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Lack of intent from our middle-order batters is nothing short of criminal

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Usman

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I get it. Our middle order is rubbish. They can’t bat to save their lives.

But the selfishness of these players. The refusal to even try. The thought process that to take singles and get a run a ball 30, just to preserve their place in the team. This is CRIMINAL.

These players deserve to be dropped and replaced by anyone, good or bad, that has the intent to score runs. Anyone who bats like this never ever deserves to play for Pakistan again.
 
Shan, Iftikhar, Khushdil - all three of them had one objective: score a fluke half century and remove any doubts over their selection in the team.

None of them even faked an attempt to try to chase the target.
 
This is natural when you have 4-5 players in the middle order playing for their spots. As much as the team management selects these guys and backs them in press conferences, are they actually given a lot of confidence behind the scenes? This would not be the case if the players are just strictly playing for their spots.
 
This is one of those performances that actually demoralizes a team. Shan looks like hes never held a cricket bat in life, Khushdil for his own sake needs to be removed from the team, and even Asif Ali's given up on trying to hit big shots. Congrats to Shoaib Malik I guess, cause he's definitely going to Australia now.
 
Savak said:
This is natural when you have 4-5 players in the middle order playing for their spots. As much as the team management selects these guys and backs them in press conferences, are they actually given a lot of confidence behind the scenes? This would not be the case if the players are just strictly playing for their spots.
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It is not that simple lol. After a rubbish Asia Cup Ifti and Khushdil were retained and Shan has been given a long rope in this series. They are just rubbish.
 
Mamoon said:
Shan, Iftikhar, Khushdil - all three of them had one objective: score a fluke half century and remove any doubts over their selection in the team.

None of them even faked an attempt to try to chase the target.
Click to expand...

For once, I couldn’t agree more. These guys have played so horrifically tonight, not because they got out, but because they didn’t even try.

I am sorry but I would much rather have 50 year old Hafeez and Malik in this team than the selfish players we have right now.

Savak said:
This is natural when you have 4-5 players in the middle order playing for their spots. As much as the team management selects these guys and backs them in press conferences, are they actually given a lot of confidence behind the scenes? This would not be the case if the players are just strictly playing for their spots.
Click to expand...

You cannot blame the management for this. This is a mindset of playing for yourself rather than your country. It’s something that comes from within - that for me, it is more important that I keep my place in the side than Pakistan win games.

I am ready for all these players to be binned and replaced by absolutely anyone who wants to put country before self.
 
hitthestump said:
It is not that simple lol. After a rubbish Asia Cup Ifti and Khushdil were retained and Shan has been given a long rope in this series. They are just rubbish.
Click to expand...

Salt had struggled for ages but the England Management kept backing him as he clarified in an interview that inspite of his repeated failures, they ordered him that this was his role and this is how they expected him to play and that he doesn't need to change his approach or worry about losing his spot.

Pakistani players don't display the same confidence and attitude. These players selected are our best domestic players. This series has shown up the massive differences in the team think tanks.
 
I think pakistan is the most rubbish team at home among all the big teams. They consistently loose the home series whoever they play. This was like an england A team.
 
Heads need to roll now, what we saw out there today today was pathetic and shameless. Two players simply trying to fluke a spot in the XI with a run a ball 50 rather than having any intention to win the game for their side, a side that millions dream of playing for. Not only that, these guys represent our country, and they’ve portrayed us as chicken hearted, weak and selfish. Should never play even domestic/club cricket again.

We’ve all known for a while that Khushdil is trash and wouldn’t even make the Zimbabwe side, but a special mention needs to be given for Shan Masood. It boils my blood to see him play for Pakistan, he along with Shoaib Malik are the biggest conmen to exist in this game. Everyone repeatedly turns a blind eye to their pathetic stats (both had middling averages with SR’s in the 120’s in the Domestic T20). It’s mind boggling how much support Masood has, he has one of the lowest test averages but keeps being selected there. His T20 stats are nothing special and it’s clear to see he can’t pull his weight against international attacks. But still you’ll have our incredible pundits like Professor Hafeez saying the ‘best middle order batsmen in Pakistan are Shoaib Malik and Shan Masood’
 
They simply don't have the ability

I'd much rather lose with guys like Sharjeel, Azam Khan etc. than these jokers
 
"Middle order" lol. Please get the facts straight. The whole team plays with the pathetic selfish mindset including the openers.
 
