India's rise as Asia's #1 pace bowling nation in the last decade in LOIs

[Suleiman]

It has been a very interesting journey. The answer is probably kind of obvious, but I think it's something most people don't want to accept or are reluctant to.

Even I was reluctant at first and in a bit of denial, so have to say this with a heavy heart. But with the advent of Bumrah as well as numerous stats posted here over the years such as wickets taken in first 10 overs in ODIs, amongst others, it is clear than India has one of the best pace attack in ODIs, if not top 1-2 along with Australia.

Is part of this success due to Dennis Lillee assisting in opening the MRF Pace Academy in Chennai in 1987?

People say Pakistan has failed to produce quality batsmen at the same rate as other cricket giants because of a "lack of batting culture". Then how is India now producing quality pacers without any big ATG pacers of their own for youngsters to look up to?

How much of this success is due to IPL and constantly playing the best talent in the world every year?

Clearly it wasn't overnight as we've seen a fair share of trundlers like Balaji and random Patels.

What lessons can Pakistan take from this to revive our scarce resources of world class fast bowlers?

 

[GLORY OF '92]

It has been a very interesting journey. The answer is probably kind of obvious, but I think it's something most people don't want to accept or are reluctant to.

Even I was reluctant at first and in a bit of denial, so have to say this with a heavy heart. But with the advent of Bumrah as well as numerous stats posted here over the years such as wickets taken in first 10 overs in ODIs, amongst others, it is clear than India has one of the best pace attack in ODIs, if not top 1-2 along with Australia.

Is part of this success due to Dennis Lillee assisting in opening the MRF Pace Academy in Chennai in 1987?

People say Pakistan has failed to produce quality batsmen at the same rate as other cricket giants because of a "lack of batting culture". Then how is India now producing quality pacers without any big ATG pacers of their own for youngsters to look up to?

How much of this success is due to IPL and constantly playing the best talent in the world every year?

Clearly it wasn't overnight as we've seen a fair share of trundlers like Balaji and random Patels.

What lessons can Pakistan take from this to revive our scarce resources of world class fast bowlers?

Just a small point Balaji won India a Test series in Pakistan and Munaf Patel is a World Cup champion.

 

[rhony]

IPL and cash brought access to better nutrition, biomechanics and coaching to under 15, 17, 19. No more coaches asking for "line and length" instead of pace. Add to that, the belief that they can bowl faster. Finally, a captain that doesn't care for trundlers.

 

[Muddaser]

It has been a very interesting journey. The answer is probably kind of obvious, but I think it's something most people don't want to accept or are reluctant to.

Even I was reluctant at first and in a bit of denial, so have to say this with a heavy heart. But with the advent of Bumrah as well as numerous stats posted here over the years such as wickets taken in first 10 overs in ODIs, amongst others, it is clear than India has one of the best pace attack in ODIs, if not top 1-2 along with Australia.

Is part of this success due to Dennis Lillee assisting in opening the MRF Pace Academy in Chennai in 1987?

People say Pakistan has failed to produce quality batsmen at the same rate as other cricket giants because of a "lack of batting culture". Then how is India now producing quality pacers without any big ATG pacers of their own for youngsters to look up to?

How much of this success is due to IPL and constantly playing the best talent in the world every year?

Clearly it wasn't overnight as we've seen a fair share of trundlers like Balaji and random Patels.

What lessons can Pakistan take from this to revive our scarce resources of world class fast bowlers?

What scarce resources?

How many fast bowlers do you want?

We need to nurture/polish what we have. Amir, Shaheen, Hasnain, Hasan and Naseem are just as talented as anyone.

 

[Suleiman]

What scarce resources?

How many fast bowlers do you want?

We need to nurture/polish what we have. Amir, Shaheen, Hasnain, Hasan and Naseem are just as talented as anyone.

Point being we’ve had talented pacers in the past 19 years but they were poorly developed and were either lead astray (Asif, Amir), or returned to obscurity like Anwar Ali, Md Zahid, Mohammad Sami, Junaid Khan, Md Irfan, and although a bit early to call, even Hasan Ali is declining. Even Amir for 2 years since his comeback was mediocre for large parts save for CT17 and now the WC after initially not even set to be part of the squad.

Ofc can’t judge Shaheen and Hasnain yet, but they are very raw and going by past history PCB may not even develop them properly. Shaheen is already being played through injury.
Compare that to how SA transitioned a young 18-19 year old Rabada into international cricket.

 

[Muddaser]

Point being we’ve had talented pacers in the past 19 years but they were poorly developed and were either lead astray (Asif, Amir), or returned to obscurity like Anwar Ali, Md Zahid, Mohammad Sami, Junaid Khan, Md Irfan, and although a bit early to call, even Hasan Ali is declining. Even Amir for 2 years since his comeback was mediocre for large parts save for CT17 and now the WC after initially not even set to be part of the squad.

Ofc can’t judge Shaheen and Hasnain yet, but they are very raw and going by past history PCB may not even develop them properly. Shaheen is already being played through injury.
Compare that to how SA transitioned a young 18-19 year old Rabada into international cricket.

Thats the risk you take.

India has had its fair share too. Cant forget Irfan Pathan, Ishant and Sreesanth.

Still remember Irfan being considered the next Wasim Akram over a decade ago on this forum.

We need to be patient with our current bunch. They have the potential. Same goes with our batsmen. Just need Hafeez and Malik to go and replace them Haris and someone like Saud Shakeel.

