Is the Pakistan team the biggest bottler of the last five years?

[RidiculousMan]

Firstly there's a slight difference between a choker and a bottler.

Chocker: A team or player that consistently fails to perform in crucial games, especially when they are heavily favored or in a strong position. Choking is more about a repeated pattern of failure despite being favorites before matches or tournaments.

Bottler: A team or player that loses composure and squanders a strong position due to nerves or lack of mental strength. Bottling is more about a specific collapse from a strong position.

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1. T20 World Cup 2021 – Semi-Final vs Australia (November 2021)

Situation: Pakistan posted 176/4 (Babar 39, Rizwan 67). Australia needed 62 off 30 balls with 5 wickets left.
Collapse: Hasan Ali dropped Matthew Wade (a sitter at mid-wicket). Wade then smashed 3 sixes in a row off Shaheen Afridi in the 19th over. Australia won with 6 balls to spare.

2. Asia Cup – Final vs Sri Lanka (September 2022)

Situation: Sri Lanka were 58/5, then 110/6. Should have restricted them to 130-140.
Collapse: Bhanuka Rajapaksa (71*) and Wanindu Hasaranga (36) took SL to 170+. Pakistan collapsed to 147 all out (Rizwan scored slow 55, but middle order failed).

3. Pakistan vs India – T20 World Cup 2022 (Group Stage, October 2022)

Situation: India 31/4 (Hardik Pandya & Virat Kohli rebuilding). Needed 48 off 18 balls (Pakistan still favorites).
Collapse: Haris Rauf’s 19th over – Kohli hit 2 sixes. Nawaz’s 20th over – Kohli & Hardik smashed 22 runs (including a free-hit six).

4. Pakistan vs Zimbabwe – T20 World Cup 2022 (Group Stage, October 2022)

Situation: Pakistan Needed 51 runs from 42 balls with 7 wickets in hand.
Collapse: Pakistan lost by 1 run. Nawaz and Wasim couldn't score 3 off 3.

5. Pakistan vs India – T20 World Cup 2024 (Group Stage, June 2024)

Situation: India 119/6.
Collapse: Couldn't chase 120. Lost by 6 runs in a low-scoring thriller.

6. Pakistan vs Australia – Test Series 2024 (Melbourne Test, December 2023)

Situation: Australia 16/4 (Pakistan dominating).
Collapse: Australia went on to score 262. Australia won by 79 runs

7. Pakistan vs South Africa – Test Series 2024-25 (1st Test, December 2024)

Situation: South Africa 99/8. Needed 49 runs.
Collapse: Pakistan failed to take a single wicket since then in the game and South Africa won courtesy Rabada with the bat.

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These were the games off the top of my head. I don't remember any other team in the last 5 years losing winning plots in games like Pakistan.

​

 

[Aqib_mustafa]

Firstly there's a slight difference between a choker and a bottler.

Chocker: A team or player that consistently fails to perform in crucial games, especially when they are heavily favored or in a strong position. Choking is more about a repeated pattern of failure despite being favorites before matches or tournaments.

Bottler: A team or player that loses composure and squanders a strong position due to nerves or lack of mental strength. Bottling is more about a specific collapse from a strong position.

----------

1. T20 World Cup 2021 – Semi-Final vs Australia (November 2021)

Situation: Pakistan posted 176/4 (Babar 39, Rizwan 67). Australia needed 62 off 30 balls with 5 wickets left.
Collapse: Hasan Ali dropped Matthew Wade (a sitter at mid-wicket). Wade then smashed 3 sixes in a row off Shaheen Afridi in the 19th over. Australia won with 6 balls to spare.

2. Asia Cup – Final vs Sri Lanka (September 2022)

Situation: Sri Lanka were 58/5, then 110/6. Should have restricted them to 130-140.
Collapse: Bhanuka Rajapaksa (71*) and Wanindu Hasaranga (36) took SL to 170+. Pakistan collapsed to 147 all out (Rizwan scored slow 55, but middle order failed).