Even Zimbabwe and Ireland have a better middle order than Pakistan and are capable of showing more intent. Pakistan probably have the worst middle order in the world amongst all the test playing nations.
 
Problem lies with the Pakistani fans and experts, they ended the careers of certain players calling them reckless, hacks, not valuing their wicket, and accusing them of brainfade whenever they got out trying to hit.

As a result almost all of Pakistani players have got into this mentality of 'valuing their wicket' way too much, because this is the only way they think they will be able to survive in the team.
 
Wasim Akram "The people of Pakistan love and understand cricket. They understand when the team goes for it and loses. But when you are not even trying to win the match, that will definitely hurt the fans"
 
This is extremely embarassing, just get out going to for broke. There’s no second place here.
Shameless display.
 
sam_ahm said:
Problem lies with the Pakistani fans and experts, they ended the careers of certain players calling them reckless, hacks, not valuing their wicket, and accusing them of brainfade whenever they got out trying to hit.

As a result almost all of Pakistani players have got into this mentality of 'valuing their wicket' way too much, because this is the only way they think they will be able to survive in the team.
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You cannot blame fans for this. Shahid Afridi had probably the biggest following of any Pakistani cricketer ever, and he was at most times completely reckless. However the reason the fans supported him is because no matter what, nobody could question Afridi’s intent to try and win Pakistan games. Whether he was capable or not, he never played a game when he never tried.

The current Pakistani team has made a habit of not trying.
 
No desire, pride or commitment today Embarrassing performance They should be ashamed
 
Playing for a place in the team. Bad coach g , bad team environment bad captaincy. Too docile of a team to achieve anything. Absolute shambles
 
D/DAhmed said:
Heads need to roll now, what we saw out there today today was pathetic and shameless. Two players simply trying to fluke a spot in the XI with a run a ball 50 rather than having any intention to win the game for their side, a side that millions dream of playing for. Not only that, these guys represent our country, and they’ve portrayed us as chicken hearted, weak and selfish. Should never play even domestic/club cricket again.

We’ve all known for a while that Khushdil is trash and wouldn’t even make the Zimbabwe side, but a special mention needs to be given for Shan Masood. It boils my blood to see him play for Pakistan, he along with Shoaib Malik are the biggest conmen to exist in this game. Everyone repeatedly turns a blind eye to their pathetic stats (both had middling averages with SR’s in the 120’s in the Domestic T20). It’s mind boggling how much support Masood has, he has one of the lowest test averages but keeps being selected there. His T20 stats are nothing special and it’s clear to see he can’t pull his weight against international attacks. But still you’ll have our incredible pundits like Professor Hafeez saying the ‘best middle order batsmen in Pakistan are Shoaib Malik and Shan Masood’
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Whom would you replace the likes of Khushdil, Iftikhar , Haider etc. with? We don't have any other better options either apart from likes of Shoaib Malik ..
 
What international side plays batsmen in T20 cricket middle order with strike rates of 136 and under, look at the England batters in the middle there strike rates are always over 150
 
Mashallah look at strike rates of Khushdil and Chacha Ifti... seems Pakistan was chasing 110 not 210.
 
shady said:
This is one of those performances that actually demoralizes a team. Shan looks like hes never held a cricket bat in life, Khushdil for his own sake needs to be removed from the team, and even Asif Ali's given up on trying to hit big shots. Congrats to Shoaib Malik I guess, cause he's definitely going to Australia now.
Click to expand...

Asif Ali can only give you quick fire 20 runs and that also not every game, expecting more of him is foolishness. Malik may make some runs but will lose same with his fielding, it's unfortunate that we do not have a replacement 40 year old player.
 
MSaad1237 said:
Whom would you replace the likes of Khushdil, Iftikhar , Haider etc. with? We don't have any other better options either apart from likes of Shoaib Malik ..
Click to expand...

Add Asif Ali to that list as well. That is the problem, we have no one.
 
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-partner="tweetdeck"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Nasser Hussain "if the Pakistan middle-order batters hit one ball out the ground, the next ball goes straight up in the air. That's why Babar Azam and Mohammad Rizwan bat the way they do" <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/PAKvENG?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#PAKvENG</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Cricket?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#Cricket</a></p>— Saj Sadiq (@SajSadiqCricket) <a href="https://twitter.com/SajSadiqCricket/status/1576637936975507457?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 2, 2022</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
 
The reality is that Pakistan's batting is totally reliant on two batters, whilst England can afford to leave out of their T20 World Cup squad, Ben Duckett who averaged 46.60 at a strike-rate of 159.58 in the series against Pakistan.

