"It’s too soon to write me off as a bowler" : Mohammad Abbas

[Abid Z]

I saw Aqib in 1992 WC the first time lol. I am not that young. He was never a good test bowler. averaged in 34-35 in test. ODIs was a different story and he was used by the planners as a "opener remover" with his outswing with new bowl. Aqib did not have the wicket attacking capability that is required for tests.

Nothing can change the fact that Aqib failed in tests just like nothing can change the fact that Abbas is bit downgraded version of Asif, averages 22 and if was given chances at right age instead of relying upon Imran Khan Jnr, Rahat Ali, Irfan, he could easily be the fourth Pakistani pacer to reach 200 test wickets at 21-23 like average. But we decided to rely upon any circus performer in PSL and Naseem, Musa, Dhani happened.

You are making too many overlapping points so let me be a little concise.

Abbas bowls with a horrible attack and a very mediocre captain. This is true.
Abbas is a downgrade on asif this is true. It’s a fact that he is many levels a downgrade just not a little bit of a downgrade.
Abbas has no ready replacement so his place is pretty much assured (like a younger hafeez)
As far as skills and prerequisites of a L&L bowler abbas doesn’t have a) the ability to move the ball away from rhb, ability to get bounce, be a threat after 10 overs etc etc. He has a low average after 23 tests but I’m sure Sami had a pretty good average after the first few tests. But average is irrelevant here. He’s playing against a bad team.

 

[Itachi]

?

I said what made him great,

Yes. You wrote the REASONS why he was GREAT according to you. So you do consider him as a GREAT bowler. That was the point I was writing to the other poster.

 

[MesonK]

What was this then?

not my qoute

 

[Itachi]

not my qoute

This is what you stated,

and nobody called Abbas a great bowler either.

Next time, read the thread properly before writing something.

 

[Saj]

Second and third spells are a problem when the ball isn't new.

Lack of pace and movement without the new ball means he's a lot less effective.

 

[Saj]

Lacked that cutting edge when his team needed it today.

Never really looked like he would trouble the Windies batsmen.

 

[NauV]

Second and third spells are a problem when the ball isn't new.

Lack of pace and movement without the new ball means he's a lot less effective.

100% Saj. He's an enigma . . he's really good when the ball is new and the pitch is supportive . . but once the ball goes old, he's quite easily neutralized . . as proven in Eng and NZ (2 countries which suit his kinda bowling), he was neutralized by batters batting 2m outside the crease . . WI realized that in the 2nd innings too . . so I am not quite sure where I stand with Abbas . . can you really play a bowler who's good only in the first 20 overs?

 

[Titan24]

He is the kind of bowler who will keep on testing the basic technique of the batsmen and can get few wickets with the new ball on his day. However, he is very limited with his current pace and becomes just a end holder after first 5,6 overs.

Not the kind of bowler who will snatch victory from the opposition and make his team the winner, yes pre shoulder injury in conditions where ball was reversing he was able to do that here and there.

Pak selectors and management need to question if he is the kind of bowler who can take Pakistan to the top 3 in test rankings?

 

[Rana]

Total waste of a spot, and he can’t bat or field to save his life!

He isn’t Test class at all, he isn’t good enough to be an international cricketer with his overall poor standards

 

[mazkhan]

I've said it before this guy is one of those uncles who drives a taxi in the UK and plays local league cricket in the UK he is not intl quality or any way a fast bowler or athlete.

 

[Shazzam]

What makes Abbas a great bowler is that in one Test match he can make his fans go from chest thumping to dead silent. Only he as a bowler can achieve this feat.

 

[Energy]

Akshay Khanna has had his best days past him when he could clock slightly over 80mph and that gave him the edge. Now it's just pies and peas.

 

[waqar goraya]

There is no other test class specialist fast bowler whose average speed is 122 kph.

 

[TheSultan]

Exactly - 122kph. You cannot survive in International Cricket at that pace as a frontline bowler. Even Part timers like Ganguly bowled this pace!

 

[Mamoon]

He is embarrassing to watch.

He looks like a 45 year old uncle who has never played any sports in his life and has zero athleticism.

He cannot contribute anything with the bat and in the field.

The fact that cricketers like him are representing Pakistan really shows how much we have regressed as a cricket nation.

 

[gazza619]

He is embarrassing to watch.

