How can Pakistan cricketers improve their game while playing mostly against SL, Zim, WI?

[Savak]

To be honest, in my view since 2015 we have lost every series against the Big 5 teams like India, Australia, New Zealand, England and South Africa. Heck even Bangladesh is a better side than us

We have only beaten teams like Zimbabwe, Sri Lanka and West Indies. The vast majority of players in our team have been able to boost their averages and cement their spots due to performances against Zimbabwe, Sri Lanka and West Indies. I don't see Fakhar Zaman scoring a double century against the big teams. We have selected a core group of 15-20 players primarily based on performances against these 3 low ranked teams. To be honest, series against these low ranked teams should be used to give chances to your bench players, second eleven players and all bilateral T20 games should be used to give chances to the bench, second eleven players. Pakistan must be the only country in the world which plays its best 11 across all formats against all teams.

How do our players expect to improve when they don't play enough against India, Australia, New Zealand, England and South Africa? This is something the PCB needs to address.

 

[Ashraful_Rox]

But Pakistan player against England before the World Cup, they should be the best prepared team and they beat England the tournament favourites. The next remaining matches for Pakistan are easy so they will go onto win remaining of their matches.

 

[Ronaldo7]

Even after the WC they're playing teams like the Netherlands, Zim, SL.

 

[BreadPakoda]

But Pakistan player against England before the World Cup, they should be the best prepared team and they beat England the tournament favourites. The next remaining matches for Pakistan are easy so they will go onto win remaining of their matches.

Playing against England compounded the problem. It demotivated the likes of Junaid and Faheem and also Pakistan ended up not selecting their best player for the world cup.

 

[Ashraful_Rox]

Playing against England compounded the problem. It demotivated the likes of Junaid and Faheem and also Pakistan ended up not selecting their best player for the world cup.

India even beat Australia, they are tournament favourites. They have better bowlers than England. Pakistan team will destroy Peoteas, Kiwis, Afghanistan and Us. The Real Pakistan is about to turn up

 

[ataullah]

India even beat Australia, they are tournament favourites. They have better bowlers than England. Pakistan team will destroy Peoteas, Kiwis, Afghanistan and Us. The Real Pakistan is about to turn up

Pak team is finished now after groupings and players revolting against captain. Our only hope left is if inzi can somehow organise Molana Tariq Jameel to meet players again and lecture them about groupings and unity

 

[Kianig89]

Set their own targets like openers going unscathed in first 10 overs, bowlers to swing the new ball, fielding acrobatics,
Most Important
i. Strike rotation
ii. Win the toss every time for next 2yrs just bowl first

 

[Ashraful_Rox]

Pak team is finished now after groupings and players revolting against captain. Our only hope left is if inzi can somehow organise Molana Tariq Jameel to meet players again and lecture them about groupings and unity

Need to pick Hasnain brother, the kid is fast and has Jazba Junoon. Wood and Archer are the fastest this World Cup followed by Wahab, if Hasnain plays it will be Hasnain + Wahab = More Jazba Junoon. Hassan Ali has lost his pace and passion. Hasnain will rattle Kiwis and Us, we struggled against Ferguson because of his manly mustache and pace second. I know in a short time Hasnain can’t grow a mustsche as he barely looks 17 but pace alone can trouble Kiwis Proteas and US

 

[Captain caveman]

Need to pick Hasnain brother, the kid is fast and has Jazba Junoon. Wood and Archer are the fastest this World Cup followed by Wahab, if Hasnain plays it will be Hasnain + Wahab = More Jazba Junoon. Hassan Ali has lost his pace and passion. Hasnain will rattle Kiwis and Us, we struggled against Ferguson because of his manly mustache and pace second. I know in a short time Hasnain can’t grow a mustsche as he barely looks 17 but pace alone can trouble Kiwis Proteas and US

I have read quite a few of your posts and i like them all!
You are either an expert on cricket like me or we are both deluded!
I think its the first!
Definetely bring in hasnain for hasan.
And haris in for malik!

 

[Captain caveman]

Set their own targets like openers going unscathed in first 10 overs, bowlers to swing the new ball, fielding acrobatics,
Most Important
i. Strike rotation
ii. Win the toss every time for next 2yrs just bowl first

You are correct sir!
If the opposition are not of high qualiy, you must set targets like the ones above.
Also try to win games in 35 overs instead of 50, etc.

