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"If ICC DRC rules in our favour, then India must play with us in new FTP programme" : Najam Sethi

Usman Chadda said:
No they won't. As I said, BCCI has given no indication whatsoever of ever standing up to the ICC's decisions. Even during the time when Manohar was basically bullying the BCCI, Indian posters were predicting BCCI going rogue to teach the ICC a lesson. Nothing as such happened and there was a compromise at the end of the day. The same thing has happened right now, when the CT which is to held in India has been swiftly converted to a T20 tournament despite BCCI's alleged protests.

And I am sure, howsoever wrong it might be, BCCI will definitely not be at the forefront IF ICC rules in favor of PCB. The GOI is another issue altogether.
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1. The last time icc tried to bully bcci was in 2000 when they wanted Indian players to sign a contract that will ban them from endorsing any rival company of icc sponsors one month before and one month after the event.

2. BCCI refused.Indian players refused. Icc threatened with banning Indian players. NZC even moved a proposal for the same.

3. India hit back with banning of all forex transfers from India to icc. No Indian team in icc CT 2000.

4. Sponsors either threatened to withdraw or pay only a part of the original amount.

5. ICC realised its situation. Changed the agreement to players not endorsing products during the icc event only.

Since then every proposal bcci wanted went through icc including big 3.

But now BCCI is a headless organisation. Its run by a 2 member CoA appointed by the court and BCCI officials cannot take or enforce decisions without asking them.

The CoA is at loggerheads with officials and that has paralysed the bcci. So they are in no position to take on the icc. Thats why ICC is able to do things even if BCCI objects.

The CoA has to leave in a few months and the bcci officials will be back in command then. Even if a Srini cant return due to age or term limits his puppets like Kasi Vishwanathan will be there. And same will be the case with other bcci members where officials banned by term limits will have their puppets run for the chair.

Then ICC will feel the heat. Manohar will be the 1st to run away. He is that kind of a personality. The moment bcci came under Supreme court he resigned as bcci president and ran away.

The moment it looked like bcci will withdraw from CT he resigned from ICC and had to be persuaded to stay and the CoA decided to participate in the CT.

Thing is ICC is still heavily dependent on Indian markets for money. The members participation agreement that is signed by boards to participate in ICC events allows BCCI to withdraw any time and with no penalties.

What will ICC do then? Manohar will run away and rest will have to face the consequences.
 
cricketjoshila said:
1. The last time icc tried to bully bcci was in 2000 when they wanted Indian players to sign a contract that will ban them from endorsing any rival company of icc sponsors one month before and one month after the event.

2. BCCI refused.Indian players refused. Icc threatened with banning Indian players. NZC even moved a proposal for the same.

3. India hit back with banning of all forex transfers from India to icc. No Indian team in icc CT 2000.

4. Sponsors either threatened to withdraw or pay only a part of the original amount.

5. ICC realised its situation. Changed the agreement to players not endorsing products during the icc event only.

Since then every proposal bcci wanted went through icc including big 3.

But now BCCI is a headless organisation. Its run by a 2 member CoA appointed by the court and BCCI officials cannot take or enforce decisions without asking them.

The CoA is at loggerheads with officials and that has paralysed the bcci. So they are in no position to take on the icc. Thats why ICC is able to do things even if BCCI objects.

The CoA has to leave in a few months and the bcci officials will be back in command then. Even if a Srini cant return due to age or term limits his puppets like Kasi Vishwanathan will be there. And same will be the case with other bcci members where officials banned by term limits will have their puppets run for the chair.

Then ICC will feel the heat. Manohar will be the 1st to run away. He is that kind of a personality. The moment bcci came under Supreme court he resigned as bcci president and ran away.

The moment it looked like bcci will withdraw from CT he resigned from ICC and had to be persuaded to stay and the CoA decided to participate in the CT.

Thing is ICC is still heavily dependent on Indian markets for money. The members participation agreement that is signed by boards to participate in ICC events allows BCCI to withdraw any time and with no penalties.

