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What went wrong for Pakistan against New Zealand in ICC Champions Trophy 2025? - Personal assessment

Well the last 10 overs of NZ batting and first 10 overs of Pakistan batting lost us the game. To be fair NZ is a better team and I wouldn't be surprised if they end up winning the whole thing.
 
TheSultan said:
We can say the bowling was bad (which it was), but pitches like Karachi in the modern day are 320 pitches, this is nothing out of the ordinary.

It’s our consumption of dots after dots after dots. This obsession has killed our cricket. 22 after 10 overs? What era do they think they are playing. Babar, Rizwan, Saud should hang their heads in shame. There is simply no excuse for it.

even kids know the importance and f rotating the strike.

Absolutely pathetic. I am ashamed of this team and their cowardly brand of cricket. India deserve to decimate them.
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This was not a 320 pitch. What made NZ cross 320 was the lack of penetration by our spinners in the middle overs i.e. our defensive, run controlling spinners and as usual our pacers going for plenty at the death.

Pakistani pacers are only effective when the pitch has something on offer for them as we saw in Australia and South Africa. The moment you have a flat pitch they lack the discipline of India, Australia, NZ, England to bowl tightly and to their fields.
 
Pakistan are hopeless in Asian conditions. They have terrible spinners and most of their batsmen, particularly Babar, are just as inept when it comes to batting against the slower ballers.

As Savak has mentioned, the pacers need enough assistance from the pitch because Pakistan can't chase 300+ against world class bowling attacks.
 
Savak said:
This was not a 320 pitch. What made NZ cross 320 was the lack of penetration by our spinners in the middle overs i.e. our defensive, run controlling spinners and as usual our pacers going for plenty at the death.
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Roll this pitch out again and put England, Australia, India and South Africa against Pakistan….it will still be a 320+ pitch

Get over it! Your batters can’t bat, and accept the fact that other teams are not as poor as your batters are!
 
Fakhar getting injured is unacceptable. How does a pure batsman whose only job for half the game is to jog around and occasionally catch the ball getting injured?

With Fakhar fit and opening, Pakistan would ha e likely chased it down. The bowling also doesn't concede as much without Fakhar's injury cloud hanging over their heads.
 
adi_62941 said:
The whole team's batting depends on Fakhar's power-hitting. If he scores, the entire team gains confidence. Today, he missed his batting spot due to the rules and was also injured, which made the other batters feel they couldn't do it on their own.

We lost the match within the first 10 overs. There wasn't a single moment during Babar's innings when I felt he could take us close to victory. His batting has been stuck and miserable lately.

God knows what has happened to him—he has lost all his confidence, and there’s no temperament left in him. He seriously needs to be rested and sent back to domestic cricket.
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Lately? Babars been garbage for years

His delusional fans deserve this humiliation
 
BlindingLight said:
Lately? Babars been garbage for years

His delusional fans deserve this humiliation
Click to expand...
I will disagree with you. He was exceptional in the start of his career. And performed agains all countries except india. He should not be blamed if Pakistan played their cricket against B and C teams because of various reasons. He was best ODI batsmen and still has a potential to be best in ODI which is his fav format but somehow because of captaincy he forgot to polish his skill which was much needed
 
psyoptica said:
The problem with Pakistan players is they see it as an insult rather than an opportunity to work on their weakness and regain form. This would never happen with an Australian player no matter how big he is. Babar is an average player at best and the way he was hyped by his fans and the media, he started thinking too much of himself. It's almost impossible now to convince him he's average and needs to work on him flaws and no one in the Pakistan team management has the gal to stand up to him
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He is a good batsmen for Pakistan standards. But he always struggles to perform in big stage. Same goes with virat and sachin. They never did well in finals or semifinals of big tournaments.
 
baba ghazi said:
321 is not par on this surface.. this mentality of " pace is pace yaar" is killing pakistani cricket.. pakistani pace attack is incapable of bowling in death..there are no variation, cutter clower ball.. even if there are its not executed properly..shouldnt have allowed nz to score more than 290..
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Time and again Rauf has proved that he is a mediocre during death overs but still he was employed for final over and NZ has massacred him. He is like Wahab and his quota should have been finished before 40 overs. His bowling made lot of difference.
 
Pakistan is simply defeated by a much better side.

There's nothing that went wrong. Pakistan played their usual play against NZ where as NZ too played their usual gameplay. It's just too bad that usual gameplay of NZ is far superior than Pakistan.