He looks like a 45 year old uncle who has never played any sports in his life and has zero athleticism.

He cannot contribute anything with the bat and in the field.

The fact that cricketers like him are representing Pakistan really shows how much we have regressed as a cricket nation.

Exactly my thoughts. The fact that he is a number 11 and not a number 8 makes his selection even more mind boggling.

But I guess he will keep fooling us with his low bowling average.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

Yes. You wrote the REASONS why he was GREAT according to you. So you do consider him as a GREAT bowler. That was the point I was writing to the other poster.

I don't. So please don't misrepresent my views just because you failed to understand what I was saying.

I know what I said and deliberately using the first five lines of my entire post just to prove to others that you didn't misunderstand what I said won't change that.

 

[shaz619]

Even for those who admire his bowling, is it that good you are happy with him being a massive liability in the field to the point where it poses serious consequences as far as winning a Test is concerned ? there are many things out of Pakistan’s loop which will not be solved over night but there is no excuse for shambolic fielding

 

[Bewal Express]

Lacked that cutting edge when his team needed it today.

Never really looked like he would trouble the Windies batsmen.

It was the same point I made before the NZ tour.

 

[mastimasti]

Even for those who admire his bowling, is it that good you are happy with him being a massive liability in the field to the point where it poses serious consequences as far as winning a Test is concerned ? there are many things out of Pakistan’s loop which will not be solved over night but there is no excuse for shambolic fielding

Are you serious? Hasan dropped a catch as well and that was far easier.

Abbas is a terrific bowler and it's mind blowing how many times he skimmed the bat and the wicket. Some of those LBWs were umpires call and could have gone either way. He took 3 for 70 in the match while bowling 34 overs at an economy of about 2.

Some Pakistani fans on this forum have no clue.

 

[ask_analyse_act]

If he can increase his pace , he will be very effective.

Well that is the job of a bowling coach to try and improve his speed.

Except Hasnain who has lost of lot of weight and looks lean , I don’t see any improvement on any bowler.

Pakistan should move on from Waqar. He is a TTF as a coach and very poor leader of men, which was clearly evident from his captaincy days.

 

[Bewal Express]

If he can increase his pace , he will be very effective.

Well that is the job of a bowling coach to try and improve his speed.

Except Hasnain who has lost of lot of weight and looks lean , I don’t see any improvement on any bowler.

Pakistan should move on from Waqar. He is a TTF as a coach and very poor leader of men, which was clearly evident from his captaincy days.

He can't increase his pace because if he could he would have done it. If he tries to bowl outside his bodies limitations, he will get injuries and he still wants to play FC to earn a living.

 

[shaz619]

Are you serious? Hasan dropped a catch as well and that was far easier.

Abbas is a terrific bowler and it's mind blowing how many times he skimmed the bat and the wicket. Some of those LBWs were umpires call and could have gone either way. He took 3 for 70 in the match while bowling 34 overs at an economy of about 2.

Some Pakistani fans on this forum have no clue.

Am not a fan but some of you guys are either too stupid or just ignorant. I have been following Abbas in county cricket to, he is not good enough for the Test level beyond his opening spell with the new ball in his hand, he is a massive liability in the field and ultimately cost his country severely in the end with his horrible fielding, he couldn’t be relied upon in the end either to clean up the tail, instead the 1st change took his position to do that job - Abbas in no shape or form eases the work load for Shaheen and Hassan, I fear these two are high risk injury targets for the future. Unfortunately for you, I don’t believe there are serviceable alternatives but Pak will need to take a gamble then stick with the zero penetration outside his first spell and horrific fielding.

 

[The Scorer]

He does not have the physique to compensate for his lack of pace. You can get away with bowling 122km-130km if you have the height of someone like Ollie Robinson of England who is 6'5", he will still be a threat because of bounce. For Abbas to be successful he needs everything to be perfect, good seam position and great accuracy.

But even then after the first spell, he becomes innocuous. His lack of physical attributes has cost him, he lacks power, though he has everything else, great application a superb skill set. But sometimes one weakness can be fatal, and Pakistan do need to look beyond him now.