 

[Khanusman1]

Need to pick Hasnain brother, the kid is fast and has Jazba Junoon. Wood and Archer are the fastest this World Cup followed by Wahab, if Hasnain plays it will be Hasnain + Wahab = More Jazba Junoon. Hassan Ali has lost his pace and passion. Hasnain will rattle Kiwis and Us, we struggled against Ferguson because of his manly mustache and pace second. I know in a short time Hasnain can’t grow a mustsche as he barely looks 17 but pace alone can trouble Kiwis Proteas and US

Brother Hasnain has so much Junoon that he will bowl in Lahore and the ball will reach Dhaka at 155kmph.

 

[Ashraful_Rox]

I have read quite a few of your posts and i like them all!
You are either an expert on cricket like me or we are both deluded!
I think its the first!
Definetely bring in hasnain for hasan.
And haris in for malik!

Our Batsmen struggled big time against Ferguson's pace when pitched in the right areas, Windies lost because they just bowled short, probably 90% of the deliveries. Kiwis smartly blocked our scoring areas and studied every player even Mommadulla was bogged down by Santner, it was fantastic game plan. When you have a 150 kph + youngsta beauty with passion in the sidelines, you are playing Hassan Ali who thinks after winning CT he was won the world. I haven't seen passion in him, saw in the eyes of Amir and hungry for success. Amir, Hasnain + Wahab = answer to Pakistan's WC win. Easier matches ahead, Pakistan needs support.

 

[Mamoon]

Pakistan needs to win bilateral series against Australia, England, India, South Africa and New Zealand. That is the only way we will get more series against these sides.

Since 2005, apart from a decent run in 2013, we have been absolute minnows against the top sides in ODIs, especially in the UAE.

At the moment, Pakistan does not deserve to play the top sides regularly, and we only have ourselves to blame.

 

[Nil Dhumrojal]

Whether you play with big teams or not if players are not capable of then nothing can make them world beater.

 

[Abdulm123]

Hasan Ali should be kicked out of the Pakistan team and show what he can do at the Wagah Border

 

[Captain caveman]

Our Batsmen struggled big time against Ferguson's pace when pitched in the right areas, Windies lost because they just bowled short, probably 90% of the deliveries. Kiwis smartly blocked our scoring areas and studied every player even Mommadulla was bogged down by Santner, it was fantastic game plan. When you have a 150 kph + youngsta beauty with passion in the sidelines, you are playing Hassan Ali who thinks after winning CT he was won the world. I haven't seen passion in him, saw in the eyes of Amir and hungry for success. Amir, Hasnain + Wahab = answer to Pakistan's WC win. Easier matches ahead, Pakistan needs support.

Brother we are on the same wavelength!
Totally agree with you!
By the way, how good have bangladesh been! Shakib has proven the doubters wrong and that he is the best all rounder in the world!
I am honestly more excited about
watching bangladesh vs india than i was about india vs pak! I knew we would bottle it, as i know you guys will push india to the limits! Don't know who will win, but i am expecting a hum dinger of a match!

 

[Captain caveman]

Pakistan needs to win bilateral series against Australia, England, India, South Africa and New Zealand. That is the only way we will get more series against these sides.

Since 2005, apart from a decent run in 2013, we have been absolute minnows against the top sides in ODIs, especially in the UAE.

At the moment, Pakistan does not deserve to play the top sides regularly, and we only have ourselves to blame.

To improve our odi petformances, how about we hold all our odi matches in SA.
The pitches are better and it will also be cheaper than UAE.
Of course, we need to select new young players as well.
Your thoughts!

 

[Executioner]

Pakistan have also not played with Bangladesh in the meanwhike. We may not be as good as top teams but we are probably better than Zim and marginally better than SL and WI.

 

[Captain caveman]

Pakistan have also not played with Bangladesh in the meanwhike. We may not be as good as top teams but we are probably better than Zim and marginally better than SL and WI.

I think pcb should stop trying to force bangladesh to tour pak and instead invite them to UAE. bangla will give pak a real hard test and could well beat pak in UAE!