We simply do not have the players.
 
It is too late now to make any new changes for the WC. A concern even bigger than the middle order has to be the CATCHING. It is absolutely PATHETIC from the so called 'fit' players.

Pakistan had a chance to see how good Aamer Jamal is with the Bat in this series but they didn't even use him up the order, so it has gone waste.

I have said this million times that Sarfaraz cannot do worse than these crap middle order players, moreover he is a very busy player who keeps the strike rotating and has good international experience, yet he keeps getting ignored for the likes of Khushdil, Masood, Iftikhar, Asif Ali... This is clearly a case of favouritism.

Sherjeel won't die wondering, that's for sure.. Yet Ramiz will never let him play for Pak again.

Umer Akmal was a good talent, but now he is wasted because no one liked him. Let me tell you, for all the hate the Akmal brothers got on this forum, they have played many match winning knocks for Pakistan than what this middle order can ever dream of, esp Kamran. I'm not asking for Umer Akmal to make a comeback, I'm just saying the hate he gets is uncalled for.

Anyways, I don't think Pakistan can do anything as of now. They just need to hope bowlers + Babar and Rizwan pull it off at the WC, and somehow miraculously the ball sticks in their hand when catching.
 
Saj said:
The reality is that Pakistan's batting is totally reliant on two batters, whilst England can afford to leave out of their T20 World Cup squad, Ben Duckett who averaged 46.60 at a strike-rate of 159.58 in the series against Pakistan.

We simply do not have the players.
Click to expand...

Lack of talent.
 
The criticism used to be that we chopped and changed every second match and new players were unable to play their natural game as they were scared of being dropped...

You cannot use this argument anymore as Happy Heart, Chacha and Asif have now played match after match, and failed almost every time (not a single T20 50 between them in 3 years)....
 
Saj said:
The reality is that Pakistan's batting is totally reliant on two batters, whilst England can afford to leave out of their T20 World Cup squad, Ben Duckett who averaged 46.60 at a strike-rate of 159.58 in the series against Pakistan.

We simply do not have the players.
Click to expand...

I can think of at least 2 players who can easily do better than this middle order and won't get stuck doing nothing - Sarfaraz and Imad Wasim. That's not counting Azam Khan who had a very good CPL and Sherjeel, who at the very least, won't lack intent.
 
It’s not lack of intent which is the main problem, it’s the fact middle order batsmen can not stay in and have terrible averages.

Khushdil shows far less intent than our openers and averages 20 at an appealing SR. Asif averages 15. Which is one of the worst averages ever seen by a specialist batsman. And all that talk of selflessness, he still only strikes at a few points higher than openers. Iftikhar again, average is pretty poor despite lower SR than openers. Iftikhar is probably the most frustrating who has continually thrown away starts, the others on the other hand are literally struggling to play 10 balls.

We need middle order batsmen who are reliable who can at least score around 130 SR at a respectable average. Then at the very least this will allow our openers to play with more intent, and at least cause our batting line up to not completely sink when the openers get out. Englands openers failed regularly, it didn’t stop their middle order from performing. These middle order can’t even play themselves in to be in the position of to accelerate the run rate regardless of how many overs they are given. When we moan over intent, it’s like complaining about running when we don’t even know how to walk.
 
Lack of talent is a better statement


2022 PSL stats
Haider Ali avg 21 SR 116
Asif Ali avg 13 SR 130
Ifti chacha avg 17 SR 126


What are you expecting?
 
shah_1 said:
Lack of talent is a better statement


2022 PSL stats
Haider Ali avg 21 SR 116
Asif Ali avg 13 SR 130
Ifti chacha avg 17 SR 126


What are you expecting?
Click to expand...

We are the only team in the world that select players based on these stats
 
Rana said:
What about the openers

What intent have they shown?
Click to expand...