 

[mastimasti]

Am not a fan but some of you guys are either too stupid or just ignorant. I have been following Abbas in county cricket to, he is not good enough for the Test level beyond his opening spell with the new ball in his hand, he is a massive liability in the field and ultimately cost his country severely in the end with his horrible fielding, he couldn’t be relied upon in the end either to clean up the tail, instead the 1st change took his position to do that job - Abbas in no shape or form eases the work load for Shaheen and Hassan, I fear these two are high risk injury targets for the future. Unfortunately for you, I don’t believe there are serviceable alternatives but Pak will need to take a gamble then stick with the zero penetration outside his first spell and horrific fielding.

He's not in shape but took 3 wickets, economy of barely 2 and bowled 34 overs. You seem so filled with hate, are you ok?

 

[Energy]

Pleasantly surprised to see die-hard fans for Abbas, with words like terrific, fantastic being used on this page. Looks like Abbas' has friends and family using the forum.

 

[Shazzam]

He's not in shape but took 3 wickets, economy of barely 2 and bowled 34 overs. You seem so filled with hate, are you ok?

How is three wickets taken from 34 overs any good? Did those wickets win Pakistan the match? I don’t think so.

 

[gazza619]

The key for me to this debate on Abbass or any other debate related to any other player is that did we win against WI? We didnt, hence players are to blame.

You look at the WI batting order and it only like a minnow batting order with not a single world class player. So Abbass was really not a hero taking 3 wickets at an economy of 2.

 

[mastimasti]

The key for me to this debate on Abbass or any other debate related to any other player is that did we win against WI? We didnt, hence players are to blame.

You look at the WI batting order and it only like a minnow batting order with not a single world class player. So Abbass was really not a hero taking 3 wickets at an economy of 2.

Who said he is a hero? Pakistan lost

My response is to the claim that he is useless, should be dropped, is not fit enough and all that nonsense.

Abbas bowled very well, was unlucky not to get the edge a lot and is a genuinely good new ball bowler. Unless Pakistan has some Mohammad Asif's lying around, he can't be dropped, especially with the Duke's ball.

Abbas' current test career stands 2 matches, 87 wickets, an average of 22 and when Pakistan win, an average of just 14. But yes, he is rubbish

Pakistan's loss came because they were about 50 runs short and the batsmen need to be blamed for that. When it came to the final innings, 4 chances were not taking. Chance one was Blackwood on about 30 odd, who would go on to score a half century and the edge was not picked up for some reason, and 3 dropped catches: 2 were difficult and one was a sitter. Guess who dropped the sitter?

Happy for you to pull out 5 more bowlers in Pakistan who have the stats and performances Abbas does who should replace him?

 

[ElRaja]

abbas is a good bowler but hes at his ceiling, hes not tall enough or quick enough to trouble world class batsmen if they bat out of the crease to him.

should keep him around as a squad bowler back up, but i wouldnt mind dahani getting a go, espeically if the pitch is like the first test, would be favourable conditions to give him a debut.

 

[TeymurBlake]

His pace has regressed and doesn't do enough on pacers pitches.

 

[MenInG]

Waqar Younis praising Abbas:

"I thought that Mohammad Abbas bowled beautifully; There are some days in Test cricket where luck deserts you and I feel that the way Abbas bowled, he should have taken a lot more wickets than he did; He was beating the bat but no edges were happening but that is part of the game; I have no doubt that Abbas is a wonderful professional in the way he puts in the effort; He bowled well but could not take as many wickets as we expected him to take and that is fine with me"

 

[Zaz]

You cant bowl at 75mph and only be limited to the new ball Hes just too dimensional and easy to see off

If he cant bowl at least on avge 82mph hed got no business being selected

The lack of penetration from him once the ball gets old is awful for someone whos supposed to be the spearhead of the team

 

[Titan24]

You cant bowl at 75mph and only be limited to the new ball Hes just too dimensional and easy to see off

If he cant bowl at least on avge 82mph hed got no business being selected

The lack of penetration from him once the ball gets old is awful for someone whos supposed to be the spearhead of the team

Absolutely. If bowling good lines and lengths is the sole target than yes Abbas bowled well and doubt many in world cricket can match his accuracy but, what is the end result? Abbas averaged 35 in Eng in 2020, 45 in NZ while maintaining good economies of less than 2.5. No wicket in Aus.

This kind of bowling at 125 kph wont be able to get you 20 wickets in test cricket on most surfaces.

