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How can Mohammad Rizwan get away with such performances?

mominsaigol

mominsaigol

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I'm referring to the Champions One Day Cup.

So far in this cup, many have performed with saim ayub's 156 making a strong case for him to still be persisted with,

Kamran Ghulam 100's convincing the selectors that he deserved an odi and test call up

Babar azam performing ensuring that at the very least he still deserves to be in the team as a batsmen

Haider Ali, Tayyab Tahir and Agha salman both making a strong case to represent Pakistan in the middle order and the likes of Husnain and Ali raza looking set in full swing to replace Shaheen who atm looks out of sorts.

However

No one is questioning Rizwan’s performance in this cup and its likely that he'll still be selected despite avergaing 29 with a strike rate of 80 batting at no 4 in this tournament. His scores in 5 games atm are

47
33
51
20
0

How can rizwan keep getting selected after such horrible performances?
 
Im convinced nothing will change with Pakistan cricket for the time being. We will keep on regressing. Pakistan cricket is morally bankrupt, nothing fazes them anymore. One would think a defeat against Afghanistan would raise hell in Pakistan.
But they went ahead and brough the same people back and lost to USA, gave a match away on a plate to India in a worldcup and still persisted with the same guy as captain. Doubling down they lost to Bangladesh not just one match but a complete whitewash at home. This should have been a nuclear bomb moment for Pakistan cricket. Yet nothing fazed them. Nothing. Soulless. Dead. I am so sick and tired of Pakistan cricket. So sick.
 
I don't get the point of this thread. Are you suggesting we have a ready replacement for Rizwan or are you suggesting that a team of Pakistan calibre needs someone much greater than Rizwan?

The reason I say this is because the only way to gauge someone's ability would be in most recent event of that sort. The most recent relevant case for ODI was the last year's world cup and if memory serves me right then Rizwan was the highest run getter for Pakistan. I just don't foresee any reason to kickout the highest run-getter, maybe you would have reasons hence asking.
 
Rana said:
What’s this shot called? I think it’s the ‘Naqvi Surgery booming drive’

Or the “All format booming drive”
Click to expand...
Watching it - he suffers from a common technical problem of feet stuck leg side. He’s only looking to play stuff on middle, middle and leg. Very common problem.

Unfortunately it’s only very common in U10s!
 
Extra_Cover said:
I don't get the point of this thread. Are you suggesting we have a ready replacement for Rizwan or are you suggesting that a team of Pakistan calibre needs someone much greater than Rizwan?

The reason I say this is because the only way to gauge someone's ability would be in most recent event of that sort. The most recent relevant case for ODI was the last year's world cup and if memory serves me right then Rizwan was the highest run getter for Pakistan. I just don't foresee any reason to kickout the highest run-getter, maybe you would have reasons hence asking.
Click to expand...
If rizwan failed a million times over you'd still not get the point of the thread lol.
 
Extra_Cover said:
I don't get the point of this thread. Are you suggesting we have a ready replacement for Rizwan or are you suggesting that a team of Pakistan calibre needs someone much greater than Rizwan?

The reason I say this is because the only way to gauge someone's ability would be in most recent event of that sort. The most recent relevant case for ODI was the last year's world cup and if memory serves me right then Rizwan was the highest run getter for Pakistan. I just don't foresee any reason to kickout the highest run-getter, maybe you would have reasons hence asking.
Click to expand...
Extra cover always appearing like Batman to provide extra cover for Rizwan’s nonsense
 
He's averaging 30... the thread is acting as if he's averaging 10 all tournament.

Fakhar, Shan, Saud, Abdullah Shafique, Mo Haris, Sahibzada Farhan are all averaging similarly or less. Where's the outrage for them?

He's the best wicket keeper batsman in Pakistan and a tournament where he averages 30 is hardly a failure. He averages 40 in One Day Internationals, averages 48 in domestic ODs, infact all his averages from domestic to international are 40+.

"How is he getting away with this" Years of consistency in domestic cricket should lead to merit based selection right? So where's the leeway when he averages 30 in one tournament?

He's got the most runs for Pakistan in tests, ODIs and the second most in T20s for us in the past year. Weird thread.
 