What will ICC do then? Manohar will run away and rest will have to face the consequences.
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Once again, its all conjecture and quite frankly chest thumping. Unless and until BCCI shows any indication to take on the ICC, neutrals won't care for this fake bravado. Making noise in the media is being done by Najam Sethi aswell, but will he actually be able to achieve what he wants? Doubt it. BCCI has been left to make a few noises in the media, while fully co-operating with the ICC eventually. Manohar might be playing his role due to a weak BCCI atm, but there are bigger sharks such as Giles Clarke and James Sutherland present in the cricketing fraternity to have a major say. I dont believe for a second the BCCI will ever take on the ICC, well not in our lifetime atleast.

Due to lack of social media and my general lack of interest in Indian cricket, I don't remember any sort of dispute in 2000 between the ICC and the Indian board at the time. Won't take your word for it ofcourse, so if you can provide me with any article of some sort or a neutral can shed some light on this, that would be helpful.
 
Usman Chadda said:
Once again, its all conjecture and quite frankly chest thumping. Unless and until BCCI shows any indication to take on the ICC, neutrals won't care for this fake bravado. Making noise in the media is being done by Najam Sethi aswell, but will he actually be able to achieve what he wants? Doubt it. BCCI has been left to make a few noises in the media, while fully co-operating with the ICC eventually. Manohar might be playing his role due to a weak BCCI atm, but there are bigger sharks such as Giles Clarke and James Sutherland present in the cricketing fraternity to have a major say. I dont believe for a second the BCCI will ever take on the ICC, well not in our lifetime atleast.

Due to lack of social media and my general lack of interest in Indian cricket, I don't remember any sort of dispute in 2000 between the ICC and the Indian board at the time. Won't take your word for it ofcourse, so if you can provide me with any article of some sort or a neutral can shed some light on this, that would be helpful.
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what is listed by CJ is not chest thumping man.. that happened during 2000. Look up the history.. Not only BCCI/GOI took on the iCC they won decisively in our life time, assuming of course you were born before 2000
 
If for some reason INDIA is forced to play...pretty sure no law or rule can stop them from sending a team c . And with team c sponsors might well be not happy
 
mp812rediff said:
If for some reason INDIA is forced to play...pretty sure no law or rule can stop them from sending a team c . And with team c sponsors might well be not happy
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Pretty sure, one of many (n = ∞) possible solutions BCCI might have thought of.
 
mp812rediff said:
If for some reason INDIA is forced to play...pretty sure no law or rule can stop them from sending a team c . And with team c sponsors might well be not happy
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or block telecast in India, blacklist sponsors, send a third grade team, stop any future tours, rework asia cup, give out exclusive contracts to foreigners willing to play in PSL, require extensive background checks for players who have traveled to Pakistan, require recommendation letter from Pak govt to issue visas to anyone who has Pak origin (don't have to deny visa, just make it a bureaucratic nightmare), blacklist umpires and administrators who work with PCB/PSL (umpires earn much less than players and have fewer options), etc, etc. some examples of BCCI/GOI can do on their own. If they team up with like minded governments cricket boards it can get more dirty... So if someone wants to play dirty the options are endless.. Pak can also reciprocate but their options are limited due to their size and place in the world order
 
Gubol123 said:
or block telecast in India, blacklist sponsors, send a third grade team, stop any future tours, rework asia cup, give out exclusive contracts to foreigners willing to play in PSL, require extensive background checks for players who have traveled to Pakistan, require recommendation letter from Pak govt to issue visas to anyone who has Pak origin (don't have to deny visa, just make it a bureaucratic nightmare), blacklist umpires and administrators who work with PCB/PSL (umpires earn much less than players and have fewer options), etc, etc. some examples of BCCI/GOI can do on their own. If they team up with like minded governments cricket boards it can get more dirty... So if someone wants to play dirty the options are endless.. Pak can also reciprocate but their options are limited due to their size and place in the world order
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BCCI is already playing dirty by not honouring it's words, about time PCB reciprocates
 
cricketjoshila said:
1. The last time icc tried to bully bcci was in 2000 when they wanted Indian players to sign a contract that will ban them from endorsing any rival company of icc sponsors one month before and one month after the event.