3. Pakistan vs India – T20 World Cup 2022 (Group Stage, October 2022)

Situation: India 31/4 (Hardik Pandya & Virat Kohli rebuilding). Needed 48 off 18 balls (Pakistan still favorites).
Collapse: Haris Rauf’s 19th over – Kohli hit 2 sixes. Nawaz’s 20th over – Kohli & Hardik smashed 22 runs (including a free-hit six).

4. Pakistan vs Zimbabwe – T20 World Cup 2022 (Group Stage, October 2022)

Situation: Pakistan Needed 51 runs from 42 balls with 7 wickets in hand.
Collapse: Pakistan lost by 1 run. Nawaz and Wasim couldn't score 3 off 3.

5. Pakistan vs India – T20 World Cup 2024 (Group Stage, June 2024)

Situation: India 119/6.
Collapse: Couldn't chase 120. Lost by 6 runs in a low-scoring thriller.

6. Pakistan vs Australia – Test Series 2024 (Melbourne Test, December 2023)

Situation: Australia 16/4 (Pakistan dominating).
Collapse: Australia went on to score 262. Australia won by 79 runs

7. Pakistan vs South Africa – Test Series 2024-25 (1st Test, December 2024)

Situation: South Africa 99/8. Needed 49 runs.
Collapse: Pakistan failed to take a single wicket since then in the game and South Africa won courtesy Rabada with the bat.

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These were the games off the top of my head. I don't remember any other team in the last 5 years losing winning plots in games like Pakistan.

​

Ya bro i agreed with all those points but if you see in a good way pakistan were actually winning those games just chocked at the last minute.

 

[RidiculousMan]

Ya bro i agreed with all those points but if you see in a good way pakistan were actually winning those games just chocked at the last minute.

I don't see that in a good way. Pakistan has failed to perform to its past standards in recent times and when they do perform in games. They end up losing games from close winning positions.

 

[Mesozoic]

Yes.

 

[CadPakFan]

You forgot about the following:
1st test vs Bangladesh, we declared at 448/6 in the first innings and then went on to lose by ten wickets.
2nd test vs Bangladesh, we score 274 in the first innings and get Bangladesh to 26/6 but then they go on to make 262 and then they win by 6 wickets.
2nd test vs West Indies, we have them at 38/7 in the first innings and they go onto score 163 and win the test match by 120 runs.

 

[BouncerGuy]

Yeah sure. Pakistan has always been an expected team. Nobody thought in their dreams that this team would win CT 201,7 but they did. But since then, it has been a nose dive.

 

[Usman Chadda]

They lack basic game awareness.

Bottlers or chokers are made out of good players faltering at the final hurdle, not the case here unfortunately.

 

[CadPakFan]

Yeah sure. Pakistan has always been an expected team. Nobody thought in their dreams that this team would win CT 201,7 but they did. But since then, it has been a nose dive.

Yeah they definitely haven't been a great team but just to play devil's advocate. I'd say that we've done some impressive feats despite the disappointing results overall. Winning that test series in SA in 2021, Making it to the 2021 WC SF, 2022 WC Final, that insane chase vs NZ in the 2023 WC (Ik DLS came in but it was still a massive total), winning ODI series against SA and AUS away from home (last time Pak won against AUS away from home was in 2002, and ik it was a B team for the last ODIs but still). Finally, just the fact that we got Australia to 16/4 in the second innings of a test match in Australia is a massive feat (The last time we won a test match in Australia was back in 1995 when Javed Miandad was still playing international cricket and we haven't been able to even draw a single match in 30 years)

 

[BreadPakoda]

Yeah they definitely haven't been a great team but just to play devil's advocate. I'd say that we've done some impressive feats despite the disappointing results overall. Winning that test series in SA in 2021, Making it to the 2021 WC SF, 2022 WC Final, that insane chase vs NZ in the 2023 WC (Ik DLS came in but it was still a massive total), winning ODI series against SA and AUS away from home (last time Pak won against AUS away from home was in 2002, and ik it was a B team for the last ODIs but still). Finally, just the fact that we got Australia to 16/4 in the second innings of a test match in Australia is a massive feat (The last time we won a test match in Australia was back in 1995 when Javed Miandad was still playing international cricket and we haven't been able to even draw a single match in 30 years)

How do I not remember Pakistan winning a test series in SA?