He is scoring runs for Pakistan so I wouldn’t be worried if he is not scoring in domestic cricket. You can’t drop a player who is performing in international cricket on the basis of him not performing in domestic cricket.
 
iPakistani said:
He's averaging 30... the thread is acting as if he's averaging 10 all tournament.

Fakhar, Shan, Saud, Abdullah Shafique, Mo Haris, Sahibzada Farhan are all averaging similarly or less. Where's the outrage for them?

He's the best wicket keeper batsman in Pakistan and a tournament where he averages 30 is hardly a failure. He averages 40 in One Day Internationals, averages 48 in domestic ODs, infact all his averages from domestic to international are 40+.

"How is he getting away with this" Years of consistency in domestic cricket should lead to merit based selection right? So where's the leeway when he averages 30 in one tournament?

He's got the most runs for Pakistan in tests, ODIs and the second most in T20s for us in the past year. Weird thread.
Click to expand...
Wrong he's averaging 29 with a sr of 80 and you deliberately chose players who haven't performed.

1) Kamran Ghulam 49avg 100Sr
2) Babar azam 76Avg 98 SR
3) Salman Ali Agha 44 Avg 90 SR
4) Tayyab Tahir 55Avg 85 SR
5) Usman Khan 51 Avg 115 SR
6) Saim Ayub 49 avg 108 SR

^^ All these guys have performed as for the rest

1) Fakhar 32 avg 89 SR
I don't give a crap about the others you've named as their not important and don't deserve a spot in the team to begin with.

All these players have performed better and their all top to middle order batters qith UK being a wicket keeper.

How on earth does rizzu still warrant a place in the team when he's averaging 29 and sr of 80 which is the lowest ampung everyone here?
 
mominsaigol said:
I'm referring to the Champions One Day Cup.

So far in this cup, many have performed with saim ayub's 156 making a strong case for him to still be persisted with,

Kamran Ghulam 100's convincing the selectors that he deserved an odi and test call up

Babar azam performing ensuring that at the very least he still deserves to be in the team as a batsmen

Haider Ali, Tayyab Tahir and Agha salman both making a strong case to represent Pakistan in the middle order and the likes of Husnain and Ali raza looking set in full swing to replace Shaheen who atm looks out of sorts.

However

No one is questioning Rizwan’s performance in this cup and its likely that he'll still be selected despite avergaing 29 with a strike rate of 80 batting at no 4 in this tournament. His scores in 5 games atm are

47
33
51
20
0

How can rizwan keep getting selected after such horrible performances?
Click to expand...
So if a batsman is performing in international but flops in a domestic tournament he should be dropped from Pak team? Look at an example of his scores:

Mohammad Rizwan batting in SENA in Tests (most recent first)

42, 10, 61, 60, 71, 53, 72, 27, 9, 45, 0, 95 & 37

Six 50s & Ten 25+ scores in 13 innings

This doesn't mean he's above criticism.
 
Mamoon said:
He is scoring runs for Pakistan so I wouldn’t be worried if he is not scoring in domestic cricket. You can’t drop a player who is performing in international cricket on the basis of him not performing in domestic cricket.
Click to expand...
Then why even host a one day tournament? This tournament revealed alot, like shaheen's form and players who atm are superior to rizwam as a whole.

Infact all the mainstays such as Abdullah, Saud, Shaheen, Chacha, Rizwan have not been performing nor has Imam.

This tournament has shown that besides Babar amd fakhar it's time for a complete overhaul toward players who are actually performing.

Rizwan is stated to he a goat by some and yet he hasn't done a damn, Babar has had no issue performing and showing why he's still top tier depaite all the criticism.
 
ataullah said:
So if a batsman is performing in international but flops in a domestic tournament he should be dropped from Pak team? Look at an example of his scores:

Mohammad Rizwan batting in SENA in Tests (most recent first)

42, 10, 61, 60, 71, 53, 72, 27, 9, 45, 0, 95 & 37

Six 50s & Ten 25+ scores in 13 innings

This doesn't mean he's above criticism.
Click to expand...
Please understand that test and whiteball are different formats.

I want saud to be dropped in odi's as well but not in test as he's had a medicore whiteball career but has been good for pakistan in test even scoring a 100 recently.

