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Israeli diplomat caught on camera plotting to 'take down' UK MPs

Abdullah719

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An Israeli embassy official has been caught on camera in an undercover sting plotting to “take down” MPs regarded as hostile, including foreign office minister Sir Alan Duncan, an outspoken supporter of a Palestinian state.

In an extraordinary breach of diplomatic protocol, Shai Masot, who describes himself as an officer in the Israel Defence Forces and is serving as a senior political officer at the London embassy, was recorded by an *undercover reporter from al-Jazeera’s investigative unit speaking about a number of British MPs.

The Israeli ambassador, Mark Regev, apologised to Duncan on Friday. An Israeli spokesman said Regev made clear that “the embassy considered the remarks completely *unacceptable”.

Although the Israeli embassy declined to comment on internal disciplinary matters, it is understood Masot has been reprimanded. Masot declined to comment or to elaborate on what he meant when he said he wanted to “take down” a number of MPs.

Masot had been speaking to Maria Strizzolo, a civil servant who was formerly an aide to another Conservative minister. Also present was a man they knew as Robin, whom they believed to be working for Labour Friends of Israel, a pressure group. In fact, Robin was an undercover reporter.

Strizzolo, discussing with Masot how to discredit MPs, said: “Well, you know, if you look hard enough, I’m sure that there is something that they’re trying to hide.” Later she added: “A little scandal, maybe.”

During the conversation, in October, Strizzolo boasted that she had helped to secure a promotion for her boss, the Conservative MP Robert Halfon. She had been his chief of staff when he was deputy chair of the Conservative party. Last year Halfon was appointed as an education minister and Strizzolo was appointed as a senior manager at the Skills Funding Agency. She continues to work part-time for Halfon.

In the footage, Masot agreed that Strizzolo had assisted Halfon and then asked whether she could also achieve the opposite effect. “Can I give you some MPs that I would suggest you would take down?” he asked. He went on to say that she knew which MPs he was referring to.

She asked him to remind her. “The deputy foreign minister,” he said. Strizzolo said: “You still want to go for it?” Masot’s reply is ambiguous but he said Duncan was still causing problems. Strizzolo asked: “I thought we had, you know, neutralised him just a little bit, no?” Masot answered: “No.”

Masot did not elaborate on what he meant by “take down”, but it is normally used as meaning to engineer a downfall, possibly through discrediting them in some way.

The conversation then turned to the foreign secretary, Boris Johnson. Strizzolo said he was solid on Israel. Masot agreed, adding that Johnson just did not care. “You know he is an idiot …” Masot said.

Strizzolo returned to the subject of Duncan later in the conversation, suggesting he had had a run-in with Halfon in the past and that Halfon had reported Duncan to the whips. So never say never, she added. Masot replied: “Never say never, yeah, but …” Strizzolo said: “A little scandal, maybe.”

Other prominent Conservatives named during the conversation include Crispin Blunt, chair of the Commons foreign affairs select committee, who is also a vocal supporter of the Palestinians.

Blunt said: “Whilst this apparent activity of a diplomat of a foreign state in the politics of the United Kingdom is formally outrageous and deserving of investigation, the real questions should be for the state of Israel itself. Israel’s future peace and security is not being served by ignoring the substantial peace lobby in both Israel and the world wide Jewish community and working to undermine those foreign politicians who share that perspective”

In another conversation, Masot agreed that Blunt was among MPs that were “strongly pro-Arab rather than pro-Israel”. Strizzolo referred to him being on a “hitlist”.

UK ministers are understood to regard such plot talks as a matter of serious concern, crossing the line beyond normal diplomatic activity. Duncan declined to comment.

Although the Israeli embassy insists Masot was a junior embassy official and not a diplomat, his business card describes him as “a senior political officer” and his LinkedIn page lists him as having worked for the embassy since November 2014. He describes his work as being the chief point of contact between the embassy and MPs and liaising with ministers and officials at the Foreign Office.

He also describes himself as having been a major in the Israeli Defence Forces (IDF) between 2004 and 2011 – serving part of that time on a patrol boat off Gaza – and still employed by the IDF as deputy head of the international organisations sector.

The disclosures comes at a sensitive moment, just over a week after Theresa May put herself at odds with the Obama administration by expressing strong support for Israel in a row over the expansion of illegal settlements in the West Bank.

The sting operation, which began in June and ran through to November last year, recorded conversations on a number occasions that include a wide range of pro-Israeli activists as well as British politicians and Israeli embassy staff.

The recordings form the basis of four half-hour documentaries that al-Jazeera is to broadcast from 15 January.

Strizzolo sought to play down what had been discussed. Asked a series of questions by the Guardian, she issued a statement that said: “The implications the Guardian is seeking to draw from a few out-of-context snippets of a conversation, obtained by subterfuge, over a social dinner are absurd.

“The context of the conversation was light, tongue-in-cheek and gossipy. Any suggestion that I, as a civil servant working in education, could ever exert the type of influence you are suggesting is risible. Shai Masot is someone I know purely socially and as a friend. He is not someone with whom I have ever worked or had any political dealings beyond chatting about politics, as millions of people do, in a social context.”

A Foreign Office spokesman said: “The Israeli ambassador has apologised and is clear these comments do not reflect the views of the embassy or government of Israel. The UK has a strong relationship with Israel and we consider the matter closed.”

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...caught-on-camera-plotting-to-take-down-uk-mps
 
This is just someone stupid enough to get caught.

Nobody is in any doubt the Israel lobby tries to take down all British politicians who dare stand up for justice.

Mossad were even accused by MI5 of bombing their own Israeli Embassy to try to spin/control UK political scene.