 

[Executioner]

I think pcb should stop trying to force bangladesh to tour pak and instead invite them to UAE. bangla will give pak a real hard test and could well beat pak in UAE!

Already beat full strength pakistan side in UAE without Tamim and Shakib.

It would be a good tournament and there are a lot of BD supporters in UAE. And BD bring along lots of sponsors and TV audience. I can guarantee teams like WI and SL being hosted causes severe loss instead of profit. Plus BD are more competitive nowadays especially in limited overs.

 

[Savak]

I think pcb should stop trying to force bangladesh to tour pak and instead invite them to UAE. bangla will give pak a real hard test and could well beat pak in UAE!

Why invite them to the UAE when the PCB has successfully held PSL games, international matches and that the security forces have proven they can provide security? They are so many westerner vloggers traveling in Pakistan without security and posting details of this trip.

Any illogical refusal by Bangladesh not to tour Pakistan cannot be accepted.

 

[MMHS]

Why invite them to the UAE when the PCB has successfully held PSL games, international matches and that the security forces have proven they can provide security? They are so many westerner vloggers traveling in Pakistan without security and posting details of this trip.

Any illogical refusal by Bangladesh not to tour Pakistan cannot be accepted.

I read a comment here in PP just about a year back - ".... you'll not be invited to UAE for any cricket, you are not worth of that - deal with it". And, one fool had the audacity to write that ".... to start with, their life isn't that valuable".

Every coin has two sides - beggars are not choosers and don't set the logic - neither it matters if beggars accept the coin or not. Start to deal with that.

Let alone playing in PAK, I am quite happy without any bilateral cricket with PAK for a decade - let's see who deals with that better.

 

[Chokli]

I read a comment here in PP just about a year back - ".... you'll not be invited to UAE for any cricket, you are not worth of that - deal with it". And, one fool had the audacity to write that ".... to start with, their life isn't that valuable".

Every coin has two sides - beggars are not choosers and don't set the logic - neither it matters if beggars accept the coin or not. Start to deal with that.

Let alone playing in PAK, I am quite happy without any bilateral cricket with PAK for a decade - let's see who deals with that better.

Hosting BD in UAE will generate a lot of income due to lots of Bengalis in the UAE

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

It all comes down to domestic cricket again.You can't rely on the ICC to give Pakistan healthy itineraries, they are not concerned in the short term about Pakistan's issues. Pakistan needs to start producing better and more competent players, and that will only come from a more professional domestic league where they can get a good grounding.

Maybe they could take some pointers from BD who have come a long way in the last decade. They are showing it is all possible even without exposure to the top sides.

 

[MMHS]

Hosting BD in UAE will generate a lot of income due to lots of Bengalis in the UAE

No, hosting BD anywhere will generate lots of income for PCB, because majority sponsorship money will come for Bangladesh - in US Dollars, which will be converted @157+ rate. Gate money isn't even enough to cover tips these days ........

 

[Savak]

I read a comment here in PP just about a year back - ".... you'll not be invited to UAE for any cricket, you are not worth of that - deal with it". And, one fool had the audacity to write that ".... to start with, their life isn't that valuable".

Every coin has two sides - beggars are not choosers and don't set the logic - neither it matters if beggars accept the coin or not. Start to deal with that.

Let alone playing in PAK, I am quite happy without any bilateral cricket with PAK for a decade - let's see who deals with that better.

My question to you is do you personally believe that there is a security risk to Bangladeshi players in Pakistan given that there are so many Bangladeshi's working in Pakistan?

 

[MMHS]

My question to you is do you personally believe that there is a security risk to Bangladeshi players in Pakistan given that there are so many Bangladeshi's working in Pakistan?

Simply because PAK is in the list of highest risk country to travel in foreign offices for at least 170 countries in world - that should be enough reason not to send 20 high risk targets for a month. Obviously, I hope no buffoon this time will come measure the worth of Bangladeshi lives.

Instead of bluffing own people with a false promise of tour by SRL, SAF.... even AUS, ENG every 2-3 months and doing false bravado by suing BCCI or cancelling BD tours, ask your Board to do something meaningful - hosting entire PSL at home safe & sound can be a decent start. Behaving civil among global partners without unworthy arrogance can make other side softer - people fell pity on someone struggling, but instead of helping will spit at face if the attitude isn't appropriate.