Rizwan after his sri lanka 100 failed 6 games in a row, Followed by a medicore Ireland and NZ c series followed by a medicore wc 2024 tournament as an opener.
 
mominsaigol said:
Then why even host a one day tournament? This tournament revealed alot, like shaheen's form and players who atm are superior to rizwam as a whole.

Infact all the mainstays such as Abdullah, Saud, Shaheen, Chacha, Rizwan have not been performing nor has Imam.

This tournament has shown that besides Babar amd fakhar it's time for a complete overhaul toward players who are actually performing.

Rizwan is stated to he a goat by some and yet he hasn't done a damn, Babar has had no issue performing and showing why he's still top tier depaite all the criticism.
Click to expand...
Yes, but you don’t drop a player performing in international cricket because he didn’t do well in domestic cricket in the middle of the season.
 
In international cricket Mr. Rizwan is the second coming of Adam Gilchrist, and on top of that, he is a lovely guy. He has been the one shining light during defeats to India, USA and Bangladesh. We must back him to the moon. It is due to his leadership, friendship and unity that make the dressing room atmosphere so positive. He is the best wicket keeper in the world and his impactful batting put him well ahead of his biggest rivals. I find it disrespectful that Mr. Rizwan had to compete in a domestic tournament which was so beneath him, the only explanation for his scores which don’t correlate to his greatness when it matters most for his country.
 
Mamoon said:
Yes, but you don’t drop a player performing in international cricket because he didn’t do well in domestic cricket in the middle of the season.
Click to expand...
Why? He's only doing well in test, not in whiteball.

After his sri lanka 100 here are his scores

1) 49 vs India
2) 46 vs Australia
3) 8 vs Afghanistan
4) 31 vs SA
5) 26 vs Bangladesh
6) 36 vs England
7) 25 vs NZ
8) 7 vs NZ
9) 24 vs NZ
10) 90 vs NZ
11) 38 vs NZ
12) 45 vs NZ
13) 22 vs NZ (Retired hurt so won't count this)
14) 1 vs Ireland
15) 75 vs Ireland
16) 56 vs Ireland
17) 0 vs England
18) 23 vs England
19) 9 vs India
20) 53 vs Canada
21) 17 vs Ireland

After failing 6 games in a row he averages, 32 in all his whiteball games with a ridiculously low SR.

The whole reason he was asked to come at 4 and bat as an opener in t20 despite low sr was due to consistency yet he seems to be averaging less then fakhar's peak t20 years even as an opener in 2018? Or heck he's averaging lower then fakhar is in 2023? Even if you count his games where he scored that 100 and his sri lanka bash exploits.
 
mominsaigol said:
Wrong he's averaging 29 with a sr of 80 and you deliberately chose players who haven't performed.

1) Kamran Ghulam 49avg 100Sr
2) Babar azam 76Avg 98 SR
3) Salman Ali Agha 44 Avg 90 SR
4) Tayyab Tahir 55Avg 85 SR
5) Usman Khan 51 Avg 115 SR
6) Saim Ayub 49 avg 108 SR

^^ All these guys have performed as for the rest

1) Fakhar 32 avg 89 SR
I don't give a crap about the others you've named as their not important and don't deserve a spot in the team to begin with.

All these players have performed better and their all top to middle order batters qith UK being a wicket keeper.

How on earth does rizzu still warrant a place in the team when he's averaging 29 and sr of 80 which is the lowest ampung everyone here?
Click to expand...
He averages 49 at 91 SR in 36 innings over the last 2 years in international cricket.

You're suggesting to drop a guy that's averaged 49 in the last 2 years in International ODs on the basis of... a random 50 over domestic competition in which he averaged 29?
 
iPakistani said:
He averages 49 at 91 SR in 36 innings over the last 2 years in international cricket.

You're suggesting to drop a guy that's averaged 49 in the last 2 years in International ODs on the basis of... a random 50 over domestic competition in which he averaged 29?
Click to expand...
After his sri lanka 100, He's been averaging 32 ever since In all his whiteball games and even had a poor psl, Followed by a poor domestic one day tournament
 
mominsaigol said:
After his sri lanka 100, He's been averaging 32 ever since In all his whiteball games and even had a poor psl, Followed by a poor domestic one day tournament
Click to expand...
Average of 32 is better than all of our wk career average in odis with the exception of sarfaraz.
 
khyberlion said:
Average of 32 is better than all of our wk career average in odis with the exception of sarfaraz.
Click to expand...
How many games have usman khan or haris played? Rizwan played over 21 whiteball games and God knows how many test games in less then a year.

