How selfish have we been as Pakistani fans towards Saeed Ajmal?

[Hitman]

Ajmal is a legend. Who cares about some nobody armchair critics. Our best offspinner alongside saqlain

Like the ICC?

 

[Azzurri]

Like the ICC?

The same ICC who cleared him? He was freaking cleared to bowl. It isn't his fault if ICC didn't had a proper sytem in place at that time

 

[Hitman]

The same ICC who cleared him? He was freaking cleared to bowl. It isn't his fault if ICC didn't had a proper sytem in place at that time

Never denied that, did I? You quoted nobody armchair critics. ICC banned him, not nobody armchair critics.

 

[BunnyRabbit]

Not his fault that they used faulty methods prior to 2014. He was already tested in 2009 and was cleared. He did what he did best.
He wasn't chucking deliberately. Chucking is illegal but not a crime. Match fixing and spot fixing are far worse things that have happened. You are totally conscious when you are fixing but chucking is not done deliberately, especially before 2014 when cricketers have very little knowledge of understanding 15 degree limit with a naked eye.
In my opinion chucking is a disease rather than a crime, with a disease, you get treatment and you come back. It's not as if someone gets sick voluntarily. Fixing is a crime which a player is doing intentionally with all his senses alive.

 

[CricFan2012]

Respect and guard of honours given to chuckers only encourages more of our cricketers to chuck.

Even the posters on the forums speaking highly of Ajmal are a problem, if we want to clean up our cricket and eradicate chucking then it starts with us

 

[Azzurri]

i would be happy if you guys start abusing harbhajan and murli as well

 

[WengerOut]

i would be happy if you guys start abusing harbhajan and murli as well

Leave Bhajji out as he is a bang average bowler.

Murali after being cleared still maintained good performance while Ajmals performance level had a free fall which means he depended more on chucking.

 

[Azzurri]

Leave Bhajji out as he is a bang average bowler.

Murali after being cleared still maintained good performance while Ajmals performance level had a free fall which means he depended more on chucking.

he was cleared by the same rules through which ajmal got cleared in 2009

 

[Sean143]

People should realize that he cleared the test in 2009 and wasn't chucking much till workload forced his body to do so.Even if he was ICC should have tested him during that period and the fact that ICC didn't do anything all these years should make a strong case for humiliating them rather than the man who played with great passion and honesty (during testing times likes 2010 match fixing saga) and won pakistan countless number of games.Suppose if an umpire gives a wrong not out decision in the favor of the batsman and the batsman then goes on to make an outstanding triple hundred who would you blame the batsman or the umpire ?.Ajmal served with great passion,honesty and gave his everything to pakistan.In my opinion this man deserves better from us

 

[Sean143]

he was cleared by the same rules through which ajmal got cleared in 2009

I think you should also consider the fact that ajmal was older at that time

 

[Lefthanded]

Ajmal was legal when the UWA tested him. The severe 'illegality' was found in everything when ICC decided to try different methods, which measure the ball from a different point of release.

UWA's judgment might favour a bowler I appreciated, but UWA does have more publications, were transparent about their methods, their research and made it public. ICC didn't, and somehow the fact they measured at different point of release, made Ajmal a pariah and virtually ended his career.

Whether or not you like Ajmal, have some consideration for the fact ICC fired the expert contractor and made up a different method which gave a different result.

Here's the doubt of UWA's biomechanist https://www.dawn.com/news/1138142

Tomorrow maybe they'll use another unverified method and things will be different.

I'm not saying that chucking is ok, but I am disturbed by lack of compassion and sympathy.

Ajmal was for a long time a great service to Pakistan and brought tremendous joy to fans, people seem to sing Wasim's praises even though he was a fixer. Ajmal at best broke rules that could've been fixed under the previous testing methods.

I can't imagine the pressure Ajmal was under after he realised that he was carrying the bowling attack too often or at least lifting it world class proportions. And under that pressure of people to carry their happiness is something extra. I remember how after losing to Ireland, there was this Urdu call-in/talk show where a man sobbed on the phone and told TV that he and his wife can't look at each other because of the grief they feel.

I'm not celebrating that kind of sensitivity, but the bunda was also very sensitive.

Why be cruel? Do you want someone to do that to you or your kids, if you/they were rapidly disgraced with no credit in the bank for your services?

 

[Lefthanded]

I think you should also consider the fact that ajmal was older at that time

That's a good point, but they were not the same tests and points of measurements.

 

[Prince of Pakistan]

He was a champion bowler. This guy won so many matches for Pakistan single handedly even when our batting capitulated.

He deserves respect and all the praise. When Misbah had Ajmal's overs left we knew we still were in the game. Farewell champion!

 

[Bilal7]

Like the ICC?

Errr... He was the #1 ranked ODI bowler in the world for weeks even after the ICC rulr change and clampdown.

The ICC rates Ajmal as one of the best ODI spinners of all time and rightly so.