2. BCCI refused.Indian players refused. Icc threatened with banning Indian players. NZC even moved a proposal for the same.

3. India hit back with banning of all forex transfers from India to icc. No Indian team in icc CT 2000.

4. Sponsors either threatened to withdraw or pay only a part of the original amount.

5. ICC realised its situation. Changed the agreement to players not endorsing products during the icc event only.

Since then every proposal bcci wanted went through icc including big 3.

But now BCCI is a headless organisation. Its run by a 2 member CoA appointed by the court and BCCI officials cannot take or enforce decisions without asking them.

The CoA is at loggerheads with officials and that has paralysed the bcci. So they are in no position to take on the icc. Thats why ICC is able to do things even if BCCI objects.

The CoA has to leave in a few months and the bcci officials will be back in command then. Even if a Srini cant return due to age or term limits his puppets like Kasi Vishwanathan will be there. And same will be the case with other bcci members where officials banned by term limits will have their puppets run for the chair.

Then ICC will feel the heat. Manohar will be the 1st to run away. He is that kind of a personality. The moment bcci came under Supreme court he resigned as bcci president and ran away.

The moment it looked like bcci will withdraw from CT he resigned from ICC and had to be persuaded to stay and the CoA decided to participate in the CT.

Thing is ICC is still heavily dependent on Indian markets for money. The members participation agreement that is signed by boards to participate in ICC events allows BCCI to withdraw any time and with no penalties.

What will ICC do then? Manohar will run away and rest will have to face the consequences.
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you keep mentioning this, but do you have any numbers with references to prove that ICC and other members are directly profiting from BCCI? Last I checked you were still getting $400 million handouts
 
daytrader said:
you keep mentioning this, but do you have any numbers with references to prove that ICC and other members are directly profiting from BCCI? Last I checked you were still getting $400 million handouts
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Handout is what associates get. Full members "earn" it.
 
Itachi said:
Handout is what associates get. Full members "earn" it.
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Well the BCCI is keeping 100% of what it earns through broadcasting deals for IPL and Indian Cricket. Those funds don't go to ICC or any associate board. Above and beyond this, BCCI still gets $400 million from ICC coffers. Call it what you like, but sounds like a handout
 
daytrader said:
Well the BCCI is keeping 100% of what it earns through broadcasting deals for IPL and Indian Cricket. Those funds don't go to ICC or any associate board. Above and beyond this, BCCI still gets $400 million from ICC coffers. Call it what you like, but sounds like a handout
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If ICC has individual revenue system where the entity itself generates an income and then gives away a share, you can call it handout.

Does ICC has individual system to generate profit?
 
ICC gets 70 % of its revenue from Indian market, 20 % of its revenue from English and Australia market and 10 % of its revenue from the remaining cricket playing nations' markets. So, in effect, ICC gets most of its revenue from Indian market. 400 millions out of this revenue is given back to BCCI as "hands out". So ICC takes billions from Indian market and hands back 400 millions out of that to BCCI .

On the other hand, ICC gets may be 20 millions from Pakistan market and hands PCB 128 millions. Now this is called handout and guess from where this 128 millions is coming from. It is not coming from Zimbabwe or Sri Lanka.
 
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Gubol123 said:
what is listed by CJ is not chest thumping man.. that happened during 2000. Look up the history.. Not only BCCI/GOI took on the iCC they won decisively in our life time, assuming of course you were born before 2000
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Jee I have been watching cricket since 1996, but I don't remember any of the sort happening at the time. Social media wasn't strong as such, neither did Pakistani newspapers take too much interest in Indian cricket. An article or a neutral confirming this event would be helpful.
 
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daytrader said:
you keep mentioning this, but do you have any numbers with references to prove that ICC and other members are directly profiting from BCCI? Last I checked you were still getting $400 million handouts
Click to expand...

The key questions to ask - how does the ICC generate revenues? Who are the sponsors? Which countries are they from? What % of revenues generated from sponsors of each country?

The biggest revenue source of ICC is the broadcast deal. TV and digital streaming. Questions to ask here - which media companies are bidding to get this deal? Which countries are these media companies from? How much weight do these media companies put on each team to generate their $$ to pay the ICC?