Secondly it's because rizzu plays in a much easier era compared to Kamran. Umar akmal spent years and years being scrutinized because he batted at an avg of 32 and 90+ sr from his days batting at no 6 in-between 2012 and 2015.

They attacked his cause people considered it pathetic for someone who showed so much promise in 2009.

Yet rizwan who's been batting at a similar avg and a much better sr is being considered a ladla?
 
mominsaigol said:
After his sri lanka 100, He's been averaging 32 ever since In all his whiteball games and even had a poor psl, Followed by a poor domestic one day tournament
Click to expand...
Clutching at straws 'all whiteball games' but you started the thread based on his performance IN A ONE DAY TOURNAMENT.

Since that 100 he's played 6 innings averaging 39 in ODIs, with 4 of these innings coming against Ind,Aus,Eng,SA.

His scores vs these top 4 teams, 49,46,31 and 36.
 
iPakistani said:
Clutching at straws 'all whiteball games' but you started the thread based on his performance IN A ONE DAY TOURNAMENT.

Since that 100 he's played 6 innings averaging 39 in ODIs, with 4 of these innings coming against Ind,Aus,Eng,SA.

His scores vs these top 4 teams, 49,46,31 and 36.
Click to expand...
All I see is you clutching at straws tbh.

He's performing poorly in a one day tournament. Whole point of this tournament was to select players WHO PERFORM.

What message are you sending by selecting a player who doesn't perform? Should shaheen also be picked again?

If a student fails an exam, does a teacher pass a student because he did well in past exams?

That's how silly that logic is, but but but he did well in international so he's a ladla exception in this tournament.

We all know what would have happened if this was some other player who you don't support. Fakhar's 89 for markhors saved him but if he didn't make that score the knives for him were already out on that thread asking for him to be dropped even though 2 International innings ago he has a 123 of 70+ deliveires chasing down a drs of 400.
 
mominsaigol said:
How many games have usman khan or haris played? Rizwan played over 21 whiteball games and God knows how many test games in less then a year.

Secondly it's because rizzu plays in a much easier era compared to Kamran. Umar akmal spent years and years being scrutinized because he batted at an avg of 32 and 90+ sr from his days batting at no 6 in-between 2012 and 2015.

They attacked his cause people considered it pathetic for someone who showed so much promise in 2009.

Yet rizwan who's been batting at a similar avg and a much better sr is being considered a ladla?
Click to expand...
You didn't tackle my question. Stick to the question. I am not a rizwan fan fyi.
 
iPakistani said:
Clutching at straws 'all whiteball games' but you started the thread based on his performance IN A ONE DAY TOURNAMENT.

Since that 100 he's played 6 innings averaging 39 in ODIs, with 4 of these innings coming against Ind,Aus,Eng,SA.

His scores vs these top 4 teams, 49,46,31 and 36.
Click to expand...
How does it feel that UK performed but rizwan didn't. Shpuld rizzu still get ladla treatment?
 
Rizwan is the second name on the team sheet after Babar. It's ridiculous to question his place in the team given that he is the best wicketkeeper in the country.

His batting has also been top-notch for years now. One bad, domestic tournament means nothing against years of top-class international performances.
 
iPakistani said:
He averages 49 at 91 SR in 36 innings over the last 2 years in international cricket.

You're suggesting to drop a guy that's averaged 49 in the last 2 years in International ODs on the basis of... a random 50 over domestic competition in which he averaged 29?
Click to expand...
What are his strike rates in Odis and T20Is?
 
Rana said:
And?