This is just the starting, unless there is a major behavioral change in your cricket leadership, you'll be enjoying lots of records in next few years from PAK players .... something you won't like, I can tell - one tour against ZIM reserves was enough.

 

[Chokli]

No, hosting BD anywhere will generate lots of income for PCB, because majority sponsorship money will come for Bangladesh - in US Dollars, which will be converted @157+ rate. Gate money isn't even enough to cover tips these days ........

PCB are missing out.

Bangladesh is a gun team now too.

 

[captain.hansolo]

To be honest, in my view since 2015 we have lost every series against the Big 5 teams like India, Australia, New Zealand, England and South Africa. Heck even Bangladesh is a better side than us

We have only beaten teams like Zimbabwe, Sri Lanka and West Indies. The vast majority of players in our team have been able to boost their averages and cement their spots due to performances against Zimbabwe, Sri Lanka and West Indies. I don't see Fakhar Zaman scoring a double century against the big teams. We have selected a core group of 15-20 players primarily based on performances against these 3 low ranked teams. To be honest, series against these low ranked teams should be used to give chances to your bench players, second eleven players and all bilateral T20 games should be used to give chances to the bench, second eleven players. Pakistan must be the only country in the world which plays its best 11 across all formats against all teams.

How do our players expect to improve when they don't play enough against India, Australia, New Zealand, England and South Africa? This is something the PCB needs to address.

Invest in improving fitness, and improving team morale.

Having a fitness boot camp, have everyone eat lean and clean, hire a team chef, have the team members spend some time camping in the outdoors to build relationships.

finally, focus on mental fitness, do some yoga, speak to a therapist and surround the team with reinforcement (family, friends and genuine well wishers).

there is no reason the Pakistani team cannot rebound from this.

 

[Abdul]

Why invite them to the UAE when the PCB has successfully held PSL games, international matches and that the security forces have proven they can provide security? They are so many westerner vloggers traveling in Pakistan without security and posting details of this trip.

Any illogical refusal by Bangladesh not to tour Pakistan cannot be accepted.

Pakistan are beggars, and beggars cannot be choosers.

 

[Pakpak]

Pakistan have also not played with Bangladesh in the meanwhike. We may not be as good as top teams but we are probably better than Zim and marginally better than SL and WI.

I don't mean to make BD fans bigheaded more than they are already but you're ten times better than SL and WI. SL especially are associate level shocking now.

 

[Mamoon]

To improve our odi petformances, how about we hold all our odi matches in SA.
The pitches are better and it will also be cheaper than UAE.
Of course, we need to select new young players as well.
Your thoughts!

It is not feasible because of the long distance flights, plus there isn’t enough Pakistani population. PCB will lose a lot of money if they decide to play home matches in South Africa, and there is little reason why CSA will accommodate PCB.

UAE is awful, but it’s the only realistic option for Pakistan to host matches.

 

[Pete Rose]

Invest in improving fitness, and improving team morale.

Having a fitness boot camp, have everyone eat lean and clean, hire a team chef, have the team members spend some time camping in the outdoors to build relationships.

finally, focus on mental fitness, do some yoga, speak to a therapist and surround the team with reinforcement (family, friends and genuine well wishers).

there is no reason the Pakistani team cannot rebound from this.

To be clear most of this was being done, but started being abandoned over last year as the board got pressured by media because of bad results. no one should believe that sarfaraz cleared the yoyo tests or haris or hafeez or abi ali.

 

[Executioner]

I don't mean to make BD fans bigheaded more than they are already but you're ten times better than SL and WI. SL especially are associate level shocking now.

Tell that to Baz who thinks Bangladesh should end up at the bottom of the points table at the end of the world cup even below those teams you mentioned.

The issue is, this sentiment is echoed by many experts and pakistan fans alike.

 

[Pakpak]

Tell that to Baz who thinks Bangladesh should end up at the bottom of the points table at the end of the world cup even below those teams you mentioned.

The issue is, this sentiment is echoed by many experts and pakistan fans alike.

Tbh mostly because of your fans. Whenever BD wins a match they have to come here and gloat and compare it to us.