And pakistani fans should blame BCCI for this. Once IPL started, the foreign teams started to acclimatise to desi pitches. Even if there is difference in here & there, they can adapt quickly because of experience from pitches from IPL.

So indirectly, BCCI is reducing the advantages that Pakistan had.
 
Nothing went wrong. Pakistan are a 5th-6th ranked team.

They can compete on spicier pitches for pacers but flatter/slower Asian conditions are a problem for them. There is a reason they have never won a trophy in Asia as well as poor record in Asia Cups.
 
PAcers played a huge role to get smashed then comes our fielding who was standing like 20 yards in and the catches gone begging for 6. The comes fakhar's injury
 
saimayubera said:
Nothing went wrong. Pakistan are a 5th-6th ranked team.

They can compete on spicier pitches for pacers but flatter/slower Asian conditions are a problem for them. There is a reason they have never won a trophy in Asia as well as poor record in Asia Cups.
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Spot on. Very good analysis. We would have done better if we had played matches on fast tracks or bowling friendly conditions.
 
Bewal Express said:
This wasn't a 320 pitch. As soon as I saw Khushdil turn the ball,I felt it was a 230 pitch. Our bowlers were really poor
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if every score is 320+ lately in Karachi, and the average runs per over since 2023 is 5.97 which is basically a 300 score, what makes you assess this to not be a 320 pitch?

Are we going by our feelings or is logic and data more accurate?

It seems to me that when other teams bat, the pitches are always a higher par score, but when we bat, we make excuses every time.
 
Savak said:
This was not a 320 pitch. What made NZ cross 320 was the lack of penetration by our spinners in the middle overs i.e. our defensive, run controlling spinners and as usual our pacers going for plenty at the death.

Pakistani pacers are only effective when the pitch has something on offer for them as we saw in Australia and South Africa. The moment you have a flat pitch they lack the discipline of India, Australia, NZ, England to bowl tightly and to their fields.
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Matches since May 2023:​

  1. 3 May 2023 - Pakistan 287/6 (50.0) → RPO: 5.74
  2. 3 May 2023 - New Zealand 261 (49.1) → RPO: 5.30
  3. 5 May 2023 - Pakistan 334/6 (50.0) → RPO: 6.68
  4. 5 May 2023 - New Zealand 232 (43.4) → RPO: 5.31
  5. 7 May 2023 - New Zealand 299 (49.3) → RPO: 6.04
  6. 7 May 2023 - Pakistan 252 (46.1) → RPO: 5.45
  7. 12 Feb 2025 - South Africa 352/5 (50.0) → RPO: 7.04
  8. 12 Feb 2025 - Pakistan 355/4 (49.0) → RPO: 7.24
  9. 14 Feb 2025 - Pakistan 242 (49.3) → RPO: 4.88
  10. 14 Feb 2025 - New Zealand 243/5 (45.2) → RPO: 5.36
  11. 19 Feb 2025 - New Zealand 320/5 (50.0) → RPO: 6.40
  12. 19 Feb 2025 - Pakistan 260 (47.2) → RPO: 5.49
Average Runs Per Over (RPO) since May 2023: 5.91


average score since May 2023 has been 5.91 runs per over. Basically 300 is par in Karachi since 2023 according to stats.


Even in the recent matches before the Champtions Trophy we saw teams score 352 and 355, and in both warm up matches in Karachi the scores were high:

RESULT
(D/N), Karachi, February 17, 2025, ICC Champions Trophy Warm-up Matches


SHA
322/8

SA
(49/50 ov, T:323) 324/7
South Africa won by 3 wickets (with 6 balls remaining



Warm-up (D/N), Karachi, February 16, 2025, ICC Champions Trophy Warm-up Matches


AFG
305/9

NZ
(47.5/50 ov, T:306) 308/8
New Zealand won by 2 wickets (with 13 b








if every score is 320+ lately in Karachi, and the average runs per over since 2023 is 5.97 which is basically a 300 score, what makes you assess this to not be a 320 pitch?

Are we going by our feelings or is logic and data more accurate?

It seems to me that when other teams bat, the pitches are always a higher par score, but when we bat, we make excuses every time.
 
before This tournament, Pakistan performance was excellent in ODI cricket but one injury of saim they changed everything .

They should have Replaced saim with another openers and rest team should have beem selected same instead changing and chopping Entire team and batting orders.

:kp
 
Devadwal said:
before This tournament, Pakistan performance was excellent in ODI cricket but one injury of saim they changed everything .