Which of the 4 did Pakistan win?
Click to expand...
None of these scores are impressive. Idkw he's flexing about 30 to 40 scores on batting paradise pitches excluding chennai where everyone was bashing 400 totals
 
mominsaigol said:
None of these scores are impressive. Idkw he's flexing about 30 to 40 scores on batting paradise pitches excluding chennai where everyone was bashing 400 totals
Click to expand...
Plus the bloke was batting at 4…not at number 8/9 where bowling all-rounders bat

Those scores are impressive for someone like Muhammad Wasim JR
 
If you all wish to he fair and just then the team of the tournament so far is

1) saim ayub (C)
2) Kamram Ghulam
3) Babar Azam
4) Usman Khan (WK)
5) Tayyab Tahir
6) Agha Salman
7) Khushdil Shah
8) Mubashir Khan
9) Jahndad Khan
10) Muhammad Husnain
11) Ali Raza

12) Irfan Khan Niazi
13) Haider Ali
14) Zahid Mahmood
15) Naseem Shah

Sub: Chacha, Imam.

^^ Logically if pcb was actually fair and selected based of PERFORMANCES, this would be your 15 man squad.

But we know this won't happen and the sane rubbish will be selected
 
mominsaigol said:
If you all wish to he fair and just then the team of the tournament so far is

1) saim ayub (C)
2) Kamram Ghulam
3) Babar Azam
4) Usman Khan (WK)
5) Tayyab Tahir
6) Agha Salman
7) Khushdil Shah
8) Mubashir Khan
9) Jahndad Khan
10) Muhammad Husnain
11) Ali Raza

12) Irfan Khan Niazi
13) Haider Ali
14) Zahid Mahmood
15) Naseem Shah

Sub: Chacha, Imam.

^^ Logically if pcb was actually fair and selected based of PERFORMANCES, this would be your 15 man squad.

But we know this won't happen and the sane rubbish will be selected
Click to expand...
Also by no means am I suggesting this squad, because I believe some players should be added as well based of qualititative data.

But quantitatively this is your squad based of performance numbers
 
mominsaigol said:
If you all wish to he fair and just then the team of the tournament so far is

1) saim ayub (C)
2) Kamram Ghulam
3) Babar Azam
4) Usman Khan (WK)
5) Tayyab Tahir
6) Agha Salman
7) Khushdil Shah
8) Mubashir Khan
9) Jahndad Khan
10) Muhammad Husnain
11) Ali Raza

12) Irfan Khan Niazi
13) Haider Ali
14) Zahid Mahmood
15) Naseem Shah

Sub: Chacha, Imam.

^^ Logically if pcb was actually fair and selected based of PERFORMANCES, this would be your 15 man squad.

But we know this won't happen and the sane rubbish will be selected
Click to expand...
Ideal squad for champions trophy 🏆
 
mominsaigol said:
If you all wish to he fair and just then the team of the tournament so far is

1) saim ayub (C)
2) Kamram Ghulam
3) Babar Azam
4) Usman Khan (WK)
5) Tayyab Tahir
6) Agha Salman
7) Khushdil Shah
8) Mubashir Khan
9) Jahndad Khan
10) Muhammad Husnain
11) Ali Raza

12) Irfan Khan Niazi
13) Haider Ali
14) Zahid Mahmood
15) Naseem Shah

Sub: Chacha, Imam.

^^ Logically if pcb was actually fair and selected based of PERFORMANCES, this would be your 15 man squad.

But we know this won't happen and the sane rubbish will be selected
Click to expand...

Mubasir at 8 is a bit too low. Guy can open and let KG bat at 3. Drop Bobzy, the guy only offers an anchor at best
 
Ahmed216 said:
Ideal squad for champions trophy 🏆
Click to expand...
Dude what is your issue? He’s made a genuine effort to give you the best picture of whose performed best. Why do you want to act like he is being disingenuous like you guys always are?
 
Rana said:
Mubasir at 8 is a bit too low. Guy can open and let KG bat at 3. Drop Bobzy, the guy only offers an anchor at best
Click to expand...
I said quantititavely, Not qualitative. My personal sqaud is different

1) Fakhar Zaman
2) Saim Ayub
3) Kamran Ghulam
4) Usman Khan (WK)
5) Tayyab Tahir/ Agha
6) Mubashir Khan
7) Khushdil Shah
8) Janhdad Khan
9) Naseem Shah
10 Husnain
11) Ali Raza

Mubashir, Saim can spin, The rest 4 are pacers

Irfan Khan might not be bad, his 100 was good but he took alot of time at the beginning.
 