The openers chased 200 and won us the game before. Today your low IQ team man had 8 over to play. What did he do again? Couldnt pick googlies again and got out like the brainless hack he is again...at less than 100 sr

I would take Rizwan over 10 asif alis
 
shady said:
This is one of those performances that actually demoralizes a team. Shan looks like hes never held a cricket bat in life, Khushdil for his own sake needs to be removed from the team, and even Asif Ali's given up on trying to hit big shots. Congrats to Shoaib Malik I guess, cause he's definitely going to Australia now.
Click to expand...

Definitely Shaoib Malik will make the squad and I wouldn't be surprised if one of Imad,Sharjeel make the squad.
 
If people still don’t realize that middle order is the problem and complain about openers than I don’t know what to say. Pakistani middle order is a serious problem and frankly speaking Khushdil, Iftikhar and Haider need to go. Not because they are bad batsmen but they are simply not mentally ready to take on a challenge. At this point I think Pakistan would be better off taking a gamble and making a large scale change to bring in some new middle order batsmen.
 
That Salman Agha looked far more assured than them even though it was against Netherlands
 
We do not have a middle order. These are aadhay adhooray players just making up the numbers
 
I can't believe I actually sat through this miserable display. Complete surrender. Crowd should have vilified them more.
 
Without Rizwan and Babar Pakistan team can only score 130-145 max.If Babar and Rizwan don’t get out early on then Pakistan on avg can score 160-170.In contrast England and Australia can score 190+ even if they lose a few early wickets.Their batsmen play with intent and play good shots.Pakistan should not have selected Khushdil and Asif.Ifti Chacha can bowl and score 20-30 runs so his selection may be excused.
 
shah_1 said:
Lack of talent is a better statement


2022 PSL stats
Haider Ali avg 21 SR 116
Asif Ali avg 13 SR 130
Ifti chacha avg 17 SR 126


What are you expecting?
Click to expand...

It’s true these guys don’t even look good in PSL. They aren’t suddenly going to turn into monsters in international cricket.

There’s no real fix. I think arguably Shadab has looked better in PSL than all our middle order batsmen, it might be time to give him a proper middle order spot higher up the order. Was against it before, but I just see so little other talent out there.
 
ads101 said:
It’s true these guys don’t even look good in PSL. They aren’t suddenly going to turn into monsters in international cricket.

There’s no real fix. I think arguably Shadab has looked better in PSL than all our middle order batsmen, it might be time to give him a proper middle order spot higher up the order. Was against it before, but I just see so little other talent out there.
Click to expand...

Good to see you posting again, mate. Totally agree, Shadab should come in at 5.
 
Fenrir said:
Without Rizwan and Babar Pakistan team can only score 130-145 max.If Babar and Rizwan don’t get out early on then Pakistan on avg can score 160-170.In contrast England and Australia can score 190+ even if they lose a few early wickets.Their batsmen play with intent and play good shots.Pakistan should not have selected Khushdil and Asif.Ifti Chacha can bowl and score 20-30 runs so his selection may be excused.
Click to expand...

This is the only chance we have to win anything.

Babar and Rizwan take us to 170 and Shaheen and co defend it.

If our openers don't fire we may as well forfeit.
 
-Playing 11-
01-Saim Ayub
02-Babar Azam
03-M.Rizwan.
04-Haris Sohail
05-Fakhar Zaman
06-Shadab Khan
07-Asif Ali
08-Imad Waseem
09-Haris Rauf
10-M. Hasnain
11-Shaeen Shah Afridi
-Bench-
12-Naseem Shah
13-Shan Masood
14-Sahibzada Farhan
15-M. Nawaz
-Reserve-
16-Sarfaraz Ahmed
17-Haider Ali
18-Aamer Jamal
 
ads101 said:
There’s no real fix. I think arguably Shadab has looked better in PSL than all our middle order batsmen, it might be time to give him a proper middle order spot higher up the order. Was against it before, but I just see so little other talent out there.
Click to expand...

It's been tried and didn't work. Shadab flatters to decieve at international level and mostly finds fresh air when trying to hit big.

We are going round in circles but i understand people are trying to find the least worst option here.
 
sam_ahm said:
It is too late now to make any new changes for the WC. A concern even bigger than the middle order has to be the CATCHING. It is absolutely PATHETIC from the so called 'fit' players.

Pakistan had a chance to see how good Aamer Jamal is with the Bat in this series but they didn't even use him up the order, so it has gone waste.