 

[Bhaijaan]

You forgot to mention May 2025

/hehe

 

[Mesozoic]

How do I not remember Pakistan winning a test series in SA?

Because they didn't.

 

[Hitman]

How do I not remember Pakistan winning a test series in SA?

Neither India, nor Pakistan has won a Test series in South Africa. Sri Lanka is the only subcontinental side to win one there.

 

[ads101]

Pakistan enters nearly every tournament as around 6th favourites to win the tournament. If anything Pakistan’s performance in tournaments is well above what is expected given their strength.

The worse the team the more likely the team is to bottle it. I’ve seen Bangladesh, Afghanistan bottle games in the past plenty of times more. When you aren’t expected to win it’s difficult to hold it together. And there’s always hope from the other side to get back in the game.

However unlike other weaker teams, Pakistan makes its own bottling problems worse themselves. Pakistan’s issue which does lead to bottling is the insane pressure on the team. Despite their relatively lower strength, anything less than a trophy win is seen as a failure. And as I’ve said Pakistan even overperforms most of the time. This puts pressure on the players which hinders development and confidence in clutch moments. And if expectations far exceed what you are likely to achieve, this can create a low confidence environment in the team. Which leads to bottling.

I think we’d have developed a more settled, better team if we paid more attention to long term progress. Improving as a side in bilateral over time. Instead we panic and revamp every single tournament we don’t win. Which means there’s never constant gradual progress over time. It’s much better to keep improving, do your best in tournaments but not flip out over them. I think examples of this are Afghanistan and New Zealand for example.

I think until we take fitness and nutrition seriously, and focused upon building a positive, high confidence lower pressure environment around the squad, we aren’t going to properly maximise the talent of our players fully and minimise bottling.

 

[BouncerGuy]

Pakistan enters nearly every tournament as around 6th favourites to win the tournament. If anything Pakistan’s performance in tournaments is well above what is expected given their strength.

The worse the team the more likely the team is to bottle it. I’ve seen Bangladesh, Afghanistan bottle games in the past plenty of times more. When you aren’t expected to win it’s difficult to hold it together. And there’s always hope from the other side to get back in the game.

However unlike other weaker teams, Pakistan makes its own bottling problems worse themselves. Pakistan’s issue which does lead to bottling is the insane pressure on the team. Despite their relatively lower strength, anything less than a trophy win is seen as a failure. And as I’ve said Pakistan even overperforms most of the time. This puts pressure on the players which hinders development and confidence in clutch moments. And if expectations far exceed what you are likely to achieve, this can create a low confidence environment in the team. Which leads to bottling.

I think we’d have developed a more settled, better team if we paid more attention to long term progress. Improving as a side in bilateral over time. Instead we panic and revamp every single tournament we don’t win. Which means there’s never constant gradual progress over time. It’s much better to keep improving, do your best in tournaments but not flip out over them. I think examples of this are Afghanistan and New Zealand for example.

I think until we take fitness and nutrition seriously, and focused upon building a positive, high confidence lower pressure environment around the squad, we aren’t going to properly maximise the talent of our players fully and minimise bottling.

True. Nobody expected that Pakistan would reach the semis of the 2021 T20WC or the final in 2022. They usually start like a minnow every time and most of the time, they end up performing better than expected by their standards, as we have seen in 2021 and 2022.

 

[GreenKhan]

Pakistan have slipped up in the above mentioned games but they have also won close encounters.
For example the Asia cup final where they lost, they chased 170 plus and won in the final over against India in the group stage.
In the world cup 2023- They recorded the highest ever WC chase against SL.
The 2021 WC- They won some close games to get to the Semi- Beat India in a WC for the first time (mental block)
They reached the 2022 World final- Lost to Zimbabwe but they managed to get a run together to get to the final.