Ahmed216 said:
Ideal squad for champions trophy 🏆
Click to expand...
What squad do you want? The one we sent for WC 2023?

1) Imam ul Haq
2) Abdullah Shafiq
3) Babar Azam
4) Muhammad Rizwan
5) Salman Ali Agha/Saud Shakeel
6) Chacha
7) Shadab
8) Nawaz
9) Shaheen
10) Hasan Ali
11) Haris Rauf

^^ Is this the ideal squad for you?
 
mominsaigol said:
I said quantititavely, Not qualitative. My personal sqaud is different

1) Fakhar Zaman
2) Saim Ayub
3) Kamran Ghulam
4) Usman Khan (WK)
5) Tayyab Tahir/ Agha
6) Mubashir Khan
7) Khushdil Shah
8) Janhdad Khan
9) Naseem Shah
10 Husnain
11) Ali Raza

Mubashir, Saim can spin, The rest 4 are pacers

Irfan Khan might not be bad, his 100 was good but he took alot of time at the beginning.
Click to expand...
A fully fit Shaheen any day over a fully fit Naseem for me.

I know he is not bowling well or is out of form, but the guy is a strong competitor.

Hasnain v Pakistan batters as opposed to SENA+ India batters will be very interesting to see. Credit to him basically for turning his career around at this point.

Need to see more of Ali Raza. As a bowler he is developing well and is YEARS ahead of his age boys like the Tall kid in PZ, Ubaid Shah etc. I know a skipper like Younis Khan would take a punt on him tbf
 
mominsaigol said:
What squad do you want? The one we sent for WC 2023?

1) Imam ul Haq
2) Abdullah Shafiq
3) Babar Azam
4) Muhammad Rizwan
5) Salman Ali Agha/Saud Shakeel
6) Chacha
7) Shadab
8) Nawaz
9) Shaheen
10) Hasan Ali
11) Haris Rauf

^^ Is this the ideal squad for you?
Click to expand...
It is, he won’t admit it. He’s going to act snarky
 
Rana said:
Dude what is your issue? He’s made a genuine effort to give you the best picture of whose performed best. Why do you want to act like he is being disingenuous like you guys always are?
Click to expand...
I genuinely agree with him
 
mominsaigol said:
What squad do you want? The one we sent for WC 2023?

1) Imam ul Haq
2) Abdullah Shafiq
3) Babar Azam
4) Muhammad Rizwan
5) Salman Ali Agha/Saud Shakeel
6) Chacha
7) Shadab
8) Nawaz
9) Shaheen
10) Hasan Ali
11) Haris Rauf

^^ Is this the ideal squad for you?
Click to expand...
It's a good squad. We're losing anyways why not give chance to some new faces
 
Rana said:
A fully fit Shaheen any day over a fully fit Naseem for me.

I know he is not bowling well or is out of form, but the guy is a strong competitor.

Hasnain v Pakistan batters as opposed to SENA+ India batters will be very interesting to see. Credit to him basically for turning his career around at this point.

Need to see more of Ali Raza. As a bowler he is developing well and is YEARS ahead of his age boys like the Tall kid in PZ, Ubaid Shah etc. I know a skipper like Younis Khan would take a punt on him tbf
Click to expand...
Ali Raza can bowl pace which is something that's lacking in pakistan cricket and so can husnain.

The problem with shaheen ans the rest like Ali, khurram, mir hamza is that their slow as molasses. Nahid rana showed why a guy who's raw and undercooked can be effective through pace alone.

It's why ihsanullah is a missed opportunity, you can teach a guy who bowls genuine pace line and length by working with bowling coaches.

A pacer with poor line and length can be groomed to become class by fixing line and length. But a pacer who can't bowl pace will be ineffective the moment his line and length fades which is why mcgrath was an exception as even kallis later on started bowling rubbish as he started to decline and age caught up with him.

As for shaheen, A fully fit shaheen is the greatest pacer we have had in the modern era. The ones who are superior like amir, Gul etc are all from a generation before him, but he faded away very quickly after 2022
 
Ahmed216 said:
It's a good squad. We're losing anyways why not give chance to some new faces
Click to expand...
It's just your remark earlier to me? You said you don't reply to kids yet relied to me multiple times and are now in agreement? What's wrong with you? You're not bipolar are you?
 
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