More recently the Labour Friends of Israel posse were instrumental in the undemocratic coup to get rid of Corbyn a longtime friend of Palestine
 
I would imagine that all intelligence agencies do this sort of thing. We do it to them and they do it to us. The CIA and MI6 are past masters at fomenting coups. The FSB destabilised institutions in Ukraine before arming the rebels. The role of the Russian hackers in the last US election is clear.

Right now the FSB is having a lot of success in undermining confidence in British institutions in the eyes of the young, and promoting Putin as a paragon of leadership because he is "strong". They encourage the youth to rail against the 'elite' and the 'establishment' as billionaire cronies Putin and Trump become the establishment.
 
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An Israeli embassy official has been caught on camera in an undercover sting plotting to “take down” MPs regarded as hostile, including foreign office minister Sir Alan Duncan, an outspoken supporter of a Palestinian state.

In an extraordinary breach of diplomatic protocol, Shai Masot, who describes himself as an officer in the Israel Defence Forces and is serving as a senior political officer at the London embassy, was recorded by an *undercover reporter from al-Jazeera’s investigative unit speaking about a number of British MPs.

The Israeli ambassador, Mark Regev, apologised to Duncan on Friday. An Israeli spokesman said Regev made clear that “the embassy considered the remarks completely *unacceptable”.

Although the Israeli embassy declined to comment on internal disciplinary matters, it is understood Masot has been reprimanded. Masot declined to comment or to elaborate on what he meant when he said he wanted to “take down” a number of MPs.

Masot had been speaking to Maria Strizzolo, a civil servant who was formerly an aide to another Conservative minister. Also present was a man they knew as Robin, whom they believed to be working for Labour Friends of Israel, a pressure group. In fact, Robin was an undercover reporter.

Strizzolo, discussing with Masot how to discredit MPs, said: “Well, you know, if you look hard enough, I’m sure that there is something that they’re trying to hide.” Later she added: “A little scandal, maybe.”

During the conversation, in October, Strizzolo boasted that she had helped to secure a promotion for her boss, the Conservative MP Robert Halfon. She had been his chief of staff when he was deputy chair of the Conservative party. Last year Halfon was appointed as an education minister and Strizzolo was appointed as a senior manager at the Skills Funding Agency. She continues to work part-time for Halfon.

In the footage, Masot agreed that Strizzolo had assisted Halfon and then asked whether she could also achieve the opposite effect. “Can I give you some MPs that I would suggest you would take down?” he asked. He went on to say that she knew which MPs he was referring to.

She asked him to remind her. “The deputy foreign minister,” he said. Strizzolo said: “You still want to go for it?” Masot’s reply is ambiguous but he said Duncan was still causing problems. Strizzolo asked: “I thought we had, you know, neutralised him just a little bit, no?” Masot answered: “No.”

Masot did not elaborate on what he meant by “take down”, but it is normally used as meaning to engineer a downfall, possibly through discrediting them in some way.

The conversation then turned to the foreign secretary, Boris Johnson. Strizzolo said he was solid on Israel. Masot agreed, adding that Johnson just did not care. “You know he is an idiot …” Masot said.

Strizzolo returned to the subject of Duncan later in the conversation, suggesting he had had a run-in with Halfon in the past and that Halfon had reported Duncan to the whips. So never say never, she added. Masot replied: “Never say never, yeah, but …” Strizzolo said: “A little scandal, maybe.”

Other prominent Conservatives named during the conversation include Crispin Blunt, chair of the Commons foreign affairs select committee, who is also a vocal supporter of the Palestinians.

Blunt said: “Whilst this apparent activity of a diplomat of a foreign state in the politics of the United Kingdom is formally outrageous and deserving of investigation, the real questions should be for the state of Israel itself. Israel’s future peace and security is not being served by ignoring the substantial peace lobby in both Israel and the world wide Jewish community and working to undermine those foreign politicians who share that perspective”

In another conversation, Masot agreed that Blunt was among MPs that were “strongly pro-Arab rather than pro-Israel”. Strizzolo referred to him being on a “hitlist”.

UK ministers are understood to regard such plot talks as a matter of serious concern, crossing the line beyond normal diplomatic activity. Duncan declined to comment.

Although the Israeli embassy insists Masot was a junior embassy official and not a diplomat, his business card describes him as “a senior political officer” and his LinkedIn page lists him as having worked for the embassy since November 2014. He describes his work as being the chief point of contact between the embassy and MPs and liaising with ministers and officials at the Foreign Office.

He also describes himself as having been a major in the Israeli Defence Forces (IDF) between 2004 and 2011 – serving part of that time on a patrol boat off Gaza – and still employed by the IDF as deputy head of the international organisations sector.

The disclosures comes at a sensitive moment, just over a week after Theresa May put herself at odds with the Obama administration by expressing strong support for Israel in a row over the expansion of illegal settlements in the West Bank.

The sting operation, which began in June and ran through to November last year, recorded conversations on a number occasions that include a wide range of pro-Israeli activists as well as British politicians and Israeli embassy staff.

The recordings form the basis of four half-hour documentaries that al-Jazeera is to broadcast from 15 January.

Strizzolo sought to play down what had been discussed. Asked a series of questions by the Guardian, she issued a statement that said: “The implications the Guardian is seeking to draw from a few out-of-context snippets of a conversation, obtained by subterfuge, over a social dinner are absurd.

“The context of the conversation was light, tongue-in-cheek and gossipy. Any suggestion that I, as a civil servant working in education, could ever exert the type of influence you are suggesting is risible. Shai Masot is someone I know purely socially and as a friend. He is not someone with whom I have ever worked or had any political dealings beyond chatting about politics, as millions of people do, in a social context.”