They should have Replaced saim with another openers and rest team should have beem selected same instead changing and chopping Entire team and batting orders.

:kp
Click to expand...

Nothing to do with Saim or anyone. Pakistani players (current) do not have the answers when teams come to them with full strength and intensity which usually is not the case with bilaterals. It has been happening time and time again now for the past few years.

Had Imam got injured just before the 2023 WC, people would have used the same excuse of how they were "missing" him just because he played so well in a bunch of bilaterals and had an average of 50+. But we all know how he did in that WC.
 
The writing has been on the wall since the t20 World Cup and the same mistakes have been repeated again

There's no consistency in management therefore no consistency in gameplan. The players are making up plans out in the middle as they go along. Most of the lads play for their own scores and reputations. Rizwan is one of the poorest captains I have seen in terms of setting good fields at the right time to enforce change.

Every team knows how to score big against Pak.
See out the first 6 overs - hell even lose 2 wickets as the first change will give you loose deliveries
15-40 go at a run a ball milking easy singles from predictable middle order average hacks.
40-50 launch the quicks on these flat decks old balls.

Theyve now played 4 games in Pakistan, won against SA once. Even that after conceding 350.

They are yet to bowl a team out in 4 games which is far more worrying

No thought has gone into squad selection for Dubai proven by lack of proper spinner

Well done Aqib, PCB and Rizwan. Cakes all round
 
Rana said:
???

Saim getting injured is unacceptable?
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Is Saim in the squad? Any batter that is injury-prone needs to make changes to his fitness regimen. Saim, so far, hasn't shown that he is injury-prone, Fakhar has.
 
Bilal7 said:
Fakhar getting injured is unacceptable. How does a pure batsman whose only job for half the game is to jog around and occasionally catch the ball getting injured?

With Fakhar fit and opening, Pakistan would ha e likely chased it down. The bowling also doesn't concede as much without Fakhar's injury cloud hanging over their heads.
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Fakhar getting injured is unacceptable. How does a pure batsman whose only job for half the game is to jog around and occasionally catch the ball getting injured?

^^ I have seen many weak posts on PP, i think this is the worst one.
 
mominsaigol said:
Fakhar getting injured is unacceptable. How does a pure batsman whose only job for half the game is to jog around and occasionally catch the ball getting injured?

^^ I have seen many weak posts on PP, i think this is the worst one.
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Try to answer the question instead of spamming this forum with your usual 'this post is weak', 'this guy is a troll's comments.

Why is Fakhar so injury prone? When was the last time Rizwan was injured?
 
Bilal7 said:
Try to answer the question instead of spamming this forum with your usual 'this post is weak', 'this guy is a troll's comments.

Why is Fakhar so injury prone? When was the last time Rizwan was injured?
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The reason I don't reply is because you're a troll and everyone knows it but fine I'll respond this time.

First and foremost, Fakhar isn't injury prone, he was shadow banned recently for Abdullah and in wc 2023 babar azam lost confidence cause Fakhar performed poorly in cpl not realising that he was still smacking and crushing it in odi.

This is the first time he's been officially injured due to a freak accident where he landed awakedly on his knee.

Rizwan is a keeper and doesn't have to run around the field and he can't fall in such a manner while chasing the ball since he's wearing pads which offer protection.

Most keepers don't get injured, the ones that typically do are openers in odi and usually suffer from stamina drain which isn't an issue for rizwan since he bats at no 4.
 
Other than some fighting spirit with the bat shown by Salman and Khushdil, Pakistan had a largely forgettable match yesterday. The bowling was uninspiring, and Babar's knock was downright selfish.
 
mominsaigol said:
The reason I don't reply is because you're a troll and everyone knows it but fine I'll respond this time.

First and foremost, Fakhar isn't injury prone, he was shadow banned recently for Abdullah and in wc 2023 babar azam lost confidence cause Fakhar performed poorly in cpl not realising that he was still smacking and crushing it in odi.

This is the first time he's been officially injured due to a freak accident where he landed awakedly on his knee.

Rizwan is a keeper and doesn't have to run around the field and he can't fall in such a manner while chasing the ball since he's wearing pads which offer protection.

Most keepers don't get injured, the ones that typically do are openers in odi and usually suffer from stamina drain which isn't an issue for rizwan since he bats at no 4.
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Fakhar himself admitted that he was injured, which is why he wasn't selected in Pakistan's recent ODI series. Do you know more about Fakhar's body than Fakhar himself? Kinda sus.