I have said this million times that Sarfaraz cannot do worse than these crap middle order players, moreover he is a very busy player who keeps the strike rotating and has good international experience, yet he keeps getting ignored for the likes of Khushdil, Masood, Iftikhar, Asif Ali... This is clearly a case of favouritism.

Sherjeel won't die wondering, that's for sure.. Yet Ramiz will never let him play for Pak again.

Umer Akmal was a good talent, but now he is wasted because no one liked him. Let me tell you, for all the hate the Akmal brothers got on this forum, they have played many match winning knocks for Pakistan than what this middle order can ever dream of, esp Kamran. I'm not asking for Umer Akmal to make a comeback, I'm just saying the hate he gets is uncalled for.

Anyways, I don't think Pakistan can do anything as of now. They just need to hope bowlers + Babar and Rizwan pull it off at the WC, and somehow miraculously the ball sticks in their hand when catching.
Click to expand...

No it's not to late becouse the three potential players who may be picked have international experience and playing either domestic or foreign t20 leagues.
 
Lol at the lack of intent. I saw all the batsmen trying to go for it. Pakistani players have too many Achilles heels ie short deliveries, slower deliveries half volley, slower ball bouncers. You have to give full marks to the planning of the English Team Management, they really did their homework on each and every Pakistani batsmen identifying their strong areas, weak areas and the bowlers bowled accordingly and the fielders were Kept accordingly. Credit to the English bowlers for execution.

What we witnessed in this series is the simple fact that our National T20 Cup is simply not good or competitive enough and is not putting pressure on our up and coming players to develop the modern T20 skills that the likes of the English Natwest T20, Australias Big Bash etc is allowing their players to develop.

I would like the PCB and Ramiz Raja to appoint foreign coaches for all the regional domestic teams. The Engro project is in the right direction and we will eventually see the rewards in 5 plus years where our youngsters would hopefully be well trained with modern T20 strokes, 360 degrees stroke play and playing the ramp shot, dilscoop, reverse sweeps etc.

Our players also desperately need to learn how to deal with slower deliveries, slower ball bouncers, you cannot be predictable by consistently hitting the same delivery to the fielders on the off and on side.
 
ads101 said:
It’s true these guys don’t even look good in PSL. They aren’t suddenly going to turn into monsters in international cricket.

There’s no real fix. I think arguably Shadab has looked better in PSL than all our middle order batsmen, it might be time to give him a proper middle order spot higher up the order. Was against it before, but I just see so little other talent out there.
Click to expand...

Pretty scary. Our batting is at an extremely low ebb. Hafeez etc at least could play good shots this lot are hapless. Ridiculous that we don't have a middle order at all. Can't see us winning anything for a decade. 2019/2021 were our chances but we choked it away. Now will be group or semis at best for a long time in all formats. We are 10 years behind the top teams in batting and fielding.
 
Mamoon said:
Shan, Iftikhar, Khushdil - all three of them had one objective: score a fluke half century and remove any doubts over their selection in the team.

None of them even faked an attempt to try to chase the target.
Click to expand...

This is 100% accurate. It's a pathetic precedent that has been set by previous players, captains and coaches and even players in the current team like Babar and Rizwan.

Shan got his 50, One of the most pathetic 50s I've ever seen in white ball cricket. Second one in a pointless cause.

The sad thing is if he scores a few more of these, random casuals will look at his record and say "hey he's not that bad, he should be a permanent fixture". And basically that's his aim. Successful night for him I'd say.
 
Savak said:
Lol at the lack of intent. I saw all the batsmen trying to go for it. Pakistani players have too many Achilles heels ie short deliveries, slower deliveries half volley, slower ball bouncers. You have to give full marks to the planning of the English Team Management, they really did their homework on each and every Pakistani batsmen identifying their strong areas, weak areas and the bowlers bowled accordingly and the fielders were Kept accordingly. Credit to the English bowlers for execution.

What we witnessed in this series is the simple fact that our National T20 Cup is simply not good or competitive enough and is not putting pressure on our up and coming players to develop the modern T20 skills that the likes of the English Natwest T20, Australias Big Bash etc is allowing their players to develop.

I would like the PCB and Ramiz Raja to appoint foreign coaches for all the regional domestic teams. The Engro project is in the right direction and we will eventually see the rewards in 5 plus years where our youngsters would hopefully be well trained with modern T20 strokes, 360 degrees stroke play and playing the ramp shot, dilscoop, reverse sweeps etc.