 

[JaDed]

Man i have been long enough on this forum to
see how much hype he got after 6 months, not his fault he did the best for his potential but if I was to go and check old threads it would be sad to see his fall.

 

[BunnyRabbit]

He couldn't trouble WI batters on that pitch, nothing but a defensive bowler after his first spell. Suffers from Sohail Khan syndrome. But Sohail would actually take wickets during his first spell.
Maybe Waqas Maqsood could be called up for the next test series whenever it is.

 

[Titan24]

Man i have been long enough on this forum to
see how much hype he got after 6 months, not his fault he did the best for his potential but if I was to go and check old threads it would be sad to see his fall.

To be honest he was really good when he first came into the seen. His average pace was higher and was consistently around 130 kph - Early 130s mark, thats enough to keep the batsman in check with his level of accuracy and skillset. He had an unfortunate shoulder injury in 2018 and since than his natural zip and pace has gone down and now he is in mid to late 120s more often than not.

 

[Last Monetarist]

He's got a couple of vital breakthroughs today, bowling tightly as is customary.

 

[Firebat]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-partner="tweetdeck"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">2 wickets in 2 balls from Mohammad Abbas! <br><br>He will be on a hat-trick when he begins his next over!<br><br>WI 105/6 (39.0), trail by 197 runs.<a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/WIvPAK?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#WIvPAK</a> <a href="https://t.co/eW1zEjCks8">pic.twitter.com/eW1zEjCks8</a></p>— PakPassion.net (@PakPassion) <a href="https://twitter.com/PakPassion/status/1429842208451141639?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">August 23, 2021</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[Firebat]

3 absolutely crucial and quick strikes from Abbas. Brilliant bowling.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-partner="tweetdeck"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Mohammad Abbas traps Da Silva lbw to get his 3rd wicket! <br><br>WI 116/8 (45.0), trail by 186 runs.<a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/WIvPAK?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#WIvPAK</a> <a href="https://t.co/knBIZm3kNV">pic.twitter.com/knBIZm3kNV</a></p>— PakPassion.net (@PakPassion) <a href="https://twitter.com/PakPassion/status/1429849963488587776?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">August 23, 2021</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[The_KING]

He is a good bowler. If only he bowled at 130-135 mph instead of 125 mph, he would be a deadly bowler.

 

[shamaan]

He's got a couple of vital breakthroughs today, bowling tightly as is customary.

His first spell and second spell was really good but he didn't get the rewards

 

[NauV]

He is a good bowler. If only he bowled at 130-135 mph instead of 125 mph, he would be a deadly bowler.

That's literally the difference between him and Glenn Mcgrath . . Many others have tried to do this at a higher pace and failed . . . to do what Abbas does consistently at 135 kph is what greatness looks like (i.e. Glenn Mcgrath)

 

[adarsh_bang]

He’s only 31?
I always thought he’s much older!

He’s nearing 100 test wickets and might even take it to 150 if he plays another 2 years or 3

Which is a decent effort!

Almost McGrath-isque line and length

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

Even if Abbas takes 9-55 people here will be complaining about his lack of pace. Or how he could have taken all 10 if he was 10 kph faster.

Get over it already. Not everyone has to live up to your expectation of a pacer. As long as he is taking wickets, he is doing his job. And clearly his style of bowling works for him.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

Also, how do you guys know Abbas will be more deadly if he bowled faster? What's to say he won't just lose his shape or consistency, if he starts bowling faster? What to say he won't start getting injured since he has bowled at a certain pace his entire career?

Sorry but unless you're Nostradamus you have no way of predicting that. So just be happy and cherish the fact that he is bowling well and taking wickets. Instead of needlessly nitpicking every little thing that isn't up to your expectations.

 

[shamaan]

Also, how do you guys know Abbas will be more deadly if he bowled faster? What's to say he won't just lose his shape or consistency, if he starts bowling faster? What to say he won't start getting injured since he has bowled at a certain pace his entire career?

Sorry but unless you're Nostradamus you have no way of predicting that. So just be happy and cherish the fact that he is bowling well and taking wickets. Instead of needlessly nitpicking every little thing that isn't up to your expectations.

Exactly his strength is his line and length and seam movement if he did bowl faster he may not get the same results

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

At the end of the day people can say what they want to say about Abbas but numbers don't lie.

No Pakistani bowler has taken more Test wickets at a better average than Abbas.