 

[Afridi96]

Pakistan needs to win bilateral series against Australia, England, India, South Africa and New Zealand. That is the only way we will get more series against these sides.

Since 2005, apart from a decent run in 2013, we have been absolute minnows against the top sides in ODIs, especially in the UAE.

At the moment, Pakistan does not deserve to play the top sides regularly, and we only have ourselves to blame.

In 2005 Pakistan beat West Indies 3-0, beat India 4-2 and beat England 3-2. In 2006 drew with India 1-1, drew with England 2-2 (probably would have won if the first game didn't get rained out) and beat West Indies 3-1. In 2007, beat Sri Lanka 2-1 and then lost to India and South Africa 3-2. In 2008 beat India in the Kitply Cup final and drew and lost to them in the Asia Cup and then beat West Indies 3-0. 2009, lost 3-2 to Australia and Sri Lanka and 2-1 to New Zealand. Also reached semi-finals of the Champions Trophy. 2010, lost 3-2 to England (dodgy umpiring throughout the series) and South Africa. 2011, beat New Zealand 3-2, reached semi-finals of the World Cup and then beat Sri Lanka 4-1. 2012,won the Asia Cup, lost to Australia 2-1 and beat India in an ODI at the end of the year.

Although there were a few more losses and wins (against minnows + West Indies and Sri Lanka), these wins and close series are enough to show Pakistan haven't been "absolute minnows" against top sides in ODIs since the beginning of 2005.

 

[khan_aa]

they do play other teams. they only dont play india.

they played SA, lost.
They played england just before WC, they lost.
Australia recent test series in australia was a fail, lost ODIs to NZ. Won T20 against NZ.

Lets stop complaining and start looking at the real issues.

It comes down to lack of self belief. thats all.

 

[Savak]

they do play other teams. they only dont play india.

they played SA, lost.
They played england just before WC, they lost.
Australia recent test series in australia was a fail, lost ODIs to NZ. Won T20 against NZ.

Lets stop complaining and start looking at the real issues.

It comes down to lack of self belief. thats all.

How many times do we play against these teams in comparison to India? When you continously play against the best, you eventually get battle hardened players. Playing against weaker sides and minnows only gives a false sense of security and where you stand resulting in being shell shocked when you are up against the best.

 

[gkswamy123]

Pakistan team at current juncture may be a mincemeat for every critic off the field and for every opposition on the field but to see everyone harping on players, coaches, support staff, UAE, PSL or selections is pretty disappointing. See where others are doing right, it's very simple!! It's their domestic cricket setup and cricket structure that's hoisting teams to a higher orbit. Just look at how structured India under 19 or India A team is organised and who is in charge of these teams, one will realise what needs to be done in Pakistan cricket.

 

[Mohammad zuber]

In 2005 Pakistan beat West Indies 3-0, beat India 4-2 and beat England 3-2. In 2006 drew with India 1-1, drew with England 2-2 (probably would have won if the first game didn't get rained out) and beat West Indies 3-1. In 2007, beat Sri Lanka 2-1 and then lost to India and South Africa 3-2. In 2008 beat India in the Kitply Cup final and drew and lost to them in the Asia Cup and then beat West Indies 3-0. 2009, lost 3-2 to Australia and Sri Lanka and 2-1 to New Zealand. Also reached semi-finals of the Champions Trophy. 2010, lost 3-2 to England (dodgy umpiring throughout the series) and South Africa. 2011, beat New Zealand 3-2, reached semi-finals of the World Cup and then beat Sri Lanka 4-1. 2012,won the Asia Cup, lost to Australia 2-1 and beat India in an ODI at the end of the year.

Although there were a few more losses and wins (against minnows + West Indies and Sri Lanka), these wins and close series are enough to show Pakistan haven't been "absolute minnows" against top sides in ODIs since the beginning of 2005.

You hasn't won a odi series against top sides since 2013 that is almost 7years with out a series win against top sides

 

[khan_aa]

How many times do we play against these teams in comparison to India? When you continously play against the best, you eventually get battle hardened players. Playing against weaker sides and minnows only gives a false sense of security and where you stand resulting in being shell shocked when you are up against the best.

what difference does it make? if you play less then you should be more focused to win those infrequent events, but that doesnt happen either.