On the whole though their performances in recent ICC events have been very poor- 2023 WC- 2024 T20 - CT 2025.
But i wont say they have been the biggest bottlers, but they have been mediocre and that charm that Pakistan cricket had seems to have dwindled over the last few years now especially in global events.

 

[gazza619]

Future looks even brighter

 

[CadPakFan]

How do I not remember Pakistan winning a test series in SA?

Sorry I meant to say against South Africa not in South Africa. For clarification, it was played at home against South Africa in 2021. That series was the last time we had balanced pitches with support for both bowlers and batsman.

 

[aboveandbeyond]

To label a team bottlers, one must fail from expectancy to be labeled in that Category.

Let's face it. Team Pakistan are bordering on mediocrity in all formats, to then label them as bottlers is unfair in my opinion.

 

[BunnyRabbit]

We have to be good enough to become the favorites first and then bottle them.

 

[BouncerGuy]

Pakistan never starts as favorites in any tournament tbh. How can they bottle if they were never among the top e teams in any tournament..

Talking about last decade or so.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

Pakistan never starts as favorites in any tournament tbh. How can they bottle if they were never among the top e teams in any tournament..

Talking about last decade or so.

Huh? Pakistan started as favourites in 2023 World Cup as the #1 ranked team and also in their home Champions Trophy

 

[jeeteshssaxena]

Yes, Pakistan keeps on bottling matches against inferior opposition in important matches, thats definitely choking.

 

[BouncerGuy]

Huh? Pakistan started as favourites in 2023 World Cup as the #1 ranked team and also in their home Champions Trophy

Who said that??? YOU?

 

[BouncerGuy]

Who said that??? YOU?

Rankings can be hoax sometimes and that is what happened.

 

[Vikram1989]

How do I not remember Pakistan winning a test series in SA?

Its against sa in pak where pak produced result oriented good pitches

 

[Nikhil_cric]

Who said that??? YOU?

You can check this forum's posts from that time and also the opinions of experts, many of whom had PAK in the semis.

 

[BouncerGuy]

You can check this forum's posts from that time and also the opinions of experts, many of whom had PAK in the semis.

Maybe said that due to their "team unpredictable" tag but reality hits hard.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

Maybe said that due to their "team unpredictable" tag but reality hits hard.

Point is, they were favourites. You can't write that off now , just because you want to avoid the tag of being "bottlers"

 

[BouncerGuy]

Point is, they were favourites. You can't write that off now , just because you want to avoid the tag of being "bottlers"

Number 1 rank in ODI does not mean they were favorites...

 

[Nikhil_cric]

Number 1 rank in ODI does not mean they were favorites...

They were favourites regardless of the rank and primarily because of popular opinion. The rank gave popular opinion credibility

 

[pillionrider]

If you analyze a lot of those games without bias, you'll see Shaheen Afridi's role in the bottling. And he has gotten away mostly because there are bigger scapegoats who overshadow him. For example Rauf, Nawaz in the MCG game.

 

[mominsaigol]

You can check this forum's posts from that time and also the opinions of experts, many of whom had PAK in the semis.

But I never made those posts? So who are these supposed experts? To be an expert you need to use me as the benchmark.

If you are above the benchmark which very few are and in a year's time no one will be(so tiktok hurry up) then its fair.

But if you are below then no they are not experts.

 

[mominsaigol]

Yes, Pakistan keeps on bottling matches against inferior opposition in important matches, thats definitely choking.

2023 Travis Head

 

[Nikhil_cric]

2023 Travis Head

Australia are not inferior opposition.

 

[mominsaigol]

Australia are not inferior opposition.

They were inferior to India.

In 2023 they were the 4th strongest team. NZ, SA and India were stronger.

