Is suicide a selfish act?...

[shaykh]

I remember when i was a little younger I myself used to be a little judgmental of those who committed suicide...how could they do that to the people who cared for them...as I've got older i've come to realize that I was wrong...this link provides a good argument and here are some of the main points...

(1) Depression is an illness...
I've had one guy on his status argue about how he was once depressed and got over it...
'dismissing the concerns of a genuine depression sufferer on the grounds that you’ve been miserable and got over it is like dismissing the issues faced by someone who’s had to have their arm amputated because you once had a paper cut and it didn’t bother you. Depression is a genuine debilitating condition, and being in “a bit of a funk” isn’t.'

(2) Depression doesn’t discriminate...
People have stated how rich he was an how his circumstances were great...doesn't make you immune from unhappiness...
'Smoking may be a major cause of lung cancer, but non-smokers can end up with it. And a person’s lifestyle doesn’t automatically reduce their suffering. Depression doesn’t work like that. And even if it did, where’s the cut-off point? Who would we consider “too successful” to be ill?'

(3) Depression is not logical...
This is where the main selfish arguments come from...why don't they think about the people they will be leaving behind...
'The “selfish” accusation also often implies that there are other options the sufferer has, but has chosen suicide. Or that it’s the “easy way out”. There are many ways to describe the sort of suffering that overrides a survival instinct that has evolved over millions of years, but “easy” isn’t an obvious one to go for. Perhaps none of it makes sense from a logical perspective, but insisting on logical thinking from someone in the grips of a mental illness is like insisting that someone with a broken leg walks normally; logically, you shouldn’t do that.'


The article aside...I find the selfish argument a little harsh also simply because they make out that the suffering of a family is significantly more important than the suffering of a guy who was experiencing so much pain that they felt suicide was the only way they could get rid of that pain...

News broke today that Robin Williams had passed away, due to apparent suicide following severe depression. As the vast majority of people will likely have already said, this was terribly heart-breaking news. Such an iconic, talented and beloved figure will have no shortage of tributes paid to him and his incredible legacy. It’s also worth noting that Robin Williams was open about his mental health issues.

However, despite the tremendous amount of love and admiration for Williams being expressed pretty much everywhere right now, there are still those who can’t seem to resist the opportunity to criticise, as they do these days whenever a celebrated or successful person commits suicide. You may have come across this yourself; people who refer to the suicide as “selfish”. People will utter/post phrases such as “to do that to your family is just selfish”, or “to commit suicide when you’ve got so much going for you is pure selfishness”, or variations thereof.

If you are such a person who has expressed these views or similar for whatever reason, here’s why you’re wrong, or at the very least misinformed, and could be doing more harm in the long run.

Depression IS an illness

Depression, the clinical condition, could really use a different name. At present, the word “depressed” can be applied to both people who are a bit miserable and those with a genuine debilitating mood disorder. Ergo, it seems people are often very quick to dismiss depression as a minor, trivial concern. After all, everyone gets depressed now and again, don’t they? Don’t know why these people are complaining so much.

I’ve said it before, and I’ll say it again; dismissing the concerns of a genuine depression sufferer on the grounds that you’ve been miserable and got over it is like dismissing the issues faced by someone who’s had to have their arm amputated because you once had a paper cut and it didn’t bother you. Depression is a genuine debilitating condition, and being in “a bit of a funk” isn’t. The fact that mental illness doesn’t receive the same sympathy/acknowledgement as physical illness is often referenced, and it’s a valid point. If you haven’t had it, you don’t have the right to dismiss those who have/do. You may disagree, and that’s your prerogative, but there are decades’ worth of evidence saying you’re wrong.

Depression doesn’t discriminate

How, many seem to wonder, could someone with so much going for them, possibly feel depressed to the point of suicide? With all the money/fame/family/success they have, to be depressed makes no sense?

Admittedly, there’s a certain amount of logic to this. But, and this is important, depression (like all mental illnesses) typically doesn’t take personal factors into account. Mental illness can affect anyone. We’ve all heard of the “madness” of King George III; if mental illness won’t spare someone who, at the time, was one of the most powerful well-bred humans alive, why would it spare someone just because they have a film career?

Granted, those with worse lives are probably going to be exposed to the greater number of risk factors for depression, but that doesn’t mean those with reduced likelihood of exposure to hardships or tragic events are immune. Smoking may be a major cause of lung cancer, but non-smokers can end up with it. And a person’s lifestyle doesn’t automatically reduce their suffering. Depression doesn’t work like that. And even if it did, where’s the cut-off point? Who would we consider “too successful” to be ill?

Depression is not ‘logical’

If we’re being optimistic, it could be said that most of those describing suicide from depression as selfish are doing so from a position of ignorance. Perhaps they think that those with depression make some sort of table or chart with the pros and cons of suicide and, despite the pros being far more numerous, selfishly opt for suicide anyway?