Best bowling average for Pakistan (min 75 wickets)

1. Mohammad Abbas - 22.6
2. Imran Khan - 22.8
3. Waqar Younis - 23.6
4. Wasim Akram - 23.6

 

[Super Santi]

Not a Pakistan fan so do not watch as much as the majority of people here.
Surprised to see the negativity given his figures.
Good average, skilful and accurate bowler.
From the other bowlers i have seen selected in recent series' i don't think Pakistan has anyone better at the moment.

 

[UzmanBeast]

Abbas is a good bowler when the ball is doing something. When it isn't, I wouldn't place my cards on him.

The point is that whilst he has done decently here in the West Indies, he has not performed up to the mark of a senior bowler as we would come to expect. He was ripping through players in the county circuit, so ideally, he should have been amongst the top wicket-takers of the series, but he isn't.

Abbas is barely giving us more wickets per game (right now) than Faheem Ashraf. In terms of what both provide, they have almost the exact same skillset, but I would always back Faheem Ashraf ahead of Abbas because of the value he brings to me with the bat.

If Abbas was a better batsman, there would be no discussion, but the issue is that as an entire package, he is lacking in quite a few areas. He can't bend his back when fielding, he is useless with the bat, and he does not take wickets when batsmen stand outside the crease or when the ball goes old.

If you compare just bowling skillset, Abbas is ahead of Faheem but it's not a gap that Faheem can't fill if he puts in the hard work. Right now, there is nothing that tells me that Abbas is an invaluable member of this squad, and it would be hard for most to accept even if his bowling stats are as good as shown.

Abbas is nowhere near the quality of players like Imran Khan, Waqar Younis, or Wasim Akram. Ever since his injury, his bowling has become more, and more toothless.

The real test of Abbas isn't against the West Indies on a seaming track with the Duke's ball, no, the real test will be what he does in conditions that don't assist his bowling.

The more pressing issue is to deal with our openers, but a decision will be taken on Abbas as well.

Let's see how he fares in today's spell, whether or not he can prove me and many others wrong about his skills with the old ball.

 

[ElRaja]

people are too polarised about him, he is not a terrible bowler, neither is he as dangeorous as his stats suggest.

new zealand and south africa showed that if you bat out the crease to him you reduce his effectiveness significantly.

he merits a place in a bowling attack which is ok, but he is not a long term solution. whilst you can imagine both shaheen and hassan potentially improving with experience abbas has shown that he is very uni dimensional, which isn't a bad thing cos it makes him a consistent and economical bowler but limits his effectiveness against technically sound batsmen.

but his place in the xi should not be guaranteed if a lesser bowler with a higher potential ceiling is knocking on the door, which is not really the case at the moment.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

people are too polarised about him, he is not a terrible bowler, neither is he as dangeorous as his stats suggest.

new zealand and south africa showed that if you bat out the crease to him you reduce his effectiveness significantly.

he merits a place in a bowling attack which is ok, but he is not a long term solution. whilst you can imagine both shaheen and hassan potentially improving with experience abbas has shown that he is very uni dimensional, which isn't a bad thing cos it makes him a consistent and economical bowler but limits his effectiveness against technically sound batsmen.

but his place in the xi should not be guaranteed if a lesser bowler with a higher potential ceiling is knocking on the door, which is not really the case at the moment.

His place in the XI shouldn't;t be guaranteed but his place in every squad should be. If the conditions suit him then select him otherwise he can bowl in the nets/ come in if there are injuries.

Very handy squad bowler and a more than useful horses for courses selection.

 

[shaz619]

At the end of the day people can say what they want to say about Abbas but numbers don't lie.

No Pakistani bowler has taken more Test wickets at a better average than Abbas.

Best bowling average for Pakistan (min 75 wickets)

1. Mohammad Abbas - 22.6
2. Imran Khan - 22.8
3. Waqar Younis - 23.6
4. Wasim Akram - 23.6

His stats are truly incredible but extremely padded due to the insane start he had to his career, like some have already said he has lost like a yard or two of pace and isn't useful when the ball goes soft. Abbas is a one spell bowler and beyond that due to the lack of resource Pakistan have to go back to him because he can keep things tight. He will have a tough time today, I hope he can help Pakistan win the match but unless he takes some key wickets in the morning session - I don't see Abbas having much of an impact later in the day.