Keepers have a far more strenuous job than the average fielder, lol. This is why so many teams have keeping duties rotated between different players. That said, it is still a relatively comfortable way to spend half the game.

A batter, who has a much less strenuous job, getting injured repeatedly is completely unacceptable.
 
mominsaigol said:
The reason I don't reply is because you're a troll and everyone knows it but fine I'll respond this time.

First and foremost, Fakhar isn't injury prone, he was shadow banned recently for Abdullah and in wc 2023 babar azam lost confidence cause Fakhar performed poorly in cpl not realising that he was still smacking and crushing it in odi.

This is the first time he's been officially injured due to a freak accident where he landed awakedly on his knee.

Rizwan is a keeper and doesn't have to run around the field and he can't fall in such a manner while chasing the ball since he's wearing pads which offer protection.

Most keepers don't get injured, the ones that typically do are openers in odi and usually suffer from stamina drain which isn't an issue for rizwan since he bats at no 4.
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You reply every single time, with nothing better to do. What I am advising you to do is to actually contribute to the conversation.
 
Bilal7 said:
Fakhar himself admitted that he was injured, which is why he wasn't selected in Pakistan's recent ODI series. Do you know more about Fakhar's body than Fakhar himself? Kinda sus.

Keepers have a far more strenuous job than the average fielder, lol. This is why so many teams have keeping duties rotated between different players. That said, it is still a relatively comfortable way to spend half the game.

A batter, who has a much less strenuous job, getting injured repeatedly is completely unacceptable.
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Everyone on the planet knew that he was shadow banned. Once you're unbanned, you're not going to go against an authority that pays you to speak.
 
Bilal7 said:
You reply every single time, with nothing better to do. What I am advising you to do is to actually contribute to the conversation.
Click to expand...
What I am advising you to do is to actually contribute to the conversation.

Irony died a 1000 deaths
 
Misbah ul haq Mindset! Tuktuk ! Way too many dot balls! If your not settled Thn don’t play Odi! It takes 8-9 balls to settle in! They also need to play aggressive cricket! Tuktuk has ruined Pakistan in the past
 
Bewal Express said:
But the pressure was off him as the game was done. The NZ team got far too many..
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Yes our bowling was poor, but bowlers get whacked in the modern game, England got smashed against India again and again. But we don’t even attempt to take singles, forget smash anything.

No matter how you may try to spin in, what our batsmen did was inexcusable. Babar and Co have been exposed yet again.

It’s a disgustingly gutless team. No pride, no honour. Truly weak and pathetic.
 
Bilal7 said:
Fakhar getting injured is unacceptable. How does a pure batsman whose only job for half the game is to jog around and occasionally catch the ball getting injured?

With Fakhar fit and opening, Pakistan would ha e likely chased it down. The bowling also doesn't concede as much without Fakhar's injury cloud hanging over their heads.
Click to expand...
Fakhar has a terrible consistency record. The writing was probably on the wall as soon as 320 was scored.
 
Man to Man , NZ edges out Pakistan in fact 11-0 so how can Pakistan win. NZ had all facets come covered, bowling batting fielding power hitting .
 
TheSultan said:
Yes our bowling was poor, but bowlers get whacked in the modern game, England got smashed against India again and again. But we don’t even attempt to take singles, forget smash anything.

No matter how you may try to spin in, what our batsmen did was inexcusable. Babar and Co have been exposed yet again.

It’s a disgustingly gutless team. No pride, no honour. Truly weak and pathetic.
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On this wicket they were worse than poor. We need a total reset but the million dollar question is- with whom?
 
Kianig89 said:
Man to Man , NZ edges out Pakistan in fact 11-0 so how can Pakistan win. NZ had all facets come covered, bowling batting fielding power hitting .
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Mostly agree but on wicket like that the gap is normally closed. Their fast bowlers are better than ours, their spinners are way better than ours and their batting is also very good. But after saying all that, our planning is appalling, and that goes back to Riz and Aqib
 
Bewal Express said:
On this wicket they were worse than poor. We need a total reset but the million dollar question is- with whom?
Click to expand...
This squad can be good.