 

[geraltofrivia]

Not just LOIs. Bumrah Shami Bhuvi and Ishant of last five years all average below 30 with Bumrah at 22 and Bhuvi at 26. Ishant has 27 avg in last 5 years. This is tests.

Great thing is we have great spinners too in both formats.

 

[ak619]

Thats the risk you take.

India has had its fair share too. Cant forget Irfan Pathan, Ishant and Sreesanth.

Still remember Irfan being considered the next Wasim Akram over a decade ago on this forum.

We need to be patient with our current bunch. They have the potential. Same goes with our batsmen. Just need Hafeez and Malik to go and replace them Haris and someone like Saud Shakeel.

Ishant Sharma has over 250 test wickets. Something which no Pakistani pacer has achieved since Shoaib Akhtar.

And simply by bowling his team to a test series victory in Australia, Ishant has placed himself above any bowler Pakistan has produced in the last 2 decades.

 

[Revolution]

These are solid players currently in our team.

In bowling :
In tests - Shami, Ishant, bumrah and Ashwin
In ODI's - Shami, Bumrah, chahal, Kuldeep

Coming to batting
Tests : kohli, Pujara, Pant ( Still long to go)
ODIs : kohli, Rohit, Dhawan, Pandya

On and off - Dhoni.

 

[ak619]

Ishant Sharma has over 250 test wickets. Something which no Pakistani pacer has achieved since Shoaib Akhtar.

And simply by bowling his team to a test series victory in Australia, Ishant has placed himself above any bowler Pakistan has produced in the last 2 decades.

Correction. Shoaib didn't even cross 180.

The last Pakistani pacer to cross 200 test wickets was Waqar.

 

[geraltofrivia]

These are solid players currently in our team.

In bowling :
In tests - Shami, Ishant, bumrah and Ashwin
In ODI's - Shami, Bumrah, chahal, Kuldeep

Coming to batting
Tests : kohli, Pujara, Pant ( Still long to go)
ODIs : kohli, Rohit, Dhawan, Pandya

On and off - Dhoni.

Test bowling jadeja and bhuvi too

 

[austerlitz]

One factor being missed out is shankar basu's power training regimen.Has increased the pace of all our fast bowlers by 5-10 kms.
Bhuvi went from 125-130 to 135-140.Shami pace also went up 5kms.Same for bumrah.

 

[sharmaji]

It's a natural outcome of professionalizing the sport. Not just fast bowling, but in every aspect. There is a seriousness around fitness, skill and consistency that was never there before.

 

[big_gamer007]

Economy developed, number of malnutritioned kids reduced. It should improve even more with time as more and more kids get proper nutrition and next generations start reaching their growth potential.

 

[geraltofrivia]

Economy developed, number of malnutritioned kids reduced. It should improve even more with time as more and more kids get proper nutrition and next generations start reaching their growth potential.

yeah. you can see that with the quality players coming out. good thing is Indian economy still going great guns. in 20 years India and cricket will be like US and basketball.

 

[Napa]

These are solid players currently in our team.

In bowling :
In tests - Shami, Ishant, bumrah and Ashwin
In ODI's - Shami, Bumrah, chahal, Kuldeep

Coming to batting
Tests : kohli, Pujara, Pant ( Still long to go)
ODIs : kohli, Rohit, Dhawan, Pandya

On and off - Dhoni.

You missed Agarwal for batting in Tests. He turned out to be more reliable than other Indian openers and was part of the reason for India's series victory in Australia.

 

[Titan24]

Correction. Shoaib didn't even cross 180.

The last Pakistani pacer to cross 200 test wickets was Waqar.

I dont remember last Pakistani bowler playing so many games. It should be quality not quantity. Ishant has been good in last couple of years but overall his stats are mediocre

 

[ak619]

I dont remember last Pakistani bowler playing so many games. It should be quality not quantity. Ishant has been good in last couple of years but overall his stats are mediocre

That's not the point. [MENTION=14]Muddaser[/MENTION] was claiming that Ishant Sharma was a failed project.

I am just pointing out to him that a guy with 250+ test wickets, a series win in Australia and an ICC CT winner is anything but that.

 

[bujhee kom]

Sound investments of money AND time!

 

[Slim]

It is this year that India has surpassed Pakistan as a bowling unit. Otherwise in 2017, Pakistan had a better bowling unit than India. Let's not please get into revisionism.

India's fast bowling stocks have risen due to Bumrah and due to Pakistan's fast bowling attack faltering. They were always neck to neck in spin.

But I see more potential in Pakistan's bowling with Hasnain and SSA.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

Not sure. Our fast bowlers are not as naturally gifted as Pakistani bowlers.

 

[jnaveen1980]

More than pace i am enthused about spin options that are coming out. Rahul Chahar, Shreyas Gopal, Murugan Ashwin. All are leggies that made big impact in the IPL. There was a time it was hard enough to find even one half decent leggie. Now they have a long supply line of leggies. Even Ravi Ashwin started practicing leggies to compete with them

 

[Corridor of Uncertainty]

India is indeed a very good bowling side. Unrecognizable from years past.

I won't say they are necessarily intimidating or can compare with great bowling sides of the past from other teams. Their strength is good length bowling and excellent discipline. Bhumrah provides the X-Factor.

Other Asian teams have just regressed too much.

Indian bowling is genuinely good to watch.