Going back to his numbers, surely you'd not pick him over the other legends lol even at his best, I don't think Abbas would ever have had the potential to compare to those greats, maybe the idiot Asif would have if we're thinking about bowlers who are not express but rely on their accuracy and bowling IQ, but you still need a bit of pace and some physical attributes which can help.

 

[OmarKhan99]

At the end of the day people can say what they want to say about Abbas but numbers don't lie.

No Pakistani bowler has taken more Test wickets at a better average than Abbas.

Best bowling average for Pakistan (min 75 wickets)

1. Mohammad Abbas - 22.6
2. Imran Khan - 22.8
3. Waqar Younis - 23.6
4. Wasim Akram - 23.6

I like Abbas quite a bit, especially since he has a big heart and is always trying. Also, I think it's important to contextualize the stats.

Average of each between the age 27-31 (Mohammad Abbas' playing interval so far):

- Imran Khan -> ~16 (139 W's)
- Wasim Akram -> ~20 (155 W's)
- Mohammad Abbas -> ~22 (90 W's)
- Waqar Younis -> ~28 (106 W's) [retired at 31]

Since the other three did start much earlier, and were therefore more developed by 27, here are each of the bowler's averages when they got to 90 dismissals:

- Waqar Younis -> ~19
- Mohammad Abbas -> ~22
- Wasim Akram -> ~32
- Imran Khan -> ~32

Take from what you will. By any metric, Abbas is doing well. I am sure the other three also had the 'novelty factor' that is often associated with Abbas, so they're on level playing field on that front. Abbas may not be a IK/Wasim/Waqar but calls of him being rubbish are harsh and untrue.

 

[Savak]

You need to look at Abbas stats in his final 10-12 test matches. He got off to a bang at the start of his career in 2017 and 2018 which is why his overall stats look impressive still but if you watch his day to day bowling now and his declining stats in his final 10-12 test matches, you can clearly see he is a much declined bowler that the opposition find it very easy to negotiate.

 

[mazkhan]

Can't do much with the old ball

I'd rather invest in some young bowler like dhani or hasnain , who are tall and got good pace and have some ability that can be further developed under the right coach or mentor.

Abbas dibbly dobbly role can be fulfilled by faheem ashraf .

 

[Super Santi]

I like Abbas quite a bit, especially since he has a big heart and is always trying. Also, I think it's important to contextualize the stats.

Average of each between the age 27-31 (Mohammad Abbas' playing interval so far):

- Imran Khan -> ~16 (139 W's)
- Wasim Akram -> ~20 (155 W's)
- Mohammad Abbas -> ~22 (90 W's)
- Waqar Younis -> ~28 (106 W's) [retired at 31]

Since the other three did start much earlier, and were therefore more developed by 27, here are each of the bowler's averages when they got to 90 dismissals:

- Waqar Younis -> ~19
- Mohammad Abbas -> ~22
- Wasim Akram -> ~32
- Imran Khan -> ~32

Take from what you will. By any metric, Abbas is doing well. I am sure the other three also had the 'novelty factor' that is often associated with Abbas, so they're on level playing field on that front. Abbas may not be a IK/Wasim/Waqar but calls of him being rubbish are harsh and untrue.

Imran Khan's average

 

[Titan24]

He has got just 29 wickets in last 13 test matches with a bowling SR of close to 90 and average in mid 30s.

He got 61 wickets in his first 12 tests!

His decline has been substantial and currently with his struggles I am not sure if he is the bowler who can help Pak compete with top 4 sides.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

I like Abbas quite a bit, especially since he has a big heart and is always trying. Also, I think it's important to contextualize the stats.

Average of each between the age 27-31 (Mohammad Abbas' playing interval so far):

- Imran Khan -> ~16 (139 W's)
- Wasim Akram -> ~20 (155 W's)
- Mohammad Abbas -> ~22 (90 W's)
- Waqar Younis -> ~28 (106 W's) [retired at 31]

Since the other three did start much earlier, and were therefore more developed by 27, here are each of the bowler's averages when they got to 90 dismissals:

- Waqar Younis -> ~19
- Mohammad Abbas -> ~22
- Wasim Akram -> ~32
- Imran Khan -> ~32

Take from what you will. By any metric, Abbas is doing well. I am sure the other three also had the 'novelty factor' that is often associated with Abbas, so they're on level playing field on that front. Abbas may not be a IK/Wasim/Waqar but calls of him being rubbish are harsh and untrue.

