How to stop England's domination in Cricket; How can sub-continental teams improve themselves?

[docteurmanish]

Hi

It’s sad to see pak loose 3-0 . I am sure india would loose 1-1 to this side or 1-2 with England winning given how poor indian batting has been of late saved by jadeja - ashwin combo

What is it in our grassroots cricket that pak / india / lanka to better fight - think all the subcontinent teams have fallen behind England and australia are rejuvenating again

( india for example needs to have better selections and approach to discarding / retiring old players on time . Pak I feel needs to get better sporting pitches and captain / players like pant who take game to the opposition , lanka needs to find better spinners but overall have been punching above their weight of the three teams in many series )

 

[AamchiMumbaikar]

India won't lose the series at home

 

[docteurmanish]

Reasons why india will loose

- catches - extremely poor catching side . Kohli is the worst . Others not far behind . Rahul can’t catch with keeping gloves on .
- aging batting - pujara , Kohli are sitting ducks against anderson
- poor spin batters - barring shreyas most are useless . Pujara will block but won’t score .
- aging ashwin - jadeja . Ashwin looks jaded .
- lack of opportunity to young players like gill
- poor coach . Lost to England in one of match

 

[Front Foot Pull]

typical knee jerk reaction thread. just cause PAK got white washed you felt the need to club IND with them? IND lost 2 matches at home in the last decade, i repeat 2 test matches. and your statement about IND would lose 1-2 to ENG, is this in india or england?

don't let pak getting white washed, india losing white ball matches have an impact on your opinion of our test side. just cause someone won over somebody else, we don't need to go into introspection and fix things in a format which needs no repairs as of now. relax.

 

[Amjid Javed]

India, SL and Bangladesh wouldn't be dumb like Pakistan and produce flat wickets, you would get pitches which would break up and turn from ball one. Completely different challenge when the ball is spinning sharply etc.. and your then trying to be aggressive. England could still do well but no other Asian side would be as charitable and clueless as pakistan

 

[jnaveen1980]

Dominate? India minus Rohit as a player, captain dominated England for 3.5 days in England right after IPL where as England after taking down NZ were found wanting for more than 3 days. Bumrah who never captained any side at any level looked inadequate. Pant and Jadeja thrashed England all over. Even with such a poor captaincy INdia should have won but for dropped catches. Bairstow was let off twice. One was regulation catch by Vihari. For the record India's run rate in the first innings was more than England's.

 

[jnaveen1980]

Under right captaincy i back this Indian side dominating England in England let alone India. India should have nailed t he series 3-1 but for that vada pav Rohit pulling out with fake covid excuses to prepare himself for IPL. That is why series was tied.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

I dont think Indians will let Rehan and Jack leach run through them like we did.

 

[Robert]

Reasons why india will loose

- catches - extremely poor catching side . Kohli is the worst . Others not far behind . Rahul can’t catch with keeping gloves on .
- aging batting - pujara , Kohli are sitting ducks against anderson
- poor spin batters - barring shreyas most are useless . Pujara will block but won’t score .
- aging ashwin - jadeja . Ashwin looks jaded .
- lack of opportunity to young players like gill
- poor coach . Lost to England in one of match

I doubt Anderson will tour at age 41.

It could be that England can bat long against the Indian spinners like Cook and KP did, with Root and Brook scoring huge and perhaps using Foakes up the order as he is so good against spin.

But unless Rehan advances rapidly in eighteen months, I can’t see England’s spinners doing serious damage like Monty & Swann.

 

[jnaveen1980]

I doubt Anderson will tour at age 41.

It could be that England can bat long against the Indian spinners like Cook and KP did, with Root and Brook scoring huge and perhaps using Foakes up the order as he is so good against spin.

But unless Rehan advances rapidly in eighteen months, I can’t see England’s spinners doing serious damage like Monty & Swann.

Ironically this line up is not that good against spin. Kohli has been regressing for the last few years against spin. Moeen Ali is his biggest nemesis. Pujara also regressed against spin. KL Rahul is useless these days.

 

[dildilpak]

Ironically this line up is not that good against spin. Kohli has been regressing for the last few years against spin. Moeen Ali is his biggest nemesis. Pujara also regressed against spin. KL Rahul is useless these days.

Pujara just scored a century in spin-haven Bangladesh.

 

[Front Foot Pull]

Under right captaincy i back this Indian side dominating England in England let alone India. India should have nailed t he series 3-1 but for that vada pav Rohit pulling out with fake covid excuses to prepare himself for IPL. That is why series was tied.

yes vihari put down a key catch. had we won that, this over the top "bazball" boasting wouldn't be there. but we can't go by IFs and but, can we? they've outplayed us and won. that said, they (stokes' side) won a single test against ind at their home. so a lot more need to be played in england and in india to get to a conclusion on better side.

on another topic, it is poor to see long time hardcore cricket watcher use words like "vada pav". vada pav, chokli, KLol etc are some of the cheap names used by dumb teenagers on twitter. poor to see long time watchers use them too.

