anyway after 15 overs. So you need a Yadav type hit the deck fast bowler and not someone like Bhuvi who relies on swing.

Also with Ashwin out, the only other choice was Jadeja. But Australia has 5-6 left handers in their batting line up, so left arm off spin with ball coming in wont have been handy anyway. Even then, Vihary didnt bowl all that bad and infact better than what Ashwin did in last test. Our opening bowlers bowled poorly and Aussies batted well. It happens in cricket and not much Kohli can do about it.
 
Kohli has made selection errors yet India are still ranked number 1 in tests and number 2 in ODIs. I think selection should be taken out of Kohlis hands and I think a more tactical coach will help him out a lot.
 
cricketindiafan said:
And yet he has won enough to ensure his tean at the top of the rankinhs for ladt 25 months. Count the number of captains who could achieve that distinction.

He has his flaws, looks clueless at times but under him we have seen some major improvements as well
- Scoring 500-600 regularly at home
- Best ever pace unit we have had in our history
- Not conceding 500-600 regularly outside India

I can provide reasons for each of those decisions and show why those were right when they were made. In hindsight with the resulrs before us, very easy to be judgmental.
Click to expand...

We have always been great at home even in the 90's. That is down to his and other players batting and most of it was in Eng series look st what happened against Aussies and SA when pitches weren't as helpful. So he some how single handedly found these guys bhuvi, ishant, bumrah and shami. He was just there right time right place, imagine having a bedt ever pace attack and getting smashed by England due to bad selections, this team is winning despite his captaincy not because of it.

Also none of those were hindsight calls, Rahane and Bhuvi dropping were roundly questioned before game even began. Logic of playing 2 spinners on a green track left many befuddled.
 
Does the team really matter when you have a player like Kohli? Kohli alone is the team, stop being jealous.
 
He can do whatever he wants.Bhuvnashwar trundler Kumar won't have saved india.He is hardly better than umesh.
 
jagatk said:
So did umesh save India?
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So would jadeja save India. Lyon look pretty ordinary and Kumar is not a good bowler in these conditions. If you think you know better than Kohli than sorry I can't help you. He took some wrong decision and every Captain do. Looking at pitch it's hard choice to make. So stop crying and enjoy India innings.
 
Well Vihari got a couple of wickets. With Jadeja in Umesh’s place would have added variety and control to the attack. Additionally, jadeja can bat a bit.
 
Mr. Cricket said:
So would jadeja save India. Lyon look pretty ordinary and Kumar is not a good bowler in these conditions. If you think you know better than Kohli than sorry I can't help you. He took some wrong decision and every Captain do. Looking at pitch it's hard choice to make. So stop crying and enjoy India innings.
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Umesh was our costliest bowler, bhuvi or jadeja wouldn't have been costly and there was nothing umesh did that any other bowler in his place wouldn't have. Additionally both those can bat, our batting ends at no 7. The first test, the England series we have seen countless times how much a wagging tail can make a difference in the game, especially a low scoring one.

Also with Lyon did nothing crap, he kept an end tied up giving away no runs. The pressure it builds and the fact that you can rest your Pacers who just 4 days before bowled 100+ overs is huge.
 
jagatk said:
Umesh was our costliest bowler, bhuvi or jadeja wouldn't have been costly and there was nothing umesh did that any other bowler in his place wouldn't have. Additionally both those can bat, our batting ends at no 7. The first test, the England series we have seen countless times how much a wagging tail can make a difference in the game, especially a low scoring one.

Also with Lyon did nothing crap, he kept an end tied up giving away no runs. The pressure it builds and the fact that you can rest your Pacers who just 4 days before bowled 100+ overs is huge.
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Ya I equally hate Umesh and I understand ur frustration, but you have to think about Kohli position when he saw that green pitch. Umesh has taken 10 wicket in last test match in India and he is more suitable for bouncy pitch. It's more of a Umesh prbm that he can deliver at right moment.
 
Mr. Cricket said:
Ya I equally hate Umesh and I understand ur frustration, but you have to think about Kohli position when he saw that green pitch. Umesh has taken 10 wicket in last test match in India and he is more suitable for bouncy pitch. It's more of a Umesh prbm that he can deliver at right moment.
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Against WI my friend, also this isn't the first time kohli has picked umesh ahead of bhuvneshwar remember SA 2nd Test, the man has his favorites and it back fires on us very badly.
 
jagatk said:
Against WI my friend, also this isn't the first time kohli has picked umesh ahead of bhuvneshwar remember SA 2nd Test, the man has his favorites and it back fires on us very badly.
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Yes that hurts but still I guess he took this decision only on the basis of pitch (aus one).
Now time to throw Umesh out of team and should try some young potential. Even if Kohli take wrong decision they will respond better than Umesh.
 