A Foreign Office spokesman said: “The Israeli ambassador has apologised and is clear these comments do not reflect the views of the embassy or government of Israel. The UK has a strong relationship with Israel and we consider the matter closed.”

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...caught-on-camera-plotting-to-take-down-uk-mps

He got caught doing something which invariably all governments do...they lobby and try and secure their interests...

Lol at Al Jazeera caring about things like this on principle considering that they themselves represent the Qatari government who have funded IS...

Actually even in Israel they have actually been allowed to fund Hamas...which has created a lot of discussion...the argument being that allowing them to fund Hamas:

"We believe that better conditions in Gaza would lessen the incentive of Hamas and the population to go again to a war,"

Doesn't seem like that plan is working...
 
Good investigative journalism by Al Jazeera. If this was a Russian diplomat caught speaking about drawing up a hitlist of MPs there would be much more outrage about this.
 
Good investigative journalism by Al Jazeera. If this was a Russian diplomat caught speaking about drawing up a hitlist of MPs there would be much more outrage about this.

On the note that we are comparing there wouldn't be much outrage when British or Americans or Saudis are doing it as well,which in all honesty most of us know they have been doing it.
 
Israeli influence on British and particular American politics should never be underestimated.

They wield an incredible amount of power through lobbying and money.

Alan Duncan is hardly a big Palestinian supporter - if anything he was neutral who criticised illegal Jewish settlements.

Look at the amount of scrutiny Obama gets yet he still gave Israel a $35 billion 10 year millitary contract. Yet the right wing Israeli government still see him as an enemy only because he told them to halt settlements.
 
"The UK has a strong relationship with Israel and we consider the matter closed.”

Nothing to see here folks... move along. Love it. It shows the type of power Israel yields over British politics. Its disgusting.

This guy is a snake and he DOES represent Israeli views, why? Because he is an Israeli ambassador to the UK! He is there to serve the interests of his employer.. ISRAEL!

Anyways, fact is not matter how obvious, blatant and even getting caught on camera like this, nothing will get done. Turn a blind eye to it and move along. I do not recall when the UK lost its backbone.
 
The Anglo Saxons have been masters at such Machiavellian subversion for centuries.
 
Honestly it wasn't even that serious. It's just one guy taking himself too seriously. If they remove him Israel might get upset and might ask some UK official to leave. Ruining diplomatic relations over one guy is never a good idea.
 
Full revelations not out yet. The Al-Jazeera documentary goes out next week and is a 4 parter apparently
 
"The UK has a strong relationship with Israel and we consider the matter closed.”

Nothing to see here folks... move along. Love it. It shows the type of power Israel yields over British politics. Its disgusting.

This guy is a snake and he DOES represent Israeli views, why? Because he is an Israeli ambassador to the UK! He is there to serve the interests of his employer.. ISRAEL!

Anyways, fact is not matter how obvious, blatant and even getting caught on camera like this, nothing will get done. Turn a blind eye to it and move along. I do not recall when the UK lost its backbone.

Ambassador to the UK??...he's not even a diplomat...nor is he the 'senior political officer' he claimed to be...he's basically an aide to the Israeli ambassador to Turkey...

Considering Al Jazeera were undercover for 6 months is this honestly the best they could manage?...

Lol even the woman Strizzolo is an aide...basically two people with essentially 0 influence...

What is true however is that Israel have a strong lobby in Britain...and far from needing to plot against Britain they actually have good relations...good relations with Cameron and good relations with May...

If you want to make an argument for there being a strong Israeli lobby in Britain then duh of course they do...but this isn't the best thing to use to make that point...

And also if such a thing were going on...it's really not that unusual anyway...lobbyists are supposed to take care of their interests...if you think every government around the world doesn't do something similar then you are grossly mistaken...
 
"The UK has a strong relationship with Israel and we consider the matter closed.”

Nothing to see here folks... move along. Love it. It shows the type of power Israel yields over British politics. Its disgusting.

This guy is a snake and he DOES represent Israeli views, why? Because he is an Israeli ambassador to the UK! He is there to serve the interests of his employer.. ISRAEL!

Anyways, fact is not matter how obvious, blatant and even getting caught on camera like this, nothing will get done. Turn a blind eye to it and move along. I do not recall when the UK lost its backbone.

It comes after May's criticism of Kerry's speech a few weeks ago about the two state solution. To be honest I don't really care about May's public rhetoric - it's just posturing to pacify the Israeli Govt. Its like the Pakistani government blasting drone attacks in public but endorsing it in private.

The UK still helped draft and voted for the UN resolution condemning Israeli settlements which is more important.

Israel are starting to suffer some diplomatic defeats. Only a couple of years ago, the UK Parliament voted to recognise a Palestinian state. Then there's the Iran nuclear deal which went through despite Netanyahu's barking up a storm about it.
 
Israel lobby trying desperately to brush this under the carpet. IF there was genuinely 'nothing to see here' they would just ignore it or keep quiet. But no they have to try to put shade on it.

Fact is the concerted Israeli plot to get rid of Corbyn as Labour leader is now being ruthlessly exposed. (almost all the failed coup leaders were Labour Friends of Israel)

Even if UK Government demonstrates their servility to Israel by not taking action the Labour Party will now have to have an inquiry and purge of traiterous elements.
 
.<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en-gb"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Statement released by the SNP calling on the government to deport Israel's Shai Masot for plotting against UK politicians. <a href="https://t.co/4RLxnthrhD">pic.twitter.com/4RLxnthrhD</a></p>— Liam O'Hare (@Liam_O_Hare) <a href="https://twitter.com/Liam_O_Hare/status/818115519333203968">8 January 2017</a></blockquote>
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Craig Murray the former UK Ambassador to Uzbekistan knows the etiquette expected of Diplomats.