Our players also desperately need to learn how to deal with slower deliveries, slower ball bouncers, you cannot be predictable by consistently hitting the same delivery to the fielders on the off and on side.
Click to expand...

The only one who showed a semblance of intent was Shan, and that too after handful of overs had passed - he just is not good enough. Khushdil and Ifti were happy to nudge it around.
 
TheSultan said:
This is 100% accurate. It's a pathetic precedent that has been set by previous players, captains and coaches and even players in the current team like Babar and Rizwan.

Shan got his 50, One of the most pathetic 50s I've ever seen in white ball cricket. Second one in a pointless cause.

The sad thing is if he scores a few more of these, random casuals will look at his record and say "hey he's not that bad, he should be a permanent fixture". And basically that's his aim. Successful night for him I'd say.
Click to expand...

Oh yes the stats and the sr of close to 140 has been padded

England also happy to let Pakistan find another accumulator. Smartly played by everyone.

Nasser Hussain happy
Wasim Akram happy
Babar happy
Saqlain happy
Muhammad Waseem happy
Rameez Raja happy
 
Is the captan and coach decides the team, or only the selector ?
There’s a middle issue gap and it has been pointed out before so captan coach and sectors don’t want to do anything about it ?
Babar basically shuffled the whole middle order but never once tried to come at #3 and let someone else open if the Captan is insecure then what can you expect
 
Oneking said:
Is the captan and coach decides the team, or only the selector ?
There’s a middle issue gap and it has been pointed out before so captan coach and sectors don’t want to do anything about it ?
Babar basically shuffled the whole middle order but never once tried to come at #3 and let someone else open if the Captan is insecure then what can you expect
Click to expand...
So Babar should come at three and break the one thing that is actually working for our batting? :))

How long will we keep giving excuses for the other batsmen? They are the best performers in PSL and every other domestic competition in Pakistan. Why not push them to just play better?

I’m sorry but looking around at the options, we do not have middle-order batsmen at all.
 
Usman Chadda said:
So Babar should come at three and break the one thing that is actually working for our batting? :))

How long will we keep giving excuses for the other batsmen? They are the best performers in PSL and every other domestic competition in Pakistan. Why not push them to just play better?

I’m sorry but looking around at the options, we do not have middle-order batsmen at all.
Click to expand...

One thing thats working?

In all critical matches even "that hasnt worked".

What could be the harm in changing the "opening"?

We will lose?

Lol.
 
So that’s the point if we don’t have any middle order batsmen at all then what should we do? Constantly depend on two players all the time and once they get out switch the tv off ?
Shan masood is a opener but he is playing @3 ( not a huge fan of him )
Fakhar zaman another opener but since we didn’t had any hard hitting batsmen lowrer down the order Misbah decide to demote him to solve the issue
What Babar and Rizwan are giving it Pak crick, rizwan strike rate in power play vs Babar strike rate in power play should be compared to find out if it’s actually worth for them to bat in power play that’s been the question all along.
 
Lovely way to deflect the heat from two middle order accumulators playing as openers whilst guys like Fakhar are being forced to bat in the middle
 
Dr_Bassim said:
One thing thats working?

In all critical matches even "that hasnt worked".

What could be the harm in changing the "opening"?

We will lose?

Lol.
Click to expand...

You were complaining that middle order doesn't get too many deliveries and hence they struggle.

But, what's your opinion now after watching this series
 
This is T20 play aggressive at the power play I would really what’s Babar and Rizwan strike rate inside power play? If it’s low then what’s the point for them to open ?
 
Here here’s the batting order I would play or atleast give it a try
Fakhar
Masood
Babar
Rizwan
iftikhar
Asif
nawaz
Shadab
Top two only allow to play till 6 th over then hit it or get out
Mid two only allow to last till 14 over hit it or get out
Last three finish it or get out
 
Ashmal said:
You were complaining that middle order doesn't get too many deliveries and hence they struggle.

But, what's your opinion now after watching this series
Click to expand...

I am going to answer your question on the "premise" you are not a troll and are really interested in a candid discussion with me.

We know Babar and Rizwan are good T20 openers. We knew at the end of Asia cup that Babar and Rizwan are two good openers who are average to above average and will be able to get Pakistan "middling scores". We also know that every once in a while "have a great day and win the match by themselves".