Why is only Umesh getting so much hate despite taking 2 wickets but no one's criticizing Shami who got 0 wickets and was more expensive?

In hindsight, Kuldeep should've replaced Ashwin.
 
Hasan123 said:
Kohli has made selection errors yet India are still ranked number 1 in tests and number 2 in ODIs. I think selection should be taken out of Kohlis hands and I think a more tactical coach will help him out a lot.
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This is what kumble did in 4th test vs australia and now he is out of the picture
 
Centurion said:
Why is only Umesh getting so much hate despite taking 2 wickets but no one's criticizing Shami who got 0 wickets and was more expensive?

In hindsight, Kuldeep should've replaced Ashwin.
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This first innings problem is known one and he seems to pick it up in the second innings, umesh is useless whatever innings he plays.
 
Nathan Lyon picks up 5 wickets and our genius Kaptaan didn't even bother to get a spinner in the side.
Worst Captain in the world if we keep Sarfaraz aside.
 
TM Riddle said:
Nathan Lyon picks up 5 wickets and our genius Kaptaan didn't even bother to get a spinner in the side.
Worst Captain in the world if we keep Sarfaraz aside.
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What's worse was he did it bowling 30 plus overs under 2 an over.
 
Has there been a worse decision maker in the history of any sport on this planet? Kohli may be a legendary batsman but as a leader he makes Rahul Gandhi look good.
 
Not picking Jadeja or Kuldeep has cost India this match, could have gone 2-0 wasn't for the poor team selection..
 
TM Riddle said:
Nathan Lyon picks up 5 wickets and our genius Kaptaan didn't even bother to get a spinner in the side.
Worst Captain in the world if we keep Sarfaraz aside.
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And Vihari got 2 lol! :91:
 
sensible-indian-fan said:
Where are those geniuses who say Kohli knows better?

Lol.
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Romali_rotti said:
Not picking Jadeja or Kuldeep has cost India this match, could have gone 2-0 wasn't for the poor team selection..
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Varun said:
And Vihari got 2 lol! :91:
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This genius captain picked 2 spinners for the Lord's test :))). I am running out of words to describe his absurd decision making abilities. Feel for Jadeja, does Kohli have something personal against Sir?
 
Jadeja's batting would have been handy on this pitch given the awfulness of our tail end.
 
Fair enough, Lyon was more effective than I expected him to be. Nonetheless, at this stage the difference between the two sides is an umpiring decision more than team selection. The Indian fast bowlers have been unlucky not to pick up more than a wicket in the second innings.
 
Last Monetarist said:
Fair enough, Lyon was more effective than I expected him to be. Nonetheless, at this stage the difference between the two sides is an umpiring decision more than team selection. The Indian fast bowlers have been unlucky not to pick up more than a wicket in the second innings.
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Umesh yadav has been anything but unlucky imagine someone holding up 1 end bowling under 2 an over instead of having to go to your best pacer over and over again with little rest because 1 of your 4 man attack is leaking runs and not picking wickets.
 
Have to say, the idea of picking umesh over jadeja/bhuvi was bad.
This must be the end of umesh yadav's test career in overseas.
 
Kuldeep or Jadeja should have played. They had the off spinner for left handers covered in Vihari, should have played 1 of Jadeja or Kuldeep.
 
Swashbuckler said:
This genius captain picked 2 spinners for the Lord's test :))). I am running out of words to describe his absurd decision making abilities. Feel for Jadeja, does Kohli have something personal against Sir?
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Its the other way round. with his horrible selection india plays every match on back foot
 
Kohli's response.

“When we looked at the pitch, we didn't think about the Jadeja option. We thought four quicks would be enough. Nathan Lyon bowled really well. We never thought about the spin option to be honest. I am focused on the next game and I hope I can contribute on a winning note,” said the 30-year-old when asked whether the name of Jadeja was considered after Ashwin was deemed unfit for the second Test.

https://www.timesnownews.com/sports...-in-favour-of-umesh-yadav-for-2nd-test/332727

There's a reason why RCB wins nothing inspite of this guy being at the helm for so many years with all the backing and money power.
 
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