 

[jnaveen1980]

Pujara just scored a century in spin-haven Bangladesh.

Shakib hardly bowled. There were only two spinners Taijul and Mehdi. This was a slow turner. Any one could score runs there

 

[jnaveen1980]

yes vihari put down a key catch. had we won that, this over the top "bazball" boasting wouldn't be there. but we can't go by IFs and but, can we? they've outplayed us and won. that said, they (stokes' side) won a single test against ind at their home. so a lot more need to be played in england and in india to get to a conclusion on better side.

on another topic, it is poor to see long time hardcore cricket watcher use words like "vada pav". vada pav, chokli, KLol etc are some of the cheap names used by dumb teenagers on twitter. poor to see long time watchers use them too.

They went from Root to Stokes. We went from Kohli -> rohit -> Bumrah. That definitely plays a huge role. Same team struggle to survive 1.5 sessions. You cannot carry 3 or 4 passengers for 3 years and win everywhere. Unlike ENgland where out of form players get dropped, India doesn't drop them.

 

[Sachin136]

For over ten years, England haven't won a test series in India, Australia, NZ, WI, or Bangladesh. I don't see the first three changing anytime soon. England have a long way to go before we can say that they are dominating this format. Winning a few tests at home and beating Pakistan (who might be the 8th best team in the world right now) isn't enough.

England couldn't even beat India in England so I'm not sure why you're worried about them beating India away.

 

[shariqnoor]

There's no domination by England. Yes they will dominate you when playing on flat pancakes but the moment they get to play on seaming tracks or rank turners they get exposed. This same England team got thrashed by an innings by SA on a seaming track. This is the same England team that couldn't even manage to score 300 in either innings in Multan against a rubbish bowling attack of Pakistan just because there was turn. Imagine Crawley, Pope on rank turners? They'll be as bad as rotten eggs. India will demolish them on home grounds with Axar, Jadeja and Ashwin ripping them out.

 

[Ab Fan]

Let them first dominate other teams in Test cricket then we will discuss how to stop the dominance. As of now, they have only dominated Pakistan and recently drew to India in England 2-2.

At present, the top two countries in Tests are Australia and India only. The Bazball needs more sample to start using the word dominance for themselves in this format.

 

[WengerOut]

India improved their play against fast bowling at the cost of deteriorating play against spin. Kohli has always been suspect against spin. Pujara just blocks and blocks and increases pressure. Only Pant has that intimidating factor against spin. Shreyas is marginally good player, his displays against fast bowling makes his spin play better than it actually is.

 

[Front Foot Pull]

They went from Root to Stokes. We went from Kohli -> rohit -> Bumrah. That definitely plays a huge role. Same team struggle to survive 1.5 sessions. You cannot carry 3 or 4 passengers for 3 years and win everywhere. Unlike ENgland where out of form players get dropped, India doesn't drop them.

who do you want to get dropped from test team? i would like to see gill in place of KL for some matches.
it has been some time since we've faced quality team at home. upcoming BGT will show whether we are still that good at home or not.

 

[Ab Fan]

Pujara just blocks and blocks and increases pressure. Only Pant has that intimidating factor against spin. Shreyas is marginally good player, his displays against fast bowling makes his spin play better than it actually is.

This part is wrong. Pujara plays spin really well and scores at a good strike rate vs spin too. He blocks mostly vs pace. Pant is intimidating vs spin but Iyer also is pretty good vs spin.

 

[jnaveen1980]

who do you want to get dropped from test team? i would like to see gill in place of KL for some matches.
it has been some time since we've faced quality team at home. upcoming BGT will show whether we are still that good at home or not.

Rahane/Kohli/Pujara all 3 averaged under 30 for 3 years. Pant and tailenders saved India far too many times even with bat. Imagine Root playing exactly like Kohli in that series. India would have whitewashed England in England.

 

[docteurmanish]

Pujara just scored a century in spin-haven Bangladesh.

His sr was about 100 . Lol . Pitch was a heaven for scoring . Kuldeep won the match - indian batting was again led by ashwin in the first innings when the pitch had life .

 

[docteurmanish]

They are odi champs , t 20 champs and soon will be no 1 test team . They are innovating and have a bold approach - giving chance to youngsters , keeping players on performance and not seniority

 

[jnaveen1980]

They are odi champs , t 20 champs and soon will be no 1 test team . They are innovating and have a bold approach - giving chance to youngsters , keeping players on performance and not seniority

They definitely have made the Test cricket interesting irrespective of whether they dominate or not.