This is, of course, nonsensical. One of the main problems with mental illness is that is prevents you from behaving or thinking “normally” (although what that means is a discussion for another time). A depression sufferer is not thinking like a non-sufferer in the same way that someone who’s drowning is not “breathing air” like a person on land is. The situation is different. From the sufferers perspective, their self-worth may be so low, their outlook so bleak, that their families/friends/fans would be a lot better off without them in the world, ergo their suicide is actually intended as an act of generosity? Some might find such a conclusion an offensive assumption, but it is no more so than accusations of selfishness.

The “selfish” accusation also often implies that there are other options the sufferer has, but has chosen suicide. Or that it’s the “easy way out”. There are many ways to describe the sort of suffering that overrides a survival instinct that has evolved over millions of years, but “easy” isn’t an obvious one to go for. Perhaps none of it makes sense from a logical perspective, but insisting on logical thinking from someone in the grips of a mental illness is like insisting that someone with a broken leg walks normally; logically, you shouldn’t do that.

Stephen Fry, in his interview on Richard Herring’s podcast, had a brilliant explanation about how depression doesn’t make you think logically, or automatically confide in friends and family. I won’t spoil it by revealing it here, but I will say it involves genital warts.

Accusations of selfishness are themselves selfish?

Say you don’t agree with any of the above, that you still maintain that for someone with a successful career and family to commit suicide is selfish. Fine. Your opinion, you’re entitled to have it, however much we may disagree.

But why would you want to publicly declare that the recently deceased is selfish? Especially when the news has only just broken, and people are clearly sad about the whole thing? Why is getting in to criticise the deceased when they’ve only just passed so important to you? What service are you providing by doing so, that makes you so justified in throwing accusations of selfishness around?

Do you think that depression is “fashionable?” And by criticising the sufferers you can deter others from “joining in”? Granted, we hear more about depression than we used to these days, but then we know what it is now. We see a lot more photos from Mars these days, because we have the means of doing so now, not because it’s suddenly trendy.

Perhaps you are trying to deter anyone else who might read your views from considering suicide themselves? Given that statistics suggest that one in four people suffer some sort of mental health problem, this isn’t that unlikely an occurrence. But if someone is genuinely depressed and feels their life is worthless, seeing that others consider their feeling selfish can surely only emphasise their own self-loathing and bleakness? It suggests that people will hate them even in death.

Maybe you know some people who have “attempted” suicide purely for attention? Fair enough; a debatable conclusion, but even if you’re right, so what? Surely someone who succeeds at committing suicide is a genuine sufferer who deserves our sympathy?

Perhaps you feel that those expressing sorrow and sadness are wrong and you need to show them that you know better, no matter how upsetting they may find it? And this is unselfish behaviour how, exactly?

A brilliant but tortured individual has taken his own life, and this is a tragedy. But levelling ignorant accusations of selfishness certainly won’t prevent this from happening again. People should never be made to feel worse for suffering from something beyond their control.

http://www.theguardian.com/science/...ssion-are-not-selfish?CMP=fb_gu&commentpage=1

 

[Markhor]

Depression is not merely being 'down in the dumps' or 'having the blues' as often assumed. Symptoms can range from insomnia, loss of appetite, breathing difficulties and aggression.

It can happen to anyone - I've often been surprised at the number of celebrities/athletes who have come out and said they've been diagnosed with clinical depression when you think they've got everything figured out in life. I think its harder for men as the social expectation is to be authoritative, infallible and the breadwinner of a family.

Mental health should be given equal priority as physical health quite frankly.

 

[PakZameen]

I used to think that but depression is a serious disease. When you feel there's no way out, it can be extremely difficult to continue on.

So no not selfish.

 

[OZGOD]

Is Suicide a Selfish Act?...

I would say that it is an irrational act. Anything that can overcome our natural instinct of self preservation is not rational. And unfortunately depression can take away someone's ability to think rationally. I've suffered from depression and anxiety in the past and it does change the way you think and look at the world. It's a physiological illness that can change the chemical composition in your brain, either by reducing serotonin levels or dopamine levels. It's not something that someone can just "snap out of". It changes the way you think.

 

[Energetic]

Suicide is not normal. Humans natural instinct is to survive. Don't forget humans are animals as well and you don't see any animal in this world especially our own species in Mammals committing suicide. Suicide is a very sensitive topic.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Do you think that depression is “fashionable?” And by criticising the sufferers you can deter others from “joining in”?

To be frank, yes I do think depression is more fashionable than it used to be, although I wouldn't criticise sufferers to deter anyone from joining in, I'm not really sure why that bit's been tagged on.

 

[srh]

I have heard that in Islam suicide is considered Haram (prohibited) and a muslim who commit suicide will not enter Jannah (Heaven). Is it correct?

And if this is correct another question: is the muslim who commit suicide will never enter Jannah (Heaven) or will enter Jannah (Heaven) after getting punishment of all his/her sins in Jahannam (Hell)?

 

[Markhor]

To be frank, yes I do think depression is more fashionable than it used to be, although I wouldn't criticise sufferers to deter anyone from joining in, I'm not really sure why that bit's been tagged on.