He's astonished Israelis not being expelled from Country

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en-gb"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Why Has Israeli Spy Shai Masot Not Been Expelled? - There is no starker proof of the golden chains in which Israel <a href="https://t.co/c0ValoL3KF">https://t.co/c0ValoL3KF</a></p>— Craig Murray (@CraigMurrayOrg) <a href="https://twitter.com/CraigMurrayOrg/status/818037777669509120">8 January 2017</a></blockquote>
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Cross Party consensus building against this Israeli trojan horse interfering with British politics

Conservative Tim Montgomerie

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Have to agree with this. I'm steadfast in my support for Israel but this "diplomat" should already be on a flight home <a href="https://t.co/DhJyT6xJVZ">https://t.co/DhJyT6xJVZ</a></p>— Tim Montgomerie ن (@montie) <a href="https://twitter.com/montie/status/818226571425226758">January 8, 2017</a></blockquote>
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I refer you to Hassan-i Sabbah.

I know of Hassan Sabbah, I even contributed with many paragraphs to his Wikipedia English page when I was 15.

I doubt he used Satanic strategies to promote misery all over the world by killing mainly (sometimes exclusively) civilians, destroying their culture and and exploiting them economically - he mainly targeted (armed) soldiers.
 
More revelations coming out now...

Israelis colluded to try to bring down the first Black Muslim women head of the NUS !

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en-gb"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">REVEALED: NUS official colluded with Israeli embassy to undermine student leader Malia Bouattia <a href="https://t.co/W1YyH4NoUP">https://t.co/W1YyH4NoUP</a> <a href="https://t.co/qwklZpauru">pic.twitter.com/qwklZpauru</a></p>— Middle East Eye (@MiddleEastEye) <a href="https://twitter.com/MiddleEastEye/status/818886324111495173">10 January 2017</a></blockquote>
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cant remember of any other country taking this active a role in the manipulation of key political operations in the uk. if its as pervasive as these reports suggest, odds are nothing will happen.

its astonishing and indefensible.
 
Screenshot_2017_01_10_at_10_38_50_PM.png


https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/arch...-undesirable-immigrant-shai-masot-given-visa/
 
First part of four part series on line now

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/ceCOhdgRBoc" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
 
Part 2 of the 4 part series

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/Vuk1EhkEctE" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
 
Israel diplomat forced to resign after AJ investigation

An Israeli political officer, who was at the centre of an Al Jazeera investigation, has been forced to resign from Israel's UK embassy, a senior official in the Israeli foreign ministry has told Al Jazeera.

Shai Masot, a senior political officer working at the Israeli embassy, resigned from his post earlier this week, the spokesman said on Thursday.

The investigation, The Lobby, reveals plots by the Israeli diplomat and a British civil servant to destroy the careers of senior politicians.

In a statement posted on his Twitter account on Sunday, the UK Israeli embassy's spokesman, Yiftah Curiel, downplayed comments made by Masot.

"The Embassy of Israel rejects the remarks concerning Minister [Sir Alan] Duncan, which are completely unacceptable; the comments were made by a junior embassy employee who is not an Israeli diplomat, and who will be ending his term of employment with the embassy shortly."

The Lobby also uncovers Israel's extensive, well-financed propaganda campaign in the UK to counter negative news stories about its policies and to fund trips to Israel for young activists.

As part of a six-month investigation, Robin, an undercover reporter using an alias, infiltrated a lobby of politicians, activists and Israeli embassy officials working to drum up support for Israel.

Many enjoyed financial or strategic support from the Israeli embassy in London via Masot.

Israel's apology

The Israeli embassy has apologised to UK deputy foreign secretary Sir Alan Duncan for comments made by Masot on plans "to take [him] down" due to his criticism of Israel's settlement activity in the occupied West Bank.

In a conversation with Maria Strizzolo, who was then chief of staff to MP Robert Halfon, the deputy chairman of the ruling Conservative Party, Masot asked her if he could give her some names of MPs he would suggest she "take down".

Masot named Duncan, who in 2014 said that while he fully supports Israel's right to exist, he believes settlements on occupied Palestinian land represent an "ever-deepening stain on the face of the globe". He also likened the situation in Hebron in the occupied West Bank to apartheid.

Strizzolo later hinted that "a little scandal" might see Duncan dismissed.

But this latest disclosure is just one among the Investigative Unit's many findings, which are being revealed in The Lobby, a four-part series that is be broadcast daily on Al Jazeera from January 11 at 22:30 GMT.

The undercover investigation reveals how the Israeli government is in the midst of a brazen, covert influence campaign in Britain.

For half a year, Robin, an undercover reporter working with Al Jazeera's Investigative Unit, met members of Britain's lobby network that enjoys strong support from the Israeli government by way of the Israeli embassy in London.

Robin posed as a graduate activist with strong sympathies towards Israel who was eager to help combat the Boycott, Divestment and Sanctions movement prominent in Britain.

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2017/...-resign-aj-investigation-170112155109626.html
 
Part 3 of 4

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I know of Hassan Sabbah, I even contributed with many paragraphs to his Wikipedia English page when I was 15.

I doubt he used Satanic strategies to promote misery all over the world by killing mainly (sometimes exclusively) civilians, destroying their culture and and exploiting them economically - he mainly targeted (armed) soldiers.

Probably because he lacked the scope due to limited technology. I find your diatribes racist. Ethnicity has nothing to do with genocide.
 