I think answers to couple of these will give a clear indication of which country/countries the ICC is dependent on most for revenues.
 
Usman Chadda said:
Once again, its all conjecture and quite frankly chest thumping. Unless and until BCCI shows any indication to take on the ICC, neutrals won't care for this fake bravado. Making noise in the media is being done by Najam Sethi aswell, but will he actually be able to achieve what he wants? Doubt it. BCCI has been left to make a few noises in the media, while fully co-operating with the ICC eventually. Manohar might be playing his role due to a weak BCCI atm, but there are bigger sharks such as Giles Clarke and James Sutherland present in the cricketing fraternity to have a major say. I dont believe for a second the BCCI will ever take on the ICC, well not in our lifetime atleast.

Due to lack of social media and my general lack of interest in Indian cricket, I don't remember any sort of dispute in 2000 between the ICC and the Indian board at the time. Won't take your word for it ofcourse, so if you can provide me with any article of some sort or a neutral can shed some light on this, that would be helpful.
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Bcci has taken on ICC in the past and come up as winners. No reason it cant or wont do it again when its back to full power.

Sutherland or Giles Clsrke are no sharks lol. Giles Clarke cant even get ECB support for the ICC chairman's post. Shark lol.

https://m.rediff.com/wc2003/2002/dec/21icc.htm

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/c...Contracts-row-threatens-Champions-Trophy.html
 
daytrader said:
Well the BCCI is keeping 100% of what it earns through broadcasting deals for IPL and Indian Cricket. Those funds don't go to ICC or any associate board. Above and beyond this, BCCI still gets $400 million from ICC coffers. Call it what you like, but sounds like a handout
Click to expand...

PCB CA CSA ECB every board keeps 100% of the money it earns through its broadcasting deals and all of them get a certain amount from ICC profits.

So all are getting "Handouts" ?
 
Gubol123 said:
Well well someone who watched cricket from 96 is calling another who has been doing it for at least a decade and half earlier as beta wow.. Man I know when social media came. I worked for one of the pioneer internet companies when there was no social media or wide spread internet. Thank you
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I posted two links for him to go through this incident which apparently didnot happen.
 
daytrader said:
Well the BCCI is keeping 100% of what it earns through broadcasting deals for IPL and Indian Cricket. Those funds don't go to ICC or any associate board. Above and beyond this, BCCI still gets $400 million from ICC coffers. Call it what you like, but sounds like a handout
Click to expand...

What other revenue icc has apart from the icc tournaments? Majority of the money for ICC tournaments come from sponsors targeting Indian market. Indian market contributes way more than it takes out. If you call what ICC gives as handouts then every board is getting a handout. India is getting way less than what it generates Australia and England close to what they generate and all others way more than what they generate. You decide who are the ones begging for handouts
 
If everyone including BCCI are living off the handouts of ICC then why is PCB dying to play cricket with BCCI, who in the opinion of PCB fans is heavily dependent on ICC handout ? Who is helping ICC earn all these big bucks in the first place ? Zimbabwe ? or Pakistan ?
 
squarecut said:
If everyone including BCCI are living off the handouts of ICC then why is PCB dying to play cricket with BCCI, who in the opinion of PCB fans is heavily dependent on ICC handout ? Who is helping ICC earn all these big bucks in the first place ? Zimbabwe ? or Pakistan ?
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ICC is secretly printing money and handing out to all. They don't need to have any source of revenue. They extra-government entity. Didn't you know that...
 
This is PCB and fans we are taking here, once their ex players and some fans wanted IPL to be run by ICC.
 
jadaja said:
This is PCB and fans we are taking here, once their ex players and some fans wanted IPL to be run by ICC.
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Indians cooking up more stories. Please share with us who these ex players were that wanted ICC to run IPL?
 
sshakir411 said:
DID YOU EVEN READ THAT?



Supervise the organization of IPL is not running the IPL.
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"
The former Pakistan captain Javed Miandad has called for the International Cricket Council to oversee the running of the Indian Premier League"
 
sshakir411 said:
DID YOU EVEN READ THAT?