His stats are truly incredible but extremely padded due to the insane start he had to his career, like some have already said he has lost like a yard or two of pace and isn't useful when the ball goes soft. Abbas is a one spell bowler and beyond that due to the lack of resource Pakistan have to go back to him because he can keep things tight. He will have a tough time today, I hope he can help Pakistan win the match but unless he takes some key wickets in the morning session - I don't see Abbas having much of an impact later in the day.

Going back to his numbers, surely you'd not pick him over the other legends lol even at his best, I don't think Abbas would ever have had the potential to compare to those greats, maybe the idiot Asif would have if we're thinking about bowlers who are not express but rely on their accuracy and bowling IQ, but you still need a bit of pace and some physical attributes which can help.

The aim of mentioning these stats was not to compare Abbas to three of the greatest fast-bowlers to ever play for Pakistan. But rather to show that eventhough his form has been very up and down in the past year, even then he is doing better at this point of his career than literally anyone in Pakistan's history. At the end of the day, numbers are numbers. And Abbas's numbers are outstanding...by any metric.

And if anything, he showed his worth in this series on numerous occasions, stepping up when Pakistan needed him. Like any bowler he has flaws, but I don't see why he has to be under laser focus despite averaging 22 with the ball. If he falls away after a period of time than you are welcome to read the eulogy of his career. But it makes no sense to criticize him when he's a million times better than most fast-bowlers in the Pakistani domestic set-up.

 

[Bewal Express]

Offers nothing and also takes ends up hurting Hasan Ali's bowling.

 

[GreenKhan]

It seems only some Pakistani fans don’t appreciate the skill of Abbas. The commentators were praising his skill and control aplenty in the first innings and were absolutely delighted when he got his wickets .

Abbas is a skilled operator and offers variety to our bowling . Because he is not express he does not pass the “ eye test” for some people but he brings control to our bowling even when he is not taking wickets .

 

[Titan24]

It seems only some Pakistani fans don’t appreciate the skill of Abbas. The commentators were praising his skill and control aplenty in the first innings and were absolutely delighted when he got his wickets .

Abbas is a skilled operator and offers variety to our bowling . Because he is not express he does not pass the “ eye test” for some people but he brings control to our bowling even when he is not taking wickets .

He is a skillful operator and is extremely accurate. However, when you are taking 15 overs (Sr of around 90) on average to get one wicket which has been the case with him in last 2-3 years than unless you are a finger spinner holding one end in overseas conditions you are not doing a good job. As in test cricket you are supposed to take 20 wickets.

He just isnt taking wickets, 29 wickets in 13 Test matches is really poor. Yes he is economical but, why other bowlers have to be the only ones responsible for wickets? It puts extra pressure on Shaheen and Hassan to get those 20 wickets.

Also what are the realistic expectations from Abbas in Aus, NZ, SA? He was extremely ordinary on Aus and NZ, couldnt even support Shaheen when he was taking some wickets.

He was exceptional when he came into the scene and took 62 wickets in 12 tests. Since then his lack of wickets have been a big issue and as a pacer you cant get away with such lack of potency just because you are accurate and economical in my opinion. WI commies mentioned that as well that he is lacking the zip he used to have since the injury in 2018-19. I hope he can turn it around but, in his current form and shape he is not a bowler who will make Pak compete with top sides.

 

[Bewal Express]

It seems only some Pakistani fans don’t appreciate the skill of Abbas. The commentators were praising his skill and control aplenty in the first innings and were absolutely delighted when he got his wickets .

Abbas is a skilled operator and offers variety to our bowling . Because he is not express he does not pass the “ eye test” for some people but he brings control to our bowling even when he is not taking wickets .

There is nothing terrible about his bowling and has some assets but he was up against a very weak batting line, probably the weakest in international cricket. As we saw against SA when Hasan was given the responsibility, he came up trumps, and we won.
For me the turning point was that he failed to turn up in the 2nd innings at OT last year, if an experienced bowler wilts under pressure, you look at others. In the 2nd inning in the 1st test, he also failed to take a wicket.

 

[shamaan]

Abbas is a limited bowler but when the ball is moving around he becomes a handful.