Probably because he lacked the scope due to limited technology. I find your diatribes racist. Ethnicity has nothing to do with genocide.

It's an example of the type cognitive dissonance that unfortunately is ever so prevalent in this world.

To paraphrase Chomsky "It's only an atrocity if they do it to us, not if we do it to them"

It is thinking like this that has led us to commit such heinous crimes on our fellows humans. Nobody says they are acting maliciously, each atrocity is accompanied by a "righteous justifying" rationale.
 
.<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en-gb"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Excellent letter from <a href="https://twitter.com/jeremycorbyn">@jeremycorbyn</a> moves us towards the truth on subversion of British democracy by a foreign power for nefarious purposes. <a href="https://t.co/5eoaExTbkU">pic.twitter.com/5eoaExTbkU</a></p>— George Galloway (@georgegalloway) <a href="https://twitter.com/georgegalloway/status/820071863816781824">14 January 2017</a></blockquote>
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Thank you for correction [MENTION=133972]shaykh[/MENTION]

Great to see Corbyn making this issue being voiced.

Its time the UK did not brush these issues under the carpet, snakes like these people should be sent back home.

For anyone who had watched the Al Jazeera videos - there are some classic examples of how well oiled the Israeli lobby is and furthermore how dangerous it is.
 
Shai deserves Israel prize for his dedication though. This is why Israel is so strong compared to their neighbors. Their citizens are intelligent, hard working and they work as a unit.
 
Shai deserves Israel prize for his dedication though. This is why Israel is so strong compared to their neighbors. Their citizens are intelligent, hard working and they work as a unit.

I would rather not be 'strong' if it comes at the cost of innocent blood.

Israel would happily take out the innocent as long as it works to their goals.
 
This is why the forces of evil were so obsessed with trying to destroy Corbyn.

The people of Britain are fair minded and support Palestine cause but the elites at top of the Establishment parties have narrowed debate so much that 'the left' were not allowed any space to criticise Israel despite their numerous and well-documented crimes.
 
I would rather not be 'strong' if it comes at the cost of innocent blood.

It is a good thought but unfortunately most of the world doesn't think like that. Do you think Nazis, Soviet Union or many other governments thought they were killing innocent people? They always have justification no matter how absurd it sounds. Israel has terrorism justification and they are really smart at exploiting it.
 
This is why the forces of evil were so obsessed with trying to destroy Corbyn.

The people of Britain are fair minded and support Palestine cause but the elites at top of the Establishment parties have narrowed debate so much that 'the left' were not allowed any space to criticise Israel despite their numerous and well-documented crimes.

Can you please state who are the forces of good and evil? Actual protagonists.

These are very general terms and with me having an interest in linguistics, I always get curious when such terms are thrown about.
 
Can you please state who are the forces of good and evil? Actual protagonists.

These are very general terms and with me having an interest in linguistics, I always get curious when such terms are thrown about.

Anybody with half a brain can work it out for themselves. If you need it explaining your education is sorely lacking.
 
Anybody with half a brain can work it out for themselves. If you need it explaining your education is sorely lacking.

That's fine my education is sorely lacking.

As yours isn't why don't you inform me.
 
Probably because he lacked the scope due to limited technology. I find your diatribes racist. Ethnicity has nothing to do with genocide.

Why do you think the French talked of the "la perfide Albion" (perfidious Albion) ?

I'm not talking of "genocide" there, but just pointing out that the English have perfected the art of undiplomatic diplomacy over the centuries (the Anglo Saxon cousins of the CIA are mere mimics), and Israelis are just amateurs.

Nothing racist, because I don't believe in the racial compartmentation of humanity, unlike you.
 
just finishing watching those first three parts.

its astonishing. almost beggars belief that this hasnt become a massive diplomatic issue.
 
Its breathtaking. The Establishment media / Deep State cabal is rock solid trying to ignore it/sweep it under the carpet.(Left wing Guardian run by Zionist Freedland) Note that even ordinary aid worker who it was revealed worked for MI6 this week. Lots of pro-Israeli groups implicated. Can not let them get away with it. Especially with Trump coming.
 
Anybody with half a brain can work it out for themselves. If you need it explaining your education is sorely lacking.

Herein kinda lies the problem...seems one can only recognise the wrong on one side...

The left generally have this love for the underdog problem...I mean Galloway is probably the biggest proponent of this...Corbyn isnt too far behind...I mean he did refer to Hamas and Hezbollah as friends...

Fact is that these organisations targeting civilians seems to be fine for many on the left...I mean Bouattia herself conforms to this belief also...

I just find it bizarre how people can speak about liberty and human rights and then support organisations or people who have no interest in these values...

Criticism of Israel is often justified in many ways...but there seems to be an obsession with a good vs evil narrative when in real terms there aren't really good guys on both sides...just battles between the right wings...

Is amusing though seeing how the left is struggling to find their position on Hezbollah...their former friends are now murdering Syrians on behalf of the other lover of human rights Iran...
 
Its breathtaking. The Establishment media / Deep State cabal is rock solid trying to ignore it/sweep it under the carpet.(Left wing Guardian run by Zionist Freedland) Note that even ordinary aid worker who it was revealed worked for MI6 this week. Lots of pro-Israeli groups implicated. Can not let them get away with it. Especially with Trump coming.

It shouldn't take Einstein to work it out but...

einsteinletter041048.jpg
 
Herein kinda lies the problem...seems one can only recognise the wrong on one side...

The left generally have this love for the underdog problem...I mean Galloway is probably the biggest proponent of this...Corbyn isnt too far behind...I mean he did refer to Hamas and Hezbollah as friends...