1 MAAZ SADAQAT.
2 HASSAN NAWAZ
3 KHWAJA NAFAY
4 QASIM AKRAM
5 MUBASIR KHAN
6 NIAZI
7 AGHA (CAPTAIN)
8 KG
9 TT
10 SAIMY (VC)

11 ROHAIL NAZIR
12 HASEEBULLAH

13 SAAD MASOOD
14 ARAFAT MINHAS
15 MEHRAN MUMTAZ

16 NASEEM SHAH
17 ALI RAZA
18 AKIF JAVED
19 ABRAR
20 SUFYAN
21 AWAIS ANWAR
22 WASIM JR
23 JAHANDAD KHAN
24 ABBAS AFRIDI
25 AAMER JAMAL
 
We dont need players who play for themselves but who play for their country.
It is better to lose by 200 by trying rather than yesterdays mental torcher.
Bewal Express said:
I agree but our youth team players aren't young. They are way older and when they play for PK they are out of their depth.
Click to expand...
 
Pakistan are completely schooled by spinners since 2023 WC. I fear for them even against Bangladesh also it might end 3-0
 
In my humble opinion this is something that was always on the cards once we had the squad selected for CT 2025. The glaring point in our defeat is our inability to pick wickets in the middle overs.

Now the selectors have got Khushdil in the team as the bowler responsible for middle overs bowling and literally our only bet to pick wickets in the middle overs. Do we expect him to get international class batsmen out in middle overs? The answer is overwhelmingly "no". Khushdil's selection is as brainless as it can be. His bowling is on par with that of Salman. If Salman can bowl at par with Khushdil then why do we need Khushdil, can't we simply use Salman to cover for that quota of overs? If Salman can make up those overs then surely we can have a pure batsman play in place of Khushdil.

There are 2 ways to look into Khushdil's selection in the team. If we have a batsman instead of him we would still have ended up chasing around 320 runs but with extra batsman atleast there would have been slightly more hope for the chase. The second way is had we played a proper bowler instead of Khushdil who would have picked up wicket(s) in the middle overs then ideally Pakistan would have been set a target of around 275. This target would have been to the ability of accumulators like Babar, Rizwan, Saud, etc. Khushdil's selection cannot be justified and I haven't added in here his mishaps on the field.

I agree with OP that it was a good toss to win not only due to recently we have chased well but also because the pitch had turn in it and best exploited in day conditions for more grip. Abrar was exceptional in the early spell, had we had a decent second spinner we would have limited them to around 260 which under lights could have been better managed. We lost the opportunity to trap them with spin on this wicket.

Now onto batters chasing 320. Babar was atrocious. For some weird reason I have seen Babar now struggle to play deliveries on good length on stumps, he seems to be falling over in his shots far more often which is a sign that his head position is all wrong and so is his balance. Clearly he needs a bit of time off as his technique is giving way to poor performances. With some time off maybe he can add couple of years to his career otherwise I see it falling well short.

Saud doesn't merit a place in the side when we already have accumulators like Babar + Rizwan in the team. Tayyab is badly out of his natural role, he isn't a finisher or aggressor but his batting position dictates he takes that route and he comes across as ugly. This is why I have mentioned previously that at a time of selecting squads we shouldn't fill the team with top 5/6 run getters from domestic, we should actually select 1/2 for their relevant role and position in the team. For example in past we used to have 4-5 openers selected in a squad and no one to play at 5/6. Our thinktank is useless to say the least.

On our bowling now. How many times we have now seen Rauf conceding over 7 per over in an international tournament? This guy is literally taken to cleaners in every international tournament which suggests he is not on par for international competitions. Yes he did well in Australia recently but you need to see the bigger picture and understand his contributions over a longer period. He has lost the plot multiple times in T20 WCs (Kohli and USA memories) and then had a horrific ODI WC. We need to realise Haris Rauf is not going to win tournaments. Shaheen is the best we have got and he gets taken apart very easily at death as well.

If we look historically when we did well in tournaments in recent past due to our bowling then it always comes down to opening bowling making breakthroughs and spinners capitalising and choking in middle overs. Whenever the game has stretched our fast bowling has been taken to tatters in death overs. If someone from PCB looks at this it means you badly need a death bowler. Get someone like Umar Gul who can bowl at death and see yourself win games like that semi final vs SAF in 2010 T20 WC.

Overall I'm very disappointed not at the loss yesterday but at how our cricket is currently being run. We have also had 2 terrible injuries to arguably our MVP in batting (Saim + Fakhar). I can hope that we would have decision-making done on merit rather than on political connections, social media clout or simply friendship going forward.
 
Bewal Express said:
On this wicket they were worse than poor. We need a total reset but the million dollar question is- with whom?
Click to expand...
With whom? Oh is this the solid defence of “oh we we don’t have anyone better so let’s stick with my favourite gutless wonders”?

Bro, just admit your hero babar is an utter failure
 
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