Supervise the organization of IPL is not running the IPL.
Click to expand...

"


“It’s a conspiracy against Pakistani players as some people behind the scenes forced the franchises to ignore them,” said Miandad. “When we call IPL an ICC approved tournament, it should mean that at least all the Test playing countries will get a substantial representation in the event.

In fact, if the hosts are not able to ensure a balanced representation, then Miandad feels the ICC should take over the event."
 
Gubol123 said:
And he says he lived through those times. Anyone who bothered to turn on TV news that time will know what was going on.
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Pakistan media did not cover this story at the time. There is a world outside India too, incase you don't realise that.

Also, from the articles, Dalmiya was busy arranging a compromise between the players and the ICC. A compromise rejected by the players. How is that BCCI taking on the ICC?
 
cricketjoshila said:
"
The former Pakistan captain Javed Miandad has called for the International Cricket Council to oversee the running of the Indian Premier League"
Click to expand...

cricketjoshila said:
"


“It’s a conspiracy against Pakistani players as some people behind the scenes forced the franchises to ignore them,” said Miandad. “When we call IPL an ICC approved tournament, it should mean that at least all the Test playing countries will get a substantial representation in the event.

In fact, if the hosts are not able to ensure a balanced representation, then Miandad feels the ICC should take over the event."
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squarecut said:
Now you will be told that ICC taking over the event is different from ICC running it. :srini
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read the article twice...no where does Miandad says that ICC should run day to day operations of IPL or put in an ICC employee as the boss.

Also the quote about Miandad 'feeling' that ICC should 'take over' the event is not an actual quote by Javed...it's what the author is implying.

Javed being dense as usual is actually alluding to ICC ensuring BCCI doesn't discriminate based on country when it calls the IPL a 'World Tournament'..hence why ICC should oversee the organization.
 
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Usman Chadda said:
Pakistan media did not cover this story at the time. There is a world outside India too, incase you don't realise that.
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Usman, no offense but I think "world outside...." is applicable more in your case than any other person here.

It was a big chaos not only in India but whole cricket world as the CA and ECB for the first time felt the heat of BCCI.

Just because Pakistan media didn't cover it, it doesn't mean it didn't happen.

Quoting your own words, "there's a world outside Pakistan too". It's not others duty to realize whether Pakistan media covered it or not. Simply saying.
 
Usman Chadda said:
Pakistan media did not cover this story at the time. There is a world outside India too, incase you don't realise that.

Also, from the articles, Dalmiya was busy arranging a compromise between the players and the ICC. A compromise rejected by the players. How is that BCCI taking on the ICC?
Click to expand...

"
The BCCI remains unable or unwilling to meet its contractual obligations and if anything has gone backwards on what it is prepared to accept from the ICC."

For his part, BCCI president Jagmohan Dalmiya concluded his press conference on Friday evening by saying the ICC was "pushing the Indian Board to the point of impossibility."
 
jaywcric said:
https://mumbaimirror.indiatimes.com/sport/cricket//articleshow/15985833.cms
Quoting his statement here:
“Instead of giving permission to private firms to organize events like IPL, the ICC should take control of such events so that countries like Pakistan do not suffer,”
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sshakir411 said:
read the article twice...no where does Miandad says that ICC should run day to day operations of IPL or put in an ICC employee as the boss.

Also the quote about Miandad 'feeling' that ICC should 'take over' the event is not an actual quote by Javed...it's what the author is implying.

Javed being dense as usual is actually alluding to ICC ensuring BCCI doesn't discriminate based on country when it calls the IPL a 'World Tournament'..hence why ICC should oversee the organization.
Click to expand...

What does taking control mean?

Try spinning as much as you can. But the truth is obvious.
 
sshakir411 said:
Indians cooking up more stories. Please share with us who these ex players were that wanted ICC to run IPL?
Click to expand...

Nobody is interested in making up stories. PCB even tried to blackmail not issuing NOCs in initial IPLs and created so much drama. IPL has been free of this drama ever since Pakistani players stopped playing IPL.
 
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