 

[khan_aa]

You hasn't won a odi series against top sides since 2013 that is almost 7years with out a series win against top sides

we won CT 2017. we beat many top teams in that tournament.
We also drew a test series against england in england.

teams go up and down, its just a bad time for us.

 

[Sunny_majoka]

It's better than loosing

 

[Mamoon]

In 2005 Pakistan beat West Indies 3-0, beat India 4-2 and beat England 3-2. In 2006 drew with India 1-1, drew with England 2-2 (probably would have won if the first game didn't get rained out) and beat West Indies 3-1. In 2007, beat Sri Lanka 2-1 and then lost to India and South Africa 3-2. In 2008 beat India in the Kitply Cup final and drew and lost to them in the Asia Cup and then beat West Indies 3-0. 2009, lost 3-2 to Australia and Sri Lanka and 2-1 to New Zealand. Also reached semi-finals of the Champions Trophy. 2010, lost 3-2 to England (dodgy umpiring throughout the series) and South Africa. 2011, beat New Zealand 3-2, reached semi-finals of the World Cup and then beat Sri Lanka 4-1. 2012,won the Asia Cup, lost to Australia 2-1 and beat India in an ODI at the end of the year.

Although there were a few more losses and wins (against minnows + West Indies and Sri Lanka), these wins and close series are enough to show Pakistan haven't been "absolute minnows" against top sides in ODIs since the beginning of 2005.

The fact that you had to highlight three series defeats to prove your point that Pakistan hasn't been minnows simply proves my point.

Also, when I said "since 2005", I was talking about post 2005, not Jan 2005 onwards. Pakistan were quite competitive till 2005, and that is why in early 2006, it was actually ranked 2nd for a few months. However, it has all been downhill since, and that is why we have consisted been ranked 5th, 6th and 7th.

Post 2005:

5 ODI series vs England, and we have lost all 5
6 ODI series vs Australia, and we have lost all 6
6 ODI series vs South Africa, we have lost 5
4 ODI series vs New Zealand, we have lost 3

We only had one series vs India in this decade, and we did win that, but it was an Indian team in transition. The likes of Tendulkar, Sehwag, Gambhir, Yuvraj etc. were on their last legs, Rohit was still batting in the middle-order and the likes of Dinda and Ishant were leading the attack. Bhuvneshwar and Shami made their debuts in that series.

If Pakistan vs India would have been a regular affair in this decade, they would have smashed the H2H record for good.

Our performances have been absolutely pathetic and minnow-level, especially for a cricket mad country with 200m population and 65 years of cricket heritage.

 

[Mohammad zuber]

we won CT 2017. we beat many top teams in that tournament.
We also drew a test series against england in england.

teams go up and down, its just a bad time for us.

We indians move on from ct13 cw11 but pakistanis are still???

 

[khan_aa]

We indians move on from ct13 cw11 but pakistanis are still???

it was a historical event. you guys beat sri lanka in a 20 over rained out game. its not about moving on, im just stating a simple fact.
2011 WC win was a fluke also. almost lost to pakistan in semis, and then crowd was behind you in the final. infact thats the biggest advantage you have in these games - 80% crowd support.
CT 2017 was a great win for us because number 1, we beat you and beat your arrogance. number 2, we did it in an incredible manner. some wins are historic. infact it was bigger than you beating australia in tests (WITHOUT SMITH AND WARNER - your media never mentions this BTW).

lets see who takes this world cup. i dont think india is as good as australia in big games. england and nz also look good.

pakistan is not competitive this time around, but two years ago they were.

 

[Afridi96]

Those results you posted include results for post 2013, my point is Pakistan weren’t “absolute minnows against the top ODI sides” from 2006-2013. The results I posted earlier clearly show that.

 

[Afridi96]

Wasn’t talking about post 2013 bro

 

[The_Odd_One]

Use these series to test your bench strength. It is Ok to lose some games with new guys but you will have a good set of players available for big series and tournaments.

 

[Syed1]

Better to be crap all four years and still reach business end of WC, than to smash everybody and their aunt for four years and at the WC lose to Pak and SL and face elimination.