SA bumbled badly, India got clowned, NZ had a bad day, it was one of those days were the openers just kicked off in the same way England lost to AU in group stages in 2019 due to the monster opening combo kicking off.

Brother what is this? Am I surpassing you in ranking now. Who's going to be my rival now

 

[Devadwal]

Who said that??? YOU?

Should I bumped the old thread around Asia Cup 2023 . Pakistani fans were doing Bhangra just because they reached to number one ranking in ODI cricket by playing against Minnows and second string team's .

 

[Nikhil_cric]

They were inferior to India.

In 2023 they were the 4th strongest team. NZ, SA and India were stronger.

SA bumbled badly, India got clowned, NZ had a bad day, it was one of those days were the openers just kicked off in the same way England lost to AU in group stages in 2019 due to the monster opening combo kicking off.

Brother what is this? Am I surpassing you in ranking now. Who's going to be my rival now

Australia with Travis Head, Warner , Marsh, Maxwell, Smith , Cummins, Starc, Zampa, Hazlewood was not clearly inferior to India.

That's a team with massive names and proven pedigree across formats.

Maybe India had more form going into the final but OZ were clearly the best of the rest even when not in top form.

 

[mominsaigol]

Australia with Travis Head, Warner , Marsh, Maxwell, Smith , Cummins, Starc, Zampa, Hazlewood was not clearly inferior to India.

That's a team with massive names and proven pedigree across formats.

Maybe India had more form going into the final but OZ were clearly the best of the rest even when not in top form.

India went unbeaten and it was their home den. India was clearly stronger.

The results + performance disagrees with your notion.

Its not always about names and scorecard insights. Don't avoid the cope. India bumbled and bumbled badly.

Theirs a reason Head is so hated on this forumn. It has nothing to do with these scholary arguments and everything to do with the fact that india could have earned a 3rd wc trophy and a wtc.

Wtc is whatever but india's issue is that their cabinet is filled qith 2nd rate trophies in comparison to The actual big dawg.

They still have 2 tbf, but when it comes to world cups it has taken them decades upon decades to acquire one.

Now with wc 2027 in south Africa with an ageing bumrah and rohit + Kohli more or less out of the picture, itll be much tougher to win without pitch rigging.

 

[BouncerGuy]

Should I bumped the old thread around Asia Cup 2023 . Pakistani fans were doing Bhangra just because they reached to number one ranking in ODI cricket by playing against Minnows and second string team's .

reaching number 1 rank is different to what they actullay capable of.. This is Pakistan team.. They do the unthinkable.LOL

 

[Nikhil_cric]

India went unbeaten and it was their home den. India was clearly stronger.

The results + performance disagrees with your notion.

Its not always about names and scorecard insights. Don't avoid the cope. India bumbled and bumbled badly.

Theirs a reason Head is so hated on this forumn. It has nothing to do with these scholary arguments and everything to do with the fact that india could have earned a 3rd wc trophy and a wtc.

Wtc is whatever but india's issue is that their cabinet is filled qith 2nd rate trophies in comparison to The actual big dawg.

They still have 2 tbf, but when it comes to world cups it has taken them decades upon decades to acquire one.

Now with wc 2027 in south Africa with an ageing bumrah and rohit + Kohli more or less out of the picture, itll be much tougher to win without pitch rigging.

None of what you said disproves what I've said here.

You rated Australia below NZ and SA even which is complete nonsense.

India and Australia were easily the strongest sides .

In fact , Australia had beaten India in India in a bilateral series earlier in the year as well.

I'm not sure what is the point of bringing in pitches and 2027.

I just pointed out that's not a clear sign of bottling.

Bottling is what PAK did against USA, a clearly inferior team when lost the plot in the Super Over imo. Should never even have gone that far.

 

[mominsaigol]

None of what you said disproves what I've said here.

You rated Australia below NZ and SA even which is complete nonsense.

India and Australia were easily the strongest sides .

In fact , Australia had beaten India in India in a bilateral series earlier in the year as well.