We knew our middle order was non-existent before the T20 series and "desperately needed" some time to bat to get to know how "awful they actually were".

Now lets look at the T20 series vs England.

1st Match - Babar batted for 10 overs and Rizwan batted for 14.4 overs before being dismissed. Our openers literally gave middle order 6 overs to score the final total.

2nd Match - Babar and Rizwan batted for 20 overs to win the match for Pakistan.

3rd Match - Babar and Rizwan came at RR of over 11 runs per over and got dismissed in 4th over with the RR at 12.5 runs per over and 20 runs on the board chasing 222 to win. And people think it was a TEST of the middle order. You have to wonder....

4th Match - Babar and Rizwan battered for 12 overs before Babar got dismissed and Rizwan batted till 19th over. So middle order got 8 overs to smash it around?

5th Match - A low scoring affair in which middle order ACTUALLY GOT A CHANCE but Failed.

6th Match - Rizwan didn't play and Mr. Azam batted for the entire 20 overs. The only myth that was dispelled was that without Rizwan Pakistan would have crashed to 120 all out.

7th Match - Babar and Rizwan got out in 2 overs and asked the middle order to chase at 11 Runs per over to see if they are good enough...

I mean what are we trying to prove here?

That Babar and Rizwan can bat for as long as possible and can score bulk of the runs? Yes, we know that.

That they will sometimes win the games by themselves. Yes, we know that.

The middle order?

Bar one 5th game, was not even given an accurate chance.

In the 2 matches that Babar and Rizwan had the courtesy of departing in 2nd and 4th over, Pakistan were chasing 210 and 220 runs.

Are you telling me we are going to test our middle order by asking them to play at 12 an over ?

While Babar and Rizwan have the luxury to bat at 7 or 8 an over for 10 to 15 overs because that's how Pakistan play?

I can wager 1000 pounds with anyone right now that even if Shan Masood and Khushdil Shah open the batting they can score 40 to 50 without loss in 6 overs without any demons.

Babar and Rizwan are regularly duping the people into believing they are great openers and are quintessential for any result that gives victory to Pakistan.

In truth, the job of Rizwan and Babar can mostly be done by ANY BATSMEN that's given a long rope of 5 to 7 games to establish him at the top of the order.

But the reverse cannot be said.

If you ask Babar and Rizwan to chase 200 plus regularly against GOOD ATTACKS, they will go back to their huts under pressure and blame the middle order for not doing something that they themselves have not ability to do.

I rarely write long articles, but since you indulged you got your answer.


You want to know how can we find out our best players?


Don't play Babar and Rizwan in ANY MATCH OF THE TRI-SERIES.

What's the worst that can happen?

We will lose?

We already are.

But guess what?

They will be the first name on the team sheet because they need to dupe the nation into believing that they are the best openers since sliced bread.
 
I am quite sure if we pick 3 nobodies from the domestic cricket and slot them into no3 4 and 5. They could do the same job the current lot has been doing and it won't be hard to topple what Khushdil and Shan have been doing.

Please bring Fakhar back. Imad Wasim to choke the runs in the PP. He is not the guy who would go for 20 an over in PP. Wouldn't be opposed to having Shoaib Malik, Azam Khan or Qasim Akram to take over the roles from the incumbents.

Iftikhar's been given enough chances and he just doesn't get it.

Shan is just below average for international cricket.
 
Thank you Bothe are good players but again they can not play aggressive nature of t20 so I don’t think they should open keep them in middle together so they can keep the stability
 
BunnyRabbit said:
I am quite sure if we pick 3 nobodies from the domestic cricket and slot them into no3 4 and 5. They could do the same job the current lot has been doing and it won't be hard to topple what Khushdil and Shan have been doing.
Click to expand...

This is literally what people said when trying to justify not picking Hafeez and Malik for last years WC. Turns out that was extremely wrong and the replacements are indeed far worse.

Same thing was said about Yasir Shah. Sajid Khan proved everyone wrong that time too.
 
Oneking said:
This is T20 play aggressive at the power play I would really what’s Babar and Rizwan strike rate inside power play? If it’s low then what’s the point for them to open ?
Click to expand...

We had 'aggressive' players in Khushdil, Haider and Mohammad Haris get an opportunity in the powerplay this series.

How did this turn out for us?
 
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