Its not so much 'fashionable' but that more cases are being successfully diagnosed.

Modern medicine has become more advanced and our understanding of human psychology, chemical/hormonal imbalances and the way the brain works has improved vastly from the days when depression was seen as 'madness' and the only solution was to be sent off to an asylum. Now people realise sufferers should be treated with compassion and care.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Its not so much 'fashionable' but that more cases are being successfully diagnosed.

Modern medicine has become more advanced and our understanding of human psychology, chemical/hormonal imbalances and the way the brain works has improved vastly from the days when depression was seen as 'madness' and the only solution was to be sent off to an asylum. Now people realise sufferers should be treated with compassion and care.

I'm not saying they shouldn't be treated with compassion and care, but I do believe that there is a tendency for people to think it's okay to indulge in self pity a bit too easily these days. The online teenage suicide pacts for instance. That said, people are exposed to a lot more ideas these days so they are under more emotional and mental stress than they used to be, not to mention confusion.

 

[itsme]

suicide imo is the ultimate liberty,you can decide about surely the most important thing,living or dying.Not the suicide himself is the liberty but the possibility of making the decision about your life is the biggest liberty.It's selfish of course,but selfiness is not bad.

 

[DW44]

It's a desperate act, one of last resort when you don't really see a way out or any silver lining of any sort.

 

[DW44]

I have heard that in Islam suicide is considered Haram (prohibited) and a muslim who commit suicide will not enter Jannah (Heaven). Is it correct?

And if this is correct another question: is the muslim who commit suicide will never enter Jannah (Heaven) or will enter Jannah (Heaven) after getting punishment of all his/her sins in Jahannam (Hell)?

Yes, it's haram. Also, apparently you keep repeatedly killing yourself and getting revived in hell the way you killed yourself in real life which suddenly makes overdosing on heroin or morphine(one of the most peaceful and serene ways to die) a very appealing way to cheat the system.

 

[lilFlip]

suicide imo is the ultimate liberty,you can decide about surely the most important thing,living or dying.Not the suicide himself is the liberty but the possibility of making the decision about your life is the biggest liberty.It's selfish of course,but selfiness is not bad.

It is also the ultimate cowardice.

Although people who commit suicide are usually sick

 

[aukhan]

A coward act but mostly people who commit suicide are struggling with some sort of mental trauma.

 

[MenInG]

Just learnt that an acquaintance commited suicide in the UK

No idea what it is that makes someone take their life!? I guess only they know.

 

[Waleed93]

It would be bad to call it a selfish act.

Only the person who is going through everything knows the pain and suffering that leads to such an unfortunate step.

 

[PakLFC]

Yes it is for sure. Those taking their own lives don't think of the loved ones they leave behind. Secondly no guarantee they will find peace in the hereafter.

 

[pillionrider]

I think there is something in the brain that makes some people more predisposed to suicide than others. Given the same set of circumstances and life experiences, one person will contemplate suicide, while the other just won't have it even occur to him.

Regarding the question - When you're on the brink of suicide, I don't see how others' feelings or thoughts would be of any relevance to you. Though it could be recommended - picture your mother or a loved one's face upon discovering your body, and maybe reconsider your decision.

 

[ex-q-zit]

Pakistan abolishes colonial-era law that punishes attempted suicide

Pakistan's parliament had repealed Section 325 of the Pakistan Penal Code, 1860 about penalising suicide attempts.

Pakistan on Friday adopted an amendment to the colonial-era criminal laws to abolish the punishment for attempted suicide.

Pakistan's parliament had repealed Section 325 of the Pakistan Penal Code, 1860 about penalising suicide attempts. Under the section, suicide or attempted suicide was an offence punishable by one year of imprisonment, fine or both.

It states: “Whoever attempts to commit suicide and does any act towards the commission of such offence, shall be punished with simple imprisonment for a term which may extend to one year, or with fine, or with both.”

The enacted law was completed when President Dr Arif Alvi endorsed the Criminal Laws (Amendment) Bill 2022, abolishing the punishment for attempted suicide, according to the announcement issued by the President's House.

Earlier, the amendment in the law was introduced by the Pakistan Peoples Party (PPP) and it was passed by the Senate in May this year.

According to the objective of the amendment, “the issue of suicide ought to be dealt with as a disease and should be treated as one”.

There is lack of authentic data on the actual number of people committing suicide each year, but according to an old report of the World Health Organisation (WHO), the estimated rate of suicide in Pakistan in 2019 was 8.9 per 100,000 people.

In other words, around 19,331 people killed themselves in 2019.

It is believed that the actual number should be much higher as a lot of cases are not reported to avoid investigations by police.

Decriminalisation may help to get the true picture of the annual suicides in the country.

https://www.hindustantimes.com/worl...attempted-suicide-report-101671808455141.html

 

[sweep_shot]

Good move.

Attempted suicide shouldn't be punished. There is no punishment for it in Islam also as far as I know (even though suicide is a sin in Islam and there is possible punishment in afterlife).