I'm not sure what is the point of bringing in pitches and 2027.

I just pointed out that's not a clear sign of bottling.

Bottling is what PAK did against USA, a clearly inferior team when lost the plot in the Super Over imo. Should never even have gone that far.

Not the same india. India was badly struggling prior everyone knows this until they bounced back especially during Bumrah's return.

You are constantly relying on big names to argue your point.

No offense but stating things like How can a team with the likes of Warner be weaker isnt an argument.

Aus got tonked for 400+ pre wc. They got demolished by south Africa. NZ was stronger as well given their performance vs India in the group stahes and other sides in general.

Infact Australia landed at the bottom of the table with india consistently being at the top. Australia nearly lost to Afghanistan is it wasnt for a superhuman effort by Maxwell.

No one will look at that tournament and assume Australia was stronger given their performance.

Your argument is akin to what people in 2003 were claiming about Pakistan aka how can a side with wasim akram and saeed Anwar perform so poorly.

This isnt an argument for very obvious reasons. Infact it is fallacious in all metrics

 

[mominsaigol]

Not the same india. India was badly struggling prior everyone knows this until they bounced back especially during Bumrah's return.

You are constantly relying on big names to argue your point.

No offense but stating things like How can a team with the likes of Warner be weaker isnt an argument.

Aus got tonked for 400+ pre wc. They got demolished by south Africa. NZ was stronger as well given their performance vs India in the group stahes and other sides in general.

Infact Australia landed at the bottom of the table with india consistently being at the top. Australia nearly lost to Afghanistan is it wasnt for a superhuman effort by Maxwell.

No one will look at that tournament and assume Australia was stronger given their performance.

Your argument is akin to what people in 2003 were claiming about Pakistan aka how can a side with wasim akram and saeed Anwar perform so poorly.

This isnt an argument for very obvious reasons. Infact it is fallacious in all metrics

Also I never stated anything about USA vs Pakistan . No clue why you are bringing that up. Its irrelevant.

Showing me other bottle job games doesnt detract from the fact this was another bottle job.

Infact India wanted to bat first anyway in the final. They even stated it in the toss and was surprised when Aus read the pitch better and decided to bowl. They assumed aus gave them what they wanted lol

 

[Hellion]

Also I never stated anything about USA vs Pakistan . No clue why you are bringing that up. Its irrelevant.

Showing me other bottle job games doesnt detract from the fact this was another bottle job.

Infact India wanted to bat first anyway in the final. They even stated it in the toss and was surprised when Aus read the pitch better and decided to bowl. They assumed aus gave them what they wanted lol

Fair enough. I actually agree with you

Australia is a mediocre nation of tullas and medium pacers so India did bottle it.

 

[mominsaigol]

Fair enough. I actually agree with you

Australia is a mediocre nation of tullas and medium pacers so India did bottle it.

Medicore nation with top tier quality of life, 6 world cups wins, best winning and unbeaten streak of all time, produced the don of the game. And a country that Indians drool over and immigrate to in flocks qith close to 800,000 indians living in it .

This is the issue with indian posters. They state certain things that make sense and showcase good argumentation but then they exaggerate things and play a silly semantics game in attempts to downplay lol.

No lower class Indian would ever wish to willingly live in India if given the opportunity to go abroad.

Only middle, upper middle, Upper class citizens are happy to stay in their home country which applicable to most countries by default.

 

[RidiculousMan]

Pakistan never starts as favorites in any tournament tbh. How can they bottle if they were never among the top e teams in any tournament..

Read the OG post

 

[RidiculousMan]

If you analyze a lot of those games without bias, you'll see Shaheen Afridi's role in the bottling. And he has gotten away mostly because there are bigger scapegoats who overshadow him. For example Rauf, Nawaz in the MCG game.

Not only Shaheen but also Haris Rauf. Vs USA and India

 

[BouncerGuy]

PLEASE STAY ON TOPIC... THREAD IS ABOUT PAKISTAN ONLY