Fact is that these organisations targeting civilians seems to be fine for many on the left...I mean Bouattia herself conforms to this belief also...

I just find it bizarre how people can speak about liberty and human rights and then support organisations or people who have no interest in these values...

Criticism of Israel is often justified in many ways...but there seems to be an obsession with a good vs evil narrative when in real terms there aren't really good guys on both sides...just battles between the right wings...

Is amusing though seeing how the left is struggling to find their position on Hezbollah...their former friends are now murdering Syrians on behalf of the other lover of human rights Iran...

It's amusing to see anyone trying to defend Israel in any way.
 
Imagine the outcry if a European diplomat was caught plotting with a uk civil servant in ousting/defaming a leading leave mp....
 
Here is part 4 of 4 of the Al Jazeera documentary

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Both Corbyn and Emily Thornberry have called for inquiries as this is a National Security issue.

I wonder if any COBRA meetings have been held?
 
A good start. Looks like Foreign Affairs Select Committee to look into matter. Remember the Trojan Horse fake letter about some small local schools caused SEVERAL separate inquiries so the factual evidence of real Israeli interference into UK Parliamentary affairs should be much much higher profile and demands a full independent dedicated inquiry.

http://www.middleeasteye.net/news/uk-select-committee-investigate-israeli-lobby-scandal-1733690633

A UK parliamentary committee will investigate a scandal involving a plan by an Israeli diplomat and British parliamentary aide to “take down” the UK's deputy foreign minister, British media reported on Sunday.

The disclosure of the secret investigation carried out by the Qatar-based al-Jazeera TV station, involving Israeli diplomat Shai Masot, who has close links to Israeli intelligence, and Maria Strizzolo, an aide to the pro-Israeli Tory MP Robert Halfon, made headlines last week.

The scandal is to be investigated by the Foreign Affairs Select Committee, chaired by Tory MP Crispin Blunt, who was also targeted by Masot and Strizzolo.
 
It's amusing to see anyone trying to defend Israel in any way.

Actually its more seeing it as less straightforward than a battle between good and bad...

In war there are rules about conduct. Having a just cause if you believe the cause to be just doesn't actually mean you can fight however you want.

When you target civilians it a crime pure and simple. Yet this stuff is conveniently neglected. If you are going to post a report on Israeli war crimes which has been done then at the very least post the crimes committed by the other side.

Hamas as it happens have been accused of war crimes against Palestinians...whether that be accused collaborators, Fatah or the PA...

Also their rockets were aimed at civilian targets...not military ones...

One of the crucial things for groups and this isn't just Hamas but in general is a need for bloodshed...and a lack of desire for peace...

If everyone is happy and agreements can be reached then an organisation lose its relevance...one thing that is common among most guerilla groups is deliberately putting their civilians in danger...the same reports that attacked Israel also attacked Hamas for launching bombs from civilian areas, from storing munitions in UN schools and civilian buildings like mosques...rules of engagement also require a combatant to be identifiable and not be hiding amongst the civilian population...there are clear advantages for Hamas and in general guerilla behaviour...it serves two purposes...one is it acts as a human shield and second if civilians do die then it helps the cause as more civilians are furious which allows groups to further fill a vacuum...i mean ask yourself why when Israeli protocol is to inform civilians to evacuate buildings before an attack Hamas imposes a curfew and prevents people from leaving...

Worth asking what their resistance achieves for Gazans?...I mean the last conflict just led to a lot of death and then the signing of a ceasefire...after the death of 2,200?...

Its ok for the likes of Mishaal who lives in his mansion in Qatar...

Resistance is a romantic ideal but its usually not that at all...its usually self serving for those at the top of the food chain and achieves very little for the people it claims to represent...

If you can show me how Hamas resistance has benefited the average Gazan I would love to hear it...

And if you took this as a defence for Israel then you miss the point...you have the right wing on both sides doing damage to their own...but Israel is all that gets discussed by the media generally...so its worth adding some balance to the discussion and showing that the side Israel is fighting are far from angels...

But this is a difficult conversation to have with you considering if I remember rightly you believe in collective punishment of all Israelis and view them all as legitimate targets...

If we get another attack here in Britain i wonder if you will make the same argument...considering Britains foreign policy worldwide...
 
And I imagine Hezbollah is causing you guys a few problems...loved them up for so long...nothing new there...they have always been loved by the left and in some cases still are...

I mean some news reports spoke of Assad liberating Aleppo...

So are you are still defenders of Hezbollah?
 
Imagine the outcry if a European diplomat was caught plotting with a uk civil servant in ousting/defaming a leading leave mp....

Better yet...

Imagine this entire episode but replace the Israeli man with a Palestinian man.

The aftermath would be very different.
 
And I imagine Hezbollah is causing you guys a few problems...loved them up for so long...nothing new there...they have always been loved by the left and in some cases still are...

I mean some news reports spoke of Assad liberating Aleppo...

So are you are still defenders of Hezbollah?

Some of the stuff you have written is pretty disturbing. BUt to be honest, i was pretty confused until I took to finding new sources of information. Please do avoid CNN and Fox News fro your info.

Here are some real facts on Syria.

http://webtv.un.org/watch/permanent...ress-conference-9-december-2016/5241732190001

I could share a lot more with you but i would have to derail this thread.
 
Actually its more seeing it as less straightforward than a battle between good and bad...

In war there are rules about conduct. Having a just cause if you believe the cause to be just doesn't actually mean you can fight however you want.

When you target civilians it a crime pure and simple. Yet this stuff is conveniently neglected. If you are going to post a report on Israeli war crimes which has been done then at the very least post the crimes committed by the other side.