 

[WengerOut]

This part is wrong. Pujara plays spin really well and scores at a good strike rate vs spin too. He blocks mostly vs pace. Pant is intimidating vs spin but Iyer also is pretty good vs spin.

Pujara for the last 3 years has not been the same.

 

[MenInG]

Reminder of what England have done in 2022

 

[James]

One series at a time for England… got two very tough Test matches in New Zealand coming up first. But let’s enjoy Christmas and New Year before those come around.

 

[Justcrazy]

India would destroy this England Team at home , so would Australia.

Last time England was in India , India despite loosing the first test continued with turning pitches. India , Australia etc all have clarity at what are there strengths and they back them . Pakistan cannot use flat tracks , they are afraid of green pitches , turning pitches they cannot use properly because they lack test level spinners. So where they can play ? There is no clarity .

 

[DJhant]

India is bad against spin now, but in the subcontinent pitch, India will decimate England, bazball or no bazball

 

[James]

Lots of confident predictions going on that England wouldn’t even have a chance of competing on some tours. You’d think that with all of the embarrassing bumped historic threads recently that people would be learning their lessons by now.

 

[jnaveen1980]

India is bad against spin now, but in the subcontinent pitch, India will decimate England, bazball or no bazball

India has more challenges to overcome though. Their Fab 4 Root has been in outstanding dream touch (with an exception of this series) for the last 2 years. On the other hand Fab 4 Kohli is at the bottom of his career. That makes a massive difference.

 

[jnaveen1980]

Lots of confident predictions going on that England wouldn’t even have a chance of competing on some tours. You’d think that with all of the embarrassing bumped historic threads recently that people would be learning their lessons by now.

If England is captained by KL Rahul odds are you will lose to most of the teams lol Stokes has come up with an agenda much like Kohli had the agenda for a few years. Right now other teams miss such aggressive captains. Otherwise in terms of quality England is no better than any other sides. Exact same team lost in West Indies, trailing 1-2 against India, got smashed in Australia. As long as Stokes is at the helm England is a favorite in most parts. The day he takes a break ENgland will return to their original state.

 

[Savak]

England's performance on this tour will not matter much. Mark my words, they cannot replicate their Bazball approach in countries like Australia, South Africa and on actual spinning mindfields in India.

 

[jnaveen1980]

England's performance on this tour will not matter much. Mark my words, they cannot replicate their Bazball approach in countries like Australia, South Africa and on actual spinning mindfields in India.

Ashwin vs Stokes will interesting. Knocked him over 11 out of 23 innings. But Joe Root is by far one of the best against Ash/Jaddu combo in India alongwith Smith. But he did have his struggles against Axar patel's fast darts.

 

[James]

England's performance on this tour will not matter much. Mark my words, they cannot replicate their Bazball approach in countries like Australia, South Africa and on actual spinning mindfields in India.

England have won the last two series in South Africa 3-1, they’ve won four series in a row against South Africa home & away and that’s when England weren’t very good. No worries about South Africa as an opponent at all.

India and Australia will be the toughies. (and NZ)

 

[Front Foot Pull]

Rahane/Kohli/Pujara all 3 averaged under 30 for 3 years. Pant and tailenders saved India far too many times even with bat. Imagine Root playing exactly like Kohli in that series. India would have whitewashed England in England.

we need not worry about rahane, i don't think he will be selected any more. the knife is on pujara's neck, he has to perform or he will be dropped too. kohli won't be dropped though. he is coming back to form in LOIs and i expect him to be back in tests as well but he has regressed a lot against spin and that worries me.

 

[Front Foot Pull]

i wish the good for nothing (except smashing IND) NZ to beat ENG. enough is enough, too many over the top articles, too many adjectives, too much chest thumping. need to given a hiccup to bring back down to earth.

 

[malakian]

I remember everyone on here claiming that BazBall wouldn't work in Pakistan lol

If we can get Archer fit, i fancy our chances against India home or away.

Australia away is the ultimate test.

 

[Front Foot Pull]

Lots of confident predictions going on that England wouldn’t even have a chance of competing on some tours. You’d think that with all of the embarrassing bumped historic threads recently that people would be learning their lessons by now.

there is always a chance, nothing is certain here but you play your odds. showing confidence on their 6th ranked test team and top ranked test teams is different.

 

[jnaveen1980]

there is always a chance, nothing is certain here but you play your odds. showing confidence on their 6th ranked test team and top ranked test teams is different.

Stopping ENgland is such a limited goal for India. They should beat other sides as well consistently. Not long ago the same England Root or bust. They were collapsico kings even against Ireland. Even now they collapsed against South Africa., India, NZ. Mostly their 4th innings performance from Bairstow kind made them look good. Otherwise in lot of phases England looked ordinary. This is the first time England truly dominated entire test match.