 

[Bilal7]

Ajmal was legal when the UWA tested him. The severe 'illegality' was found in everything when ICC decided to try different methods, which measure the ball from a different point of release.

UWA's judgment might favour a bowler I appreciated, but UWA does have more publications, were transparent about their methods, their research and made it public. ICC didn't, and somehow the fact they measured at different point of release, made Ajmal a pariah and virtually ended his career.

Whether or not you like Ajmal, have some consideration for the fact ICC fired the expert contractor and made up a different method which gave a different result.

Here's the doubt of UWA's biomechanist https://www.dawn.com/news/1138142

Tomorrow maybe they'll use another unverified method and things will be different.

I'm not saying that chucking is ok, but I am disturbed by lack of compassion and sympathy.

Ajmal was for a long time a great service to Pakistan and brought tremendous joy to fans, people seem to sing Wasim's praises even though he was a fixer. Ajmal at best broke rules that could've been fixed under the previous testing methods.

I can't imagine the pressure Ajmal was under after he realised that he was carrying the bowling attack too often or at least lifting it world class proportions. And under that pressure of people to carry their happiness is something extra. I remember how after losing to Ireland, there was this Urdu call-in/talk show where a man sobbed on the phone and told TV that he and his wife can't look at each other because of the grief they feel.

I'm not celebrating that kind of sensitivity, but the bunda was also very sensitive.

Why be cruel? Do you want someone to do that to you or your kids, if you/they were rapidly disgraced with no credit in the bank for your services?

So many people are ignorant about this whole issue and it is quite sad to see. I'm sure the majority of this 'Ajmal is a chucker' brigade knows nothing about what you so eloquently described.

Ajmal himself said that 90% of bowlers would be unable to pass the new testing methods and there is some truth to his statement. Back when the ICC only allowed 5 degrees of straightening, it was found that 99% of bowlers were chucking!

Who's to say how many go over the limit now? This is why the ICC needs to conduct a faculty-wide test and revise their methods if need be.

 

[Bilal7]

Leave Bhajji out as he is a bang average bowler.

Murali after being cleared still maintained good performance while Ajmals performance level had a free fall which means he depended more on chucking.

Ajmal cleared the same test that Murali did. Did you know that? Do you think there was a difference of 40 degrees between the straightening that Murali used in his bowling action and that of Ajmal's?

 

[WengerOut]

Ajmal cleared the same test that Murali did. Did you know that? Do you think there was a difference of 40 degrees between the straightening that Murali used in his bowling action and that of Ajmal's?

After clearing who performed better? And whose performance tapered off? I wonder what could be the reason!!

 

[hadi123]

Yep, way too selfish, but that's PP. My own stance on Ajmal is simple.

He was NOT a chucker until ICC put everyone through the new biomechanical tests. The reason is simple. Before the new tests, ICC tested him and cleared him. He started to bowl based on this impression and - in fact - everyone else also agreed. All batsmen, all officials, and all umpires. Bar some, maybe.

If ICC had these new tests available in the first place, he would be advised earlier of his action and he would change it. Now, at the age of 38+, it is too late. He cannot invest the next 3 years of his career in coming up with new deliveries and pace variations because he is not even going to last physically for that long internationally. New action or old action.

It is no different than having a speed limit of 100 KPH on a road revised down to 60 KPH. Those who drove in the past at, say, 90 KPH cannot be ticketed retrospectively for having broken the new limit.

Post is 2 years old but I agree 100%. So many people give him hate for being a chucker but the fact is he hadn't been banned when he was taking all those wickets. And he was taking wickets over a long period, was a key player for 3+ years and didn't get called till 2014 or so which is why I disagree with people who say his wickets shouldn't count.

 

[Pete Rose]

he is a champion whiner now.

 

[Bilal7]

After clearing who performed better? And whose performance tapered off? I wonder what could be the reason!!

You seem confused. Ajmal became the best spinner in the world after clearing his 2009 test.

 

[Suleiman]

Probably too selfless if anything.

 

[SensiblePakFan]

Its ironic how Ajmal and Misbah brought us back from the 2010 humiliation, beat england 3-0, and Ajmal loses his last match to none other than Salman butt.

 

[James]

I think it's the fact that he lied about his action that irked Pak fans. I believe he said something along the lines of a car accident being responsible for him not being able to straighten his arm which he was magically able to do once he was banned and had to remodel his action.

This is the real point. The chucking controversy is neither here nor there for me, because factually speaking he could bowl after passing some tests and then hecould not bowl after later failing some other tests.

But the supposed car accident / deformity was his key citation for an unusual bowling action all along - now we know that there are massive question marks over this story, it massively undermines his integrity and brings his character into question in a way that has not at all been resolved.

Based on this I believe him to be a potentially dishonest person - and if he could lie about this, perhaps he would have been capable of knowingly cheating on a cricket field as well.

The Ajmalistas will not like this conclusion but it is an argument based on logic. Not saying it’s right or anything - I could be wrong - but, if the boot fits...