Hamas as it happens have been accused of war crimes against Palestinians...whether that be accused collaborators, Fatah or the PA...

Also their rockets were aimed at civilian targets...not military ones...

One of the crucial things for groups and this isn't just Hamas but in general is a need for bloodshed...and a lack of desire for peace...

If everyone is happy and agreements can be reached then an organisation lose its relevance...one thing that is common among most guerilla groups is deliberately putting their civilians in danger...the same reports that attacked Israel also attacked Hamas for launching bombs from civilian areas, from storing munitions in UN schools and civilian buildings like mosques...rules of engagement also require a combatant to be identifiable and not be hiding amongst the civilian population...there are clear advantages for Hamas and in general guerilla behaviour...it serves two purposes...one is it acts as a human shield and second if civilians do die then it helps the cause as more civilians are furious which allows groups to further fill a vacuum...i mean ask yourself why when Israeli protocol is to inform civilians to evacuate buildings before an attack Hamas imposes a curfew and prevents people from leaving...

Worth asking what their resistance achieves for Gazans?...I mean the last conflict just led to a lot of death and then the signing of a ceasefire...after the death of 2,200?...

Its ok for the likes of Mishaal who lives in his mansion in Qatar...

Resistance is a romantic ideal but its usually not that at all...its usually self serving for those at the top of the food chain and achieves very little for the people it claims to represent...

If you can show me how Hamas resistance has benefited the average Gazan I would love to hear it...

And if you took this as a defence for Israel then you miss the point...you have the right wing on both sides doing damage to their own...but Israel is all that gets discussed by the media generally...so its worth adding some balance to the discussion and showing that the side Israel is fighting are far from angels...

But this is a difficult conversation to have with you considering if I remember rightly you believe in collective punishment of all Israelis and view them all as legitimate targets...

If we get another attack here in Britain i wonder if you will make the same argument...considering Britains foreign policy worldwide...

You sound pretty much like the minister of propapganda for Israel or the hundreds of online workers they are paying for furthering their nonsense. If you're not getting paid , I suggest you apply so you are at least earning while defending Israel.

Firstly the thread is regarding Israel and how it's uses proxy methods to shift the thinking towards their beliefs. You write there should be BALANCE, this is laughable on it's own due to the nature of this conflict which is between one of the biggest armies in the world which is protected by the biggest army ever. The bigger power known as the state of Israel, is usuing it's advanced military might and it's influence in the mainstream western media to continue the oppresssion and occupation of a people who have no real powerful allies, little influence in the media and no military might to defend themselves against state terrorism which has been on-going for decades. To use the word balance should be almost embarrasing to someone who claims to be a teacher. Instead of trying to derail this thraed, if you truly believe there is a balance in this conflict and both sides share equal blame, please start a new thread and defend this position. I will be happy to address all your points there.
 
You sound pretty much like the minister of propapganda for Israel or the hundreds of online workers they are paying for furthering their nonsense. If you're not getting paid , I suggest you apply so you are at least earning while defending Israel.

Firstly the thread is regarding Israel and how it's uses proxy methods to shift the thinking towards their beliefs. You write there should be BALANCE, this is laughable on it's own due to the nature of this conflict which is between one of the biggest armies in the world which is protected by the biggest army ever. The bigger power known as the state of Israel, is usuing it's advanced military might and it's influence in the mainstream western media to continue the oppresssion and occupation of a people who have no real powerful allies, little influence in the media and no military might to defend themselves against state terrorism which has been on-going for decades. To use the word balance should be almost embarrasing to someone who claims to be a teacher. Instead of trying to derail this thraed, if you truly believe there is a balance in this conflict and both sides share equal blame, please start a new thread and defend this position. I will be happy to address all your points there.

The old Hasbara position which one takes when their beloved Hamas are being attacked...

If you do notice I haven't denied that Israel has used indiscriminate force...and they have been rightly criticised for it...the problem with ONLY doing that is you fail to see the flaws and crimes of the other side...

Before we continue discussion...do you believe the targeting of Israeli civilians is ok?...at least then we know the parameters of the discussion...
 
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The old Hasbara position which one takes when their beloved Hamas are being attacked...

If you do notice I haven't denied that Israel has used indiscriminate force...and they have been rightly criticised for it...the problem with ONLY doing that is you fail to see the flaws and crimes of the other side...

Before we continue discussion...do you believe the targeting of Israeli civilians is ok?...at least then we know the parameters of the discussion...

I don't fail to see any crimes from any side and there is nowhere I have suggested that I do.

It depends what you believe is a civilian. Usually a civilian is someone who is not part of the armed/security forces but as you well know in Israel every person is obliged to carry out military service.
 
I don't fail to see any crimes from any side and there is nowhere I have suggested that I do.

It depends what you believe is a civilian. Usually a civilian is someone who is not part of the armed/security forces but as you well know in Israel every person is obliged to carry out military service.

But you do and its because you hide behind that definition...

In short by law a civilian is not a legitimate target...now in this case you have decided to widen the definition of civilian...

In order to ensure respect for and protection of the civilian population and civilian objects, the Parties to the conflict shall at all times distinguish between the civilian population and combatants, and between civilian objects and military objectives, and accordingly shall direct their operations only against military objectives.

Military objectives as those objects which by nature, location and purpose actually contribute to the military effort...can you explain to me how killing a group of guys who have completed military service and have joined civilian life is contributing to the military effort at the time of attack?...surely it makes more sense to attack SOLDIERS ON DUTY...than potential soldiers no?...