 

[shaz619]

Abbas is a limited bowler but when the ball is moving around he becomes a handful.

Most top teams have figured him out

 

[shah_1]

Tbh he bowled a lot better than last year. I don't expect much from him when he is bowling with Kokabura ball. Dhani should be groomed

 

[Shoaibbtt]

Tbh he bowled a lot better than last year. I don't expect much from him when he is bowling with Kokabura ball. Dhani should be groomed

Dukes is used in WI

 

[PakHammer]

Most top teams have figured him out

Yeah they bat out of the crease to counter his movement as he has not got the pace to bounce them for doing that.

Buttler did this well to Abbas when him and Woakes chased down that winning target in England last summer.

 

[Caved12]

He has everything to become a top 5 bowler in test cricket, but this guy just refuses to work on his physique. I repeat all his problems are fitness and pace related.

Btw how do we continue to bring back players with zero improvements?

 

[shah_1]

Dukes is used in WI

I know this

That is why he shouldn't play with Kokabura ball. His overseas record apart from Australia series in UAE is awful to say the least.

 

[Shoaibbtt]

I know this

That is why he shouldn't play with Kokabura ball. His overseas record apart from Australia series in UAE is awful to say the least.

Very true, sometimes you get lucky with him. He did ok in this series but nothing brilliant, we are practically a bowler down after his first 10 overs are done with the new ball.

 

[MesonK]

Pakistani fans deserve Musa Khan and Naseem Shah from PSL circus.

Abbas is a class above these PSL boys. Nobody understands the amount of dropped catches off his bowling in NZ tour that got him dropped.

 

[TheSultan]

I agree it’s too early to write him off as a bowler. He should continue his career as a spinner. He already almost bowls the right pace and the flight he gets is impressive

 

[Hassaan HS]

Video of Mohammad Abbas practicing ahead of the Test series against Australia
<div style="width: 100%; height: 0px; position: relative; padding-bottom: 100%;"><iframe src="https://streamable.com/e/41pjrq" frameborder="0" width="100%" height="100%" allowfullscreen style="width: 100%; height: 100%; position: absolute;"></iframe></div>

 

[MenInG]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-partner="tweetdeck"><p lang="en" dir="ltr"><a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/OnThisDay?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#OnThisDay</a> in 2018. Mohammad Abbas at his best with 8 wickets in the match, 5 for Mohammad Amir and 4 for Hassan Ali as Pakistan comfortably beat England by 9 wickets in a Test match at Lord's <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Cricket?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#Cricket</a> <a href="https://t.co/hfYpjcnkuK">pic.twitter.com/hfYpjcnkuK</a></p>— Saj Sadiq (@SajSadiqCricket) <a href="https://twitter.com/SajSadiqCricket/status/1530091413056241665?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">May 27, 2022</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[MenInG]

40th FC 5fer for Mohammad Abbas:

<div style="width: 100%; height: 0px; position: relative; padding-bottom: 56.250%;"><iframe src="https://streamable.com/e/3s0gn7" frameborder="0" width="100%" height="100%" allowfullscreen style="width: 100%; height: 100%; position: absolute;"></iframe></div>

 

[MenInG]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-partner="tweetdeck"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Mohammad Abbas has today reached the milestone of 600 wickets in First-class cricket. He's reached the figure with a brilliant average of 20.61 and a very good strike-rate of 47.10. <br><br>He's taken 5 wickets in an innings 40 times and 10 wickets in a match 11 times.<a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Cricket?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#Cricket</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/QEAT?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#QEAT</a></p>— Saj Sadiq (@SajSadiqCricket) <a href="https://twitter.com/SajSadiqCricket/status/1586762069885571072?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 30, 2022</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[BunnyRabbit]

With all due respect, he will continue to take wickets in domestic but fail at international level now. His international career is done. Should give the likes of Sameen Gul and Mir Hamza a go in Tests.

 

[Saj]

I thought he might have made the current Test squad given the lack of experience in there.

 

[ElRaja]

I thought he might have made the current Test squad given the lack of experience in there.

what would he have achieved? nz figured him out in the UAE, walk down the track and he's tootheless, theres no way 125kph dibbly dobblers would have any impact on this pitch.

yeh, maybe hed have conceded 20 less runs, but in the context of the game it wouldn't have made a differnece.