But first you're making out that Hamas are actually making this a concern...religious Jews do not do military service, there are children who obviously arent in the miltary, those who have retired, those who are mentally ill or not physically able to do military service etc...and Hamas claim that these are non-combatants sometimes yet their rockets are always indiscriminate...are you trying to tell me that their attacks distinguish between what youre arguing is a combatant and what isnt?...

As for reservists again...

Point is this...by law...reserve or off duty soldiers are civilians UNLESS they are directly taking part in hostilities or become subject to military command...

And this is what Hamas argue sometimes and its patently absurd actually...but Hamas cant make up their mind sometimes...because they also make the argument that they are aiming for military targets but sometimes hit civilians...so which one is it?...

Maybe you agree with Yassin who has decided all Israelis are legitimate targets...

"The Geneva Convention protects civilians in occupied territories, not civilians who are in fact occupiers. All of Israel, Tel Aviv included, is occupied Palestine. So we're not actually targeting civilians-that would go against Islam."

I mean hes widened the definition of combatant to include everyone in Israel there...

If you are wondering about the legal status of settlements...they are themselves illegal but that doesnt negate the right to life of the civilians there...who are still civilians...unless they take up arms and engage in hostilities...

Theres one justification that you have failed to mention which Hamas likes to bring up as a justification...and that is imbalance of means...its a nonsensical argument because war never has two sides with identical means...one side is stronger than the other but the rules of law apply...

This is for starters...we haven't even discussed their crimes in terms of deliberately putting their own in danger...or even human rights in Gaza in regards to the various factions who abuse the populace...
 
But you do and its because you hide behind that definition...

In short by law a civilian is not a legitimate target...now in this case you have decided to widen the definition of civilian...



Military objectives as those objects which by nature, location and purpose actually contribute to the military effort...can you explain to me how killing a group of guys who have completed military service and have joined civilian life is contributing to the military effort at the time of attack?...surely it makes more sense to attack SOLDIERS ON DUTY...than potential soldiers no?...

But first you're making out that Hamas are actually making this a concern...religious Jews do not do military service, there are children who obviously arent in the miltary, those who have retired, those who are mentally ill or not physically able to do military service etc...and Hamas claim that these are non-combatants sometimes yet their rockets are always indiscriminate...are you trying to tell me that their attacks distinguish between what youre arguing is a combatant and what isnt?...

As for reservists again...

Point is this...by law...reserve or off duty soldiers are civilians UNLESS they are directly taking part in hostilities or become subject to military command...

And this is what Hamas argue sometimes and its patently absurd actually...but Hamas cant make up their mind sometimes...because they also make the argument that they are aiming for military targets but sometimes hit civilians...so which one is it?...

Maybe you agree with Yassin who has decided all Israelis are legitimate targets...



I mean hes widened the definition of combatant to include everyone in Israel there...

If you are wondering about the legal status of settlements...they are themselves illegal but that doesnt negate the right to life of the civilians there...who are still civilians...unless they take up arms and engage in hostilities...

Theres one justification that you have failed to mention which Hamas likes to bring up as a justification...and that is imbalance of means...its a nonsensical argument because war never has two sides with identical means...one side is stronger than the other but the rules of law apply...

This is for starters...we haven't even discussed their crimes in terms of deliberately putting their own in danger...or even human rights in Gaza in regards to the various factions who abuse the populace...

You seem to be deluded into thinking I'm speaking on behalf of Hamas or agree with them.

Any person who has been part illegal/immoral occupation cannot claim to be an innocent civilian. If you believe otherwise, you're entitled to your opinion.

You keep saying you haven't discussed the crimes of Palestinians but where have you detailed the crimes the of the oppressors first? Care to list those or is that too difficult for you? I assume you agree Israel is the oppressor in this conflict?
 
[MENTION=133972]shaykh[/MENTION]
This thread is about Israel's (very successful) attempts, in conjunction with those of the pro Israel Jewish lobby in the UK, including within Parliament itself, at subverting the British democratic processes by maligning and planning to 'take down' UK Government Ministers, Members of Parliament, the Leader of the Opposition, and anyone else who disagrees with Israeli policies.

So why are you doing your utmost to try and derail the thread? If you wish to discuss Hezbollah's, or Iran's, or Russia's actions in Syria then why not go ahead and start a thread on that topic instead of trying to derail this one which is on a totally different topic?

[MENTION=43583]KingKhanWC[/MENTION] - Don't indulge him.
 
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Over 7000 signatories to this petition now. Needs over 10k for Government response.

With Leader of Opposition and even Tory MPs/Commentators calling for Inquiry hard to see how they can turn it down without exposing themselves as being servile to Zionist interests.
 
All a part of the democratic process. We can only keep raising awareness and escalating complaints. Not for us to know which straw will break the camels back.
 
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en-gb"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Pro-Israel groups in the UK complained about our journalism. Here’s what happened <a href="https://t.co/2DEQUx0D5d">https://t.co/2DEQUx0D5d</a> <a href="https://t.co/dWDq4c6pUH">pic.twitter.com/dWDq4c6pUH</a></p>— Al Jazeera English (@AJEnglish) <a href="https://twitter.com/AJEnglish/status/917344424333524992?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">9 October 2017</a></blockquote>
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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en-gb"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">With investigation about to blow lid off Israeli meddling, <a href="https://twitter.com/claytonswisher?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@claytonswisher</a> wonders if elite US media will notice <a href="https://t.co/qVPvx0r0AI">https://t.co/qVPvx0r0AI</a> <a href="https://t.co/t8iSxqECGm">pic.twitter.com/t8iSxqECGm</a></p>— Max Blumenthal (@MaxBlumenthal) <a href="https://twitter.com/MaxBlumenthal/status/917498637491556354?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">9 October 2017</a></blockquote>
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